Boy howdie it sure was great to see a bunch of white men snap to last night and say that the day women lost the right to have control over their own bodies it would be a "blessed day" in America, eh?
I wasn't terribly impressed with the answers the Democratic candidates gave on abortion last week either, but given the way Brian Williams phrased the question I had some sympathy -- saying "most of the American people agree" with the recent Supreme Court decision and then asking them what they think was the equivalent of saying "when did you stop beating your wife?" Why didn't he say, "considering the fact that women will lose kidney function, suffer stroke, have seizures, brain damage and even death because doctors now face criminal penalties for performing this procedure, how do you feel?" It would have been equally leading, but Williams wouldn't have sounded like such a right wing hack.
Nothing, however, excuses this:
Imagine if Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama or John Edwards had said in last week’s South Carolina presidential debate that their “model Supreme Court justice” is the late “Whizzer” White — the same Byron White who wrote the blistering dissent against Roe v. Wade in 1973. Safe to say these Democratic frontrunners instantly would have been charged with a major gaffe by pundits and feminists, given the party’s fealty to abortion rights.
Yet that’s just what New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson replied to the Supreme Court hypothetical, and a week later his answer has gone unremarked except by a few liberal bloggers. “You lost us,” one wrote. But at NARAL Pro-Choice America, the leading reproductive rights group, a spokesperson seemed just vaguely aware of the exchange.
Nancy Keenan -- Hello, McFly? It's not like nobody noticed:
One who did was Kate Michelman, the former NARAL president, who backs Edwards for president but has known Richardson as an abortion-rights supporter. “I remember turning to my husband and saying, ‘That was an odd choice,’” she said. “My next thought was, somebody needs to call that campaign.”
Besides writing the Roe dissent, in which he was joined by conservative William Rehnquist, White also opposed the 1966 Miranda ruling that police immediately inform criminal suspects of their legal rights. And he wrote the 1986 Bowers ruling, anathema to gay-rights groups, that upheld a state antisodomy law; the Court overturned that decision in 2003.
I guess Keenan was too busy fundraising off the recent decision to actually do her job. Is it any wonder Democratic presidential hopefuls spent as much time making the anti-choice "abortion icky" crowd feel okay about that position as the Republicans did?
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How’s it going, Jane?
Jane!!!
JANE!
missed it by *that* much
Glad you are keeping on her back.
That’s two today, I’m on a roll!
Whoa! Nancy Keenan is STILL in charge of NARAL? I thought by now that they’d have replaced her with someone who supports abortion rights.
Frank Probst @ 7
Workin’ on it.
I got a call last week asking for money and I proudly told them that I had heard that they were sitting on a pile of cash and did nothing to fight Alito’s nomination…and so If I support Naral, it will be my local chapter… the woman on the phone took it all down…I hope they get the message.
The decision to terminate pregnancy is the pregnant woman’s domain. No one elses. Least of all a man’s prerogative. I feel strongly about this. It is demeaning to women and to me, as a man, to even have to make this comment. It is simply put, none of my business.
Frank - chances are, the rot in NARAL is too deep to expel Keenen. Most likely, they see her as “one of them” more that they would a women who actually needs their help.
The national organization, anyways. IIRC, some of the state branches are still actually doing what they were formed to do.
So is NARAL the lefty version of wingnut welfare?
This ‘debate’ needs to be reframed as a defense of privacy, of the need to prevent governmental intrusion into private decisions between women and their doctors. ‘Partial-birth’ abortion is a red herring.
A thought just hit me (but not too hard or it prol’ly would have hurt), but I’m thinkin’ that Richardson naming White as the outstanding justice was a rather shoddy attempt at triangulation.
IIRC, he said later part of it was because White had been the All-American football player. Given the guff that Richardson took after it was discovered that he hadn’t been drafted by an MLB team, it may just have been an attempt to play the good ol’ boy jock card.
Dems get beat up for not being good ol’ boys for sports as witness the reaction to Kerry windsurfing. After all, JFK got a lot of mileage out of the family touch football games.
It does not however, excuse Richardson for his idiocy in picking White nor does it excuse Keenan for her craven backing of HoJo and the others and her responses to the cloture votes.
Jane Hamsher:
Just want to let you know I got solicited by mail by those people and explained in a letter why they would never get my money. I also told my mother and sister to be on the lookout.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 10
Agreed. Unfortunately, too many other men still believe that it is their Dog given right to be patriarchal a**holes.
Jane
EPU’d last thread
I sent it to you and Christy, yours to the gmail, hers to the firedoglake address. It has four photos attached, is that a problem?
Tried again with just one attached to you only. Let me know.
OT but On dogs and Dana Perino
Icy blonde propagandrix Dana Perino’s husband jailed
/SMACK!>
It is NEVER too late to expel Nancy Keenan, and it will be done. As long as women are always in danger because of the Keenans and Rethugs of the world us real women will keep making sure we control our own bodies. Period.
Elliott @ 18
Looks like the Bushies just can’t get a break!
;)
Een my book, Integrity ees most easily defined as being whole, as having a completeness that comes when jour actions match closely weeth jour stated principles.
I am reluctant to say thees, but using the above definition, eet ees regrettably easy to see that the N.R.A. has more integrity than N.A.R.A.L.
The question becomes: ?Do we try replace Keenan, or do we route around N.A.R.A.L. altogether and replace eet weeth other, stronger groups wheech weel fight the continual theft of our human rights?
?eh?
Wow. New story on Goodling/Sampson. I don’t think we knew about these emails before.
http://quote.bloomberg.com/app.....E0Xyb65axc
Three hours before Goodling visited his fourth-floor office, Margolis told House and Senate investigators that Sampson dropped by to say he had information Margolis needed to know, one congressional aide said.
Margolis recounted that Sampson read his e-mail exchanges with White House aides that showed the decisions on firing the prosecutors were closely coordinated with members of the president’s staff, the aide said.
Stunned Reaction
Margolis recalled that he was stunned to learn the extent of White House involvement in the dismissals, congressional aides said. Margolis testified that preparation for McNulty’s Senate testimony — which took place more than a month before his meetings with Goodling and Sampson — was based on the assumption that the White House only became involved at the end of the firing process, the aide said.
McNulty told the Senate Judiciary Committee on Feb. 6 that the White House’s only involvement was that presidential aides were informed of the decision before the U.S. attorneys were told. Charles E. Schumer, the New York Democrat leading the Senate investigation into the dismissals, has since said that he believes McNulty may have been misled by Sampson.
Margolis testified that Sampson didn’t explain why he hadn’t disclosed the consultations with White House Counsel Harriet Miers and other White House aides nor did Margolis ask him, the aide said.
!El Gato Negro! @ 23
The question becomes: ?Do we try replace Keenan, or do we route around N.A.R.A.L. altogether and replace eet weeth other, stronger groups wheech weel fight the continual theft of our human rights?
?eh?
!Las dos cosas!
Elliott @ 19
That is so damn funny.
dakine01 @ 15
Why didn’t Richardson just go the safe route and say Thurgood Marshall? It’s obvious that Richardson didn’t do his homework there, neither him nor his staff.
Um, JMHO, but I pronounced Richardson’s campaign DOA in my house the first time I clapped eyes on him. First impressions and all…
sorry!
*xyz @ 23
Isn’t it great that the leaks are working for us for a change?
Re: Margolis et al
do we have enough to throw anybody in jail yet?
anyone? anyone?
When the Perino’s query the dog what it thinks of John Kerry, it fetches a flip flop.
When the dog hears the name George Bush it runs and hides under the bed.
Joe Klein’s conscience @ 27 asks:
That’s just it. Marshall would have been the obvious choice for a Dem and he was looking for something not so obvious to set himself apart yet make it look like he was a regular guy. By picking White and basing it partly on how White had played football, it gave the football imprimatur to him as a “I follow sports like most beer drinkin’ yahoos.”
Shez@21
Just remember, once Keenan is gone you may have to scour the rest of NARAL of people like her. Few things are worse than booting an incompetent leader only to replace them with more of the same.
Shouldn’t we be getting a news dump soon?
do-si-do @ 30
In the real world in an alternate universe, the whole gang would be in prison already.
A whole 1/2 hour! Very comforting.
Rice met with another regional rival of the U.S., Syria. She held a half hour of talks Thursday with its foreign minister, urging Damascus to do more to control its notoriously porous border with Iraq.
from the AP.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 36
Her new shoes were too tight.
*xyz @ 24
Oh this is good.
Did wittle Monica sell her soul to the big bad devil, and now she’s tewwibwy tewwibwy sad about it? Oh, nooo….
Heh.
Man in the Mists @ 33
same concept, different topic: is there any link anyone has to reveal campaign mgr genealogy on all the candidates? IE connections to Rove and Rovian political theory?
Oklahoma kiddo @ 36
Methinks Rice’s hands are tied pretty tightly. She cannot do or say anything of her own accord. She can shop, though.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 36
Of course, because the Commander Guy is out of luck when it comes to controlling Iraq’s notoriously porous border with Syria.
The Judiciary Committee Chairman Conyers is conducting a phone poll - the number is (202) 225-5126 . Just call in and say something to the effect of “I’d like to register my support for the impeachment of Mr. George W. Bush and Dick Cheney.”
Per commenter on ThinkProgress
hackworth @ 40
epu’d from another rice discussion:
perhaps if Pelosi sends an aide over to the Waxman hearings, Rice will too. /s
do-si-do @ 43
According to that logic, we need to get
Pelosi herself to honor a subpoena to testify at the Waxman hearings.
LS @ 42
methinks this is a wild goose chase …
Jane
Batgirl has a tangentially related message (womens rights)
EvilDrPuma @ 44
My bad. wasn’t trying to diss Pelosi but acknowledge her initiative. Like, see? this is how we talk to Syria, this is how we visit Henry, etc. But you’re right. My lame joke doesn’t hold up.
I’ve got two daughters. This is motherfucking madness. And as said before - I don’t even have the extremely limited redress of bitching to Keenan’s (invisible) board members. Christ, you could even get a list of board members after things like Minimata or the Buffalo Creek disaster.
Man in the Mists @ 12
There is no NARAL state organization in my state.
I got solicited too. I got rid of all my junk mail in their postage free envelope. So, the way I look at it, they donated $1.57 to my cause.
Waxman sent letters to WH, CIA, NSA, and RICE, and they are gagging Dodge (Niger Doc witness).
http://oversight.house.gov/story.asp?ID=1293
Monica Goodling seems to be the key figure right now. I still can’t tell if she was a dupe (albeit a willing one) or if she was a full-fledged conspirator in all of this. Her lawyer seems to be making a BIG push for immunity right now, and the DOJ seems to be trying to stop her from getting it. Trouble is, that doesn’t really help us figure out where things are at. A good lawyer is going to try to get keep a client’s immunity deal even if they think the client is totally innocent, so that doesn’t help. A good DOJ would want to investigate and prosecute Goodling’s wrongdoings, so they wouldn’t want her to have immunity, but a bad DOJ would want to cover up everything Monica did, so they wouldn’t want her to have immunity, either. I tend to be very much against the appointment of special prosecuters, but this is one of those rare cases where I think it’s necessary. The whole DOJ is suspect, including all of the US Attorneys out there, as is the entire White House. I can’t see how anyone on the inside is going to investigate this.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 36
Maybe the Damascus press is headlining the conference like this:
He held a half hour of talks Thursday with the American Secretary of State, urging Washington to do more to control its notoriously porous border with Mexico…
ABORTION…AMERICA…COURT…CRIMINAL
DECISION…DEMOCRATIC…DISSENT…
EDWARDS…FEEL…GIVEN…KEENAN…LEADING…LOST…NARAL…
PRESIDENT…PRESIDENTIAL…RICHARDSON…RIGHTS…ROE…RULING…
SUPREME…WEEK…WILLIAMS…WOMEN…WROTE
This is fun!
Ed*ard Teller @ 49
ET,
Looks like the FBI is moving in on the corruptocracy that is running your state.
Keep us posted. I ‘m looking forward to a Stevens or a young perp walk.
How’s that new Governor working out?
-GSD
I can just imagine the wailing and gnashing of teeth that must be happening at NARAL HQ as one after another Hamsher-broadside cleaves their last mast… shatters their rudder… and holes them beneath the waterline… You GO (((Jane)))!!
Frank Probst @ 52
Agreed — but the special prosecutor provision no longer exists. Congress allowed it to expire several years ago.
Thanks to a link about Simon Dodge (and his honest public service at INR) posted by cinnamonape in the last thread, I found this in TPM’s comments, FYI:
Jane,
I hope you’ve had your walk and been drinking your water. Miss you.
At this stage of the game I would support the appointment of a Special Persecutor.
-GSD
There is a very simple, correct and complete statement on this which could be given by any Democrat:
All marriage, birth control, childbearing, illness and end-of-life issues should not be the government’s business, but the private business of the family in conjunction with their health advisor. Period.
do-si-do @ 29
Well, Ed*ard Teller had this in the last thread:
Ed*ard Teller @ 44
Error alert: I thought it was Biden who said his model justice was Wizzer White.
By the way, I hope any women with the slightest notion that there is such thing as a pro-choice Republican had better check in for some intense reality therapy.
-GSD
Imagine Tom Coburn as the Surgeon General.
Frank Probst @ 52
Goodling was recently granted immunity — vide http://tinyurl.com/yqzfww — HTH
GSD @ 60
At this stage of the game, Articles of Impeachmet on Gonzo would have the same power of investigation. Then, a SP; I’d not trust the USA/DC Taylor.
S.O.S. from MA @ 64
Goodling was recently granted immunity — vide http://tinyurl.com/yqzfww — HTH
It doesn’t become effective until the subpoena is issued.
Ed*ard Teller @ 53
That would only work if Syria had invaded Mexico…
GSD @ 60
I’m puttin’ in a good word for a Special Percolator. To administer the Chinese Water Torture (H/T to Gonzo) with nice, scalding hot water. Metaphorically speaking, of course. :)
I would like to see the Pro-choice debate move into a more generalized area of the rules made by men violating the rights of women, i.e., the women are not equal under the law on a whole bunch of issues. The focus on abortion creates a constant revolving door where the focus ends up in an unwinnable and impossible argument about what is torture of an embryo or fetus; when it should be based on what is torture for any human who is ruled by other peoples’ criminalization of fellow citizens’ personal choices, due to contrived laws made by people who don’t believe in equality of human beings regarding ownership of their own bodies. Does this make sense?
Listen, first Mrs. Alito, now Monica Goodling. Why do you hateful liberals want to make good Christian conservative women cry?
-Dave Broder’s Pud
GSD @ 60
Heh — I’d rather grace the Bushco Mal-Administation with my favorite blessing:
“May you get exactly what you deserve.”
(It’s a cousin to “May you live in interesting times.”)
MayDaze @ 62
thank you
GSD @ 70
It’s not our fault that good Christian conservative women are whiny-ass titty babies just like their menfolk.
Brisingamen @ 72
Edited for spelling
OT:
2008 CAMPAIGN
Thompson Campaign Speech
Fmr. Sen. Fred Thompson (R-TN) makes his national political dbut in a speech at the Lincoln Club Dinner. This is his first major address since announcing his presidential exploratory cmte. The Lincoln Club of Orange County’s 45th Annual Dinner is held in in Orange County, CA.
TONIGHT, C-SPAN, 11:30PM ET
also earlier this evening:
C-SPAN 2 Highlights
Friday:
* French Presidential Election Debate (8pm)
* French Presidential Election Preview (9:30pm)
Times gives are ET
EvilDrPuma @ 68
what if Syria feels threatened by terrorists they perceive are hiding in Mexico? What if they are concerned with preserving and promoting democracy in Mexico?…
In the event you are not sufficiently outraged at the current state of affairs in America.
Looks like the Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld doctrine of impudence, abuse and moral rot has filtered into the ranks of America’s soldiers.
(Snip)
In the first internal military study of battlefield ethics in Iraq, officials said Friday they also found that only a third of Marines and roughly half of soldiers said they believed that noncombatants should be treated with dignity
Submission accomplished.
The war criminalizing of the US military continues unabated.
-GSD
When HRC was at the Lake, I had a question which I either asked after she left or dropped, but essentially, it’s this: Given that women 18-35 are the least likely to vote, and the ones most directly affected by this clusterf*#k of a Supreme Court, how do you mobilize this group? Most women I know who are in or close to this demographic are politically aware and vote - how do we get the rest pissed off, engaged, registered, and voting for their rights?
Mind you, we’d want to skip the Regent University precision female subordination squad in this outreach…
S.O.S. from MA @ 63
Goodling was recently granted immunity — vide http://tinyurl.com/yqzfww — HTH
Not quite. Congress voted to give her immunity at the time they subpoena her, but the DOJ (who she would presumably be testifying against) has to sign off on it.
Prediction: Rove skates again. He’s going to claim that he had no idea that Sampson and Goodling weren’t telling everyone else at Justice what they were doing. Bush told Rove to fire certain USAs for “pleasure of the President” reasons (e.g. Carol Lam–bad hair), Rove passed on the list to Sampson and Goodling, and they did the dirty work. Rove then “preps” the other DOJ employees, telling them they need to tell Congress exactly why the USAs were fired. If he’s ever placed under oath, Rove will say he thought everyone was going to say that Carol Lam had bad hair. He had NO IDEA they were going to try to trot out some horseshit about guns and immigration. Rove walks, and Kyle and Monica (and maybe Gonzo) are left holding the bag. Monica looks like she’s trying to flip, which is why she’s being “investigated” right now. By next week, there will be some sort of story about how she’s out to get poor Karl, because he spurned her romantic advances. They’ll be portraying her as a raving psychotic by the time she takes the stand.
do-si-do @ 77
I must admit, I think they have a case with the preserving and promoting democracy.
LS @ 70
focus…human…torture…women
Why would both Elston and Comey use the exact same terminology and phrasing to described firings of USA’s?
dakine01 @ 32
That’s just it. Marshall would have been the obvious choice for a Dem and he was looking for something not so obvious to set himself apart yet make it look like he was a regular guy. By picking White and basing it partly on how White had played football, it gave the football imprimatur to him as a “I follow sports like most beer drinkin’ yahoos.”
Don’t you go the safe route when you are given a question you are unprepared for? Richardson just makes himself look like an ass saying White is a hero, when he obviously didn’t do enough homework on the guy. Trying to be a jock is gonna get his ass blasted out of the pool, something he can’t afford at this point.
Frank’s proposed Constitutional Amendment on abortion rights:
1. No restrictions on abortion in the first trimester (first 13 weeks) of pregnancy. No parental or spousal notification. No waiting periods.
2. No restrictions on any proecedure necessary to save the life of the mother. Otherwise, the states can place any restrictions on 2nd trimester (14-26 weeks) abortions that they want, with the following caveats:
a. There can be no restrictions on interstate travel for reasons that relate to abortion laws, including no restrictions on the travel of minors.
b. If any state refuses to allow an abortion for rape or incest, or for a medical condition that is found in the fetus, and the pregnancy leads to a live birth, then the state is responsible for the lifetime medical costs of the child.
c. Clause (a) supercedes clause (b). Therefore, if California will allow a woman to have a 2nd trimester abortion because the fetus has Down syndrome, but the state of Mississippi will not, a pregnant woman may travel from California to Mississippi, and the state of Mississippi will be required to assume lifetime medical costs of the child.
3. Third trimester abortions (26 weeks on) are allowed if necessary to save the life of the mother. Out of respect for a woman’s autonomy, she may decide that she does not want to be pregnant at any time during the third trimester, but the treatment will be either a C-section or an induced vaginal delivery, and the baby will be considered a “person” with all of the usual legal rights.
Thoughts?
neokneme @ 82
It would be cool to do that with some of the testimony we’ve been reading!
Frank Probst @ 80
Not quite. Congress voted to give her immunity at the time they subpoena her, but the DOJ (who she would presumably be testifying against) has to sign off on it.
Prediction: Rove skates again. He’s going to claim that he had no idea that Sampson and Goodling weren’t telling everyone else at Justice what they were doing. Bush told Rove to fire certain USAs for “pleasure of the President” reasons (e.g. Carol Lam–bad hair), Rove passed on the list to Sampson and Goodling, and they did the dirty work. Rove then “preps” the other DOJ employees, telling them they need to tell Congress exactly why the USAs were fired. If he’s ever placed under oath, Rove will say he thought everyone was going to say that Carol Lam had bad hair. He had NO IDEA they were going to try to trot out some horseshit about guns and immigration. Rove walks, and Kyle and Monica (and maybe Gonzo) are left holding the bag. Monica looks like she’s trying to flip, which is why she’s being “investigated” right now. By next week, there will be some sort of story about how she’s out to get poor Karl, because he spurned her romantic advances. They’ll be portraying her as a raving psychotic by the time she takes the stand.
But Justice apparently have some of Rove’s emails. His computer was examined by the FBI via Fitz.
OT, but, thought some of you might enjoy a little lightness in this otherwise heavy pile of stuff to worry about…Matt Davies Animation
Hope you all enjoy, and then get back to the worrisome stuff. :(
Frank Probst @ 84
Truth in advertising ‘clinics’ who seem like providers but use stonewalling, etc to get to at least adoption, or some other result. Often by delaying ‘test results’ or insurance technicalties to be resolved until the third trimester.
Evil.
Yes…