This is who we are at the moment:
The men, Muslims from western China’s Uighur ethnic minority, were freed from their confinement in Cuba after they were found to pose no threat to the United States. They have now lived for more than a year in a squalid government refugee center on the grubby outskirts of Tirana, guarded by armed policemen.The men have been told that they will need to get work to move out of the center, they said, but that they must learn the Albanian language to get work permits. For now, they subsist on free meals heavy with macaroni and rice, and monthly stipends of about $67, which they spend mostly on brief telephone calls to their families. But some of the men have already lost hope of ever seeing their wives and children again.
“We suffered very much at Guantánamo, but we continue to suffer here,” Mr. Basit said. “The other prisoners had their countries, but we are like orphans: we have no place to go.”
Mr. Basit and four other men here, who spent time at a hamlet in Afghanistan run by Uighur separatists, are still considered terrorist suspects by China’s Communist government. Only Albania’s pro-American government would give them asylum, but Albanian officials have since told the men they cannot afford to give them much else.
Things could be worse, the former prisoners note. At least 15 of the 17 Uighurs who remain at Guantánamo have also been cleared for release, but not even Albania will accept them — and neither will the United States. Instead, American diplomats say they have asked nearly 100 countries to provide asylum to the detainees, only to find that Chinese officials have warned some of the same countries not to accept them.
“The United States has made extensive and high-level efforts over a period of four years to try to resettle the Uighurs in countries around the world,” the State Department’s legal adviser, John B. Bellinger III, said in an interview. Its lack of success, he added, “has not been for lack of trying.”
Many American officials privately describe the Uighurs’ plight as one of the more troubling episodes of the Bush administration’s detention program. The case also provides a view of the remarkable difficulties Washington has encountered in trying to winnow the detainee population at Guantánamo in response to domestic and international criticism. (emphasis mine)
Digby has a revealing glimpse of how this came to be:
That prison is right out of dystopian science fiction. It is not as if the United States government doesn’t have access to the mountains of information that shows these techniques are incredibly unreliable and counterproductive. It’s not as if they don’t know that there are much better ways of extracting information. It’s not as if over the course of centuries we developed a set of moral guidelines that define what it means to be a decent society. They know all these things. They just chose to use television shows and movies as their guideline instead of real information, real morality or the rule of law.And then, there is the assault on reason itself:
The details of prison life were given by retired and current American intelligence agents who had been promised confidentiality, the report says.Their motives were varied, Mr. Marty said. “For 15 years, I have interviewed people as an investigating magistrate and I have always noticed that at a certain point, people with secrets need to talk,” he said.
Others justified the grim treatment, the reports said, saying, in one instance: “Here’s my question. Was the guy a terrorist? ’Cause if he’s a terrorist, then I figure he got what was coming to him.”
Well, that is an excellent question, isn’t it — the very reason due process was conceived in the first place. It is, of course, unacceptable to torture anyone, even if they are terrorists. But this argument is especially specious coming from a country that picked up a bunch of innocent people and then tortured them and confined them indefinitely. (Not to mention started a war based on false evidence.) Let’s just say they aren’t the greatest at unilaterally discerning who’s guilty and who’s not. Which, again, is the fucking reason for due process in the first place.So, they adopted a torture first, ask questions later approach based upon … what? Season 1 of “24″? (emphasis mine)
In case you were wondering, the answer to that may be “yes.” Just go look at the photo that Digby posted. But someone tell BobbyG to take his blood pressure meds first…he’ll need them.
Note that the US cannot find asylum for these innocent people because the Chinese government told these nations not to take them. George Bush has put the United States in such a weakened posture that the Chinese government is now dictating terms to other nations on whether or not they can do the decent thing and accept innocent people who we have been wrongly detaining — for years — because the Chinese government doesn’t want these people to receive mercy. A lot of these nations have been enjoying Chinese loans (just like the US has been to finance a lot of George Bush’s follies), and they cannot afford to anger the Chinese and their substantially strengthened posture. Welcome to the world that George Bush built for all of us. Feeling safer now?
(Photo via maureenml0521.)
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Christy! FDL!
???
Bush!? Safe!? No, not really.
Back!
Hooray!!
We’re back!!
Hey! There’s no parking lot here after all!!!
Yay! It’s all working again!
((( tech crew )))
Thank you Techies for all your hard labors in making our lives the good that it is today. The submit comment button just worked for me (albeit a little slowly) without my having to do a hard refresh of the page.
praise the lord and pass the packets!
What Teddy said!
and note, everyone, no more spinning comments wheel of doom…!!!!
Without a repost is my original stored and will show up or should I repost?
TeddySanFran @ 7
Hey Teddy! You got first place in the bash Broder contest, huh? I made it to page 7 with my bash and skimming the comments, I think I saw TWO that could MAYBE be considered positive towards him…
QuakerGirl @ 12
I’d repost. I think all previous comments went into the electricity.
Alfred Kelgarries @ 14
Thank you – will do.
Well, Hillary Clinton said at the debate one week ago that we are safer now than we were on Nine-Eleven. So, I guess the answer to your question, Christy, is “Yes, if you believe Hillary.”
But, no, I don’t feel safer. And the way we’ve treated the Uighurs makes me feel even less safe.
Some slight disagreement it seems.
From Bloomberg: LINK
Thank you, Christy, for this post. Digby is right on!
Bob in HI
So when the cabal said they created their own reality, they meant they’d create a reality just like 24? And that all of us would have to live in it? Now, that’s scary.
I don’t feel safer but it has as much to do with the leadership of my country than it does anything done by those from other countries. The idiots in charge, from the Chimpenfuhrer and Darth on down, are far and away, the most responsible parties for my discontent with safety.
I have but one thing to say;
it is really disgusting how muchh damamge one man has been able to visit apon our country
our children and their children will pay a price told for time yet not known
Ain’t that the sad truth? It stuns me that this could happen at all. And other than a couple newspaper stories and blogs, no one is talking about this. I’m embarrassed as an American.
Christy Hardin Smith states:
“Note that the US cannot find asylum for these innocent people because the Chinese government told these nations not to take them. George Bush has put the United States in such a weakened posture that the Chinese government is now dictating terms to other nations on whether or not they can do the decent thing and accept innocent people who we have been wrongly detaining — for years — because the Chinese government doesn’t want these people to receive mercy. A lot of these nations have been enjoying Chinese loans (just like the US has been to finance a lot of George Bush’s follies), and they cannot afford to anger the Chinese and their substantially strengthened posture.”
China has been a rising star for as long as I can remember. They are so much smarter than the Bush/Cheney NeoCon company it isn’t even a competition. The NeoCons, like other cult groups, have been believing their own prejudices for so long they can’t read reality when it is in front of them. And just what was the guy thinking who cut down the last tree on Easter Island?
Kafka knew whereof he wrote ……
Here is why we can’t say BOO to the chinese, even when they kill our dogs and cats and put antifreeze in toothpaste:
http://www.sinodaily.com/repor…..t_999.html
Now this is a wingnut site (WashTimes) but the info is correct. If chine stopped buying our TBills we’d be broke tomorrow. literally. and any ideas of a trade boycott are right out, as about 70% of the low-end consumer goods are now made there, as well as parts for most everything else. This is a serious ticking time bomb…
While I was out surfing, I found this incredible Dengre diary at Kos. Wowwee..
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/6/10/1458/13889
OfT:
Hey Westerners! Got any beef in the freezer dated April 6-May 6? Check out this expanded recall.
LS @ 26
HOLY
FRAKKING
FRAK!
I’m blasting this one out to everyone I know or can find. I think the other shoe may have dropped and the Body-Mass-Index-Challenged Lady may have begun to sing…..
OMG OMG PONIES!
OT – The local San Antonio Express-News had an AP story in today’s edition with the headline “Ethics clouds hovering over 4 California GOP congressmen.” Most of the article covered Doolittle but had thumnail pics of Jerry Lewis and Gary Miller (pic IDs were reversed). I tried to find a link on both the EN site and AP but nothing I could get to. But the fact that a story like that even made it into the San Antonio paper has to show something is penetrating people’s consciousness.
perris @ 21
really – on the world…
if he cared one whit for his legacy, he’d quit immediately and let the grownups take over…again. it’s the only game he knows…
There is a simple solution to this problem. Let the Uighurs stay in the U.S. After all, we have determined they are not terrorists. They have been harmed, and the only right thing to do is for the guilty party to make things right. What is the stated justification for not allowing them to stay here?
Chertoff could use some sunlight.
There is a very important point in the DKOS post I spasmed over above. Namely this: a specific DOJ official had been SITTING on the Abroamoff investigation (yes it’s THAT one) and then decided he wanted his payoff now, please and was given a nice Federal Appeals Court Position In Jersey (where for some reason court postings are far more “lucrative” than elsewhere…)
Once he left, the DOJ civil service dudes (who had at this point been left alone by AGAGAG and Monica The Impaler) proceeded to lower the boom on the whole squealing rats nest. and they are continuing to lower it, and now that the Chimpy Brigade at DOJ is hiddled in a corner with hands over their ears singing WE CAN”T HEAR YOU they can pretty much do as the please.
And one of the things they pleased to do was to send an arrogant little girl who was the bagperson for Abramoff and the GOP to jail for FIVE YEARS and a 250K$ FINE for…
wait for it…
IGNORING A SENATE SUBPOENA TO TESTIFY!
Condi, its your attorney. line one.
Oh, I do love the smell of a working DOJ in the morning….
LS @ 26
That’s a good one!
–with some ideas for action at the end!
Bob in HI
LS @ 32
One side effect of the immigration bill’s failure may be that Chertoff’s reputation (?) is damaged. I was quite disturbed when the regime’s hometown rag started fawning over him when the agreement was announced. Now that there’s no bill, of course, WaPo’s treating it as a Harry Reid stumble.
In reality, though, the immigration bill was Chertoff’s to get approved while the Preznit was G8ing. Didn’t happen.
Democratic leaders of my party. Get rid of Lieberman. This man wants to start a world war. Strip him of any influence.
I’ve seen this story.I am very p’oed. These folks are country-less. I saw in the NYT that Chinese Muslims were caught in Afghanistan way back during the invasion, and a friend and I just looked at each other, and he said something like, “whatever they do, DON’T send them back to China, because they’ll be disappeared.” The muslim population was hit pretty hard during the Cultural Revolution. It’s just coming back, and then along comes ChimpCO. Now MC always suspects separatists, which is the same as terrorist to them. ChimpCo sends out implicit signals that it’s ok for the Chinese to take on their own population with a certain gusto. I wouldn’t be surprised if the Chinese Muslims were seeking asylum (all relative) in nearby Afghanistan. The Uighars must be given compensation and citizenship in the U.S. We can’t turn back the clock and convince China not to do anything that ChimpCO hasn’t done.
Signing off.
Alfred, Federici didn’t ignore a subpoena to testify. She went and did testify, I watched it. She was openly hostile about it, and has pled guilty to lying that day.
This is all good. My bet is that she’s going to give up Gale Norton, her long time friend who left the DOI suddenly last year, saying she wanted to spend more time with her family. Riiiiiight. That’s what they all say, just before the indictment comes down.
I want Lieberman gone from my party. I don’t give a damn about the so called political consequences.
yellowdogD @ 31
‘Cuz they haven’t applied for a visa and filed the proper papers. D’uh.
The Uighur plight is really sad. In Kashgar, the locals (whose Central Asian city is being remade into just another Han Chinese ugly town) come up to you and three sentences after determining you’re an American, confide, “We hate the Chinese.” And they see America as their hope–they love Americans.
And in bizarro world, the War on TERRAH! gives the Chinese continued excuse to clamp down, the Uighurs get the shaft, and America can’t even release the Uighurs in Gitmo to Albania.
LS @ 26
Now that’s what I’m talking about! I recall Federici’s testimony – McCain openly ridiculed her. Beautiful.
Valerie on Air America on Clout she is speaking at BEA
yellowdogD @ 31
What?!! But…but…they’d probably vote for Democrats!!! We can’t have that! Oh, wait…
Actually, yours is probably the best proposal yet. But the Bushies would never allow it.
Bob in HI
TheOtherWA @ 38
Ah, my bad. I’m still having issues with the latest “upgrade” microsoft dumped on me and it’s eating at the time i have to read posts. Still, it’s a start (in re perjury). Now we just need to get some bigger fish on the end of the line…
I agree. We screwed up, the least we can do is let these people live here and give them a chance at rebuilding some kind of life.
From the Digby picture in Christy’s excellent post above, I see Chertoff on the Board of the Heritage Foundation.
One thing I don’t understand is how do the RNC religious right Bushies work with the really hardcore neocons like Chertoff, Cheney, etc.
Resettle the Uighurs on the Bush Brush Ranch.
Does Liarman have a hernia? With every word his voice sounds like he is hurting – straining something? Serious intestinal turmoil.
LS @ 26
Thanks LS!
I didn’t know she got 5 years, watched her testimony she deserves it. McCain sounded oh so outraged then. HA!
love the pie chart, would like to see the lie chart.
Val is speaking about her work and book and the glare of the media when she was exposed.
TheOtherWA @ 45
Give Us Your Tired, Your Poor, Your Huddled Masses Yearning to Be Free…. what a concept!
chucknduck @ 48
Continual lying takes its toll…when you’re not a Bush or a Cheney.
Lieberman is a cheap, unclassy, blackmailer. And he should be required to register as an agent for a foreign government.
TheOtherWA @ 45
what a choice.
do you think they would actually do it? would they want to do it?
Alfred @44, no worries. It’s hard to keep all the rats and their various lies straight. There are soooooo many of them.
LS @ 46
they don’t. and neither of those work with the moneyed interestes who, in the end, call the shots for the rethuglicans and (unfortunately) some DINO’s.
Up until now, the Neos and the Xtians were fed sound bytes, some meaningless jobs in the admin, and legislative initiatives doomed either to failure or court rejection. This was viewed as sufficient because “any day now” the party was gonna “get it done”. Putting two hardcore Xtians on the supreme court was the final payoff, since it provided a vector to destroy the social advances of the last 40 years one bite at a time. Anything beyond that was always “too hard right now”. The neos and the xtians had to accept it because for them the rethugs are the only game in town.
meanwhile, behind the scenes, the moneyed interests that run the show racked up their desired gains. Tax cuts, long term commitments to defense spending, supression of unions and worker rights, continuing free trade agreements and plenty of powerless immigrant labor.
Now that chimpy is a spent force, the money boys fade away for a decade and concentrate on holding onto their gains. Then, it’s time to find a new sock puppet and repeat the cycle…
Well. to Christy’s post-
Thanks so much for this. You and Digby show a lot of courage in looking very hard at this mess. Hell, I can barely read it.
Follow the money, indeed. My God.
newtonusr @ 41
That was several years ago, wasn’t it? I think I remember seeing that testimony. It was in my pre-FDL days, so I wondered, in my innocence, why McCain was being so hard on her.
Who controls McCain’s old boodle of 750,000 emails? I sure would love to see them made available to TPMmuckraker!
Bob in HI
Badwater @ 47
I second that, and settle the Bush family in the refugee camp in Tirana, let’s see how George does learning Albanian.
TeddySanFran @ 27
Keep sending this kind of information. It helps remind me why I’m vegetarian. Trader Joe’s!!! Ain’t nobody safe!
Why was Bush in Albania?? Did you see the fake red, white, and blue photo-op of how much the Albanians love W. Suzanne Malblow was gushing how she had never seen anything like in the past 6 years. Pretty sad when that is the only place you can go for some hugs. Wonder if the Uigurs were in the crowd..
Elliott @ 59
I regret to inform you, he no speekee de eenglish either…linky!
Lieberman calls for attacking Iran:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/…..51480.html
Bob Schacht @ 58
He (McCain) was either plainly pissed at the issue itself, pissed at her for blatantly lying (her testimony made AbuG’s Senate hearing look like an exercise in transparency), or he was already in the ‘08 race. Or all three. It was actually funny to watch.
yellowdogD @ 31
I agree. Unless, of course, we are the last people they want to be around. Did the Jews want to resettle in Germany? Not many. Bush/Cheney NeoCons have tainted us all.
This is the Italia F and her subpoena “event”:
http://www.citizensforethics.org/node/23820
Badwater @ 52
all three of them have to feel kind of dirty, the kind of dirty that taking a shower doesn’t help. it’s a kind of stickiness for which there is no absolution. lieberwurst has gone all quavery. fuckwad and cheneycakes are going to start having violent ticks. they’re going to start jumping around like fleas in a frying pan full of crisco. it’s the kind of thing that happens to people when they start to realize that their souls are condemned to perdition…….
well, it ought to be that way anyways …..
LS @ 61
He’s a wannabee. Prince Phillip Is a GOD: linky!
chucknduck @ 48
Credulity?
For Joe, that’s a chronic condition.
This painful post makes me wonder how many people world wide are living in refugee camps, beyond those displaced by BushCo.
I am so spoiled.
snowbird42 @ 50
Thanks for that — I enjoyed listening to her. Can’t wait for her book in October. I hope she’ll be a Book Salon guest.
Lieberman tells Iranians they “must play by the rules” or risk being attacked by our military might. Who’s rules? I am livid.
Alfred Kelgarries @ 68
707 O.M.G. – it is like something out of Monty Python – all of it, just all of it…
LS @ 46
why not? osama bin forgotten is the religious right of islam. same difference ……
fahrender @ 74
Even Osama has worked with these same people.
How about building some low-income housing for the Uighurs in Kennebunkport?
Bibi is once again guiding American policy in the Middle East. Netanyahu will soon be back in power.
LS @ 73
except, unfortunately, these poor people aren’t acting. The Cargo Cults Are Still Here!
Sharon, Olmert and Bibi are not friends of the American people.
Alfred Kelgarries @ 78
Why am I thinking “Mall of America”?
*g*
Oklahoma kiddo @ 77
Lord Elpus!
However, Israel currently isn’t going along with the plans to jump on Iran and Syria…linky.
.. and it’s God’s birthday — Prince Phillip is 86 today!
allan_in_upstate @ 76
also an excellent idea.
I just got the spinning comment posting wheel of frak you again…but refresh fixed it and no leftover crud in the posting edit control…if anyone has similar problems we should let the mods know….
seems fixed now…
testing
OKK at 86 your comment was truncated.
Alfred Kelgarries @ 81
Olmert is basically toast. Bibi is the ‘new-old game in town’. And this nut wants to bomb and send missiles into Iran.
Alfred Kelgarries @ 88
I realize that. And that was not intentional.
Is Sharon still alive???
allan_in_upstate @ 76
LOL
fahrender @ 54
Guys, please if I sound angry it is because I am angry at ChimpCo and sad for the Uighars. Unbearably sad.
We can not let our government be hypocritical. Remember George I. and Tiannamen square? *Plenty* of mainland students were allowed permanent residency in the U.S. after that incident by decree of George I. Georgie I & II can grandstand all they like, but we should not allow them to be hypocritcal in the case of the innocent and much persecuted Uighars.
Bob Schacht @ 58
More on the emails and Federici:
Oklahoma kiddo @ 90
Didn’t think so. Can you spell out exactly how you see Bibi returning to power (and I agree with you 110% that he is the most dangerous nutjob in the middle east, even worse that Ahmenawhatever, because he ALREADY HAS NUKES, he doesn’t have to wait for them…)?
Christy, I hope we revisit this on a day when the hiccups are cured, please.
Steve Gilliard, we need you now:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/…..0610/iraq/
Another crucial highway link out of Baghdad is severed…
yellowdogD @ 31
Is this the reason Bush is going to Albania???
Gotta be either that or the Kosavars aren’t sending him their share of the profits from the international heroin trade…ya know, where there’s a member of the Bush family there’s a connection to illegal and highly profitable drugs. Look no further back than Poppy as head of the Drug Interdiction Task Force under Reagan…a 600% increase in the amount of cocaine that made it into the US…now that’s an impressive statistic although not one I’d want on my resume if I was looking for work with the DEA as an effective soldier in the war on drugs…I’m just saying.
I response to:
Alfred Kelgarries says: June 10th, 2007 at 12:35 pm
I know you most of you people don’t read Arabic so I’ll just say that in the coverage by Aswat Al Irak they point out that that bridge was under continuous and I do mean continuous heavy guard by the US. There’s a reason for that and its that its a major chokepoint. Photo here:
U.S. troops and private security guards, in black, work to remove concrete rubble from atop wounded soldiers, at a bridge
We’ve been writing about the bridges and isolation campaign on “guides” for 2 years now. Today’s one on top of Badoush a few days back is a major disaster for your troops in Irak.
Christy sorry for the o/t
What happened to George Bush’s faith based initiatives? These Chinese muslims should be turned over to an American Mosque in the American Muslim community and rehabilitated into a productive life. It’s the least we should do for innocent detainees. Are’nt we supposed to be winning hearts and minds here?
Oklahoma kiddo @ 79
I certainly wouldn’t go so far as to say they are out enemies either. It’s just that they have their own agenda and they have some hooks into us, so we tend to jump like puppets when they pull our strings.
We need a foreign policy with regard to Israel which is in America’s interests first and Israel’s second.