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	<title>Comments on: When Democrats Learn to Speak Plainly</title>
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		<title>By: bhatten</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-787139</link>
		<dc:creator>bhatten</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 03:41:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-787139</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Not sure where to post this, but about the Democrats…I went to a public airing of the debate tonight.  I, along with most of the group, was quite impressed with the content of the answers.  Most of the candidates addressed the questions and offered some practical plans.  I heard hope in the room.  Tavis did a good job, and the framing around a Black perspective focused on some important issues.  All, of course, underscored by the coincidence of the day’s decision.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not sure where to post this, but about the Democrats…I went to a public airing of the debate tonight.  I, along with most of the group, was quite impressed with the content of the answers.  Most of the candidates addressed the questions and offered some practical plans.  I heard hope in the room.  Tavis did a good job, and the framing around a Black perspective focused on some important issues.  All, of course, underscored by the coincidence of the day’s decision.</p>
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		<title>By: Via</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786831</link>
		<dc:creator>Via</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 00:52:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786831</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;To whom did she respond?  Did anyone see it or hear it other than the people who read progressive blogs?  If the Dems don’t start speaking this way every day, loudly and clearly via MSM, the majority of people will never hear the story.  We will not have the surge of outrage from the streets, because those people will not have gotten the message.  The Dems are lousy, absolutely lousy, about using the media.  It is a huge failure on their part.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To whom did she respond?  Did anyone see it or hear it other than the people who read progressive blogs?  If the Dems don’t start speaking this way every day, loudly and clearly via MSM, the majority of people will never hear the story.  We will not have the surge of outrage from the streets, because those people will not have gotten the message.  The Dems are lousy, absolutely lousy, about using the media.  It is a huge failure on their part.</p>
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		<title>By: MarkH</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786785</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 00:21:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786785</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-786590&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;rwcole @ 93&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Bush will leave office with an economy on the verge of recession. … the most corrupt government in history- &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;If someone mentions “republican” and adequate response will be “Bush”.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The phrase “Bush Republicans” would probably be very effective if used repeatedly.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-786590"><em>rwcole @ 93</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p>Bush will leave office with an economy on the verge of recession. … the most corrupt government in history- </p>
<p>If someone mentions “republican” and adequate response will be “Bush”.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>The phrase “Bush Republicans” would probably be very effective if used repeatedly.</p>
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		<title>By: MarkH</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786773</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 00:10:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786773</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-786523&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;JPL @ 38&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Hersh also stated that Bush likes to compare himself to Winston Churchill. Sources close to the President have heard him “say things like, ‘It’ll be 20 years before they appreciate me. … Yes, I may be at 30 percent in the polls, but in 20 or 30 years, they’ll appreciate what I’ve done.’”&lt;br /&gt;
  This was from the Think Progress article about bombing Iran.  Bush is one sick puppy..&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;He might truly believe that. It’s possible. If he says it there’s a strong chance he does.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;How, you ask? If he is as stupid as many of us think, then he probably does believe the “evidence” that Saddam was behind 9/11.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Of course, that doesn’t explain his lying to Congress, refusing to fire the people who disclosed the classified job title of Valerie Plame and numerous other criminal acts.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;What is there to “appreciate”?&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-786523"><em>JPL @ 38</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p>Hersh also stated that Bush likes to compare himself to Winston Churchill. Sources close to the President have heard him “say things like, ‘It’ll be 20 years before they appreciate me. … Yes, I may be at 30 percent in the polls, but in 20 or 30 years, they’ll appreciate what I’ve done.’”<br />
  This was from the Think Progress article about bombing Iran.  Bush is one sick puppy..</p>
</blockquote>
<p>He might truly believe that. It’s possible. If he says it there’s a strong chance he does.</p>
<p>How, you ask? If he is as stupid as many of us think, then he probably does believe the “evidence” that Saddam was behind 9/11.</p>
<p>Of course, that doesn’t explain his lying to Congress, refusing to fire the people who disclosed the classified job title of Valerie Plame and numerous other criminal acts.</p>
<p>What is there to “appreciate”?</p>
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		<title>By: MarkH</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786761</link>
		<dc:creator>MarkH</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 00:02:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786761</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-786492&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;Attaturk @ 10&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Speaking of HYPERBOLE!!!&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://rising-hegemon.blogspot.com/2007/06/somebody-needs-editor.html&quot;&gt;HERE’S YOUR HYPERBOLE&lt;/a&gt;  Mark Krikorian at “The Corner”.  Absolutlely insane.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Voting down immigration reform in the Senate is the equivalent of defeating the Ottoman Empire in the 14th century.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I shit thee not.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;When one path is closed, another path, perhaps unnoticed before, can be discovered.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;There is still room for immigration reform, but it just won’t be what Bush wanted and it will require Congress to separate (as Cornyn mentioned today) border protection from immigration and visitation. Once that step is taken they can open the border to friendly visitors (who want to live &amp; work here and then return “South”, live &amp; work here and retain their homeland nationality or live &amp; work here and start on the path to becoming American citizens) and separately guard the border against dangerous illegal intruders.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-786492"><em>Attaturk @ 10</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p>Speaking of HYPERBOLE!!!</p>
<p><a href="http://rising-hegemon.blogspot.com/2007/06/somebody-needs-editor.html">HERE’S YOUR HYPERBOLE</a>  Mark Krikorian at “The Corner”.  Absolutlely insane.</p>
<p>Voting down immigration reform in the Senate is the equivalent of defeating the Ottoman Empire in the 14th century.</p>
<p>I shit thee not.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>When one path is closed, another path, perhaps unnoticed before, can be discovered.</p>
<p>There is still room for immigration reform, but it just won’t be what Bush wanted and it will require Congress to separate (as Cornyn mentioned today) border protection from immigration and visitation. Once that step is taken they can open the border to friendly visitors (who want to live &amp; work here and then return “South”, live &amp; work here and retain their homeland nationality or live &amp; work here and start on the path to becoming American citizens) and separately guard the border against dangerous illegal intruders.</p>
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		<title>By: DrenchedOtter</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786728</link>
		<dc:creator>DrenchedOtter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jun 2007 23:42:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786728</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-786629&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;marshen @ 110&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-786578&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;newspaperbrat @ 83&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt; I think Pelosi has a grand plan for the country and wants to make marked progress passing legislation that is going to help regular americans and move the country forward. Her focus is on us the voters not them Bush and Cheney. It’s like she is in her kitchen baking a pie from scratch. She has pressed the dough into the pan and Bush and Cheney are the excess crust she cuts away from around the edge of her pie. She has this vision of an american  pie and a piece will be served to everyone, an election is coming and she has to hurry, she has no time to waste on impeachment proceedings which would choke anything getting accomplished legislatively between now and the election. More reps in the house gives Nancy more power and after all she is a politician. Nancy knows the voters are keeping a score card on her and she wants as many 10’s as she can get. I think deep down being Queen of the House is more fun than the Presidency would be for her.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;You provide an excellent analysis and I hesitate to comment, but I’m afraid I think her vision is too small.  The Republicans are coalescing their message on fundamental principles … “America for Americans” hence the immigration bill is no good … “Security is our top priority” hence some troop reductions in Iraq but no immediate withdrawal.  By playing the temporal game and not reaching for people’s fundamental beliefs, I’m afraid Pelosi is conceding the rhetorical ground to the Republicans, and that’s death when offices are at stake.  She may hope for more seats, but I’m afraid she’s looking at a Republican victory that will take the Presidency, the Senate, and may even take back the House in 2008.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-786629"><em>marshen @ 110</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p><a href="#comment-786578"><em>newspaperbrat @ 83</em></a></p>
<p> I think Pelosi has a grand plan for the country and wants to make marked progress passing legislation that is going to help regular americans and move the country forward. Her focus is on us the voters not them Bush and Cheney. It’s like she is in her kitchen baking a pie from scratch. She has pressed the dough into the pan and Bush and Cheney are the excess crust she cuts away from around the edge of her pie. She has this vision of an american  pie and a piece will be served to everyone, an election is coming and she has to hurry, she has no time to waste on impeachment proceedings which would choke anything getting accomplished legislatively between now and the election. More reps in the house gives Nancy more power and after all she is a politician. Nancy knows the voters are keeping a score card on her and she wants as many 10’s as she can get. I think deep down being Queen of the House is more fun than the Presidency would be for her.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>You provide an excellent analysis and I hesitate to comment, but I’m afraid I think her vision is too small.  The Republicans are coalescing their message on fundamental principles … “America for Americans” hence the immigration bill is no good … “Security is our top priority” hence some troop reductions in Iraq but no immediate withdrawal.  By playing the temporal game and not reaching for people’s fundamental beliefs, I’m afraid Pelosi is conceding the rhetorical ground to the Republicans, and that’s death when offices are at stake.  She may hope for more seats, but I’m afraid she’s looking at a Republican victory that will take the Presidency, the Senate, and may even take back the House in 2008.</p>
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		<title>By: Fern</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786717</link>
		<dc:creator>Fern</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jun 2007 23:34:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786717</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-786538&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;Brisingamen @ 49&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;I really think the key is impeaching Gonzales. I think the investigation surrounding that MIGHT give you Cheney as well…&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;It might be useful to impeach a supreme court justice or two.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-786538"><em>Brisingamen @ 49</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p>I really think the key is impeaching Gonzales. I think the investigation surrounding that MIGHT give you Cheney as well…</p>
</blockquote>
<p>It might be useful to impeach a supreme court justice or two.</p>
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		<title>By: Knut Wicksell</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786716</link>
		<dc:creator>Knut Wicksell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jun 2007 23:33:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786716</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;mailto:P@55&quot;&gt;P@55&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I agree that Impeachment (of the President, at least) is less important than the Indictment process in the House.  Whether it gets through the Senate or not is a secondary issue.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="mailto:P@55">P@55</a></p>
<p>I agree that Impeachment (of the President, at least) is less important than the Indictment process in the House.  Whether it gets through the Senate or not is a secondary issue.</p>
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		<title>By: joel hanes</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786706</link>
		<dc:creator>joel hanes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jun 2007 23:24:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786706</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Patience, firepups.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;In only six months, we’ve gone from a complete Republican hegemony in Congress to the point where even Republicans are starting to vote for subpoenas.  Six months.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Waxman and Leahey grind onward.  More things the Administration wants hidden will get disclosed.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;A year from now, the nation will be &lt;em&gt;demanding&lt;/em&gt; impeachment, even though W and his hench will at that time have only a few months left in office.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Patience, firepups.</p>
<p>In only six months, we’ve gone from a complete Republican hegemony in Congress to the point where even Republicans are starting to vote for subpoenas.  Six months.</p>
<p>Waxman and Leahey grind onward.  More things the Administration wants hidden will get disclosed.</p>
<p>A year from now, the nation will be <em>demanding</em> impeachment, even though W and his hench will at that time have only a few months left in office.</p>
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		<title>By: KLynn</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786700</link>
		<dc:creator>KLynn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jun 2007 23:20:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2007/06/28/when-democrats-learn-to-speak-plainly/#comment-786700</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-786499&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;RevDeb @ 17&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;I’d like to hear more statements about the “rule of law” applying to everyone, not just ordinary folks. And about how they have violated their oaths to preserve defend and protect the Constitution. Gotta get that meme out there if we are ever going to go down the impeachment road.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Go read&lt;a href=&quot;http://thenexthurrah.typepad.com/the_next_hurrah/2007/06/shall.html#comments&quot;&gt; EW’s  “Shall” at NH.&lt;/a&gt;  The comments are packed with information on this concern.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-786499"><em>RevDeb @ 17</em></a></p>
<blockquote><p>I’d like to hear more statements about the “rule of law” applying to everyone, not just ordinary folks. And about how they have violated their oaths to preserve defend and protect the Constitution. Gotta get that meme out there if we are ever going to go down the impeachment road.</p>
<p>Go read<a href="http://thenexthurrah.typepad.com/the_next_hurrah/2007/06/shall.html#comments"> EW’s  “Shall” at NH.</a>  The comments are packed with information on this concern.</p>
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