Paul Bremer comes to his own defense in an op-ed in the Washington Post entitled "What We Got Right in Iraq " where he defends, among other things, the disbanding of the Iraqi army:
Before the 2003 war, the army had consisted of about 315,000 miserable draftees, almost all Shiite, serving under a largely Sunni officer corps of about 80,000. The Shiite conscripts were regularly brutalized and abused by their Sunni officers. When the draftees saw which way the war was going, they deserted and, like their officers, went back home. But before the soldiers left, they looted the army's bases right down to the foundations.
So by the time I arrived in Iraq, there was no Iraqi army to disband. Some in the U.S. military and the CIA's Baghdad station suggested that we try to recall Hussein's army. We refused, for overwhelming practical, political and military reasons.
[]
So, after full coordination within the U.S. government, including the military, I issued an order to build a new, all-volunteer army. Any member of the former army up to the rank of colonel was welcome to apply. By the time I left Iraq, more than 80 percent of the enlisted men and virtually all of the noncommissioned officers and officers in the new army were from the old army, as are most of the top officers today. We also started paying pensions to officers from the old army who could not join the new one — stipends that the Iraqi government is still paying.
Now I wasn't there but Rajiv Chandrasekaran was and he tells a somewhat different tale in Imperial Life in the Emerald City. As I wrote during our Book Salon coverage of the book:
[Bremer's] de-Baathification of the government was a model of efficiency compared to the dissolution of the Iraqi army that put put between 250,000-300,000 military personnel on the street. As Chandrasekaran tells the story, Bush had approved a plan to disband the Republican guard but retain the regular army. The Central Command dispatched planes over Iraq to drop leaflets telling soldiers not to fight, to "stay home with their families" — which is exactly what they did as the American tanks rolled into Baghdad:
Despite the leaflets instructing them to go home, [civilian in charge of the Iraqi military Walter] Slocombe had expected Iraqi soldiers to stay in their garrisons. Now he figured that calling them back would cause even more problems. The bases had been looted, so there was no place for them to live. And he assumed that most of the army's rank and file, who were Shiite conscripts, wouldn't want to come back anyway. If there had been proper barracks, only corrupt Sunni officers keen to retain their positions of authority would have returned. As far as Slocombe and Feith were concerned, the Iraqi army had dissolved itself; formalizing the dissolution wouldn't contradict Bush's directive.
[]
Eleven days after he arrived in Iraq, Bremer issued CPA order Number 2, which dissolved not just the army but the air force, the navy, the Ministry of Defense, and the Iraqi Intelligence Service. With the scrawl of his signature, he created legions of new enemies.
Bremer eventually announced that army officers who were not senior Baathists would receive monthly stipends and a new army of 40,000 infantrymen would be formed to guard Iraq's borders, but it was too little too late:
In a land of honor and tradition, the viceroy had disrespected the old soldiers. I never ran into Omri again, but months later, I did see another former soldier who had been at the protest.
"What happened to everyone there?" I asked. "Did they join the new army?"
He laughed.
"They're all insurgents now," he said. "Bremer lost his chance."
I have no proof that one tale is more valid than the other, although one does sound a whole lot more plausible. And the Washington Post opinion section is given of late to publishing weird, self-serving, fact-free NeoCon tripe by people seeking to absolve themselves for responsibility for this disastrous war. But considering the fact that Chandrasekaran was in Iraq as Bureau Chief for the Washington Post and continues to work at the paper as an assistant managing editor, and his widely read and respected reporting paints a whole different picture from what Bremer is claiming, you have to wonder what posessed them to run this op-ed unchallenged.
Or not. The opinion section of the Washington Post seems to have severed its ties with the Reality Based Community some time ago.
Related posts:
- The End of the Delusion in Iraq
- The Major General’s Temper Tantrum
- Report Confirms Poor Electrical Work by KBR Endangers US Troops in Iraq and Afghanistan
- In Iraq, As in So Many Contexts, Withdrawal is Victory
- Torture: Obama Heeded Maliki on Abuse Photos, Says McClatchy; What That Says for Our Occupation





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Where’s lolo?
mornin’ Jane. sorry about the other day. hope you are feeling great today!
{{{{{Jane}}}}}
I heard that even the demon of Roshomon gate fled when he learned of man’s cruelty.
closer
Alternative scandal list.
‘Morning, Jane!! Rashomon, so early in the day? Groovy!!
I hope that we will some day be able to turn up the goods to prosecute Bremer; there’s a point when willful stupidity becomes gross negligence, and he’s the very definition of the concept.
Tell you what, any of these troops that were anywhere near the first Gulf war were going to have nothing to do with engaging the US in a conventional conflict. Can you say “Highway of Death”.
Bremer chats today at 3 pm eastern, btw.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..id=topnews
Abu Ghareb destroyed the US’ moral authority in Iraq.
Bremer’s de-Baathification destroyed Iraqi civil society.
Sen. Reid is right–the war is lost, and it was lost in 2003-04.
I am surprised lolo didn’t get the zed on the Advertise on Firedoglake even though it didn’t take comments.
G’mornin’ pups, Jane & pups w dino!
I couldn’t get past the first sentence of Bremer’s article:
of all the words in all the languages he picks the one that refers to blood loss.
bleeding.hemorrhage.death
the man has no soul.
A small historical note about the Post from a gentleman of a certain age. Up through the late sixties, the Post was, at best, a small regional paper, given to promote the latest nonsense from DC ’society’, along with government pronouncements.
It was really through the gutsy work of Ben Bradlee and Katherine Graham that the Post broke through as a ‘national’ paper, first through the publication of the Pentagon Papers and then, of course, with Woodstein and Wagtergate. At the same time, the Post’s magazine, Newsweek, grew into a well-respected weekly.
Now with Bradlee and Graham gone, you can see that Young Graham has given in to the old guard (who never really went away) and allowed it to go back to being a Republican paper in all but name. As for Newsweek, two words. John. Meacham. Res ipsa loquitur
I just keep coming back to what war? We are and have never been at war with Iraq. What this debacle is and always has been is a military operation to takeover, occupy, and secure oil for the U.S. and British oil companies.
Col. Lang has already written on this subject. He reaches the same conclusion as the above article; and details the many false and erroneous assumptions and conclusions made by Bremer.
If I corectly recall, the Colonel refers to Bremer and a few others as “the axis of incompetents”.
Ghostman
Morning Jane:
Hope this meets you well.
Lady Hamsher!!
Wasn’t Bremer some sort of an expert on risk (and the profits to be derived therefrom) before he took charge of Iraq?
What effect did his actions have on the risks in Iraq, and who made money from them?
Everything’s cool, Tiredfed. How about you?
At hospital, Trex covering my feet with a blanket.
Now I’ll feel bad if I taser him.
love your posts as always jane, hoping all is well
now for some additional insight to your post
it doesn’t matter which side is true and which side is not, here’s something that cannot be denied;
whether or not it was best strategy to send the loyalist armed forces home, it CANNOT be claimed ANY sceario dictated allowing them to go home with their weapons and ordinance
THAT was not only bizzare, it was counter intuitive and it made it CLEAR the administration had NO clue how to fight insurgents
figting insurgents 101;
1)DO NOT voluntarily give your potential enemies the weapons and arsenol they will use against you
2) GAURD OR DESTROY ALL OFFICIAL CACHE OF WEAPONRY AND ORDINANCE YOUR ENEMIES WILL USE AGAINST YOU IF THEY GET THEIR HANDS ON IT
now, figthting insurgents 101 has more obvious rules to follow I don’t know them all and I’m sure some of you here have rules that were ignored that anyone would know had they not been a military moron
OT PBS’s “Frontline: Spying on the Home Front”
Tomorrow night at 9:00 p.m. Eastern, PBS’s Frontline is broadcasting a new documentary entitled Spying on the Home Front, which examines the numerous ways in which the government’s domestic surveillance powers have been vastly expanded since 9/11. Most of that expansion has taken place in secret, with virtually no oversight of any kind, and has remained almost completely shielded from any public debate.
[…] Like the Bill Moyers documentary on the pre-Iraq press failures, the program does not really contain blockbuster new revelations that are unknown to those who have been attentive to these matters, but is nonetheless very much worth watching because it powerfully dramatizes the severity of privacy erosion at the hands of a federal government operating largely in the dark.
In Salon today, Patrick Cockburn on the illusion of time’s arrow in Baghdad:
perris @ 19
it doesn’t matter which side is true and which side is not, here’s something that cannot be denied;
whether or not it was best strategy to send the loyalist armed forces home, it CANNOT be claimed ANY sceario dictated allowing them to go home with their weapons and ordinance
THAT was not only bizzare, it was counter intuitive and it made it CLEAR the administration had NO clue how to fight insurgents
figting insurgents 101;
1)DO NOT voluntarily give your potential enemies the weapons and arsenol they will use against you
2) GAURD OR DESTROY ALL OFFICIAL CACHE OF WEAPONRY AND ORDINANCE YOUR ENEMIES WILL USE AGAINST YOU IF THEY GET THEIR HANDS ON IT
now, figthting insurgents 101 has more obvious rules to follow I don’t know them all and I’m sure some of you here have rules that were ignored that anyone would know had they not been a military moron
details, details!
Pat Lang had a scathing commentary on Bremmer’s Op Ed piece yesterday on his blog, which he opens by placing the CPA boss in an “Axix of Ineptitude” along with Tenet and Franks. (Personally, I don’t think he cast his net wide enough; Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, and especially Feith belong in this august inner circle as well. And, of course, we can’t forget Bush and Cheney.)
http://turcopolier.typepad.com…..f_ine.html
Definitely worth the read.
jane hamsher @ 19
I get the idea trex might enjoy the pain if it’s you that inflicts
jane hamsher @ 18
you’ll just have to teaser him instead!
are those peep toes you’re wearing?)
(((Jane)))
For a good explanation of this, look at the Washington Post’s contemporaneous coverage: see this Nov. 2003 article about the decision to disband the Iraqi army:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..ge=printer
It won’t be news to most of you that Bremer made the decision “in consultation with” Wolfowitz and Feith. Bremer, obviously, was a figurehead — he was plucked from obscurity and has now receded into the netherworld of self-serving memoirs. It would be naive to think of the momentous decision to disband the Iraqi army as some inept improvisation done by “the stupidest fucking guy(s) on the face of the earth”: it was, rather, an essential condition for creating the vacuum that has “justified” our stay.
As with Justice Department scandal, how could the CPA have appointed loyal bushies to handle such extreme and sensitive posts in a foreign land where most did not even speak the language?
According to Chandrasekaran, these neophytes had no real world administrative experience, some didn’t even have passports. All they had was the correct political affiliation.
From the start, this was a head-on collision waiting to happen. And Bremer cannot re-write history with Op-Ed spin.
O/t to Jane -
May I compliment you on your ownership of an Eames chair….bought mine back in the ’80’s from an office supply store going out of business and it is still among my most prized possessions. One of those life-time investments that is probably now worth more than the reduced price I paid for it. Wonder how much value added one could attach to the contact with Mr. Newman’s back side? *g*
The last paragraph of Patrick Cockburn’s piece:
Elliott @ 23
a few more details’
3) DO NOT divert the resources neccessary for you national security into an area that you know poses no threat
4) DO NOT initiate policies that you know as a fact will help insurgents recruit, for instance condoning and participating in torture, for instance ignoring treaties your predecessors GAURANTEED with the full integrety of the United States of America they would follow, like the geneva convention
5) DO NOT voluntarily engage with fewer troops then you know you need, less equiptment you know is neccessary
there are more, I’m hopin’ others can add
I read that Bremer oped. I don’t blame him for being incompetent. I blame Bush for putting him in charge. I blame Bush for giving him orders that he clearly couldn’t carry out. I blame Bush for saying that he is going to liberate Iraq and then putting an American General in charge. That doesn’t sound like liberation to me. Invading a country, bombing it to shit and then auctioning off the “rebuilding” contracts to friendly companies in your own country isn’t liberation. It sounds like the opposite to me.
Mmmm, maybe because they saw which way the war was really going maybe? Foresight, Mr. Bremer, can be an invaluable gift. But I suppose that’s an unnecessary quality for people like you sitting in your ivory towers making worthless excuses. You ought to at least have the decency to keep your mouth shut at this point in time.
Would that Bill Kristol and his ilk had waited this long to open their smug little lips.
The War can’t be won by purely military means – everyone, including the Pentagon, seems to agree on that.
The Iraqi Parliment is yawning and about to go on a two-month “too hot to move in the Summer” vacation – so, there’s no effective political means being employed to supplement the military effort.
Bush is like a Pinata that’s been burst but still dangling – leaking blood and treasure – he’s nothing to fear now. In fact, Bush is laughable in his ham-fisted stupidity – lashing out and bellowing from a powerless position.
In the art of war, the best enemy to have is a predictable enemy.
I believe that, to some extent at least, the transformation of the Iraqi army into the insurgency was the deliberate policy of Saddam. Huge numbers of weapons & explosives were buried in small caches all over Iraq PRIOR TO the invasion, and are still being used to fuel the insurgency. During the invasion, embedded reporters (en route to Baghdad) were reporting pickup trucks full of non-uniformed “fedayeen” attacking Americans using guerilla tactics. It turned out later that they were former Iraqi army troops (mainly Republican Guard, I think). Clearly, some forethought went into the insurgency before any American soldiers set foot on Iraq soil.
After the 1st Gulf War, Saddam knew he couldn’t stop the Americans by conventional military force, even if his army hadn’t been degraded by a decade of sanctions. After the sanctions, he really had no choice but to resort to unconventional war. Given the circumstances, his defense of Iraq was actually quite clever and may, in the end, defeat us.
It is true that his plan to hole up in Baathist strongholds & direct the insurgency from hiding didn’t work out very well for him personally. On the other hand, he was a good deal smarter than Bush, Cheyney, et. al., and their blunders have increased his status posthumously. That’s not something that happens to very many mass-murdering oppressive autocrats, and it is not something that is likely to happen to Bush.
Minnesotachuck @ 24
He has definitely not cast the net wide enough (see my link above). I don’t think the ruthless decision to disband the army was unadulterated malice: I’m sure it was sincerely hoped an Athens on the Tigris would spontaneously arise, but, if it didn’t and the U.S. army had to stay, that was a desirable outcome, too, if not optimal. I’d say it was about one part criminal recklessness, two parts fiendish calculation.
By the way, Bremer isn’t the only Bushie to go around trying to convince people that the wrong decisions they made seemed like good ideas at the time. Michael Brown will still tell anyone who will listen that he did a great job in N.O. Tenet. Wolfie. Gonzo. Condi “I don’t know what we were supposed to bomb in Afghanistan” Rice. Sure they made mistakes, but they were only looking at the facts at the time. What a load.
OT anyone else having trouble accessing CSPAN online? there’s a whistleblower hearing on CSPAN3 now but I can’t get to it.
It is impossible for Bremer to resuscitate his reputation, as this factotum never had one to begin with. Hiatt is offering him space because he wants to reinforce the fiction that Bremer, not Wolfowitz and Feith, was making decisions.
Paul Bremer ?? really Loretta ?!?!?, last week it was Richard Perle –
is this a series Donnie ??
next up – Grayston Finch on how he could’ve succeeded at the Bay of Pigs if only . . .what a shame Westmoreland isn’t around to write about how Tet should’ve gone
the second Generals ad is up at dkos, Major General (ret.) Paul D. Eaton:
If the President won’t listen, Congree must
GeorgeSimian @ 37
Bremer, Tenet, Wolfie, Gonzo, and Condi are simply exhibiting the traits that made them loyal Bushies in the first place.
I didn’t know that Baghdad had a DisneyLand. That must have been where Bremer was staying since it’s where dreams come true right? Right?
Either that or he’s got a hell of a supply of ‘Shrooms…
Mornin’ everybody!
Jane – keep your feet warm and taser whomever seems appropriate. My guess that a human taser would barely dent the therapod’s hide…
U.S. soldier shot to death in Pakistan
dakine01 @ 43
Bremer stayed in Sadaam’s palaces, not exactly reality-based places and better than Disneyland.
Turning Iraq over to the Iraqi Generals was the ONLY chance we had to prevent the chaos of civil war. General Gardiner was fired and replaced by Bremer because that was his plan.
Frontline’s The Lost Year In Iraq is the best report I’ve seen on this — Paul Bremer was a meglomaniac asshole, the Bushies were totally incompetent, and the Iraqis are paying the price.
Best Frontline quote — Kissinger calls Bremer a control freak!
When the black hole of Real Politik calls someone a disfunctional control freak, that’s as damning as it gets.
twolf1 @ 45
That won’t make Bush do anything, but maybe the Pakistanis will decide enough is enough.
GeorgeSimian @ 32
Nevertheless, Bremer was an invaluable neocon tool and he must bear the weight of executing their punishing will upon the people of Iraq and our soldiers. He willingly took on the mantle. Bush, I truly believe at this point, is way too stupid and mentally damaged to have dreamed up such a mess.
They wanted this mess in the Middle East. They just didn’t count on the American public starting to peek under the propaganda curtain and seeing Dick Cheney’s wingtips.
brendan @ 39
Excellent point.
Fred Hiatt is a Neocon.
Minnesotachuck @ 24
And Bill Kristol! Any exploration of tragically inept and foolish theories put to test in the workings of the Iraq debacle are sorely remiss if they do not lay a good portion of the blame at this drum beaters feet!
that and it was Ahmad Chalabi’s birthday;)
Elliot – thanks for the link – integrity personified
((((Jane))))
((((Katey))))
Can the WaPo op-ed writers and the WSJ op-ed page just dump their respective news/journalism operations and form a new paper?
Because they’d do a hell of a job threatening The Onion’s monopoly on fake news and wishful thinking.
Ah yes, William “the Bloody” Kristol
there is a special place in hell for just him.
cbl @ 53
where is Chalooba now, anyway?
Elliott @ 55
Masticated in the mouth of the fallen one, himself, no doubt.
OT, but definitely worthy of a read: the truly wonderful Scott Horton skewers Gonzo yet again.
http://harpers.org/archive/2007/05/hbc-90000060
johnSwifty @ 57
that’ll wipe that smirk off his face!
where is Chalooba now, anyway?
busy crafting the latest oil revenue sharing contract no doubt- but a good question – let’s see what the Google knows . . .
The entire post opinion section yesterday seems to have emanated from Karl Rove’s dictaphone: from the Bremer front page piece to the letter in support of Wolfo’s girlfriend to the editorial bashing the Democratic Congress AGAIN, to the insufferable George Will holding his daintly little First Amendment nose over the hate crimes bill. A steaming pile of sewage from cover to cover.
And well you may ask, WHAT will it TAKE before I cancel my subscription……
Nice piece, Jane! (And wonderful movie.)
If anything, the comparison to Rashomon is somewhat unfair to Chandrasekharan, since it implies that both his and Fred Hiatt’s world view have equal validity and that The Full Truth May Never Be Known Or Knowable (you know — the squid ink of obfuscation that the neocons and their enablers like to squirt out when caught in a tight spot?). I personally prefer a comparison to Gaslight — with the American public as Ingrid Bergman to the GOP/Media Complex’s Charles Boyer.
Good morning from L.A. Excellent post to wake up to, JH.
Glad to see others have posted link to Pat Lang’s piece refuting Bremer’s op-ed. David Habbakuk has a follow up on Pat’s blog re: who made the decision to disband the Iraqi army & why:
Habbakuk on Ineptitude
Elliott @ 59
My contempt for Joe Lieberman is eclipsed only by my contempt for Bill Kristol by a thousand suns and moons and all the myriad planets of the universe.
In essence, it is the ‘winnable’ nuclear war faction struggling to put into place their idea of ‘paradise’, against the realists. Who will be victorious? That’s the real question. Our children’s lives and humanity, hang in the balance.
From Salon’s War Room on McConnell’s exchange with Wolfie yesterday:
Marie Roget @ 63
Good morning, fellow Angeleno. Had a bit of a scare when my digital thermomenter had inexplicably flipped to Celcius, but I was skeptical that it was 11 degrees in the southland this morning…
This neocon crowd has a very high opinion of themselves. They all look alike and have generally the same background. The same goes for all the high renking officers in the military.
Our greatest strenght as a country is our diversity. This debacle in Iraq has illustrated the need for a more diversity of opinion in our national policy making aparatus. Women, various minority groups, various economic groups, people from the arts, education, medicine etc.
Phoenix Woman @ 61
One of the things I love about
Roshomon is that all of the characters take credit for the killing, instead of exonerating themselves. There’s a point here, but I’m not sure what it is. :)
All the best to you, Jane.
jane hamsher @ 19
I’m good. working on a master list of questions for Delilah. Hmmm. that must be some taser to slow a 60ft dino. does he just giggle when you hit him with it?
– “for”! –
(I can’t edit on here – I hate that)
johnSwifty @ 52
The disbandment was not the implementation of a “tragically inept and foolish policy”. It was done to deliberately create a power vacuum so that a parade of humanitarians could insist that if we left it would be a bloodbath.
Compare the end of the Gulf War with the “end” of of the war 2003. Bush I purposely kept the Baathis guard in place, the end of the war was negotiated with the defeated Iraqis in tableaux that could have come from Compeigny or Brussels. Significantly, we scrupulously abstained from intervening in the Shiite rebellion — the neocon narrative is that we incited them to rebel and then chickened out, but count me skeptical on that now; I think it was the seed of the “liberation” justification for the current war. I think the one neocon victory was the establishment of the no-fly zones, also under the guise of humanitarian intervention (remember those fleeing Kurds?). Maybe Bush I, Scowcroft, et al themselves wanted to retain a military presence in Iraq, but it doesn’t seem to jibe with the rest of the way they treated the defeated regime. In any case, my point is that this time the neocons were not going to allow an “exit strategy”, even if it entailed a “quagmire” of the most infernal sort.
Elliott @ 38
how ironic!
Phoenix Woman — fair point, Rajiv seems to have his feet firmly planter in the Reality Based Community. Bremer — not so much.
The only benchmark in Iraq that matters to the Ali BushCo Den of Thieves is in trouble.
From the LA Times, via TPM –
OT – I read Marcy’s latest on Monica. Have to hope she’s wrong (which isnt likely). If anyone has any questions they would like the House Judiciary Committee members to ask, please post here or at TNH.
TiredFed @ 73
Darlene Fitzgerald, U.S. Customs Agency whistleblower on now.
FBI whistleblowers coming up I think they said 11.30 eastern.
On topic – this war has got to end! and a lot sooner than next spring!!! I don’t care if it means a wholesale drubbing of Republicans at the polls, a permanent Republican minority in Congress and the White House goes Democratic for the next 16 years! I want it over NOW!
-ck- @ 75
September sounds good, eh? The surge’s progress report is in direct proportion with the Iraqi parliment’s adoption of the oil law/PSAs.
Phoenix Woman @ 62
Oh I can’t resist, I’ll posit another Boyer anology with Cheney and Rumsfeld playing the part of Boyer in Algiers; having escaped the dangers of previous administration’s failures they now entice the american public (as Hedy Lamarr) to return with them to the Cazbah, knowing it is suicide.
It’s a stretch, of course, but Boyer in the morning…smells like FDL!
Mutant Poodle @ 67
Good morning, MP. 11 would be startling- coldest I’ve ever experienced here was about 29 (in the middle of the night, of course).
Are you on the Westside? 60 over here & cloudy…
jim oconnor @ 68
This point never leaves my mind for a moment when I hear these pampered, flabby-faced white men blabbering endlessly on CNN and other outlets about events that are shaping our country and our world.
I think Amy Goodman said it best, but I have to paraphrase a teensy bit out of context here. We keep hearing so much opinion, framed as news, from such a small amount of the same people who know so little about the subject at hand and, although they have been consistently wrong about everything, no one seems to notice but us and somehow they are allowed to keep on talking.
If we replaced them with the kind of people you’re talking about, this nation would be at peace with the world and we’d still have an effing surplus.
Bremer was just a tool. He was sent there with an agenda and a bevy of starry-eyed true believers as his only back up. It was apparent from the very beginning. I made myself persona non grata at my fathers house for telling him and my uncle(both very conservative) that Bremer received his medal of freedom for laying the groundwork for the rape of Iraq’s economy.
“The opinion section of the Washington Post seems to have severed its ties with the Reality Based Community some time ago.”
and yet it continues to be taken seriously — more than, say, that of the wsj, which everyone at least knows to roll eyes at and discount.
what i don’t get is why top management — and don graham, that includes YOU — thinks fred hiatt and his prattlings on non-sense is the way to go. exactly what long-term constituency is being served?
Helpless Dancer @ 83
yes, i can see how that might not have gone over quite so well…
apparently they have parked Chalabi as chair of some committee looking in to detention conditions
TImes Select abstract
brendan @ 72
I follow you. And does this dovetail with the political necessity for BushCo to show good faith to the House of Saud by removing the military occupation from Suadi Arabian soil, left over from Gulf War, and make a permanent move to Iraq?
Marie Roget @ 81
I am just the other side of Mulholland Drive, about 1.5 miles west of the 405. It’s 57 degrees here and sunny – you must be getting an early dose of June Gloom.
I am surprised that no one has mentioned the obvious culprit. I blame Clinton.
For those who think that the disbanding of the Iraqi Army was part of a conspiracy to create chaos in Iraq, you can’t have it both ways. They can’t be diabolically clever on this and so incompetent everywhere else. Indeed they have been very consistent. The only thing diabolical about them is their neverending capacity for self-delusion and stupidity.
brendan @ 72
i am absolutely in agreement with you on this. the point was chaos — chaos was the GOAL. because chaos enables the continued martial state.
the crooks and punks in the bush administration know that all they have to do is put up with the label of incompetence — why should that bother them as long as they hold on to the reins of power?
Ever notice how nobody talks about “mutual destruction” anymore?
seen in westchester county, n.y., yesterday. a handwritten sign in the back window of an s.u.v.:
we heart patrick fitzgerald.
would we have believed 5 years ago that a government would come into power to line their own pockets and do nothing at all for the people of this country?
would we believe anyone so callous that they would actively destroy everything that we, the people, had fought for, come to know, come to expect, and base our lives on?
it is time to remove them to prison. It is time to pass laws holding our representatives to a much higher level than anyone else. Why? because then only people that don’t want to steal will ask for the job and the current crop will wither. some will remain, but not many.
Hugh @ 89
Oh, don’t go saying there’s no grey area; that’s the job of the rabid right who only see in black and white.
Isn’t it possible that Brendan has a point about the nefarious intention being to create a need for permanent occupation AND that was coupled with complete ineptitude in realizing how pervasive a result would be to the entire region?
Considering the figures here for Sunni officers and Shia conscripts, it gives creedence to the theory that, in the FIRST “gulf war” we enabled Saddam by carpet bombing those Shia conscripts for him, as his Sunni relatives and officers skeedadled back to Baghdad. Remember, how our jets were taking out that long string of vehicles fleeing from the actual battle front, and SOMEONE called them off?
Why did we so agreeably back off of taking out Saddam’s Sunni henchmen, but so willingly bury, bomb and generally destroy all those unwilling Shias hiding in the sand?
More Bush Family Secrets for the future to unveil? Only time will tell…
oddmommy @ 61
A move away from DC is probably what it would take. So long as the only viable alternatives locally are the Moonie Times and the Baltimore Sun, the Compost wins by default.
Mutant Poodle @ 88
Probably. I’m more or less in Santa Monica. Overcast already starting to burn off a little here.
If the United States keeps going on the way it is going, like staying in Iraq for another ten years or so, sooner or later we will have to use nuclear weapons.
“I used to think that the causes of war were predominantly economic. I came to think that they were more psychological. I am now coming to think that they are decisively “personal,” arising from the defects and ambitions of those who have the power to influence the currents of nations.”
~ B. H. Liddell Hart
Mandrake @ 49
I tend to agree with this conclusion. The only other alternative is that they are all just to stupid to tie their own shoes and while that has a fair amount of appeal it is probably wrong.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 91
I think that is is because that Russia(our only comparable nuclear state) is more focused on economic warfare. Economic games played with oil and natural gas isn’t amendable to counter by nuclear war. At least not yet.
Hugh @ 89
well… they weren’t completely incompetent about getting elected/selected.
but, that was “rove’s shop” – not the neocons.
Marie Roget @ 63
from that link:
[my bold] I think this explains a lot.
Who was initially responsible for dubbing Bremer “viceroy”? Media? “Viceroy Bremer” sure has been used prolifigately in print & on tv. Titles like viceroy, czar & homeland security make me queasy.
brendan@72
“The disbandment was not the implementation of a “tragically inept and foolish policy”. It was done to deliberately create a power vacuum so that a parade of humanitarians could insist that if we left it would be a bloodbath.
[…]
In any case, my point is that this time the neocons were not going to allow an “exit strategy”, even if it entailed a “quagmire” of the most infernal sort.”
DING DING DING!
This is the most horrible part of it all, that it’s all deliberate, not a mistake.
You just don’t want to believe people could be so devious, so unfeeling about the thousands of lives lost, the millions of lives affected-all to steal another sovereign country’s oil and test neocon nation building strategies.
I feel confident that, ten years from now, when we must continually to refer back to Bush’s constant mistake as we recognize future misdeedsin similar veins, we will have more credibility than these desperate Clinton accusers.
Do any of you ever think for yourselves?
Your Clinton obsession is becoming glaringly Freudian; is it jealousy or blind contempt or both that drives you people to blame Clinton for everything that you refuse to admit the Republicans, particularly the neocons,have actually done?
The Ghost of Bill Clinton plagues you all.
And he isn’t even dead!
Whatever form of envy inspires all of you to continue the trash-talk, only your psychiatrist can tell.
neokneme @ 6
Nice, but with so much material available, why so short?
Adelman on Bremer, and Chalabi on Wolfowitz: the neocon roundrobin. From Frank Rich’s column on May 6, 2007:
(NYTimes link behind TimesSelect firewall.)
It is not only God that will be Blair’s judge over Iraq
His cravenly pro-US policy on the Middle East misunderstood Bush’s real agenda and resulted in catastrophic failure
Avi Shlaim
Monday May 14, 2007
http://www.guardian.co.uk/comm…..46,00.html
FBI whistleblowers panel on c-span 3 now.
STTP in Ohio @ 105
you don’t WANT to, but this is the mentality of the sociopath/nihilist — that we can do whatever we want, because we feel no contraints whatsoever.
and this is who has been running our country, and ruining our planet.
history will not look kindly on us.
egregious @ 77
If anyone else is having trouble, I had to reinstall realplayer (I hate you realplayer) arrrgh
but am now back in business. Grassley coming up at the conference.
Our Sweet Lady Jane!
It would be a huge mistake to think the necons are beaten. And no matter who wins in ‘08, their ideology will still be very much alive. And these guys will be even stronger than they are now.
Well this might be ‘conduct unbecoming’ or viza,verza. Ed*ward?
thinkprogress link
realworld @ 100
This is a correct analysis. They are that stupid. A distinction needs to be made between clever and smart. These guys were clever in manipulating the public and public opinion to fix elections or garner support for the Iraq War. They are masters at acquiring power but they are complete dopes in its exercise whether that is governance at home or waging war abroad.
I admit I am surprised that people here find it more comforting to imagine that this was all planned instead of the opposite that none of it was.
(longtime lurker, first time poster)
This latest Bremer story is easily debunked per Bob Woodward, Frontline, Thomas Ricks, and pretty much every other histroian that has written about the CPA. Don’t forget, Jay Garner was sent in to Iraq after the DoD totally dropped the ball on a Phase IV reconstruction plan. Garner had a working plan to start paying the Iraqi military men a mere $50 a month to serve as police/security forces. The soldiers were clamoring for the opportunity, and he had reached the point in negotiations that all he had to do was produce the cash… But Garner ruffled a lot of feathers by ignoring the whole State vs Defense turf war that was going on, and he was promptly replaced by Bremer. On his way out, Garner told Bremer not to do three things:
1. Do not dissolve the military.
2. Do not proceed with de-Baathification.
3. Do not project the US as being the governmental authority — let the tribal locals have final say.
Guess what three things Bremer promptly did as soon as he took over?
perris @ 31
6) DO NOT voluntarily engage in an area where you have no unbiased human intelligence reports. You must have agents on the ground who can give you an accurate picture of the situation.
7) Listen to the experts, not the folks wearing rose-colored glasses.
Mandrake @ 82
one of the beauties of Pelosi and the November 2006 election is the diversity we now see chairing committeee hearings. A breath of fresh air.
Me @ 107:
Redacted:
Welcome nickm!
Hope to hear from you often.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 114
i don’t know if they’ll be stronger, but you’re right — they’re not going away.
it is the lesson we have learned to our shame, since this mental illness masquerading as a politcal ideology has been stumbling around since at least reagan’s time.
and we know that, should these twisted souls finally be torn kicking and screaming from the houses of power, we must always track their movements. because these are dangerous people, and they will do anything to return.
cbl @ 86
THANK YOU cbl!
Emptywheel’s got the good word upstairs in the new thread.
The Storm Shelter From Reality
Hugh @ 116
Sorry, I really think they are evil, not stupid. It is part of Bush’s cleverness that he presents himself as dumb. I don’t even believe he is dumb. He turns it on and off too easily.
Hugh @ 115
I gotta admit surprise that you think it’s an all or none deal. I’m slogging my way through “The Great War for Civilization,” and the only thing my shallow layman’s brain can come away with is that the nuance of the area is as many layered as a shallot, inside an onion, wrapped in Garlic. You’ve got a much more studied history with the whole topic. I love your stuff. I’m just proposing that, just as the entire region is complex so, too, might be the intentions of various factions who wanted war.
I don’t like anything to be an all or none, but sometimes it is. Binary works for computers.
dmg @ 110
if there is a history
Brisingamen @ 118
NICE
to add to yours;
8) when a draft dodgers tells you your military generals are wrong and your military advisors are wrong when talking about the proper method to conduct a war, DO NOT listen to the draft dodgers
Elliott@118
“one of the beauties of Pelosi and the November 2006 election is the diversity we now see chairing committeee hearings. A breath of fresh air.”
Remember the one about the black, the gay, and the woman assuming powerful positions in Congress?
Of course we all do, because that was the scare tactic du jour before the 2006 elections.
Well, lookie lookie. We haven’t all gone to hell in a handbasket (yet), and Congress hasn’t been this productive in years. If anything, it seems the adults are back in charge of the asylum.
dmg @ 122
I think POINDEXTER & ABRAMS are great examples or this.
egregious @ 121
Seconded!!!
And I might add, your post was the most concise telling of the Bremer screw up of the Gardiner plan I’ve ever read.
realworld @ 100
Greg Palast’s analysis seems to make the most sense. If they had wanted to just take the oil, they would have done a much better job of securing Iraq. But they only wanted to stop the flow of Iraq’s oil or at least control it so that OPEC and the Saudis can keep prices up. Everything else is just collateral damage and the whole deal is paid for by the tax payers, not the corporations (energy/oil & contractors to boot), which benefit. What could be more sweet?
That’s why I really wonder about all this talk regarding handing over all the oil revenues to the Iraqis. If they did that, their venture would be a failure. That’s what they really mean when they’re talking about “failure.” I can’t see it happening but I hope I’m wrong.
I’m not really sure exactly how the neocons fit into the OPEC picture, but they were also helpful, perhaps unwitting tools, towards that end. And Cheney has ties to both, thanks to Bush.
“The president, he got his war.
Folks don’t know just what it’s for.
Nobody gives us rhyme or reason,
Have one doubt they call it treason.
We’re chicken feathers all, without one gut!
Goddammit! Tryin’ to make it real, compared to what?”
— Eugene McDaniels, 1969
youtube link
Bremer’s not interested in serving as the
Reichstag Fire scapegoat for the misery.
He sure deserves some shit for his pillow, but hammering on him for these “tactical” fuckups, and NOT pointing out that NO policy would have brought an apple-pie ending for the invasion and attempted occupation of Iraq, is parroting the bushCo “it’s all his fault!” line.
Very soon, there is going to be a TON of fingerpointing among republicans.
For the coming 18 months in the GOP, throwing people under the bus is going to be worthy of consideration as a new sport for the next Olympics. :o)
But it’s going to degenerate into Greco-Roman-cum-Grayhound wrasslin’, with every man (and woman…are you listening, Condi? :o) ) for themselves.
I make no apologies whatsoever, for looking forward to it. :o)
ironranger @ 104
When you see outlandish titles like “czar” or “viceroy” attached to someone in American politics, it’s a tipoff that they have no actual power.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 109
For those who want to read a history of the Israeli state, Shlaim’s “The Iron Wall” is a good one.
Hugh @ 89
This flippant argument deserves rebuttal.
Yes, in fact, Clinton does deserve some of the blame. He maintained the sanctions regime on Iraq, bombed it for his entire two terms in office and, finally, removed the inspectors in 1998. The Clinton administration was a halfway between Bush-Cheney neoconservatism and its polar opposite, Bush-Baker oil-centrism (you can practically hear them gnashing their teeth at the mention of Baker). So, for example, here’s a quiz: did Holbrooke or Dennis Ross oppose invading Iraq?. You inhabit a partisan echo chamber if you think the there’s no continuity between Clinton and Bush; that’s when neocons began to make headway, particular in cultivating the ideological ground in the media and think tanks.
Secondly, they didn’t have to be “diabolically” intelligent to decide they wanted a permanent U.S. presence in Iraq and then to figure out ways to do it: it took a few key “blunders”, i.e., conscious decisions, to create a series of faits accomplis. And in the first Gulf War, they had an example of precisely how to bring a war to a definitive end (see my #72), and at the time they railed against that (remember all the ridicule heaped on Bush and Scowcroft for not “going to Baghdad”?) Don’t get me wrong — the neocons would have definitely preferred the flowers and candy, and secular democracy, and pipeline through Haifa, and everything else, but, barring that, a vacuum was an acceptable outcome.
johnSwifty @ 87
Yes.
Hugh @ 89
Ulterior motives and ineptitude aren’t mutually exclusive.
brendan @ 139
WORD
dmg @ 90
Badda boom, badda bing. Yer all over it.
Chaos is their main tool and that’s how they have manipulated this game since 1984 (or earlier).
Typical guerrilla tactics, which is kinda ironic (but they learnt he lessons well from both Goebbels and the guerrilla movements thruout history).
Create chaos, divide, conquer where possible, create false illusions, condemn and codify as THREAT any who don’t go along with it all and stifle dissent with quick and swift accusation.
All this band of ReThugs wants out of Iraq is the PSA’s.
All they want out of our Republic here at home is extended rule beyond an elected Presidency, and Supreme Executive Privilages, which they are WELL on their way to having.
And the Dem’s are part of it all, lock on the public, stocks on the market and barrels of oilfilled profits.
Barring some HUGE unforseen divine intervention on the part of the general public (street marches) we have lost our Republic and are likely NOT to ever see it again.
Polish up on the New Testament and get thee HIE into a local congragation (one that does NOT sanction gay marriages much less gay relationships and preferably, one that’s lily white), fly the flag on yer car, stock up on Support The Troops Ribbons for yer car, and tell everyone at work and in yer neighborhood how proud you are of your country and what an HONOR it is to live here oh those poor souls in 3rd World Countries, when will they ever get a break what a shame they won’t stand up for themselves.
Anyone got a way OUT of this? Given BOTH sides of the aisle are part and parcel of the same fuckery? Given the leading edge of this battle for empire is part and parcel of every fabric of our daily lives, and our system of governence from top to bottom?
I got nuttin.
oldtree @ 93
Old Tree My Dearest Ent, the system is corrupted from top to bottom, WE are the problem. The nation is the problem.
We The People can’t fix this system by holding ANYONE to higher levels of standards. The elections are rigged, the system’s rigged.
We are the end product of a mass production/capitalistic and mass consumer experiment gone all self serving wrong.
How do you stop it? Ya don’t, mama nature and the pendulum’s of time will swing to stop it all . . . maybe in our lifetime, maybe not. Maybe it gets worse for another generation, then it comes crashing down.
I suggest making peace with what you can live with in terms of personal honor, and getting on with what ever we have of our lives we enjoy and can deal with. The rest is out of our hands.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 114
They have morphed from the White and Black Russians, thru the Labor Movement of the 20’s, to McCarthyism and Anti Communism to Christian Fundie’s. And they are morphing now, into what ever they need to, to glom onto the next ‘wave of power’ . . . that Big Brother continues to tolerate them causes me pause for concern, for they are not proving to be effective to Big Bro’s Causes . . . they must have some value and influence over the Big Bro Schema I’m missing . . . .
Elliott @ 119
. . . . one of the beauties of Pelosi and the November 2006 election is the diversity we now see chairing committeee hearings. A breath of fresh air.
What fresh air? They’re all bought and paid for by A*P*C and the other PAC’s. It’s all Wall Street and MIC money. If they were truly on their own and free to pursue, there’d be folks hanging from gallows at this point!
Nah, just an illusion we fall for . . . that there are two party’s.
Tanbark @ 134
Well well, back from the depths of backyard BIG tonka toys for boys, digs for treasure and all that banjo magic!! My friend, Tanbark!
Tan likes to dig for treasure, and he’s also a Black Water Diver. This dude’s a former Marine of GREAT standing, and man of great heart for history. One of the most fascinating folks I’ve ‘met’ in years . . . . :grin:
My only disagreement with much he’s ever posted anywhere is that, what ever the Rethugs and NeoCon’s are, so is the rest of our country and it’s ownership. So getting rid of The ReThugs is really not ridding ourselves of the pure evil and horror that’s wasted our place in history as the country that had the potential but, chose NOT to change the world for the better, only for themselves.
Other n that, Tan’s a HOSS of Hosses! :GRIN:
I’m certainly gonna enjoy the bus throwing unders’ but, it will be tepmered by the fact that the Dem’s get the same PAC money as the Evil One’s Do. And all that money comes from our Big Brother.
Why so much “new” shoddy infrastructure built not up to code in Iraq? All done under Bremmer and other Bush Americans in charge. Many of the new bldgs. and utilities already falling apart as per NPR report that aired this spring. Billions of US dollars wasted. Big contractors awaiting trial for taking money and not delivering.
“Yes, in fact, Clinton does deserve some of the blame. He maintained the sanctions regime on Iraq, bombed it for his entire two terms in office and, finally, removed the inspectors in 1998.” — Brendan
I think you need to distinguish between No Fly Zone bombing and the two bombing campaigns using Cruise missiles which Clinton ordered.
The inspectors were removed before Desert Fox, which destroyed the Al Qaqaa high-explosives factory, a major accomplishment, along with degrading other targets. The other Cruise missile attack on Iraq occured a few months after Clinton took office.
June 27, 1993
US President Bill Clinton orders a cruise missile attack on Iraqi intelligence headquarters in the Al-Mansur district, Baghdad, in response to the attempted assassination of former U.S. President George Bush in Kuwait in mid-April.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I….._1990-1996
The sanctions regime cannot be laid solely on Clinton’s doorstep. And while the civilian toll was extreme, the disarming of Hussein was a noble purpose — though it may mask a two decade-long effort to set up for a Bushco invasion. I’m unaware of any evidence that Clinton was complicit in such a long-term invasion plan.
Bush’s invasion released “tens of thousands of tons” of high-explosives and artillery shells — which is the source of the IEDs — to hostiles, due to gross underdeployment, and the total failure to write orders for that guarding.
Peter Galbraith, in his “The End of Iraq,” gives a longer list of the security services dissolved by CPA Order #2: “It dissolved Iraq’s army, its air force, its navy, its secret police, its intelligence services, the Republican Guards, the Ba’ath Party militia, and the Ministry of Defense. (p. 119)
“Cobra II” supplies the tidbit that CPA decided to call the new Iraqi force they would build the NIK, which sounds like the word for ‘f*ck’ in Arabic.
Bremer and his fellow warcriminals must have had a big laugh about that one, though Cobra II pretends this was a coincidence that showed how little the West understood those inscrutables now ‘in their charge.’ Even the bad speakers of a language commonly know such words — indeed, there is every reason to expectd that Nik was one of the words used most often by U.S. males deployed to what Kissinger briefed to the Saudi princes in early 2004 as “Former-Iraq.”
the awarding of the Medal of Freedom to Paul Bremer — an act that was more coverup than honor — is probably one of the most disgraceful moments in modern U.S. history. i’ve just finished looking at photos of crying Iraqi toddlers bruised and battered in the latest bombing. you’re some hero, Paul.
Bremer and his ilk read Sun Tzu’s the Art of War for the purpose of winning, not to become a better human being.
Maximilien Robespierre spoke of those who consider the world to be “the heritage of the astute egoist.”
•Henry Kissinger is underneath all these troubles, as usual.
His student Jerry Bremer is just as guilty.
These ‘astute egoists’ wash themselves in blood, for corporate war profits.