
Joe Conason has a doozy of an op-ed in the NYObserver. And he calls Vice President Cheney out for being the king of duplicity:
Seeking to intimidate the Congressional leaders last week, he recited the misleading old formula conflating war in Iraq with the struggle against Al Qaeda. His theories on that subject have been blown up with the same force and frequency as those daily explosions on Baghdad’s streets. Only a few days ago, the Pentagon Inspector General issued a devastating report describing how Mr. Cheney’s agents in the Defense Department distorted intelligence to “prove” the mythical linkage between Osama bin Laden and Saddam Hussein.
Moreover, every credible analysis of the Iraq insurgency estimates that only a tiny fraction of the fighters are linked to Al Qaeda in any significant way. While the jihadist movement is growing, Mr. bin Laden and his lieutenants can profit from our mistakes without leaving their strongholds thousands of miles away.
But Mr. Cheney cares nothing for those facts. As the official who most vehemently assured us of the certain existence of weapons of mass destruction in Iraq, he remains immune to the kind of embarrassment that would have required an honorable man to resign from office long ago.
During his latest foreign trip, he warned Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Representative Jack Murtha (D-Penn.) that the redeployment of U.S. troops from Iraq would “validate the Al Qaeda strategy,” as if Mr. bin Laden somehow lured the United States into invading Mesopotamia. Reiterating the point later, he added: “Al Qaeda functions on the basis that they think they can break our will. That’s their fundamental underlying strategy: that if they can kill enough Americans or cause enough havoc, create enough chaos in Iraq, then we’ll quit and go home.”
Actually, we now know that the occupation of Iraq—the Cheney strategy—has strengthened Al Qaeda immeasurably by recruiting thousands of young Muslims to its cause. We know that because the National Intelligence Estimate prepared for the Bush administration a year ago said so. According to The Washington Post, a newspaper whose editorial page supports the war, officials familiar with the classified document said the N.I.E. concluded that “rather than contributing to eventual victory in the global counterterrorism struggle, the situation in Iraq has worsened the U.S. position.”
Let's be clear, shall we? Under the Bush/Cheney Administration, we are less strategically prepared, less militarily capable due to poor decision making that has weakened our troop strength and stretched our supply lines beyond the safety point, and more universally despised. Our diplomacy yields discord, our strategy leads to more failures. And neither George Bush nor Dick Cheney will be honest with anyone else — let alone themselves — with regard to accountability or the need for fundamental changes in what we have been doing. In short, we are stuck in a cycle of failure — and it has Dick Cheney and George Bush's names written all over it. How, exactly, does that make us safer?
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Fitz!
It isn’t designed to make US safer. It’s designed to make BushCheney Corp.’s revenue streams safer for the foreseeable future.
angie!
Facts!? We don’t neeed no stinking facts!
EPU’d from previous thread
Hi all,
This is regarding the image that Christy posted this am of the small child being held by the soldier. Does anyone remember a similar image posted sometime ago ? A standing soldier carrying a small child, a tragic image. I’ve been searching for it, slogged through some of the Iraq posts – but there’re almost 500 of them. I searched using soldier. Anyone remember when around that was or a better method of searching than I’m using.
I’d appreciate some help. Gracias.
The waiting is making me insane
My bold.
There it is in a nutshell.
(why is msnbc crawl saying “verdict in libby trial may come at any moment”?)
inmymind’s eye @
5
There was an extensive conversation about that picture, some thought it was touching, some thought it was intimidating. Been a while.
EPU’d:
Rayne,
I am copying text from a several word docs into one publisher doc. When I try to cut and paste a from a coupld of the word docs, I get a emssage saying that an error occurred while attempting to import the text. Then after clicking “ok” three times (I get the message three times), I get a message saying that Word is running low on memory and that I should save and shut down other programs, etc.
I have no idea why I’m having this problem with some files. The files were created by me and sent out for others to make changes to. I don’t know if some of the people who made changes have old copies of Word and if that is causing the problem or what.
If you have any ideas or solutions, I’ll be ever so grateful.
rosalind @ 8
So you won’t change the channel. Is it working? ; )
We need a coordinated effort to put the possibility of resignation out into the discursive world. I’ll start.
Dear Dick Cheney,
RESIGN RESIGN RESIGN RESIGN RESIGN RESIGN RESIGN RESIGN RESIGN RESIGN RESIGN RESIGN
Cozumel @ 11
I think it is working. I just turned it on.
EPU’d from last thread:
Elizabeth de la Vega has a new piece at TomDispatch Public Misconduct
A Call to Investigate All of the President’s Men.
She lays the whole mess at Representative Henry Waxman’s House Oversight Committee on Government Reform because he
“has subpoena power and can subpoena telephone records, meeting notes, daily calendars, memos, and a host of key players whose testimony was not legally relevant in the Libby trial, but who obviously have intimate knowledge of the entire CIA leak case and cover-up. These figures would include Karl Rove, Richard Armitage, lobbyist Ken Duberstein, Colin Powell and Stephen Hadley among others. Finally, unlike the prosecutor in a grand jury investigation, Waxman can hold hearings that are public — in Room 2154 Rayburn Office Building, Washington, D.C. So the misconduct of these public men and women, our highest elected and appointed officials in the Executive Branch, can finally be judged by a much larger jury of their peers, the people of the United States”.
It’s a must read.
Listen, people, this Cheney argument about validating the Al Queada strategy has been making my head explode for weeks. I distinctly rememeber reading quite some time ago that Osama Bin Laden wrote his strategy out in quite some detail way back in the ’90’s, and he said that he meant to hit the US so as to PROVOKE US INTO INVADING A MUSLIM COUNTRY, AND THAT HE WAS RELYING UPON THE RESULTIN OUTRAGE TO MOBILIZE MUSLIM ANGER AGAINST US AND TO BRING MILLIONS OF NEW RECRUITS TO HIS MOVEMENT. This Administration fell right into his trap from the get go when we invaded Irag, and Bin Ladens strategy has been playing out perfectly ever since. This point should be used to refure Cheney every time he opens his lying mouth, and of course nobody in the MSM will do it. Can anyone here provide the specific citation to these writings of Bin Laden?
God, how John Kerry argued these now tired but still true points in his presidential run, but he was wooden and foppish and not the sort of guy you would want to have a beer with.
Yeehaw! is not a foreign policy, but it is now.
Bustednuckles @ 7
Cheney is a sociopath with a Secret Service detail
– and a special office in the Pentagon making plans for “push-button” Iran War this year.
Only by our own action will we be safer. To that extent, Bushco’s extremism has brought the rest of us to our senses…
thank you so much for these invaluable reports.
It’s a sad state of affairs. The sheeple just don’t get it, and Congress makes me want to scream with the snail’s pace and timidity of investigating this outrage.
I just never, ever, want to hear Dick Cheney say,”watch this”.
My new name for Cheney is the Cowardly Ahab. He’s monomaniacally bent on irrational destruction, like Ahab, but his — and all the NeoCon gang’s — worldview is profoundly shaped by their own personal experience of cowardice. Too cowardly to fight a war they supported in the 1960s, they continually project their own cowardice onto their enemy-du-jour; hence, “Shock and Awe,” etcetera.
Congress needs to put Bush on notice: War against Iran = Immediate Impeachment Hearings. They need to do it Now.
Thanks, Christy and all, for all your terrific work.
“he remains immune to the kind of embarrassment that would have required an honorable man to resign from office long ago.”
That kind of immunity is also known as “hubris.”
But it is Cheney’s LEGAL immunity that should be tested and broken, not his personal delusion of immunity from admitting error.
When Christy says “immune” here, she’s talking about Cheney’s sociopathic psychology, not his legal status…
The Bush/Cheney war has helped Al Qaeda develop a larger field organization too.
Now recruits can go to Iraq and do training in an urban combat zone under live fire conditions.
They can learn techniques and then head on to Afghanistan and learn the arts of mountain and hard terrain fighting too.
Under Bush/Cheney Al Qaeda has gone from a small outfit in Afghanistan to one that seeps into Pakistan and into Iraq too.
Heckuva job.
-GSD
As a paralegal I love Jack web and his quest for facts!
inmymind’s eye @
5
OK, at the bottom of the photo it says Damir Salolj/Rueters
heres a link but I cannot verify Photo
Are you interested in the photo or the post?
What’s wrong with you people. Don’t you realize the true threats that need our attention?
Nancy Pelosi asked for a larger jet than Dennis Hasturd.
Al Gore has large electricity bills.
Deval Patrick in the Mass. Governors’ office requested a Cadillac to as his state car.
Stop with this habeas corpus, rendition, domestic spying crap and root out the real enemies.
-GSD
Which brings us to Douglas Feith. He’s on the web now with douglasfeith.com [I’ll bet he didn’t have much trouble getting that IP].
Working on the thesis that the best defense is a good offense, he’s mounted a very offensive web sit. The beauty of this guy is that he can’t keep his foot out of his mouth. He’s personally working hard to give this story “legs,” at a time when he ought to take a long vacation trip to the Dead Sea wearing shades and a blond wig.
He’s literally writing his own indictment…
GSD @ 28
my bad
Cozumel @ 11
damn they’re good. but not that good. the text also said “the subject of the (juror’s) note was not known”.
Inmymind’s eye-
Was it this one?
http://www.michaelyon-online.c…..e-girl.htm
Sure, we’re safer…
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/2/28/123713/496
The guy isn’t capable of embarassment or shame. He has nothing but contempt for americans. I would guess that means everyone in his personal & white house circle also, with the disaster in chief at the top of the list.
That web address should be
httpStupidestFuckingGuyonthePlanet.com
raven @ 26
My reply also EPU’ed from previous thread: If you’re asking what photo from the past it reminded you of– it reminded me of the image of the Oklahoma City bombing (1995) rescuer cradling a child
One-year-old victim of the Oklahoma City bombing cradled by a local fireman
kirk murphy@18
I think Cheney was the victim of repeated sexual child abuse, probably ritual. Nothing else could explain him.
Bustednuckles @ 34
Go ahead. Try it!
Mickey @
13
I’m expecting to hear word of the verdict here first. It’s where I first heard of Anna Nicole’s death. Oh, and the baby’s mine.
Sy Hersh, in an Alternet interview, via TomPaine –
Bush/Cheney are funding Al Qaeda
Listen to Sy Hersh explain his latest explosive scoop: Bush has been funnelling money to al-Qaida-related Sunni extremist groups in his misguided jihad against Shiite Iran.
Read the full article in the latest issue of The New Yorker.
If sending money to Al Qaeda in Lebanon isn’t outrageous enough to fuel the impeachment fires, it’s all over for this country.
This should be the final straw after the TreasonGate conviction comes in, but time will tell.
ROFLMAO.
Sachem515 @
15
Let us not forget Mr. Richard Hohlt.
And is Cheney a sociopath, or more accurately, a psychopath?
Here’s from Wiktionary;
psychopath (plural psychopaths)
A person with a personality disorder indicated by a pattern of lying(WMD), exploitiveness (Halliburton), heedlessness (scattergun event), arrogance (do I even need an example here), sexual promiscuity(?), low self-control (Go f yourself), and lack of empathy and remorse(Pelosi’s a terrorist).
Such an individual may be especially prone to violent and criminal offenses (torture for profit).
A person who has no moral conscience(outing a CIA NOC agent)
A person who perpetrates especially gruesome or bizarre violent acts.(WATERBOARDING)
I’ll give himn a bye on the sexual promiscuity, just because I don’t know if there’s any to be pointed out, but as for the other definitions of a psychopath, can we all agree on those?
KM @ 18
I’ve worked in mental health for the last 8 years. There is compelling evidence that both GW and Darth are clinically sociopaths (or anti-social personalities) They also generally fit the DSM IV criteria for psychotic – separated from/not recognizing reality.
Hiya, Manimal — check the tail of the last thread for suggestions Rayne and I each commented re the Word to Publisher issues.
eeeewwwww….Cheney – sexually promiscuous? I just don’t wanna know!
Gene Lyons has a great column on Cheney.
Don’t the jurors know that there are some sweet dogs in Connecticut and Michigan who want their moms back? (Virtual scratches behind the ears to Jane and Marcy’s dogs.)
I find it much more calming to think of pooches than Cheney’s sociopathology this afternoon.
Well said, as per usual.
Wil @
43
I have a mother-in-law like that…..
Islamo Fashionista @ 12
Well, I just took out the garbage, then the compost. Layered the compost with chicken sh*t and on top of that some origanic alfalfa. Think I want the ’shooter’ to stay, cause this would remind me of what in the items listed above and would remind the world of past deeds done.
Hey folks! I’m back online! You know how nice it is to come back to your computer after shutting it down for a few hours. Shew. So long as we don’t go over, I think I’ve got enough battery now for the end of the day.
Prairie Sunshine, I saw both of your answers. Thanks so much for the help! My boss is still trying to figure out what’s going on, I’ve told her that I might have gotten the answer but don’t have the guts to tell her I found it while sneaking a few minutes on a political blog…
I really wish Wes Clark would get the nod to run on the Dem line. He is a one man restoration of the Truman line of Democrats. We need a tough old guy like him to beat back the wingnuts AND deal with the external threats which have grown under the Cheney Administration. Clark will have Bin Laden’s head on a pike in the Rose Garden within weeks of taking residence in the White House.
Celtic Music @ 48
Do it for Kobe and McCaffrey!!!!
emptywheel @ 53
hurray!
Bustednuckles @
7
I agree. So then what?
I don’t mean to be unnecessarily blunt about this, but isn’t that part & parcel of what makes shooter so horribly dangerous to world peace?
This man should not be in office. He is acting in a totally irrational manner, and everyone just sits on their hands, helpless, slack-jawed.
I don’t mind admitting this crazy man scares me witless. We cannot expect him to remove himself from office. He’s beyond understanding, beyond caring.
Recalling a variation of an old “joke” that’s not funny any more, “If you’re not panicked by this, maybe you don’t understand the situation.”
Folks, we have ourselves a real live constitutional crisis on our hands.
Now back to reading wonderful, brave Joe Conason for clues on where we go from here.
Wringing our hands just isn’t going to cut it.
From Froomkin:
For a second there I thought Sanger was going to suggest Bush sent Dick there to be assassinated…..
emptywheel @ 51
Welcome back Marcy. Now post something! Preferably your usual insightful and thought provoking anyalysis, but otherwise just post something long.
So EW —- back to your conversation with Fitz… (unless you have something better to discuss)
emptywheel @ 53
Welcome back, Marcy. What’s new at Prettyman? And when do we hear about your conversation with Fitz in detail?
Cheney was in a hunting party with other women–not his wife–when he shot Whittington in the face. See articles at the time.
Fini – my gut instinct is that Clark is eyeing being Clinton’s VP. I think that’s why she urged him to run in ‘04 – get him known, see how he could do in the race, also show him how he probably won’t get the top job without ever having held political office before. I think she’s been courting him, and by the end of this year, we’ll hear more of a partnership between them.
This is wild-arsed speculation on my part.
Re: Marcy and Fitz—Eyewitness Account
Hi, all. I had the honor of joining the vigil at the courthouse with Jane and Marcy for a while this morning, and Marcy gave me the okay to mention a bit more about her conversation with Fitz, which I was privileged to witness.
Let me just tell my fellow Fitzoholics, first of all, that he is as charming, easygoing, personable, and—did I mention charming?—as we all would have hoped. And Marcy was just as charming and engaging right back. I believe Fitz was as delighted to meet Marcy as she was to meet him—you all would have been very proud of our Marcy in action.
Seeing and speaking with Fitz has made me even more excited about the justice that I hope will soon be served. And watching Jane and Marcy tirelessly and cheerfully handle the long hours of waiting to keep us informed up to the minute–well, they are awe-inspiring.
And, now, I have to see how long I can keep from washing my right hand after “the handshake.”
–
Toby Martin @
16
Robert Fisk “The Great War for Civilization” had interviewed OBL and might be used as resource. The book is exquisite and balanced resource for ME history.
Islamo Fashionista @
12
Most folks seem to think this is not a useful discussion, but I disagree. I think that it is the right approach. Why didn’t Conason call for Cheney’s resignation? Why didn’t Dionne call for Cheney’s resignation in his last op-ed? Don’t ask me, cuz I don’t know !! When you make the claim that someone is doing a lousy job and refuses to admit that they are doing a lousy job, then you have to take a stand that they should stop and let someone else do the job. John Warner should be standing outside Cheney’s office, waiting for him to vacate. We should not need to impeach. Cheney must resign.
CityGirl
THANK YOU.
I’m with Fini on that one.
He would be quite formidable against our opponuts and mitigate their accepted “stronger on defense” bullshit.
I guess he’s in a hole in the $$$ department. He’d make one Hell of a running mate too.
Gore/Clark anyone?
emptywheel @
51
Go run over to Staples after Beer Thirty!
jim prseton @ 64
… and take all his federally embedded flying monkeys and relatives with him!
egregious @ 66
yes, thank you.
but, could we have the live blogging version of the conversation now? please? need content… gestures… details… marcy’s got us spoiled rotten.
T- @ 66
I think Gore/Clark would be a wonderful ticket.
It’s very interesting in the on-line races — Clark won the one that was just done a la the final four and he’s way ahead at 2008horserace.com. Interesting for someone who isn’t even running.
just checkin’in Firedogs – sigh
Wil,
Dr. Murphy took some time laying it all out for me last week and this lay person concurs although I think they both exhibit some marked traits of BPD
- with us or against us
- serial, callous disposal of long time valued associates and retainers
- trotting out the Iran is getting uranium from Tanzania meme like it’s a brand new gambit – I’m told BPD’s will actually throw out old crap like it’s brand new b/c they actually are not aware of doing it in the past
hey! I said I’m a layperson :)
Where’s the verdict, ARRRGGGHH
ps – are absolutly sure Fitz is straight, I’m single at the moment and 1/2 in love with him.
Marcy–
Can you almost-liveblog your discussion with Fitz? I’m not sure there would be any such thing as an insignificant detail to that encounter.
I started to read Dan Froomkin’s column and had to check to make sure that today isn’t April 1st!
Is this Animal Farmish or what?
this cracked me up:
Our Ravingly Mad Big Dick
http://pmcarpenter.blogs.com/p…..ly_ma.html
CBL –
Another good citeria for bi-polar is the lack of impulse control, especially in the most severe form of the disease – bi-polar with psychotic features. Good catch
I am imagining Marcy created an afternoon thread of her fitz conversation…. maybe it’s a mirage in the verdict watch brought on by relentless waiting.
You know that Whittington who Cheney shot is the brother in law of James Baker of (Baker Hammilton), and also James Baker of the Carlye group.
Just interesting
Kirk Murphy @ 17.
Whoa, Dick fits every criteria for a sociopath. What do we call it when it is done on a massive scale? Megalasociopath?
Woodhall Hollow @ 75
OK, he goes, chicken sh*t.’
Ok, I’ll throw in another court story.
If you walk down the corridor, the well-trodden path between the media room and the kind people who sell coffee, there are two display tables under glass.
One has documents from the Teapot Dome Scandal.
The other one is empty. I figure they’re saving it for the documents from this trial :)
It appears there are enough people in the wh that fit the diagnosis to fill a hospital wing. Birds of a feather. Makes me want to hide in bed with the covers over my head.
egr, is the coffee station the cart between the old / new building? When I went to it, they were out of coffee. I had to shift to Mt. Dew.
are we there yet?
ironranger @ 84
that’s where I am
Silva writes more at the Swamp: the comments are worth reading through (and a good way to kill more time!
inmymind’s eye @ 5
Is this the one you are after
http://www.michaelyon-online.c…..e-girl.htm
Toby Martin @
16
This might do:
The Gospel According to Osama Bin Laden
http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200201/gerecht
Armagetiton
Pat_AlexVA @ 84
I only saw just the one cart on the main floor, central corridor. Hope I’m not revealing state secrets by telling the location of the coffee sellers.
Once relatives of mine fed my 2 year old nephew an entire bottle of Mt. Dew without realizing that it had caffeine. Predictable results.
Ummm, EW… is something going on?
Terry Olson @ 80
World War Three. For real.
Go back and look and newspaper front pages in the days before the first and second wars. Things seem relatively normal, except for agitation in some other safely distant part of the world.
I visited a war memorial in Scotland that had walls full of names from both world wars. The shocking part was realizing they built additional, blank walls for the future wars.
We, as a species, are slow learners.
Boil it way down. The Bush/Cheney doctrine is a terrorist multiplier.
“Bring it on,” so saeth Dear Leader.
Pah
You may think it’s a failure, but the cash flowing into the hands of the Bush family, Cheney, and their cronies says that, for them, it’s not.
Froomkin:
Someone over at gabbly just said that David Shuster just reported the same thing being scrolled at the bottom of the TV: “verdict could come at any minute.” Is Shuster still in the media room with you, Marcy? Could he know something you guys don’t?
and not to forget Condi – I’d guess Borderline pd – not quite psychotic, not just neurotic
Wil @ 98
she has scary eyes
Pat_AlexVA @ 92
Hey there,
I’m waiting on my post.
All I can say is that I thought Bob Hopley, who coached me, had been at Amherst for at least 8 years.
Apparently, I’m mistaken.
re msnbc scroll—
Duh the verdict could have come at any minute beginning on the second day of deliberations.
Or I could be wrong and there would be a rush to fdl of Biblical proportions.
May I take this opportunity to ask regulars, if you see the site loading very slowly, to leave the lake and reduce the load? It seems against all we have worked for, yes we are all eager to see the results, but it’s important to keep things going. Also there are peak times as people at work check in. I pledge to leave if the site loads slowly.
Marcy:
Will you ask Richard Schmitt (L.A. Times), who I presume is there in the media room, how he knows what Plame’s job was at CIA?
This is from a story he filed this morning:
“. . . for allegedly covering up his participation in the events leading to the disclosure of the identity of Plame, a former agency arms proliferation analyst.”
http://www.latimes.com/news/po…..s-politics
I was under the impression the CIA has not said what her job was. How does he know?
Thanks.
Toby Martin @ 16
Cheney is a Straussian, so he probably believes that “the enemy” is always trying to fool you, and you can’t believe what appears to be true, only what you know to be true. (And apparently continue believing this, even if everything turns out like your enemy predicted when you were sure he was trying to fool you.)
Ugh.
SharonRB @ 96
Sharon,
The verdict could indeed come at any minute. That’s Judge Walton’s gift to the media – since there’ll only be fifteen minutes notice, viewers who are interested need to remain tuned-in. And, not surprisingly, the media is milking the suspense for all it’s worth. But no, no one has a clue when the jury will return. And when something happens, you’ll read it here, first.
SharonRB @ 97
Hey,
I bet it’s making you watch MSNBC, right? Any other questions?
The verdict could come at any moment. but we certainly haven’t gotten word that is IS coming.
And the scaiest part of axis II (borderline, psychopaths, et al) there is no effective treatment
EW, can you go smack Shuster?
I just did my regular call to the Congresswoman back home (thank you, skype) and after the discussion about Iraq with the staffer, I asked if I could gossip a bit. He said “Sure.”
Me: “Are you following the Libby trial?”
Him: “Personally, yes.”
Me: “Where do you get your information?”
Him: “Variety of sources…newspapers, tv”
Me: “Please go look at Firedoglake.com. And get Marcy Wheeler’s book, Anatomy of Deceit. It may give you more insight into how this administration is malfunctioning.”
(Rough paraphrase)….but do get the word out to those in Congressional offices and help raise their awareness.
FWIW, CNN hasn’t mentioned anything about a verdict coming soon. However, they just showeed Cheney & Bush heading tinto a meeting with the bipartisan group to discuss Iraq war strategy.
any WHICH moment?
Wil @ 106
impeachment would help
lina @ 101 I was under the impression the CIA has not said what her job was. How does he know?
Uh, Novak’s columns? The raison d’etre of this case?
Sparkles the Iguana @ 94
Jon Stewart is my new TV boyfriend.
emptywheel @ 107
Or, it could come right after a short break LOL
jim prseton @ 65
Amen, Jim Preston. The burden of proof should really be on the administration as to why Cheney should remain in office. Make them make the argument: I’d love to hear it. But like everything else, it won’t happen without pressure from Dems.
we call it Team Haldol ™ at chez cbl ;)
egregious @ 112
he says she was an analyst. if she was an analyst, we wouldn’t be here.
and lest I was unclear, why is the L.A. Times calling her an analyst?
Speaking of MSNBC, Richard Goodstein was just on, billed as a “Democratic Strategist.” Isn’t he the Lieberman agitator who engaged in attempts to goad Lamont supporters last summer/fall? The one behind the diner scene where Lieberkids sneaked into and took over Ned’s campaign event? Truth in labeling?
–
I miss the good old days of lobotomies. Haldol wears off
While we’re waiting, Lambert’s got a photo of Cheney’s container.
christy, your post is excellant, but the person you quoted needs to source his claim..notice bold;
does anyone have this link for me please?
perris @
122
Hi pups -
Glad to see so many mental health profs here turning their clinical assessment skills to Cheney’s apparent symptoms.
For pups with the good sense to have remainned laypeople, “sociopath” and “psychopath” are synonyms for the psychiatric diagnosis known as “antisocial personality disorder”.
In the US, diagostic criteria for psychiatric disorders are defined by the Diagnositc and Statistical Manual (DSM), produced* by the American Psychiatric Association.
The current DSM is DSM-IV-TR.
THe criteria set forth in the Wiki article cited below are from the DSM critereia for antisocial personality disorder.
On a biological level, patients with APD appear to have dysfunctional “anxiety sensors”: some studies indicate the physiology of anxiety is “off-line” in sociopaths. These studies suggest sociopaths are capable of hideous acts at least in part because they are incapable of fear of the conseqeunces.
Cheney’s public actions allow us to assess whether he meets criteria for the APD dignosis. IN other words, the diagnostic criteria are designed to rely upon externally observable criteria.
What follows is speculation, as it does not allow direct external observation.
Cheney is known to have multiple cardiac surgeries, and hence would have had multiple exposures to cardiopulmonary bypass (CPB) support. Cheney – IIRC – has also suffered overt myocardial infarctions (MI = heart attacks).
Both MI’s and CPB exposure are associated with possible brain damage. Some brain damage (strokes) are obvious.
Much brain injury is subtle, and requires specialized testing to detect and assess.
GOP COngressional insiders are reported to have observed Cheney’s behavioral changes and even asked among themselves “What’s gotten into Cheney?” [note - if anyone has this reference, I’d be grateful].
Anone who had had a few drinks – or watched sommeone else have a few – has data on our inhibitory nervous systems: they’re easily impaired. THe inhibitory nevous system is a net of neural processors which have some capacity to allow us NOT to do/say stuff that causes problems.
THe inhibitory nervous system isn’t just a bunch ‘o shy neurons standing in a corner.
Rather, the inhibitory system is comprised of neurons distributed around certain areas of the brain – most notably the frontal cortex.
The frontal cortex is at the front of the brain. (isn’t anatomic jargon creative?). As legions of dysinhibited ex-snowboarders and head-bangers (or their long suffering families) can attest, damage to the frontal cortex leaves people permanently dysinhibited.
Traumatic brain injury is a catastrophe for all concerned. For a garage band drummer, the ramifications may be limited to the neighbors and immediate family.
With Cheney, the ramifications of his cerebral dysfuction could destroy our Constitution, Republic, and a good part of our Army and Marines – not to mention millions of lives.
Cheney’s symptoms are public knowledge. His medical history is somewhat known.
The authors of the 25th Amendment failed to anticipate the incapacitation of a Vice-President.
Which leaves impeachment proceedings – againt Cheney.
Cheney seems to be frightening the GOP old gaurd, the US military, and the pre-43 “permanent government” in DC. These constituencies – together with public opinion – were sufficient to rid us of Nixon via impeachment.
If Bush/Cheney frighten the JCS, wonder wht the DC mandarins are feeling today?
(*like all human products, both the APA and the DSM are inherently flawed, but I won’t go into detail here – I’ve ranted on that elsewhere at the Lake)
David Baerwald @ 37
Wil @ 44
JEP @ 43
The fact he paired up with Lynne suggests at least a certain kind of kinky…
If MSNBC captures new interest in the trial by hyping “verdict could come at any minute”, then I think I’m for it, even if it drives us nuts.
Okay, no more discussions that include the words Cheney or kinky, or any implications thereon. I’d like my lunch to stay inside, thanks.
this man stands in front of the camera, makes bizzarre claims and says it as if he is saying water is wet, he says it as if it’s a given and then whoever is in the room simply defers to what he’s saying as though it is not a bold in your face lie
this is what pisses me off…cheney has been nothing but wrong, yet when he makes a bizzarre statement, he is deferred to as if he actually might know something
wil -
fyi – our egregious blogs and advocates on behalf of the mentally ill – she may not take kindly to either of us cracking wise about same – and I pretty much knew that when I made the Haldol crack – sorry I led you down that path – my bad
wuv you egy
Christy Hardin Smith @ 127
MEA CULPA and so soooorrrry!!!!!
egregious @
82
SOME of the docs… weren’t there a truckload or two?
Christy Hardin Smith @ 127
Yes. Hello Christy, aside from the slight queaziness, I hope this finds you well.
Looks like Shuster is “talking up” the fact that the Jury decision could be imminent on MSNBC. Tweety has been in Court so probably wants to do the “breaking news” thing!!
Oilfieldguy,
You still here?
If Joe’s on top, it must be Friday. Whatever the day, it is beginning to feel a lot like Fitzmas.
Reading through this thread – what a flurry of articles about Shooter. Is he due back stateside soon?
Bustednuckles @ 134
Yes.
OFG at 130 — Hey, good to see you. Get a break from hauling this week?
Bustednuckles @
21
or “pull my finger”
Kik Murphy – thanks for the clarifications for lay-folks
The only issue we need for the diagnosis is the presence of a juvenile history of illegal activity
Christy Hardin Smith @ 137
Off today. Real bad day yesterday.
Long time no see OFG.
Sorry to hear that OFG.
Anything you care to mention?
perris @ 123
I do.
Gave Matthews a copy of Marcy’s book. Wonder if he’ll read it?
FiniFiniTOOBZ! @ 143
thank you sir
OFG,
I was skimming through a Lte Nite thread the other day and saw a reference to a “Cheaterpipe Shampoo”.
Jeebus did I start laughing.
That was hilarious.
Most folks probably don’t know what a cheater pipe is, but I busted out laughing as soon as I saw it.
Good one!
Why is congress rufusing to consider much of what is in this post and thread?
I would also add paranoia ( Extreme, irrational distrust of others) to the list of symptoms.
Bought my ticket for YKos. Will be there for the duration this year. I seriously need the company of a large group of fuzzy headed libruls and dirty hippies.
cbl @ 116
At the ER, we always called it “Vitamin H.”
From Froomkin’s chat:
Milwaukee, Wis.: Dan, thanks for your response on the York and Toensing op-eds. What can we do to get others besides you at the Post to understand that op-eds such as those are tantamount to the Post publishing that the earth is flat? FYI, in honor of GOP operative Barbara Comstock, some have nicknamed the Post the ComPost.
Dan Froomkin: I hadn’t heard that. Thanks for sharing.
But the good news is that there are an increasing number of ways to make yourself heard, both officially and unofficially. Write a letter to the editor, write to the ombudsman, post a comment, post a comment on a popular blog, write your own blog.
I don’t think the exponential growth in ways for members of the public to express themselves has been matched by a similarly enormous growth in the elite media’s willingness to listen, but I do think the latter has grown somewhat.
Jane Hamsher @ 144
wow, nice Jane, need to give it to tweety too…need to give it to anyone we think is misslead instead of evil
Jane Hamsher @ 144
Did you give him the picture book version?
OFG at 138 — Well, that doesn’t sound good. Hope you are okay.
Jane Hamsher @ 143
Did you ask him why Russert hates him?
Jane Hamsher @ 144
Great job!
cbl,
I wasn’t taking cheap shots at the mentally ill, sorry if it came out that way. I was just commenting that Haldol is pretty short acting. (OK, the lobotomy comment was lame, but only directed to GW and Darth, not the general population)
What time is the jury sent home? L
sparkles @ 96 – that quote hits it on the head!
Jane Hamsher @
144
Go, Vaster Books!
Oilfieldguy @ 149
Exxxxxxxcellent. You, me, a bar and a bottle of Glen Fiddich for sharing with other firepups, whaddaya say?
sferris @ 157
beer:15
then it’s beer:30 for the rest of us to hang it up for the day
perris @ 150
Isn’t Matthews Tweety? Or am I hopelessly confused again?
Tweety = Chris Matthews.
John Casper @ 149
what ‘pup was that?
also, Shooter landed at Andrews AFB at 4am
Are Jeffress and Mrs. Libby still smoking their coffin nails outside Prettyman?
new thread
sferris @ 157
About 5:00 pm, EST.
Thanks for the comment about making cracks about mental health. Today is a very tough day for Dreaming Crow and others dealing with mental health issues. I appreciate the way this community keeps those who suffer in tender regard.
The sober analysis of the mental health of the administration is necessary, though, and it is beyond time for those not under the delusions that plague Cheney and Bush (and consequently the rest of us) to act on the reality that these men are not healthy. They need to be removed from power by legal means. Now.
oh no Wil,
I didn’t think you were, just with us all wound so tight, I saw it as something egregious would be displeased by – you didn’t do anything wrong – ;)
Tweety will read that book if Shuster tells him it’s worth reading (and gets all the gurl cooties off )and since it’s such a good whodunnit read, there is a real chance he will !
Hi TSF, it was me.
Jane Hamsher @ 144
He’ll at least scan it for mentions of his show or name!
Waving to Jane. Bustedknuckles–I started to give Jane a tour of my truck in Tulsa and show her my cheaterpipe, but figured somehow that would get misinterpreted.
Regarding my by day yesterday–it was much worse for the bull of a 26-year-old young man whose head came in contact with a live wire, trying to help me under them. He will make it, probably lose a toe and has a bad burn on his head.
Real bad stuff. there.
Jane Hamsher @ 144
Good for you, Jane! I observed a number of trial reporters holding and even reading Marcy’s book. Imagine how much more knowledgeable and accurate future news reports could be….
FiniFiniTOOBZ! @
160
You guys can keep the scotch. I’m doing Cuervo shots.
And I’m buying if Tweety actually reads “Anatomy” and cites it on Hardball.
perris @ 123
does anyone have the link for the bold portion of this quote?
Review of Pre-Iraqi War Activities by the Office of the Under Secretary of Defense for Policy – Executive Summary
Review of Pre-Iraqi War Activities by the Office of the Under Secretary of Defense for Policy – Overview of Briefing
OFG,
OUCH!
Very Scary, that.
was looking at a pix of scooter’s wife (taken between hair tosses outside courthouse). looks like she had a bit too much taken off. too bad all her husband’s lying couldn’t grow it a little longer.
toolpusher @ 171
That’s called a “Washington Read” — you check the index for your name, and go from there.
OFG at 170 — Oh, so sorry to hear that. Glad he will be okay, but so sorry that he — and you — had to deal with it yesterday. Hugs to you. (PS: Next time you are coming out this way, dinner’s on us. I believe it is our turn.)
LoudounLib @
45
Just WHERE did the sack over the head torture regimen start from, do you suppose? Dicky! Dicky! Dicky!
aah!!!! edit comment won’t work. i was talking about scooters wife’s nose.
And, why would this ssurprise anyone?
Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld total years military service: 0
Management experience:
Bush – State Governor: OK, no major events to measure. Displyed a pathelogical lack of empathy towards Death Row
Cheney – CEO Haliburton, an organization whose profitability model was most dependant on the frequency of oil field fires.
Rumsfeld – to be honest, I forget, but I think corporate cost-cutting was his area of expertise: a questionable skill set in managing a war time military.
All of the above are accustomed to managing entities where short-term measurements and reports are critical, and the long-term prospects of aquisition are acceptable if not desireable.
USA for sale anyone?
Terry Olson @ 81
Nope.
“Business leaders.”
aka CEO’s.
(epu’d from comments on Tula’s post yesterday
I wish they could be embarrassed.
But when I think of the CEO’s choices – the destruction they bring to workers, communities, and our common health.
I think of this:
Given criteria I.7, I don’t think they can be embarrassed.
They can still be fined and imprisoned, however.
Oh – the diagnostic criteria above are for
“Antisocial Personality Disorders”.
The fancy word for sociopath.
But look at the criteria.
The Fortune 500 CEO’s are sociopaths with great dentists, cosmetic surgeons, and tailors.
And CEO’s are selected precisely because they ARE amoral sociopaths.
Corporate directors of publicly held megacorps are legally obligated to maximize earnings.
The directors’ true gods are balance sheet zeros and lifeless shiny metals.
We are merely sacrifices to the megacorps’ true gods.
Nothing else matters – not your childrens’ health, not your grandparents’ pension, not your clean water, not your beloved’s breast cancer.
Only a wholly amoral person would put the acquisition of inanimate stuff over the very lives of other humans.
Complicity in that hideous decision is the basis for every megacorp CEO’s selection.
And the destruction of our health, communities, families, jobs, food, and water.
Bush, Cheney, Hillary, the DLC/K street crowd and the CEO’s are merely the prominent zombies.
Our basic fight is that of the living world against the megacorps’ zombie world
– where only abstract numbers are real, and the living are mere abstractions for some hack economist at the U of Chicago to discard.
If Fermi could have known how much destruction the U of Chicago’s
whoresmegacorporate co-conspirators“free-market” economists would wreak across our planet, I wonder if he would have let the reactor go critical…And some days I wonder if he should have.
squirrel hiller @ 181
doesn’t work after IE7 update
(and i don’t preview often enough either
Jane Hamsher @ 144
What did he say when you gave it to him.
pat @ 79
No shit??? Never saw that tidbit mentioned at the time of the shooting. Was this a warning shot across Baker’s bow…..so to speak?
sometimes my mind says preview and my finger says submit.
clueless @ 186
more likely a coincidence of a limited group of extremely priviledged individuals
Since Joe Conason was the original subject of this thread, just a reminder that he’ll be at Politics & Prose tomorrow night @ 7, speaking & autographing his new book.
Marcy, maybe you could make him a trade?
Oilfieldguy @
132
You think you’re queazy, how about poor Cheney trying hard to digest yesterday’s Chinese dinner. Iran doesn’t look nearly so delicious today.
John Casper @ 163
Thanks for clearing that up. I thought i had gone senile. ~Now what is this verdict thing y’all keep talking about? Is that what i’m waiting for?
Jane Hamsher @ 144
Why hasn’t he read it already????????????
CityGirl @
119
I believe you’re thinking of Dan Gerstein.
Oilfieldguy @ 173
Sounds dreadful and genuinely traumatic, OFG.
I hope you and the young man and all present have the opportunity for healing soon – and that the healing comes to you all.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 128
Oops – just saw this.
I humbly apologize to you and your GI tract, with special apologies to the gastroesophageal sphincter.
My bad.
Perris 122. Linky
http://www.observer.com/200703…..onason.asp
emptywheel @ 103
Not me. I’m at work. Of course, I’ll be watching when I get home!
only 3? Like any combination of 3? ‘Cuz if so, then apparently i was a sociopath for most of my 20′S.
apologies to those of you who have seen this already…
and while I am no fan of Cat Stevens, my gf sent this to me, she was born in Tehran, lived thru Iran-Iraq war and can’t believe the wack-jobs in DC are THAT f-in crazy
real people in the target zones of the as-yet-to-be-triggered air strikes of Iran
http://www.lucasgray.com/video/peacetrain.html
mroom@193:
No, I meant Richard Goodstein. He and Dan Gerstein are different people, and both worked for Lieberman in the campaign, Gerstein on staff, Goodstein as an outside agitator.
http://www.mydd.com/story/2006/8/4/214743/1686
What does he have to be embarassed about, it wasn’t a matter of misinterpreting intelligence or anything else – they wanted to go into Iraq and install a permanent base as part of his energy strategy – the faux rationale(s) for war were fabricated out of the whole cloth of deceit, deliberately … and they got away with it. Embarrassed? Hardly. The shame of an honorable man on the other hand …
rocket scientist @
88
Thanks rocket scientist, that’s the one.
Thanks to raven too. I appreciate the help.
….for generations to come, the Children of Iraq will hate America and the West for what they have done to their homes and their family’s.
Nearly everyone in Iraq has been negatively affected by this ill defined War. Orphans will grow into soldiers.
How on Earth can we (the Western nations who invaded Iraq) support these people?
I am an Australian and I feel deep and absolute shame that my government has had a part in this.
Bush, Cheney, Rumsfield and all those that caused this illegal invasion need to be held accountable for propagating this madness.
Resign?! If there were any honor or shame left in Washington, Cheney and a slew of his neocon buddies (yes, I’m talking to you Kristol) would have gone home and swallowed a bullet long ago.