Sen. Russ Feingold will be chairing a Judiciary subcommittee hearing later today — beginning at 3:00 pm ET, due to to slight schedule change — on the overuse and misuse of national security letters by the FBI, and the decided lack of supervision thereof provided within the agency and within the DoJ on that issue. Witnesses will include: former Rep. Bob Barr (R-GA); George Christian, of a library association in Connecticut; Suzanne Spaulding and Peter Swire, and it will at least be webcast on the Committee website (because I haven't been able to confirm if C-Span will be doing coverage as yet).
I wanted to put this hearing into context for everyone, and the best way to do that is through Sen. Feingold's own words on this issue.
…I want to make one additional point about national security letters.
There is a crucial difference between obtaining records in national security investigations and in standard criminal investigations. As the General Counsel of the FBI testified before the House Judiciary Committee last week, actions in national security investigations "are typically taken in secret and they don't have the transparency of the criminal justice system." She explained that in the criminal system, agents know that "if they mess up during the course of an investigation, they're going to be cross-examined, they're going to have a federal district judge yelling at them." That means that more vigorous controls and compliance mechanisms are needed with respect to sensitive authorities like national security letters than their analogues in the criminal justice system–something I think the inspector general report demonstrates.
With that background, what did the inspector general find as a result of his audit of the use of NSLs from 2003 to 2005? He found that even the very limited protections in the existing statute were not being followed.
The inspector general found, based on FBI records, that the FBI's use of NSLs expanded exponentially after the PATRIOT Act, moving from approximately 8,500 requests in 2000, to 39,000 requests in 2003, 56,000 requests in 2004, and 47,000 requests in 2005. The total number of requests was 143,074 over the 3-year period.
But the inspector general also found that even those numbers are inaccurate because the FBI had no policies in place with respect to the retention or tracking of NSLs. In many cases, agents did not even keep copies of signed NSLs. As a result, the FBI significantly undercounted its NSL requests. In a sample of 77 case files that the IG looked at, the NSL requests were undercounted by roughly 22 percent.
Although it is hard to know how much can be extrapolated from that figure, if that figure holds throughout the Bureau, that could mean that there were roughly 30,000 more NSL requests issued that the FBI didn't keep track of. That is appalling — that the privacy rights of Americans would be treated so cavalierly that there are potentially tens of thousands of NSL requests out there that the FBI itself doesn't even have a record of. And it resulted in inaccurate information being reported to Congress about the use of NSLs, raising another grave concern.
What else did the inspector general find? He found that the use of NSL requests regarding U.S. persons–that is, citizens and legal permanent residents — shifted from 39 percent of all NSL requests in 2003 to 53 percent of all NSL requests in 2005, at least with respect to the NSL requests for which the FBI kept track of the U.S person status of the target. And, until 2006, the FBI did not keep track of how many NSL requests pertain to individuals who are not the subjects of authorized national security investigations. Obviously, if the FBI is using NSLs frequently to obtain information about people who are not the subjects of open investigations, that would present serious concerns about their use.
The inspector general also found that the FBI significantly underreported violations of the NSL statutes and internal guidelines from 2003 to 2005, with respect to notifying both the FBI's Office of General Counsel, or OGC, and the President's Intelligence Oversight Board, or IOB, as required by Executive order. FBI employees did report 26 violations to OGC, but the IG found examples of 22 more unreported violations in 17 investigative case files out of a sample of 77 investigative files in 4 field offices.
Some of these were significant violations, others less so. But that means that 22 percent of investigative files surveyed by the IG contained one or more violations not identified by the FBI or reported to the Intelligence Oversight Board, as required. According to the IG, "we have no reason to believe that the number of NSL-related possible IOB violations we identified in the four field offices was skewed or disproportionate to the number of possible IOB violations that exist in other offices." Thus, the IG's findings "suggest that a significant number of NSL-related possible IOB violations through the FBI have not been identified or reported by FBI personnel."
What else did the inspector general find? Perhaps the most disturbing revelation in his report, among many disturbing revelations, is that on more than 700 occasions, the FBI obtained telephone toll billing records or subscriber information from 3 telephone companies without first issuing NSLs or grand jury subpoenas. Instead, it relied on what it called "exigent letters" signed by personnel not authorized by statute to sign NSLs. Although the Electronic Communications Privacy Act does contain an emergency provision permitting the FBI to obtain certain communications records in emergencies where there is an immediate threat to a person's physical safety, many of these exigent letters were issued, admittedly, in nonemergency circumstances. Indeed, they were used as a matter of course by one headquarters unit. This violated both the statute and internal FBI policy.
The inspector general also found that FBI headquarters issued more than 300 NSLs without determining whether there was an authorized investigation in progress. Issuing an NSL without tying it an authorized investigation is a violation of the statute.
The inspector general also found that internal FBI guidance on how to properly use NSLs was woefully lacking, and that even to the degree there were FBI policies in place to govern the use of NSLs, those policies were not being followed. In 60 percent of the 77 case files that the IG examined in detail, there was some infraction of FBI guidance. Sixty percent. That is absolutely astounding.
But that is not all. Once information is obtained through an NSL, the Inspector general reported that the FBI retains it indefinitely and uploads it into databases like the "Investigative Data Warehouse," where it is retrievable by the thousands of authorized personnel, both inside and outside the FBI, who have access to these types of FBI databases. The FBI has no process for removing that information from its databases depending on the results of the investigation. So if a person's full credit report is obtained with an NSL as part of a preliminary investigation and that preliminary investigation is closed because the FBI determines that the person has done nothing wrong, it doesn't matter–the FBI can keep it anyway….
There is a very good reason that we set up investigative statutes with all sorts of safeguards, checks and balances for civil liberties: the people who work for us as investigators and police agents and supervisors are human beings. And human beings are flawed, subject to occasional lapses in judgment resulting from panic or anger or revenge or any of the other very human emotions that can carry us away down a path that we ought not go.
Having a disinterested third party review the evidence, to be certain that what is being done in the name of the public is appropriate, is not only a sound policy, but an essential safeguard for liberty.
That the Patriot Act has end-run this long-held check on the vast power of the state to surveil its population is appalling enough. But that the Bush DoJ and FBI management took that vastly increased power handed to them on a platter by Congress…and did not have even the slightest foresight to establish clear guidelines for its use and internal checks and safeguards to prevent abuse? That screams incompetence at the highest level. And a thorough disrespect for the rule of law and the Bill of Rights and Constitution. For shame.
Any person who has ever worked with law enforcement knows that all it takes is one rotten apple in an investigative unit to stink up the entire place. The rules and regs are there for a very, very good reason — because you cannot tinker with essential notions of liberty and the rule of law without seeing some very grave consequences on the back end of that. Good cops and prosecutors take that very seriously, because with substantial power also comes a substantial responsibility to use it with great care.
There are always safeguards built into surveillance oversight requirements for exigent circumstances. The FISA statute, for example, has a window which allows for an emergency wiretap or other surveillance method to be established on the fly and for agents to then be able to present their affadavit and warrant well after the fact (72 hours actually, which is quite a chunk of time after the fact) to justify the surveillance to the FISA Court. This is true for state and federal statutes in pretty much every circumstance that I can recall from my prosecuting days — because sometimes, things come up on the fly and you need to be able to immediately go into action. But you also need to be able to fully justify why that is the case.
The Patriot Act provisions for the National Security Letters end-run this process entirely and, because it is human nature to do so, ease of getting around the paperwork by using these has become far too commonplace. And, as there are no safeguards provided — either internally or externally to ascertain whether they are being properly used — we get what Sen. Feingold has detailed above.
I have a feeling that today's testimony is going to be quite interesting. Here's to much more sunshine to come on this very important issue.
Related posts:
- House Judiciary Committee to Propose PATRIOT and FISA Reforms
- Silvestre Reyes Announces Investigation into Violations of National Security Act
- PATRIOT Renewal Hearing, Day One Wrap Up: Who Protects Us from the Protectors?
- Bush’s Illegal Domestic Surveillance Program Also Expanded “Legal” Spying
- Does Obama Plan to Give Up a Little Liberty to Get a Little Safety?





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Best Freewayblog Ever:
http://freewayblogger.blogspot…..go-il.html
Laughed out loud.
Christy!
I wonder how many people here are mentioned in NSL letters….
Over at TPM, there’s
this interesting item:
[snipped: the original story is in the WaPo.]
Looking for a lot out of Russ, since he opted out of the race. Have no doubt he will deliver. But who will get behind him on the Hill?
Tnx for the hearing linky, FDL — Gonna love me some more Honorable Senator Russ Feingold this PM!! :)
This is important, Christy. Good on ya.
To paraphrase SF writer Spider Robinson, “Beware of librarians — they are the masters of the universe.”
(And it’s a SUBcommittee hearing, not a full committee hearing. Those are Leahy’s pleasure to chair.)
Jane at 6 — This is a huge first step hearing. With several more to come, I hear. Good on Feingold.
Each day in 2007 has disclosed more criminal activities by this thoroughly corrupt administration, occasionally occluded by distractions like Anna Nicole and Imus. Anna Nicole is mostly gone now that we know who her daughter’s father is. Imus will soon be gone form MSNBC when more companies pull their commercials.
“Any person who has ever worked with law enforcement knows that all it takes is one rotten apple in an investigative unit to stink up the entire place. The rules and regs are there for a very, very good reason — because you cannot tinker with essential notions of liberty and the rule of law without seeing some very grave consequences on the back end of that. Good cops and prosecutors take that very seriously, because with substantial power also comes a substantial responsibility to use it with great care.”
Christy, you got my “blog quote of the day…” with this paragraph. Someone needs to post this around the halls and offices of Congress, the FBI and the Dept. of Justice.
Wouldn’t hurt the White House to hang a copy of it in the Oval Office.
On the hearing announcement website, it lists Bob Barr as a former member of Congress and also “Chairman, Patriots to Restore Checks and Balances.”
Just been poking around that site a little bit, and it looks pretty good. Who could have anticipated that the Bob Barr of old would now be joining forces with folks like the ACLU?
Biodun @ 9
Nice to see market forces at work for the common good.
Hm. The webcast available at the linky so kindly posted by CHS (which is http://judiciary.senate.gov/hearing.cfm?id=2679 ) no workie. I’m assuming that this is because it’s too early. I wuz trying to glom a connection and squat on it, because I bet there’ll be lots of folx who will want to watch. Any info or thoughts on why no workie? Yet? :)
I just checked C-SPAN.ORG to see if it’ll be webcast from there as well… couldn’t find any mention.
Christy Hardin Smith @
8
Yupper. Especially as there’s a new push by the heads of some spy agencies to have the FISA rules relaxed even further.
Peterr @ 11
Never ever trust a wingnut. The only reason they are clamoring for the reigning in of the Executive branch now is because they are scared of what is going to happen when the Dems take over in “08. His little group would have had much more credence if they would have been calling for this back in “03 and 04 when the current administration began it’s consitiutional end around. Barr gets no respect from me.
Peterr @ 7
and
I believe he was on C-SPAN2 over the weekend, giving a presentation at U of VT, urging attendees to urge Leahy to do something about NSLs. I believe CT librarians are the only ones who have received NSL, replete with gag orders, who’ve been able to talk about it afterwards. (Only other instance is anonymous op-ed in WaPo a week or so ago.) It’s a spell binding story & well deserving of an airing. CT librarian lawyers were ACLU.
I hope we can watch this hearing. Creepy.
I have a question with regard to the dems putting time lines for getting out of Iraq. The wingers are putting this plan out as a date certain that the “enemy” will know and plan for. I see it more as a final date, and we can bring our troops home at any time and in any number before that date.
Signed,
Confused
And human beings are flawed, subject to occasional lapses in judgment resulting from panic or anger or revenge or any of the other very human emotions that can carry us away down a path that we ought not
But Christy there is something else hanging out there. Sheer malicious intent. We saw it with Hover, and again with Nixon. There are those that use the FBI and other law enforcement agencies to do some really insidious stuff. This is more than important – it is damn well urgent to get a handle on it. Thanks to Senator Feingold, you and, glory be to the sunshine.
“I wonder how many people here are mentioned in NSL letters….”
BRING EM’ON!
If I found out I’m not on thier “no-fly spy-on” list, I would actually be disappointed.
Considering my pre-war peace marches in CA, and my continual blogging drumbeat against the Bush/Cheney cabal, I can’t imagine they have not gathered a dossier on me that is thick as a brick, especially if they printed off all my vitriolic snarky posts.
Could be I’m delusional about the influence of “the blogs”, but I think many of us who post here and at KOS and some of the other icons of the blogosphere are on more than one list.
Call it the blog badge of courage, we should wear it proudly…
Maybe a future FOIA application will uncover that long list,and we can have a “no-fly-spy-on” party to celebrate our inclusion on such a worthy list of ne’er-do-wells and provocatuers.
Re: Bob Barr:
snarkon -Of course, why should it be a problem if you have nothing to hide. -snarkoff Although I’m sure KKKarl and Abu Gonzo would beg to differ.
I’ve never been a big fan of Bob Barr but he is one wing-nut who does seem to understand just how bad this stuff is. And hey, he’s gone to work for NORML now.
Christy said,
Any person who has ever worked with law enforcement knows that all it takes is one rotten apple in an investigative unit to stink up the entire place. The rules and regs are there for a very, very good reason — because you cannot tinker with essential notions of liberty and the rule of law without seeing some very grave consequences on the back end of that. Good cops and prosecutors take that very seriously, because with substantial power also comes a substantial responsibility to use it with great care.
From my 13 years work in public safety, I concur. I guess the outstanding exception to this rule is the way decisions are made in narcotics investigation teams. For instance, undercover agents routinely have to do things to prove up to their targets. Often the proving up involves breaking the law, like using the drugs their trying to interdict, so that their targets trust them. Then when the investigation’s product is presented to the grand jury, these officers routinely “testilie.” Depending on how long the team has been working together, knowledge of how much this happens varies. This, more than the danger of narcotics undercover and support work, is probably be the main reason officers feel uncomfortable doing this stuff for longer than their career path requires.
I imagine the politization of federal law enforcement under Bush is a lot like this. Career pros who value the rule of law are quitting teams which are more and more routinely “testilying” about what is happening behind these letters, and behind other politically-oriented investigations now underway – many of which we are still unaware.
Hi Christy, Jane, All,
Things happen so fast around here, I can’t keep up!!
Anyway OKkiddo reiterated a FAQ that I see often in the threads here and I just can’t NOT answer anymore. (I read the posts offline.) So this got EPU’d:
Audrey @ 114
Sorry for the OT disruption. Now on to read the post.
Love you all.
Shades of J. Edgar, even John Mitchell would be wetting his pants to have all these powers that Junya, Deadeye and Abu have stolen.
Who knew that the Constitution was just a piece of paper?
eCAHNomics @ 16
I believe he was on C-SPAN2 over the weekend, giving a presentation at U of VT, urging attendees to urge Leahy to do something about NSLs. I believe CT librarians are the only ones who have received NSL, replete with gag orders, who’ve been able to talk about it afterwards. (Only other instance is anonymous op-ed in WaPo a week or so ago.) It’s a spell binding story & well deserving of an airing. CT librarian lawyers were ACLU.
eCAHN –
I watched him too. He’s a bit dry, but his talk showed how deeply he understands the essential creepiness of the experience these letters force upon recipients.
Even if you excise the GOP parasites, permanent damage has been done. They have corrupted the Federal officials we once trusted. As we’ve seen in the Eastern bloc, you can’t just purge the secret police, you have to dismantle it and publicize individual agent’s actions. We now have complete moral equivalence between the FBI and the NKVD. Turns out Robert Hanssen was the exemplary FBI official.
Loo Hoo (Terry Olson) @ 17
This is a ploy by the Bush cabal. I would like for it to quit being referred to as a timeline. I think a “Measurement of Success” date is more appropiate. I would also like the Democratic leadership to offer to have the “Measurement of Success” date be classified. That should put the dampers on the ol hacks that keep crying about the enemy will wait us out. Just a thought.
Biodun @ 9
One might think that under the current threat of oversight, this administration would be trying to tone it down, but no. Yesterday it was a push to liberalize FISA; today we’re back to ominous accusations against Iran. Scary. One wonders what card they may think they still hold up their sleeve.
Crappity crap! Missing another good hearing today; esp. with the “star” being my personal political heart throb, Russ! *thumpity-thump!*
Sonoma Rus @ 18
exactly.
i would like to believe that
“the good shepherd“ is just a
matt damon movie i saw on
dvd last night. . .
nope — it is playing, real time
all over our nation, for the last
six years. . . time to take the
initiative back — time to press
directly for the return of habeas,
the revision of section 215 of the
patriot act (i mean some MORE revisions),
and on and on and on. . .
and these hearings are a good start.
what jane said — squared.
good on ya’ christy. . .
spurious @ 28
aces and eights…
Why should these librarians be concerned about the conduct of our government under Bush?
The head of the International Red Cross in Tehran says he saw wounds on an Iranian diplomat who has alleged that US forces in Iraq tortured him.
Peter Stoeker said there were marks on Jalal Sharafi’s feet, legs, back and nose but he was unable to say if they were the result of torture.
Iranian media quoted Mr Sharafi saying the CIA tortured him “day and night”.
Biodun @ 20
He has been removed from wingnut status in my book.
i just called c-span, and was told that they don’t plan on covering this hearing…. although, i did follow up with an email to request coverage of this hearing (and similar ones), i was told that the best thing to do (to request coverage for this afternoon) would be to send a fax.
so, for those of you with access to a fax machine… please consider faxing the c-span assignment desk at 202-737-6226 to request coverage for this afternoon’s hearing.
i told the nice person answering the phone that i don’t have a fax, but that i know people who do and i would post this info for them (that’s you!).
selise @ 34
Fax sent. Web cam is nice, tv is nicer… :)
More on Bob Barr:
selise @ 34
Done.
Here’s what happens when you get your news from FDL & TPM – I realized this morning that I did not know who the father was! I had to scroll through Huffington Post to yesterday’s news. OMG! Who would have thought us pups were so out of the loop!
Finally, about Bob Barr:
Yes, I did see him in that. He did change for the better. Who knew?
Gnome de Plume @ 38
Obviously you switch channels before the last 10 min of KO.
Back On Topic – Did Bushco intend to destroy Law and Order along with everything else, or is this just unintended consequences? That they are stonewalling the Justice subpoenas over “privacy concerns” put me ROFLMAF.
I’d like to humbly apologize for my comments last night. I was wrong and rude and I feel terrible about it.
SnarKassandra, I’m very sorry for being such a jerk. (I’ll post this again when she’s here)
Everyone else, I’m sorry for being such a jerk.
Gnome de Plume @ 38
Me, too! I was so pleased I received the news from an inane email from my mom, not an inane media report. Fine water we swim in here.
I had to miss KO last night because of Orchid Club. (Yes, I have a non-fatal disease called orchidmania.)
good day FDL’ers – my do i wish feingold would rethink his decision to run for the WH – he’s been so right in all that he has said and slowly dems are coming around to some of what he’s doing – brave sen feingold…
Biodun @ 39
Libertarians have their uses, and they’re one of the few groups out there who seem to be earnest through & through. (Note correct use of all 3 forms of homonym there.)
Marie Roget @ 35 and eCAHNomics @ 37 and anyone else willing to send a fax –
many thanks!
c-span coverage will mean more people get to see it… and most importantly – the video will be available on the c-span website for people to view later (there’s no archive of senate judiciary committee hearing videos)…
w/o c-span coverage most people (who don’t read fdl) will only know about this hearing if the nyt, wapo, et al. cover it… and even then, all they will know will be what the reporters/editors deem appropriate.
i can’t record the video from the committee hearing stream, but i will attempt to record an mp3 audio….
I would never switch channels on Keith!
Ali Allawi now on WNYC.org. You can listen online.
Shorter FBI: Feingold, go *f* yourse…We mean, we mean, uh, uh, um,…so sorry. We won’t do it again. We promise.
Oh, sweet, I just saw this at TPM. It’s a poll saying most Americans are behind the Dems on the funding bill:
http://electioncentral.tpmcafe…..ce_of_veto
Go Feingold!
Jimmy Carter receives award from Jewish group
http://www.jta.org/cgi-bin/iow…..award.html
Gnome de Plume @ 38
Actually, I think it was reported on one of the earlier threads. We all knew. Please keep up! ;)
Gnome de Plume @ 44
So it would be Gnome de Blume?
OT–Re Imus:
Those thirsting for the wit and wisdom of Imus can go here to tompaine.com for many samples.
Biodun @ 55
Strange. I somehow expected a link for the “wit and wisdom” of Imus to give me a “page not found” message.
Balrog — Good for you. Give her a glad welcome when Late Nite comes up.
scarecrow @ 53
Busted! You’re not supposed to find out that I wander away from the ‘pewter from time to time.
Oh I really hope that this congress can begin rolling back the policy of the Bush admin, but I wonder how long it will take for us to return the country to the ideals we had before.
Biodun @ 55
NPR just announced he’s losing major sponsors rapidly.
egregious @ 54
ba da bloom!
OT, Fox Movie Channel is showing “Deadline USA” at this moment. Maybe the Washington punditocracy and the ComPost folks should rent the movie and see a tribute to actually reporting the news rather than being stenographers.
You are as bad as Punaise.
LBrowne @ 56:
707!
Balrog @
42
Actually, she was asleep for most of it, but I accept your apology for insulting my niece. Peace?
OT – I’m just so astonished at junya trying to hire someone to “coordinate” the wars in Iraq and Afganistan.. he’s go a Sec of Def, a Sec of State, he’s hired the Iraq Study Group…
I realize that he may not be getting the agreement from them, but – what the heck is he doing??!!??
of all the nutty things, this is super duper nutty…
And before I could get my reply off, he/she steps in with another “tacky” comment . . .
Gnome de Plume @ 63
Shhh! He’s here!
TexasBetsy @
65
Thank you Betsy. I will make things right with Cassie this evening.
I have to leave now. Won’t be back for a few hours. Please put any worthy news either in the main posts or within the first 50 or so comments. Thanks. ;0)
Sorta OT, but we wouldn’t be having to wonder where to watch hearings if it weren’t for Dem control of congress. Got this Monday from Diane Benson:
Dear Phil,
I just got back from the east coast, and just before I left, I filed for office with the Division of Elections. So, yes, I am running. Much to do, and I look forward to any assistance you can provide. It’s time to get Don out.
Diane
Diane Benson will have to win the summer 2008 primary, but I’d put her chances of doing that at about 2 to 1 in favor…
Ed*ard Teller @ 60:
The market speaks, quite eloquently. We all knew it would come down to sponsors. With MSM you can bet everything comes down to bottom line. Everything, except the Bush Administration.
Update on the Wilsons -
mediainfo link
(Apologies if previously noted)
I hear someone in Alaska calling my name.
I’m in of course for Diane Benson.
Ed*ard Teller @ 71
Good news from up north — glad to hear it, ET!
OT–Re Imus:
Yet more wit and wisdom here at tompaine.com. It’s bottom-less. tompaine.com has several numbered archives of the bad stuff.
All who are praising Bob Barr here – while I agree he seems much more reasonable lately (he was actually very concerned with privacy when in Congress), the wingnut blood still flows.
He has a column in today’s AJC blaming the British prisoners for getting released alive. Another column a while ago was backing a proposal here in GA to force employers to allow employees to keep guns in their cars on company property.
selise @ 34
so, for those of you with access to a fax machine… please consider faxing the c-span assignment desk…
Now, the Geneva Conventions are NOT quaint; but fax machines CERTAINLY are. No email addy? WTF?? :)
Rep. Rush D. Holt is contemplating subpoenaing the non-responsive FBI re the anthrax investigation:
Holt said “Subpoenas should be used sparingly.”
Peterr @ 11
Some of the most vociferous anti-Bush people out there are those with strong Libertarian or conservative economics credentials. To wit:
Paul Craig Roberts, an Asst. Treasury Secretary in the Reagan administration; Karen Kwiatkowski, a retired USAF intelligence officer who posted as “Deepthroat” during her last active duty post in Feith’s shop in the Office of the SecDef, from early fall, 2002, until she retired the following summer; and Bruce Fein, a conservative jurist. (Sorry, no link at the moment.) There are more.
Anyone see this little tidbit this morning? The Repubs have a terrible field of candidates!
Questions on Schiavo Bedevil Giuliani
By RYAN SAGER
JF @ 77
Unfuckingbelievable!
Waccamaw @ 73
Unlike Valerie, I AM anti-Bush. My favorite T-shirt says, “I hated Bush before it was cool.”
“Who could have anticipated the break in the Barr?” :)
Frank Probst @ 83
Unlike Valerie, I AM anti-Bush. My favorite T-shirt says, “I hated Bush before it was cool.”
Need to get myself one of those!
Biodun @ 76
Bottomless? I can believe it. That man show his ass more often than a pole dancer at a titty bar.
Ed*ard Teller @ 60
Imus loses for scandalous racial remarks. Even though he has been on his knees ever since the idiotic remark.
Yet The Bush administration stays after lying about WMD’s, being responsible for the deaths of 3200 American soldiers, injuring 50,ooo Americans, over 600,ooo Iraqis dead, who knows how many have been injured, over 2 million displaced, etc. etc.
Justice?
Imus fucked up…bad. Although he has sincerely apoogized.
Minnesotachuck @ 80
Sorry — left off my snark tag on the “Who could have anticipated . . .?” line. That’s what Bush, Cheney, and Co. must be saying to each other.
Ed*ard Teller @ 60
Um, why can’t this happen to Limbaugh/Beck/Savage/O’Reilly/Coulter please? As Al Sharpton noted on Hardball last night, this is NOT just about Imus. I’m just concerned there’s going to be this big firestorm about Imus and then nothing, no one else held accountable for the same behavior.
Oh, lord. I cannot believe Thom Hartmann is just now bringing up my point (in the Imus context) that I made yesterday on here, about O’Reilly implying the kid that was kidnapped by that sicko enjoyed his captivity. Point being that I really expected Fox to, at the VERY LEAST, be flooded with complaints and consequently O’Reilly would be admonished by Fox, shamed into some kind of apology, SOMETHING! The only attention I saw that disgusting comment get in the media was from KO. That was it.
JF @ 77
Big tent, friend. We have a narrow window to get these guys out of office.
Then we can go back to bickering about the “lesser” matters.
egregious @ 74
I’m signing up for the duration for, you might have guessed it, opposition research on Don Young. I want Don’s head on my wall!
I read your report on yesterday’s frustrations and small victories – the little baby with the oxygen circulation problems. You’re my super hero, eg!
Ed*ard Teller @
79
Mr. Holt better watch his mail carefully. He won’t get the phony anthrax letter like Judith Miller got.
Remember how all of the Democrats who got the anthrax were so terrified and French that they quit the US government immediately after getting attacked?
-GSD
This was just on NPR’s Day to Day. Away to look at the genocide taking place in Darfur. Wonder if the “Genocide prevention” group will do the same for the Iraq genocide?
http://blogs.pcworld.com/staff…..04070.html
egregious @ 90
I’m siding with JF on this one. It’s all fun and games until your commanding officer puts you in a rubber raft in disputed waters with no backup.
Thom Hartmann playing sexist & racist crap quotes from John Gibson & Limbaugh.
Hey, egregious, how’re things goin?
egregious @ 90
I agree. My point was that he has not turned over a new leaf, but that a couple of his pet issues have risen to the top.
His voice should definitely be welcomed, but it should also be known that he will take an equally strong stand against some of our issues when the time comes. Just don’t be surprised when it happens.
For now, I am happy to hear his comments – as there are people who will only see the light if they see him pointing them to it.
Right on, there. Contesting hegemony by consensus, an expansive consensus.
Waccamaw @ 73
Hey lady!!
Oh my.
Another hardcore republican Bush voter with Buyer’s Remorse. Via the Carpetbagger Report:
That’s Lee Iacocca speaking. Click through for the whole piece.
Thanks for linking the Schoolhouse Rock. I always liked I’m just a bill.
Anyone know if they have one for Congressional subpoenas or Impeachment?
Feingold consistent, honorable.
Gore/Feingold…2008
Mandrake @ 95
We know that a lot of other people on the right do the same thing, but that shouldn’t distract us from Imus’s spectacular death spiral right now. This is one of those rare occasions where capitalism does exactly what it’s supposed to: Imus is going to get sacked because his sponsors are jumping ship, and that’s just not good for the bottom line.
Any background on Julie Hirschfeld Davis and why she is writing cover for Gonzales? (as linked from Josh Marshall)
First, there’s the setup:
So it’s about a Democrat “weapon”, not a case of the rule of law.
Then the sucker punch:
And finally, the GOP talking point:
Oh yeah? Any reason? Like, you didn’t cave to our demands for political interference in the judicial process?
And then there’s this use of the word “uncanny”.
Boy she must have spent some sweat coming up with that one.
Seconded. FDL is full of wonderful amazing people. This fact cannot be overestimated, IMHO.
Mandrake @ 95
How deep did he have to dig to find those?
Being unable to win, Billary and Obama, the only candidates the Dems have drawing any notoriety, it is past time to draft Russ Feingold.
He has the character and convictions of his principles that American voters need to “pull that lever” in 2008.
Billary and Obama simply cannot get the majority because Americans have never, ever voted for a new president while “holding their nose.” They have voted for an incumbent, or a Vice President come Presidential candidate. But, never a new President as “the lesser of two evils.”
DRAFT RUSS, and look at Obama or Pelosi as his running mate. These folks have convictions. People are now cynical about the conviction-less GOP! We need some fresh oxygen.
““waving at Mandrake“““
(closest I could come to a “wave”) ;-)
Lou Costello @ 101
Well they were recorded in the mid-70’s, so you might think so, but alas …. none on our complete CD set!
Peterr @ 100 – wow!
just wow… ’spose anyone will notice?
ET, Biodun,
Thank you for your words of encouragement. I need this more than you might imagine.
Mandrake, we had a full day of surgery with no losses today. Still trying to figure out why the child died yesterday, there was a problem with the diagnosis last week [before I was here].
Now it’s evening, just kicking back and enjoying catching up with the threads.
Who is The Father? Art he in heaven?
Peterr @ 88:
I guess my snark detector isn’t working too well this morning; its inputs must biased by the gloom field generated by our unwelcome April snowstorm. :(
My thanks to the mods for releasing my 9:41 comment. Reload your screens (not “refresh comments”) to see a rant from another rightwinger who’s “had enough.”
“Who could have anticipated . . .?”
OldCoastie @ 110
Once he hits the book tour circuit, you won’t be able to miss it. The other excerpts at Carpetbagger are incredible.
Peterr @ 100
Alright!!!
OT but thought folks here would be especially interested:
MASTECTOMY HOSPITAL BILL in Congress
If you know anyone who has had a mastectomy, you may know that there
is a lot of discomfort and pain afterwards.
Insurance companies are trying to make mastectomies an outpatient
procedure. Let’s give women the chance to recover properly in the
hospital for 2 days after surgery. It takes 5 seconds to do this and
is very important…please take the time and do it really quick!
Please send this to everyone in your address book who may care about
this issue. If there was ever a time when our voices and choices
should be heard, this is one of those times. If you’re receiving this,
it’s because I think you will take the 30 seconds to go to vote on
this issue and send it on to others you know who will do the same.
There’s a bill called the Breast Cancer Patient Protection Act which
will require insurance companies to cover a minimum 48-hour hospital
stay for patients undergoing a mastectomy. It’s about eliminating the
“drive-through mastectomy” where women are forced to go home just a
few hours after surgery, against the wishes of their doctor, still
groggy from anesthesia and sometimes with drainage tubes still
attached.
Lifetime Television has put this bill on their web page with a
petition drive to show your support. Last year over half the House
signed on.
Please sign the petition by clicking on the web site below. You need
only give your NAME, ZIP CODE and EMAIL.
http://www.lifetimetv.com/heal…..ledge.html
This takes almost no time. please pass this on to your friends and
family, and on behalf of all women…THANKS!!
Re “I was anti-Bush before it was cool” T-shirts
Reminds me of a bumber sticker I saw while on vacation in northern California a few weeks ago:
“Where are we going? Why are we in this hand basket?”
TiredFed at 116 — As luck would have it, I have something coming up next on that.
egregious @ 111
I don’t know how you do it but I admire you for it immensely. God be with you!
Nice line from Lee Iacocca excerpt above:
“And the press is waving pom-poms instead of asking hard questions.”
Let’s see how many talk shows he’ll get invited to.
Iacocca sounds like he’s channeling Donald Trump too.
I always knew they were a couple of communists who hated America!
-GSD
everyone has seen Nancy’s latest gambit, I suppose?
(segue into talks with Iran…)
Where did the refresh comment button go?
Re Peterr @ 100 & ff:
IIRC, Iacocca has supported Democratic candidates in the past. Dont know about formal party affiliation, though.
There it is.
While still extremely skeptical about Bob Barr, I nevertheless believe most people possess the ability to have a change of heart when confronted with incontrovertible evidence that their former convictions were, to be polite, misplaced. (Less polite: incredibly bone-headedly stupidly wilfully partisanly 100% wrong).
Maybe Mr. Barr has had an honest change of heart and is now courageous enough to admit it, and is trying to make amends.
However improbable in the case of Barr, it’s not impossible. Here’s to sunshine.
OT – msnbc tv just said that Thompson has already had treatment for the lymphoma and now is in remission… so, tinfoil hatters, he DID know before he announced.
Just checking my keyboard after moving my home office network to my new. . . home office.
Yay! I didn’t fuck it up. The keyboard works!
Forrest Prince—
I agree. We are going to see a lot of wingers desert their positions and come over to the reality-based side.
We need to welcome them with open arms, encouragement, and maybe cookies.
Minnesotachuck @ 124
At Carpetbagger, they describe his Republican endorsements in detail, including Bush.
Some interesting articles
http://www.informationclearing…..e17508.htm
http://www.weeklystandard.com/…..1fmfsu.asp
http://www.davidcorn.com/
Hagel is coming
http://www.amconmag.com/2007/2007_04_09/cover.html
The Twilight Zone
http://www.amconmag.com/2007/2007_04_09/article
.html
Carter receives award from a Jewish group in L.A.
http://www.jta.org/cgi-bin/iow…..award.html
[Modnote: Comments with a large number of links may take a long time to get posted.]
Fresh thread, up and running. And I would very much appreciate if folks would read this one and click thru the links…it’s about a subject near and dear to me and to many of us. Thanks.
Peterr @ 100, heh. I knew something of the sort couldn’t be too far off when my father glumly said (over Easter) he’d been abandoned by his party and his president. “He’s not the man I voted for.”
I bit my lip and did not bring up the times he screamed at me for daring to question Bush’s wisdom.
New thread.
a little OT, but maybe she’s trying to tell us something and she couldn’t find another way?
From yesterday’s Morning Edition on NPR:
This is the morning that kids were invited to the White House for the Easter egg roll. The roll for Laura Bush includes reading a children’s book. It’s called, “Duck for President.” The first lady will read the story of a duck who takes over the farm, then runs for governor, and then runs for the White House. He wins after a recount, but Duck gives it all up to go back to the farm. The duck concludes, “Running a country is no fun at all.”
According to the book’s publisher, “President Duck,” who didn’t realize being president would require a lot of “very hard work,” ends up with “a very bad headache” before passing his duties off to his Vice President.
By all indications, Laura Bush chose this book to read to the kids. (Maybe the First Lady has a good sense of humor?)
Bit NOLA @ 4
Leahy will.
Pachacutec @
129
Welcome to your new home, Pach, and congrats…not just on not screwing up te computer installation, on everything. Big step. Right move.
New homes rock.
Peterr @100:
Wow!! I guess some of the Republicans are finally realizing they installed a bunch of people in the government that are Republican-imposters.
debit @ 134
Yeah, I’m in the same kind of place with my Dad. ‘cept, he’s angry at Bush, so he won’t talk to ME. It’s like he’s blaming me for Bush’s failure to live up to his expectations. And I have never once even hinted at “Told ya so!”
Gnome de Plume @ 63
NOTHING gets by the eagle eyes and wit of punaise or egregious! ;~)
conniptionfit @ 140
What kills me is that my dad used to be as close to being a hippy as you can get without actually smoking pot. He wanted to build a dome house, he read Mother Earth News, he was a nut for recycling. Then along came the 80’s and he fell in love with Regan and after him Georgie and…
Needless to say, he’s a different man. But, baby steps. Maybe he’ll see his way back to the side of the light.
debit @
142
Was he mugged?
Peterr @
11
And Al Gore– in his January 2006 speech at Constitution Hall.
Bob in HI
conniptionfit @ 140
Dang, if that were me, I’d have a scar where my lower lip used to be!
Mommybrain @ 143
LOL. No. Regan was elected when his life was in a bit of turmoil (unruly teenagers -including me-, uncertain job prospects, the suicide of his father) and I think he wanted the comfort and security of the moral absolutes Regan and his party promised.
debit @ 146
The 60’s scared the shit out of a lot of people. It’s one reason I never had any kids.
I put a link up on DU to this hearing, hope some folks will follow it there.
DU link
Don’t forget the most underreported aspect of the entire story. Back in February 2006, when he signed into law the renewal of the Patriot Act, Bush issued a signing statement that said he didn’t feel compelled to abide by the Congressional oversight provisions that were crucial to the bill being past in the first place.
In other words, the FBI was recently caught violating the very rules President Bush said he didn’t feel he had to follow. Greenwald has more.