
(2005 photo of a billboard on the Iran-Iraq border, via The Arabist. The face
and quote belong to the late Ayatollah Khomeini.)
Oh, heavens, here we go again. The U.S. military in Iraq decided it was time for another finger-pointing distraction exercise yesterday, and the New York Times was there:
Arms that American military officials say appear to have been manufactured in Iran as recently as last year have turned up in the past week in a Sunni-majority area, the chief spokesman for the American military command in Iraq said Wednesday in a news conference.
The spokesman, Maj. Gen. William B. Caldwell IV, said that detainees in American custody had indicated that Iranian intelligence operatives had given support to Sunni insurgents and that surrogates for the Iranian intelligence service were training Shiite extremists in Iran. He gave no further description of the detainees and did not say why they would have that information.
. . . The accusation of a link between the Iranian intelligence service and Sunni Arab insurgents is new. The American military has contended in the past that elements in Iran have given Shiite militants powerful Iranian-made roadside bombs known as explosively formed penetrators, and training in their use.
Critics have cast doubt on the American military statements about those bombs, saying the evidence linking them to Iran was circumstantial and inferential.
Yeah, you could say that. And that's the case again here:
It is unclear from the military’s comments on Wednesday whether it is possible to draw conclusions about how the weapons that the military contends are of Iranian origin might have made their way into a predominantly Sunni area or why Shiite Iran would arm Sunni militants.
There are several possibilities, military officials who were not authorized to speak publicly for attribution said privately. One is that they came through Syria, along a transit route for Iranian-made weapons being funneled to the Lebanese Shiite militia Hezbollah. Another possibility is that arms dealers are selling to every side in the conflict.
The Washington Post helps amplify both the doubts and the likely explanation:
It was unclear what motivation Iran, a Shiite theocracy, would have for backing Sunni insurgents, many of whom are staunchly anti-Iranian and fear the rise of Shiite power in the region.
. . . The markings on all the munitions were in English. Maj. Marty Weber, an explosives expert, said countries selling arms on the global market tend to use English lettering.
In other words, even if the weapons in question really did come from Iran, it's far more plausible that the Sunni insurgents obtained them through a third party than it is that Tehran is intentionally arming guerrillas for whom the best Iranian is a dead one.
But then, you probably know all that already. The reason I bring up these articles is to address the more complex truth behind the other part of Gen. Caldwell's accusations — that Iran is helping to train Iraqi Shiite militias.
Since Caldwell's credibility is somewhere near Anna Nicole Smith's pulse rate, it helps that the Associated Press yesterday provided some corroborating testimony:
Commanders of a splinter group inside the Shiite Mahdi Army militia have told The Associated Press there are as many as 4,000 members of their organization that were trained in Iran and that they have stockpiles of deadly roadside bombs known as EFPs.
The Mahdi Army commanders who spoke to the AP did so on condition of anonymity because their organization is viewed as illegal by the American military and giving their names would likely lead to their arrest and imprisonment. They said Iran's elite Revolutionary Guards was running the training operation in Iran.
We can't know these anonymous sources' credibility or motivations, so it's not definitive proof — but if you leave aside the Bushite propaganda and look at the logic of it, a below-the-radar Iranian training program for the Shiite factions in Iraq's government is not only imaginable, it's entirely unsurprising.
Back when FDL was just a gleam in Jane Hamsher's eye, you see, I was making my mostly imaginary reputation as a blogger for ahead-of-the-curve analysis of political developments in post-invasion Iraq. Specifically, I was perhaps the first online observer to recognize many of the steps by which top Shiite cleric Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani seized control of the political process, first by refusing to accept the U.S. transition scheme in late 2003 and then forming an all-Shiite slate in 2004 to sweep the elections he had forced.
Shortly after pointing out, three months before the January 2005 elections, that they would result in exactly the kind of sectarian government that is now pretending to be running Iraq, I realized that Sistani had another, perhaps more difficult challenge ahead: Once he had installed his preferred pro-Shiite government over the wishes of the United States, how did he plan to protect it from the Sunni insurgency without becoming eternally reliant on the American military:
… on the one hand, Sistani is selling elections to his Shiite followers as the way to end the U.S. presence in Iraq, but on the other, the Americans are seemingly the only counterweight in place to stave off the Sunni-led resistance (and even they are just barely keeping their body-armored heads above water).
What will Sistani do to prevent the Shiite government he's shepherded into existence from being overrun almost immediately by its enemies? I wrote a couple of weeks ago that how the U.S reacts to the prospect of defeat in Iraq's scheduled January elections is the key question regarding what happens there over the next several months, but how Sistani responds to the prospect of victory won't be far behind.
Given the presence of a large, Shiite-dominated neighbor with an extensive military on Iraq's border — one being threatened by a stream of bellicose U.S. rhetoric itself — should we really be shocked that a year or two after the elections, lethal and tactically skilled Shiite militias have somehow sprung up independent of the supposedly American-trained Iraqi army?
So, to me, what Bushite functionaries allege is irrelevant. Tell me Iran is arming Shiite-hating Sunni guerrillas, and I'll roll my eyes and say it's meaningless propaganda. But tell me they're helping create a shadow Shiite military that may eventually turn against the U.S., and I'll say, "Well, duh. What did you expect?!?"
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ROOTZ!
Swopa!!
SWOPA!
If first you don’t succeed, try try again! The Bush/Cheney motto!
Sorry AZ Matt, didn’t mean to yell. *g*
CNN – CBS radio dumped IMUS show
Swopa — welcome.
OT Just in, CNN says CBS just announced Imus is gone from CBS radio. And there was a report that some radio yahoo in PA who encouraged listeners to mimic Imus was canned on the spot. Shoes are falling all over.
Back to read the post.
MSNBC CBS fires Imus
mc @ 5
Wha’cha say? Can’t hear yoz!
Catapulting the propaganda: BushCo’s sole expertise.
To assume we are dealing with rational and reasonable human beings in the Bush administration regarding Iran, Iraq, the Palestinian issue, or for that matter, most anything else, is to be irrational, etc., too. These guys are going to do what they want to, and damn humanity in the process. We’re talking big money and power here (oil).
Where you been? I’ve missed you.
OT, (sorry), but EPU’d:
—————
Emergency! Trex must see this ASAP!
http://www.cnn.com/2007/TECH/s…..index.html
I anxiously await any response…
Surely there aren’t any chicken-hawks in the family?! :)
Alan Johnstons dad just read a piece on BBC. Rip your heart out. There is a petition at the BBC website for Alans release. Sign this one.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6518185.stm
At the least, these Bush guys are boring. Same playbook for Iran as was used for Iraq.
deja vu all over again!
It was unclear what motivation Iran, a Shiite theocracy, would have for backing Sunni insurgents, many of whom are staunchly anti-Iranian and fear the rise of Shiite power in the region.
Oh that’s easy, the exercise was expressly for the mouth breathers. They don’t know the difference, Sunnie Shia? They’re all towelheads to the base.
SWOPA!
gee Swopa, whomever do you mean :) ?
Ya reap what ya sow.
It may surprise you guys to learn I sent emails to the Imus show from time to time. Praising his good stuff. And castigating the crap. I hope everybody who participated in the discussion here, on either side, will do more than just talk amongst ourselves about an issue we obviously all feel strongly about.
I’m not advocating blanket firings, but I do believe strongly that we must do more than complain after the fact, and more power to those who did protest when it was due all along.
Jane and Christy and Co show us the way…zero tolerance for media stenography instead of reporting on everything from WMDs to missing emails. The same zero tolerance for slurs and hate on the air whether it’s racial, gender, or sexual orientation.
Make your voice heard and hold all the media voices to a higher standard.
The results of an attack on Iran could be horrendous. After all, according to a recent study of “the Iraq effect” by terrorism specialists Peter Bergen and Paul Cruickshank, using government and Rand Corporation data, the Iraq invasion has already led to a seven-fold increase in terror. The “Iran effect” would probably be far more severe and long-lasting. British military historian Corelli Barnett speaks for many when he warns that “an attack on Iran would effectively launch World War III.”
“Since Caldwell’s credibility is somewhere near Anna Nicole Smith’s pulse rate…”
Good one Swopa!
TRexS.O.S. from MA @
13
TRex,
I will never eat another chiken thigh lest I think of you!
EPU’d: twolf1 @ 265
I just tuned in, he sure sounds tired. Hope he gets to drawing & quartering the Bushies. Thus far he’s just praising the US Congress…
Cue the music and sing with me:
Swopa!
Keep needling, I’ve already decided.
LIARS!
cbl @ 18
Hakim’s smiling in the picture like he just managed to sell Dubya some beachfront property in Anbar province.
Which, come to think of it, he probably did.
noen @ 17
Did you notice sometime last week Rudy managed to blame Iraq & Iraq for 9/11 and was seemingly unaware of any differences between Sunnis & Shias. But then he didn’t know the price of a loaf of bread or a gallon of milk either. Perhaps they should have asked him what he does know. Answer would have been shorter.
“Freedom of speech isn’t something somebody else gives you. That’s something you give to yourself.” – Kurt Vonnegut Jr.
http://freewayblogger.blogspot…..ntest.html
Cardboard, paint and something to say. That’s all it takes.
Byrd maunders on about how much he loves Sen. Stevens of Alaska.
scarlet p. @ 27
For the record, the Freeway Blogger rocks. That is all.
On BBC tonight…El Baradei (he keeps saying this but it barely makes the MSM) reports Iran a long way away from potential nuclear weapons.
We know the Bush administration did not listen to El Baradei last time.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/ca550f…..e2340.html
http://www.iaea.org/NewsCenter…..12006.html
S.O.S. from MA @
29
Tomorrow, Ted Stevens and his Toobz become the longest serving gooper Senator.
cbl – your pic makes a very important point- the Bush love for SCIRI and Hakim who are behind the deathsquads is the great unnoticed issue in all of this.
eCAHNomics @ 26
Here’s a question…what the f**k did CheneyCo think was gonna happen after Saddam was gone, the puppet gov’t was installed and we didn’t leave? Sh**! That the Sunni (probably Baathists) were gonna just lay down? Did CheneyCo really think that it was that intimidating to the locals? Obviously, they were not as astute as you Swopa!
eCAHNomics @ 26
I never know if people like Rudy are just pretending or are actually that stupid. I can’t decide.
kdh22 @ 33
How quickly you forget. The plan was to turn Iraq over to Chalabi & draw the troops down to 30,000 with 3 months.
Given the criminal negligence that had the army failing to secure known locations/armories of conventional weapons during the invasion, it’s a bit on the late side for anyone in power in Iraq to be whining about where the weapons are coming from.
True but why the hell would they talk to the AP? Did their arm patch say BlackWater?
5,000,000 lies
Perhaps I should turn to our Democratic front running money maker, Hillary, for advice on the Bush Iran plans. The Senator is such a heavy hitter on the big issues.
noen @ 34
From allI’ve seen, Rudy’s sharp as a tack about the things he knows. There’ve been some fine kudos for him on this site about when he was a USA.
But he doesn’t know a thing about foreign policy (I don’t know what milk & bread cost & I just got back from the supermarket, so that was a gratuitous snark), but has an ego so big that he is unaware of what he is unaware, she said, mimicing Rumsfeld.
SOS from MA @ 13
Giving new meaning to the phrase ’scarce as hen’s teeth’ – but will our TRex want to eat his descendants?
Siun,
I went a little bonkers over that visit – not a word, not a peep from the vaunted MSM about this guy or his well documented connections to Iran – all of course, just as Cheney was ramping up Iranapalooza – oy
AZ Matt @ 4
Fixed.
eCAHNomics @ 40
So foreign policy is Rudy’s “known unknown” and milk and bread his “unknown known”.
Hey, I ain’t as think as you drunk I am.
Phule @ 44
I think that goes for most of the repub party.
S.O.S. from MA @ 29
Give Stevens the Byrd for me.
Swopa
I’d be more surprised if this hadn’t happened, given our past history in the region.
CBL – his family is also known as major oil smugglers …seems like a fitting guest for W.
Darth Cheney and his boy, Our Benighted Emperor, have one agenda – perpetual war in the Middle East while they and the Saudi’s control all the oil, which means keep it away from the uncontrollable theocracy.
Step two is to “let the genie out of the bottle” so no successor can stuff it back in.
However, there is a hurdle here they have not quite figured out how to get around – Having cried wolf in 2002 and 2003, the “free speech” mongers are ahead of them watching and chatting about “starting a war with Iran.”
Darth and his Boy are amazed at their snake oil salesman techniques seem to be stymied this time around.
The American people will focus more on deleting government e-mails to hide something, than they will a bunch of crazy theocrats killing each other, ad infinitum.
The people have lost interest in the monotheist nuts in the Middle East when they are starting to see a few in the White House.
The tipping point has started, and this guy will be in the History books 20 years from now under the definition of “credibility zero” – FINALLY!
I hope The Idiot in Chief lives in enough reality to know that our armed forces aren’t up to invading Iran, and that going in without troops, only a few bunker-busting bombs, would turn every country in the ME against us.
We’ve just got to shout this loud enough for the WH to hear. I’m hoping for some real old fashioned Republicans to go in there and calm the boy down.
OldCoastie @ 16
Same shit, different day.
eCAHNomics @ 35
Yeah well that plan went down the toilet really fast didn’t it? Why? Because “they” refuse to acknowledge the intensity of the religious loyalty of the factions and their subsequent resistence to being raped and pillaged by CheneyCo for its bottomline?
YEP!
Sorry about the yelling. I’m pissed because “they” just won’t accept that their plan has been foiled as it should be. It was an evil enterprise from the start. They underestimated the loyalty of the Iraqis, of Middle Easterners as a whole. They saw Iraq as ripe for the pickin’ and knew they could bring down Saddam.
I gotta stop. Too emotional.
OT but according to TPM, RNC’s legal counsel says that even though the emails were put on hold, Karl Rove may have deleted his emails from the server himself. And Patrick Fitzgerald may have known about those RNC email accounts.,
Phule @ 46
Buh bye Byrdie.
You know, he was old as the hills even back then. humf… Kids!
noen @ 44
I was thinking foreign policy was his unkonwn unknown. Won’t touch the unquoted part of your comment, as I don’t know you well enough.
OT. Cafferty is taking comments on the “thousands” of missing e-mails.
Puesto – seems to me the “crazy theocrats” are sitting in the White House.
Bye Bye you racist phony cowboy piece of shit:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/SHOWBI…..index.html
Howard Stern predicted this on his show this morning.
eCAHNomics @ 36
Ah, yes, the great Iraqi leader, Ahmad Chalabi, so beloved of the Iraqi people. (/snark)
One of the few things on which everyone in Iraq agrees — Sunni, Shia, Kurd, you name it — is that Ahmad Chalabi is a scumbag.
IMUS FIRED FROM CBS RADIO:
http://youtube.com/tullysvision
Those of us in the uncivil reality based community normally call this “you’re lying to us”.
Twisted Martini @ 59
Didn’t Robin Quivers used to work for Imus?
Since Chalabi is currently in the government and in charge of administering major development contracts, I’d say he still has some friends – and a great source of revenue.
puesta @ 49
Whatever it takes. Remember the Watergate–took the breakin to make Nixon breakdown. The thing about tipping points is that there usually isn’t one. It’s more often like now that the crimes get revealed little by little or alot by alot, and the crook goes down.
BREAKING: Dogs teach cats to chase cars, pee on trees.
About as credible as Shiites training Sunnnis.
eCAHNomics @ 55
heh… Coffee is my drug of choice. Sometimes I hit the hard stuff – 70% cacao Lindt chocolate… hmmmmmm… I’m having flashbacks even now…
Phoenix Woman @ 62
Phoenix Woman @ 59
He was only loved by Bush and Cheney because he was gonna hand over the natural gas and oil without a fight, with a huge kickback. But, alas, divine intervention?
Phule @ 62
Yeah. The media never has problems accusing Democrats of lying, but they get all tongue-tied when faced with Bush Junta and GOP lies.
Phoenix, Robin never worked for Imus. She worked with him at WNBC and said he was a racist asshole back then-82-87 I believe. She said she witnessed him call a black secretary the N word, and he had called her one as well. So one less bigoted hater polluting our airwaves. Glenn Beck, you’re on notice!
dakine01 @ 36
If ya ever hear a Gooper saying that, fix them with a steely glare and say “Al-QaQa.” If they say “Whazzat?” tell them to go Google themselves, and to STFU.
[ http://tinyurl.com/ys7wqm ] :)
Phoenix Woman @ 68
Nice to see you again.
I think the reason the media is afraid of them is because they bite. Dems don’t seem to, they just gum you to death.
Phoenix Woman @ 63
No, but Howard and Imus were both at wNbc -NY in the 80’s.
I can’t believe they canned him. Glad they did, although I will miss getting “candid” comments from some of the hacks that go on there.
Now, what’s CNN/ABC’s excuse for keeping Glen Beck?
Juan Cole is, as usual, very good on this subject:
http://www.juancole.com/2007/0…..-bomb.html
eCAHNomics @
36
Far more Orwellian. This is the long war to keep everyone patriotic, and all eyes off the corruption.
The Iraqi resistance only exists to end the occupation
The escalating attacks are not usually aimed at civilians, but are a direct response to the brutal actions of US-led troops
Haifa Zangana
Thursday April 12, 2007
http://www.guardian.co.uk/comm…..81,00.html
HERE IS THE IMUS FIRING VIDEO FROM CNN
Donna Brazille, Terry Jeffrey clueless on Wolf Blitzer:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=2EjJqM2c1hE
Phule @
52
S2D2 – (the incompetent’s ‘droid nomenclature)
So does that mean that Holy Joe will have to discuss the Yankees starting rotation on Mike and the Mad Dog now that Imus is gone?
Loo Hoo @ 75
Yep, while simultaneously burning the whole place down, and forcing increased escalation. I wouldnt be surprised to find out we’re arming all sides. A modern Prescott Bush operation. ( I realize that’s hyperbole, but nothing would surprise me from this bunch now.)
If I were an Iraqi, I would fight the American occupiers and killers with everything I had.
Siun @ 58
That was my point… Exactly!
The US may have some difficulty releasing the Iranian diplomats kidnapped in Irbil since the Iranian diplomat released a day before the UK sailors showed the world some pretty horrific signs of torture yesterday – he claims, and the video sure looks convincing, that his feet were drilled amongst other things.
I wouldn’t want to guess what condition the Iranians we took in the 3AM raid in the north are in.
You must distinguish between those who thought Plan A was to leave Iraq to Chalabi, with the U.S. departing quickly. Rumsfeld was definitely one of those. Remember, he doesn’t do nation building.
There was a separate group that wanted to destabilize the whole area in order to remake it.
Think Cheney & W were part of the the first group & thought they were using the second. Guess who got last laughs.
If I were a Palestinian, I would be fighting the Israeli and U.S. governments every which way I could.
fyi, new thread
From one of the quotes in the post’
“Another possibility is that arms dealers are selling to every side in the conflict.”
Since when have the US government and our arms dealers not been doing this in regard to Iran and Iraq as well as other recalcitrants?
has Imus been fired completely?
OKKiddo, I understand the feeling. It is interesting to imagine yourself sitting in your own home and have another country invade. A really big country with lots of money and bombs, more than you have. Let’s say China invaded us, and they only spoke Mandarin. What would your first actions be? How would you secure your family? Would you move away to a relatives home for safety? What about getting food. Would schooling continue? Would your job be gone? It’s a very interesting (and scary)game to play with yourself, I think.
Urban Pirate @ 73
How can we get rid of Limbaugh?
che @
54
TES!!! FITZ ALERT!!!
Specifically, see TPM article by Paul Kiel – April 12, 2007, 3:38 PM, CREW: Millions More Missing White House Emails
–scroll down to the last two paragraphs. Kiel closes with these words: “I’m sure we’ll hear more about this.”
Do you suppose that Conyers, Waxman & Leahy will be providing grist for Fitz’s mill??
FITZMAS!!!
Bob in HI
kathleen @ 89
Urban Pirate @ 73
Phoenix Woman @ 63
Twisted Martini @ 59
Bye Bye you racist phony cowboy piece of shit:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/SHOWBI…..index.html
Howard Stern predicted this on his show this morning.
Didn’t Robin Quivers used to work for Imus?
No, but Howard and Imus were both at wNbc -NY in the 80’s.
I can’t believe they canned him. Glad they did, although I will miss getting “candid” comments from some of the hacks that go on there.
Now, what’s CNN/ABC’s excuse for keeping Glen Beck?
How can we get rid of Limbaugh?
Spike his oxycotin supply?
(Mod Note: edited to prevent the margins from being busted )
all this talk about war on iran leads me to 1 question : George Bush and what army ? sure, he can bomb the price for crude oil to 100 bucks a barrel, and then what ? those iranian (non-nuclear) rockets cannot reach the U.S., but they CAN reach Baghdad airport and cut 80% of the U.S. forces in Iraq off their cheeseburgers.
i doubt if they can fight off the revolutionary guards afterwards, as these guys are able to, for example, read the road signs. or understand the civilians. they indeed *might* be greeted with flowers… talk about the irony.
start another illegal war, but this time not botch it, but lose it … on the other hand, this may be the quickest way to get the troops back home.
Cspan has joe lieberman sounding like a Democrat? ……blech.
off topic
there are over 5 million emails missing
isn’t that 5 million counts against the act and 5 million crimes?
quite a bargaining chip no?
Bob Schacht @ 90
Funny, I remember someone blogging about that a month ago…
noen @ 92
Didn’t Robin Quivers used to work for Imus?
No, but Howard and Imus were both at wNbc -NY in the 80’s.
I can’t believe they canned him. Glad they did, although I will miss getting “candid” comments from some of the hacks that go on there.
Now, what’s CNN/ABC’s excuse for keeping Glen Beck?
How can we get rid of Limbaugh?
Spike his oxycotin supply?
(Mod Note: edited to prevent the margins from being busted )
many would if they could?
Swopa @ 96
I read Swopa wrt this. I just mentioned this morning that I had an eerie feeling that Fitz was going to enter stage left on this. I just didn’t think it would be so soon. SWOPA!
Swopa @ 96
fitz words…
” If information comes to light or if new information comes forward that warrants further investigation, we will do that. The case is now inactive. We are going back to our day jobs.”
You guys ought to EPU this Fitz stuff to the thread upstairs!
“How can we get rid of Limbaugh?”
IMHO, CBS incremantally addressed their problem of being too “FOX-like” by ditching Imus.
However, FOX ditching Limbaugh wouldn’t make them appreciably less FOX-like, as Rush is “not a bug, but a feature!”
Seriously, though, I think the Spocko-inspired action on Disney’s Bay Area hate radio is the way to go — send FOX’s sponsors CD’s loaded w/ abundant “cream o’ the crap” highlights along w/ suggestions that no Reputable Company would want to be associated with such irresponsible froth, etc.
John Murtha, speaking to a bushCo warpimp, a while back, as he was telling all and sundry how well things were going in Iraq:
“Why should we listen to you?”
I have seen no reason to withdraw, or rephrase that question.
And we sell weapons to who???