
(Photo by Reuters/Jason Reed. I absolutely love this shot — the juxtaposition of Congress and the view of Libby through the darkened window of the SUV that Wells' office has been using for morning transport from their office is pitch perfect in how things have felt at the courthouse as Libby has arrived. Jason Reed has such a great eye — I usually love his work. But this one hits that "waiting for judgment" feeling perfectly, doesn't it?)
***BREAKING: There has been exposure of at least one of the jurors to media coverage of the trial. There is discussion going on in chambers with Judge Walton and counsel for both sides as to how to proceed. There will likely be individual voir dire (discussions) with each and every juror now to determine if there is a taint to the jury process. We won't know anything about whether things will proceed until that has concluded. There is a possibility of a mistrial being declared but, again, we will not know anything unless and until the judge and attorneys speak with the jury foreperson and all of the jurors, and make their determination as to how things will or will not proceed from there. More news as we get it.***
Huge thank you to Looseheadprop for putting together this post for us this morning — she is stuck in court herself this morning, but I will be around to answer the questions that I can about this for everyone. We had some discussion on the Allen charge last week, and wanted to be sure everyone understood the legal rationale involved in something like this. But, and let me be clear about this, we have absolutely no reason to think there will be one today or ever during the jury deliberations. We are giving you this information up front because it is a common thing for juries to hear this at some point in intricate cases — and, frankly, we try to operate on an "abundance of caution" sort of framework in terms of explaining the basics to everyone where we can.
The jury is back in the courthouse for deliberations today. I checked with folks on the staff, and delibrations are scheduled to begin on time today, despite some inclement weather in DC over the weekend. There is a note that will be addressed in the courtroom at 9:45 am ET this morning, and the parties have been asked to be there to deal with it. (This could be as simple as a jury question or another request for materials. Take deep breaths.) As soon as we hear anything, we will let you know — we will have folks on the scene today reporting in whenever we get news. And now, back to your reading and your regularly scheduled waiting for a verdict. (Yes, deliberations for more than 2 and a half days are very, very common. Please do not fret.) — CHS
The other day our own beloved Evil Parallel Universe suggested that maybe the time was coming when I should get busy writing a post explaining what an "Allen Charge" is, I think maybe that time is here. Since we didn’t get a verdict on Friday, there may be a note coming out any day now saying that the jury is divided. DO NOT PANIC.
Such a note does NOT lead to the immediate conclusion that the jury is deadlocked or the declaration of a mistrial due to hung jury. What it will almost always lead to is a supplemental jury charge know in the biz as an Allen Charge.
The Allen Charge is based upon a United States Supreme Court case decided in 1896, Allen v. US. The relevant portion of that case is the supplemental jury instruction after they had deliberated awhile and failed to reach unanimity:
…in a large proportion of cases absolute certainty could not be expected; that, although the verdict must be the verdict of each individual juror, and not a mere acquiescence in the conclusion of his fellows, yet they should examine the question submitted with candor, and with a proper regard and deference to the opinions of each other; that it was their duty to decide the case if they could conscientiously do so; that they should listen, with a disposition to be convinced, to each other's arguments; that, if much the larger number were for conviction, a dissenting juror should consider whether his doubt was a reasonable one which made no impression upon the minds of so many men, equally honest, equally intelligent with himself. If, unon the other hand, the majority were for acquittal, the minority ought to ask themselves whether they might not reasonably doubt the correctness of a judgment which was not concurred in by the majority. These instructions were taken literally from a charge in a criminal case which was approved of by the supreme court of Massachusetts in Com. v. Tuey, 8 Cush. 1, and by the supreme court of Connecticut in State v. Smith, 49 Conn. 376, 386.
While, undoubtedly, the verdict of the jury should represent the opinion of each individual juror, it by no means follows that opinions may not be changed by conference in the jury room. The very object of the jury system is to secure unanimity by a comparison of views, and by arguments among the jurors themselves. It certainly cannot be the law that each juror shoud not listen with deference to the arguments, and with a distrust of his own judgment, if he finds a large majority of the jury taking a different view of the case from what he does himself. It cannot be that each juror should go to the jury room with a blind determination that the verdict shall represent his opinion of the case at that moment, or that he should close his ears to the arguments of men who are equally [Page 164 U.S. 492, 502] honest and intelligent as himself. There was no error in these instructions.
Shorter version: Each juror must reach his/her own decision and not merely surrender to group pressure. However, each juror should also listen to the views of his/her fellow jurors with a mind open to the possibility of being persuaded by the views of his/her fellow jurors.
Oh…and that the jurors in the minority ought to be especially open to the possibility of being persuaded by their fellows.
Some judges add a little something to give the jurors the sense that they will be kept at it until Hell freezes over, so they ought to lose the stubborn and get with the deliberatin’. But sometimes those little extras go too far.
Bottom line, it is a jury’s DUTY to decide a case unanimously, if there is any way that each juror can honestly reach the necessary conclusion with respect to the verdict and there is to be no lazyman’s quick rush to declare a jury hung as a way to avoid the hard work and discussion necessary to reach consensus.
Related posts:
- Cheney’s Betrayal Made an IIPA Charge for Libby Possible
- The Bush Fairy Tale on the Libby Pardon
- Blue Dog Allen Boyd (FL): “Scrapping Everything” on Heath Care Reform Would Be “Excellent”
- Fort Hood Shooter’s Trial May Shed Light on NSA/CIA Domestic Spying
- Peggy Noonan: Catering to the Base Hurts the Country, Except When Republicans are in Charge





Spotlight








Support this site!
Subscribe to the newsletter
Advertise on Firedoglake
Send
us your tips
Make us your homepage
About Firedoglake
Advanced search

fitz!
JUSTICE!
FITZ
How long does a judge normally wait until administering the Allen charge to the jury? Is this case lagging based upon the length of the trial?
moe99 at 3 — Usually, they wait until there is some discussion from the jury that there is a deadlock — or something of that nature. Or when there have been really lengthy deliberations with no sign of any movement. You get a feel for it as you weigh the amount of evidence and the time the jury has been out, because it’s different for every case.
FITZ!
“For some of you, this is probably one of the most important jobs you’ll ever have sitting in judgment of another human being. It is an enormous responsibility. All I will say to you is follow Judge Walton’s instructions. Trust in the evidence. Trust in the evidence and trust in each other.
Be the protector of the integrity of your deliberation process. If somebody begins to go off track and starts to have a situation where Mr. Libby has to prove his innocence as opposed to the Government has to prove his guilt, help that person. Somebody starts to speculate, help that person. If somebody starts to say, oh, you know, he’s a Republican. He worked for Cheney. You know, let’s do him, you know, help that person.” —
Ted Wells pep talk for rogue jurors
Good Monday Morning, fellow FireDogs! ==>(EPU Alert) :)
Are U ready for >>1 GUILTY verdicts today? Is waiting getting U down? You could always join the regular “Gabbling of the Clan” over at
And, to while away the time some more, and if U didn’t see it last Fri PM, whyncha keep your spirits up by checking out my http://tinyurl.com/yvu7pa (that’s just a compressed URL EPU’d from an FDL string from last Friday evening)?
I took Wolverine’s excellent start on “The Wrath Of Big Patrick Fitzgerald” (based on Gordon Lightfoot’s original lyric of “The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald” (that’s available, for your reading pleasure, at http://tinyurl.com/nhqh5 )) and kept on riffin’… I kept Wolverine’s title and verses… Many props to Wolverine for the kick-start!
Allen charge =? Come to Jesus.
SOS in MA at 6 — That is waaaaaay too long. Can you possibly shorten that please if you are going to post it in the comments? Otherwise, we’re going to have to edit it because that takes up way too much bandwidth. Thanks.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 8
Yeppers. Just did it; sorry for causing probs to the best team of mods ever. If still too long delete & I’ll chop more :)
Thanks, looseheadprop and Christy, appreciate this. Very informative.
The parties in the Libby trial have been asked to come to the courtroom at 9:45 today (Monday) morning. Thank you.
– they should listen, with a disposition to be convinced, to each other’s arguments –
Basically, they should be of open mind. This does not mean they should -be- convinced by another, but they should be willing to be convinced, and not wed to any initial conclusion or impression they may currently hold. The antithesis of bloggers everywhere!
Fitzmas at 11 — Yes, we know. It’s in my note in the above post. ;-)
Well, today I have that fitzmas feeling,
no, wait, I had that feeling last week too…never mind….
Christy, pass me that coffee please and it deserved to be strong and bold like a good cup of java. ;)
Orient Lodge from media bloggers says we may have a exposed juror outside courtroom?
Can we speculate about what might happen if there is a not guilty verdict.
Will Fitz appeal, or just give up. What are his options?
thanks
Fitzmas at 15 — Just poured myself another cuppa. And we only make strong coffee in this house — none of that weak crap here, thanks. *g*
1896 is the same year the Supreme Court handed down Plessy v Ferguson. It established the odious concept of “separate but equal.”
From Orient Lodge …
9:57 All Rise…
Judge Walton speaks: My understanding from the foreman of the jury… A juror may have been exposed outside courtroom… Others jurors may have been exposed… Don’t know the nature of the situation… make arrangements with jury…
annx at 17 — If there is a juror who got exposed to media coverage of the case, there will be a voir dire of that individual juror to determine what, if anything, they heard or read. It is SO tough to avoid all media coverage — especially for them in a political case within the Beltway, I would suspect.
Haven’t left for Court yet. I may be in for the kill yet (praying).
Christy, did your source suggest the nature of the note?
Is that why the Allen Charge post is up? It seems a tad early for the jury to be at that stage (unless that goofy 11-1 rumor was true?)
annx @ 16
Brrrr.
If the foreman and the other jurors are being careful to note and alert the judge to this kind of thing … I think that is good. Speaks well of them.
quill @ 17
prosecution cannot appeal from Not guitly verdict. This is the essence of double jeapardy
LHP at 22 — Nope, just said there was a note from the jury that needed to be addressed. Spoke to Jane earlier and she was on her way to the courthouse — bu parking there is a bear and a half, so no idea if she’s made it to the media room as yet or not.
Libby lost it, he is streaking downtown wearing only his ear muffs!
annx at 24 — I agree. A careful and concerned jury is always a good thing.
Sitting in the waiting room of Lynchburg General Hospital, my father in law is having heart surgery. I’m hoping for a double play her!
jeebus Christy – am trying so hard t/b a good little Plamer – hands folded in lap, ankles crossed - but what the hell does ‘exposed’ mean in this case -
okay, sees Christy’s note above, refolds hand, purposefully, deliberately exhales . . .
Christy Hardin Smith @ 21
It’s Slugworth. I knew it.
Agh. What’s the chances that Toensing’s POS in WaPo was the point of exposure?
Wish there was a legal remedy for her nonsense.
(((best wishes))) for your father in law and the surgical team, raven!
I’m in the media room at the court house. Here is a loose recounting of what Walton just said:
Judge Walton speaks: My understanding from the foreman of the jury… A juror may have been exposed outside courtroom… Others jurors may have been exposed… Don’t know the nature of the situation… make arrangements with jury…
CNN reporting on the jury exposure now…
Be exposed (which does sound like flashing the way it is written)
Do we mean that one or more jurors had their ID’s exposed in the press (which is news to me) pr that that one or more jurors were themselves exposed to press coverage.
Why am I fladhing back the Vicky’s peice of jury tampering in the WaPo?
Ok, ok, don’t ove react.
Plaese godess, no mistrial. Please
(((((raven’s father-in-law)))))
Heart surgery usually works!
We’re thinking about you.
(((((((raven))))))))
Shuster – ‘ juror used meia based arguments in deliberations . . .’
cbl @ 39
Oh lord.
cbl @ 39
this can’t be good
Time to book 16 suites at the St. Regis and sequester these pups.
and I swear to God, if we find out it was TOesuck . . .jes angrily sayin’
Aldon — thanks for dropping in, appreciate any help you can offer with updates.
cgreen @ 38
Thank’s ya’ll. Given that we thought we were going to hospice last week at least he’s got a shot with this valve replacement.
cbl at 30 — It could be as simple as a juror running into Wells or Fitz or one of the other attorneys or even Libby in the hallway, too. There are any number of issues that it could be. But whatever it is, you always — ALWAYS — want to thoroughly discuss it and get it on the record so that if there is an appeal later, the appellate court will have a full and thorough record of the issue in case it is one of the grounds alleged for appeal.
This is why you have detailed motions and memoranda, etc., filed as well — it is all preserving the record for your client for appeal, just in case. That’s one of the biggest parts of the job for attorneys. And Judge Walton, in my observation, is very careful and very thorough about that sort of thing — he’s meticulous. (I’ve been in front of judges who are sloppy about that sort of thing, Judge Walton is very, very good about it. And will put all of this on the record for us, I’m sure.)
LHP – thanks for the enlightening post.
Christy – thanks for keeping us up-to-date. Looking forward to hearing what the what this “note” is about. Lurk time!
Shuster is reporting on MSNBC that a juror has been exposed to media coverage.
How is the George W. Bush/John McCain “Fast Bleed” policy coming along?
-GSD
cbl @ 39
that cannot be good. My bet, off the top of my head, the guy who used to work for Woody. You cannot be a news junkie and just quit cold turkey like that.
I don’t think I could, even if I wanted to
oh – oh.
BREAKING NEWS Via MSNBC’s David Shuster:
one of the jurists brought outside info into jury deliberations.
hmmm… i wonder about that jurist… intentional jury tainting by one jurist?
cbl @
39
Someone’s been reading Driftglass. Damnit!
Let me just say — if there is some taint from media exposure on this, there is a possibility of a mistrial and then a retrial. No idea if that will happen, but I want to be sure everyone knows this.
looseheadprop @ 50
Argh!!! Toensing. I hope she’s disbarred and tarred and feathered.
v o x p o p g i r l @ 51
Well if we go by the WaPo’s recent coverage there is a 4 in 5 chance it’s a GOP mouthpiece claiming there is no underlying crime.
Or else they brough EJ Diones column in today.
I’m discounting the chance its the Washington Times as nobody admits to reading that pile of shit.
question:
why would one jurist inform all the other jurists to know that they brought in outside info — when they were all instructed to NOT do so?
Man, that is not good. If someone brought in one of the op-eds from the WP for example – that would be bad news.
Poster wrote:
Can we speculate about what might happen if there is a not guilty verdict. Will Fitz appeal…
Do you know anything about the US justice system at all?
Fitzmas @ 42
I was shocked they were not sequestered in the first place, but didn’t want to skew things by saying so in public.
Please no mistrial. I wish I had the time, maybe Hugh or EPU does, There is a jury instruction relating to taint by exposure to media. I do not have it to hand and it would prably take me an hour to find it on the net. I’m still home b/c of the snow
ditto that, emptywheel!
dang it.
Thanks, Aldon.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 53
Son of a bitch. No more coffee for me.
I am trying to remain calm but I feel like I am going to throw up.
Submission Accomplished.
-GSD
emptywheel @ 54
Has it been confirmed that it was Toensing’s editorial? Lots of people have been guessing that it might be her.
it seems so…. OVERT.
Jurist possibly tainted in Libby trial? One juror was exposed to Libby trial info outside the courtroom. Walton called the parties together and they are now discussing this serious development with the jury foreman. Also to check and see if any other jurors were involved.
Developing, per CNN….
Christy Hardin Smith @ 53
But first the judge will bend over backwards to make sure they can reach a verdict. The greatest likelihood is an admonishment and continued deliberations.
I will try to keep adding color here, as well as on Orient Lodge as I get it. People are talking about mistrial
raven @ 45
Pig valve? or mechanical. My aunt had the pig valve and it was like a geting a whole new lease on life.
voxpopgirl – immediately wondered same thing – either the tainted was a dummy or whoever exposed them as such was a dummy for indicating it was ‘media based’ – sweet jeebus
A McGriddle sandwich that had the likeness of Scooter toasted on the muffin – an act of God or Satan?
LOL – Well, believe it or not, there was only one comment that I saw before I typed up and posted mine. sigh :o)
v o x p o p g i r l @ 55
Or, if one juror based an argument on recent coverage, how would other jurors know unless they saw the same coverage?
emptywheel @ 54
coating her with honey and putting on a fire ant hill would be the green way to do it ;)
Bet Ted Wells is crying right now, “But my Scooter has been denied a fair trial.”
Attaturk @ 67
OmiGAWD I sure hope so, Attaturk.
Nothing is confirmed. Everything beyond the description of media exposure has been reported. Let’s all take it one bit at a time, gang.
motherlowman @ 72
To: motherlowman exactly.
Are there alternates left?
motherlowman @ 73
I’m guessing from MI, not talking from DC, but I think what happened is that one brought up something that hadn’t been admitted into court. And then the foreman asked questions or realized what it meant.
Can I just say there was one almost taint with a Style page article. And then Toensing’s style page article. As if the first were a dry run…
Ummm, I know that anything is possible and, heck, even obviously guilty murderers can be set free, but I just find the possibility of a not guilty verdict in this case to be extremely remote. Maybe there may be a disagreement on one of the charges but totally not guilty? I just ain’t seeing it.
I think the waiting just has us rattled a bit. We have to remember that these people have to figure out what we’ve known for several years. Without the benefit of blogging, that’s bound to take some time. I’m confident they will reach the correct conclusion.
I knew that freakin’ Toesning was trying to throw the jury. If it is her, and I emphasize IF, then she should undergo some sort of sanction.
Balrog @ 23. LOL
Pig valve? or mechanical. My aunt had the pig valve and it was like a geting a whole new lease on life.
Pig, he’s 84 and been having some degree of difficulty for a while beu he never misses a Virginia Tech football game! The kindneys are a concern as well but they say this hospital is good .
trifecta @ 79
Yes, two. And they’ve only had 4 days to get exposure themselves, but they also didn’t seem like news junkies.
do we know if the juror in question brought media material in on Friday, or this morning? It seems kind of early this morning for the exposure to happen this morning, but maybe the jury began deliberations earlier than I realized.
Everybody – keep breathing. We shouldn’t speculate too much. It could just be that a juror heard or read something, and started to mention it but didn’t really expose the other jurors because he/she was stopped before they could proceed. We have no idea what kind of information this juror had. Don’t panic.
Pachacutec @ 76
Is anybody liveblogging this anywhere? I would even read Clarice at this point. We need DATA
Toensing’s article had a front page, above and past the fold spread and graphic in the Sunday opinion section, called “Outlook.” It was not the Styles section. Just to be clear.
emptywheel @ 79
I’m guessing from MI, not talking from DC, but I think what happened is that one brought up something that hadn’t been admitted into court. And then the foreman asked questions or realized what it meant.
Thanx Emptywheel~
Can I just say there was one almost taint with a Style page article. And then Toensing’s style page article. As if the first were a dry run…
Orient Lodge hasn’t had anymore updates. If I see one – I will cross-post it in comments. If that’s okay with Christy.
Clarice? Good God, mon! Have you lost it?
looseheadprop—
What about http://www.springerlink.com/co…..0277l2650/
It leads to a pdf but you have to be a member and/or pay $32. I’ll spring for the link if you like :)
trifecta @ 78
If they bring back the two alternets. then the jury has to begin delibeating from scratch. There is an instruction for this. However, if the jduge determines that the deleiberations have gone tto long/far for the jury to credibly be expected to start over, he is reqired to declare a mistrial.
I have stomache ache
CNN update: foreperson told Walton a juror MAY have been exposed to information from outside the courtroom. No further details, other than Walton is talking with the foreperson.
trifecta @ 79
One maybe. Don’t hold me to it.
Valentine shirt, now this…Runaway Jury, Grisham style. Why not, case has everything else…
VP abroad to various undisclosed till arrival locations.
Still at the same game.
ugh.
Alternates were excused, they can’t come back, can they?
A single exposed juror will not result in a mistrial. The other 11 will be asked whether their exposure to that juror’s extra-trial info has affected them or can be put aside. They will agree that it hasn’t. An alternate will be selected and the juror who likely read the media (and is probably Libby-friendly given how the MSM is AWOL or pro-Libby) will be sent packing. This bodes well for a unanimous guilty verdict, although more time will be necessary as the newly constituted jury must begin deliberations anew. As Lincoln said: “As we face problems anew, let us think anew.”
CNN also said there is no information if other jurors may have been exposed.
So, keep breathing. This may be much less of a big deal than the first rumors.
egregious @ 95
There are two. They were dismissed with instructions to stay away from the news.
egregious @ 91
If it leads to a PDF
I am told there are two alternates left, but the juror may have tainted other jurors….
Side question: Did anyone hear any good late night TV jokes about the trial? If so, can you get me the joke and the source?
motherlowman @ 73
THAT IS THE MILLION DOLLAR QUESTION, imo.
A. J. Greif @ 97
From your fingers to God’s ears
– f one juror based an argument on recent coverage, how would other jurors know unless they saw the same coverage? –
.
The “tainted” juror may have announced the source of information – either expressly, or it may have been obvious as something not coming from within the four corners of the trial proceedings.
egregious @ 94
two left
A. J. Greif @ 97
Assuming this is a realistic scenario, and God I am praying you’re right, does this help Libby on appeal though?
Hilarious…this comment at least helps break the tension for me.
Pat_AlexVA @ 96
Maybe they can. See my 92
emptywheel @ 100
That is great news actually. If they stayed away from the news as per their instructions(and you mentioned they weren’t newshounds) then we still have two backups if they decide to boot the juror who introduced the outside media information into the deliberations.
I wait with bated breath.
But if the rest of the jury has been exposed to the media information that the one juror brought into the deliberations, doesn’t that taint all of them? Alternates wouldn’t be able to cover all of the other 11.
Does one bad apple spoil the whole bunch? And did Victoria Toensing just throw sand in the ump’s eyes again?
motherlowman @ 73
If it was something that was not permitted to be introduced at trial. Say, if it had to do with Plame’s covert status.
In a company town like DC with a pulsating media, perhaps sequestering the jury during the deliberation phase might have been a good idea.
How is that for Monday morning quarterbacking?
I hope they didn’t read my pro-Libby blog.
wow egregious ! that was fast, I’m still mired down in NOLO and Findlaw – lol !
Aldon Hynes @ 101
I went to bed. Were there any jokes comments about the trial at the Oscars?
hmmm…
i wonder WHICH juror it is….
Aldon Hynes @ 102
good luck with that, I’m not sure any of them know there’s a Scooter Libby trial.
portia.vz @ 109
IANAL but jurors hear things in the course of the trial that are objected to and then they are instructed to ignore it. When I was a juror, a witness inadvertently revealed that the defendant had a prior conviction. We were to disregard it but I heard it.
> If they bring back the two alternets. then
> the jury has to begin delibeating from
> scratch.
I would think the alternates would all be media-contaminated at this point.
Cranky
Interesting development following the Andrew comment on Friday — the Word has it – comment that had Tom Henegan as the source.
I know I sound tinfoilish, but that stunt with the red t-shirts and the white heart on Valentines really bothered me, it just struck a discordant tone with me, straight out of Grisham’s Run Away Jury…and the fact that one person declined to wear one…too weird for words. Based only on my tin foil theories, I feared a hung jury. Someone on that jury seems to have a great deal of influence over the rest, eh??? It just didn’t strike me as the kind of thing that you do in a trial, let alone one of this magnitude.It would be interesting to find out exactly which one came up with that, etc.
Thank you all for your exceptional work on all this. I don’t know how I could have stayed so informed without you all!!
so hard to avoid the media in today’s world. maybe a jury composed of the following would work:
*the amish,
*off the grid types,
*someone raised by wolves,
*sunny von bulow who suddenly wakes up from her coma,
*or those folks in the biosphere
Barb @ 121
Barb…
why would that juror who didn’t wear the same tee shirt, WANT to STICK OUT like a SORE THUMB?
Rumour has it Joseph DiGenova was spotted in the courthouse restroom hear a gloryhole with the with the words “Scooter’s innocent” written on his forehead.
Just reporting the buzz.
-GSD
On the bright side, the foreperson handled this exactly right. Immediately brought it to the judge’s attention. I hope…that is what it sounds like.
This had to be deliberate sabotage. None of these people are idiots. The jury was given, as they are in any trial from the lowliest civil action to a death penalty case, instructions to avoid media coverage of the case at hand. To not only consume media pertaining to the case, but to then bring it into the jury room and contaminate the rest of the jurors? If the one juror had been tainted, an alternate juror could have replaced him/her. This action makes a mistrial almost certain.
… say it was a new book, that their book club just started reading, a thriller about the Anatomy…
Here’s the TP link regarding the tainted juror:
http://thinkprogress.org/2007/…..side-info/
squirrel hiller @ 121
They could use my students. None of them had heard of Libby before I mentioned him a couple of weeks ago.
From Think Progress:
This is from DailyKos front page, from a Schuster report:
The jury now, which is in its fourth day of deliberations, has a major problem which could put this entire case on the verge of a mistrial. The jury foreperson sent the Judge a note this morning, saying that one of the jurors in this panel had contact with news coverage of this case and used that information as part of the jury deliberations with others. In other words, this outside news coverage seeped into deliberations despite the Judge adamantly demanding that jurors not watch any news coverage, that they judge this case strictly on what is presented in court. This could be a huge problem. And what the court is now doing is, the Judge and the attorneys, in chambers, are asking the jury foreperson exactly what information has been essentially been moved into jury deliberations, who was the juror who came in contact with it, what did that juror say to the other jurors. And then after the court is done talking to the foreperson, then the Judge and the attorneys on both sides will then go individually, one at a time if necessary, to question each individual juror about what impact all of this had. In most cases, when a Judge has said there can be no consideration of outside information, and that information gets into jury deliberations, in most cases the court will declare a mistrial.
sunny @ 126
Sadly, it’s the first thing that came to mind with me, too.
Jane S. @ 107
No. One could only flip Walton on this if he “abused his discretion”, which is the hardest appellate standard on which to prevail
victoria toensing
tar and feather those long long teeth of hers.
. . .typing out loud here – let’s say it was Toesuck and the Mighty Shillin’ Power Stenographers at WaPo Editorial Board – nothing really happens to them does it ? it’s all on the exposed juror isn’t it?
oh gawd Pat_Alex - a much needed, well timed 707 !
wondering which juror it was….
[1] Woodward’s former assistant?
[2] the person who didn’t wear the same tee shirt…?
anyone?
Lets think positive and hope its nothing more than a consciences juror who walked past a tv showing coverage (and kept walking) and was compelled to let the court know.
Maybe it was Scooter’s bodice-ripper the juror was reading.
Who is “slugworth”?
Pat_AlexVA @ 127
That’s a helluva good book… but not appropriate for the Jury Room, more’s the pity :)
This could be something as simple as a juror telling just the foreperson “I heard the (insert name of newspaper) said…” and then the foreperson cut the juror off. Or, the juror had someone walk up to them and start to tell them info, and the juror cut the informant off – but then reported the incident to the foreperson even though they didn’t know anything. So, we could have a situation where not even one juror is tainted.
CNN update: no new info. Expert says “this isn’t uncommon… sometimes people inadvertently read something or hear something. Walton will likely interview the juror and possibly all jurors to see if anyone has been tainted.
The admonition wasn’t to avoid ALL media. Orient Lodge report the buzz in the media room is that a juror heard a joke on a late-night television program. That sort of thing would be hard to avoid (if watching the program) and if the speculation is accurate, both the juror who admitted hearing the joke (maybe he/she retold it) and the foreman for bringing the exposure to the attention of Judge Walton are doing the right thing. I would take it as a sign that the jury is in fact working in good faith.
ya gotta love how the CNN Chyron reads:
“Jury Foreman says juror may have been exposed to trial info.”
as if, you know, the “trial info” was a “flasher” that opened it’s provervial raincoat and “exposed” all that “trial info” onto the poor unwitting jurist.
luc @ 140
Willy Wonka’s chief and evil competitor. He tried to steal the secret to the Everlasting Gobstopper from the Golden Ticket kids.
squirrel hiller @ 134
I sure hope Victrola Toesuck just went to change her NASA diaper; she musta filled at least one by now LOL
A mistrial only means that Scooter will enrich Bill and Ted’s Most Excellent retirement accounts….and Fitz can stay in DC a little longer.
The downside is that it postpones the inevitable indictment of Dick Cheney. :(
The jury foreperson DID handle this right. And I am assuming the event happened first thing this AM, so the info MUST have been something that happened since they left on friday
LandOfTheFree @ 140
This is very comforting.
CNN has an article up on the jury matter:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITI…..index.html
ABA Standards for Criminal Justice, Fair Trial and Free Press
IANAL, hope this might shed some light; see Sections 8.3.5 thru 8.3.6, in particular at this point in time. (Don’t read the rest and then panic, it’s not yet applicable IMO.)
cboldt @
143
The buzz is completely unsubstantiated, someone’s wild fancy, but it sounds very reasonable. The comment about the jury working in good faith I think is too the point, but some are wondering if it will add to the arguments for a mistrial.
As an aside, Fitzgerald does not appear to be in with the lawyers and the judge investigating the incident, leaving it to a different member of his team.
cbl @ 136
it would depend how that info got to that juror. Was it the juror who defiantly read the WaPo or did someone deliberatly give it to the juror? latter case, there could be consequences for that person. Many many “ifs” mhere
Shuster is hyperventilating a bit in my opinion. The CNN expert is right, this is not UNCOMMON, and judges with experience like Walton know how to handle it. It could be that the juror is uncommonly conscientuous and in my experience most of them are.
I think people need to stop about the t-shirts. I wouldn’t have worn the t-shirt, not because I am bad person or not a team player or because I’m easily bribed, but just because I don’t think jurors are supposed to do that kind of thing. I would have demured on that basis–that it was inappropriate and I am surprised that there was only one hold out.
OT.
Iraqi Vice President almost assassinated.
The surge is going great guns.
Let’s see, the Iraqi President Talibani is stricken ill and leaves country, VP is almost assassinated.
Sounds like there is an effort underway to clear the boards and bring in…..ta…daaaaa……Ahmed Chalabi to sign the oil laws into place.
-GSD
Wow! An honest juror who admits to hearing a joke about the trial is a good thing, I think.
looseheadprop—aldon hynes is in the media room and on this thread adn said he would offer info here as it comeshttp://www.orient-lodge.com/aldon hynes @orient lodge
cboldt @ 143
Thank you. I AM OVER REACTING. My tummy feels better now. Iam shutting off the laptop now and going tothe office
portia.vz @ 156
If that is the case yes, like I said at 153 my experience over the years is that jurors are uncommonly conscientious.
Ditto Jane S. on the t-shirts.
If it was the wrong shade of red for my complexion or hair, I might not wear it, even if everyone else did. Or if it wasn’t flattering to my figure.
And this would have no impact on my working with a group to come up with a united verdict.
From MSNBC’s site
i wouldn’t wear the t shirt.
my fashion rule: nothing whiter that my teeth.
that means only taupe colored t shirts
WASHINGTON – Attorneys and a federal judge began privately questioning each juror in the CIA leak trial Monday after one juror apparently saw or read something about the case over the weekend. …Jurors occasionally saw some news coverage during the monthlong trial. Unlike those incidents, after which only one juror was questioned, Walton said each juror would be questioned behind closed doors…..If Walton dismisses any jurors, he has two alternates — both women — that can fill in. The alternates, both women, sat through the trial and have been on standby since deliberations late began Wednesday morning.
cboldt @ 143
That was EXACTLY what I was thinking – but I didn’t want to fuel more speculation (hard to do!) I was thinking, what if someone was watching Leno or Letterman or a similar late-night non-news talk show, or was watching some Oscars pre-show and someone made a joke or comment? They thought they were avoiding news, but accidentally heard a joke that made them panic, worrying that they may have just inadvertently blown their opportunity to continue in deliberations.
It’s great to hear that the jury is being so careful to make sure that nothing can be construed as “tainting” the jury.
To be clear, there is no reason to conclude that someone read Toensing’s article, or any other major piece of media (pro- or anti-Libby, for that matter).
dmac at 158 — Jane is also there and will have an update shortly. Everyone, remember to breathe.
lhp, i meant that he would offer info in this thread, not just on his site.
The only joke I saw all weekend, or last week for that matter, was MSNBC’s coverage of the Anna Nicole Smith Corpse case.
thanks Prof Prop! already beginning to breathe normally again
btw, believe Hizzoner admonishes them to avoid media coverage of the trial/charges, now I’m wondering if simply trying to catch up on the grotesque that is All Anna, All The Time™ did they catch something on a crawler ???
Fresh thread from Jane from the media room.
If it is a big nothing-which I sincerely hope-will Walton now sequester them to avoid future incidents–I know Walton wants to make this comfortable for his jurors but it isn’t likely they would have to be sequestered for that long.
Why can’t the jurors use a TiVo and have someone screen what they watch, so they don’t get blindsided by random humor in prominent cases? Partially serious, here…?
My first, cynical thought was jury tampering. Bribe a juror, get him to introduce information heard on the news, get a mistrial. Maybe avoid the scrutiny of a pardon?
Another ironic twist in a trial about (among other things) the manipulation of, and by, the media.
Someone on the jury was probably watching The Faux 1/2 Hour News Hour.
Talk about contaminated…
Jane S. @
155
That’s exactly what bothered me about the whole thing, especially considering what’s been reported on the jurors.
angie @
33
…joining hands…
best to you and your whole family, raven ;->
looseheadprop @
116
I’m sad to say it was a joke-free Oscars. Were Ellen Degeneres charged with being a comedienne, a jury given only her Oscars performance last night would have to find her Not Guilty.
The photo at the top of the thread reminded me of something that has bugged me throught the trial. In most of the photos of Scooter he is smiling – not a Shooter smirk, but a real smile. Should we make anything of this?
rocket scientist at 179 — He smiles a lot with his mouth, and his eyes crinkle up — but it doesn’t actually reach his eyes. Don’t read anything into it other than he knows the press is keeping an eye on him any time he’s near the courthouse.
raven @ 29
Thinking of you, Raven, and your dad-in-law, and my dad. Hope all goes well for you there.
Fitzmas @
42
Looks like the horse has already been stolen.
squirrel hiller @ 123
;->
cbl @ 30
Maybe they saw Scoots trotting by in his earmuffs?
CNN is reporting that the juror was dismissed
illegal w/h secret wiretap of jurors for blackmail starting to pay-off… eh
*sigh* If only the Republicans in Congress conducted themselves in the same manner. No lock-step voting, no arm-twisting, no heaven-knows-what-is-held-over-their-heads to get the results they want.
Given Defense’s demonstrated contempt for process integrity (Libby/cheney bait-and-switch), I’m sure that Ms Art Curator realized, with help from Slugworth, that her plutocrat DC art patrons are vastly disproportionatly from Irving’s ethnic community.
Is it really the *duty* of the jury to reach a unanimous verdict, or just to try their best to do so? Reasonable (and unreasonable) people can differ about the interpretation of a set of facts, let alone the value they place on different factors, and that may even be an accurate or fair reflection of what’s been presented to them. A lot depends on the nature of the issue and the values of the jurors. But by calling it a “duty,” you implicitly eliminate the juror(s) who holds out for good reason.