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You know, I love technology. Except, of course, when I don't.
At the time of this writing, I am hastily banging out a post before my brother and I pile into the car and drive home to Athens from our mom's house in Columbus, Georgia. When I get home, there is about a 50/50 chance that I will be able to log on to the Internets from my DSL modem, which has suddenly decided that it has the work ethic of the GOP controlled Congress.
Perhaps there will be an Easter miracle when I get home and my modem will have risen from the dead.
However, no matter how clueless or technologically thwarted I may feel, I can always take some comfort that I'm not the danger to myself and others that our President is. From the Detroit News:
Business Insider
Plug it in, fire it up, Mr. President
The Detroit News
Credit Ford Motor Co. CEO Alan Mulally with saving the leader of the free world from self-immolation.
Because Psycho President Magoo just can't help but destroy everything he touches, no? I do want to thank you though, Mr. Mulally, for keeping him alive so we can impeach his Hague bound ass.
Mulally told journalists at the New York auto show that he intervened to prevent President Bush from plugging an electrical cord into the hydrogen tank of Ford's hydrogen-electric plug-in hybrid at the White House last week. Ford wanted to give the Commander-in-Chief an actual demonstration of the innovative vehicle, so the automaker arranged for an electrical outlet to be installed on the South Lawn and ran a charging cord to the hybrid. However, as Mulally followed Bush out to the car, he noticed someone had left the cord lying at the rear of the vehicle, near the fuel tank.
Uh oh. Wasn't anyone briefed on this? Didn't they mention this to that special branch of the Secret Service who are in charge of keeping 100 yards between the Toddler in Chief, forks and knives, and any light socket? Not to mention the woman who cuts and chews his food for him? Surely they didn't allow him around something as dangerous as a tank full of hydrogen without a minder? Holy Hindenburgs, Batman!
"I just thought, 'Oh my goodness!' So, I started walking faster, and the President walked faster and he got to the cord before I did. I violated all the protocols. I touched the President.
Good lord! You TOUCHED the PRESIDENT without his permission?! Oh! The humanity!
I grabbed his arm and I moved him up to the front," Mulally said. "I wanted the president to make sure he plugged into the electricity, not into the hydrogen This is all off the record, right?"
Oh, don't worry, Mr. Mulally. We won't tell a soul that our Preznint nearly blew up himself, a hybrid car, and everyone in the Rose Garden.
Good thing there weren't any pretzels lurking in the area. We could have had a real Incident.
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Dick Cheney Controls Tim Russert.
What kind of fuckery is this?!?!?!
Is this TRex or is it memorex? Only his modem knows for sure.
Hello all! Back to read.
Is that Cheney I see in the background? We coulda had a 2-fer? There is no God.
“Back up in your ass with the resurrection” — on Easter?? :)
Entire Science Fiction series have been predicated on ‘What Ifs’ smaller than this.
It was all a plot by Nancy Pelosi I tell you.
Ya can’t help but dream, can you?
Hague bound ass!!
I know how you feel, TRex, sometimes my cable doesn’t work for the laptop. No rhyme or reason, and it drives me crazy.
TRex- where can we send hate mail to Mulaly?
Remember this scene of Bush cutting in front of Clinton to get through a door first? I can’t think of them off the top of my head, but I know there have been other such situations.
Y’know, the Founding Fathers really tried to make the job of President of the United States simple enough that a reasonably intelligent and well-trained baboon could do it.
They weren’t counting on unreasonably stupid and untrained baboons.
I can just see Mr. Me-Firster walking faster and faster. “Not gonna let that CEO beat me, no siree, nu-uh.”
err…uhhh…
the quote (”back up…”) in comment six is not from the post, correct?
(or was I in the sun way too long today?)
EvilDrPuma @ 13
LOL!
Renee in Ohio @ 12
Like a schoolkid fighting to be first in line. You have to ask what it’ll matter 5 minutes from now who was first?
Would the SS concider it a threat to the preznits life if I just sent him a little ol’ bag of pretzels?
WHERE DID EVERYONE GO?? HELLO??
BREAKING NEWS: President Bush prays for PEACE!
BREAKING NEWS……….: President prays for Peace
Are we really to believe that one could plug an electrical cord into a hydrogen tank?
I call bullshit.
Ok. ok I ‘pologize! I didn’t really mean it! Come Back! Don’t leave me aloooone!!
I’m still wondering why Ford thinks a plug-in hybrid is a good idea. (Especially with hydrogen – did they flunk chemistry?) Don’t they realize that there are very few places to plug in a car?
I’d consider cussing out Mullaly for stopping Shrub, but most of the other people there probably don’t deserve what would have happened.
I think everyone is either sleeping off dinner or driving home from grandma’s house.
Yeah, laughed my ass off when I read this–especially Bush trying to be “first” again.
It’s like the textbook definition of “fools rush in….” :)
Sort of defines his whole presidency, in a way.
I was trying to find some other story about how sadly, compulsively competitive Bush is, but came up empty. But I did find something rather amusing about what the top April Fool’s pranks would be in a world populated entirely by robots.
I just got home so I don’t know if you guys saw this about Walter F. Murphy, professor emeritus of Princeton. Tried to board a plane and went through quite an ordeal because he had written a book critical of the Administration:
http://balkin.blogspot.com/200…..eople.html
lolo @ 19
Linky.
Like I said in the last thread…I had a screaming fit over this. I still haven’t really recovered. Is there anything so hypocritically evil that this bastard won’t say it or do it?
Balrog @ 21
It’s a Ford, after all. If they knew that the tank valve was a little leaky, and there were sparks when grounding the plug, well….
conniptionfit @
5
You took the words right out of my mind. :)
Terry Olson @ 27
Well duh! There’s a long list to parse now.
lolo @ 20
I saw that on the tv news and it looked like Pickles was a little nervous to stand too close to him for fear of being struck by lightening.
Renee in Ohio @ 26
01010101110!
Bush is too well insulated now, but after he leaves office, I could really see him becoming the first former POTUS to win a Darwin Award.
joysness @ 30
It’s good to know I’m not the only evil freak.
conniptionfit @ 32
Yeah, but 101101110010001!
This man can not operate a simple plug correctly and we are entrusting him with our country? Anyone else have a problem with this?
Yeah, that’s Cheney in the picture too. My brother pointed out this comment on Fark:
Renee, there was a picture in a morning thread of Bush going ahead of both his wife and mother out a door. What can mom expect? She brought him up.
Life must have been interesting for George and Bar when young W was coming along—setting fire to the couch, spiking the punch with rubbing alcohol, driving another car into the swimming pool—always some excitement or other. What a relief it was when that gullible Welsh girl took him to raise. (They must have died laughing after the newlyweds drove away.)
EvilDrPuma @ 36
snort.
A little Purell would come in ‘handy’, there
;>)
Renee in Ohio @ 26
Randi Rhodes had a story once about him operating the forklift in a warehouse and scaring all of the employees and the secret service. Does that count?
Evening Balrog, coniptionfit, Suzanne, EDP, all.
I am wondering, how could someone could design a car, even a prototype, on which one could inadvertantly plug an electrical cord into a hydrogen fuel cell? And result in an explosion? Does this sound like very bad design?
Although I am reminded of some spam I have been getting lately for Kaboom Toilet Cleaner, “never clean your toilet again”. It seems to be serious.
EvilDrPuma @ 34
Nah, too late. He’s already reproduced….
darkblack, I bet to differ – a LOT of purell would be necessary in that instance
Renee in Ohio @ 37
Just as well it didn’t happen. It would be too much trouble maintaining some semblance of decorum.
TexasBetsy @ 37
He hires really competent people to do everything for him.
Suzanne @ 46
indeed !
EvilDrPuma @ 28
I know…..I was lurking and wanted to hear more outrage.
montag @ 44
Are we sure they’re his? I demand DNA testing!
GWB has jelly beans for brains
TexasBetty, I remember that story. That’s an example of him acting like a sociopath. Not quite the same thing as the “me first”, but probably related.
Elliott @ 52
Only today. The rest of the year it is plain jelly.
conniptionfit @ 11
LOL
lolo @ 49
I’m surprised you didn’t hear it when I had the screaming fit. I was getting nasty calls from Finland.
TexasBetsy @ 37
Just a quick driveby- Aunt Betsy, welcome again. And thanks for watching out for Cassie. Freckles is such an inspiration, and it is delightful to have you both at FDL.
Renee in Ohio @ 53
Forgive me for missing the distinction. So many disorders, so little time! Ah!
TexasBetsy @ 37
I do not believe this man was ever elected President. We haven’t entrusted it, he stole it.
Curses….
Karma foiled again….
Elliott @ 51
No, that was Reagan. Bush has shit for brains.
EvilDrPuma @ 51
Ah, a nature v. nurture argument… they do behave a lot like him, though, don’t they? :)
Cassandra @ 40
You funny, Cassandra.
Valley Girl @ 57
Thanks so much! We are both enjoying our visits here, though it is hard to shut down the computer without hitting “Refresh Comments” just one more time.
montag @ 61
Bush boinks unemployed Argentinians?
Speaking of Randi Rhodes, I heard Stephanie Miller today talking about the warmongers, and said they were having wargasms.
HotFlash @
44
I seem to remember Kaboom was a breakfast cereal in the 70’s. Class?
OT to Ms. Terry Olson, please book your flight to Minnesota for Mother’s Day. I’m gonna need some help out here.
PretzelGruber.
-GSD
EvilDrPuma @ 28
I did hear you how about an ENCORE?
Balrog @
67
Not to be confused with Freakies.
-GSD
montag @ 45
I don’t think that reproducing precludes him from winning a Darwin Award. I’m pretty sure that the only requirement is that the last words be:”Hey guys, look at THIS!”
My only concern is that some idiot would demand that the Taxpayers foot his lavish National Cathedral Funeral. Although, they COULD sell raffle tickets for a chance to dance on his grave…we could fund Social security and have enough left over for National Health!
Balrog @ 66
Hey, I remember that! (We just carbon-dated ourselves, didn’t we?)
TexasBetsy @ 64
p.s. I noticed that people don’t respond to Cassie’s comments much during the daytime. Alas. But, she arrived on FDL late nite, so many of the morning people probably don’t know who she is. Please tell her not to get discouraged about that. The late nite and the daytime audience don’t necessarily overlap.
Hmmmm…
Here’s a question born out of ignorance, facts skittering just out of reach.
Isn’t there some sort of increased security issue with having POTUS and Vice-POTUS in the same area at an event like this?
Double risk, that…If Mulaly’s on the level, he may have averted a major incident if there was any estimable concerns involved.
Just playing tin foil advocate, here
;>P
.
Just as well it didn’t happen. It would be too much trouble maintaining some semblance of decorum.
you are so right there…..
Valley Girl @ 72
Too bad. She’s a good kid. She deserves some encouragement.
Was Kaboom out at the same time as Quisp?
Hey EDP- what’s next for you?
Renee in Ohio @ 76
I think it may have been. Difference is, I never ate Quisp.
TexasBetsy @ 54
Heh. My 16 year old was lethargic and moaning and groaning this morning. I asked her if she had a hangover.
‘I stayed up until 4 AM drinking Full Throttle and eating jelly beans.’
You can’t make up stories like that. She got a pass. Why can’t she just experiment with Sloe Gin and Doritos like I used to puke on?
EvilDrPuma @ 76
And, her snark is excellent!
Valley Girl @ 73
p.s. I noticed that people don’t respond to Cassie’s comments much during the daytime. Alas. But, she arrived on FDL late nite, so many of the morning people probably don’t know who she is. Please tell her not to get discouraged about that. The late nite and the daytime audience don’t necessarily overlap.
She’ll only be here on weekends during the day. And evenings until 11:30. She does not discourage easily in any case.
Shall I change my log in name to Aunt Betsy?
How utterly despicable. Here is a CEO, lamenting that he broke protocol by touching the president, the horror! And we hear that the same president played with the reporters like they were his court jesters, asking one to submit to the claws he was operating. We all know the arrogant resident of the white house fancies himself a king, but what is even more appalling is that so many “stalwarts” of the society indulge him in this delusion. Can’t wait for Jan 20, 2009.
Balrog, you’re going to be fine. Others have made it, and you will too. Call if need an adult blankie or liquid pacifier. You got names?
Valley Girl @ 77
Keep plugging. I’ve got my teaching arse covered for the next year, and it looks like I’ll be getting a publication out of the Theoretical Roman Archaeology Conference last month. All is not lost by a long shot.
Valley Girl @ 81
Snark is far better suited to the chat rooms and blogs than to the dinner table!
Renee in Ohio @ 77
Yes. And Quake was the cereal introduced at the same time for Jocks. Quisp was for the space cadets.
Valley Girl @ 80
Yes, she is a precocious snarkist.
Balrog @ 87
Far out, man.
-GSD
EvilDrPuma @ 47
that’s when you would wish you had a machine gun so you could fire some celebratory rounds from the top of the roof.
If I recall correctly, Darkblack had a stellar rendition of King George W., The Turd.
-GSD
EvilDrPuma @ 76
Ya know, I don’t think that the daytimers necessarily realize that Cassie is a kid. I think that may be a big tribute to the quality of her writing.
TexasBetsy @ 82
No! that would give the impression that you don’t live another life!
EvilDrPuma @ 61
Shit and a prayer for brains.
conniptionfit @ 91
Maybe. I know that the more like her I can get into a classroom by the time they hit college, the better.
Valley Girl @ 93
But is it ok if we still call you Aunt Betsy? I always wanted an Aunt Betsy…
Valley Girl @ 92
Besides, the world needs more decent Texans. And it’s past due for somebody to mess with the rest of ‘em.
EvilDrPuma @ 95
I work in a high school and don’t often see that level of enthusiasm or thirst for knowledge.
I always wanted an Auntie Em but instead had an Aunt Apple (Ethel).
conniptionfit @ 96
Of course you can :)
TexasBetsy @ 97
It is to be rewarded and encouraged.
EvilDrPuma @ 79
Don’t remember Kaboom, but do remember Quisp…..it had an archrival named Quake….sort of like Frankenberry and Count Chocula.
But I never ate any of that stuff…always been a one-cereal kind of woman. First Rice Krispies, then Raisin Bran. About ready for Total now.
Terry Olson @ 84
Easy for you to say.
Adult blankie or liquid pacifier: Spicy Tuna rolls and Macallan’s 20 yr.
Terry Olson Balrog Brown
Cassie’s role model is a decent Texan with plenty of her own snark — Molly Ivins.
Terry Olson @
27
I’m not so sure I’m willing to buy all of the good professor’s assertions at face value (some seem a bit far-fetched). However, everyone should read the comments to see the amazing trollery that the readers of Balkinization (a must-read blog, BTW) put up with on a daily basis. Bart de Palma — who, amazingly enough, is an actual lawyer (he apparently has a thriving DUI-defense practice outside Colorado Springs) — is one of the worst of the worst. How the faculty talent-scouts at Regent University Law School missed this guy is hard to understand. The so-called “humble law student” is nearly as bad.
GSD @ 91
Naw man, I only do family portraits and landscapes
;>)
conniptionfit @ 71
Actually, yeah, it’s one of the requirements to be a grand prize winner. The runners-up sometimes get included if they’ve reproduced. But, the prime consideration is that one offs one’s self prior to passing on one’s genes to others. The essence of the Darwin Awards is, after all, natural deselection. :)
Suzanne @ 99
My kids have an Auntie Em.
Quisp was good…vanilla, processed sugar…yum
darkblack @ 105
My friend, Karl Rove is a landscape.
conniptionfit @ 108
My step-sister is Elizabeth, and my son always called her “Aunt Little Bit” when he was young.
TexasBetsy @ 104
Rearin’ that girl right!
greenwarrior @ 94
Y’know, trying to imagine what Bush prays for makes me just a teensy bit queasy….
Balrog @ 87
Quisp was my favorite, up until the time that I figured out that most of those cereals were exactly the same except for the shape.
TexasBetsy @ 104
A worthy choice on her part. :)
Funny, On Mt. Rushmore, whenever you try to look into Seedy Gonzales’ eyes, they move.
-GSD
Aunt Apple was called this by my brother, who could not say Ethel when he was a wee lad. She is Aunt Apple to this day.
montag @ 112
I’m guessing that God has been checking His caller ID lately.
conniptionfit @ 112
Her brother is her legal guardian, but I’m doin’ my best!
What is Full Throttle?
I thought everyone had an Aunt Marian.
GSD @ 115
LOL! Thanks, I needed that.
Not sure if I ever ate Quisp or not, but I remember the little alien dude’s picture on the box.
EvilDrPuma @ 110
‘My friend, Karl Rove is a landscape.’
Well, he’s big in Japan.
;)
TexasBetsy @ 37
Runs in the family. Remember Daddy with the grocery store scanner?
Burns,
I have never seen that DePalma ntiwit until earlier today…..running the same old anti-Joe WIlson smokescreen….The “luxury trip to Niger” and on and on.
That clown is a font of winger propaganda.
-GSD
Terry Olson @
120
Energy drink. Think Jolt with Ginseng and other unapproved energy herbs.
GSD @ 116
Tectonic shifty
;>)
Balrog @ 80
Sloe gin and Doritos??? You almost made me puke, just thinking about that one. I thought I was bad, washing down Breakfast Jacks with Cuervo Gold. Ahhh, the 70s.
montag @ 113
Reminds me of a favorite bit of dialogue, though I can’t recall for sure where it’s from (Ladyhawke, perhaps):
B: I’ll pray for you.
A: Whatever you pray to, I don’t want to be brought to its attention.
Redshift @ 124
I remember the wingers trying, desperately, to downplay that little tableau for all their worth, as if GHWB had ever pushed a cart down a grocery store aisle in his life. George going out for groceries, and Babs whining at him as he went out the door, “and don’t forget to get me Tampax….”
Yeah, right.
Reports that Alberto hasn’t been doing so hot on his murder boards either.
If you are going to have a hapless chowder-head as an inside guy, hope that he doesn’t live down to the nickname Fredo.
Break out the butter and Smucker’s, he’s toast.
-GSD
burnspbesq @ 105
I saw that too. I actually thought one of “Bart’s” posts was supposed to be satirical. Nope.
Defending DUI. How very…..Gonzales-like.
I just remembered this page–”worst Halloween costumes of all time“.
Don’t forget BooBerry…
Terry Olson @ 120
Full Throttle.
I had to drink the sloe gin one night in high school just cuza Janis Joplin. Never,ever again.
GSD @ 131
Well now, that would make a great title for an FDL post. xxoo
Renee in Ohio @ 133
What a marvelous website! A whole era in plastic masks!
Renee in Ohio @ 133
Bet those are worth something on e-bay now.
VG,
I should spend some time tooling through the archives for my greatest hits.
But I’m just so damn lazy.
-GSD
The Village People costume. Imagine the reaction of the poor Archie Bunker father type who’s kid picked that costume up at Ames.
Valley Girl @ 137
I’d like to see an FDL post called:
RECESS: Return of the Fox or Swiftboaters in Your Face.
Bush hates manatees! Read all about it!
From WaPo:
Bush Hates Manatees!
It is beginning to appear that the legendary ability of the american people to pick the right political canidate was a bunch of shit. They picked GW Clusterfuck—then they got lied to- and their hero fucked em over every way including sideways- lied to em- gave everything they owned to the rich- and eventually (when the price of gas reached $3 per gallon) the wise american people said–”Wait a fuckin minute- this fucker is costing me $100 a month is gasoline charges- I hate him”.
He was a total piece of dog shit from the beginning- he had all the talent of a junior grade sewer polluter- he has the people reading ability of a drunk copper miner lookin for a hooker on a saturday night- he has the leadership ability of drowning rat- and the intellectual vigor of Saddam Hussein AFTER the hanging. He’s a fuckin loser- and the brain dead american public elected him NOT ONCE-
BUT TWICE!!!
Pathetic.
Democracy is a joke in this country.
Valley Girl @ 173
Wow – what a great list about awful stuff.
How do I subscribe?
(this looks more depressinng than the global infectious disease alert list. of course, I cant wait to read ‘em…)
McCain thinks it’s fun when he misspeaks!!!!!
http://thinkprogress.org/
What I was trying to find is the story by the guy whose Stretch Armstrong suffered a puncture wound, allowing him to find out that the stretchy action figure was filled with corn syrup. And this was a kid whose parents didn’t let him eat sweets. Hilarity ensues.
But I’ve got to get to bed now. Night, everybody.
rwcole,
How do you feel about George Bush?
rwcole @ 143
Whoo,dont hold back..tell us how you REALLY feel
EvilDrPuma @
34
Ironic, his stance on evilution and all.
GSD @
140
I did a Devo costume in 79 using a one-piece ski suit that zipped up the back. I had to plead with my friends to unzip it after massive beer consumption so I could pee…
They still laugh at me about that one.
Bed time. Night friends.
start_beating_around_the_bush @ 149
First Romney’s bragging about blowing away bunnies on Easter weekend…Now G.W. Monkey Nuts is turning manatees over to the canned-hunt crowd.
Unreal.
RWCole, don’t hold back. The first election was close enough to game….The US really duffed the Mulligan 04.
Meanwhile in Iraq:
Iraqis streamed toward Najaf for Monday’s 4th anniversary demonstration. Witnesses said thousands of residents in Baghdad’s largest Shiite slum, Sadr City, boarded buses and minivans Sunday for Najaf.
“The faithful should participate in a demonstration in Najaf on April 9, demanding that the occupiers withdraw from our lands. They should carry or wear Iraqi flags,” al-Sadr’s office said.
-GSD
We now know…yes it does matter if you vote…
Night Renee and Balrog.
Balrog @ 150
Good night. Thanks for the laugh.
with sad’r haveing just declared open season on the us troops,we can tell the surge is working…
rwcole @ 143
Well, in fairness to the current generation, we also elected Reagan, twice. Bummer, that.
And, there was Nixon, twice. Bummer, that.
And, GHWB, but only once. And, there was Harding (who was, if anything, even slower than GWB), and Coolidge, and Hoover (my favorite anecdote from his administration was when he wanted to campaign in Detroit in late 1931, and the police said, “don’t come–we can’t protect you”). McKinley was elected, twice. And he was Mark Hanna’s (Rove’s idol) creation. His assassination is mostly a footnote in history today–nobody missed him all that much.
GWB is the worst, so far, but, the American public, thanks to the lies of the right wing, and the power of advertising today, can always pick worse… Rudy Giuliani, anyone?
snuffy @
156
Lonesome Joe, is that you?
-GSD
AZ Matt @ 142
Ya know, this (and the whole USA/Purge thing, and most of the rest of the gov’t being drowned in the bathtub) fits into this dKos diary that I just read about ‘Constitutiinal Hardball’. I don’t think anyone’s mentioned it here yet. If I missed it being mentioned, sorry for the rerun:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/4/7/192112/0900
rwcole @ 143
Now that’s a riff
;>)
montag @ 157
Bush was NEVER elected. He stole 2 elections.
oddmommy @
132
That would have been Bart Jr.
Hmmm… I thought Aunt Betsy’s wording (evilution) was so apt. Too bad she’s signed off.
So- Dumya is a proponent of evilution! (Not evolution.)
wcole @ 143
and the brain dead american public elected him NOT ONCE-
BUT TWICE!!!
Pathetic.
Democracy is a joke in this country.
Bush was never elected. he STOLE 2 elections.
rwcole,
I got to talking to a 39 year old woman tonight who thinks everything in America is just duck soup. I asked her how she liked the war. She said that Bush was right, we had to take Hussein out to protect ourselves. I could see it was hopeless, but asked what she thought of the USA firings, she didn’t know jack about it. I gave her some info, and she ACTUALLY SAID “Okay, I don’t really follow that stuff. I like to watch American Idol.”
There you have it, buddy.
Valley Girl @ 162
Have not signed off just yet. A few more minutes.
TexasBetsy @ 163
It may not be polite to say it, but a bunch of American fuckin’ idiots got him close enough so he could steal `em….
montag @ 166
True enough. Now time for me to say good night.
G’nite Aunt Texas Betsy
montag @
157
’scuse me, but I didn’t vote fer any of them fuckers!
Suzanne @ 168
Good night Suzanne!
TexasBetsy @ 163
“He” stole 2 elections? “HE”? Givn the boy credit for KKKarls work.
I subscribe to the “Integrity in Science” weekly email updates. Copied from that, but w/o links.
~~~Interior IG: Top Wildlife Official Censored Endangered Species List
The Interior Department’s Inspector General has confirmed allegations that Julie MacDonald, a 2002 Bush administration appointee who now runs the Fish, Wildlife, and Parks division, tampered with the Endangered Species Act listings generated by agency scientists.
The charges by internal whistleblowers first surfaced in a Washington Post report last October that was based on documents obtained by the Union of Concerned Scientists.
IG Earl Devaney told Congressional investigators that MacDonald, an engineer by training, ‘bullied, insulted, and harassed the professional staff of the U.S. Fish and Wildlife service to change documents and alter biological reporting regarding the Endangered Species program.’
The IG also accused MacDonald of disclosing ‘nonpublic’ information to the conservative Pacific Legal Foundation, which mounts legal challenges to implementation of the Endangered Species Act. ~~~
edit p.s. There a plenty of links, if anyone wants them.
Valley Girl @ 171
Another Monica Goodling, methinks. The next president better be makin’ a list and checkin’ it twice so that all these Bush automatons end up where they belong in 2009….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBE2h8Gdmvc
Russerts Bush interview. Highlights all the progress in Iraq.
Valley Girl @ 173
…And is she also a 30-something with no experience except a large hankerin’ to blow GW?
montag @ 174
What? A brothel?
My fear is there are a lot of little monica goodlings throughout our government – seedlings for the future.
Suzanne @ 169
night night Aunt Betsy
conniptionfit @ 175
Umm, I was thinking more along the lines of the ash heap of history, on top of Rove, Bush and Cheney. Rummy went out early, so, he’s on the bottom….
Montag-
But it would be so karmic!
conniptionfit @ 179
Why? To suggest them being in a brothel is redundant. They’re already in one–that’s what they’ve made of government….
montag- yes! I was checking through the links on this at the same time as reading about the USA case. This particular case hasn’t gotten much news. But I was shocked to realize how pervasive the infiltration has been. Shocked? Geez, am I naive. I just didn’t imagine how simple little BushCo. could have managed to fuck up absolutely everything. And here I thought he had only gone for Iraq and domestic persons. I hadn’t thought about the “little” creatures that drive the world.
Schlaf gut, Tante Betsy. Bis morgen.
Nighty night all.
Jeez I love you guys.
g’nite conniptionfit
Let’s not forget the scandals in the Dept. of Education. The other brother selling some “product” that met NCLB standards, the student loan mess, and now this out of New Jersey:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04…..build.html
Is there any place in government that has NOT been infected?
montag @ 107
Needn’t be death, just removal from the gene pool. For instance, the guy who shoplifted a live lobster made the list because he stuffed the critter down his pants to make his getaway.
By the way, the wingers have already photoshopped Speaker Pelosi onto the infamous Jane Fonda/Viet-Cong anti-aircraft photo.
-GSD
Valley Girl @
173
There was a quick blurb on CNN a few weeks ago about the shrub WH requesting that Health and Human Services should review its prohibition against the use of domestic prisoners without informed consent for human biomedical experimentation, with an eye toward eliminating said prohibition. Rethug pharma industry buddies are pushing for it, apparently. They actually are making the argument that our country’s 2.2 million prisoners should have to contribute more economically, and using them as human guinea pigs, Tuskegee-style, is as good a way as any. That’s integrity in science, shrub-style, for you.
Don’t you mean Tus-kee-jee?
-John “Tanned and Smoking” Boehner
TexasBetsy @
37
Could we please insist on Impeachment hearings now? Impeach both – create a media crisis and before ya know it we’ll be doing the Snoopy dance for Nance!
Countless lives are counting on We the People so can we please take back what is left of our Bill of Rights?
start_beating_around_the_bush @ 175
Good Catch!
Valley Girl @ 181
Look at the recent recess appointments other than Fox–they’ve now gotten someone in the regulatory office of OMB whose history is completely anti-regulatory (as was their original pick for that office), and the guy they’re trying to get into the Consumer Protection office is a long-time lobbyist for the American Manufacturers association.
Then there’s the recent news that all rule-making–in every agency–has to be approved by the political appointee in charge, and you’ve got them all busy as bees trying to screw up every aspect of corporate control and oversight in the government.
The God in government stuff is just the trimmings–they’re all determined to undo the New Deal in its entirety… because, the Bible says so.
Terry Olson @ 185
You know, when the Kowboy was ’selected’, I thought to myself, “How bad can it be? This guy’s as dumb as a bag of hammers – he’ll be in and out like Jerry Ford, and no one will even notice.”
Could I have been more wrong? But, then again, I didn’t realize that he was a prop for plans 30 years in the making…
yellowdog jim @
191
Does it rain it Juarez?
conniptionfit- so far nothing about her age. but she is obviously old in BushCo. terms.
Bush Appointee Said to Reject Advice on Endangered Species
The Interior Department’s Inspector General has confirmed allegations that Julie MacDonald, a 2002 Bush administration appointee who now runs the Fish, Wildlife, and Parks division, tampered with the Endangered Species Act listings generated by agency scientists. This link is to the DOI report- warning- pdf.
also Systematic Interference with Science at Interior Department Exposed
GSD @ 188
Let’s see!
Valley Girl @
197
This man wants to Mengelerize our prisons for goodness sakes. Why would we expect him to care about endangered species?
Blub @ 188
Thanks ? for that info. It is really sickening. If you can find a link, I would like to follow up on this. I will check this thread tomorrow, to see if you or anyone else has further information.
Blub @ 197
Mengelerize? That sounds as if it deserves a trademark symbol….
Mengelerizing™ Get it at your nearest prison or county jail….
Valley Girl @ 200
It was just on TV. I just looked and found the segment on Pipeline (CNN’s video repository service thingy), if you subscribe to that.. According to Pipeline it was first broadcast 2/27/07 at 9:49pm.
EvilDrPuma @
61
Please, let us not insult shit.
Holy Hindenburgs, Batman!
“Oh, the humanity!”
Blub, do you have a link on the prisoner thing? That is totally bizarre. If it’s true, the dems better jump on it yesterday.
Lord Markos family grows!
BTW- “To subscribe to Integrity in Science Watch, please send an e-mail to science at cspinet dot org with your e-mail address in the subject line or in the body of the message.”
montag @ 200
Kind of like ‘Hannitizing™’.
Blub @ 201
I don’t subscribe. But I will try to see if there is a CNN transcript… or, can you?
newspaperbrat @
192
I think Soros or somebody.. or maybe one of our Dem presidential candidates, should distribute to every single American citizen a free copy of our constitution. I don’t know what’s worse. That we have a president who does what he does or that must of us just take it all in stride.
Alicia @ 195
Not to mention No Child Left Behind itself. It is a plan to have every public school fail so that private companies can come in and take over. Kinda like Walter Reed.
Terry Olson @ 205
above you, in #202. It was on Barbara Zahn’s sohw accordin to Pipeline. I don’t know how to look for a transcript.
EvilDrPuma @
97
Smile when you say that, stranger.
Terry Olson @ 198
Actually, I would prefer not to propel that picture any further.
-GSD
Has this been discussed yet on the Lake? Carl Levin is undermining Harry Reid. ANd the Celinda Lake person saying Dems should back off wrt getting out of Iraq. Jeez, hello, if we’d wanted Republicans we’d have voted for them.
Blub @ 208
Right now, the Constitution is no match for the right-wing Wurlitzer.
The RW idiots don’t read, they listen–and believe. It’s in their genes.
I’m thinking here of the editor of a Madison, WI, newspaper, who for years went out into the streets with a copy of the Declaration of Independence, saying it was a petition, and asking people to sign it. Most said it was “communist,” virtually none recognized it, and only a handful would sign it.
The Constitution is much more difficult reading….
Terry Olson @ 198
I almost hope they do – Jane can handle those clowns – and give the media whores ulcers in the bargain – while We the People get our act together and demand our congress critters impeach Boosh & Shooter.
Yes, I’ll have a double impeachment, thank you bartender and make it pronto please. Would hate to miss President’s Pelosi’s first press conference in the White House.
newtonusr @ 206
Ain’t she perdy?
HotFlash @
215
I don’t think they’re necessarily contradicting each other, to be fair. Levin said that we’re not going to cut off funding needed by the troops (presumably, meaning those troops presently in Iraq)…. sure.. they’ll need funds to fly them out of Iraq.
Blub @ 211
I assume you meant Paula Zahn. No transcript available as far as I can tell. Link to her show here.
I will try see if there is a video link.
Terry Olson @ 210
Exactly. That’s the point with every social service they want to eliminate – ruin it on a governmental level, call it a failure, and privatize. Even prisons, for God’s sake! And prop up every sorry, no-account member of the Bush family in the process.
Remember when Barbara Bush specified that her Katrina ‘donation’ be earmarked for that stupid-ass ‘educational’ software of one of her sons? “Ignite!” or something like that with an unnecessary apostrophe at the end – Bushes seem to gravitate towards those useless apostrophes.
Valley Girl @
220
Yeah, Paula. Anyway, it’ll still be on Pipeline, and there’s a way to get at Pipeline archives via the main website.. I just don’t know how. I found it again by searching for the word “prisoner” and then scrolling down the list of articles to the date 2/27.
DAMMIT. He should have let Uncle Chuck do his work.
Shit.
Terry Olson @
211
Well.. as Montag said above, the rank-and-file rethugs don’t read, so education isn’t a necessity. And it’s your fault if you have to send your kids to a public school anyway. For all we know, doing medical experiments on those kids’ll probably be their next step :P
HotFlash @ 215
Hotflash, Levin is a democrat.
Loved the video! I have felt like that often with various electrical equiptment from time to time including, but not limited to, Gas chromatographs and computers. That being said, uh, someone is gonna have to cleean up that mess…
OK, for the moment, I will allow that the man is not a science major and hates all thing that he cannot understand, but if ya don’t know where to plug a think in, doncha think ya oughta ASK someone first?
Come to think of it, isn’t this “prezdint” supposed to have majored in history? Then how come that old adage about those who don’t remember history are doomed to repeat it doesn’t apply? Does this president have CRS disease?
Blub @ 196
sure does.
Night pups.
Sweet leg-kicking dreams.
-GSD
Sign o’ the times.
Who was it who said ‘what you do to the least of mine you do to me’?
Bush’s America.
-GSD
LOL
yellowdog jim @
203
Liberty Lover @ 223
He can’t remember things he never knew….
Found the link on CNN
http://dynamic.cnn.com/apps/tp….._noads.asx
GSD @ 188
You’ve set the movement back 5 seconds, man
;>)
GSD @ 227
Monstrously lucrative civil suit – I’m sure the revamped Civil Rights Division is all over this one… Oops.
I’m sure Main Justice is all over this…
I’m sure Jeb is…
fuck.
Just when you thought it couldn’t get any better, this:
Enjoy!
So Bushie wanted set off his first H bo*b? And they didn’t let him! bwaahahaha
GSD @ 188
I understand you don’t want to broadcast this. Is this photoshop as good as what we get from our own Darkblack?
Terry Olson @ 224
I think HotFlash’s point was that Levin was acting like a Republican.
On another note, what do you guys think will happen when Bush really dies, 10, 20 years from now?
montag @ 230
I’m sure his degree was bought and paid for. The only degree bush would be able to obtain on his own would be alcohol and drug use.
Blub @
231
Woops.. slightly different version of the Zahn story.. but same info I think
DakkonA @ 235
AtlasBuggs will ask John Bolton to get her a ticket to the funeral….
Liberty Lover @ 225
Corrupted Repulsive Shit?
DakkonA @ 236
Dunno, but we’ll only be 50 years away from knowing if Iraq was a good idea.
Alicia @ 221
Sadly, yes. And that is not a blog.
tbsa @ 236
Even those I doubt he did well enough to garner a degree. Otherwise, he wouldn’t have had to take the courses over and over again until he was forty. :)
montag @
241
You’re kidding right? Pammy’ll be his last BFF.. she’ll be the only one invited.
darkblack @
42
Unless you are Michele Bachmann, then it’s Lube…
Blub @ 246
What about Harriet? Don’t forget Harriet….
Bil @ 245
I wonder if she calls Laura and hangs up…
tbsa @ 245
Fuck Harriet. Don’t forget Poland. :)
Alicia @ 246
Bet the IMs to the Oval Office are positively torrid, in a proper Xtian sort of way, of course….
Blub @ 231
Thanks, Blub. I think…
Alicia @ 248
‘Is your refrigerator running?’
;>)
darkblack @ 250
Umm, Laura’s refrigerator is always running… it’s just a little short of Freon.
montag @ 249
Poland? Don’t forget Argentina.
greenwarrior @ 252
Hum a few bars, and I’ll fake it. :)
Holy shit, Wigwam.
Remember “We’re inside the White House now”?
The Cerebrus nexus is a skein of criminal enterprise wound through the West Wing corridors…
and out the door to the Naval Observatory, the Pentagon, and A*P*C.
Cerebrus guarded the gates of Hades.
Perfect.
Time for Waxman to subpoena a bowl full of Lethe water.
Wigwam @ 234
-WIGWAM-
Immediate link, please!
Terry Olson @
258
The word “this” is a hot link.
DakkonA @ 237
So many demons – so few suitable hosts.
No worries – the Mellon foundation has several endowments to support the hosts of demons made homeless when Shrub bites the pretzel.
The less loathsome ones are pensioned off as Pox Anchors.
kirk murphy @ 257
The greater ones work for the election of the next crop of right-wingers….
Terry Olson @
165
Terry,
I just talked to someone in an old political chat room I used to go to. Real right winger. He said if we left now, Israel would use nukes on Iran or Iraq or someone.
I mean, is it ever going to occur to these people that we can’t leave ourselves unprotected because of what some country MIGHT do? We have an almost broken army. We have to see to that.
Thanks, Wigwam.
Katrina Van den Heusel on the Colbert report tomorrow night everyone. Editor of “The Nation”.
Margot @ 259
This “broken army” business has much more to do with our ability to engage in more overseas misadventure than it does with defending our own shores and our own territory. We’re now spending more, combined, on war and the Defense Dept. than ever in post-war history.
Yes, the military is broken, but in that sense only. The only real threat to us (the real us, not the “us” out there in the rest of the world that is composed of our multinational corporations) is nuclear, and we have the means to deter that threat.
This “broken” stuff is about getting even more money, and our inability to mount an effective occupation force in Iraq.
Yes, there are many, many soldiers who are hurting because of what has been done to them in Iraq, but, ultimately, this is a ruse. It’s about continuing to be an imperial force, rather than one able to defend our own territory.
montag @ 255
which one do you like better?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v…..mp;search=
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdD3MUFKleQ
Wigwam @
259
When you say hot, you really mean hot, huh Wigwam?
Did TRex have a post recently entitled “What Kind of Fuckery is This?” Apt.
greenwarrior @ 262
Sorry, YouTube and dial-up is a bad combination. I’ll take your word for it. :)
Honey!
I’m hoooome!
TRex @ 265
So, you didn’t eat the modem, after all. :)
I really SHOULD like Katrina vandahueval– but she makes me puke. Can’t help it- she’s too much for a full stomach.
TREX!!!
montag @ 269
Nah. It’s too old.
Not fresh anymore.
Man, I’m tired.
re: the prisoner expts stuff Lindsay had a post here but I don’t know if she has updated this in light of whatever Blub found on 2/27. I have emailed her. This is is an important story.
From the Sydney Morning Herald, “The World Bank’s employee organisation has questioned the promotion and pay raise of a female staffer it says is involved with bank president Paul Wolfowitz.” Probably more details will be coming out later.
montag @ 167
Not to put too fine a point on it, but the real villian of 2000 is Ralph Nader.
Remember the CNN exit polling in Florida? They asked people who self-identified as having voted for Nader who they would have voted for if Nader had not been on the ballot. The responses favored Gore about 6 to 1.
Nader got 97,000 votes in Florida. Do the math.
Yo Ralph, tell us again why we should have voted for you? Oh yeah, because there’s no real difference between Bush and Gore.
Flippin’ narcissistic idiot. How do you sleep at night?
Terry Olson @ 264
I read that too – staggering.
TRex!! Welcome home!
Ralphie represents a part of all of us- that would rather turn blue than compromise- taken to an extreme- Ralphie turns into GW Clusterfuck.
I’ve got one cat purring in my lap and the other one purring at me from the next chair.
Good to be home.
burnspbesq @ 272
Keep that up. I’m sure it will help.
Nader didn’t lose the election. Bush stole it. Look at the results of the investigation into the election. Look at the Supreme Court ruling. Look at the thousands of miscounted votes due to the butterfly ballot.
You’re looking for a scapegoat. The real villains are the Bushies.
Wolfie is said to lick the female staffer’s comb.
montag @ 266
madonna doing eva peron’s don’t cry for me argentina.
btw: i clicked on your name – where is Little Texas. I’m standin’ right here in it and Texas is a mighty big place. Takes hours and hours to get out of it going in just about any direction.
rwcole @ 276
I don’t understand why he needed to run for President. I appreciate what he does on behalf of consumers and he’s dead right about what he’s talking about, but that does not translate into Presidential material.
rwcole @ 278
But, what comes after that is more than marginally disgusting.
GreenWarrier,
The second one is best. So good! Thank you.
TRex @ 267
Out half the night, drinking and whoring…And what’s this on your collar?
;>)
greenwarrior @ 279
Little Texas is the nickname for southeastern NM. That’s where I am….
Nothing like a couple of nice kittehs to come home to!
Ralphie has always figured that if he punished the democratic party enough- they’d turn progressive–kind of a dumb idea for an otherwise smart fella.
Hi Honey. So glad you’re safely home and with working tubes.
greenwarrior @ 265
I love the second video, one of my favaritos of all time.
darkblack @ 286
I was at my mother’s.
I even went to church this morning and didn’t loudly guffaw once during the whole sermon.
montag @ 284
Volfie says “comb to me, dahlink”
Comb up and see me sometime, big boy is what he wants to hear.
punaise @ 290
“I’m all teeth, my dear….”
rwcole @ 281
Can’t wait to hear more on this one.
Suzanne @ 291
Good one!
“How comb you don’t suck my dander the way ya usedta?”
Terry Olson and lolo
i like the second one best too. and it almost helps me to not notice the mengelizing of our prisons story. it’s more than i could bear right now.
rwcole @ 295
“Whatsamatta? Can’t get yer dander up?”
Suzanne @ 293
LOL LOL LOL
montag @ 280
I know about all of that. The math is simple and inescapable: no Nader, Gore carries Florida by over 80,000 votes, a margin that no amount of Republican fuckery could have done anything about.
I don’t think that this is an appropriate topic for this blog.
montag @ 300
someone’s about to be upbraided.
TRex @ 291
…and you were probably there with a sick friend too, Hmmmm?
Whaddya take me for…Tim Russert?
;>)
greenwarrior @ 299
In college I took a class called Revolution and Social Change in Chile. Should have paid more attention since it’s a neighbor.
Valley Girl @ 303
is that comb-in-cheek?
darkblack @ 304
kewl
punaise @ 306
Absolutely.
montag @ 254,
I’m glad to hear your take on it. It really concerns me.
I think of the huge amounts of money we’re spending in Iraq, and all the things here we need to fix…infrastructure, health care, on and on.
Terry Olson @ 305
how close of a neighbor?
Valley Girl @ 303
HAAA!
burnspbesq @ 299
Look, make of it what you want. Nader was entitled to run–just like all the other third-party candidates that ran, too. I don’t see you blaming them.
It’s very simple–between the fuckery before and after the election, the election was stolen (you blame Nader for 80,000 votes, but Katherine Harris’ office obliterated 93,000 voters from the rolls, so how does that figure into the mix?).
Make of it what you will, but the election was stolen, and that’s the main problem, not Nader.
You’re looking for a scapegoat, as I said. Focus on the real criminals, will you?
Lately Wolfie’s a few teeth short of a full comb.
I have a friend who worked with Wolfie back in the mid 70s. He described him as very very smart and very very crazy, as in dangerously crazy. I’m talking end-of-the-world kind of crazy.
Wolfie is head and shoulders above that.
Suzanne @ 315
and you can take that to the bank.
Stoopid at any speed.
Wolfie been suckin the chrome off a trailer comb.
Suzanne, smokin’!
OK, Breck it up.
“Just as well it didn’t happen. It would be too much trouble maintaining some semblance of decorum.”
No. By the principle of contagion, it would have been impossible to maintain any semblance of decorum.
Suzanne @ 315
Bit of a gossip, though…He tells two friends, and they tell two friends, and so on…
Okay, I’m pretty tough and all, but this comb-sucking thing is really starting to squick me out.
Margot @ 307
Yeah, I know it’s a tough one to work through, but, apart from the ancillary role of the National Guard as being available for regional emergencies, it’s all about the military’s ability to continue to fight foreign wars. I’m kind of sensitive to that, because it has nothing to do with the defense of us and ours.
The Dept. of Defense is actually now the Dept. of Offense, and has been for several decades. The National Guard has always been given the active military’s cast-off equipment and has been less prepared to fight overseas. Now that they’ve been impressed into that role, it makes it harder to assess the real damage.
But, strategically, the only way we’re in real danger is from ICBMs. Even terrorism is manageable and containable–if we weren’t always fuckin’ around in someone else’s backyard….
Nite all, with hugs to Suz and montag and Punaise
Sorry, TRex. I forgot about the don’t ask don’t prell policy.
Valley Girl @ 323
G’night, VG. Be well.
nite vg, sleep well :)
Wolfie got hair lice-
Valley Girl @ 326
night night
Suzanne @ 324
Umm, that policy is already Breck-en.
Nite again. Above edited to include Punaise and lolo.
‘nite VG and all…
burnspbesq @
275
OK…. when our 8 year nightmare is finally over, the villains are in jail or Paraguay, please please please tell me we get to tar and feather this little man?
TRex @ 324
Please define squick. Is it pleasurable?
Night, Valley Girl.
Blub @ 332
Fer chrissakes, he’s not the enemy. When are you guys going to accept that Gore ran an atrocious campaign, Lieberman sold Gore out the day after the election, and the corrupt, evil bastards in the GOP did everything to subvert the election in Florida, and the goddamned Supreme Court–including the sainted Sandra O’Connor–handed the fucking election–illegally–to George W. Bush.
Nader isn’t at fault here. George W. Bush, his father, his supporters, his enablers, and his brother subverted the election.
Period.
Montag,
Are you a left coaster like me?
Terry Olson @ 336
Not really. Well inland….
http://www.urbandictionary.com…..erm=squick
SQUICK
lolo @ 341
Thanks, lolo. Time for your midnight snack? What will it be tonight?
Cerebrus guards the gates of Hades?
What better hiding place for the Bushies and their megacrop masters.
Too bad they privatized the guard dog handlers.
Cerebrus is a loser.
The Italian partisans knew about storming the gates of Hell.
note – the above link takes you to a free Chumawamba download.
In memory of Carlo Giuliani, murdered July 20, 2001 in Genoa, Italy by the Carabinieri during Global Justice Protests against the G-8 meeting.
OK – time to feed drugged honeycakes and Lethe water to the Cerebrus crowd.
Shake the Gates of Hell open – and stomp the creatures wriggling in the dark corners.
Before they can stomp us again.
Terry Olson @ 342
I had an apple and some chicken.
Trex -
Welcome home. YGM
montag @ 331
hope we’re not being nit-picky…
I need to eat something and go to bed. Hello, Easter left-overs! There was one slice of coconut cake left and I got it.
I grated enough coconut last night. I think I earned my right to that piece of cake.
Good night, everybody.
Happy Beaster!
petedownunder,
Do you really live in Australia?
Night T.
Kirk, next time you head down to the Santa Cruz mountains, check out the Caio Bella restaurant in Ben Lommond.
montag @
338
Oh yes, you’re absolutely correct on all points, Montag. But at a more emotional level, I still want to see him tarred… I’ll forgo the feathering :)
Here’s an article on cleaning up the quality of online discourse:
Hope our discourse is acceptable!
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04…..og.html?hp
That’s it for me tonight, folks. G’nite all.
Suzanne @
350
Thanks, Suzanne – I will.
I hope the spring has brought you many prospects and the realty deities have smiled upon you.
G’nite and sleep well, Suzanne –
I’m off to bed myself (after I hear Bella Ciao one last time).
Mmmmmmmm.
Coconut cake.
Blub @ 347
Then your emotions are misplaced in their direction–if the facts point to the Bushies, then they should be the object of your animosity.
Look, I know Nader was likely delusional in thinking he could win, but let’s look at the facts, such as they are. Most everyone here hates the DLC for being in the pocket of big business. Gore was a founding member, as was Lieberman, and they ran on those reputations until Gore realized he got no traction from that–and that realization came way late in the game. Lieberman continued to be the high-mucky-muck of corporate toadyism, a role he retains today.
Nader was saying, in essence, oligarchy is the problem. Unrestricted, unregulated corporations are the problem. Both the candidates are bending over for big business. And, in many ways, that was true.
Was that wrong? Not hardly, and not by a long shot. That straightforwardness appealed to some voters.
But, ultimately, Nader did not decide the election–the interference of the Bushies and a corrupt Supreme Court accomplished the ends desired. There’s ample evidence that the Bushies got what they wanted, not by honest effort, but, rather, by subterfuge.
Are you ruled by your head, or by your gut–as is George Bush?
Montag, please be nice to Blub!
My question is regarding Gore choosing Liebermann as a running mate. That was really stupid.
Also, why did Obama go help Liebermann last election cycle? That might come back to bite him except that so did Bill Clinton. What’s Liebermann got that I don’t know about?
montag @
356
I guess my problem is that after the election he didn’t fight enough for Gore or at least rally his troops around the stealing of an election… As a bona fide candidate.. and a stakeholder in the election, I felt it was his responsibility to speak up about how the process was subverted. The Greens should’ve been on the Supreme Court steps demanding Scalia’s head. If he came out and said that he believed that the election was stolen I missed it. Of course, Gore didn’t fight either, and he can legitimately be faultd for that, but at least, years later, he said what needed to be said. As far as I know, Nader’s never once said what needed to be said.
Terry Olson @
357
another reason why it would be hard for me to support Obama.
i wonder how many contributions that got him and what the sources were …..
Terry Olson @ 353
Umm, I am doing that. If logic hurts, then, I’m guilty of inflicting that kind of pain….
Your question is a different one from that previously. My feeling is that Gore’s choice of Lieberman as a running mate was a calculated one made by both Gore and his advisors. Clinton was viewed as suspect, and Lieberman had not only endorsed Tipper’s war on the music/video industry, but had also been the first Democrat to stand up in the well of the Senate and demand Clinton’s impeachment. Lieberman was a moralistic little sod, and Gore and his advisors saw moralistic as moral–they are worlds apart logically, but not politically. I’m sure that Gore and his advisors thought that move would serve to distance them all from Clinton, and that was an incredibly stupid thing to do. They misjudged public opinion and the times, and they paid for it, dearly.
Well, that’s this election, not 2000.
Obama was “assigned” to Lieberman as a new senator–Lieberman was supposed to help Obama learn “the ropes.” Obama was likely comfortable with that, in that he’s as moralistic, in different ways, as Lieberman. If he wasn’t comfortable with it, I’m sure could have told Lieberman to piss up a rope, but he didn’t. It’s one more reason I don’t trust Obama to do the right thing, regardless of what he says….
Cheers.
Must be Liebermann’s good looks.
I think it may be useful to put my comment in 358 in context. I remember being at the Dem gathering place that night-morning… people were sobbing and outraged, not just because they were concerned that Gore was going to lose but because of the consequences for this country. For the right to choose, for social justice, for a thousand issues-based reasons… they were genuinely scared to death. Yes, corporate corruption was an important issue, but it wasn’t the only issue. People were terrified.. and they had a right to be. And, as it turns out, they were absolutely correct to be scared shiteless.
And all Nader had to say that night was: “Well, you can’t spoil a system spoiled to the core.” OK, fine. He’s right. But as a stakeholder in that election, he had a responsibility to say more. So did Gore. Gore eventually did, altough it took him years.. Nader, never.
Terry Olson @ 348
As he hasn’t responded I’ll answer for him, yes Pete is an expat American who lives in Brisbane with his Aussie fiance. There are quite a few of us Aussies who regularly visit FDL.
Man, I’ve got to get to Australia. I have never had the pleasure.
montag @
338
Nader’s campaign helped Bush, inadvertently or not. he had the right analysis but the wrong strategy. it’s a paradox but, Nader brought about something he has to regret. we will never know for sure because we don’t know if the voters who supported Nader would have voted for Gore or Bush or just stayed at home. The vote was so close, though, that it clearly made a difference, just in Florida alone…
that said, Gore ran a hapless campaign. his campaign staff were inept, and Gore knew it. i think that’s why he took as long as he did to come around. he knew he’d screwed up.
Blub @ 354
Well, first, would it have made a difference? Second, if Nader thought Gore/Lieberman just another example of the same problem, would he see any reason to defend them?
After all, Bush was an unknown. Nader wasn’t affiliated with either party in the contest, for reasons previously described. He was, basically, out of it at that point.
All considerations to that end ignore the reality, still. If the contest–after the election–were between the Dems and the `pugs, why didn’t the Dems bring in the big guns to defend their position? Why should you castigate Nader for not doing so when the Dems didn’t–and when Lieberman himself told the Dems they should lay down and die and accept the results?
There’s a very strong desire, still, to seek out scapegoats, rather than admit that serious mistakes were made in the campaign by the Dems, that the whole of Florida was gamed by the `pugs (by Bush’s fucking brother, fer gawd’s sake!), and that the Supreme Court diddled the country in broad daylight.
It’s too easy to blame Nader for all that, especially when the blame lies elsewhere….
Blub @ 358
He’s right, and you still blame him, and not the perpetrators of the spoilage. Why?
Terry Olson @ 364
Well c’mon down! Though you might want to wait until we vote out our fascist, Bush-loving government later this year. I hope.
montag @
367
Oh, I do blame the perpetrators much more than I blame him, but he should’ve joined the lawsuit or at least spoken up rigorously about the theft of the election. Yes, the system was spoiled, but to just stand by and let the greatest act of treasonous fraud in American history occur just to make a point is the height of civic irresponsibility. I don’t blame him for his role in the election at all.. I think he’s scum for what he did after the election.
Okay. Simple question: did Nader rig the vote in FLorida, or did someone else?
Who’s responsible for that rigging? Bushies, or Nader?
The answer to that gives you the answer to the problem in Florida in 2000.
Kirk Murphy @343
I didn’t know what Lethe water was, so I wikied it and here are the first coupla lines:
In Classical Greek, Lethe (λήθη; LEE-thee) literally means “forgetfulness” or “concealment”. The Greek word for “truth” is a-lethe-ia (αλήθεια), meaning “un-forgetfulness” or “un-concealment”.
Which I find interesting in the context of the forgetfulness of our public servants…that is that it is interchangeable with concealment and its opposite is truth.
montag @
370
Again, that’s not the point or at least not my point… he failed to act afterwards, and just made the same points about corporate corruption he made during his campaign, after it, over and over again. At that point, he had a moral responsibility to stand by Gore, join the lawsuit and demand that the recounts be allowed to continue. The fact that he didn’t, and, instead, made a series of inane and self-surviving speeches that basically said “oh,. it’s not my fault” over and over again, puts him well into Lieberman territory, IMO.
Sorry, but I think we’ll just have to agree to disagree on Nader :)… I have the greatest respect for the point you made, but I think our differences about Nader are due to his behavior from two different periods.
Terry Olson @ 346
Terry – I really do. I’m in Brisbane, Qld. I’m a yank semi-expat, I spend about two weeks of every eight in Northern Calif.
Sorry to be slow to reply, I’ve got work I’m behind on.
i have no quarrel with you about what the Republicans did. Nader had nothing to do with that.
But there is a limit to what can be stolen in an election. If Gore had had the votes that went to Nader it would have been more difficult for the thievery and fuckery to have succeeded, and that would have made a difference.
[Modnote: you guys are giving the Margin Faerie a headache.]
Blub @ 365
Still looking for a scapegoat after all the evidence, I see.
You now blame Nader for not defending the Dems in their post-election problems, instead of looking at the real problems. Why should he? Would the Dems have accepted his help had he offered it? No, of course not–he was anathema to both major parties.
You can defend this view forever, but, by doing so, you will never get at the real nub of the problem. That’s what scapegoats are for–avoiding the obvious–diverting attention from the obvious.
petedownunder @ 373
Sheesh, you must have billions of freequent flyer points if you fly back and forth every 2 months.
montag @
375
I think you’re misunderstanding me here.. I blame shrub and his followers for the crime. I blame Nader, Lieberman, segments of the Democratic Party, and a lot of other people for acquiescing to it, after the fact, for their own reasons. The treason was the greater crime.. allowing it to flourish, the lesser.. but it’s still despicable.
fahrender @ 370
If Gore had the “Jews for Buchanan” votes (which were quite suspect), Gore would have won easily, too. Nobody’s mentioning those.
((Waives to persiflage))- thanks for filling in for me, I have to teach a class in Sydney Wednesday and it’s already Monday night and the lecture notes aren’t done and I’m at the Lake when I should be working and so I go back and forth between the notes and the Lake. Now back to work.
Terry – Oz is really cool, come see the place. Brisbane is a lovely town, not much for tourists to do here, but great beaches an hour or two both north and south, and the late Steve Irwin’s Australia Zoo is an hour away.
persiflage @ 374
Sheesh, you must have billions of freequent flyer points if you fly back and forth every 2 months.
I think I have enough for a ticket to Saturn. But I use them for upgrades to biz class, and bring my mum out at Christmas.
Help – How do I fix the underlining?
[The Mod never sleeps. Well almost never.]
persiflage @ 368
Heaven help you. And us! Let’s keep in touch here on FDL. I visit you, and you visit here in San Diego County.
Watch the freaking margins. Whatever that means.
montag:
i agree with a lot of nader’s ideas but the most that third parties have ever done in this country is to serve as a spoiler. and that can happen again in ‘08.
politics, as you know, is the art of the possible. anybody that runs a third party campaign must address the issue: who are we going to knock out? anybody that says they think otherwise is being disingenuous.
montag @ 378
equally true. i’ve no quarrel with that either.
Blub @ 373
But, you place the greater blame on Nader.
Look, please. Look up the definition of “scapegoat,” then get back to me.
You’re blaming someone who exercised his right to run, and attracted some voters in the process. That is both legal and proper under the Constitution. At each demonstration of the facts, you’ve still chosen to blame Nader for exercising that Constitutional right. You’ve ignored the obvious, you’ve downplayed the larger effects of corruption, of familial interference, of the corruption of the Supreme Court in the process. You’ve sought to place blame where it does not belong. You’ve not mentioned the dozens of other third parties to the election, anyone of which’s absence would have demonstrably affected the results.
You want to believe that Nader caused it. He did not. That is a fact. Gore won, by about 512 votes, according to the results of the post-election investigation, which the very newspapers paying for that investigation downplayed–a year after the election.
That’s the bottom line. Gore won. Therefore, Nader did not cause him to lose. That is simple logic. Other forces prevented Gore from assuming the presidency. Among those forces, Nader is completely absent, but you still choose to blame him.
Nothing more I can say on the matter.
Man! I just got through reading that link about Cerberus IAP, etc. That thing’s like the Unified Field Theory of Republican Fuckery!
Terry Olson @
383
sorry, Terry. for me, ziggurats are irresistable …..
[Modnote: yellow card to fahrender]
night all. it’s been real, same as it ever was. fahr has to git to work.
Terry Olson @ 381
Let’s do that. I live a long way from Pete. If you imagine a map of Australia Pete is about half way up on the east coast, I’m in Perth, about a quarter from the bottom of the West Coast. I have a wonderful friend who lived in San Diego but now lives in Florida because his wife, who worked at the San Diego Zoo, was headhunted by Disney and now is in charge of the Primate Section of Disney’s Animal Kingdom. He always raved about how wonderful San Diego is so it’s already on my list of Must-Visit places. Now I have another reason to pitch for a US holiday.
fahrender @ 380
No one complained about Ross Perot’s third-party runs in 1992 and 1996, did they?
Why? Because Clinton won.
Had Clinton lost because of the same skulduggery exhibited in 2000, would there be the same venom exhibited–six years later–as towards Nader now? I wonder.
montag @
386
Yep. He did, and it’s a fact. And by refusing to acknowledge that fact after the election, as a stakeholder in the process, Nader acquiesced to the crime… he became, in my opinion, an accomplice to it.
Legally, you’re right, Nader had no obligation to fight the good fight after election day, but morally he did. Therefore he’s just as much to blame as Lieberman and a host of others after the election. Let me repeat, shrub and his followers committed the crime. Nader and others let it happen without even having the decency to speak out in acknowledgement of the bare facts of that election.
Why am I arguing this point? Because I think this is the exact same issue some Dems have in Congress now, with the war and speaking out of both sides of their (cowardly) mouths.. their obligation.. or obligation.. does not end with the law or our obligations under it. What people like Nader let shrub do after the election in Florida (not before) is exactly what Biden, Landrieu and a ton of others in Congress would have our party do with the president’s intransigence now.
rxbusa @ 386
Oh, yeah. That will be something to look for. I see Waxman or someone equally competent in the future on this guy.
petedownunder @ 380
Pete, This happened to me once. I think if the text is highlighted when you quoted someone, this is what happens. But heck, that’s just a marginal guess. (Not to alert the margin faries.)
[The Margin Faerie thinks petedownunder might have backspaced over something necessary at the beginning of his comment.]
montag @
391
More, I’d say. If Clinton did what Nader et al did after that election, I’d be the first to burn him in effigy over and over again. But he didn’t, and Nader’s no less culpable. Once again, I am not saying that Nader was a spoiler. I’m saying he was a self-serving coward, beginning the day after election day and all the way until the present time.
Terry Olson @ 392
I do hope so …and soon! None of this can happen fast enuf to suit me. I feel like I’m holding my breath and biting my fingernails all the time.
Ready to see the bad guys “brought to justice” as W likes to say (but appears not to know what it means).
too bad about that electrical plug in the hydrogen car. Coulda propelled the Heart of Gold into another universe with the improbability factor on that one!
Persiflage, Yes, yes!
Persiflage – I just realized I’ll be in Perth 29 June, perhaps an FDL coffee meet up if you have time.
Bingo, Blub @ 391.
montag @
391
but that’s part of my argument. Perot helped Clinton to win. he sure didn’t help Bush the father. i don’t mean to demonize Nader, but i do say that his campaign helped to put Fuckwad on the throne. no more, no less. just like Perot’s campaign helped Clinton.
third parties are spoilers. that’s what they do, whatever their intentions. if the outcome proves bad for the country then the spoiler gets some of the blame. it doesn’t matter what her/his intentions were. Nader enabled the election of the worst president the US has ever had. little wonder that some people are really pissed about that.
that said, i’m about what happens next. that was then, this is now. we need progressive discipline and we need to get focused on this week and also what happens in ‘08:
IMPEACH BUSH FOR BLOWING THE JOB (thanks for that, “Freeway”, alias ScarletP).
I’m still for Russ Feingold. but, being the political slut that i am, i will vote for the Democratic Party nominee, and that includes the possibilites of Hillary or Joe Biden (Lord, forgive me, and i do know what i do). after Russ i favor John Edwards or Al Gore.
may i make a plea for being for people rather than against them. choose you candidate and work for them. don’t give the Republican Nazi Party ammunition by taking swipes at other Democrats (we won’t include a certain Senator from AIP*C as a member of the party)
now i really am going to work ….
petedownunder @ 397
Where’s Perth?
Blub @ 388
You’re blaming Nader for everything that Bush has done, and the Dems have acquiesced in.
Nader didn’t “let” Bush do what he did in Florida. He wasn’t a party to what happened after the election. He was out of it. Period.
It was not his fight at that point. It was the Dems.
You keep blaming the wrong people–or person.
That’s little more than denial. If you can’t get past denial, then you’ll never get to acceptance.
Jaysus, why is this so hard to understand? Bush stole the fucking election! Nader had nothing to do with that. Nader had nothing to do with Gore picking Lieberman. Nader had nothing to do with the lame-ass performance of the Gore people after the election. Nader had nothing to do with the DLC-dominant campaign that Gore ran for 5/6ths of the campaign period. Nader had nothing to do with Harris’ purge of 93,000 fucking voters from the rolls on suspect criteria. Nader had nothing to do with Jebby getting his cousin to call the election early for Dubya.
You will find a way to blame Nader for something, no matter what. But, in doing so, you’re denying the obvious.
You still want a scapegoat. You still need one, for some reason, why, I don’t know. I don’t.
Cheers.
Terry Olson @ 398
A question many of us on east coast often ask – it’s out there somewhere. Australia is very large (about the same as the US except AK) but only 20 million folks. So imagine you went from the east coast of the US to the west coast and the only thing there, from Mexico to Canada was a city about the size of Fresno. Put Fresno on the coast and pretty it up a bit, and give a heap more money and that’s Perth.
Nevermind. On the west coast. I’ll check a map.
Terry Olson @ 401
Look on the lower left hand corner, about 8:00.
Petedownunder,
You’re starting to make it sound like a real estate investment!
Nader’s post-election speech:
http://www.workingforchange.co…..temid=9178
speech summary: thanks to my campaign team, two party system bad, Dems, Rethugs equally bad, yadayadayada, Bush and Gore both ran lousy campaigns, corporate corruption bad, yadayada, I’m not a spoiler ’cause the system was already spoiled.
OK.. for him to say that there is moral equivalence between stealing an election (rethugs) and running a bad campaign (dems) is pathetic and just wrong. The former is treason. The latter is inanity. They are not equivalent. And to say that corporate corruption is just as bad as the treason of rigging an election is unforgivable.
The speech he should have given: “I fought this campaign because the other candidates were not saying what needed to said about the direction of this country, but now that it is over, I must speak out. President-elect Gore won the election. Mr Bush and his colleagues are trying to steal that election from Mr Gore. However much I disagree with both men, this is just wrong, and it must be stopped. Let me say this: Al Gore won this election. George W Bush is attempting to steal that victory from him. I stand with the president-elect and will help him fight for what he is due.”
The fact that he’s never said that much is as unpardonable as the man who ignores a burning building with people in it.. or, for that matter, as a senator who lets a president get away with continuing to wage an illegal war ’cause the senator’s afraid of losing the next election.
If we expect our party to stop shrub now and stop failing in their responsibility to stand up to the president, then we have to hold the Naders of the world to account for what they FAILED to do in December, 2000. This has NOTHING to do with scapegoats, Montag.
petedownunder @ 398
That would be excellent. I’ll definitely find time. You can email me at persiflage at bigpond dot com.
Blub @ 403
You go on believing that. You want–and need–a scapegoat.
Everything Nader said that night was true. Look at it today. The press is gauging the suitability of the candidates on how much money they’ve raised–little mention of the most important issues. That’s what Nader said that night, and exactly the same is true today–even more so.
Not one major candidate in this election cycle has said anything about serious election financing reform to date. Not one, from either party.
Not a single one.
Big money still dominates the election process in this country–that means that the fatcats and the corporations they own get, in effect, more votes than you or me.
As best as I can figure out, you’re okay with that, as long as it’s the Democrats being corrupted by that system.
Blub @ 406
I would agree, Blub. You know more about these events than I do, and I appreciate your letting us know this info. I knew it, but never really processed it. At the time it just seemed chaddey, and I didn’t understand all of the criminality.
Not to piss you off, Montag, you add lots to the dialog too.
montag @
402
That’s exactly the point. What shrub was allowed to do in 2000 and get away with is NOT a Dem fight or problem. It’s the problem of every American who isn’t a craven rethug wingnut. And, as the third candidate, for ANY party, Nader had a responsibliity, even greater than the responsibility of any American, at that point to do something about it.
I should add that I wasn’t a registered Dem at the time, and I had voted republican in several elections before that (yeah yeah, I’ve seen the light now… :) ). I just hated and feared everything that shrub stood for. Are you saying that it wasn’t my fight either? Or yours? Or Nader’s.
Only Nader had a national audience, and I didn’t. Neither did you, and most other FDLers, I presume. He failed to use that national audience to do what any responsible citizen, much less a candidate, should’ve done in the face of craven misconduct from the shrub camp. He didn’t do it, and he has to be considered responsible for that much. Again, this is nothing to do with scapegoats.
It’s to do with the abrogation of civic responsibility by our public figures.. and it matters not at all whether that public figure’s name is Ralph Nader, Rahm Emmanuel, John McCain, Stenny Hoyer, Joe Lieberman (although the pathology there probably runs deeper), Joe Biden or Arlen Spector…. all people who seem content to hide behind demagoguery and doubletalk when the real criminals steal the horses, burn down the barn and salt the land that it sat on.
Nader could have thrown his weight and votes.
on that note, I bid you all adieu. … thanks for a great discussion, all of you :)
persiflage – YGM
Night, Blub. And why did you choose that handle?
Blub @ 411
Wow. To put Nader’s name in that list and accuse him of double-talk is a really wrong. Here’s a guy that has fought for the “little man” for over 30 years, and has delivered real, tangible changes to our society that protect the most vulnerable. Any liberal should have nothing but praise for him.
Imus is apologizing for his statement about the Rutger’s Women’s Basketball Team. At 7 he is going to provide “context” for his comments.
Good morning, pups. Raven, you are a brave one to be able to listen to Imus! Today in the NYT Bob Herbert writes on turning 6 year olds into felons, and Paul Krugman says the Right Wing Noise Machine has returned to its roots.
http://mgpaquin.wordpress.com/
Coffee and tea are ready, and I had a hankering for corn muffins. Help yourselves, and have a good day even if it is Monday.
Marion in Savannah @
418
I know it’s not going to be popular here and that’s OK. I thought he might just go off and tell people he didn’t give a damn what anyone thought. He is beyond contrite, it seems to me he is truly sorry for what he said and concerned for the Rutgers womens and their families.
Jesus, lighten up, Montag.
The Bushies took advantage of a situation created by those nincompoops who voted for Nader in Florida (and New Hampshire), which made the vote close enough for them to steal. The Nader votes are absolutes — we know what they are and they represent a huge enough margin that Florida’s electoral votes would have never been in play, REGARDLESS of the confused Jewish voters and the ex-felon purge and Katherine Harris as SOS.
Even if Gore ran a perfect campaign and the same people still voted for Nader, the situation still would have been ripe for the Bushies to steal.
I have read that Nader felt snubbed by the Democrats (including Gore), going back to the Carter administration, and that is one reason he is so down on the Dems, which he dresses up in his anti-corporatism. To me, he is a political adversary no different than the nuttiest of the wingnuts and those who voted for him deserve everything that the Bushies have dumped on this country. And they made us all pay for their exercise of poor judgment and their failure to recognize that ELECTIONS HAVE (sometimes adverse) CONSEQUENCES!!!
Hi, raven; hi, Marion; hi, twolf (I know you’re out there *g*) -
Gaaaakkkk, what a night! I had the two most grotesque nightmares (of the mouse on a treadmill…….”help! I can’t get off” variety) & feel like it would be a good idea never to go to sleep again.
Yes, please, Marion……..a nice hot muffin and some tea would go down quite nicely about now.
Good morning everyone. Marion, thanks for the Krugman and Rich. I wonder if either of them realizes just how fast they went from being household names to fond memories?
Mornin
G’s in Roosia, no?
Mornin’ all!
waccamaw – you caught me, I was lurking.
Hehe.. sitll not asleep yet.
bonkers @
416
For me this has nothing to do with the “little guy” or Nader’s support for him, or his past deeds… (truth in advertising: I freely admit that I dislike Nader for a lot of reasons, since the 80s actually), but in this case, the similarity with that list of names isn’t that they are alike ideologically.. it’s about the decisions he chose to make at a critical time in history.. when he could have made a difference and, because of whatever reason goodness knows, chose not to.. chose, like all those other people choose every day in Congress now, to stand aside, and let bad things be done.
Look, I’m a liberal and a progressive, but I can’t abide Nader’s attitude after 2000, and his apparent position that there is some type of perverse moral equivalence between Democratic lack of courage and Rethug depravity. These just aren’t the same thing.. or even part of the same sickness. For him to argue that there is, puts him squarely in the Specter/Hoyer league of good men who, to paraphrase Yeats, lack all conviction, while the worst (shrub & co) are endowed with passionate intensity (sorry Yeats). He can say he’s for the little man all he wants, but the center still won’t hold.
raven @
417
Contrite Don Imus: ‘I’m a good person‘
good morning, Marion, Maggie, Raven….
back from a short stint at work. i have to go back soon.
i’ll repeat my belief about third party candidates in America:
they are spoilers, in effect if not intent.
it would be good if they could be more than that, but i have never seen it happen. Nader claimed that he wasn’t a spoiler.
if he genuinely believed that then he was deluding himself. he’s much too intelligent not to come to the realization by now that he did, in fact, enable the Republicans to win.
whether he admits it or not is another matter.
Maggie, i will be less harsh than you on the people who voted for Nader in ‘00. many of them have changed their perspective since that time. i personally know a few of them. one is a niece of mine. people do change, even some Republicans.
when Ralph Nader got so down on the Democrats Howard Dean hadn’t come to the position he has now. i think Howard has made some important changes in how things can work for us. i don’t know Nader’s view of what seems to be happening but maybe he will wake up to it. Meanwhile, the rest of us need to keep Howard’s back and see that things keep the momentum moving in the direction of a citizen’s America instead of what we still have now.
‘B.C.’ cartoonist Johnny Hart dies at storyboard
twolf1 @ 426
Same ol’ same ol’ SNAFU. i think the context he provided didn’t make him look a bit better.
We’re not talking about whether or not Ol’ Donnie has any redeeming qualities or not. Hitler professed to like dogs and children. Imus is one arrogant f-ck and he blew it. Some people would get fired for this. What about it, CBS?
That’s too bad about Johnny Hart. I enjoyed BC.
Thanks for the Imus link, raven. I had no idea what the controversy was because I avoid “scream radio/tv” like the plague spot it is. It’s amazing what people consider a “joke” nowadays, isn’t it?
marion,
that was twolf1 that provided the link…..
Guess who said this:
answer is here
Well, I thought it was gonna be OT, but not so, I guess.
Imus sounds desperate. Frankly, the joke about the Rutgers bb team was nothing out of the ordinary. The segment that got me to stop listening for quite a long time involved interviews in Harlem at 7 in the morning where Bernard was giving out 40 ounce malt liquor bottles to people who were being interviewed.
My guess is that he’s become radioactive to his guests–especially sitting senators–over his “nappy-headed hos” comment.
The excuse he’s giving is that they make fun of everybody, including Imus himself. This is, of course, completely absurd. Racist content is central to the program and always has been.
Ipus has a thirty year history of racist bigoted remarks…just google Imus and racist and let the fun begin…after all it’s all a big joke
be sure to write NBC and GE and let them know airing racists is not acceptable
And now he’s claiming this isn’t part of a pattern of behavior–and even worse, he’s saying he didn’t say some of the things he’s being accused of saying.
But, of course, he mostly hands those lines to Bernard.
The idea that this guy is really a lovely man who made a stupid mistake, as McCord just said, is ridiculous.
katherine graham cracker @ 435
That would be CBS. The MSNBC component of his audience is trivial.
I guess Imus could still have Michael Richards and Mel Gibson on his show.
twolf1 @ 438
It’ll be interesting to see what happens. I do listen because of the people he gets on, and he does speak more frankly to them than pretty much any other interviewer. He also sucks up more than pretty much any other interviewer, so it’s hard to know what you’ll get.
He had Kerry on last week, and the conversation was quite interesting. He’s also a consistent supplier of the current
RepublicanBeltway talking points.Now Howard Fineman is running out the “good person” defense.
CBS ok but don’t leave out the NBC and MSNBC
Fineman was confronted by someone who wanted to know whether he was going to refuse to go on. “We all make mistakes. This was a big one….I know you well enough that you’ll do what you can to make it right.”
Some of the stuff you used to do, you can’t do anymore….Barack Obama has twice the number of the contributors than anyone else in the race. You can’t make the same jokes anymore.”
So, Fineman is saying that racism used to be okay, but isn’t now.
“A context and proportionality to what I do is crucial.” says Imus.
“This is a teaching moment” says Fineman.
“Les Monves knows I’m not a bad person.”
Howard Fineman is a liar and fraud
His reporting on the 2004 campaign in Ohio was done from the Board Room of the Timken Roller Bearing Company and he repeated Shrubco lies
But now he says what nobody else will say:
“Is this surge [in Iraq] just some sort of a dog and pony show?”
That’s right, all of you were born perfect, what sanctimonious bullshit.
He’s going to be on an Al Sharpton radio show this afternoon, he says. Not broadcast here in NYC.
Sharpton has called for him to be fired.
His claim of being a “good person” is bizarre. He’s the classic example of an out of touch, extremely rich individual–the kind of guy who refused to fly commercial (literally).
jayackroyd @ 444
people have been saying that for a long time
Howard the Duck is usually the last to know
A lot of people have said including Joke Klein that the surge would give the illusion of change…
jayackroyd @ 446
Yea, especially when he take his Net Jet to pick up a sick kid in Atlanta and take him to New York, the pig.
The Ipus charity ranch is a big fraud. EVen has the Spitzer report cleared him of illegalities they did point out the costs were out of whack –five times the cost one fifth the good of the Paul Newman charity he copied.
As for picking up sick kids –bfd and it allows he to write off the otherwise personal trip
and Ipus apologist –geeeze
Ipus was going to sue over the stories about the ranch…but never did because they were all true
katherine graham cracker @ 448
And he sends cut out dolls of himself to their funerals too.
katherine graham cracker @ 449
That’s my view. For example, it’s hard to understand how a state of the art radio studio is essential to helping kids with cancer.
My father (RIP) was in many ways a lot like Don Imus.
He was a racist (as was his mother) who on an individual level was color blind.
By this I mean he was the opposite of today’s conservatives. He could vote a straight Republican ticket, make disparaging comments about ‘welfare queens’ and insult my (non wasp) wife.
There were times when I despised him.
But I can remember many individual acts of charity and kindness which were not tax deductable.
Everyone who knew him would tell you he was a good guy (in the end, even my wife).
But that generational cultural racisim was inexcusable. In a private person, only the closest friends and family have to deal with it.
For a public person, the bar is higher.
Being a ‘good person’ is insufficient – your words and deeds must match – and in a positive sense.
jayackroyd @
452
You are right, It’s not MSNBC’s studio that he constantly ridicules himself for beiing ridiculous.
good mornin’ gang -
raven- absolutely not perfect but I am indeed enjoying the hell out of watching this racist goon forced to roll around in his own puke
I pray to goodness Sharpton brings up the Gwen Ifill comment and other ‘bad things’ spouted by this ‘ good person’ in the past
there are far too many folks walking around thinking everything is hunky dory b/c they don’t burn crosses or use the n word in polite company
anyone tempted to feel sorry for this Lamont bashing git only has to imagine what ol Imus and Bernie would be sayin’ if Charles Barkley had commented about some “corn fed crackers” playin’ in the title game
Just caught a bit of Fineman talking with Imus, and then Imus after. This is a toughie, isn’t it. McGuirk and Dietl are the far end of outrage on this show and their statements I find hold genuine malice from time to time, but it’s Imus’ show, and the responsibility for this incident rests with him. And he acknowledges “I made a mistake.” “I’m apologizing and asking for forgiveness for what I did.”
He owns his screwup…unlike the bullsh*t way Russert and Hatch reacted to Hatch’s genuine malice toward Carole Lam on Meet The Press. This contrast too is a teaching moment.
Imus is obviously chastened. And soul searching. And my first thought when I heard about the Rutgers incident seems to be hitting him hard…namely, would he talk this way with/about the kids he works so hard to help.
You gotta be fair, he says. And mentions the camp and his outspokenness about Katrina. He talks about a teaching moment.
And I agree. He’s owning his mistake. Unlike a certain president we could mention. How this will all shake out is yet to be determined. Probably in large measure by places like this.
Fineman summed things up pretty well. I think it’ll be worth your listening, but you can search out the link for yourself at wfan.com. Because we all need to match our actions to our words.
I stayed here even though I wasn’t thrilled with a certain blackface photo. Sometimes we screw up. Bigtime. It’s how we handle our screwups that matters. And that’s playing out for Imus. He’s the first to say he’s not trying to weasel out or excuse what happened.
The contrast he presents to Hatch/Russert and Bush is a teaching moment.
I’ll keep watching.
Terry Olson @
27
This would be an interesting investigation for Waxman. Someone from the committee staff ought to interview Murphy and see what there is to it.
Where’s that new thread!
Scarecrow upstairs.
rxbusa @ 387
I think that diary neglected to mention that IAP also had the Katrina-cleanup contract, on which they’ve not performed particularly well.
Ouch! lotta vitriole on the morning side of this thread.
I just hope nobody becomes that which they accuse others of being. That’s so Bush-league…leave it to those other guys.
Back to hydrogen, something is very fishy here. I can not believe one can blow up a hydrogen fuel-cell hybrid (Focus, presumably) with an extension cord. Ford is just not THAT much dumber than say Toyota. And the average American is not THAT much smarter or well informed than the WH idiot. I googled a bit and couldn’t find anything about the fueling/charging process for the hydrogen adapted Focus (apparently there are about 5 actually running on the streets). Was this maybe ignorance on the part of the Ford CEO? It’s not like our national media actual check anything they’re told. Anybody has info or sources(like an engineer friend who works for Ford), I’m betting there’s more to this story than we’ve heard.
Blub @ 425
Having a hard time following your logic. I thought you wanted Nader TO step aside and let the grown-ups take care of everything. When you say he “lacks conviction” like Specter/Hoyer, aren’t you really meaning that he has too much conviction? After all, he’s so committed to his ideals, he stubbornly keeps running for office. Given his life’s accomplishments, saying he lacks conviction is silly, sorry to say.
He runs in order to swing the pendulum more to the left. I’m still perplexed by all the Al Gore enthusiasm around here, since he was rarely a champion for liberal causes when he was a Senator and VP. Environmental activists used to show up at his speeches and yell, “Read Your Book!!” Gore vocally supported NAFTA, Telecommunications Act, and so on. Because he gave a few speeches that sounded liberal since 2000?!? This are the kinds of issues people at FDL rail against. If Gore wasn’t like this, Nader might never had run.
I voted for Nader in 2000, and thought he looked pathetic in 2004. I too have dissagreed with him several times over the years. I’m glad here’s out there fighting for what’s right. The fact that anyone can run for Prez in this country is crucial, and it provides a check and balance for the entire system. I don’t like it when people start trying to squelch this. Then, you start sounding like these people.
(warning: link takes you to the darkside)
jayackroyd @ 440
Imus, a good person! In what NeverLand?
conniptionfit @
5
My sentiments exactly. Proof that there is no God.