The question that naturally arises is how did this happen? Why would Americans, who overwhelmingly want a forced end to the war, favor every measure for achieving that other than de-funding? How did it happen that — to use Alter's formulation — "Americans have been convinced" of a patent falsehood: that de-funding would "endanger the troops"?[]And yet exactly this nonsensical notion was permitted not only to take hold, but to become unchallengeable conventional wisdom in our public debate over the war. The whole debate we just had was centrally premised on an idea that is not merely unpersuasive, but factually false, just ridiculous on its face. That a blatant myth could be outcome-determinative in such an important debate is a depressingly commonplace indictment of our dysfunctional media and political institutions.But the real reason this happened is because Democrats not only allowed it to occur, but eagerly helped it. As much as anyone else, even leading anti-war Democrats such as Carl Levin and Barack Obama continuously equated de-funding with a failure to "support the troops."
The Democratic message machine is horribly broken (and Obama in particular seems incapable of opening his mouth without repeating Republican talking points). But perhaps this is in part because Rahm Emanuel, as Democratic Caucus Chair, is in charge of Democratic House messaging.
Check out the YouTube above and watch Rahm doing his job.
Anybody see a problem?
(Thanks to John Amato at C&L for making the above clip)



130 Comments





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zed?
missed the zed
damn the rain is delaying Indianapolis 500!!
Dem message machine is broken, but so is the press.
Maybe The Sparrow needs to visit Rahm?
cancer_cures @ 3
dakine01 @ 1
Is it always a question?
Rahm is so totally full of sh*t it is dumbfounding. If it weren’t for the sh*t, he’d prol’ly weigh in at about ten pounds total.
I had to laugh at his “I truly believe…” nonsense as it has as much validity and relation to the truth as belief in the Easter Bunny or Great Pumpkin
The link to the Emanuel youtube clip is working no better than the Dem message machine, at least for me.
Yeah, really Obama lost a lot of points by not just his votes, but his reasons behind them.
I don’t know why these senators keep saying if they cut off funding, the troops will suffer. No, jackasses. The troops will come home. This whole ‘troops will suffer’ is a freaking LIE they can hide behind. They are trying to frame this issue early that withdrawal = troop punishment!
Ed*ard Teller @ 8
i can see it, firefox on an xp
Anyone with half a brain can see that the Dems have consistently set themselves up for failure, when it comes to ending this war. Why? Because war is good business, and the Dems are in the business of pandering to business. It has been Hillary & Bill’s game plan since they where in the WH.
Wordsmith:
It’s a question for me as I try to never assume that I actually AM the first just because I see no other comments. It may be that I’m just a slow typist or reader so I make it a question.
TexBetsy @ 10
Gave me a YouTube pop-up window.
Using iBook G4 and latest safari…
now why would that be?
mebbe cuz in his heart of hearts, he’s a dyed-in-the-wool DLC Dumbocrap?
has everyone forgotten his undaunting support for his mentor, HoJo Lie-berman, last fall, even AFTER Conn. Dems had repudiated the wattled war-hawk?
.
If they cut off the funding, who orders the troops home? The commander in chief?
Obama may be in trouble on this, but he did do at least one thing right this weekend.
DCCC and DSCC are not getting my $$$.
We also have a G4, and I try to use firefox rather than safari for youtube because of the same problem.
does the bad messaging lead to the bad policy?
or
does the bad policy (iraqi oil privatizaton is a benchmark) lead to bad messaging?
or are they self re-enforcing, creating a spiral of negative feedback?
I am sorry that Emanuel continues to be a spokesperson for the party.
Doesn’t Pelosi know that he is a failure, was in the last election, and continues to be one?
cando @ 19
Why doesn’t Dean speak for the party?
mods: please
explain why my posts are delayed?
When are these nitwits going to start just speaking from what they know is true or even what they actually believe and be damned with everything else. That would show real character. When are they going to see that is why Gore is so popular? Its so damn frustrating.
Excellent point, Jane. I’m getting concerned that Obama may be way too influenced by standard narratives of hackdom. Who is advising him?
TexBetsy @ 17
I wasn’t complaining mind you. I kinda like the fact that it gave me the YouTube site on a new window as it means I won’t lose my place. Although since it was the top of the page anyway, kinda hard to get lost. I tend to stay with Safari cuz it should be more readily integrated with the OS and fewer overall problems although YMMV. :})
anyone talking about this today?
selise @ 18
selise I vote for option 3…
TY Texas Betsy.
The war is unjust, but at least our veterans and those who have stood up are treated well. God damn – If you are willing to spend billions on bullets, missiles, and brand new infrastructure for a country which constantly blows it up, you OUGHT TO spend a few billion to cushion those who have fought the war.
The supplemental should have included this in the bill. Why is Obama talking about it NOW instead of last week when the bill was vetoed??
Did a restart and Rahm came across. Just as pathetic as usual. Too bad we can’t just do are-start on the whole Democratic Party leadership. But we can’t. We have to take that leadership from them and get it to a new wave of progressive, liberal and highly effective Democrats we help get elected to the US House, and then the US Senate.
not to mention that it also sets the Dems up to get pinned for the blame from earlier (and continuing) shortfalls leading to no up-armoured HMVs, lack of body armour, lack of ammunition etc.
False messages getting out there?
From the wing-nuts I have contact with, Rush is the top of the common denominators. Second, other righty TV thugs like OReilly. Third, the religious channels on radio.
TexBetsy @ 25
Talk about a very weak title. From the title, I’m thinking they mean either normal Iraqis, or insurgents, but the article points out that it was Iraqi army forces. Shouldn’t the army reference be included in the title? I mean, if we reversed roles here, Blackwater would be called an insurgent org.
dakine01 @ 26
me too. :(
Rahm can’t take a punch, and worse still – he walked right into that one.
He looked like he was still seeing stars and hearing tweety birds in that clip.
He’s a lightweight who leads with his face where we need a heavyweight – with skills, strength and the ability to weather damage on the way to a knockout.
Throw in the towel on him and let’s get a contender in there.
I know he is running for national office, but be bold, Sen. Obama! Working in Chicago a few years ago, I KNOW Chicago is an Obama town, and downstaters love him, too. He should have no troubles being re-elected to the Senate until he decides to stop running. So, take a stand, get out in front, and see where it takes you and the rest of the country. Make the center-line between the left and right shift back to the left, a bit. I am sure Axelrod is telling him not to make waves, but damn it, make it happen!
As far as “supporting the troops”, the republicans have once again set the table for the debate. The republicans continously drum up sentiment by “defending the troops/don’t disrespect the troops”, and then the dems say, “oh, we do, too. we don’t want them to get hurt because of us.” Stop it, backtrack, stay on the offensive and simply state it is not the troops we are worried about, it is the policy wonks putting the troops in harms way. Set the debate, rather than react to it.
Emmanual is a DLC DEM and everything that comes out of his mouth is designed to push the DLC aggenda and make Hillary the nominee. He is as helpful to the Democratic Party as Mitch McConnell and Boehner.
selise @ 19
I think it is both (3), but overriding is the bait laid out long ago by GOPers, and once they had all the levers, well, just squeeze.
The only way to get it back is to do like Jane – call Bullshit out in the open, again and again.
Imagine a Dem going on Tweety and, instead of treading water, he_she says the following:
Chris, let me stop you right there… I saw you bend over backwards to grace the contention of Kate O’Beirne with your tacit blessing, in the face of the obvious lie she spouted in the last segment. Now if you would come prepared to confront, with facts, a guest who lies to your face, then you and I can have an honest dialog on x issue…
Let me preface my comment with this disclaimer: I cannot stand fuckin’ Rahm Emanuel. What this is indicative of – to me – is his blatant use of the same kind of doublespeak bullshit the administration uses. And way to ‘bank off’ of David Obey too.
What is it that keeps these guys so at odds of the people? Is it the power, money, sex? ‘cuz it sure ain’t “the good of the country.”
TexBetsy @ 21
Perhaps because a serving member of the House needs to do his particular job? I don’t know but if that’s true why not let truth speaking progressive bull dogs like Kucinich or Waters slap down the GOPer talking points like it’s batting practice?
Rahm gives Ari Fleishcher a run for the money.
The whole Democratic strategy on this bill sucked. 1) They allowed a supplemental. 2) They completely ignored their power in the veto scenario; Bush had to have the money! Plus they were passing the spending each time!
Rahm’s spin is represhensible and ridiculous.
Time to forget the spending battles. Time to reverse the AUMF and require the Executive branch to supply a redeployment/withdrawal plan within 60 days.
mls @ 14
That’s right.
And I do believe Bush would, only because if he didn’t, then we would see generals and other high ranking military officials ignoring him to make sure either the troops get the equipment and food they need, or get out of the country. I say this often, but I think we need to embrace this line of thought – Do you think the military would let their troops patrol with no arms or food? Honestly, we would have a coup. American troops aren’t the soviet troops of 1940’s – They will revolt.
That is why when we hear our democratic representatives repeat the lines of ‘We are funding the troops, because if we didn’t, then Bush would let them starve.’ It’s a horrible argument to make, and it sounds like something Rove would say..
TexBetsy: I am with you! Where is Howard Dean? Did you ever see him on tv before November 2006? He is a true democrat, and tough as nails. Where the heck is he?
TexBetsy @ 16
I’m sorry but I am sick of politicians exploiting the fact that we are doing a horrible job caring for our wounded while being very unclear about saying we need to stop getting them wounded asap. While Edwards is not the perfect progressive he has at least been clear on this point for some time. Obama just keeps playing games.
selise @ 19
Yes.
The Democratic message machine broke on 11/08/07 when our DeeCee leadership kept talking about “the war.” It’s an occupation; occupations can’t be WON; there is no victory in an occupation.
We won the war. Mission Accomplished. Bring them home for a well-deserved parade, flowers and medical care (esp. mental health, which many won’t ask for).
Until DeeCee Democrats talk about the Occupation Of Iraq, they’ll lose the message wars with the President and his goons. This loss has been coming a long time.
Is that rain? (you know the rest….)
Get Tough @ 42
He’s still rebuilding the party, keeping quiet, prepping for ‘08. Right where we need him, I think.
How many times do I have to repeat this to you people? “Support the Troops” means Support the War –
PERIOD!!!!
Why the persistence of this bizarre belief that “the troops” and “the War” are separate entities when they are one and the same?
I’d really like to hear from someone in charge of this place about this.
Seriously.
Jane?
Christy?
Fitz?
Thanks Jane!
I loved Greenwald’s article on this, except for one thing: he used the wrong word in calling this myth-making. Its much more sinister than that.
The Republicans got where they are by learning the techniques of disinformation, propaganda, and Big Lie. Per the Wikipedia:
The Republicans “got smart” about these techniques through their think tanks that flourished under Newt Gingrich. Democrats need to get smart about these things not to use them, but to learn how to counter them quickly, and effectively. As it is, we let these lies fester in the public mind until they take root.
Howard Dean has professed a desire to sponsor Democratic think tanks. Perhaps a curriculum on de-fanging disinformation, propaganda, and Big Lies is in order?
For example, the Swift-boat thing should have been a one week story. But Kerry’s campaign was clueless about how to deal with it, and it contributed to his defeat. Democrats are in a “Ground Hog Day” situation where they are condemned to live the day over and over again until they get it right. THIS needs to be the year that we get it right.
Bob in HI
If you defund the war, which means the troops will have to come home, which means more soldiers will not die in Iraq if we aren’t there, how does that translate into not supporting the troops.
Obama, Rahm and ?.
Where is Howard Dean? Well, if he were to run again in 08, I think he’d win. The trick is with American politics is not to announce a year or two before the actual run. Gives your opponents too much time to sour your name and policies. That is why, I think, we end up with so many ’shitty’ candidates for the past few elections. And anyone who jumps in after the big dogs, is considered ‘unelectable’
But if Gore (or Dean) decided to announce their run a month or two before 08 elections, it would add a lot of new energy focused on one candidate. And all they’d have to do is focus on the one issue that is big at -that- time.
Beware, this could also be used by the G.O.P. Seeing as all the candidates running right now are rotton in the eyes of their voters.
Howard Dean is also pissing on yer leg:
here is glen, finding the essence of the problem:
This has long been the principal flaw of Democrats and it has not changed. They are both fearful and incapable of defending any position unless, from the outset, they are assured, by their coniving and principle-free consultants, that most Americans already agree with it. The idea of forcefully articulating a view in order to change public opinion — such as explaining why de-funding is a perfectly valid option like all the others for ending the war — never occurs to them.
when the goopers want to push something they create the marketing for it–as in going to war against Iraq, Weapons of Mass Destruction, Saddam downed the Towers.
Card admitted it was a marketing game. Dems don’t play that game. They let their consultants tell them you can’t. I heard exactly the same thing out of first-tier Dem CA consultants with regard to a referendum idea.
Goopers understand that if you have a product, you have to figure out how to sell it.
Rahm didnt market a product, he put lipstick on a pig afterwards; i.e. found the spin to make it look better than it was afterwards–”It is the end of the blank check.”
this is very ugly for us.
Newtonusr: Great. I love that guy. He is a warrior. The republicans spent a lot of money/time discrediting him.
And speaking of broken messaging, what’s with Jay Rockefeller’s team taking out the trash on a holiday weekend with the SSCI report? That made no sense either — why release the information that BushCo had intelligence predicting Iraq’s descent into chaos on the Friday of Memorial Day weekend?
Our leaders need some schooling. Big time.
peterboy @ 50
agreed.
so how do we convince the dems they need a new strategy?
cancer_cures @ 50
But, but, but…
If Dean runs (which I both hope and believe he won’t), who would you trust with the strategy he has implemented to build the party in all 50? This is no joke – it’s probably the best long-term planning the Democratic Party has ever done, and I trust Dr. Dean to do it right. And only Dr. Dean.
Al Gore, OTOH…
Left this way to FACE THE SNARK
Jane, I think you’ve hit on it. Unfortunately, I can’t see any way of legally removing him from his seat that doesn’t involve pictures of him with a goat in drag. (And that would besmirch the good name of a perfectly respectable goat.)
Isolating him might be another story.
TeddySanFran @ 53
I’m not too surprised. Rockafeller is so ‘old money’ and career pol, that he doesn’t want to shake any boats at all. This gives him the ability to act like he’s doin his job, but he doesn’t care as long as those who fill his coffers are happy.
Get Tough @ 35
I agree. The repub machine is doing its usual ‘defining’, and the dems are left lamely trying to defend themselves, instead of putting out a message of their own. Maybe we need a hired Newt.
TexBetsy @ 26
Blackwater scares me. Congress should look at defunding it.
TexBetsy @55–
I think TeddySanFran has it right. Propganda and selling is about making an emotional link.
This is the occupation not a war on terror… and we need to point out that an American soldier dies every 10 hours in Iraq, and we spend $2 billion every 10 days.
I actually think it is a good thing that the vote came before the Mem recess. Our leaders will get an earful. I was one of those who called Jane Harman, and if I see her I will say thank you. otherwise, I would have told her off.
EIA provides the proof that Bush has no plan to leave Iraq. Ever. When the Bush administration says “It’s not about the oil” it’s about the oil. Bush, Cheney and most of the crew are oilmen.
Molly Ivins was right when she wrote in Jan. 2001 “George W. Bush is threatening to give us an energy policy that marches militantly in exactly the wrong direction.”
Unless the Democratic party understands this, all their speeches and statements are full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.
newtonusr @ 37
This is basically what Bill Clinton did when he was ambushed on Fox. It would really help if more dems would show a little temper, and not let these idiots continue to perpetuate repub control of the issues.
TeddySanFran @ 51
The thing is that Dean’s right — up to now, Bush was rejecting any bill with even non-binding benchmarks in it.
We’re talking about George W. Bush, the guy who was given the perfect face-saving escape hatch, complete with benchmarks, from Iraq from his daddy’s friends in the Iraq Study Group — and he rejected it as a “flaming turd”. (Speaking of messaging: If I were Rahm Emanuel, I’d have made sure that quote got repeatedly passed around to every news org in the nation. Then again, the news orgs certainly knew about it — they just chose not to talk about it.)
The problem with the message machine is of course that it gets its “electricity” from the same fools that have brought the Dems to their present state of Jellyfishosity. Unfortunately, the message machine that works (and seems to reflect what the electorate feels) is out in the Netroots, but almost every Democrat is so terrified of having a blogger, or perhaps a “Netroots-aware citizen” that might have said something “bad” (Amanda and Melissa, for example who said nothing improper nor out of the mainstream of Netroots thinking/perceptions) associated with them that they are unwilling (or unable due to “consultants”) to accept their value at framing a coherent and valuable message.
As long as the progeny of JokeLine, BobShrum, and ToeSucker Morris are framing “the message”, any message, we (Democrats) are doomed to a failure to communicate, and promise results but deliver disappointment. IMHO, anyhow.
spurious @ 63
Nice. A real-world example. Thank you!
Who would doubt the power of that moment?
SeamusD @ 11
And that is my reason why I won’t vote for Hillary. They are too willing to throw the base overboard. Where is Phil Ochs when we need him?
I was watching Al Gore on teevee last night and noticed he looks really stressed out. Maybe he’s keeping a little secret. I am sure he is heart sick about the destruction of the last six years to the government as a whole. He was devastated the way everything went down in 2000 and I really think shocked. Now if he were to pull it together and decide to run again don’t you think he would put a lid on it? Why announce. So they can turn him into a laughing stock 500 days before the election? He has plenty of money behind him. If Al Gore ran in 08 would you all vote for him if he ran as a third party candidate? Why should he run as a dem? Fool me once…… I will never forget when the only dems that backed him were the black caucus. Not one of those other dems came to his aid not even hojo. Why in the hell would Al Gore ever run as a dem? There is no loyalty, none. I will vote for Al. I will vote for John, hell I would even vote for Ron Paul before I would vote for a DLC dem in the primary.
lolo
newtonusr @ 68
So why don’t they do what Bill did to Chris Wallace? Are the Dems in Washington that dumb? Did someone slip them a stupid pill before they go on TV?
cancer_cures @ 50
ReElect President Al Gore in 2008!
Accept no substitute.
lolo @ 70
If you haven’t noticed, Maureen Dowd is getting back into “attack Al Gore” mode again. They are gonna attack Al no matter what. He might as well run since they’ll attack him no matter what. Hopefully he’s learned how to deal with the punditry BS and would fight back.
Phoenix Woman @ 66
Dean has to run a party. I am sure he didn’t like it, but he can’t go around bashing people like Emanuel. We can’t have Dean pulling a Joe “HoJo” Lieberman, can we?
newspaperbrat – how about Gore/Waters (Maxine) ‘08. Man would that send Obama and HRC and Lieberman through the roof! rotfl!!
And Maxine knows how to support President elect Gore.
Eureka Springs @ 72
WOW! What a great ticket!
TeddySanFran @ 54
Why didn’t they release it before the 2004 election?
haha, or the 2006?
Joe Klein’s conscience @ 72
lolo – thanks I hadn’t noticed MoDo’s latest attack Al – the MSM establishment must fear his reelection as much as Hillary, etc., et al. Only strengthens my personal resolve to hold out for the Honorable Al Gore’s presidential re-election by acclaimation. ;~)
Loo Hoo. @ 76
Because the Senate was under Republican control and Pat Roberts of Kansas was Bush’s stooge who kept pushing the report further and further off into the future.
As to the Democrats not making an enormous production about this information….I really wonder if they are like the ham and egger perennial losers in a fake wrestling. Always knowing when to throw the match.
-GSD
For those of you who don’t know, Rahm Emmanuel is Ari Emmanuel’s brother. Ari is the Hollywood agent who’s the model for the notorious Ari Gold on “Entourage,” a guy so driven by ambition there’s exactly nothing he won’t stoop to. Rahm may come across as a reasonable guy, but if he’s at all like his brother, he’s a vicious infighter and an implacable enemy. I’m sure a lot of Beltway Dems see him as our answer to Cheney and Rove, but is the answer to beating the Rethugs really to become more like them?
Wishful thinking..A democratic congressman or
Senator with gravitas speaking truth loudly and continuously, in other words, doing what they were elected to do, no matter the cost politically because to pay that political price they become whores for who(whom)ever is paying their bill, and those paying the bills don’t want them to speak the truth.
GSD @ 79
I’m just asking:
Is it possible that Rockefeller is just an asshole? He spent very little (if any) of his political capital decrying the UnAmerican actions of Roberts, who clearly had only Chimpy’s interests in mind.
Of course, we wondered at the time what Roberts had on Rockefeller – pictures or video – that would so completely muzzle him. He was nearly invisible.
GSD, then Pat Roberts has blood on his hands and needs to be called on this whenever he is up for re-election. Geez.
Eureka Springs @ 74
Yes! Does Maxine have any skeletons?
Maddy @ 81
We have a guy like that. His name is Russ Feingold — and the Democratic Corparty won’t give him the time of day.
newtonusr @ 46
If he’s keeping quiet and rebuilding the party — then my question is who is he rebuilding the party with? That’s my worry.
Eureka Springs @ 74
Hey ES! Always happy to see ya and indeedy I would love to see our firebrand Maxine elevated from her house seat and had serious fantasies she might challenge Bar Boxer (a fantasy no doubt but I just can’t move on from Boxer’s colossal arrogant support of HoJoLeibermonster when Ned Lamont was so clearly suited for the U.S Senator).
My President Gore fantasy is he choose Edwards or Richards as his running mate.
Rumors persist here in Lotus Land that Ahrnold may challege Boxer for her Senate seat and if true she may be marginalized to such a degree she could be unemployed. As annoyed as I am with her I wouldn’t wish Ahnold on my worst enemy much less our country. ;~)
Rockefeller probably figured Phase II would be the talk of all the Sunday news shows, right???
You couldn’t see it, but I was laughing when I typed that…
Sergeant Safstrom will tell you 95% of his platoon wants out of Iraq: Via Huffpo:
http://www.iht.com/articles/20…../delta.php
newtonusr @ 56
Exactly. Dean’s got the more difficult job: Creating a base in the states that will eventually push out the monied people like Rahm. Running for president is easy by comparison.
But if you want to help the process along, you can go to http://www.publiccampaign.org, the Clean Elections people, and work with them to help spread the public financing of elections across the country and into the national level. It’s a large and growing movement, and in places you wouldn’t expect it to be, like Arizona (where not coincidentally, Democrats have made gains at the state and local levels since Arizona went to clean elections).
In my own opinion, the biggest reason our politics is so messed up is because of the staggering (and ever-growing) cost of elections. Candidates in some Senate races in this cycle will be spending close to what Bill Clinton and Bob Dole spent in 1996 on their presidential campaigns. (In fact, the 2000 Senate race between Hillary Clinton and Rudy Giuliani/Rick Lazio in New York, Clinton spent $30 million while Giuliani and Lazio spent at least $40 million — and probably more: I’m not sure if this graph counts the $20 million that Rudy raised before he bowed out.) And the only entities that can reliably foot the bill for this are — you guessed it — corporations. And their lobbyists. Clean elections stop this trend dead in its tracks.
dalloway @ 80
Those who live by the sword, die by the sword.
Watching Emmanuel spout his line of absolute bullshit cover attempt — when any thinking human is well aware that the Democratic leadership is sorely in need of a spinal column — was more than a little reminiscent of watching Cheney lob one of his barrage of lies at the media. That is NOT the sort of person anyone should want to draw a comparison with. Emmanuel is a blight in the Democratic party that will continue to drive truly progressive folks away. The only worse example in the party might be Steny Hoyer.
If Al Gore wants to run, he’d be smart to wait six months. If he doesn’t want to run, he should play Merlin to someone else’s Queen/King and model how Dems should be public speechifying.
He’s stronger and more experienced than the whole pack. That is, if he remains willing to let his emotions out – we all know about his intellect – and be constantly ready with his bullshit meter.
Attack the Rovian word games head on. If they can find a Churchill, great. But an English 101 blue pencil and loud voice should do it, along with a copy of Strunk & White and Orwell on Politics and the English Language.
The Dems don’t need carloads of prescription medications to excite them; that just makes up for the Republicans’ ruthlessness and thoughts of Melanie Morgan or Dick Cheney without their clothes. Democratic passions and priorities would go a long way, if they just let them out. I think Main Street America is literally dying to hear them.
CheckingIn @ 86
Rahm Emanuel can fuck off. Howard Dean’s 50-state strategy was instrumental in the results of ‘06 – more emphasis on machinery, and let the machinery pick and run the candidates. WTF does a creep from Illinois know about picking a candidate in Washington State, or North Carolina, or Arizona?
I’ll repeat something I posted last night at kos just because it fits perfectly with Greenwald’s message:
And to that I’ll now add: the Executive Branch has effectively denied the Congress its Constitutionally-mandated power of the purse simply by repeating a ridiculous and easily-refutable falsehood.
dalloway says@85
May 27th, 2007
You’re right, sometimes I feel like I’m banging my head against a wall and I do so much it starts to feel good-Jeesh.
Without pandering, I say this often, thanks all, without these forums I would be well and truly f#@@Ked
Jo Fish @ 66
There’s a reason I call the US press “The GOP/Media Complex”. It’s because they are.
Former RNC Chair Roger Ailes worked for NBC’s Jack Welch before going to set up FOX News. And Welch (who is looking to get back into the media game after “retiring” a few years ago) took great pride in corrupting people like Russert and Matthews.
VictorLaszlo @ 94
The Executive Branch had some help. I give you, among others, The Majority Leader of the United States House of Representatives .
Phoenix Woman, your public campaign link doesn’t work. Thanks for that.
earlofhuntingdon @ 92
Amen.
Loo Hoo. @ 98
I didn’t mean that the way it sounded! I sincerely meant thanks.
” the GOP/Media Complex ” GMC to us common folk – great one Phoenix Woman
FYI, Anthony Romero of the ACLU is today’s guest for Book Salon and is chatting live right now. Please drop in and give him a big FDL welcome.
newtonusr @ 93
Rahm knows one thing about candidates in NC, AZ or Washington state. It is whether they are and will be beholden to him.
Loo Hoo. @ 76
They didn’t release it before the 2004 election because Pat Roberts(Bush-bot) was chair at the time.
They aren’t that dumb. But I guess they think we are.
VictorL @ 94, I now believe it’s more than Rahm Emanuel being a “pathetic sucker and rube.” Or that those who trail along behind him in the House or Senate are “pathetic suckered Democratic rubes.”
It’s far, far more sinister than cowardice or cluelessness among Democratic consultants and the people who listen to them. The closed-door capitulation conference proved that, if nothing else.
Remember when Israel bombed Lebanon, and all the Democrats sat passive and silent on the sidelines? John Conyers, for pete’s sake, bit Jimmy Carter’s head off because of the title and content of Carter’s new book criticizing apartheid practices of the Likudniks in Israel. As did Nancy Pelosi.
We need to start to really internalize what this means. “Think tanks” are actually corporate-underwritten. They are corporate propaganda mills, when they aren’t foreign lobby mills. And NPR uses them regularly for ‘objective,’ ’scholarly’ news analysis, without informing its listeners whose private agenda is thereby promoted. AEI (the American Enterprise Institute) is basically the shadow, permanent, private Bush foreign policy administration.
The Democrats (or at least those in leadership positions) are focused on enacting the agenda of the A*P*C Lobby in the Middle East, and they need a cover story to hide that corrupt, anti-democratic, unAmerican sell-out. “Clueless cowards” works beautifully to cover their ulterior motives. They’ll take those insults from us without a peep, and keep on keeping on for the powers that be.
The Democratic Majority in Congress gave away, with no strings attached, the power that we own and loaned them last November to end the occupation of Iraq. Members of Congress have no right to give our power in the Legislative Branch away, to a foreign lobby, or to corporate interests, or to the Executive Branch. They seem, however, to have managed to do all three, simultaneously, and their only “punishment” has been to be considered moral cowards and incompetent fools. No charges of corruption, or of violating their oaths of office, or of being traitors to our nation. Those charges are all reserved by us for members of the Republican Party. Nice work if you can get it.
In short, “our” Congress has chosen to continue the assault on the American people, using our volunteers in the Armed Forces as the excuse and the cover, instead of choosing to stand between an outlaw Executive and our men and women he has put in harm’s way, with their blessing, for private and corporate profit and the interests of a foreign lobby.
So much for duty, honor, country.
Teddy @ 54, I’d word it slightly differently:
http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/52135
http://www.commondreams.org/ar…..05/27/1491
Rahm’s no rube. He’s trying to “remake the Democratic Party in his own image.”
We don’t need “our” Karl Rove, thank you very much.
Get used to this clip, you’re going to be seeing a lot of it.
This piece is all about the other workings of the Emanuel and Hoyer gang:
The Evolution of a Democratic Con Job.
Or: All we ended up with was that stinking ‘Oil Bill’..
After all the huff and the puff and the Democrats with the “Never Never Never back down” ..and all the other spin and bravado by Hoyer, Pelosi, Emanuel, Reid and their newly crowned buddy Joe Lieberman, this inside clique of Democrats have actually conned us so far away from the hard won mandates of the election, the party may be permantly corrupt beyond repair.
(When their sweaty hands grabbed the limelight and kicked the grassroots and Gov. Dean smack in the blogs, I felt we were going to be sorry).
So now the cowardice of the Democrats is all over the news and their excuses are pathetic. That infuriates me enough. But, combined with the other big stories of this new march to war with Iran, I suddenly rememered the Democrats flip floppery on the Iran provision, too. Which really infuriated me.
Remember that doozy? They actually pulled out a provision out on a previous bill requiring the President to come to Congress for approval before any action against Iran can be taken?
So with a sick feeling in my stomach, I went back and re-read several of the March stories about what their excuses were for that:
http://smirkingchimp.com/thread/6042 http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-…..43302.html
So I offer this chilling bit of the past from Robert Naiman’s article:
No Iran. No troop withdrawal. Just oil.
Suckers we were. All of us.
__________________
An adversary is not an enemy. And nationalism is not terrorism.
Minor edit ** by Mod
The biggest falsehood in town is that Voters will see defunding the war as failing the troops. This is simply not true. I talk with a lot or Republicans. They know better. Democrats know better. Emanuel is a Quisling.
newtonusr @ 93
I agree… but what the creep ( Hoyer) does/did know is how to funnel money to his picks. Through his power at the DCCC and their Leadership PAC’s…
2006 ELECTION OVERVIEW
Candidate to Candidate Giving
Below are the top overall donors to other candidates …. giving through their candidate committees and/or leadership PACs.
http://www.opensecrets.org/ove…..isplay=all
Top Overall Donors
2. Steny H. Hoyer (D-Md) (#1 Democrat Giver)
(Maryland District 5) $1,164,226
7. Rahm Emanuel (D-Ill) (#2 Democrat Giver)
(Illinois District 5) $938,250
8. Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif) (#3 Democrat Giver)
(California District 8) $879,500
Money talks and votes — maybe? So, what’s going to happen in 2008?
Phoenix Woman @ 65
But why do the Dems have to give him a bill at all? I still agree with John Edwards– just keep sending up the original bill– with deadlines and all, until he signs it. And if he won’t sign it, then he doesn’t get any money for war.
Bob in HI
Loo Hoo. @ 76
Because the Republicans were in charge.
Bob in HI
I suppose you could argue that Emanuel had nothing to do with the Democratic victory last year… or maybe even somehow lessened it. I don’t believe that, though, and my guess is that his colleagues, including the Speaker, don’t think so either.
So the next question is whether he’s putting lipstick on a pig here or he’s sincere. You know, he just might be sincere. Things don’t change on a dime… or even in 6 months. The Democrats don’t have a big enough majority to make that happen, they aren’t united enough even in their own caucus to make that happen, and the President still holds plenty of power even in his weakened condition. So his position is that it’s a process that you have to go through.
Finally, I continue to be amazed by the “you’re either with us or you’re against us” model of politics promulgated here. Take that far enough and you end up like we did in 2000. Anyone could see that it was going to be closer than it should, and that Nader could screw things up big time. I still met plenty of nitwits who voted for him and who became positively irate when I raised the question of whether he might throw the election to Bush, as though somehow that kind of calculation were crass and out of bounds. Not if you want to win, it isn’t.
And that’s what I like about Emanuel and why I trust his judgment. More than anything else, he wants to win. No tilting at windmills in the Nutmeg State. Just winning.
newtonusr @ 97
Hoyer and Emanuel work hand in hand… against the progressive elements of the party. Both A*P*C and corporate Clinton sympathizers. Even tho’ Emanuel is no longer the head of the DCCC this time round, he’s still gonna make sure that primaries are not going to be a problem against BAD dems in 2008. He made sure he has his fingers in many pies.
“…The caucus chairman typically is a mostly ceremonial position but Democratic aides said Emanuel would be given additional duties, including responsibility for rapid response to Republican attacks, input into party policy positions and a role in strategy for re-electing vulnerable incumbents….”
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/polit ics/chi-0611100175nov10,0,4895472.story
larry birnbaum @ 112
///and will take money, loves money, will do anything for money…
CheckingIn @ 109
I might find this a somewhat compelling argument except for the use of the word “Democrat” instead of “Democratic.” Speaking of adopting Republican language…
How do you edit a comment when you can’t get into the text to edit?
larry birnbaum @ 115
Well you tell me how to edit!
newtonusr @ 82
I know we’re in EPU-land, but what the Republicans have on Jay Rockefeller is his Uncle David, current patriarch of the Rockefellers. He’s one of those New World Order guys. Maybe you remember the speech Pappy Bush gave about the NWO?
Uncle David was a founder of the Bilderberg Group in 1954, and he organized the Trilateral Commission in 1973. I don’t think he cares all that much about Democracy.
Bob in HI
Phoenix Woman @ 90
I agree. I think one of the Republican’s goals is to reduce “votes” to the status of a commodity, to be bought and sold like everything else. For them, the idea of selling your vote to the highest bidder makes perfect sense.
Bob in HI
When we impeach Bush and Cheney, let’s all go after Pelosi and Reid and Rahm Emanuel. They offer nothing of value to us since they bow to Mr. 30% and spit in the face of the 70% who want the occupation and continued shedding of American blood to end.
Whenever I hear that sending these young people to be blown to bits is supporting the troops, I want to throw up. People who say or print that are accomplices to mass murder.
CheckingIn, to edit inside the quote after hitting “quote this comment”, I just cut out what I wasn’t commenting on inside the text part without messing with any of the tags at the top and bottom. (I put “…” in where I cut though to make this clear.)
Have at it.
Publicus’s comments are a good example of what I’m talking about. Impeach Pelosi and Emanuel?
First of all, I don’t even think that Congress impeaches Members of Congress. I believe each body can censure or even expel members of that body.
Second, on what grounds? That you don’t think they’re following sufficiently aggressive political tactics in pursuing a policy that you agree with? Do you even live in either of their districts?
Please, no more circular firing squads. Let’s leave that to the Republicans for a while.
“Finally, I continue to be amazed by the “you’re either with us or you’re against us” model of politics promulgated here.”
And I continue to be amazed at how many battered wives keep telling themselves it’ll get better when they know they’re stuck with an abuser that will never change. The democrats have fucked up for the last time for me. Go read Murtha’s blog comments on Huffpost. The blowback is amazing, hence Rahm’s uh-oh, pasty-faced, apologia/bullshit shpiel.
The co-dependant two party system has become so disfunctional there is nothing left to lose by voting for a third party candidate. I guess we’ll see how it all shakes out in the fall. Meanwhile, don’t call me democrat. And I mean that in both senses.
This whole slanderous and false “defunding the troops” meme can be addressed in one simple way by the Democratic Party.
This entire bogus meme is based on the idea that not funding the troops (as Bush and Cheney want the war to be funded) will leave our troops in Iraq (and Afghanistan) without the money and materials necessary to do their job, thus endangering their lives (anymore than Bush and Cheney have already endangered their lives?).
Thus, after Memorial Day, Democrats in Congress need to enact a stand-alone bill that specifically covers the Pentagon-projected expense (based on a liberal troop-level projection) of redeploying our troops out of Iraq, sometime in the future, no deadlines or timetables or benchmarks required.
In other words, a “rainy day” redeployment fund, totally separate from any day-to-day operational funds.
Democrats, in enacting this measure, will essentially be saying, “Yes, we support the troops. In fact, we feel so strongly about the safety and well-being of our troops, that we are going to fund their redeployment right now, and put the money in a “rainy day lockbox,” without any assurances that President Bush ever plans on removing our troops from the middle of the civil war raging in Iraq. But at least the funding will already be in place to cover the cost of redeploying our troops out of Iraq, as efficiently and safely as possible, when the order is finally given for them to leave Iraq.”
Do you see?
Democrats were pushing deadlines and such, knowing full well that Bush would veto any Iraqi War funding bill containing these provisions. Also, this “all or nothing” approach played right into the hands of the Rovian smear merchants with their “cute” talking points, that defunding the war would leave our troops in harms way.
In one simple bill, therefore, Democrats could turn this false message around. Democrats would be “supporting the troops” by making certain that sufficient funds are in place already, in a “rainy day lockbox,” to cover the expense of reploying our troops out of Iraq.
Plenty of money budgeted to cover this. No troops left behind and endangered because of a presumed lack of funds. When the order is finally given (probably not by Bush or Cheney, but possibly by their successors in the White House). Money just waiting for when the time comes. Money held in “escrow” for our troops.
Do you see?
So, Democrats in Congress…hop to it.
AZ Matt @ 5
Ha! Good one.
Bring on the bird!
wgg: tokin lib’rul @ 14
Nope…I did not as you can see from my post: ‘Why Joey the LiarMann is still in the Senate’! And the reason is!
AssClowns like Obama, Schumer, Reid, Boxer and Clinton supported their ‘good friend’ The LiarMann.
CheckingIn @ 113
I suppose things were going too well for Dems, so Hillary & Rahm had to interfere, by triangulating with some Repubs, to preserve their chance to grab the Presidency.
This makes it more obvious that the only thing standing between now and the end of the Iraq war is Republicans and Dems who love geometry.
Of course, that doesn’t mean the’re pure evil or of no use at all. We just need to recognize who the opposition is and what their tactics are, so we can fight effectively and win.
I suspect we’re in for more triangulation policy-making in the next few months, so be ready to be disappointed again and again.
We should take every opportunity to demonstrate good leadership (speech rhetoric or in proposing legislation and so on); to push Congress in the right direction; to expose Republican Congressional corruption (and complicity with Bush), stupidity, incompetence, fraud, etc. and to show the public the differences between good Progressive leadership and the alternatives. Civility, but aggressive politickin’.
GSD @ 79
You said a mouthful, GSD! Check out this article posted by Cossack (comment #254) on Phoenix Woman’s “Come Saturday Morning: the Good, the Bad & the Ugly” thread. We are getting conned, big-time.
This must be some kind of good-cop/bad-cop scam. (Better vote for us because there’s no telling what those other guys will do to you!) So we vote for them but we still end up doing time. It’s always that “next election”, they tell us, that’s going to give them the power they need to make real changes. So keep on supporting them and settling for less, because someday they’re going to give us what we want.
Nobody is this “stupid”, that they can’t figure out how to frame an issue when the science of perception management is out there for everyone in political life to see and study. They are framing issues: but they’re aiming it all at us, not the opposition. They’re making us believe they’re in our corner. The party leaders have made a cynical calculation that they must please the corporate contributors, while appearing to fight for us. A delicate balancing act, but necessary for gaining and keeping power.
Bob Schacht @ 119
Hi Bob!
Sorry I didn’t respond to a comment from you a while back. Things move pretty fast here and I don’t have much time to keep up with it. But I’m glad to see an old TO member here. How have you been?
You’ll be interested in this article posted by Cossack (comment #254, PW’s “Come Saturday Morning” thread) on how we can apply pressure to the Democratic Party to do what we want. Hint: They don’t need our money so much, since they’ve got their corporate fat cats to supply that. But their lifeblood is volunteer precinct workers to get people registered and get out the vote. What will they do if the volunteers refuse to work during the critical months before a presidential election? Oh my. Now that’s pressure.
Nothing went wrong. It’s all about the money and not the party. As clearly pointed out by David Sirota, there are the people who are on the side of the money, and the people who are on the side of the people. This has nothing to do with being a Democrat or Republican. It’s how the real lines are drawn in Washington. The problem is the money people know what this is all about, the people-people do not.