uno?

Go Jane!

ME!!!lol

oppps…lol

Getting “all the way to the end of the book” is so pre-9/11.

Jane!!!

When is this balloon finally going to be punctured? The local readership of WaPo are highly educated, actually read books mostly to the end, and can be expected to sift the grain from the chaff. Exactly who are these nincompoops writing for? This newspaper business is getting so self-referential that it would make a Harold Bloom dizzy.

I think the GOP is scared to death of Gore. Wouldn’t it be interesting to have a Gore vs. Thompson match. I believe Gore would trounce Fredy.

I want Gore in ‘08!

WaPoO “media critic” Howie Kurtz weighed in on this during Monday’s chat:

New York: I know columnists are given more leeway than straight reporters, but does Washington Post allow its columnists to write abject falsehoods? The first sentence in Andrew Ferguson column is “you can’t really blame Al Gore for not using footnotes in his new book, ‘The Assault on Reason.’ ” But if you take two seconds to open Mr. Gore’s book, you see that it has extensive footnotes — 20 pages worth. Does The Post have any standards at all for its op-ed pages, or are we back to the days when anyone can make up anything they want about Al Gore?

Howard Kurtz: It’s a piece in Outlook, the Sunday opinion section. Since I don’t have the book, I can’t rule on whether the book contained footnotes or not, but certainly editors try to prevent factual errors even in opinion pieces.

TeddySanFran @ 5

Getting “all the way to the end of the book” is so pre-9/11.

LOL, but in truth, Fergusen could have known about the endnotes, he just chose to lie.

This way a falsehood gets spread thru the RW toobz and becomes a talking point…one more of the Al Gore is a serial liar.

That it eventually gets shot down won’t be repeated…just like the internet story.

It is disgusting.

Jane,
You do realize that Ferguson’s email address is at the bottom of the op-ed, right? ;-)

P.S. Yes, I am sending him the link to the column in about 15 seconds.

Oklahoma kiddo @ 8

I think the GOP is scared to death of Gore. Wouldn’t it be interesting to have a Gore vs. Thompson match. I believe Gore would trounce Fredy.

I want Gore in ‘08!

Somerby makes a good point about how they’ve got it in for him because he betrayed his class. Which I think has a lot to do with it.

Looks like Mudcat thinks he can take his place in a NASCAR hat. Probably not going to happen.

TeddySanFran @ 9

WaPoO “media critic” Howie Kurtz weighed in on this during Monday’s chat:

New York: I know columnists are given more leeway than straight reporters, but does Washington Post allow its columnists to write abject falsehoods? The first sentence in Andrew Ferguson column is “you can’t really blame Al Gore for not using footnotes in his new book, ‘The Assault on Reason.’ ” But if you take two seconds to open Mr. Gore’s book, you see that it has extensive footnotes — 20 pages worth. Does The Post have any standards at all for its op-ed pages, or are we back to the days when anyone can make up anything they want about Al Gore?

Howard Kurtz: It’s a piece in Outlook, the Sunday opinion section. Since I don’t have the book, I can’t rule on whether the book contained footnotes or not, but certainly editors try to prevent factual errors even in opinion pieces.

Hacktacular Howie said that? Boy is HE confused (nothing at all new about that). Lil Debbie’s been saying for months now that opinion writers do their own fact checking and corrections IIRC.

By the way, here is Ferguson’s email address:

aferguson61@comcast.net

It is listed at the bottom of the article. Also, there is now a correction at the top of the article on the ComPost’s website.

I cant imagine why Gore would write this book if he wasnt going to run. This book should be read in schools all over the country.
I am half way through and its not a hard read but very thought provoking.
I still think Gore feels this early, never ending campaigning is obscene and he wants no part of it.( I heard him say this on Larry King)

Jane, I’m awed by your talents.

Jane – Really sorry for this OT, so early, but…I’m trying to help Bree Walker who is buying Camp Casey to help find a bio-fuel bus to get folks there for a Peace Rally. Information on Bree at Bradblog, June 9th piece. (sorry, can’t link the specific articles)
You have my email…oh, beautiful powers that be, right? Your voice would be so much stronger than mine. I have more info to share, if you have time to help. And, THANK YOU!

http://www.ufppc.org/content/view/818/39/
“For a reliable pedigree, cite p. 40 of The Lincoln Encyclopedia, by Archer H. Shaw (Macmillan, 1950, NY). That traces the quote’s lineage to p. 954 of Abraham Lincoln: A New Portrait, (Vol. 2) by Emanuel Hertz (Horace Liveright Inc, 1931, NY).”

dakine01 — I thought HK’s construction

certainly editors try to prevent factual errors even in opinion pieces

was particularly fine parsing.
====
Sounds like someone got tired of hearing from the DFH bloggers:

Correction to This Article
Andrew Ferguson’s June 10 Outlook article, “What Al Wishes Abe Said,” said that former vice president Al Gore’s book “The Assault on Reason” does not contain footnotes. The book contains 20 pages of endnotes.

Jane – this news, albeit off topic, is important:
McNulty to testify before House Judiciary Committee

ThinkProgress very recently reported the following:

Salon’s Tim Grieve reports that Paul McNulty, who recently resigned as Deputy Attorney General, will testify next week:

Word just in from the House Judiciary Committee: The Subcommittee on Commercial and Administrative Law will hold a hearing next week related to “The Continuing Investigation Into the U.S. Attorney Controversy and Related Matters.”

The witness: Paul McNulty, who has announced his resignation as deputy attorney general and — in the wake of attempts by Gonzales and Monica Goodling to implicate him in the U.S. attorney mess — may suddenly be feeling a little talkative.

UPDATE: ThinkProgress has confirmed with the House Judiciary Committee that McNulty’s hearing will be Tuesday, June 19, at 1:00 PM.

(my emphasis)

Ruining Running a newspaper is hard work.

Well, he also says that Gore made up the quote, and that’s absolute BS as many commentors on the WP site point out.

Most people won’t read past the article though, and a new “lie” by Gore will be invented.

The WP sucks.

Absolutely infuriating!! They don’t want anybody to read Gore’s book. Too f**king late!

TeddySanFran @ 5

Getting “all the way to the end of the book” is so pre-9/11.

The WaPo is proving Gore’s point for him. Daily.

Oklahoma kiddo @ 8

I think the GOP is scared to death of Gore. Wouldn’t it be interesting to have a Gore vs. Thompson match. I believe Gore would trounce Fredy.

I want Gore in ‘08!

I concur that they are terrified of him as well. He makes too much sense and could actually help make the country a better place through his leadership and wisdom. He also wants to enlighten people and we simply can’t have that. The unwashed masses simply cannot be allowed to peek behind the Oz curtain.

All moneyed forces will stop at nothing to stop him. Can they stop netroots, I wonder? Is this a really stupid question?

I live on the west coast and although we have easy access to the New York Times in print, I have never seen a Washington Post here. So for everyone who thinks the whole country will know about this review, they won’t.

Stupid trolls with megaphones. It really is “Al Gore’s internet”. He said he was instrumental in creating it (not “inventing it”) and the scientists who invented the technology agree.

I hate our stupid corporate media and the vapid members of its world. They make the likes of Paris Hilton seem intellectual.

The Washington Post used to be a damned good paper–in the days of Katharine Graham.

Reading Ferguson’s piece again (spit!) it really needs more than a correction. The central thesis of the piece is that Gore’s book is non-factual and without noted references. If untrue, the piece can’t be “corrected” — it fails utterly.

I wonder if there’s someone who could address this at the WaPo? Does anyone know if the paper employs an Ombudsman? *g*

I meant to ask Murray Waas this last Sunday.
Is there any truth to the rumor that the Washington Post is considering opening up a news bureau in DC?

C’mon, Jane. You don’t expect him to actually read the book he is reviewing, do you? I mean he already knows everything he needs to know to state his impeccably credentialed opinion without actually working at it (or thinking, God forbid). That is how our modern punditocracy works: fact free navel gazing.

Here’s a note; I just looked for the 1999 Schwartz article mentioned. It’s not up on the AL Society newsletters online. . . methinks he made it up.

TeddySanFran @ 29

Reading Ferguson’s piece again (spit!) it really needs more than a correction. The central thesis of the piece is that Gore’s book is non-factual and without noted references. If untrue, the piece can’t be “corrected” — it fails utterly.

I wonder if there’s someone who could address this at the WaPo? Does anyone know if the paper employs an Ombudsman? *g*

By Ombudsman, if you mean an advocate for the reader who corrects errors of fact and keeps the editors and reporters honest, no they don’t.

The Republicans, and Bush is number one at this, have been lying about everything for the past ten years to get their way. Look at the lies they spout about immigration, or the success of tax-cuts, or Iraq, or wire-tapping, or energy policy, or environmental policy, etc. They can’t tell the truth because it disagrees with their policies. If you tell the truth, you’re just being political, they say.

While it’s true papers like WaPo, and WSJ are guilty of churning out these lies, nothing is going to change until there are consequences. As long as politicians tell lies, the American media seems fine with printing it. So, we need to get the politicians. Impeach Gonzo for a start. He lies to congress and is still AG. WTF? Is that WaPo’s fault?

As Molly Ivins once said of the chattering classes’ bizarre rage at Hillary Clinton (a dislike that is not grounded in her politics or actions, but is simply left over from their ten-year witchhunt from the 1990s): “Most people have a very hard time forgiving those whom they have deeply wronged.”

Ergo, the DC press corps will never, ever forgive Al Gore, because they have spent the better part of two decades wronging him up one side and down the other. And they can never, ever admit that they did so.

Why doesn’t Gore just sue the crap out of them? They made a correction, okay. But how many people read an article once, then go back to read a correction? This madness has to stop. Conyers ought to sue Fox too. It’s time to have some accountability. I realize that honest mistakes can be made, but this WP article seems like deliberate character defamation or whatever the legal term may be.

Go Jane at the “Take back America” awards! Your leadership and initiative as a concerned citizen is an inspiration! You have provided another powerful outlet and tool for concerned citizens to practice vigilance and share information in regard to what our elected leaders, our government and our military are doing. FDL is a new “deliberative body” for good! Thank you!

The right (wrong) will be attacking Gore in force as the tidal wave to RE-ELECT GORE breaks!

GeorgeSimian @ 34

The Republicans, and Bush is number one at this, have been lying about everything for the past ten years to get their way. Look at the lies they spout about immigration, or the success of tax-cuts, or Iraq, or wire-tapping, or energy policy, or environmental policy, etc. They can’t tell the truth because it disagrees with their policies. If you tell the truth, you’re just being political, they say.

While it’s true papers like WaPo, and WSJ are guilty of churning out these lies, nothing is going to change until there are consequences. As long as politicians tell lies, the American media seems fine with printing it. So, we need to get the politicians. Impeach Gonzo for a start. He lies to congress and is still AG. WTF? Is that WaPo’s fault?

Yes, it is. They can get away with it because the press won’t do its job and call them on it. The press is the number one reason IOKIYAR exists.

old gold @ 30

I meant to ask Murray Waas this last Sunday.
Is there any truth to the rumor that the Washington Post is considering opening up a news bureau in DC?

No.

Gore’s new book is fantastic. Also, he WILL be the next POTUS. I expect him to announce just after winning the Nobel Peace Prize.

Meanwhile, back at the Swamp … I don’t think Mudcat’s pesudo apology is going too well.

Oklahoma kiddo @ 8

I think the GOP is scared to death of Gore. Wouldn’t it be interesting to have a Gore vs. Thompson match. I believe Gore would trounce Fredy.

I want Gore in ‘08!

Although I like Gore I still wish the American people would wake up to the talents of Clark. Most Americans don’t realize that he has a grasp of the economic situation like Clinton. The top percentages are living like it’s in the twenties and that’s what I’m afraid of…
They just see the General in front of his name.

Jane — did you happen to see Lil’ Debbie’s reply to a reader who complained about this particular lack of fact checking?

Apparently she is also asking for a drubbing; I guess I didn’t take her for a submissive pain freak, but there you go.

Good God I am so sick of these lying liars and their lies!

Speaking of fact free hot air, wrt Dratty’s post @157 on previous thread re professional BS writer Frum: if former presidents used respite and he is going to be so offhand about it, please state specific instances if you are so frigging knowledgable.

I’m so sick of these sh*theads thinking we’re so stupid! I may not know my history, but I expect some TRUE FACTS to back up their ACCUSATIONS!

Sorry to SHOUT…but I’m so sick of it! How does FDL keep birddogging the BS. How? OK, I’m going to ask for a dosage adjustment now. gasp.

Andrew Ferguson is a disgrace to the name, and all Scots.

Ferguson: It goes without saying that Gore isn’t the first politician to enlist Lincoln, however spuriously, in a pet cause. In 1992, Ronald Reagan used his last appearance at a GOP convention to warn of a liberal ascendancy that threatened Lincoln’s cherished Republican principles.

Ehh, you left out Bush and his pundit minions. A few months back they were trying to put the Lincoln mantle on Bush because Iraq is going up in flames. Not doing much of that these days are ya?

Stephen Parrish, CPA @ 20

Jane – this news, albeit off topic, is important:
McNulty to testify before House Judiciary Committee

ThinkProgress very recently reported the following:

Salon’s Tim Grieve reports that Paul McNulty, who recently resigned as Deputy Attorney General, will testify next week:

UPDATE: ThinkProgress has confirmed with the House Judiciary Committee that McNulty’s hearing will be Tuesday, June 19, at 1:00 PM.

(my emphasis)

Thanks for going “off topic”. Only a few here at FDL will selectively attack you when you bring up issues that they do not want talked about! This is important news.

The only thing wrong with Gore is that he put Holy Joe LIEberman on the ticket. He’s got some explaning to do on that one. BIG TIME.

On a less serious note; I don’t want anyone to worry about their tax dollars at work:

http://world-o-crap.com/blog/

Ferguson: It goes without saying that Gore isn’t the first politician to enlist Lincoln, however spuriously, in a pet cause. In 1992, Ronald Reagan used his last appearance at a GOP convention to warn of a liberal ascendancy that threatened Lincoln’s cherished Republican principles.

If it goes without saying, STFU, *sshole. Ugh.

hayduke @ 48

The only thing wrong with Gore is that he put Holy Joe LIEberman on the ticket. He’s got some explaning to do on that one. BIG TIME.

Now at the time Liebermans voting record was pretty liberal so even though he was not someone I would have chosen his track record wasn’t bad.

kathleen @ 47
Thanks for going “off topic”. Only a few here at FDL will selectively attack you when you bring up issues that they do not want talked about! This is important news.

Let’s try to get past that…peace.

Well, you can’t just blame “the press” because it’s like blaming “the Government”. It’s too vague and just sounds conspiratorial. The problem with American news is that it tries to tell a two-sided view of everything, and these liars take advantage of that. So, if you don’t agree with them – even if it’s a lie – then you must be from the Left Wing. So the more Right Wing crap they shout out, with Coulter, or the thinktankers, the more the truth sounds like just another opinion, and because it’s the truth, it probably doesn’t sound as fun.

Good news!

The Weapons of Mass Destruction have been found.

The bad news is they were dumped all over the ocean floor along the Eastern seaboard.

-GSD

Phoenix Woman @ 35

As Molly Ivins once said of the chattering classes’ bizarre rage at Hillary Clinton (a dislike that is not grounded in her politics or actions, but is simply left over from their ten-year witchhunt from the 1990s): “Most people have a very hard time forgiving those whom they have deeply wronged.”

Ergo, the DC press corps will never, ever forgive Al Gore, because they have spent the better part of two decades wronging him up one side and down the other. And they can never, ever admit that they did so.

Do you suppose if the Democrats ran a Gore/Clinton ticket with a promise of Obama as SofS, the right wing would overload so badly their heads would explode? Interesting idea.

At least their hate would reach such levels that the clarity of their thinking would be impaired.

2008-2016 Gore/Clinton
2016-2024 Clinton/Obama
2024-2032 Obama…..

hayduke @ 48

The only thing wrong with Gore is that he put Holy Joe LIEberman on the ticket. He’s got some explaning to do on that one. BIG TIME.

It is my impression that Lieberman has had a complete change of perspective since those years. He truly is not a Democrat anymore, and I don’t even think he’s a Repub. The only “independent” thing about him is that he independently chose to hook up with the neocon party, and they are using him as a front man in their ramp up to attacking Iran rather than it coming from a Repub. JMHO

Uh oh,

The underlining infestation showed up on my post. Ack!

sorry.

[Mod: fixed]

JPL @ 42

Oklahoma kiddo @ 8

I think the GOP is scared to death of Gore. Wouldn’t it be interesting to have a Gore vs. Thompson match. I believe Gore would trounce Fredy.

I want Gore in ‘08!

Although I like Gore I still wish the American people would wake up to the talents of Clark. Most Americans don’t realize that he has a grasp of the economic situation like Clinton. The top percentages are living like it’s in the twenties and that’s what I’m afraid of…
They just see the General in front of his name.

I agree Wesley Clark is amazing. Everytime I have heard him speak about Iraq, Iran, the middle east I am so impressed.

The Israeli lobby viciously attacked him a while back for a comment that he made. This often means that the individual has a wider perspective on the middle east than the “Israeli firsters” want pursued or considered.

Diane @ 41

Meanwhile, back at the Swamp … I don’t think Mudcat’s pesudo apology is going too well.

linky, sil vous plais?

GSD @ 54

Good news!

The Weapons of Mass Destruction have been found.

The bad news is they were dumped all over the ocean floor along the Eastern seaboard.

-GSD

Outrageous! Who is responsible for this??

Edwards/Clark.
You heard it here first.

Unless or until Gore enters the race.

Illinois History

It does look like the quote is in dispute, according to Schwartz…this part will be ambiguous, as there are scholars who do not think it’s in dispute…like the one Gore references.

It’s the Right’s famous m.o.

DrDick @ 31

C’mon, Jane. You don’t expect him to actually read the book he is reviewing, do you? I mean he already knows everything he needs to know to state his impeccably credentialed opinion without actually working at it (or thinking, God forbid). That is how our modern punditocracy works: fact free navel gazing.

he could have at least paged through it. I mean how hard is it to see if there are endnotes? That it never occurred to him to even look in the back of the book is mind-boggling.

I’d like to see Gore/Whitehouse

puppethead @ 27

Stupid trolls with megaphones. It really is “Al Gore’s internet”. He said he was instrumental in creating it (not “inventing it”) and the scientists who invented the technology agree.

I hate our stupid corporate media and the vapid members of its world. They make the likes of Paris Hilton seem intellectual.

Hell, we’d be better off if Paris Hilton replaced Fred Hiatt on the WaPo masthead.

Reminds me: One of the best interviews Bill Clinton ever got, in terms of sheer substance, was from Leonardo di Caprio for ABC News on the occasion of the thirtieth anniversary of Earth Day in 2000. (The NYT references it but of course doesn’t link to it.) And of course the chattering classes all rose up as one to attack ABC for such a move.

GSD @ 54

Good news!

The Weapons of Mass Destruction have been found.

The bad news is they were dumped all over the ocean floor along the Eastern seaboard.

-GSD

The Soviets dumped thousands of tons of the same kind of stuff in the North Pacific and Arctic Oceans. Also, the late Pete Isleib, one of Alaska’s great ornithologists, documented huge American dumps of similar WMDs south of the Aleutian Trench in the early to mid-1960s. His notes and document copies were destroyed when his house in Cordova burnt down in the early 1980s.

Phoenix Woman @ 35

As Molly Ivins once said of the chattering classes’ bizarre rage at Hillary Clinton (a dislike that is not grounded in her politics or actions, but is simply left over from their ten-year witchhunt from the 1990s): “Most people have a very hard time forgiving those whom they have deeply wronged.”

Ergo, the DC press corps will never, ever forgive Al Gore, because they have spent the better part of two decades wronging him up one side and down the other. And they can never, ever admit that they did so.

Phoenix Woman, what an interesting quote. Thank you for sharing. Sounds just like something Molly would have said. And, you know, even though I don’t understand it, even though it’s totally illogical, it’s the only explanation that really rings true when you look back on it all.

I guess they have to keep on demonizing both of them for fear of being proven wrong in the 90’s.

I just keep wondering when the “decider” will announce that they have found the really good hider? (OBL)

Fall of 2008?

Gore/Clinton: not possible ‘coz they can’t stand each other

Clinton/Obama: won’t work: the US is not ready for an identity politics ticket, although maybe by 2016…

Edwards/Clark.
You heard it here first.

I’m also a huge Clark (Pres.) fan but I’m not seeing the traction yet.

I’d be down for your ticket but don’t you think Clark would also be great as Sec. Defense or Sec. State ?

Gore can’t sue the crap out of him, because Ferguson told nothing but the truth. He didn’t tell the whole truth either, but while this would make him a better editor, it’s not exactly mandatory. Endnotes aren’t footnotes (read Al Franken on this ^^) and while i didn’t check the link, i believe him that the quote didn’t show up. See, blatant lying is for dummies. Clever guys let the lie develop in the brain of their audience.

Maybe Murdoch can buy both the WaPo and the WSJ so those two rolls of toilet paper can finally stop trying to appear fair and balanced and can take their rightful places behind the Fox news crew as chief propagandists.

Tim @ 70

Edwards/Clark.
You heard it here first.

I’m also a huge Clark (Pres.) fan but I’m not seeing the traction yet.

I’d be down for your ticket but don’t you think Clark would also be great as Sec. Defense or Sec. State ?

Am I missing something here because I haven’t seen hide nor hair of Clarke these days.

Kathleen, Clark taught Econ @ West Point. His grasp of the present day problems is amazing. Gore obviously would be an excellent president and Clark a great VP. Obama would outshine many recent Secretary of States. If only wishing would make it so.

kathleen @ 68

I just keep wondering when the “decider” will announce that they have found the really good hider? (OBL)

Fall of 2008?

Could be. I’d bet 11/1/08. Not enough time for the public to look into how it went down.

james @ 72

Maybe Murdoch can buy both the WaPo and the WSJ so those two rolls of toilet paper can finally stop trying to appear fair and balanced and can take their rightful places behind the Fox news crew as chief propagandists.

Really, just f**king get it over with.

Tim #70,
Yes. Totally. Either one.

LS @ 56

hayduke @ 48

The only thing wrong with Gore is that he put Holy Joe LIEberman on the ticket. He’s got some explaning to do on that one. BIG TIME.

It is my impression that Lieberman has had a complete change of perspective since those years. He truly is not a Democrat anymore, and I don’t even think he’s a Repub. The only “independent” thing about him is that he independently chose to hook up with the neocon party, and they are using him as a front man in their ramp up to attacking Iran rather than it coming from a Repub. JMHO

That’s exactly it. And Gore was even at that time a far different person from the one who helped found the DLC — so much so that he’s now their worst enemy.

Lieberman was actually sane on health care; if Gore had been able to shunt him off into working with Howard Dean (who also used to be liked by the DLC and is now hated by them) on a gradual implementing of a national health care plan, he’d have been kept too busy to hear the siren song of Ahmad Chalabi.

Phoenix Woman @ 35

As Molly Ivins once said of the chattering classes’ bizarre rage at Hillary Clinton (a dislike that is not grounded in her politics or actions, but is simply left over from their ten-year witchhunt from the 1990s): “Most people have a very hard time forgiving those whom they have deeply wronged.”

Ergo, the DC press corps will never, ever forgive Al Gore, because they have spent the better part of two decades wronging him up one side and down the other. And they can never, ever admit that they did so.

DING! And in HC’s case, not only was she wronged but the attacks helped to make people’s careers–witness MoDo’s Pulitzer, which, IIRC was based on her reporting of that stupid impeachment business, as well as all her nonsense about HC and Bill’s personal life. Talk about infotainment.

Spiritcatcher @ 71

…See, blatant lying is for dummies. Clever guys let the lie develop in the brain of their audience.

This is the M.O. of Straussian monsters, not “clever guys.” And it is blatant lying, in the form of a Big Lie; this stewing doubt the Straussian monster feeds festers into the greater lie that Gore is somehow not authentic and disingenuous.

As if Gore could ever do a fraction of the inauthentic and disingenuous stuff perpetrated by this administration and its minions, both public and private.

Biodun @ 69

Gore/Clinton: not possible ‘coz they can’t stand each other

Bill Clinton and Gore never liked each other either and it worked. I watched some bio of Clinton and it was said that Gore was one of the few people that could “talk Bill down” if he was in a rage and keep him focused and logical.

You don’t have to love each other to have a practical, working relationship.

I didn’t see that Edwards and Kerry were best buds, either.

If you truly want to scare the Reps into heart attacks, make up some bumper stickers “Gore / Bloomberg ‘08″

LS @ 75

kathleen @ 68

I just keep wondering when the “decider” will announce that they have found the really good hider? (OBL)

Fall of 2008?

Could be. I’d bet 11/1/08. Not enough time for the public to look into how it went down.

Bin Laden will be the guest speaker at the Republican Convention in 2008.

-GSD

Diane @ 41

Meanwhile, back at the Swamp … I don’t think Mudcat’s pesudo apology is going too well.

sorry–who is Mudcat?

Spiritcatcher #71,
Robert A. Heinlein: “I do know the slickest way to lie is to tell just the right amount of truth, and then shut up.”
-from Stranger in a Strange Land

Mudcat? Who’s that?

snowbird42 @ 15

I cant imagine why Gore would write this book if he wasnt going to run. This book should be read in schools all over the country.
I am half way through and its not a hard read but very thought provoking.
I still think Gore feels this early, never ending campaigning is obscene and he wants no part of it.( I heard him say this on Larry King)

Takes Americans minds off of the millions of people in Iraq that have been killed, injured and turned into refugees by the Bush administrations illegal and immoral war in Iraq. (that is really giving too much credit to most Americans)

Americans would much prefer to think about the elections in a year and a half in between going to the mall and on vacations than what their government and military did to a country that never attacked the U.S.

Mandrake @ 59

Diane @ 41

Meanwhile, back at the Swamp … I don’t think Mudcat’s pesudo apology is going too well.

linky, sil vous plais?

That is so sad. I really think Mudcat’s heart is in the right place. I just think he did something really stupid. Temporary insanity maybe?

Ed*ard Teller @ 66

GSD @ 54

Good news!

The Weapons of Mass Destruction have been found.

The bad news is they were dumped all over the ocean floor along the Eastern seaboard.

-GSD

The Soviets dumped thousands of tons of the same kind of stuff in the North Pacific and Arctic Oceans. Also, the late Pete Isleib, one of Alaska’s great ornithologists, documented huge American dumps of similar WMDs south of the Aleutian Trench in the early to mid-1960s. His notes and document copies were destroyed when his house in Cordova burnt down in the early 1980s.

Maybe the statue of ted Stevens can be made from reconsituted WMD and place at the end of a long bridge to somewhere.

-GSD

Mandrake @ 59 – here is the link.
http://time-blog.com/swampland…..ntion.html

Oklahoma kiddo @ 8

I want Gore in ‘08!

I am so with you on this! I have just dreamed up the ultimate Waiting for Gore Campaign campaign. Lemme think on this a bit.

Meanwhile, “The Assault on Reason” is a must-read for human beings. Even right-wingers. Surely there’s a shred of humanity buried until all that crap, yes/no?

LS @ 64

I’d like to see Gore/Whitehouse

Yeah, Whitehouse was incredible on the Gonzales no-confidence motion yesterday. Did you catch that? Man, I would NOT want to be prosecuted by him, guilty or not!

Spiritcatcher @ 82

If you truly want to scare the Reps into heart attacks, make up some bumper stickers “Gore / Bloomberg ‘08″

I prefer Gore/Feingold myself. ;-)

GSD @ 83

LS @ 75

Could be. I’d bet 11/1/08. Not enough time for the public to look into how it went down.

Bin Laden will be the guest speaker at the Republican Convention in 2008.

-GSD

Funny…sad…all rolled into one!

From our own Cafe Press. Re-elect Gore goodies.
http://www.cafepress.com/electionblues/884543

PeterK @ 92

LS @ 64

I’d like to see Gore/Whitehouse

Yeah, Whitehouse was incredible on the Gonzales no-confidence motion yesterday. Did you catch that? Man, I would NOT want to be prosecuted by him, guilty or not!

How old is Whitehouse?

PeterK @ 92

LS @ 64

I’d like to see Gore/Whitehouse

Yeah, Whitehouse was incredible on the Gonzales no-confidence motion yesterday. Did you catch that? Man, I would NOT want to be prosecuted by him, guilty or not!

blah, blah, blah – NOT TRUE!!!
blah, blah, blah – NOT TRUE!!!
blah, blah, blah – NOT TRUE!!!
blah, blah, blah – NOT TRUE!!!

I was trying to find some video of that, but my computer was acting up. He is so kewl!

Mudcat Saunders is an Edwards adviser. Known for his “rural outreach” but recently manifesting itself in whiny ass behavior attacking the netroots and squealing about how misunderstood the inbred creationists have become.

-GSD

PeterK @ 92

LS @ 64

I’d like to see Gore/Whitehouse

Yeah, Whitehouse was incredible on the Gonzales no-confidence motion yesterday. Did you catch that? Man, I would NOT want to be prosecuted by him, guilty or not!

As a nation our two major concerns should be global warming and the death of the middle class. The middle class has really helped us achieve great things. (and I don’t mean Lou Dobb’s idea of the middle class. I mean unions, health care and the american dream). I still say Gore/Clark

LS @ 97

PeterK @ 92

Yeah, Whitehouse was incredible on the Gonzales no-confidence motion yesterday. Did you catch that? Man, I would NOT want to be prosecuted by him, guilty or not!

blah, blah, blah – NOT TRUE!!!
blah, blah, blah – NOT TRUE!!!
blah, blah, blah – NOT TRUE!!!
blah, blah, blah – NOT TRUE!!!

I was trying to find some video of that, but my computer was acting up. He is so kewl!

I saw it on CSPAN on the net. Don’t know if they archive, tho.

PeterK @ 100

LS @ 97

blah, blah, blah – NOT TRUE!!!
blah, blah, blah – NOT TRUE!!!
blah, blah, blah – NOT TRUE!!!
blah, blah, blah – NOT TRUE!!!

I was trying to find some video of that, but my computer was acting up. He is so kewl!

I saw it on CSPAN on the net. Don’t know if they archive, tho.

C&L might have it.

Joe Klein’s conscience @ 96

PeterK @ 92

Yeah, Whitehouse was incredible on the Gonzales no-confidence motion yesterday. Did you catch that? Man, I would NOT want to be prosecuted by him, guilty or not!

How old is Whitehouse?

Early 50s, at a guess (I only saw him on the net–small screen y’know).

GSD @89: Definitely. Shpeaking as one of those high-tone liberals a la Mudcat: A multi-media project involving various toxins and explosives would be so apropos!

GSD @ 98

Mudcat Saunders is an Edwards adviser. Known for his “rural outreach” but recently manifesting itself in whiny ass behavior attacking the netroots and squealing about how misunderstood the inbred creationists have become.

-GSD

Fortunately, Edwards’ most powerful advisor is Elizabeth Edwards, and she has no truck with that sort of nonsense. Saunders may have been stuck on Edwards’ payroll to placate certain Beltway types, but he’s not going to override Elizabeth.

hayduke @ 48

The only thing wrong with Gore is that he put Holy Joe LIEberman on the ticket. He’s got some explaning to do on that one. BIG TIME.

Here’s a hypothetical: What path do you suppose Lieberman would have followed had Gore been elected? Because 2008 might have been Lieberman’s run at the top of the ticket. Maybe there really is a dog!

Two days after Bloodthirsty Joe Lieberman called for war with Iran…..Nicholas Burns is alleging Iran is aiding The Taliban.

P.S.Is George Bush going to have to invade Central Command after it has been revealed that they are the source of some weapons being used by Iraqi insurgents?

-GSD

snowbird42 @ 15

I cant imagine why Gore would write this book if he wasnt going to run.

I can. I imagine he hopes people will, you know, read what he wrote.

GSD @ 89

Maybe the statue of ted Stevens can be made from reconsituted WMD and place at the end of a long bridge to somewhere.

-GSD

Although I’ve communicated directly to Sen. Stevens that I feel he should leave office, people should be aware that from the fall of the Soviet Union through the beginning of the Bush administration, nobody in congress or in DC, for that matter, did more to assure responsible dismantling of Soviet nuclear boats and ships than Stevens. He was also in there from the beginning in trying to find ways to keep Soviet and Eastern Bloc nuclear and WMD scientists both gainfully employed and accounted for in the period between 1990 and about 2002. The Bushistas have destroyed that program entirely, though.

I call him Pudcat.

I am tired of the poor downtrodden ‘heartland folks’ theme that is forwarded by beltway asschappers who don’t give a red shit about what ails most of America other than how to get them to vote.

-GSD

Elliott @ 63

DrDick @ 31

C’mon, Jane. You don’t expect him to actually read the book he is reviewing, do you? I mean he already knows everything he needs to know to state his impeccably credentialed opinion without actually working at it (or thinking, God forbid). That is how our modern punditocracy works: fact free navel gazing.

he could have at least paged through it. I mean how hard is it to see if there are endnotes? That it never occurred to him to even look in the back of the book is mind-boggling.

Obviously he has interns who do that for him and the kid who was assigned the final section of the book called in sick. C’mon, you do not think that our elite pundits should actually work (or think), do you?

Mandrake @ 76

james @ 72

Maybe Murdoch can buy both the WaPo and the WSJ so those two rolls of toilet paper Dcan finally stop trying to appear fair and balanced and can take their rightful places behind the Fox news crew as chief propagandists.

Really, just f**king get it over with.

I watched Fox this Sunday, Tennis on NBC. Kristol was all but licking Libby’s balls (am I allowed to say that here). Kristol truely fits the definition of a traitor, condoning illegality and “deliberately attempts to cover the tracks of a traitor” Libby.

Somehow Kristol’s commitment to embarrassing and pushing for the impeachment of a standing President for lying under oath about a b/j and then doing everything in his power to undermine Fitzgeralds investigation, and pushing for a pardon are not consistent or honorable. Somehow!

Juan Williams often looks sick to his stomach when he sits next to Kristol.

Even though he is a crusty old bird, I have far more respect for him than the new wave of Gingrichites like Coburn, Demint and Brownbag.

But it is indeed time for Teddy to go.

-GSD

GSD @ 106

Two days after Bloodthirsty Joe Lieberman called for war with Iran…..Nicholas Burns is alleging Iran is aiding The Taliban.

P.S.Is George Bush going to have to invade Central Command after it has been revealed that they are the source of some weapons being used by Iraqi insurgents?

-GSD

Time to reframe the article. Why would Iran want to help their enemy especially after giving us so much help in defeating the Taliban after 9/11. What did Bush do wrong?

hey guys, this is too good to miss, right on point

whenever we get a chance we need to hit the fascist neo supporters with this…they will go balistic;

Rift Between Army and White House Widens
by The Angry Rakkasan
Mon Jun 11, 2007 at 07:33:09 PM PDT
Nobody wants to talk about this in the media, but it’s true: The Army hates the Bush administration, and the Bush administration hates the Army.
This is all started when the White House ordered the Army to fight a war that wasn’t necessary. And if you’ve been in the military, or know those who have, you know that this is the cardinal sin in the sometimes rocky, but always balanced relationship between the military and its civilian principals. In essence, it’s the basis of trust between the military and the civilians who control it: You don’t send us to fight when it isn’t necessary, and we’ll do whatever else you want.
While most people would see this as pretty fair, President Bush doesn’t. He wants a military that doesn’t ask for as much. That’s why his administration has begun purging the military’s top ranks of Army officers.

The Angry Rakkasan’s diary :: ::
Richard Lardner reported for the AP this afternoon:

At a time when the Army’s soldiers are doing most of the fighting and dying in Iraq and Afghanistan, the service’s influence in key decision-making positions is waning.

Of the U.S. military’s nine combat commands, only two are run by Army generals, and that number will be cut in half when Bryan Brown retires next month as the senior officer at U.S. Special Operations Command.

So why would the Bush administration want to rid the top brass of the Army’s influence? That’s pretty easy:

“The political appointees seem to be saying to the Army that its senior officers are not intellectually equipped to hold the highest levels of command,” said Loren Thompson, a defense analyst with the Lexington Institute, a think tank in Arlington, Va.

Allow me to translate that: In this case,

“are not intellectually equipped”

means

“do not agree with our insane methods of managing international conflict.”

great stuff, have a read

Bill Kristol would also easily pour into a Jell-O mold. A more oily and gelatinous cretin there is not.

The poster boy for the banality of evil.

-GSD

Diane @ 90

Mandrake @ 59 – here is the link.
http://time-blog.com/swampland…..ntion.html

Thank you. Pretty sorry blogging, there. Time’s blogs look like pre-school doodlings compared to blogs like FDL. Hence, the resentment and jealousy on their end.

Its not just the book. Its the movie, the Oscar, the book, the bestseller, and the Nobel Peace Prize Nomination, and perhaps the Nobel Peace Prize. GENIUS. He’s outside the fray, gets to let the current front runner beat each other up and spent their $$$, then… waltz on in to claim the prize. Its really all about who will be his V.P. at this point. I’d be the house that he’s going to run.

I went looking for the Senator Whitehouse Gonzales piece, but I came back with this instead. It is about US plans to attack Iran from the Jerusalem Post. It also talks about more emphasis being directed toward the Navy and Airforce for future defense, which falls into line with Perris 114.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/S…..e/ShowFull

JPL @ 113

GSD @ 106

Two days after Bloodthirsty Joe Lieberman called for war with Iran…..Nicholas Burns is alleging Iran is aiding The Taliban.

P.S.Is George Bush going to have to invade Central Command after it has been revealed that they are the source of some weapons being used by Iraqi insurgents?

-GSD

Time to reframe the article. Why would Iran want to help their enemy especially after giving us so much help in defeating the Taliban after 9/11. What did Bush do wrong?

Because the US hasn’t stopped threatening Iran since 2001. Because the US is actively arming and fomenting instability in Iran.

Among other things.

-GSD

Phoenix Woman @ 104

GSD @ 98

Mudcat Saunders is an Edwards adviser. Known for his “rural outreach” but recently manifesting itself in whiny ass behavior attacking the netroots and squealing about how misunderstood the inbred creationists have become.

-GSD

Fortunately, Edwards’ most powerful advisor is Elizabeth Edwards, and she has no truck with that sort of nonsense. Saunders may have been stuck on Edwards’ payroll to placate certain Beltway types, but he’s not going to override Elizabeth.

Excellent point. I hope she kicks his sorry ass. Maybe we should write to her.

OT: breaking (?) via HuffPost

WASHINGTON — Special Prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald urged a federal judge Tuesday not to delay former White House aide I. Lewis “Scooter” Libby’s 2 1/2-year prison sentence in the CIA leak case.

Libby, the former chief of staff to Vice President Dick Cheney, has argued that he has a good chance of winning an appeal and should be allowed to remain free until that challenge has run its course.

U.S. District Judge Reggie B. Walton, who sentenced Libby to prison for lying to authorities and obstructing the investigation into the 2003 leak of CIA operative Valerie Plame’s identity, has said he sees no reason to grant Libby’s request. He did not set a date for Libby to report to prison, however, and scheduled a hearing on the issue for Thursday.

A delay in Libby’s sentence would give President Bush more time to consider pardon requests from Libby’s supporters, who say the loyal aide was caught up in a political investigation and does not deserve prison time. (snip)

Fitzgerald, in court documents filed Tuesday, said an appeals court is unlikely to overturn Libby’s conviction because the evidence against him was so overwhelming.

Who reads that rag anyway? Geez….

just checking in and catching up on posts and comments…. hmm i see fitz wants libby in jail like now – good for him….i dont think gore’ll run and clark is now a commenter on faux news….

hayduke @ 117

Its not just the book. Its the movie, the Oscar, the book, the bestseller, and the Nobel Peace Prize Nomination, and perhaps the Nobel Peace Prize. GENIUS. He’s outside the fray, gets to let the current front runner beat each other up and spent their $$$, then… waltz on in to claim the prize. Its really all about who will be his V.P. at this point. I’d be the house that he’s going to run.

I am not a big Gore fan (though he has improved in the last few years), but I honestly do not think he is all that calculating. I think he is generally sincere about what he says and does and really is not contemplating a run.

GSD Those are things that you don’t hear on the news. Do you think that the average Joe realizes that Iran and the Taliban are enemies? Help us out CNN and tell us what is really going on.

Also Palestinian militants have been barraging Israel for days with katyushas and the Palestinian Authority and Hamas are about in civil war.

One of the many stabilizing benefits of the Bush/Rice foriegn policy.

Heckuva job.

-GSD

This is soooo OT, but it made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up:

Former U.S. ambassador to Iraq meets with al-Maliki
BAGHDAD (CNN) — John Negroponte — U.S. deputy secretary of state and the former U.S. ambassador to Iraq — visited Iraq on Tuesday and spoke about security and other topics with Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki.

“We have many missions ahead of us, especially the development of our security apparatus and armed forces so they can fulfill their national role in confronting the terrorist al Qaeda organization, the Saddamists and the militias and in order to spread the rule of law all over the country,” al-Maliki’s office said in a news release confirming the meeting.

Other topics, according to the news release were completing the legislation now pending in the country’s Council of Representatives, such as a measure that strives to fairly apportion energy resources; and fostering the national reconciliation process “despite all the regional interventions and conspiracies that try to obstruct the political process.” (Posted 1:29 p.m.)

IMO Negroponte’s hands in anything is truly sinister.

Joe Klein’s conscience @ 93

Spiritcatcher @ 82

If you truly want to scare the Reps into heart attacks, make up some bumper stickers “Gore / Bloomberg ‘08″

“

I prefer Gore/Feingold myself. ;-)

How about Gore/Helen Thomas …or are folks too ageist?

I love Helen Thomas. I remember when she was allowed to sit in the front row of a few Bush administration press conferences. She would sit there with her hand supporting her chin like a wise old owl. You could just see the questions on her face that were running through her mind “are these folks for real”?

Has there ever been a journalist who has run for President?

LS @ 118

I went looking for the Senator Whitehouse Gonzales piece, but I came back with this instead. It is about US plans to attack Iran from the Jerusalem Post. It also talks about more emphasis being directed toward the Navy and Airforce for future defense, which falls into line with Perris 114.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/S…..e/ShowFull

Embedded within that JPost article is this link to details of all the major presidential candidates’ stand on war with Iran. I was tempted to post the link earlier, but I’m afraid my pessimism about war with Iran is too depressing for some pups…

kdh22 @ 127

This is soooo OT, but it made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up:

Former U.S. ambassador to Iraq meets with al-Maliki
BAGHDAD (CNN) — John Negroponte — U.S. deputy secretary of state and the former U.S. ambassador to Iraq — visited Iraq on Tuesday and spoke about security and other topics with Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki.

“We have many missions ahead of us, especially the development of our security apparatus and armed forces so they can fulfill their national role in confronting the terrorist al Qaeda organization, the Saddamists and the militias and in order to spread the rule of law all over the country,” al-Maliki’s office said in a news release confirming the meeting.

Other topics, according to the news release were completing the legislation now pending in the country’s Council of Representatives, such as a measure that strives to fairly apportion energy resources; and fostering the national reconciliation process “despite all the regional interventions and conspiracies that try to obstruct the political process.” (Posted 1:29 p.m.)

IMO Negroponte’s hands in anything is truly sinister.

Ugh, kdh, that did the same thing to me. Death Squad Negroponte…this is like finding a horse’s head in your bed. Is Negroponte delivering a threat to al-Maliki, or a resource? Makes me want to heave.

DrDick @ 124 Man I don’t know… if he thinks he can win you can bet he’ll run. NO ONE that has a real shot walks away from that kind of power. Especially when they’ve been as close as Gore has. Also he was smart not to run in 2004.

I have some issues with Gore but I’d take him out of any of the Dems right now save Kunnich (longshot anyway).

When Gore says “I will not run” I’ll believe it, until then, he’s the frontrunner as far as I’m concerned. He’s parsing his words, I think there is a reason for it.

The Last Temptation of Al Gore:

http://www.time.com/time/natio…..09,00.html

With the surge going sour, how do you folks think our Congress will react if the Iraqi government does take a 2 month vacation?

LS @ 118

I went looking for the Senator Whitehouse Gonzales piece

[snip]

I can’t find it either. Maybe CSPAN hasn’t put it up yet, it was only yesterday. Meanwhile, here is a nice piece on the debate in the Guardian by Marcy:

http://commentisfree.guardian……_vote.html

OT
CSPAN 3 hearing on about Katrina v Insurers.

i’d prefer any ticket that has sen feingold on it – at this point none of the folks running has me excited (sigh..)

OT info-
Laura Flanders, whose book is frontlined on this page and who was on fdl recently will be on lou dobbs/cnn today……

“And we’ll be joined by three of the nation’s best radio talk
show hosts to find out what the American people are fired up
about: Warren Ballentine, XM Radio in Raleigh, North Carolina,
Laura Flanders, Air America in New York and Doug McIntyre, KABC
in Los Angeles.”

Rayne @ 130

kdh22 @ 127

This is soooo OT, but it made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up:

Former U.S. ambassador to Iraq meets with al-Maliki
BAGHDAD (CNN) — John Negroponte — U.S. deputy secretary of state and the former U.S. ambassador to Iraq — visited Iraq on Tuesday and spoke about security and other topics with Iraqi Prime Minister Nuri al-Maliki.

“We have many missions ahead of us, especially the development of our security apparatus and armed forces so they can fulfill their national role in confronting the terrorist al Qaeda organization, the Saddamists and the militias and in order to spread the rule of law all over the country,” al-Maliki’s office said in a news release confirming the meeting.

Other topics, according to the news release were completing the legislation now pending in the country’s Council of Representatives, such as a measure that strives to fairly apportion energy resources; and fostering the national reconciliation process “despite all the regional interventions and conspiracies that try to obstruct the political process.” (Posted 1:29 p.m.)

IMO Negroponte’s hands in anything is truly sinister.

Ugh, kdh, that did the same thing to me. Death Squad Negroponte…this is like finding a horse’s head in your bed. Is Negroponte delivering a threat to al-Maliki, or a resource? Makes me want to heave.

You know history repeats itself.

Feeling pessimistic about Iran? There is a good argument why it’s not so likely (see 2nd article from yesterday).

http://www.juancole.com/

Juan Cole seems to be very knowledgeable, AFAIK.

must be a new post going up. getting that endless racetrack on the refresh.

sho nuff.

ooops. deleted.

Brisingamen @ 132

With the surge going sour, how do you folks think our Congress will react if the Iraqi government does take a 2 month vacation?

The surge was supposed to create “room” for the political process to take place. The Iraqi parliament can claim they’re just going to wait until the surge creates that “room.”

Hi,
Love your stuff, usually. The guy’s an asshole for giving Gore shit about not having footnotes, and ignoring the end notes. However, he’s right about the quote. Check here.
http://www.snopes.com/quotes/lincoln.htm

Sorry, no new thread.

no thread, just Pach’s request to advertise at the lake. I set up an automatic debit that goes to FDL every payday. painless. about the same as I would pay for the Washington Post (which of course I won’t pay for any time soon). worth every penny.

Ed*ard Teller @ 129

Embedded within that JPost article is this link to details of all the major presidential candidates’ stand on war with Iran. I was tempted to post the link earlier, but I’m afraid my pessimism about war with Iran is too depressing for some pups…

ET – i’d rather be depressed about reality than happy in denial. do you have an analysis you’re willing to share?

Ed*ard Teller @ 129

LS @ 118

I went looking for the Senator Whitehouse Gonzales piece, but I came back with this instead. It is about US plans to attack Iran from the Jerusalem Post. It also talks about more emphasis being directed toward the Navy and Airforce for future defense, which falls into line with Perris 114.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/S…..e/ShowFull

Embedded within that JPost article is this link to details of all the major presidential candidates’ stand on war with Iran. I was tempted to post the link earlier, but I’m afraid my pessimism about war with Iran is too depressing for some pups…

Seymour Hersch has been blowing his bugle for quite some time “The Iran Plan”

http://www.newyorker.com/archi…..417fa_fact

The plans for a much desired pre-emptive strike on Iran are all but layed out at the PNAC wesbite under U.S. strategies.

I am sure the “cakewalk in Iraq” zealots are hoping that a pre-emptive strike on Iran happens before the A*P*C trial/hearing. That is if anyone in the MSM or elsewhere ever reports anything about this trial.

To the lawyers here at FDL, how do I find out about where and when a trial/ hearing is taking place?

Eureka Springs @141
That link takes you back to this AM’s post.

Does clicking on the ads bring revenue to the lake. I hope so cause I clicked an everything!

OT: Here’s the contact number for the Edwards campaign:
Phone: (919) 636-3131

hayduke @ 131

DrDick @ 124 Man I don’t know… if he thinks he can win you can bet he’ll run. NO ONE that has a real shot walks away from that kind of power. Especially when they’ve been as close as Gore has. Also he was smart not to run in 2004.

I have some issues with Gore but I’d take him out of any of the Dems right now save Kunnich (longshot anyway).

When Gore says “I will not run” I’ll believe it, until then, he’s the frontrunner as far as I’m concerned. He’s parsing his words, I think there is a reason for it.

The Last Temptation of Al Gore:

http://www.time.com/time/natio…..09,00.html

Did you read the whole story? Was it Kos that mentioned that if he was losing weight and getting trim that it was a sign he was leaning towards getting in? We can always hope, right?

selise @ 146

Ed*ard Teller @ 129

Embedded within that JPost article is this link to details of all the major presidential candidates’ stand on war with Iran. I was tempted to post the link earlier, but I’m afraid my pessimism about war with Iran is too depressing for some pups…

ET – i’d rather be depressed about reality than happy in denial. do you have an analysis you’re willing to share?

Just popping in, came in to get a glass of water ’cause I’m i the garden, weeding and planting. Listening to Cold Play….your comment reminded me of the lyrics I just heard…am I part of the cure, or part of the disease. Well, it’s always Good to aske questions. I like your comments, Selise. Aargh, back to the work. But the garden gives back. Yes?

kathleen @ 12:52 pm -

News about the trial you’re wondering about, which has apparently been postponed until September, is posted either in a previous comment in this thread or in the comments appearing in another of today’s threads.

Today’s lesson learned: Do not post “breaking” news as hot flash w/o checking in on FDL’s posts earlier in the day. (sigh) Shoulda known the big kids would be all over it. I shall now retreat to my happy place.

Another OT but wow!

http://www.campaignlegalcenter.org/press-2667.html

Check out this letter to DiFi from former DOJ Voting Section personnel re: Hans von Spakovsky and the impending confirmation hearing(s).

Ouch! :)

demi aka dmoore @ 17

Jane – Really sorry for this OT, so early, but…I’m trying to help Bree Walker who is buying Camp Casey to help find a bio-fuel bus to get folks there for a Peace Rally. Information on Bree at Bradblog, June 9th piece. (sorry, can’t link the specific articles)
You have my email…oh, beautiful powers that be, right? Your voice would be so much stronger than mine. I have more info to share, if you have time to help. And, THANK YOU!

While I’m still here I’m going to repeat my comment from earlier, ’cause I’d really appreciate any help any of the fellow dogs can contribute.
Please indulge my interruption. But, now, back to the garden.
Will check back with you later. and heartfelt thanks for everything talked about, contemplated and acted upon here at the Lake.

kathleen @ 147

Ed*ard Teller @ 129

Embedded within that JPost article is this link to details of all the major presidential candidates’ stand on war with Iran. I was tempted to post the link earlier, but I’m afraid my pessimism about war with Iran is too depressing for some pups…

Seymour Hersch has been blowing his bugle for quite some time “The Iran Plan”

http://www.newyorker.com/archi…..417fa_fact

The plans for a much desired pre-emptive strike on Iran are all but layed out at the PNAC wesbite under U.S. strategies.

I am sure the “cakewalk in Iraq” zealots are hoping that a pre-emptive strike on Iran happens before the A*P*C trial/hearing. That is if anyone in the MSM or elsewhere ever reports anything about this trial.

To the lawyers here at FDL, how do I find out about where and when a trial/ hearing is taking place?

kathleen,
Here’s what I found through a Google alert:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,280172,00.html
(THanks, Stephen Parrish!)

demi aka dmoore @ 152

But the garden gives back. Yes?

with gifts beyond compare. *g*

“Liberal Interventionism” – Neocon strategy.
So, this is a site where the neocons have gone to try to escape the PNAC stigma.

http://www.henryjacksonsociety.org/

demi aka dmoore @ 156

demi aka dmoore @ 17

Jane – Really sorry for this OT, so early, but…I’m trying to help Bree Walker who is buying Camp Casey to help find a bio-fuel bus to get folks there for a Peace Rally. Information on Bree at Bradblog, June 9th piece. (sorry, can’t link the specific articles)
You have my email…oh, beautiful powers that be, right? Your voice would be so much stronger than mine. I have more info to share, if you have time to help. And, THANK YOU!

While I’m still here I’m going to repeat my comment from earlier, ’cause I’d really appreciate any help any of the fellow dogs can contribute.
Please indulge my interruption. But, now, back to the garden.
Will check back with you later. and heartfelt thanks for everything talked about, contemplated and acted upon here at the Lake.

Geographically, we are not far from Crawford. (Intellectually we are millions of miles away.) If our ability to be on-the-ground can help the country or democracy in any way, we’re happy to help. Mods know how to get in touch with me, yes?

TexB @ 160

demi aka dmoore @ 156

While I’m still here I’m going to repeat my comment from earlier, ’cause I’d really appreciate any help any of the fellow dogs can contribute.
Please indulge my interruption. But, now, back to the garden.
Will check back with you later. and heartfelt thanks for everything talked about, contemplated and acted upon here at the Lake.

Geographically, we are not far from Crawford. (Intellectually we are millions of miles away.) If our ability to be on-the-ground can help the country or democracy in any way, we’re happy to help. Mods know how to get in touch with me, yes?

I don’t know if this would be helpful, but check with Willie Nelson’s Biodiesel station on I-35 North of Waco. The name has slipped my mind.

LS @ 161

TexB @ 160

Geographically, we are not far from Crawford. (Intellectually we are millions of miles away.) If our ability to be on-the-ground can help the country or democracy in any way, we’re happy to help. Mods know how to get in touch with me, yes?

I don’t know if this would be helpful, but check with Willie Nelson’s Biodiesel station on I-35 North of Waco. The name has slipped my mind.

That’s practically right around the corner from Crawford.

LS @ 159

“Liberal Interventionism” – Neocon strategy.
So, this is a site where the neocons have gone to try to escape the PNAC stigma.

http://www.henryjacksonsociety.org/

Henry Jackson is actually godfather of the DLC types. The HoJo’s and HRC’s. I read once where Al From said so himself. So while they are neo-con related, it is not exactly the same thing as PNAC.

kathleen @ 58

JPL @ 42

Although I like Gore I still wish the American people would wake up to the talents of Clark. Most Americans don’t realize that he has a grasp of the economic situation like Clinton. The top percentages are living like it’s in the twenties and that’s what I’m afraid of…
They just see the General in front of his name.

I agree Wesley Clark is amazing. Everytime I have heard him speak about Iraq, Iran, the middle east I am so impressed.

The Israeli lobby viciously attacked him a while back for a comment that he made. This often means that the individual has a wider perspective on the middle east than the “Israeli firsters” want pursued or considered.

Take heart for when we reelect President Gore in 2008 the good General Clark would surely be among his first appointment to his new cabinet for who is more qualified for Secretary of Defense – a man the thinking citizens of our beleagured Republic’s can count on to clean up (out?) the rat nests Rummy and Shooter spawned throughout the DOD.

The new Gore Administration is destined to not only clean out the rat nests embedded in eight years years of the sociopathic, treasonous and most corrupt era in our history, President Gore will restore hope and dignity and peace globally.

ReElect President Al Gore in 2008. Accept no substitute!

Margot @ 157

kathleen @ 147

Seymour Hersch has been blowing his bugle for quite some time “The Iran Plan”

http://www.newyorker.com/archi…..417fa_fact

The plans for a much desired pre-emptive strike on Iran are all but layed out at the PNAC wesbite under U.S. strategies.

I am sure the “cakewalk in Iraq” zealots are hoping that a pre-emptive strike on Iran happens before the A*P*C trial/hearing. That is if anyone in the MSM or elsewhere ever reports anything about this trial.

To the lawyers here at FDL, how do I find out about where and when a trial/ hearing is taking place?

kathleen,
Here’s what I found through a Google alert:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,280172,00.html
(THanks, Stephen Parrish!)

Thanks. This is the sixth time that this trial has been delayed. Will the Israeli lobby be successful at having it dismissed? They sure have been successful at shutting down “most’ news coverage of the investigation.

Interesting that this info was at Fox

I went looking for the Senator Whitehouse Gonzales piece, but I came back with this instead. It is about US plans to attack Iran from the Jerusalem Post. It also talks about more emphasis being directed toward the Navy and Airforce for future defense, which falls into line with Perris 114.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/S…..e/ShowFull

Randi Rhodes is talking about this article today. She’s got a lot of details

Clark sent out another email today.

A snip below

After wrongly supporting George W. Bush’s strategic blunder of attacking Iraq, and continuing to support Bush’s failed policies after the invasion, Senator Joe Lieberman made irresponsible comments this weekend regarding military action against Iran.

On CBS’s Face the Nation, Lieberman said, “If [the Iranians] don’t play by the rules, we’ve got to use our force, and to me, that would include taking military action to stop them from doing what they’re doing.”

This type of “tough-talk” by the Bush Administration and folks like Senator Joe Lieberman is why VoteVets.org and I collaborated to create StopIranWar.com, calling for heavy diplomatic, economic, and political action to discourage the acquisition of nuclear capabilities by the Iranian government.

Over 40,000 people have signed our petition to President Bush, urging him to work with our allies and use every diplomatic, political, and economic option at our disposal to deal with Iran. Add your name to the petition today!

http://StopIranWar.com/

She’s got this article too.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO505A.html

no wonder HoJo is out paving the way.
When will our side stand up?

Joe Klein’s conscience @ 163

LS @ 159

“Liberal Interventionism” – Neocon strategy.
So, this is a site where the neocons have gone to try to escape the PNAC stigma.

http://www.henryjacksonsociety.org/

Henry Jackson is actually godfather of the DLC types. The HoJo’s and HRC’s. I read once where Al From said so himself. So while they are neo-con related, it is not exactly the same thing as PNAC.

I guess I assumed that since Richard Perle and William Kristol are listed as Patrons, it was more closely related. I see what you are saying.

newspaperbrat @ 164

kathleen @ 58

I agree Wesley Clark is amazing. Everytime I have heard him speak about Iraq, Iran, the middle east I am so impressed.

The Israeli lobby viciously attacked him a while back for a comment that he made. This often means that the individual has a wider perspective on the middle east than the “Israeli firsters” want pursued or considered.

Take heart for when we reelect President Gore in 2008 the good General Clark would surely be among his first appointment to his new cabinet for who is more qualified for Secretary of Defense – a man the thinking citizens of our beleagured Republic’s can count on to clean up (out?) the rat nests Rummy and Shooter spawned throughout the DOD.

The new Gore Administration is destined to not only clean out the rat nests embedded in eight years years of the sociopathic, treasonous and most corrupt era in our history, President Gore will restore hope and dignity and peace globally.

ReElect President Al Gore in 2008. Accept no substitute!

Did you see the Time article yet? The drum beat will have to get louder for Gore to enter. It can be done, but it needs to be louder.

TexB @ 162

LS @ 161

I don’t know if this would be helpful, but check with Willie Nelson’s Biodiesel station on I-35 North of Waco. The name has slipped my mind.

That’s practically right around the corner from Crawford.

Willie might get involved in this Camp Casey thing.

Wes Clark alive and well and sending email. His invitation to join his effort to Stop Iran War in the toobz now.

LS @ 169

Joe Klein’s conscience @ 163

Henry Jackson is actually godfather of the DLC types. The HoJo’s and HRC’s. I read once where Al From said so himself. So while they are neo-con related, it is not exactly the same thing as PNAC.

I guess I assumed that since Richard Perle and William Kristol are listed as Patrons, it was more closely related. I see what you are saying.

I didn’t see that. I thought Kristol and Perle were from the Leo Strauss school of things. Maybe Jackson was too. I don’t know the whole history. I do know that Al From and the DLC hold up Jackson as a hero(he is what they model their foreign policy on). So it makes sense they were so gung ho for invading Iraq. It is kind of interesting that this society is based in England.

Demi – Try sending your biodiesel bus questions and the Camp Casey related stuff to Poodie. You never know, they might get involved. He is Willie Nelson’s Road Manager:

http://www.poodies.info/contact.htm

No foolin’ a new thread.

There is a new thread.

Thanks, Eureka (and now TexB), appreciate that, was just coming back downstairs here to provide a link.

BTW, what’s to stop you from using a pseudonym, “Eureka Springs” at Facebook? Somebody going to out you?

It’ll be just my luck I’ll be EPU’d, but here goes:

Over on dKos yesterday, A Seigel wrote a follow-up diary, Washington Post responds re Gorephobia Truthiness … and gives us Deborah Howell’s response to his initial letter:

from Ombudsman Internet DropBox 6:33 pm (4 hours ago)
to A Siegel
date Jun 11, 2007 6:33 PM
subject Re: Re “What Al Wishes Abe Said”

Thank you for your note. A correction will run on the fact there were endnotes in the Al Gore book. However, the author stands by his belief that the Lincoln never said the things Al Gore quoted him as saying.

Deborah Howell, Washington Post Ombudsman

I’d post his reply, but it’s rather long, although thoroughly enjoyable.

Larisa Alexnadrovna at Raw Story catches up with O’neil about the spy Hansen.

http://rawstory.com/news/2007/….._0612.html

O’neil believes that “Although he doesn’t think there is any “correlation” between the Hanssen and Plame cases, O’Neill tells RAW STORY “a journalist that knowingly or negligently releases/reveals classified information should face federal prosecution.”

It really makes one wonder why journalist like Judy Miller and newspapers like the New York Times print seriously flawed information about pre-war intelligence and then are not held accountable by the law for very serious mistakes in their reporting.

Robert Novak prints the classified status of a CIA undercover agent and does not suffer any serious consequences (oh I know Judy lost her job with a $$ settlement). But Judy’s false reports and Novak’s report have “allegedly” damaged National Security and the results of printing false pre-war intelligence on humans lives (in Iraq) is catastrophic.

“Allegedly” in the A*P*C /rosen investigation (trial delayed for the sixth time) Rosen was taped saying that “he was so happy that the U.S. did not have an “official secrets act” as classified intelligence was being made available to him.

Why are journalist able to operate knowing that it is highly unlikely that they will be held accountable by the law?

ccmask @ 150

OT: Here’s the contact number for the Edwards campaign:
Phone: (919) 636-3131

For those who would rather email, I’ve been getting messages from this link:
Edwards Campaign Link

LS @ 174

Demi – Try sending your biodiesel bus questions and the Camp Casey related stuff to Poodie. You never know, they might get involved. He is Willie Nelson’s Road Manager:

http://www.poodies.info/contact.htm

Thank you, LS. Saved link. We’ll help make this happen together. I appreciate your help.

selise @ 158

demi aka dmoore @ 152

But the garden gives back. Yes?

with gifts beyond compare. *g*

This flower is fabulous. You are too. It’s too hot to work out there now… I’m stayin’ in.
I have to go there Early! (talk to you later.)

Joe Klein’s conscience @ 170

newspaperbrat @ 164

Take heart for when we reelect President Gore in 2008 the good General Clark would surely be among his first appointment to his new cabinet for who is more qualified for Secretary of Defense – a man the thinking citizens of our beleagured Republic’s can count on to clean up (out?) the rat nests Rummy and Shooter spawned throughout the DOD.

The new Gore Administration is destined to not only clean out the rat nests embedded in eight years years of the sociopathic, treasonous and most corrupt era in our history, President Gore will restore hope and dignity and peace globally.

ReElect President Al Gore in 2008. Accept no substitute!

Did you see the Time article yet? The drum beat will have to get louder for Gore to enter. It can be done, but it needs to be louder.

When I was a kid hanging out in newsrooms with my late great reporter Dad one of the frequent wise cracks these pros all seemed to favor and repeat often about TIME boiled down to: TIME – the rag for people too lazy to think for themselves – or knowing snark to that effect.

No amount of spin from MSM, DLC, RNC, etc. et al ad-nauseam could stop the momentum of a Gore run following the upcoming worldwide concert and fall Nobel Peace Prize well earned award. The next presidency is Gore’s if he chooses to run.

The great irony IMHO is the power of the internet and the little discussed but powerful reality that even the least privileged among our citizens as well as greatly privileged know Gore’s relection has moral dimensions. He was fairly elected once and poised to receive a historic landslide reelection in the happy event he chooses to enter the fray before the early 2008 primaries.

kathleen @ 179

Larisa Alexnadrovna at Raw Story catches up with O’neil about the spy Hansen.

http://rawstory.com/news/2007/….._0612.html

O’neil believes that “Although he doesn’t think there is any “correlation” between the Hanssen and Plame cases, O’Neill tells RAW STORY “a journalist that knowingly or negligently releases/reveals classified information should face federal prosecution.”

It really makes one wonder why journalist like Judy Miller and newspapers like the New York Times print seriously flawed information about pre-war intelligence and then are not held accountable by the law for very serious mistakes in their reporting.

Robert Novak prints the classified status of a CIA undercover agent and does not suffer any serious consequences (oh I know Judy lost her job with a $$ settlement). But Judy’s false reports and Novak’s report have “allegedly” damaged National Security and the results of printing false pre-war intelligence on humans lives (in Iraq) is catastrophic.

“Allegedly” in the A*P*C /rosen investigation (trial delayed for the sixth time) Rosen was taped saying that “he was so happy that the U.S. did not have an “official secrets act” as classified intelligence was being made available to him.

Why are journalist able to operate knowing that it is highly unlikely that they will be held accountable by the law?

i completely disagree… otherwise we are never going to know about things like rendition and secret prisons, nsa wiretapping in violation of fisa.

if reporters are allow to write stories on classified material – then all the gov has to do is classify their bad acts.

“…The Department of Justice even invented the position of White House Liason, first time ever, who by her own admission screened applicants based on inappropriate, and probably illegal, political factors.…

“There have been an almost incredible series of half-truths and obfuscations coming out of the Attorney General and his circle:

“They told us that the firings of US attorneys was perfomance related. Not true. They told us that the Attorney General was not involved in and didn’t discuss the plan to fire US Attorneys. Not true. They told us that the White House was not involved. Not true. They told us that these EARS performance evaluations were not relevant. Not true. They told us that the Attorney General didn’t discuss the substance of his testimony with other witnesses during the investigation. Not true. They told us that the Chief of Staff to the Deputy Attorney General, never made threatening calls to U.S. Attorneys who were going to publically discuss the matter. Again, not true. How many times can the Department of Justice say things that aren’t true?…”

– Senator Sheldon Whitehouse (D-RI), 11 Jun 07

How long that remains a rhetorical question is at issue, but it is still nonetheless true that these actions are now in evidence as a direct result of Democratic control of the Congress. Bravo, Senator Whitehouse, who clearly laid bare the Bushco cronyfication of the DoJ yesterday.

My Letter to the Post:

The degree to which the Editorial shop at WaPo has mailed it in is astonishing. Did no one read the first sentence of this hackery before the paper went to bed? We’re only talking about the former vice president here; seems like a common-enough courtesy, especially for the friggin’ Sunday paper.

Your correction is absolutely farcical and completely inadequate. I would actually like to read 800 words on the particular process by which this “editorial” was published. Who solicited whom? — did Ferguson call WaPo or vice versa? How much money was exchanged/what was the contract? What were the names of the WaPo staff tasked with publishing this. Who pushed the “send” button, on whose authority?

I think a story like this would be a damn interesting read. I’d even pay for a copy the paper.

It’s as Joseph Pulitzer said — “Our Republic and its press will rise or fall together.”

Here’s the newsletter Ferguson is quoting Schwartz from.

In fact all the historical quotes (even those attributed to Robert Todd Lincoln) were lifted from this one newsletter.

Also notice that this account had presumably been still up for debate until the mid 90s (since the anecdote about Pete Seeger was said to have taken place “a number of years [before]” the newsletter (published in 1999).

The spuriousness of the quote does sound like a potentially legitimate complaint, but how interesting that Ferguson would probably never have found this PDF online if he hadn’t been able to google the quote itself. Ironically, footnotes and endnotes (the proto-link predecessors employed by books) only serve to obfuscate the source of a citation’s authority. I think it’s really interesting then that Ferguson seems to be in a sense demonstrating Gore’s point about how internet discourse creates a really powerful fact checking mechanism.

But internet discourse is also fantastic at unveiling the uncomfortable contextual baggage that an overly tight thesis seems to want to ignore. In this case, notice how Ferguson conveniently leaves out the way that Schwartz himself characterizes the spurious Lincoln quote: he calls it Eisenhoweresque!

But that would have clashed so awkwardly with Ferguson’s dismissive tone (not only dismissive of Gore but dismissive of the sentiment of the quote itself).

Notice the way that Schwartz (1999) bookends the spurious Lincoln quote:

A number of years ago, folk singer Pete Seeger sent a fax to the Abraham Lincoln Association trying to verify the following excerpt supposedly contained in a letter
written to Thomas Elkins on November 21, 1864: “We may congratulate ourselves that this cruel war, which has cost a vast treasure of blood and money, is almost over. But I see in the future a crisis approaching which fills me with anxiety. As a result of the war, corporations have
become enthroned, and an era of corruption in high places will follow. The money power of the
country will endeavor to prolong its rule by preying upon the prejudice of the people, until all wealth is concentrated in a few hands, and the republic destroyed. I feel at this time more anxiety for the future of my country than at any
time in the past, even in the midst of war.”
The tone and content foreshadows Dwight Eisenhower’s warning of the dangers of the “military and industrial complex.” But is it from the pen of Abraham Lincoln?

How interesting that the old school “fact checker” diligently following up the source in this example is Pete Seeger!

And how equally interesting that Ferguson leaves out such a useful piece of information: i.e. that while Gore’s allegiance to Lincoln-the-populist may prove misguided, Gore was unintentionally aligning with an equally potent Republican father figure (who also valued reason and public discourse), namely: Eisenhower.

Mandrake @ 46

Ferguson: It goes without saying that Gore isn’t the first politician to enlist Lincoln, however spuriously, in a pet cause. In 1992, Ronald Reagan used his last appearance at a GOP convention to warn of a liberal ascendancy that threatened Lincoln’s cherished Republican principles.

Ehh, you left out Bush and his pundit minions. A few months back they were trying to put the Lincoln mantle on Bush because Iraq is going up in flames. Not doing much of that these days are ya?

And how BushCo used Lincoln to rescind habeas corpus…ignoring the fact that Lincoln specifically pointed out that the Constitution stated that the executive can do so during times of INVASION or CIVIL INSURRECTION […but does not say that one can suspend it during a foreign war}.

Note the word “spurious”…that implies that Gore made up the quote…or at best took it out of context…but since Ferguson explicitly claims he didn’t review the source (noted in Gore’s end-notes)…he was pretty much asserting that Gore lied.

I wonder what precisely Mr. Ferguson’s credentials are as a Lincoln scholar to assert “the quote doesn’t exist” and why he would be so unaware of such classic Lincoln biographies if he were one?

LS @ 161

I don’t know if this would be helpful, but check with Willie Nelson’s Biodiesel station on I-35 North of Waco.

Would it be appropriate to call it “Slick Willie’s Biodiesel” or perhaps “Willie’s Biodiesel Slick” or is that just too snarky when he’s doing such a great thing for America?

Isn’t it amazing they tried to put him away for weed and here he is leading the way for America on biodiesel?

Gore did not use footnotes, but he used endotes

Has Ferguson even opened Al Gore’s book before trashing it?

Is there any way that the netroots can reverse the right-wing slant that has taken over the WaPo?

I’d bet anything Ferguson didn’t even read the book, barely looked at it, and wrote his “review” on the basis of stuff he read elsewhere.