frist

yo!

ho ho

The above poster just cracked me up. I thought you all could use a giggle this morning as well.

I’m truly a pacifist and really do not wish ill on any other human. But it seems like it would be a very good thing to have an “extraordinary rendition” pulled on these smarmy anal orifices. Of course, that would require building a prison at Gitmo larger than the Super Max in Colorado…

Why don’t they subpoena the NSA’s email archive?

/snark off.

And the use of outside email servers is a national security problem, because of the risk that Rove and others could have discussed classified matters using their outside email addresses.

Last night I saw a Daily Kos diary on that.

Howdy, Christy, FirePups!

Yeah, imagine that…a U.S. Attorney well-liked by not only federal judges for her integrity, but by the strongly Republican constituency in her district, dismissed without adequate reason by Washington.

Rover, that’s a f*ckup of the first water here. They don’t like Washington over much in Michigan, and they REALLY don’t like it when Washington mucks around in their backyard.

There’s a lot more going on here, buried in emails that haven’t been released and more in phone calls about which we’ll never learn.

For some perspective on Katymine’s point about the non-official email addies for official business:

I work for a Fortune 500 100 company. We are prohibited from using any other email addresses for business purposes than our official ones, and everybody knows it. We have to go through little computer-based modules on ethics, protocol, document and email retention all the time, and your manager gets notified if you don’t do the modules, and he has to enforce that all his charges complete the modules, as does his manager, etc. We are blocked from using any other email sites from our work computer. I just don’t believe that any outfit under regulatory scrutiny (like the executive branch) does not enforce this type of control. Any deviation would have to be knowing and egregious.

Prof @ 7

And the use of outside email servers is a national security problem, because of the risk that Rove and others could have discussed classified matters using their outside email addresses.

Last night I saw a Daily Kos diary on that.

OK. Found it:

Karl Rove and GWB43.com – Huge National Security Threat?

Shitheel Orrin Hatch and his faith based logic. ‘Al Qaeda will use the oil revenues from Al Anbar Province to fund their terrorist activities’.

Orrin buddy, look at the map. Al Anbar aint got no oil.

Maybe they’ll use revenues from a sand flea circus.

-GSD

Morning, CHS!

Here’s concern troll Broder:

It seems doubtful that Democrats can help themselves a great deal just by tearing down an already discredited Republican administration with more investigations such as the current attack on the Justice Department and White House over the firings of eight U.S. attorneys.

Is it possible to be more politically tone deaf?

Wowww… front paged!

Some would say that Yesterday was interesting… started reading the DOJ docs and the comments over at TPMmuckraker and got sucked into it all day.

What I found…
Several outside .gov email addys…
Yahoo, Comcast and gwb43 (RNC email addy)

My ex-US Attorney Paul Charlton was rated NUMBER ONE and was not on the hit list until it slipped that Rep. Rick Renzi was under investigation. BTW… Charltons prosecution for immigration crime was up 91% in 2005. Such a slacker.

John Dean said that executive privilege can only extend to conversations between the president and others, not staff and staff.

Prof @ 7

And the use of outside email servers is a national security problem, because of the risk that Rove and others could have discussed classified matters using their outside email addresses.

Last night I saw a Daily Kos diary on that.

I don’t get this prof. Did the diarist think that the WH servers are somehow more secure than Yahoo? There’s an audit and oversight problem, but that’s true about voice communications as well.

My impression has always been that the WH communications systems are far from state of the art–I’d be very surprised if they’re using encryption, for example.

And how much does Karl “earn”?

If you are still asking yourself, “Okay, what’s the big deal about all of this?”, have I got a bit for you from TPM. Read this from Josh, let it sink in, and then ask yourself just how many lies an Administration gets to tell the public, and the Congress, before no one ought to trust them at all? (My answer: we passed my limit a long, long time ago.)

Christie,

Slight correction, it’s David Kurtz writing at TPM, not Josh

oh goddammit. I just heard John McKay on MTP saying that Abu Gonzo “needs to understand” that his job is blahblahblah. Abu understands perfectly what his job is and it is to twist the DOJ into another instrument to enforce the permanent Repuglican majority.

Likewise, all the public statements by BushCo that sound nonsensical to reality-based humanoids make perfect sense if you put yourself in the proper viewing point. Patrick Fitzgerald is a mediocre performer if your yardstick is advancing BushCo’s agenda. The war in Iraq is a great success if you are a shareholder of Halliburton.

Anonymous Liberal over at C&L says that only the president can fire USAs. Is that correct, and if so, were these firings even leagal if the president didn’t know about them as he claims? Something about this doesn’t seem right, though, because this points hasn’t been raised by anyone else yet.

Didn’t anyone learn appropriate business language? Some of these people sound totally inept.

a little nugget for katymine – I actually found these links while surfing on USA story – all from Terrorist Screening Center – a DOJ unit -just scroll down a hair to the color type :)

oh and just so ya know

TSC Mission

To serve as the authoritative source in coordinating the use of terrorist identification information and consolidating the approach of screening for all who act to prevent terrorist activities

You Want Me On That Wall !

You Need Me On That Wall !

Wonder if this is what Bush and Blair have been hoping for. Things could heat up?

Iran defiantly rebuffed international demands yesterday for the release of 15 seized British naval personnel, claiming that the sailors and Royal Marines had confessed to entering its waters in an illegal act of aggression, and were now to be prosecuted in the Iranian capital.

The heat must be getting to Karl — Specter and Hagel were out on the take-show circuit dissing Gonzales this morning, so it sure sounds like Rove’s ready to jettison the Gonzo firewall.

Here’s a thought: If Gonzo had left last week over this, the whole bidness would have likely settled down and Rove would be safe. But it would be yet another humiliating loss of a good buddy for Bushie, as Gonzales has been him nearly long as Rove, IIRC. Now, too many reporters are joining with their blogger brethren into focusing on Turdblossom’s role in all of this.

What really hurts the Blossom is that this comes so soon after the Libby trial, and the whole ‘why isn’t Karl on trial here?’ theme of jury nullification the Libby team tried to use. That didn’t have time to fade from the public mind before this came up.

Regarding the National Security Letters: When the Patriot Act was coming up for re-auth these deceitful $%$#@ were saying that there was obviously no abuse of the Act since there were no complaints. Meanwhile they were gagging everyone who received an NSL.
Honestly, I cannot stay ahead of the curve with these guys. Every word out of their mouths is deceitful, but sometimes it takes months (years?) to realize it.

jayackroyd @ 15

Prof @ 7

And the use of outside email servers is a national security problem, because of the risk that Rove and others could have discussed classified matters using their outside email addresses.

Last night I saw a Daily Kos diary on that.

I don’t get this prof. Did the diarist think that the WH servers are somehow more secure than Yahoo?

In terms of interception by foreign intelligence services — Yes.

The White House servers are likely inside the building. The Republican servers are in Tennessee. Between Karl Rove (and others) in DC and the servers in Tennessee there are dozens of possibilities for interception of communications by foreign intelligence services.

(In the military, that’s what I worked on.)

Oklahoma kiddo @ 21

Wonder if this is what Bush and Blair have been hoping for. Things could heat up?

Iran defiantly rebuffed international demands yesterday for the release of 15 seized British naval personnel, claiming that the sailors and Royal Marines had confessed to entering its waters in an illegal act of aggression, and were now to be prosecuted in the Iranian capital.

Since the UK’s backing down from its claim that the sailors weren’t anywhere near Iranian waters (translation: they were blatantly over the line and the Iranians have proof), I expect that the soldiers are going to be guests of the Iranian government for a little while — but most likely no longer than a few weeks. Their presence in Teheran will put pressure on the Brits to negotiate and not nuke, and the Brits in turn will put pressure on the US to do the same.

However, the government currently in power in the UK is a Labour government (though it’s Labour only in name, thanks to Tony the Third Way Man). I can very easily see Rove advising Bush that endangering those British sailors by attacking Iran would be just what is needed to give the Tories a boost in Blighty.

Oklahoma kiddo @ 21

Wonder if this is what Bush and Blair have been hoping for. Things could heat up?

Iran defiantly rebuffed international demands yesterday for the release of 15 seized British naval personnel, claiming that the sailors and Royal Marines had confessed to entering its waters in an illegal act of aggression, and were now to be prosecuted in the Iranian capital.

Hopefully they won’t be tortured or otherwise harmed. I worry the Iranians might think the Geneva Conventions are “quaint” or something, and no longer apply.

Phoenix Woman @ 22

The heat must be getting to Karl — Specter and Hagel were out on the take-show circuit dissing Gonzales this morning, so it sure sounds like Rove’s ready to jettison the Gonzo firewall.

Here’s a thought: If Gonzo had left last week over this, the whole bidness would have likely settled down and Rove would be safe. But it would be yet another humiliating loss of a good buddy for Bushie, as Gonzales has been him nearly long as Rove, IIRC. Now, too many reporters are joining with their blogger brethren into focusing on Turdblossom’s role in all of this.

What really hurts the Blossom is that this comes so soon after the Libby trial, and the whole ‘why isn’t Karl on trial here?’ theme of jury nullification the Libby team tried to use. That didn’t have time to fade from the public mind before this came up.

How does this executive privilege thing work with ex-staff member?

Both Kos and Josh Marshall have had pieces about members of the Bush administration illegally using personal or outside emails so their communications cannot be tracked.

There was a good point raised on the Face the Nation program this morning on the need for public testimony by Karl Rove. Rove has been giving public speeches around the country justifying the firings of the US-Attorneys and saying the Democrats are simply playing politics. So, one of the commentators asked, why can’t Rove make these same statements under oath to a Congressional committee and face cross-examination?

something else bothering me -

this from gov. website (ironically entitled “Expect More”) this is first link you get when you type in USA’s under ‘keywords’
Expect More . . .USA’s

Laws exclude US Attorneys from performance appraisals. The Department of Justice is working to improve accountability in order to help U.S. Attorneys meet performance and management expectations.

emphasis mine

what are they talking about here ?!?!?

Prof @ 24

jayackroyd @ 15

Prof @ 7

And the use of outside email servers is a national security problem, because of the risk that Rove and others could have discussed classified matters using their outside email addresses.

Last night I saw a Daily Kos diary on that.

I don’t get this prof. Did the diarist think that the WH servers are somehow more secure than Yahoo?

In terms of interception by foreign intelligence services — Yes.

The White House servers are likely inside the building. The Republican servers are in Tennessee. Between Karl Rove (and others) in DC and the servers in Tennessee there are dozens of possibilities for interception of communications by foreign intelligence services.

(In the military, that’s what I worked on.)

thanks. And you can secure a blackberry? And they pptp into the white house from home?

Rove is a must for prosecution. Get him and you’ll get the other two.

Christy commands: Now, bring on the sunshine.

Here I am ;->

One over-arching meme I got from Repub talking points this morning is the shift to “serious concern” about Gone-zo. But with this important subtext left unexplored by the talking heads. They’ll focus on Gone-zo as chum to distract from the Rove shop. Toss away the mid-sized mackerel so the media will ignore the sharks that form the core of BushCo.

Several outside .gov email addys…
Yahoo, Comcast and gwb43 (RNC email addy)

Talk about the banality of evil. I wonder if karlturd1 is active?

By the way:

“If they dropped 8 members from the Team because they didn’t play ball, well, how many others did play ball?”

Sen. Durbin on Meet the Press.

He is on it.

I haven’t heard anyone in the MSM bringing up the following facts.

*Irve Libby lied under oath and was convicted for attempting to cover up for higher-ups.

*J. Steven Griles was convicted for lying under oath.

There is an established pattern of Bush administration officials lying under oath.

They no longer deserve the benefit of the doubt.

Swear ‘em all in.

-GSD

Whenever there is a commenter thinking perhaps Arlen Specter is starting to come around, remember he is the guy who gleefully inserted the piece into the Patriot Act allowing Bush to appoint US Attorneys without congressional approval. Although he blames a staff member, it was Specter alone who allowed it to go in.

It’s a cheesy trick Specter always employs. He talks the talk, he’s vocally “shocked” etc. by something Bushco is doing. When it’s time to vote, he never sticks to his initial statements and votes the Bush meme, always.

Wow. The plot thickens.

I haven’t been on the toobz very much the past couple of days, and I’m amazed at what has transpired in the US Atty scandal.
- Secret email systems to try and hide activities of high-ranking officials who supposedly “don’t use email”
- Documentation of meetings & memos proving that Gonzales was directly involved in the plotting to fire the attorneys, despite his denial of involvement
- Cathie Martin in the middle of it all

If the plot gets any thicker, we’ll have to use heavy mechanical equipment to get through it.

I do think we’re going to have to watch for “scandal overload”. Don’t mean to sound like a concern troll, but I wouldn’t be surprised if the GOP starts throwing out a lot of suspicious sounding information about various topics in an attempt to get us running in circles, chasing the “potential scandal du jour”. They know we love to do it – us Democrats, particularly us bloggers – are prone to sniffing out scandal. If we have too many potential scandals at once going, the Democrats could look like they’re spending all of their time investigating potential scandal, and less time accomplishing real change. I suppose that’s what us bloggers are for, though – we can sniff out the real scandal from shrewd attempts to get Democrats running in circles.

Ok, now that I’m done thinking out loud, I’m gonna make myself a cup of espresso. Just got a new machine – I had no idea how bad my old machine was. Wow.

Rove, a dingleberry with a Blackberry.

-GSD

LandOfTheFree at 38 — Oooh, send some of that espresso over here. *g*

Yeah — note that Goodling is only taking a leave of absence — she’s not resigning. Because, you know, if she resigned there’d be no way to shield her with “executive privelege”

Wankers, every one.

GSD @
39

Rove, a dingleberry with a Blackberry.

-GSD

John Dingell / Marion Barry ‘08 – the dingellbarry ticket ;)

Regardless of the outcome of the car smuggling event in the Persian Gulf, the view here is that Iran is squarely in the Bush cross hairs. We are simply not going to let the oil in that part of the Middle East get away from us. Iraq and Iran have little to do with what the Bush boys and girls tell us it does. It’s about oil. Always has been.

Monica Goodling is still on the payroll. Kyle Sampson, the connected Mormon from Utah, even though he resigned his title, is still on the DOJ payroll. No cut in pay for Kyle.

karen allen @ 37

Whenever there is a commenter thinking perhaps Arlen Specter is starting to come around, remember he is the guy who gleefully inserted the piece into the Patriot Act allowing Bush to appoint US Attorneys without congressional approval. Although he blames a staff member, it was Specter alone who allowed it to go in.

It’s a cheesy trick Specter always employs. He talks the talk, he’s vocally “shocked” etc. by something Bushco is doing. When it’s time to vote, he never sticks to his initial statements and votes the Bush meme, always.

Exactly. Chuck Hagel’s the same way. They pretend to be independent tough guys, but when crunch time hits they meekly fall in line.

The fact that both of them were sent to do the Sunday talks dissing Gonzo indicates to me that the Bushies are getting ready to dump him. They’re getting the ground prepped first — they’re having the “moderate” Republicans get in their licks first, and then tomorrow or Tuesday some of the non-moderates will join in, and by Friday Gonzo will be gone.

sunshine and a hazardous materials cleanup crew should do the trick

karen allen @ 44

Monica Goodling is still on the payroll. Kyle Sampson, the connected Mormon from Utah, even though he resigned his title, is still on the DOJ payroll. No cut in pay for Kyle.

Now THAT is interesting! How’d they manage that?

I have read on Daily Kos and TPM that Our Benighted Emperor’s Achilles Heel is the subpoena to “ex-staffer” Harriet Meirs. Thus, I believe this means they cannot quash her with executive privilege because the point to that, according to Court cases is they would be inhibited in giving advice at liberty in the future with such a cloud hanging over them. No more future advice for Bush’s “Homely Aunt Harriett”..

Awww… Gee! I hate it when that happens!

jayackroyd @ 27

Phoenix Woman @ 22

The heat must be getting to Karl — Specter and Hagel were out on the take-show circuit dissing Gonzales this morning, so it sure sounds like Rove’s ready to jettison the Gonzo firewall.

Here’s a thought: If Gonzo had left last week over this, the whole bidness would have likely settled down and Rove would be safe. But it would be yet another humiliating loss of a good buddy for Bushie, as Gonzales has been him nearly long as Rove, IIRC. Now, too many reporters are joining with their blogger brethren into focusing on Turdblossom’s role in all of this.

What really hurts the Blossom is that this comes so soon after the Libby trial, and the whole ‘why isn’t Karl on trial here?’ theme of jury nullification the Libby team tried to use. That didn’t have time to fade from the public mind before this came up.

How does this executive privilege thing work with ex-staff member?

Well, it looks like today’s talking points from the WH thru three key Republican Senators was that they questioned Gonzo’s truthfulness…

It does look like Gonzo will be thrown further under the bus this week to save Rover. I expect a resignation by Friday.

There was a great diary over at Kos yesterday about the national security issues involved in using non-WH email servers.

“Karl Rove and gwb43.com–Huge National Security Threat?” diary by Citizen92 on 3-24-07

It’s bad enough that they were probably trying to keep their communications beyond scrutiny, but in so doing they may have (again!) compromised our national security!

Tell me again how it is that this is the party that keeps us safe. They post the instructions for making an atom bomb on their website, they publish their counter-insurgency manual for all to read, they auction off ’spare’ military parts to the highest bidder…

…and Tom Engelhardt has a must read article posted at Alternet: “Neocons in Cheney’s Office Fund al Quaeda-tied Groups…and No One Cares?”
3-17-07

But, if they fire Alberto Gonzales who will protect the children?

-GSD

Rep. Chris Cannon, R-UT and Senator Orrin Hatch R-UT, via the Salt Lake Tribune and other media, have come out solidly in support of Abu Gonzales. Has anybody connected the dots and see that Kyle Sampson is their peep?

This is something I’ve brought up before, and maybe it bears a little more examination (responses will tell the tale).

I’m not so sure, if Lincoln could see what the nation has become, he would have bothered stopping the Confederacy from seceding.

In my opinion, the south in particular, has led the way in the dumbing down of our nation, a process started before I was born. If you don’t believe me, see the way our opposite numbers think.

I don’t know if I see any way out of the political morass our country is in. Even if we take power (win the Senate more decisively, and take the WH) in 2008, the circus will never end. The wingnuts are never going to figure out they’re wrong (and they ARE wrong), and given their desire to jam their ways down our throats, I just don’t see a way out. There can never be real peace among our own people, we’re descending toward being the Serbs and Croats, the Shia and the Sunnis. At my age, I probably won’t live to see he end of it , but we’re so indebted, and spread thin, so weakened by job outsourcing and the destruction of the American military by the Iraq clusterfuck,. there’s hardly any bones left to pick.

I don’t know about you, but I grow weary of the struggle. The USA is fucked. I’ve never believed until now, the US could be destroyed in a single man’s tenure, even a two-term one, but I have been proven wrong. It’s like Greg Stillson (a character from the Stephen King book “The Dead Zone”) come to life.

Would Lincoln have allowed the Confederacy to stand, had he been able to see into the future? I wish he had let them go. The remainder of the US would be stronger, smarter and better equipped to stand among the great nations of the world.

twolf1 @ 42

GSD @ 39

Rove, a dingleberry with a Blackberry.

-GSD

John Dingell / Marion Barry ‘08 – the dingellbarry ticket ;)

And Marion Barry gave DC the Metro, so he’s at least one up on Bush in terms of Good Things Done For The Greater Community. Yeah, he knows what cocaine tastes like — but if coke use was a disqualification, we wouldn’t have the Boy-King now, would we?

GSD @ 51

But, if they fire Alberto Gonzales who will protect the children?

-GSD

(^_^)

karen allen @ 52

Rep. Chris Cannon, R-UT and Senator Orrin Hatch R-UT, via the Salt Lake Tribune and other media, have come out solidly in support of Abu Gonzales. Has anybody connected the dots and see that Kyle Sampson is their peep?

You have, just now.

Got more on Sampson (Rove’s mini-me) and the whole Utah/Hatch/Cannon thing?

PeteCO @ 26

Hopefully they won’t be tortured or otherwise harmed. I worry the Iranians might think the Geneva Conventions are “quaint” or something, and no longer apply.

Now, I wonder who could possibly have given them such an idea…

I think Our Benighted Emperor is between a rock and a hard place. Once he throws Gonzo under the bus, he cannot invoke executive privilege. This whole thing has gotten way out of control.

Nixon’s tipping point was when his Repuglicans started abandoning him; eg – Lindsey Graham, Spectre, etc., today.

The guy got caught telling Congress lies.. The only one safe enough is Orin — The Great Theocracy of Utah — Hatch.

Chimpy has a support club of ONE.. Awww Gee!!

Quzi @ 49

Well, it looks like today’s talking points from the WH thru three key Republican Senators was that they questioned Gonzo’s truthfulness…

It does look like Gonzo will be thrown further under the bus this week to save Rover. I expect a resignation by Friday.

Bob Scheiffer said the Eubanks scandal is more important than the firing of USA’s. If anything it just corroborates the fact that this Admin. politicized the DOJ. Get a clue Scheiffer!

Phoenix Woman @ 47

karen allen @ 44

Monica Goodling is still on the payroll. Kyle Sampson, the connected Mormon from Utah, even though he resigned his title, is still on the DOJ payroll. No cut in pay for Kyle.

Now THAT is interesting! How’d they manage that?

Can’t remember where I read that he went over to the environmental side of justice. That oughta help Gore’s cause.

Phoenix Woman @ 47

karen allen @ 44

Monica Goodling is still on the payroll. Kyle Sampson, the connected Mormon from Utah, even though he resigned his title, is still on the DOJ payroll. No cut in pay for Kyle.

Now THAT is interesting! How’d they manage that?

Same way Rumsfeld is still collecting a check. These people don’t fire cronies, they move them into an office with fewer windows.

Karen — Sampson was actively lobbying for the other Utah USAtty spot, with a boost from Hatch supporting his efforts. So, yes, there is a connection there in a number of ways. Hatch has a number of fingers in the Turdblossom pie.

op99 @ 9

For some perspective on Katymine’s point about the non-official email addies for official business:

I work for a Fortune 500 100 company. We are prohibited from using any other email addresses for business purposes than our official ones, and everybody knows it. We have to go through little computer-based modules on ethics, protocol, document and email retention all the time, and your manager gets notified if you don’t do the modules, and he has to enforce that all his charges complete the modules, as does his manager, etc. We are blocked from using any other email sites from our work computer. I just don’t believe that any outfit under regulatory scrutiny (like the executive branch) does not enforce this type of control. Any deviation would have to be knowing and egregious.

ding ding ding. egregious, call on line 2.

Oklahoma kiddo @ 43

Regardless of the outcome of the car smuggling event in the Persian Gulf, the view here is that Iran is squarely in the Bush cross hairs. We are simply not going to let the oil in that part of the Middle East get away from us. Iraq and Iran have little to do with what the Bush boys and girls tell us it does. It’s about oil. Always has been.

Gulf of Tonkin. The first thing that crossed my mind when this broke on Friday morning.

My greatist fear these days is the use of war to stop the investigations,and put a cork in the media coverage[”look look! shiny”]

Then,we get to see what Frank Zappa ment when he said “the chairs and tables are moved aside and you see the brick wall in the back of the theater”

karen allen -
it goes a little deeper than that – current USA Utah: Brett Toleman was the “unauthorized staffer” who slipped language in to rev. Patriot Act – both Hatch & Specter backed him for USA job although WH and Sampson wanted Sampson to have it – quid pro quo Senator Hatch ?

Christy made the point that Hatch is in this up to his eyeballs and I’m with her, Specter is taking heat b/c he was chairman and such a weasel, but Hatch deserves plenty of sunlight :)

EvilDrPuma @ 57

PeteCO @ 26

Hopefully they won’t be tortured or otherwise harmed. I worry the Iranians might think the Geneva Conventions are “quaint” or something, and no longer apply.

Now, I wonder who could possibly have given them such an idea…

I hope you’re not “blaming America first”, Sir!

Looks like Turdblossom is taking Fredo on a little rowboat ride.

Chimpy has a support club of ONE.. Awww Gee!!

What happened to Laura and Barney?

karen allen @ 37

Whenever there is a commenter thinking perhaps Arlen Specter is starting to come around, remember he is the guy who gleefully inserted the piece into the Patriot Act allowing Bush to appoint US Attorneys without congressional approval. Although he blames a staff member, it was Specter alone who allowed it to go in.

It’s a cheesy trick Specter always employs. He talks the talk, he’s vocally “shocked” etc. by something Bushco is doing. When it’s time to vote, he never sticks to his initial statements and votes the Bush meme, always.

They’ve got something on him. I think it kills him to go along with this admin. He seems to know that he’s doing things that are bad for US. But, then they must send someone to ‘talk’ to him and he comes back on board.

Great Point!!

I hope one of the questioners of Kyle – Angel Moroni – Sampson on Thursday is “are you still being paid, and employed?”

This may be obvious to political junkies, but the average main street voter will be shocked – good fodder for Dobbs or Cafferty… Well, maybe, at least Cafferty.

EvilDrPuma @ 61

Phoenix Woman @ 47

karen allen @ 44

Monica Goodling is still on the payroll. Kyle Sampson, the connected Mormon from Utah, even though he resigned his title, is still on the DOJ payroll. No cut in pay for Kyle.

Now THAT is interesting! How’d they manage that?

Same way Rumsfeld is still collecting a check. These people don’t fire cronies, they move them into an office with fewer windows.

smiley @
19

Anonymous Liberal over at C&L says that only the president can fire USAs. Is that correct, and if so, were these firings even leagal if the president didn’t know about them as he claims? Something about this doesn’t seem right, though, because this points hasn’t been raised by anyone else yet.

we have been talking about this here at FDL for a while. bottom line, no one has been able to confirm that the President delegated his authority to fire these US Attorneys. These folks were fired (forced resignation = constructive discharge, aka fired). The powderkeg is over at the White House. The fuse is lit. That’s why Leahy and Conyers want to talk to Karl and Harriet.

snuffy @ 65

My greatist fear these days is the use of war to stop the investigations,and put a cork in the media coverage[”look look! shiny”]

Then,we get to see what Frank Zappa ment when he said “the chairs and tables are moved aside and you see the brick wall in the back of the theater”

Frank, where are you when we need you?

smiley @ 19

Anonymous Liberal over at C&L says that only the president can fire USAs. Is that correct, and if so, were these firings even leagal if the president didn’t know about them as he claims? Something about this doesn’t seem right, though, because this points hasn’t been raised by anyone else yet.

Smiley: check out this dKos diary. Mary2002 created this on May 16 (which seems like a long time ago, when you consider what new info we’ve learned since then). She documents what the President has to sign off on. Of course, these attorneys “resigned” under pressure, so technically they were not fired.

Looks like Turdblossom is taking Fredo on a little rowboat ride.

ah Dr. Probst, therein lies the rub – they can’t get rid of him – not b/c they’re worried about his loyalty, they hired him b/c he’s weak and pliant and they know some junior investigator will have him compromising testimony in no time

Terry Olson @ 60

. . .Kyle Sampson, the connected Mormon from Utah, even though he resigned his title, is still on the DOJ payroll. No cut in pay for Kyle.

Can’t remember where I read that he went over to the environmental side of justice. That oughta help Gore’s cause.

I need that information. Does anyone have that?

The WaPo article linked above was quite disturbing to read. Imagine, THREE years later and the author still is under a gag order, over an investigation the FBI isn’t interested in anymore.

This is pure totalitarian Bushit!

Say, anybody know of another planet I can move to?

PhoenixWoman @55: Ah, where to start about Kyle Sampson and his fellow Mormon defenders? Sampson served a “mission” in the LDS church for two years. He graduated from Brigham Young University. His law professor, Michael McConnell, recommended him to Senator Orrin Hatch, and Sampson went to work as an employee of Hatch. Sheldon Bradshaw, a former deputy US Attorney General, has stated that Sampson “has an outstanding legal mind” and that he “has been wronged”. Bradshaw and Sampson belong to the same ward (district) of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints in Salt Lake City. What a coincidence! Sampson is also good friends with a law school classmate, Elizabeth Cheney. Does the name “Cheney” somehow seem familiar? And there’s more, much more.

cbl @ 66

karen allen -
it goes a little deeper than that – current USA Utah: Brett Toleman was the “unauthorized staffer” who slipped language in to rev. Patriot Act – both Hatch & Specter backed him for USA job although WH and Sampson wanted Sampson to have it – quid pro quo Senator Hatch ?

Christy made the point that Hatch is in this up to his eyeballs and I’m with her, Specter is taking heat b/c he was chairman and such a weasel, but Hatch deserves plenty of sunlight :)

I printed out the email from Brett Tolman to William Moschella dated 11-9-05 at 11:06 pm (talk about the dead of night) where he replied to the request to slip the provision in: “I will get the comprehensive fix done.” Anyone got the date of Senate passage handy?

Gonzalez is testifying to the Senate Judicial Committee on April 17??? Why so soon (sigh)?

I think Kyle Sampson is a big wildcard here. He’s a Rove protege, so I doubt he’ll take the stand and tell the whole truth. But I’m very curious about which story he’s going to tell. Is he going to take the fall for the whole thing? (”It was all my idea. All by myself. As for that one-hour meeting with the AG where I was supposed to tell him about it, we just sat there in silence for sixty minutes. It was awkward, but I didn’t want my boss to know what I was up to. Then I went back to my office and wrote thousands of pages of fake e-mail about the whole thing.”) Or is he going to shiv Gonzales but protect Rove? (”Gonzo told me the Bush bet him that Gonzo could never pull off a Rove-like stunt like this without Rove’s help, so we had to keep Rove in the dark the whole time. That part worked, but since the whole thing blew up, Gonzo lost the bet. I don’t know what they were betting for, but Gonzo’s been brushing his teeth quite a bit lately.”)

Prof @ 76

Terry Olson @ 60

. . .Kyle Sampson, the connected Mormon from Utah, even though he resigned his title, is still on the DOJ payroll. No cut in pay for Kyle.

Can’t remember where I read that he went over to the environmental side of justice. That oughta help Gore’s cause.

I need that information. Does anyone have that?

Actually, I remember it now. Is is not Sampson. It is that Stephen Griles, recently convicted, has been sleeping with (and bought a house with) the head of the Environmental and Natural Resources Division of the Justice Dept — someone who also helped out a company. Not that Kyle Sampson went over there.

Do we know where Sampson is, and what his employment deal is with Justice at present?

PeteCO @ 64

Oklahoma kiddo @ 43

Regardless of the outcome of the car smuggling event in the Persian Gulf, the view here is that Iran is squarely in the Bush cross hairs. We are simply not going to let the oil in that part of the Middle East get away from us. Iraq and Iran have little to do with what the Bush boys and girls tell us it does. It’s about oil. Always has been.

Gulf of Tonkin. The first thing that crossed my mind when this broke on Friday morning.

My first thought, too.

cbl @ 75

Looks like Turdblossom is taking Fredo on a little rowboat ride.

ah Dr. Probst, therein lies the rub – they can’t get rid of him – not b/c they’re worried about his loyalty, they hired him b/c he’s weak and pliant and they know some junior investigator will have him compromising testimony in no time

I agree that they’re in a Catch-22. They can’t keep him, because he reeks of scandal, but they can’t really fire him, either, because that’s just going to make it worse. Another Bush crony will never survive the confirmation process, and a non-crony is going to have to do a bare minimum of house cleaning, and all sorts of fun stuff is going to come out.

Karl “Moroni” Sampson appears to be ready to talk. He just has to be pissed that he got passed over for USA job in Utah..

Even Lackey Toads will jump out of the water when they start to figure out they have been used. Rove and Gonzo are in a proxy war, I believe. I think Rove spoke for the WH when they had the Friday doc dump and Gonzo got egg all over his face.

It seems, therefore, the finger pointing is ready to get thick and heavy on Thursday when Sampson tries to help with more finger pointing at Gonzo. Hatch is probably telling him what to do.

It seems Our Benighted Emperor will wait until Gonzo is a “High Value Target” ie; If I give you Gonzo’s head, will you let all this die? He has to wait a while for that level to be reached. Then his “Dem’s overeach” might have some traction… “This is all over, and it was all Gonzo’s fault…”

Tired Fed

revised bill was passed 3/3/6, signed in to law 3/9

fyi – one of my unanswered questions is why did they have to have Senate Confirmation (voice vote) for USA Utah on 7/21/06 ???

Marion in Savannah –

You okay? I’ve missed your NYT firewall-outing at your website.

Prof– Alberto said he was still working there at his presser on the 13th:

QUESTION: Were there any discussions between you and the White House regarding you stepping down or Deputy Attorney General Paul McNulty stepping down, and with regard to the Chief of Staff Kyle Sampson, is he still here at the Justice Department working?

ATTORNEY GENERAL GONZALES: Kyle Sampson has resigned. I accepted his resignation yesterday as chief of staff. As a technical matter he is still at the department as he transitions out and looks for other employment.

more here

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/…..s-sampson/

karen allen @ 78

PhoenixWoman @55: Ah, where to start about Kyle Sampson and his fellow Mormon defenders? Sampson served a “mission” in the LDS church for two years. He graduated from Brigham Young University. His law professor, Michael McConnell, recommended him to Senator Orrin Hatch, and Sampson went to work as an employee of Hatch. Sheldon Bradshaw, a former deputy US Attorney General, has stated that Sampson “has an outstanding legal mind” and that he “has been wronged”. Bradshaw and Sampson belong to the same ward (district) of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints in Salt Lake City. What a coincidence! Sampson is also good friends with a law school classmate, Elizabeth Cheney. Does the name “Cheney” somehow seem familiar? And there’s more, much more.

OK, my head just exploded. I can’t keep up anymore. I guess that’s what they want.

Maybe its time for Leahy et al to note for the record that they are not asking that DOJ and WH officers be hooded, stripped naked and photographhed, kept in a dark grave sized room chained in stress positions for hours, forced to urinate upon themselves, threatened with dogs, struck, doused with icewater and left with cold air blowing on them until their heart rates drop, or any of the other interrogation techniques that DOJ has expressly approved as humane and reasonable.

Just show up in a dark suit and yellow tie and testify under oath, with a transcript.

karen allen @
52

Rep. Chris Cannon, R-UT and Senator Orrin Hatch R-UT, via the Salt Lake Tribune and other media, have come out solidly in support of Abu Gonzales. Has anybody connected the dots and see that Kyle Sampson is their peep?

The support of Gonzales by the Utah republicans should come as no suprise. The current US-Attorney for Utah is Brett Tolman, who in 2006 worked for Arlen Specter pushing through the Patriot Act renewal. Tolman got unanimous confirmation by the Senate. There is some speculation that Tolman helped slip in the provision in the Patriot Act under Specter’s name which allowed US-attorney vacancies to be filled without Senate confirmation. Rove failed in a duel with Specter to get Rove’s guy in the Utah US-Attorney spot, but eventually Rove got his guy in the Arkansas slot following the firing of Cummings. It all stinks of corruption, and any time Specter himself gets near this issue people should watch very carefully.

I think they’re past the point where they can dump Gonzo and staunch the bleeding here. They would’ve had a hard time doing it before the tobacco story, but that little gem had to have put them over the edge. That one really has to be investigated, even if Gonzo were to resign today. And there are quite a few rocks that are going to have to be turned over in that case.

fwiw, going on a “mission” is a fairly common occurrence for Mormon kids. Know a lot of folks that went on them. In fact, know lot of Mormons. Just because someone is LDS, or is in the same “ward” (which is the way that things are organized in the church) isn’t uncommon — especially if they lived in the same area in Salt Lake City. What is unusual with Sampson and company is the substantial amount of patronage work that Sen. Hatch has done for them. He doesn’t do that for just anyone, Mormon or not — and the fact that this was all linked to the Patriot Act provision insertion for the Congressional oversight end-run, among many other things, ought to raise a LOT of questions.

PhoenixWoman@45:

You are right about Hagel. Let’s not forget that he was one of the two Senators who voted against restoring Senate confirmation of USA’s last week.

He also voted against raising the minimum wage and voted for eliminating the federal minimum wage completely.

He may be right about Iraq, but he’s wrong about everything else.

ERGO, Sampson would seem to be ready to start the Canary thing… “he has been wronged..”

I love it!!

PeteCO @ 89

karen allen @ 78

PhoenixWoman @55: Ah, where to start about Kyle Sampson and his fellow Mormon defenders? Sampson served a “mission” in the LDS church for two years. He graduated from Brigham Young University. His law professor, Michael McConnell, recommended him to Senator Orrin Hatch, and Sampson went to work as an employee of Hatch. Sheldon Bradshaw, a former deputy US Attorney General, has stated that Sampson “has an outstanding legal mind” and that he “has been wronged”. Bradshaw and Sampson belong to the same ward (district) of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints in Salt Lake City. What a coincidence! Sampson is also good friends with a law school classmate, Elizabeth Cheney. Does the name “Cheney” somehow seem familiar? And there’s more, much more.

OK, my head just exploded. I can’t keep up anymore. I guess that’s what they want.

Mary4 @ 90

Just show up in a dark suit and yellow tie and testify under oath, with a transcript.

How quaint and pre-9/11.

cbl @ 86

Tired Fed

revised bill was passed 3/3/6, signed in to law 3/9

fyi – one of my unanswered questions is why did they have to have Senate Confirmation (voice vote) for USA Utah on 7/21/06 ???

yes, but the Conference Report was passed by the House on December 8th, less than a month after Tolman added this language. This late-night provision was apparently slipped into the conference version of the bill. No one noticed. At least some of the 89 Senators who voted for the conference report ought to be pissed.

Thad Beier @ 41

Yeah — note that Goodling is only taking a leave of absence — she’s not resigning. Because, you know, if she resigned there’d be no way to shield her with “executive privelege”

Which means that Goodling actually had communications with Bush.

If Sampson is still on the payroll (and I thought I read at TPM that they nixed the environmental job because of protests), then he likely had communications directly with Bush.

All other communications are fair game.

And I’d still go after the Bush-staffer conversations because there is no Executive Privilege to violate the law or aid and abet criminal activity. If it is found conclusively that the law has been broken, well…subpoena the top Bushie!!

Puesto @ 85

Karl “Moroni” Sampson appears to be ready to talk. He just has to be pissed that he got passed over for USA job in Utah..

Even Lackey Toads will jump out of the water when they start to figure out they have been used. Rove and Gonzo are in a proxy war, I believe. I think Rove spoke for the WH when they had the Friday doc dump and Gonzo got egg all over his face.

It seems, therefore, the finger pointing is ready to get thick and heavy on Thursday when Sampson tries to help with more finger pointing at Gonzo. Hatch is probably telling him what to do.

It seems Our Benighted Emperor will wait until Gonzo is a “High Value Target” ie; If I give you Gonzo’s head, will you let all this die? He has to wait a while for that level to be reached. Then his “Dem’s overeach” might have some traction… “This is all over, and it was all Gonzo’s fault…”

Why do you call him Moroni? The only Moroni reference I can come up with is from Johnny Dangerously…”I want this fargging wall knocked down. I want this fargging wall knocked down, and this farrging wall knocked down. (Explosion) This is fargging war!” Please advise. Reminiscing about Johnny Dangerously is fun!!! Note to self: go to video store. rent Johnny Dangerously DVD.

Mary4 @ 89

Maybe its time for Leahy et al to note for the record that they are not asking that DOJ and WH officers be hooded, stripped naked and photographhed, kept in a dark grave sized room chained in stress positions for hours, forced to urinate upon themselves, threatened with dogs, struck, doused with icewater and left with cold air blowing on them until their heart rates drop, or any of the other interrogation techniques that DOJ has expressly approved as humane and reasonable.

Just show up in a dark suit and yellow tie and testify under oath, with a transcript.

good point. hi Mary.

I can hear Leahy roaring that right now.

Phoenix Woman @ 47

karen allen @ 44

Monica Goodling is still on the payroll. Kyle Sampson, the connected Mormon from Utah, even though he resigned his title, is still on the DOJ payroll. No cut in pay for Kyle.

Now THAT is interesting! How’d they manage that?

Hey, as far as we know, Rumsfeld is still working over at the Pentagon on his “transition” while we pay his expenses (and salary?) including a staff of six or seven

Brad Berenson, an associate counsel in Bush’s first term, said of Sampson in 2001, “a tremendously sharp mind and shrewd polital talent”. Today, Berenson is Sampson’s personal defense attorney.

Sheldon Bradshaw,who as recently as today is staunchly defending Sampson and belongs to the same LDS ward in Utah, is now counsel at the FDA.

Taylor Oldroyd, Sampson’s good friend and fellow Mormon, now with the US Agriculure Dept.stated, “Kyle is the reason myself and his other friends now have jobs in the Bush administration.”

Prof @ 82

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/…..s-sampson/

SHAPIRO: According to Justice Department sources, after Kyle Sampson resigned as the attorney general’s chief of staff on Monday, he was going to work as a lawyer in the legislative section of the department’s environment division. …

Tired Fed -

At least some of the 89 Senators who voted for the conference report ought to be pissed

.

a few of them are . . .

http://feinstein.senate.gov/07…..-intro.pdf

TiredFed @ 79

cbl @ 66

karen allen -
it goes a little deeper than that – current USA Utah: Brett Toleman was the “unauthorized staffer” who slipped language in to rev. Patriot Act – both Hatch & Specter backed him for USA job although WH and Sampson wanted Sampson to have it – quid pro quo Senator Hatch ?

Christy made the point that Hatch is in this up to his eyeballs and I’m with her, Specter is taking heat b/c he was chairman and such a weasel, but Hatch deserves plenty of sunlight :)

I printed out the email from Brett Tolman to William Moschella dated 11-9-05 at 11:06 pm (talk about the dead of night) where he replied to the request to slip the provision in: “I will get the comprehensive fix done.” Anyone got the date of Senate passage handy?

March 3 passes senate; march 9 signed by president

Tired Fed, do you have a link to that email and others around that time?

PeteCO @ 67

I hope you’re not “blaming America first”, Sir!

When it comes to ignoring the Geneva Conventions and making torture an instrument of public policy, I blame America first, last, and only.

Sorry, but I have to be a nit-picker again. You spelled warrentless, the right spelling is warrantless. Also, a typo: And nNothing like stringing…

I’d humbly point out that calling Sampson “Moroni” is a bit of a religious slur…….
If he’s a liar and a jerk, then he deserves to be called on it. To bring his religion into it lowers the discourse.

[Ducking out]:)

Other little nuggets I found yesterday in my document diving…

1. Rep Issa was siting a Border Patrol report/memo which cannot be referenced by that agency then he changed it to DHS.
2. Rep Issa & Sensenbrenner paid a onsite visit to Carol Lam about immigration cases. SDCA office had 1/2 of it’s resources dedicated to immigration cases with a 42% increase in prosecutions in 2005.
3. One of the worst performing offices on immigration was TX and the USA in that office has a long Bush history going back to TX Gov Bush.
4. Senator Kyl was against the firing of USA Paul Charlton, even wrote a op-ed/statement in our local paper. And the recommended replacement from Kyl & McCain was ignored.

The reason why the fired USA might be willing to talk is that by the DOJ stating they were terminated for performance or poor management reasons, they are having severe problems finding employment. Many emails back and forth nearly begging to restate the reason for termination because this was effecting their ability to seek their next employment.

The one that seemed to willing to do anything to have that “tag” removed was the USA from MI. Tons of emails back and forth from her and she was finally promised a position in another department.

EvilDrPuma @ 106

PeteCO @ 67

I hope you’re not “blaming America first”, Sir!

When it comes to ignoring the Geneva Conventions and making torture an instrument of public policy, I blame America first, last, and only.

well said!

kdh @ 99

Why do you call him Moroni?

Morman prophet.

Kyle Sampson is unhappy he lost his job title at the DOJ. He isn’t unhappy with the Bush administration. They are taking care of him. And all the friends he supplied with jobs in the administation are still on the payroll, as is Kyle.

And it isn’t unusual for Mormons to serve a mission. Ot’s common.

Thread Theorist @ 91

karen allen @
52

Rep. Chris Cannon, R-UT and Senator Orrin Hatch R-UT, via the Salt Lake Tribune and other media, have come out solidly in support of Abu Gonzales. Has anybody connected the dots and see that Kyle Sampson is their peep?

The support of Gonzales by the Utah republicans should come as no suprise. The current US-Attorney for Utah is Brett Tolman, who in 2006 worked for Arlen Specter pushing through the Patriot Act renewal. Tolman got unanimous confirmation by the Senate. There is some speculation that Tolman helped slip in the provision in the Patriot Act under Specter’s name which allowed US-attorney vacancies to be filled without Senate confirmation. Rove failed in a duel with Specter to get Rove’s guy in the Utah US-Attorney spot, but eventually Rove got his guy in the Arkansas slot following the firing of Cummings. It all stinks of corruption, and any time Specter himself gets near this issue people should watch very carefully.

more than speculation. In an email dated 11-9-05, William Moschella (DOJ) suggested a “comprehensive fix” to Brett Tolman (Senate Judiciary staff):
Section 546 of title 28, United States Code, is amended by replacing subsections (c) and (d) with the following new subsection:

(c) A person appointed as United States attorney under this section may serve until the qualification of a United States attorney for such district appointed by the President under section 541 of this title.

Brett’s reply: “I will get the comprehensive fix done.”

katymine @ 110

The one that seemed to willing to do anything to have that “tag” removed was the USA from MI. Tons of emails back and forth from her and she was finally promised a position in another department.

And I still haven’t seen anything that indicates Chiara actually got a job in the government.

WaPo’s article today cited her from East Lansing Michigan — long ways from Washington or that $580K home in South Carolina.

I certainly hope it’s not a bad thing to serve on a mission. That’s about 1/6 of my life right now.

Tithonia @ 109

I’d humbly point out that calling Sampson “Moroni” is a bit of a religious slur…….
If he’s a liar and a jerk, then he deserves to be called on it. To bring his religion into it lowers the discourse.

Good point.

karen allen @
37

Whenever there is a commenter thinking perhaps Arlen Specter is starting to come around, remember he is the guy who gleefully inserted the piece into the Patriot Act allowing Bush to appoint US Attorneys without congressional approval. Although he blames a staff member, it was Specter alone who allowed it to go in.

It’s a cheesy trick Specter always employs. He talks the talk, he’s vocally “shocked” etc. by something Bushco is doing. When it’s time to vote, he never sticks to his initial statements and votes the Bush meme, always.

Has this staffer been identifed, fired,subpenoaed to find out who put him up to this, and charged with Fraud? Only Senators can insert things into laws. Or is Specter lying?

I have a request for the Sunday Talking Head Thread. Please consider delaying posting a new thread until after the discussion there runs down. Sunday morning political talk TV is packed with notable discussions. In my area, the shows overlap so I can’t watch it all. We discover new talking points, hear old ones, and we critique our elected officials and journalists on their effectiveness and honesty. I know there is nothing keeping us from continuing conversation on a news thread but the topic does tend to change to the topic of the new thread. Thank you for all you do and keep up the good work.

I’m not questioning that Sampson is a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. What I am doing is pointing out some ethical questions and connections. We have the right to know facts and information.

Orrin Hatch is staunchly supporting Sampson and Gonzales. Shouldn’t he also point out that Sampson was a former employee of his and the Hatch is a mentor of Sampson?

GPB@53:

I have had the same thought over the last few years.

I moved to NW Georgia about 8 years ago from Florida. I have had my house on the market since last September because I want to get the hell out of here and go back to Florida to get away from the narrow minded conservative majority of people here. With some exceptions, most of them have minds like steel traps–that have been left out in the rain so that now they are rusted shut!

I think alot of people in the South need a brain enema.

I feel like a bright blue dot in a very dull red state.

Mary4 @ 103

Prof @ 82

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/…..s-sampson/

SHAPIRO: According to Justice Department sources, after Kyle Sampson resigned as the attorney general’s chief of staff on Monday, he was going to work as a lawyer in the legislative section of the department’s environment division. …

By reporting his resignation publicly as some indication of corrective action while in actuality he remains in house, is this an incarnation of the saying “keep your friends close and your (potential) enemies closer” ?

dakine01 @ 5

I’m truly a pacifist and really do not wish ill on any other human. But it seems like it would be a very good thing to have an “extraordinary rendition” pulled on these smarmy anal orifices. Of course, that would require building a prison at Gitmo larger than the Super Max in Colorado…

I second about respecting others and not wishing ill. This squad of fascist thugs have usurped not only the constitution but the Law as well to serve their own purpose. Maybe they should be protected by that shreaded constitution and shielded by the abrogated law they have created. No 5th Amendment rights, No presumption of innocence. Required to prove absence of guilt. I am sure, some medium sized out of date Walmart can be shipped to Gitmo to warehouse the lot, without access to council, for as long as they were planning to do to others. Once a month shower privelidges for those co-operating with authorities outlining a history of their malfaesance.

All the best…….

angie @ 111

EvilDrPuma @ 106

PeteCO @ 67

I hope you’re not “blaming America first”, Sir!

When it comes to ignoring the Geneva Conventions and making torture an instrument of public policy, I blame America first, last, and only.

well said!

Blame Gonzalez First.

oregondave @ 117

Tithonia @ 109

I’d humbly point out that calling Sampson “Moroni” is a bit of a religious slur…….
If he’s a liar and a jerk, then he deserves to be called on it. To bring his religion into it lowers the discourse.

Good point.

I thought it was a Godfather reference!

yellowsnapdragon @ 106

Tired Fed, do you have a link to that email and others around that time?

dig it up. it was in one of the doc dumps. think it was this past friday night.

btw, Brigham Young University recently pulled Kyle Sampson’s photo from its online alumni magazine so it can’t be used by the media when writing about Sampson.

Senator Orrin Hatch today said Sampson has “a magnificent future”.

Tired Fed, Correction. March 2 passes senate
http://www.govtrack.us/congres…..=h109-3199 Sorry about that.

Puesto @ 58

Chimpy has a support club of ONE.. Awww Gee!!

Hey, you forgot Laura and Barney! :-)

[Mod Note; please have mercy on the Margin Faerie and close blockquotes, thanks]

oregondave @ 112

kdh @ 99

Why do you call him Moroni?

Morman prophet.

Oh, Thanks! I obviously need to educate myself with Mormonism. Appreciate the linky!

Frank, Sampson’s new job:

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/…..s-sampson/

Hatch moved to Utah in ‘76 from Pittsburg. He had a lot of (non-local) money behind him. Although he can claim to be from a pioneer Mormon family, he was born and educated in Pennsylvania. Maybe that’s where he met the Spectre. Anyway he defeated a great senator, Frank Moss, a Democrat Mormon (things were different then) claiming that Moss had been in Congress too long. My point is that he basically bought the office, and I’ve held for a long time that he probably could have gone almost anywhere to get elected. Since then, our state has been one of the best at drinking the koolaid and is now becoming famous for producing clever young operatives.

egregious @ 116
I certainly hope it’s not a bad thing to serve on a mission. That’s about 1/6 of my life right now.

egregious,
I have long admired you for what you do in the name of humanity. When you give us news on your latest trip, it inspires that all of us should work harder as you do to make this world a better place.

karen allen @ 127

btw, Brigham Young University recently pulled Kyle Sampson’s photo from its online alumni magazine so it can’t be used by the media when writing about Sampson.

Senator Orrin Hatch today said Sampson has “a magnificent future”.

In GOP ‘think’ tank, perhaps? ;0)

pachelbelle @ 120

GPB@53:

I have had the same thought over the last few years.

I moved to NW Georgia about 8 years ago from Florida. I have had my house on the market since last September because I want to get the hell out of here and go back to Florida to get away from the narrow minded conservative majority of people here. With some exceptions, most of them have minds like steel traps–that have been left out in the rain so that now they are rusted shut!

I think alot of people in the South need a brain enema.

I feel like a bright blue dot in a very dull red state.

So why do you want to move back to Florida? Along with TX, it has to top the list of States That Have Brought Us To This Sorry Pass.

Talking point to wingnuts: No one let Bill Clinton remove Ken Starr, but as soon as Carol Lam starts getting convictions against Republicans, Bush gets to fire her? How is that ok?

[Of course, then they have to dig into all the minutiae and detail of how Independent Counsels work etc. to respond - but the point will always still hang out there to non-lawyers who aren’t poltical junkies.]

105 – keep the overall context in mind. What happened with the Pat Act renewals is that Senator Russ Feingold actually managed, on his own and with nada support from the likes of Obama and Clinton, to put together three or four Republicans to stand with him on a filibuster of the original Pat Act revisions. I don’t think the slip in was there then, but Feingold would know – he knew the Pat Act stuff cold.

Feingold’s coalition said, with the holiday recess (Dec-Jan) coming up, they would agree to an extension of the old Pat Act, without any of the revisions, and take it back up when they came back. Bush had the hugest of hissy fits and directly went after Feingold, saying that the President would not agree to merely an extension of the old act and he would VETO such an approach and then the country would be left, over the holiday break, completely and totally unprotected from terrorists, with no Pat Act and it would be ALL RUSS FEINGOLD’S FAULT.

Spectre hit the talk shows to help make that point. Feingold flat out laughed at it and Bush blinked. He signed the extension before the break. However, over the break arms were twisted relentlessly and as they came back, Cheney was sent out to make face to face meetings and there was a flurry of changes back and forth to “accomodate” without actually accomodating, and the Republicans caved and Feingold’s great effort died.

But there was so much going on with very specific focus on a few provisions that my guess is it was ez for someone to slip in a change that was not even being discussed in this back and forths, where House and Senate and WH and OVP were talking about a few other unrelated provisions being changed.

lets’ see if I can get this link right. if not, the email is in pdf #3, at page DAG00..2010. over at McClatchey Docudump site

karen allen @
78

PhoenixWoman @55: Ah, where to start about Kyle Sampson and his fellow Mormon defenders? Sampson served a “mission” in the LDS church for two years. He graduated from Brigham Young University. His law professor, Michael McConnell, recommended him to Senator Orrin Hatch, and Sampson went to work as an employee of Hatch. Sheldon Bradshaw, a former deputy US Attorney General, has stated that Sampson “has an outstanding legal mind” and that he “has been wronged”. Bradshaw and Sampson belong to the same ward (district) of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints in Salt Lake City. What a coincidence! Sampson is also good friends with a law school classmate, Elizabeth Cheney. Does the name “Cheney” somehow seem familiar? And there’s more, much more.

Cheney, huh? Do tell.

Apple Canyon 2—

Thank you for your encouragement about my Russia work. I need this so much.

Please write more long pieces, I remember a couple of truly poetic things you have written in the past here.

Mmmmm… Toady legs, marinated in delicious lies.

;>)

pachelbelle @ 94

PhoenixWoman@45:

You are right about Hagel. Let’s not forget that he was one of the two Senators who voted against restoring Senate confirmation of USA’s last week.

He also voted against raising the minimum wage and voted for eliminating the federal minimum wage completely.

He may be right about Iraq, but he’s wrong about everything else.

He isn’t even right about Iraq. When it counts, he’s voted with Bush.

Christy:

My head explodes every time I see slime merchants like Orrin Hatch contradict the obvious: when asked by the Beard about the blatant contradictions by Abu over his “knowlege” of the firings he says “I see no inconsistency”.

Wanker of the Decade: Orrin Hatch

These guys can caterwall until the cows come home about “political witchunts” all they want but at the end of the day, the American people will strongly back all attempts to determine how their DOJ was a tool for political hackery.

Sampson is up this week and I don’t believe he will play the fall guy. Pressure to get Miers and Rove under oath will grow exponentially this week.

Oh, and don’t you love all the concern trolls going on and on about protecting “future presidents”?

These guys make me sick.

egregious @ 116

I certainly hope it’s not a bad thing to serve on a mission. That’s about 1/6 of my life right now.

if you only count your missions to Russia. but if you add your time here at FDL, would that be more like 1/2 your life? (FDL is beginning to eat into my “spare” time, too.) :)

karen allen @ 127

btw, Brigham Young University recently pulled Kyle Sampson’s photo from its online alumni magazine so it can’t be used by the media when writing about Sampson.

Senator Orrin Hatch today said Sampson has “a magnificent future”.

Does Google Cache still have it? If they don’t, try The Wayback Machine.

TiredFed @
114
Thanks for the removal of the “speculation” qualifier.

…more than speculation. In an email dated 11-9-05, William Moschella (DOJ) suggested a “comprehensive fix” to Brett Tolman (Senate Judiciary staff):
Section 546 of title 28, United States Code, is amended by replacing subsections (c) and (d) with the following new subsection:

(c) A person appointed as United States attorney under this section may serve until the qualification of a United States attorney for such district appointed by the President under section 541 of this title.

Brett’s reply: “I will get the comprehensive fix done.”

Another facet of this scandal is that part of the motive for the unprecedented mid-term firings of the US-Attorneys was to stock the “bench” of potential federal judge appointments. Rove figured that a US-A needed at least 2 years on the job to qualify for a federal judge appointment, and that these appointments would come near the end of Bush’s term. At the very least none of the 8 replacements now stands a chance of being appointed as a federal judge including Rove’s guy, and Tolman as well.

LandoftheFree @ 74:

Being ‘forced to resign under pressure’ is called constructive dishcarge.

As a former personnel director of a manufacturing company, I can tell you that it is legally considered ‘firing’ an employee and he or she is legally entitled to file a complaint.

TiredFed @ 126

yellowsnapdragon @ 106

Tired Fed, do you have a link to that email and others around that time?

dig it up. it was in one of the doc dumps. think it was this past friday night.

soory. I meant to say “I will…” I typed it, I swear!

TiredFed—

The 1/6 is just travel, mostly overseas. It’s full-time work wherever I am.

And as to FDL except for Plamehouse and the trial I don’t know that it takes up very much time.

Talking point to wingnuts: No one let Bill Clinton remove Ken Starr, but as soon as Carol Lam starts getting convictions against Republicans, Bush gets to fire her? How is that ok?

Even Better:

The FIRST Whitewater IC, a Republican named Robert Fiske, was about to shut down shop after six months because he and everyone else knew that there was nothing to investigate. But the Republicans couldn’t have that, so they invented a bogus “conflict of interest” charge to get Fiske replaced by the hyper-partisan zampolit Ken Starr.

Know what the “conflict of interest” was? Fiske was selected by Clinton’s AG, Janet Reno. Of course, ALL Independent Counsels are SUPPOSED to be selected by the AG, but the GOP/Media Complex didn’t let that fact stand in their way.

Phoenix Woman @ 141

pachelbelle @ 94

PhoenixWoman@45:

You are right about Hagel. Let’s not forget that he was one of the two Senators who voted against restoring Senate confirmation of USA’s last week.

He also voted against raising the minimum wage and voted for eliminating the federal minimum wage completely.

He may be right about Iraq, but he’s wrong about everything else.

He isn’t even right about Iraq. When it counts, he’s voted with Bush.

Ding!

Re: Moroni, aka the Angel Moroni..

Because Moroni’s mission was vital to the restoration of the gospel of Jesus Christ and the establishment of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, a statue of Moroni as a herald sounding a trumpet has been placed on several Latter-day Saint temples (e.g., Salt Lake City, Los Angeles, and Washington, D.C.).

kdh @ 99

Puesto @ 85

Karl “Moroni” Sampson appears to be ready to talk. He just has to be pissed that he got passed over for USA job in Utah..

Even Lackey Toads will jump out of the water when they start to figure out they have been used. Rove and Gonzo are in a proxy war, I believe. I think Rove spoke for the WH when they had the Friday doc dump and Gonzo got egg all over his face.

It seems, therefore, the finger pointing is ready to get thick and heavy on Thursday when Sampson tries to help with more finger pointing at Gonzo. Hatch is probably telling him what to do.

It seems Our Benighted Emperor will wait until Gonzo is a “High Value Target” ie; If I give you Gonzo’s head, will you let all this die? He has to wait a while for that level to be reached. Then his “Dem’s overeach” might have some traction… “This is all over, and it was all Gonzo’s fault…”

Why do you call him Moroni? The only Moroni reference I can come up with is from Johnny Dangerously…”I want this fargging wall knocked down. I want this fargging wall knocked down, and this farrging wall knocked down. (Explosion) This is fargging war!” Please advise. Reminiscing about Johnny Dangerously is fun!!! Note to self: go to video store. rent Johnny Dangerously DVD.

oregondave @
117

Tithonia @ 109

I’d humbly point out that calling Sampson “Moroni” is a bit of a religious slur…….
If he’s a liar and a jerk, then he deserves to be called on it. To bring his religion into it lowers the discourse.

Good point.

Okay, just drop the ‘i’ !

Volunteering can be satisfying. For example, take me, I drive one of the church buses in our little burg. But I never go to church. One of the minor paybacks, is that these folks tolerate my political radicalism. Though we never talk politics. And more importantly, I think they like me too. And I know I like them.

We know the Bush political dynasty is absolutely ruthless. They want a one party state.

Until I see emails released in a doc-dump that originate from non-governmental addresses, rather than appearing in quoted replies, I’m going to believe that ‘Rove’s Shop’ does its email business off the books, on RNC servers.

And Henry Waxman needs to deal with this quick-smart, before the servers mysteriously vanish. My gut sense is that the gwb43.com mailing addresses hide an awful lot of shit.

Thread Theorist @ 145

TiredFed @
114
Thanks for the removal of the “speculation” qualifier.

…more than speculation. In an email dated 11-9-05, William Moschella (DOJ) suggested a “comprehensive fix” to Brett Tolman (Senate Judiciary staff):
Section 546 of title 28, United States Code, is amended by replacing subsections (c) and (d) with the following new subsection:

(c) A person appointed as United States attorney under this section may serve until the qualification of a United States attorney for such district appointed by the President under section 541 of this title.

Brett’s reply: “I will get the comprehensive fix done.”

Another facet of this scandal is that part of the motive for the unprecedented mid-term firings of the US-Attorneys was to stock the “bench” of potential federal judge appointments. Rove figured that a US-A needed at least 2 years on the job to qualify for a federal judge appointment, and that these appointments would come near the end of Bush’s term. At the very least none of the 8 replacements now stands a chance of being appointed as a federal judge including Rove’s guy, and Tolman as well.

John McKay, former USA of Western District, State of Washington and one of the Gonzalez Nine, applied for such a judgeship. Guess he wont be getting it now.

Via Josh:

http://www.sltrib.com/news/ci_5517136

Cannon comes right out and says the firings were political but that’s OK. Oh really? You want to run on that platform Chris?

And another RNC talking point is bubbling up: since there is no implication of a “crime” there is no need for subpoenas. WTF???

Oversight by the Congress is not a legal proceeding. It is an exploration of how OUR government is functioning in OUR name.

But, of course, since W thinks he’s the dicatator of a banana republic, he doesn’t get that now does he?

SHINE A LIGHT SHINE A LIGHT SHINE A LIGHT.

And see all manner and form of vermin scurry out.

I know many of you have seen this already, but if true, it makes me wonder just how many different kinds of spies are out there watching us all the time, especially those of us involved with the peace movement from BEFORE this war.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03…..ref=slogin
“For at least a year before the 2004 Republican National Convention, teams of undercover New York City police officers traveled to cities across the country, Canada and Europe to conduct covert observations of people who planned to protest at the convention, according to police records and interviews.

Rayne… I have gone back and looked any reference about Chiara and there are multiple email exchanges about finding a gov job – leadership position at VAWA. There were tons of exchanges about looking for a position with McNulty but nothing confirmed. The date spans are into December.

The more W resists this the harder his life is gonna be. We’ll be on his and the MSMs ass like white on rice.

This is a matter of principle and we are going to win this fight.

And another RNC talking point is bubbling up: since there is no implication of a “crime” there is no need for subpoenas. WTF???

Guess their tiny minds also have short memories. Their boi “scooter” was tried and convicted of obstruction, and lying. We already know Fredo lied to Congress, it’s not rocket science.

Guitar Playing Bastard @53:

The thought has crossed my mind (about saying “never mind. You can secede.”). I grew up in Texas and always say it is a good place to be from, FAR from…even though I have a very dear liberal uncle who lives there.

but on the other hand, I escaped Texas and am a true-believer pluralist and think everyone has something to contribute. so I think we gotta listen and come up with an equitable compromise. Of course believing that makes me a crazy lefty. sigh.

Nah. fuckem after all.

Re: Criticisms of “religious comments.” I appreciate and respect the comment about not making religious slurs. I hear you.

However, I would point out that I am not the one who brought these conservative, authoritarian, evangelical, intolerant dogmas into the politics of MY COUNTRY..

When NIT Romney will be running on “My morals (read, because I am LDS) are higher than theirs” I think it is fair game.

Utah supported Chimpy by some 75% in the last election and it is because of the Theocracy they have become. Anyone who touts, or has a background in that sort of Theocratic government and wants to bring it to Washington, to me, is fair game.

Faith based initiatives, and Air Force Academy cadets acting the “KKK” of Christianity needs to be fought boldly and bluntly. Your religious affiliation should not get you appointed to be a public official.

An atheist would not stand a chance in having his resume reviewed for a job as a USAttorney.

These are the seeds of a budding theocracy that is MY Country…. with all due respect.

Kevster @ 160

The more W resists this the harder his life is gonna be. We’ll be on his and the MSMs ass like white on rice.

This is a matter of principle and we are going to win this fight.

Hound Presidunce Pissy Boy and his handlers and MSM lackeys mercilessly EVERY DAY!
.

egregious @139
You are very generous in your compliment.
Actually, I lurk more than write because I just feel privileged to be part of this community.
There is so much caring, compassionate, intelligent, and witty writing that goes on here that a person lurking can learn a lot if they just read the post and the comments related to that post.

rxbusa @
162

Guitar Playing Bastard @53:

The thought has crossed my mind (about saying “never mind. You can secede.”). I grew up in Texas and always say it is a good place to be from, FAR from…even though I have a very dear liberal uncle who lives there.

but on the other hand, I escaped Texas and am a true-believer pluralist and think everyone has something to contribute. so I think we gotta listen and come up with an equitable compromise. Of course believing that makes me a crazy lefty. sigh.

Nah. fuckem after all.

I used to be a pluralist. Then, for the past 13 years, I saw what being a pluralist got you (see the Dems of the past 13 years) and I decided pluralism isn’t what it’s cracked up to be.

Agreed. Fuck ‘em.

Tired Fed @156 Evergreen politics, based in Mckay’s neck of the woods, has been covering the judgeship aspect as well as other details – some very good stuff there

http://www.evergreenpolitics.com/

He was asked in his interview why he didn’t handel the voter fraud issue differently and the WH has let that slot sit empty rather than recommend on anyone who didn’t fit the “loyal Bushie” criteria.

Apple Canyon 2—Your response is the kind of poetic writing I am talking about.

More please!!

cbl,
I started writing you a thank you at the end of the last post when Christy told us there was a new thread.
I thank you so much for the heads up on the PBS documentary.
You are a sweetheart!

Forrest Prince @ 77

The WaPo article linked above was quite disturbing to read. Imagine, THREE years later and the author still is under a gag order, over an investigation the FBI isn’t interested in anymore.

This is pure totalitarian Bushit!

Say, anybody know of another planet I can move to?

Linked where? I’d like to read it.

Oklahoma kiddo @ 154

We know the Bush political dynasty is absolutely ruthless. They want a one party state.

Why one party? Much better to have the illusion of democracy with Money Party One vs Money Party Two.As long as the barrier to entry into the political process is dictated by wealth, The ruling elite’s position is guaranteed.

“…this inequality persisted, Sokoloff writes, because elites were able to “institutionalize an unequal distribution of political power” and to “use that greater influence to establish rules, laws and other government policies that advantaged members of the elite relative to non-members.”

http://www.rollingstone.com/po…..sfer/print

cbl @
66

karen allen -
it goes a little deeper than that – current USA Utah: Brett Toleman was the “unauthorized staffer” who slipped language in to rev. Patriot Act – both Hatch & Specter backed him for USA job although WH and Sampson wanted Sampson to have it – quid pro quo Senator Hatch ?

Christy made the point that Hatch is in this up to his eyeballs and I’m with her, Specter is taking heat b/c he was chairman and such a weasel, but Hatch deserves plenty of sunlight :)

This guy is not a Senator he can’t slip things into a law! His law license is being suspended by the American Bar Assocation I trust?

New thread up.

PeteCO @ 73

snuffy @ 65

My greatist fear these days is the use of war to stop the investigations,and put a cork in the media coverage[”look look! shiny”]

Then,we get to see what Frank Zappa ment when he said “the chairs and tables are moved aside and you see the brick wall in the back of the theater”

Frank, where are you when we need you?

Oh, I hope he is back…perhaps reincarnated as Brendancalling or someone with great sensibilities like that.

I was over looking at the editorials in the WaPo this morning. One was on representation for DC and how rotten the Republicans are for preventing that. Another was the Bush administration turning a blind eye to the increasing autocracy of the Egyptian government and how it should be pushing for more democracy. Then I think about the WaPo editorials concerning events here the last few months where they regurgitate Repub talking points. Are these people whacked or what?

TiredFed @
79

cbl @ 66

karen allen -
it goes a little deeper than that – current USA Utah: Brett Toleman was the “unauthorized staffer” who slipped language in to rev. Patriot Act – both Hatch & Specter backed him for USA job although WH and Sampson wanted Sampson to have it – quid pro quo Senator Hatch ?

Christy made the point that Hatch is in this up to his eyeballs and I’m with her, Specter is taking heat b/c he was chairman and such a weasel, but Hatch deserves plenty of sunlight :)

I printed out the email from Brett Tolman to William Moschella dated 11-9-05 at 11:06 pm (talk about the dead of night) where he replied to the request to slip the provision in: “I will get the comprehensive fix done.” Anyone got the date of Senate passage handy?

It was Dec 05 as i recall

PeteCO@ 135:

Jeb Bush is no longer in charge and the new governor, although he is Republican, isn’t acting like a neocon. There are changes going on in Florida. There are a lot of progressives in Florida, but with little bushco Jeb and his buddies in charge they could totally screw the election system and keep the progressive voices muffled.

I want to go back and add my voice where it may make a difference–working from the inside out, so to speak.

Here, I am a voice crying in the wilderness. And I have to be careful of what I say and to whom because there are a lot of good ole boys who might want to “teach me a lesson.” As a single woman living alone in a rural area, I’m not taking any chances!

Guitar_Playing_Bastard @ 53

This is something I’ve brought up before, and maybe it bears a little more examination (responses will tell the tale).

I’m not so sure, if Lincoln could see what the nation has become, he would have bothered stopping the Confederacy from seceding.

In my opinion, the south in particular, has led the way in the dumbing down of our nation, a process started before I was born. If you don’t believe me, see the way our opposite numbers think.

I don’t know if I see any way out of the political morass our country is in. Even if we take power (win the Senate more decisively, and take the WH) in 2008, the circus will never end. The wingnuts are never going to figure out they’re wrong (and they ARE wrong), and given their desire to jam their ways down our throats, I just don’t see a way out. There can never be real peace among our own people, we’re descending toward being the Serbs and Croats, the Shia and the Sunnis. At my age, I probably won’t live to see he end of it , but we’re so indebted, and spread thin, so weakened by job outsourcing and the destruction of the American military by the Iraq clusterfuck,. there’s hardly any bones left to pick.

I don’t know about you, but I grow weary of the struggle. The USA is fucked. I’ve never believed until now, the US could be destroyed in a single man’s tenure, even a two-term one, but I have been proven wrong. It’s like Greg Stillson (a character from the Stephen King book “The Dead Zone”) come to life.

Would Lincoln have allowed the Confederacy to stand, had he been able to see into the future? I wish he had let them go. The remainder of the US would be stronger, smarter and better equipped to stand among the great nations of the world.

Bush is from a Connecticut family and attended Ivy League schools. I won’t say anything else except that there are boneheads all over this nation. *I* am not sorry Lincoln didn’t let us go.

Thread Theorist @ 145

Another facet of this scandal is that part of the motive for the unprecedented mid-term firings of the US-Attorneys was to stock the “bench” of potential federal judge appointments. Rove figured that a US-A needed at least 2 years on the job to qualify for a federal judge appointment, and that these appointments would come near the end of Bush’s term. At the very least none of the 8 replacements now stands a chance of being appointed as a federal judge including Rove’s guy, and Tolman as well.

IMO, this is at the heart of the matter. This is typical of Rove’s thinking: control the judiciary long-term. The selection process was secondary. Again, IMO, Rove used Sampson and others to produce a list of those attorneys that they DIDN’T want to ever become judges–because they weren’t “loyal Bushies”, i.e., couldn’t be trusted in future to rule against Democrats. The rest of the complaints–immigration, gun cases, pornography–were just tangential issues to supposedly build up a case against attorneys that they had decided to throw overboard for larger political reasons.

Phoenix Woman @ 141

pachelbelle @ 94

PhoenixWoman@45:

You are right about Hagel. Let’s not forget that he was one of the two Senators who voted against restoring Senate confirmation of USA’s last week.

He also voted against raising the minimum wage and voted for eliminating the federal minimum wage completely.

He may be right about Iraq, but he’s wrong about everything else.

He isn’t even right about Iraq. When it counts, he’s voted with Bush.

OMG–you’re right! I can’t believe that I fell for his bullsh*t orations! Thanks for setting me straight!

Saw Graham on Face the Nation today and Lindsey didn’t look like he was up to facing the nation or anything else. Maybe his Republic logic in defending the indefensible is catching up with him. I’m waiting for his and his fellow Republics’ tongues to fall out.

cbl @ 86

Tired Fed

revised bill was passed 3/3/6, signed in to law 3/9

fyi – one of my unanswered questions is why did they have to have Senate Confirmation (voice vote) for USA Utah on 7/21/06 ???

Because they weren’t ready to show their hand yet. Mass firings still to come.

Lindy @
178

Bush is from a Connecticut family and attended Ivy League schools. I won’t say anything else except that there are boneheads all over this nation. *I* am not sorry Lincoln didn’t let us go.

that may be true, but the values he espouses are most prevalent inn the south. It’s a damn shame most of the great cultural achievements of the US also originate there (Cooking, Music) but that would have propagated regardless.

But most of the knuckle-dragging, mouth-breathing dogma seems to be most prevalent in the southern US from Virginia to Texas.

When you loiok at the political history of the US over the past 60 years (post-war), the whole “Southern Strategy” has served the repukes well and kept them in power for the majority of the past 40 years.

So, yeah, I think I can say, I wish Lincoln had let them secede.

ChristyHardinSmith@40
Here’s some raw expresso wrt USA scandal:

For a coup [d’etat] to succeed, it need only succeed…because who controls any investigation? No matter any witnesses, document trails, evidence or outrage.

Observe the past and forthcoming maneuverings of the current Administration. That principle of covert ops was long ago established.

We are seeing the co-opting of the justice system to establish and then maintain control. As for any investigation, what better targets than SCOTUS and USAs.

The little conspiracy wheels are going in my head: remember the fuss about an incident a while back where a bill was passed which had gotten changed in conference? What was that, anyone? Maybe that was a dry run?

“I’m getting a whole “discussion off the books” feeling from these people that needs some serious explanation.”

“How, exactly, is an e-mail discussion waged in non-governmental e-mails protected by Executive Privilege?”

No shit. Time’s up for these clowns. The questions keep piling up and no straight answers are forthcoming.

They’ve had weeks and weeks to start explaining this network of deceit — time’s up.

It’s going to take a lot more than subpoenas to drag any truth out of Bushco.

Since the Senate majority is still too slim to support impeachment (even if articles could be gotten through the House – but without any Republic support, would just be construed as “partisan payback for Clinton”), then the best option is ongoing investigations/subpoenas, the whole mishegas.

Keep hammering on rule of law and oversight. Let the various committees of the Senate and House pick a day of the week and do their thing so that there is something every day. Keep the lights shining on the cockroaches and keep ‘em scurrying.

Even if the Chimpy claims EP, it can be worked around. I believe Leahy and Schumer and Waxman have a number of disgruntled career lawyers and civil servants who are ripsh*t over the last six years.

There is no way that the Republics can gum away ALL the crap they’ve been floating and outside of the 30%, the rest of the country has been catching on. Frame the talking points from the left in a reasonable, deliberate tone. Let Brit Hume, Rust Limpballs, Hannity, O’Lielly et al froth at the mouth, slap ‘em with the truth, and we can pretty much assure the Republic scumsuckers will be mostly irrelevant for the next generation.

My $.02

PeteCO@171
“…this inequality persisted, Sokoloff writes, because elites were able to “institutionalize an unequal distribution of political power” and to “use that greater influence to establish rules, laws and other government policies that advantaged members of the elite relative to non-members.”

The 2 Houses of Cong. were created as one of the pre-conditions to “elites” acceptance of the Constitution. Electon of Senators was vital to slay the power of any “popular”, majority-rule power in a potential democracy.

BTW, when did the US become a Democracy? Was it 1920, when women got national right to vote? Was it later, when most barriers to “colored” voting were removed? So confusing, isn’t it?

dakine01 @ 187

Since the Senate majority is still too slim to support impeachment (even if articles could be gotten through the House – but without any Republic support, would just be construed as “partisan payback for Clinton”), then the best option is ongoing investigations/subpoenas, the whole mishegas.

Keep hammering on rule of law and oversight. Let the various committees of the Senate and House pick a day of the week and do their thing so that there is something every day. Keep the lights shining on the cockroaches and keep ‘em scurrying.

Even if the Chimpy claims EP, it can be worked around. I believe Leahy and Schumer and Waxman have a number of disgruntled career lawyers and civil servants who are ripsh*t over the last six years.

There is no way that the Republics can gum away ALL the crap they’ve been floating and outside of the 30%, the rest of the country has been catching on. Frame the talking points from the left in a reasonable, deliberate tone. Let Brit Hume, Rust Limpballs, Hannity, O’Lielly et al froth at the mouth, slap ‘em with the truth, and we can pretty much assure the Republic scumsuckers will be mostly irrelevant for the next generation.

My $.02

You make an interesting point. If their tactic is to bury us in scandal, let’s turn that around against them. Let’s keep beating the drum of corruption in all arenas of the federal government, and then make the point that this is only the tip of the iceberg without the evidence which executive privilege hides from view.

If what we SEE on the surface is THIS ugly, what on earth is under that big rock called the White House? The fish rots from the head down, after all.

Guitar_Playing_Bastard @
166

rxbusa @
162

Guitar Playing Bastard @53:

The thought has crossed my mind (about saying “never mind. You can secede.”). I grew up in Texas and always say it is a good place to be from, FAR from…even though I have a very dear liberal uncle who lives there.

but on the other hand, I escaped Texas and am a true-believer pluralist and think everyone has something to contribute. so I think we gotta listen and come up with an equitable compromise. Of course believing that makes me a crazy lefty. sigh.

Nah. fuckem after all.

I used to be a pluralist. Then, for the past 13 years, I saw what being a pluralist got you (see the Dems of the past 13 years) and I decided pluralism isn’t what it’s cracked up to be.

Agreed. Fuck ‘em.

Dorothy & Toto were also from where I fled, wanna guess? ditto on the last sentiment. and Orrin Toady Hatch would only know honour if a bird flew over! All the best……..

I have a question for Patrick Fitzgerald: did you abort the Plame investigation after indicting Scooter Libby because Alberto Gonzales ordered you to?

(I’m not casting aspersions on Fitz. Gonzo is his boss and could easily have brought him to heel by saying: “No real evidence of a crime, we’re dropping it.” Fitz’s only choice would have been to drop it or resign and if I were him, I’d have figured I could do more to get in their way from the inside.)

Late to the party again, but here’s an analysis I did of some of the latest e-mails yesterday:

http://cujo359.blogspot.com/20…..eight.html

This new document set brings up quite a few pointed questions.

Having lived in Texas, I know that the one thing of note that blossoms on cow turds is the psilocybin mushroom. Among real cowboys, who thought people were fools for collecting them, they were called cowshit mushrooms. What if George bought the former cattle ranch, where he likes to clear brush, for the ‘blossoms’ growing on the remnants of old cow ‘turd’s there? It might explain a lot about the Crawford Village Idiot. I bet Laura got a great tea recipe from an enabler with an apropos nickname.

things come undone @ 172

cbl @
66

karen allen -
it goes a little deeper than that – current USA Utah: Brett Toleman was the “unauthorized staffer” who slipped language in to rev. Patriot Act – both Hatch & Specter backed him for USA job although WH and Sampson wanted Sampson to have it – quid pro quo Senator Hatch ?

Christy made the point that Hatch is in this up to his eyeballs and I’m with her, Specter is taking heat b/c he was chairman and such a weasel, but Hatch deserves plenty of sunlight :)

This guy is not a Senator he can’t slip things into a law! His law license is being suspended by the American Bar Assocation I trust?

hahaha. he’s now a US Attorney I believe.

yellowdogD @ 182

cbl @ 86

Tired Fed

revised bill was passed 3/3/6, signed in to law 3/9

fyi – one of my unanswered questions is why did they have to have Senate Confirmation (voice vote) for USA Utah on 7/21/06 ???

Because they weren’t ready to show their hand yet. Mass firings still to come.

looks like it was a matter of timing.

Bugboy @ 185

The little conspiracy wheels are going in my head: remember the fuss about an incident a while back where a bill was passed which had gotten changed in conference? What was that, anyone? Maybe that was a dry run?

that was a very strange scenario, unlike this one. IIRC, a change was made after the conference report was passed by one or both houses. will have to look it up. however, what happened here is not unprecedented; it happens all the time on big approps bills.

I hope this is not OT…but this article in today’s Washington Post is definately worth a read….

http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..01613.html

As regards the “off-the-books” communications:

As an IT weenie with a great amount of curiosity and a suspicious nature, the first place I would look is in Knoxville TN. I would move out from there as logs are analyzed.

But really, setting up a mail server on a DSL line, anywhere, is trivial stuff.

How deep does this rabbit hole go? All the way, I suspect.

PeteCO @
64

Oklahoma kiddo @ 43

Regardless of the outcome of the car smuggling event in the Persian Gulf, the view here is that Iran is squarely in the Bush cross hairs. We are simply not going to let the oil in that part of the Middle East get away from us. Iraq and Iran have little to do with what the Bush boys and girls tell us it does. It’s about oil. Always has been.

Gulf of Tonkin. The first thing that crossed my mind when this broke on Friday morning.

The USS Pueblo.

kdh @ 130

oregondave @ 112

kdh @ 99

Why do you call him Moroni?

Morman prophet.

Oh, Thanks! I obviously need to educate myself with Mormonism. Appreciate the linky!

Recommended read: “Under the banner of Heaven” by Jon Krakauer

T. Scheisskopf @ 198

As regards the “off-the-books” communications:

As an IT weenie with a great amount of curiosity and a suspicious nature, the first place I would look is in Knoxville TN. I would move out from there as logs are analyzed.

But really, setting up a mail server on a DSL line, anywhere, is trivial stuff.

How deep does this rabbit hole go? All the way, I suspect.

Well, I noticed your screen name.

Even if they weren’t doing anything wrong, which seems impossible, there still should be a huge problem with conducting government business on non-government systems. First there are archival and transparency issues which many other have brought up. But the issue that is not often mentioned is the security issue. Who the hell is running the gwb43.com domain? Do YOU trust these people to maintain a secure mail server? I sure as hell don’t.

rxbusa @
18
Abu understands perfectly what his job is and it is to twist the DOJ into another instrument to enforce the permanent Repuglican majority. That shit ended permanently in November 2006!!!!

Comparing Northern to Southern, this says something – note that all the safest places to be in the country are Northern, all the most dangerous towards the South – and this very much reflects the morality of the local populations. Now, the Southwest is in more crime trouble than the Deep South (excepting Tennessee). Please don’t take me wrong when I suggest that the high proportion of relatives of Gonzalez there is a contributing factor – the difference between Bush I and Bush II being that II has embraced not so much a WASP as a Mexican attitude towards the law – the Mexican attitude being that the law exists exclusively to serve power.

Cathie Martin. Monica Goodling. Mark Foley.

Mark Foley?!?!?!

So, I wonder if President Bush viewed the pre-election Rep. Mark Foley (R-FL) sex scandal as being “a partisan fishing expedition aimed at honorable public servants”?

Or maybe it was an “overblown personnel matter” not deserving of the intense media coverage afforded it before last November’s elections?

Josh Marshall says: “But we know that US Attorney David Iglesias was fired because he wouldn’t submit to pressure from Republican activists and members of Congress to issue an election-timed indictment to save New Mexico’s Republican Rep. Heather Wilson.”

He also points out that what is “missing” from the DOJ document dump may be just as important as what has been released up to this point.

So, let’s look at the clues that might indicate what is “missing”:

1) By last October, Bush, Rove and Gonzales had politicized as much as possible the offices of the U.S. Attorneys.

2) The Mark Foley sex scandal broke like a tsunami wave over the House Republican leadership, the White House political strategists and all the Republicans running for election or re-election around the country…including Heather Wilson of New Mexico.

3) David Iglesias, the U.S. Attorney for New Mexico, is contacted during this critical October pre-election time-frame, to generate anti-Democratic Party publicity, to help Heather Wilson in her bid to retain her seat in Congress.

You do see the pattern, don’t you?

In Karl Rove’s mind, the essential thing before any election is to control “the message,” to control “the publicity,” and the Mark Foley sex scandal had turned last year’s Republican election strategy upside down. Instead of Rove ordering the “swift-boating” of Democrats, the Mark Foley sex scandal was “swift-boating” Republicans around the country, and the scandal was based on facts, not on fabricated lies.

Thus, all the Republican-appointed U.S. Attorneys were mobilized to “pushback” against the negative publicity of the Mark Foley sex scandal in an attempt to push this scandal into the background and replace this negative publicity detrimental to Republicans with news reports of contrived Democratic Party improprieties.

This is what is missing in the emails released. Any internal White House deliberations involving the Mark Foley sex scandal, as well as any communications with anyone in the DOJ that refers to the handling of the Mark Foley sex scandal last October, are not being released.

I don’t believe the Mark Foley scandal was the sole reason for the firing of eight U.S. Attorneys in December, but I do believe it served as a catalyst. Why? Because Rove and the neo-con Republican strategists realized that if certain U.S. attorneys were unwilling to “break the law” concerning “pushback” over the Mark Foley sex scandal, then (in Rove’s and their minds) how could these rogue U.S. Attorneys be trusted to “help” the Republican cause in the lead-up to the November 2008 elections? Thus, eight U.S. Attorneys, who chose following the apolitical, non-partisan “rule of law” over helping the Republicans retain control of Congress last year, HAD TO GO.

Which, of course, makes one wonder how corrupt the Republican-appointed U.S. Attorneys who were not fired are? What did they do to help “pushback” last year against the negative Republican publicity generated by the Mark Foley sex scandal? Can any of them be trusted to follow the “rule of law” and put aside their partisan allegiances, especially in the lead-up to the November 2008 elections?

Any “rule of law” American, whether Democrat or Republican or Independent, should be very concerned over the answer to these questions.

Which makes interrogating Monica Goodling, the DOJ’s White House liaison, that much more important, under oath, in public, before a congressional hearing. Last October, during the midst of the Mark Foley sex scandal, she would have been the go-between, passing Rovian partisan instructions to the DOJ and to the U.S. Attorneys on how to handle the fallout from the Mark Foley sex scandal. Hopefully, her “extended leave of absence” doesn’t involve her skipping the country?

Christy Hardin Smith @
62

Hatch has a number of fingers in the Turdblossom pie.

must delete mental image.
must delete mental image.
must delete mertal image …

…

pachelbelle @
121

GPB@53:

I have had the same thought over the last few years.

I moved to NW Georgia about 8 years ago from Florida. I have had my house on the market since last September because I want to get the hell out of here and go back to Florida to get away from the narrow minded conservative majority of people here. With some exceptions, most of them have minds like steel traps–that have been left out in the rain so that now they are rusted shut!

I think alot of people in the South need a brain enema.

I feel like a bright blue dot in a very dull red state.

i respect GPB a great deal, but there are at least two reasons to not have Lincoln blow off the Confederacy.

the Union was worthy preserving and still is.
And slavery is an abomination and must be destroyed.

i live in Red meat texas in the bluest state capital (”Live Music Capital of the World“) in all the South.
we had six years as shrubRove as our governor, before they attacked D.C.
i feel shame as big as the Dixie Chicks for what has been inflicted on our world in Texas’ name by these carpetbagging Connecticut Yankees.

It could not be tolerable for the North to coexist with a slave Confederacy on it southern border.

Imagine a vast slave-economy subsidized Klan Army.

The South had to be defeated.

we CAN still be repatriated!

Please?

oh, you could still blame us for Lee Harvey Oswald, too.

being a texan ain’t real easy like.

(i have been on 10mg of lexapro for four years now.)

and i come here every night to mainline all the deep pure blue i can get.

I haven’t read the whole thing, but I can attest to the fact that some government agencies use outside email.

I got an email from somebody purporting to be an FBI agent a few years ago, about my business, and trying to track down some information on somebody who bought something from it.

It was from a yahoo address, and they had asked for business records for a certain time, so i pretty much shined it on.

Lo and behold a few weeks letter, i get a certified letter from the same person via snail mail.

I think i asked the person when I called her what’s the deal with the yahoo email address, and she said that they do sometimes use them due to problems with email they have.

So strangely as it seems, an FBI agent in the fraud division sent me an email from a yahoo account.