
Commentor Bob Schacht asked a question a while back about why Special Counsel Patrick Fitzgerald cannot use his "plenary powers" to expand his investigation into other kinds of wrongdoing. I was on my way out of the threads at the time and merely said that "plenary powers" didn't mean what he thought it meant and I would maybe do a post on that because it seemed to be source of confusion for a lot of folks who would like to see the tall man take on the Walter Reed scandal, "Purgegate" and a whole host of other problems right up to and probably including rescuing a kitten stuck up a tree.
Recently, Bob reminded me that I have yet to make good on that promise:
Are we into EPU already? I send a shout to looseheadprop, who a week or more ago promised a post on Fitzgerald's plenary powers, and why they are not as far reaching as one might think after reading Comey's scope of powers commission. Did I miss it? I am interested in this subject.
Fitzgerald derives his plenary powers from the initial letter appointing him as Special Counsel which reads in pertinent part:
...delegate you all the authority of the Attorney General with respect to the Department's investigation into the alleged unauthorized disclosure of a CIA employee's identity, and I direct you to exercise that authority as Special Counsel independent of the supervision or control of any offices of the Department...
You see, the plenary powers relate only to the narrow subject matter of "the alleged unauthorized disclosure of a CIA employee's identity." This was further clarified by a subsequent letter where the famous "plenary powers" language crops up:
"all the authority of the Attorney General with respect to the Department's investigation into the alleged unauthorized disclosre of a CIA employee's identity" is plenary and inclused the authority to investigate and prosecute violations of any federal criminal laws related to the underlying alleged unauthorized disclosure, as well as federal crimes committees in the course of and with intent ot interfere with, your investigation, such as perjury, obstruction of justice, destruction of evidence, and intimidation of witnesses; to conduct appeals arising out of the matter being investigated and/or prosecuted; and to pursue administrative remedies and civil sanctions (such as civil contempt) that are within the Attorney General's authority to impose or pursue....
Please note that by the very language of this letter that the "plenary powers" are related solely to violations of law "related to the underlying alleged unauthorized disclosure" and to obstructions of the investigation in the unauthorized disclosure. Shorter version, Fitz had very narrowly drawn subject matter jurisdiction. This was made even more clear during the litigation of a motion offered by the Libby defense team in which they asserted that Fitz’s appointment was improper. Fitzgerald and Comey were able to establish that Fitz was indeed an "inferior officer" because although he had all the powers of the Attorney General with respect to this one narrow area of inquiry, it was limited solely to that one narrow area.
Consequently the repeated calls in some parts of the blogosphere for the tall man in the rumpled suit to dive in and investigate this scandal or that are completely without legal foundation. He simply does not have the power to do that. He cannot unilaterally expand his mandate. Shorter version: he's just a lawyer, not a superhero; wears a rumpled suit, not tights and a cape.
He also has exhibited none of the over ambition nor unseemly self aggrandizement of some of the other special prosecutors who have come before him. There have been no daily impromptu press conferences in his driveway while he hauls out a Heftybag full of household trash, no requests to expand his subject matter jurisdiction involve himself in other people's civil litigations, no swanning about on talk shows.
This is real life folks, and this was simply a profession criminal investigation (which was, ahem, obstructed from reaching its ideal conclusion) followed by a professional criminal trial and conviction on more than ample evidence of the crimes for which legally sufficient admissible evidence existed, not some comic book with "kerpow" in the text balloon.
We should not try to convert a serious somber event (please remember that Scooter Libby is looking at going to jail for a significant period of time, even if he deserves every minute of it, it is still a very sad thing for him and his family to deal with), done by a serious person into some silly call for one guy who is supposed to single handedly right every wrong, solve every mystery, fix every problem for us.
The thing about participatory democracy is, we get to solve our own problems.
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First???
Anybody have a clue what this guy is all about????
http://www.victorypac.org/about.php
About VictoryPAC
I’m a liberal Democrat (pro-gay marriage, pro-choice, pro-progressive taxation, pro-equal rights, pro-environmental regulation, pro-public schools) who supported and supports the war in Iraq. As I tell my liberal friends “Did I miss the part where it was progressive not to fight medieval religious fascists?”
I’ve been waiting for four years for the White House to start really explaining the war to the American people, and to do anything sensible at all to maintain the political capital necessary to keep America in the fight - to keep us from withdrawing because the war is too messy, or too long, or just plain makes us feel bad.
During that time I was blogging about the war and issues around it at Winds of Change.NET, felt I was doing my part, and hoped that the leadership of the country would wake up and realize that public support for hard things - like wars - must be earned and maintained.
[snip]
[CHS notes: Please don’t do really long cut and pastes when you’ve got a link, because it eats up a lot of bandwidth. Thanks much!]
LHP!!!
But my name is Schacht, please :-)
Bob
looseheadprop!!
Funny photograph.
lhp!
Exactly, exactly.
It is we, the people, who have plenary powers. Supporting people like Jerry on the previous thread is one way that we exercise them.
Demanding more and more from our representatives and Senators between now and the next election is another way.
Let’s give Fitz a rest.
Fitz! Thanks, lhp!
thanks for another lucid and inspiring post, looseheadprop.
may your blades always spin freely
Bob at 2 — ask and ye shall receive your correction. (Refresh and you are properly spelled, I hope.)
I just donated to the Roots Project.
Woot !
Sorry, I don’t comment often:-) I’ll be more careful next time.
So is this guy for real? Anybody know his story???
“[CHS notes: Please don’t do really long cut and pastes when you’ve got a link, because it eats up a lot of bandwidth. Thanks much!]>
Muzzy at 9 — Oh, thanks so much! Jane and I were talking about some of the plans we’re looking at for it — and I think you guys are all going to love what comes next. :)
link
Former New York Times reporter Judith Miller, who in 2005 spent 85 days in jail for refusing to identify former White House aide Lewis “Scooter” Libby as a confidential source, said Friday she believes the media failed a major test when reporters and news organizations acquiesced to subpoenas issued them by federal prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald, reports U.S. News & World Report media correspondent Liz Halloran.
Cara at 10 — No problem. And to be honest, I have never heard of that guy. Hmmmmm….anyone?
Ah, too bad the AGAG and all his minions (little Chimpys and Karl Jrs that they be) chose to not understand the actions of a PROFESSIONAL prosecutor…
FYI to Christy, in case you didn’t see this before, I’ve got a transcript of your Thom Hartmann segment up here.
Cara @ 10
Google his name. He’s a partner in Pajamas Media, posts on right-wing blogs about Jamil Hussein and how the Democrats would be weaker without Lieberman, etc. So yeah, he really exists, and no, there appears to be little that’s progressive or liberal about him except his chosen blog name.
dakine01 @
14
Raw Story:
GOP Lawmaker Urges Gonzales to Resign
And were Fitz attempt to push the plenary you wouldn’t hear the end of the screaming. After all he doesnt have the authority of Garbage Bag Man who in his endless investigation of something called “Whitewater” left it far behind in the dust from whence it came to pursue any and all rumors regarding Big Dog leadings we all know to impeachment over a blow-job.
This, we were assured, was the very model of prudence and restraint.
But, but, but — what about the new info emerging about the email domaine outside the WH. Might that not hold all manner of info relevant to the area he’s allowed to investigate?
Danziger is a Lieberman supporter, he’s pro war and he is a neanderthal to use that last sentence in the first paragraph cited in #1.
That is all.
*xyz @ 12
I guess US News has forgotten the basic lesson the “dog bites man” isn’t news.
She bit someone again?
Oh, Fitz…
I agree with your examination of plenary powers.
However, my wish, is that Fitzy resign and
as a private citizen tell all…
I know, I know, I have no right
to tell anyone what to do… but it is my
wish….
I’m guessing both Bush and Cheney lied to him
in June of 2004 and how Rove escaped being
charged, having gone to the Grand Jury five times, is beyond my comprehension…
In this case, time is not of the essence…
By the time we have all the facts, the Bushies are gone, and the clock has run out…
In the meantime, Bush has corrupted this country…
I am sick of waiting…
I’m sorry that’s how I feel…
Jack
*xyz @ 12 -
i despise judith f. miller as much as i despise joe lieberman.
they are not good for my blood pressure.
Maybe there is more to come. I feel it. What if he waits until after Bush/Cheney are out of office so they can’t pardon anyone. What do you think Christy, in your gut. Do you think he could walk away from this cabal?
lhp - thanks so much for the continuing education.
sigh. too bad… ‘cuz fitz has access to some things we don’t have - like a grand jury and subpoena powers.
When, not if, we get a new AG part of the confirmation’s process should include a commitment to appoint an new Special Prosecutor with a broad mandate. And the agreement should include picking the person from a mutually agreed list of three candidates developed jointly by Dem’s and Repugs in congress. There should be an agreement to do this within thirty days of confirmation. I’m not sure how this could be enforced except, perhaps through impeachment but perhaps that would be enough of a threat.
He’s just a lawyer — and not much of one at that. I will never be forget him NOT indicting Rove — after insiders said he was being indicted.
He gave Rover 5 chances — FIVE CHANCES — to get his story straight before the grand jury. That’s a neon sign that something is rotten in the state of denmark. How could you even indict him for lying to a GJ when you give him 5 chances?
I think his deal was either not being fired with the 8 or a judgeship later.
When does the Conrad Black trial begin? Will Fitz himself be trying that case?
And did you know that you can’t comment about Conrad Black on any WaPo George Will columns? He’s got a filter installed, after his conflict was revealed, where comments get trapped unless you type Conr*d Bl*ck or similar filter-evading nonsense. Which people have, of course, learned to do.
Thinking here about the opposite of Phoenix Woman’s post this morning about how different our world would be had Gore been President:
http://www.firedoglake.com/200.....have-been/
What if Comey hadn’t appointed Fitzgerald??
Mad props to the Prop!
One other thing that differentiates Fitzgerald and the Plame case from Ken Starr and the OIC’s preening: Unlike Fitzgerald and his staff, the OIC was a quasi-legal body; while they had the power to subpoena, their rulings had at best limited legal force — they could be used by Republicans to impeach in a Senate show trial, but never in a real law court.
That’s the real irony here — if Clinton were just Joe Blow instead of the president, and the case were tried in a real court of law, it would have been laughed out of court. (Indeed, key parts of it, such as the Paula Jones nuisance lawsuit, were laughed out of court — but not before the Jones/Starr team tried to catch Clinton in a perjury trap.)
Thanks for this clarification lhp. I recall having the impression after reading one of the initial letters from Comey to Fitz that he had the full power as granted by the office of the AG to pursue the matter, in essence, wherever it lead. In fact, I thought it stated as much in no uncertain terms. That may be why I (and surely many others following the Plame case closely) had high hopes that all roads would lead clearly to Cheney and that Fitz would be obligated to go there.
Disappointing that it didn’t work out that way. One way or another these criminals are going down.
So, hypothetically, what happens if, while working in his narrow area, he uncovers something suspicious (or even outright illegal) that falls outside his jurisdiction? What does a rule-abiding lawman do? What are the legal options, in his position? Esp if they came up in the GJ?
Certainly those ex-WH domains might qualify. And we can all imagine plenty o’ others…
angie at 20 — Oh, THAT Danziger…
Can he formally request an expansion of his mandate/power?
Can he publicly request such a thing?
oh selise — cspan 2 @ 7pm is carrying your Rep. Jim McGovern hosting a reception for Mike Farrell re his new book
“Just Call Me Mike: A Journey to Actor and Activist”
(yeppers, Christy– the one and the same)
TeddySanFran @ 30
The trial’s already started, though there’s been a short recess which Black used to hop over the border to attend a party.
Chimp wants Poodle’s sailors returned. Foot-stamping:
It’s disturbing when he uses the word “must.”
Phoenix Woman @ 31
This is the problem with impeachment. By putting it in the hands of a partisan body, it means that high crimes can easily go unpunished, while misdemeanors can result in impeachment, all depending on the makeup of the Congress.
The reason I ask is that it is obvious that more wrong doing needs to be oncovered and if something is worth going to jail to obstruct justice then it is likely a serious matter - such as a crime.
Perhaps now it is for Congress to investigate, so the balance of powers is all well and good.
By the way, it is time for a little reminder: You get one name on this blog. No sock puppetry. We catch you trying to do it, you risk being banned. Just so you know.
whateva @ 29
Not much of a lawyer? I’ll bet Libby would disagree with you on that one.
((((((Fitz))))))))) don’t give up. When I saw the picture of Fitz scowling at Abu, my heart skipped a beat.
http://thenexthurrah.typepad.c.....nows_.html
We should not try to convert a serious somber event
sigh
not a single sip of schedenfreude? no Fitzmas cheer?
TeddySanFran @ 38
Chimp wants Poodle’s sailors returned. Foot-stamping:
It’s disturbing when he uses the word “must.”
Yea, “What the American people MUST understand…”
*xyz @ 12
When writing responses to US News, do feel free to cite the information contained in this post of mine on Dearest Judy.
It would be great if the ICC would begin a trial of these thugs… Even if it is just a trial in absentia… let the evidence be presented and the judgment rendered… and let them move to Uraguay and live in hiding… on some ranch.
The whole criminal lot of them… may they rot in eternal hell.
Christy Hardin Smith @
42
huh?
[madly scrolling upwards to see what’s up….]
DefJef @ 48
I think they have all reserved spots in the Bush Wing of Hell.
Terry Olson @ 46
It’s disturbing when he uses the word “must.”
Yea, “What the American people MUST understand…”
Maybe if he said it was *unacceptable*, I might take him seriously…
TeddySanFran @ 39
It’s disturbing when he uses the word “must.”
Language, language, language.
They are not hostages if they were in disputed or Iranian waters and it seems that they were and we’ll find out. They are arrested/detained but not hostages or pows. They may have violated international law. Bush’s bullying is surely not helping things, either.
We don’t know for certain yet. But they are not hostages.
Bob Schacht @ 2
Sorry, as I read this I found my usual high ratio of typos.
TeddySanFran @ 39
The ‘quid pro quo’ Bush mentions is of course the fact that the US has been holding five Iranian diplomats hostage since January and refuses to exchange them for the fifteen UK sailors.
Never fear, we have another tall man in a rumpled suit.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 41
Christy, can you change your handle in some way? I took my name when I was so pissed about Bush using AT&T to snoop on Americans that I just wanted to show them I was not afraid!
OT:looking for garlic mashed potatoes recipie that someone has used-I have a bunch but am curious if someone here has a special recommendation(sedar monday night!)
Cara @
1
Looks like a troll to me:
this from the page presented:
Here in California, defeated Gubernatorial candidate Phil Angelides (who I used to work for, by the way…)
and then the author says he’s a Democrat supporting the war and against bringing the troops home now…
but the web page source indicates the author is writing on a style sheet which has an interesting source…
Phoenix Woman @ 54
We do not negotiate with people we accuse of being terrorists.
Not publicly, anyway.
redX @
36
Isn’t the democratic reality that the primary benefit of Fitz’ prosecution of Scooter Libby is not that one liar is going to jail and the Rule of Law is upheld, but that the Bush Administration is held up to scrutiny by the public a bit?
In other words, Fitz will not save us, and should not save us.
Relying on prosecutors to restore both democracy and the Rule of Law is leaning on a thin reed, no matter how good one prosecutor may be.
Only an active (and even enraged) populace can do that.
That is how I read lhp, himself a lawyer, and that is how it ought to be.
(And that’s how I read redX’s followup comment.)
angie @ 37 -
thanks angie… i didn’t know, will try to watch.
i’m still so bummed about McGovern voting for Iraq war funding bill… i’d sorta decided to cut him some slack (howie’s encouragement in this regard should not go unheeded)…. but there are now TWO MORE things that have me irked.
1. where the frack is the “don’t attack iran w/out congressional approval” bill that McGovern told me (last saturday) that he had a promise from Pelosi there would be a vote on? isn’t the House on break now for 2 weeks?
2. on thursday McGovern endorsed Clinton for president. the one democratic candidate who not only voted FOR the war, and she still thinks it was right to vote for the war. acckkkk!!! if McGovern had made this endorsement before the anti-war rally here, he would have caught hell.
i am so bummed.
angie @ 52
On the other hand, what is the status of the Iranian diplomats that Chimpy’s troops grabbed in Iraq?
Phoenix Woman @
54
One could do a very interesting comparative workup on the psychology of hostage-taking presidents.
dakine01 @ 14
Oh, I think they understood them very well, that was the problem. An honest and professional approach was NOT AT ALL what they wanted.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 42
And believe me, we CAN catch you doing it.Terry Olson @ 31
Good question. We were very, very lucky with this one.
petedownunder @ 62
Unlawful combatants?
DefJef @ 48
my fantasy is to have Fitz appointed ICC prosecutor and have another whack at Rove along with Darth Vader and Smirk
angie @ 52
The Iranians want to exchange for their 7 diplomats that were taken last month in Iraq.
Alice @ 55
Excellent point… I hope Condi and others respect him…
Bay State Librul @ 69
Excellent point… I hope Condi and others respect him…
I hope they take him very, very lightly as someone not to be worried about.
News Grinder @ 19
Maybe it will, in which case there might be a squoosh more work for him to do. Or, Maybe they won’t…
Terry Olson @ 56
I am no expert, and don’t mean to speak for Christy, but I’ve seen others change handles by using the form “new handle formerly known as old handle” for a while and then just using “new handle”. I don’t know what the official method is.
“Shorter version: he’s just a lawyer, not a superhero; wears a rumpled suit, not tights and a cape.”
Precisely…
Unfortunately, most of us here are desperately looking for somebody, anybody to use their super “plenary powers” to fix this huge mess Bush and his gang have been up to…..
(including myself)….
Agreed that “plenary powers” were limited to the CIA leak investigation, but could not that have included going beyond charging one person, Libby, with perjury, obstruction, and lying, and actually telling us who were responsible for the leaks, even if there was no crime committed?
As it is, something critical (Who done it?) is left to implication (It was Cheney, but he had the authority), interpretation (It was Armitrage, but no crime was committed), and second-guessing (Nobody did it and there was no crime.)
I have a sneaking suspicion even Plame and Wilson are not totally happy with this legal outcome, as they seem to be bent on pursuing a civil case.
Terry Olson @ 56
Only if it’s LooHoo teeheehee *g*
petedownunder @ 72
Even if you change your name abruptly and without notice, I don’t think that’s a problem. But if you try to maintain two *simultaneous* identities, that’s a huge no-no.
One my my senators, Gooper John Ensign (R-NV), recently wrote me back to claim that Fitz had determined that “no crime had been committed” in the outing of Valerie Plame Wilson.
Where did Fitz ever publicly state that?
.
Bay State Librul @ 24
Hate to ruin you fanatasy, but even if he resigns, he still can’t tell. Grand Jury secrecy attached to the information, not to the person who knows it.
Even all these many years later, I still carry around secrets learned through the GJ process.
Lolo, tee hee back at you!
BobbyG @ 76
Damn good question. My recollection was that he said the exact opposite.
However, he *did* say something to the effect that he could not *prosecute* the underlying crime because of the obstruction (the sand in the eyes).
*xyz @ 12
I’ll let her call herself a writer (not a reporter) if she stops pretending to be an expert on law.
As for the damage she thinks ‘the media’ did to itself, she should look in the mirror. Reporters shouldn’t get to shield the commission of crimes.
(She isn’t worth the money the NYT has spent on her in legal fees, either.)
The thing about participatory democracy is, we get to solve our own problems.
I love that line.
I think the short version of DoJ’s instructions could be summarized as “Investigate this crime and whatever crimes may be related to it. Do whatever we have the power to do within the law. Call if you need more instructions.”
@12: So Judith Miller is still beating that red herring? (yeah, I know, mixed metaphor, but it’s a red herring and she’s still beating it.)
freedom of the press, protection of confidential sources, etc. does NOT extend co-conspirators, accessories to crimes, etc..
whateva @ 29
You are entitled to your opinion, but I must respectfully disagree with you.
Eli @ 80
Damn good question. My recollection was that he said the exact opposite.
However, he *did* say something to the effect that he could not *prosecute* the underlying crime because of the obstruction (the sand in the eyes).
My response to Ensign:
_____
For the record, Special Prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald did NOT conclude dispositively that “no crime had been committed” in the leaking of Valerie Plame’s identity. Libby’s obstruction of justice, along with all the other White House stonewalling, obfuscations/obstructions, rendered such a case problematic.
You seem to support treasonous acts. You should be ashamed. Let’s cut the crap, shall we John? WHAT vital and pressing national interest was served by revealing her identity? Name ONE. You cannot.
This lawless administration is a blot on the national character, and, to the extent that you make excuses for them, you are complicit in the stain.
.
TeddySanFran @ 30
I think it started already, but maybe I am mistaken, I thought I read that though.
It would be impossible for him to came back from Libby and prep Black in a week. Prepping a trial is VERY time consuming
Phoenix Woman @ 65
Christy Hardin Smith @ 42
And believe me, we CAN catch you doing it.Terry Olson @ 31
Good question. We were very, very lucky with this one.
Over at Sadly, No!! you can always masquerade as teh Preview Button. ’cause, he/she/it isn’t showing up any time soon.
P.S. This post was meant to invoke teh power of the Preview Button. Please stand up and spin around three times.
looseheadprop @ 84
You are entitled to your opinion, but I must respectfully disagree with you.
If they tried to bribe him he would kick them to the curb.
Terry Olson @ 31
I think about THAT a lot.
selise — Just sent this to my Congresswoman. If I get an answer to this email, I will post it at FDL:
Looseheadprop,
Thanks again for taking this on. I was first put onto this issue by Citizen Spook in a blog quoted elsewhere on the internet. Now, I should make clear before going further that Citizen Spook has problems with FireDogLake (here and here), mainly dating to an exchange last June with Christy Hardin Smith, so said Spook is not a favorite around the Lake. However, let’s look further at the public record about this, which Citizen Spook published back on August 8, 2005.
Now, first I should state that the main point of Spook’s blog was that Fitzgerald could not be fired. He was not primarily concerned with the breadth of his investigatory mandate.
However, Spook does make the following claim, in bold:
Citizen Spook makes much more of a clarification of Fitzgerald’s powers by Comey’s press conference of December 30th, 2003, and Decision B-302582 (September 30, 2004) issued by the Government Accountability Office. Here’s part of what Comey actually said in the press conference:
Citizen Spook’s diary on this subject is long, and quotes verbatim Comey’s letters, press conference, and the GAO decision. I think that establishes that
(1) Fitzgerald can’t be fired;
(2) His budget cannot be limited.
The third and crucial point is the scope of his mandate, and what exactly is meant by “the alleged unauthorized disclosure of a CIA employee’s identity,” and the legal basis for Comey’s comment that “Follow the facts; do the right thing. He can pursue it wherever he wants to pursue it.”
The Libby trial is interesting because it did not directly involve perjury or obstruction of justice with respect to Plame’s identity. Furthermore, it was pretty well established at the trial that the trail of cookie crumbs regarding disclosure of Plame’s identity leads right to the office of the VP and beyond that to the President’s office itself.
I think that Fitzgerald’s mandate is broader than he has chosen to exercise, and that he is being very cautious. I think he conducted the trial in a way that would expose all kinds of loose ends, but apparently he feels that he does not have enough good evidence to go after Cheney, Rove, or other members of WHIG. I think he could, but he has chosen not to.
Thanks for putting this issue back on the table!
Aloha,
Bob in HI
looseheadprop @ 78
Bay State Librul @ 24
Hate to ruin you fanatasy, but even if he resigns, he still can’t tell. Grand Jury secrecy attached to the information, not to the person who knows it.
Even all these many years later, I still carry around secrets learned through the GJ process.
You did ruin my fantasy…
On another matter, what’s your take on a DOJ
official taking the 5th?
Alice @ 55
I like Waxman, but he strikes me as being a short man in a rumpled suit, which is just fine. Einstein was also a shorty, and so were Beethoven, Mozart, and the second president of the US, John Adams.
Christy Hardin Smith @
8
Yes! Thanks!
Bob in HI