
Ted Wells, Patrick Fitzgerald and Reggie Walton
(Quick Note: Catch Firedoglake's Jane Hamsher and Marcy Wheeler, author of "Anatomy of Deceit," streaming on Cynthia Black's radio show here as they discuss the Libby trial. This runs today at 2:00 PM EST/11:00 AM PST.)
The day began like any Washington, DC commuter's day: on the Metro. Then I got to the courthouse, and suddenly, it was no longer an ordinary day.
I watched opening statements from a seat between my incredible co-blogger Christy Hardin Smith and the vivacious (who knew?) Nina Totenberg of NPR. Her eyes always dance happily, even in repose. I lent her a pen; we whispered furtive courtroom quips. I was charmed.
Marcy Wheeler, the eponymous emptywheel who has been liveblogging the trial for the last week, is amazing. She types so fast! If you want to get up to speed on this case, you really need to buy her book. The day of opening statements, Christy and I were in the courtroom while Marcy, er, womaned the keyboard from the media room.
A trial is a complex thing. There's all the evidence, rules of evidence, legal stuff and rules for jury deliberations, but anyone who has interviewed jurors after a trial (and I have) knows that it's often the unpredictable elements, the very human elements, jurors hang on to and remember. As I watched opening statements this week from inside the courtroom, as preoccupied as I was with taking notes of the competing arguments, I was also most attentive to the ebb and flow of human energy, the little looks and asides, the personalities and the dynamics of people and perceptions, as best I could read them, drawing on my experience and my doctorate in psych. I want to share a little of what it was like to be in the courtroom, through my perceptions of how the players came across.
Here's the thing: in my view, the three dominant personalities in the room – Pat Fitzgerald, Reggie Walton and Ted Wells – are all engaged in a complex game of "who's your daddy?," both among themselves and, perhaps most especially, for the jury and the media. Think of it as an alpha male American Idol for the jury and the public, where the ultimate prize is the jurors' trust and confidence, with public perception a very close second.
Reggie Walton:
Walton's courtroom personality is actually pretty likable. He's very thoughtful when he speaks to jurors, and he talks to them, not at them. His style is very empowering of a jury, allowing them to do some things not all judges do. He gives them paper and pens, so they can take notes. He describes their role to them as "judges" of fact. He tells the sixteen jurors and alternates that there are seventeen judges in the room: himself, as the judge of the law and the process, and the jurors themselves. That's some nice framing. He lets them know that if they need a break, they should just signal, and he'll stop the proceedings. Each member of the jury has access to an emergency brake.
When Walton speaks, he speaks in what comes across generally as a down to earth style. He doesn't shout or preen, and he even shows flashes of humor. It's his court room, to be sure, but he does not seem to try to flaunt or prove it to anybody. True, he can drag on a bit with some of his favorite stories, like the one about the importance of serving on a jury, illustrated by his experiences in Russia when he did some work abroad to help people understand what a functioning judicial system is all about. But for all that, he's not a windbag. Walton seems okay, though I have no idea how he is in terms of fairness in the law. From what I can tell, he seems to be playing it pretty straight.
Walton's had to deal with a fair amount of legal jockeying between Fitzgerald and Wells. For example, on day one of the trial, Wells made a bit of a flourish during his opening statement to suggest, rather indirectly, that a requirement that he read certain descriptions of classified information to the jury verbatim represented a kind of government conspiracy to place limits on the defense's ability to tell its full side of the story.
This implication was not so much in the text of what Wells said (he's too smart for that), but in the rather dramatic way he said and repeated it. Fitzgerald objected after the break, outside of the presence of the jury, and Walton tended to agree with the prosecution. He required Wells to make a clarifying statement in front of the jury, and then added his own fairly mild statement to the effect that the defense has been fully enabled to present its case through rulings of evidence made by the court.
Fitz didn't think Walton's statement went far enough, since he wanted to convey that the prosecution also has limits on what it could bring out related to classified evidence. Walton wasn't buying that argument completely though, since, technically, the prosecution stems from the executive branch of government, which could, if it chose to do so, declassify information at will. Through all of this, Walton seemed to listen genuinely to both sides, made his decision, and said with some humility (as he now has done more than once), "Look, if I'm wrong, I'll be reversed, if it comes to that, but this is my decision."
The feeling is this is very much Reggie Walton's courtroom, but he does not seem to feel the need to push his personality as some kind of dominating presence. Still, I found it a little unnerving when the glare of the lights off his glasses made it impossible for me to tell if he was watching me as I surreptitiously scarfed some M&M's from my jacket pocket after lunch. I got a little paranoid there for a minute.
Ted Wells:
Wells is a bit of a wild card, and laid down his marker with an aggressive opening statement. Before he began, he was pacing off to the side of the courtroom, almost in the corner, gathering his focus. Then, once he began, he shot out of the box, loudly, passionately, even angrily introducing himself as the "voice of Scooter Libby," whom he declared to be completely innocent.
Hmm. . .
Okay, here's my thing with Wells. Were I the accused in any trial, I would want my attorney to make an aggressive case on my behalf. My natural sympathies tend to align with the defense, civil liberties and civil rights liberal that I am. But Wells is coming across to me as a wee bit reckless, and his theatrics, when he employs them, just a tad contrived. My gut sense is this is the generally shared view in the courtroom: from what I can suss out of some jurors' body language, they have their doubts as well.
I struggle to question and check myself: do I harbor this impression because I expect and believe that Libby is guilty, and not merely of the current charges at the bar? It's possible, but I don't think so. I've seen plenty of presentations, professional speakers (in fact, I am one), and stage productions, so I'm coming at this more purely from a stage/courtroom/audience dynamics perspective. Take what follows for whatever it may be worth.
I frequent the Shakespeare Theater here in DC, whose productions are typically top notch. I know persuasive, compelling acting from technically good but somehow slightly off key performances. I have found myself both convinced and unconvinced by performances, and authentic live acting sears itself upon your consciousness: it doesn't look like acting. What can I say? Wells didn't do that for me, though with his dramatic flourishes and flashes of fury against supposed government abuses, he surely was trying, not so much to persuade me, but to persuade the jury and the press corps as a whole.
Wells is a risk taker, though maybe he's that way because the facts so far in this case are so bad for him. He seems to be laying the groundwork for at least three potentially exculpatory narratives, not all of which are simultaneously logically consistent. No doubt he's hoping the jury won't notice: he seems to want to create as much confusion as possible through high volume irrelevancies and a surfeit of confusing detail.
In the end, his opening statement was most notable not only for its volume, but because it was just so. . . damn. . . long. Fitz took an hour; in contrast, Wells took two hours and twenty minutes, right through the afternoon, after lunch. You could feel the energy ebbing in the room, and see the posture of several jurors incrementally sag, so much so that Wells apologetically implored the jurors to "stay with" him.
When Wells speaks, he clearly seems to want to use his body, his presence and his voice to control the room. Maybe it's because I do public presentations and have studied all the little tricks for gathering the attention of an audience to you, but Wells is doing lots of them, and I'm sure it's not an accident. Of all the three wannabe "daddies" in the room, Wells is the one most obviously campaigning for the job. Again, I suppose he has to do this, both because trials in our system tend to favor the prosecution and because the facts in this case may really suck for Libby.
Wells has an uphill battle to fight and he's working hard, but is he winning the trust of the jury? His is also a defense strategy tailored to apply pressure for a pardon, in which effort perception management in the media is of primary importance. Can he convince, not only the jurors, but members of the press that Scooter Libby, of all people, is a powerless pawn and victim?
I don't think he's off to a great start. One more senior African American woman on the jury was giving him a serious look of. . . how shall I describe it?. . . "I know you crazy!" incredulity for the first ten or fifteen minutes of his opening statement. Wells sometimes tries to use a bit of classic African American cadence in his speech when he's on a roll, but he still has this patrician air about him that makes it feel somehow contrived. Walton does it and it sounds completely natural and authentic, and I don't expect the contrast with Walton in the courtroom is one Wells is accustomed to or one from which he's deriving any great benefit, if indeed he's aiming for a kind of folksy, traditionally African American authenticity.
Outside of the presence of the jury, it seems Wells may have lost a minor credibility point or two with the judge, and Walton's opinion matters. Judge Walton has approached this case with a generous posture, trying hard to allow the defense to present its case, through four months of CIPA hearings and by offering the defense some laititude in the questioning of potential jurors' possible biases against the administration during voir dire. But late this week, Walton more or less called bullshit on Wells over a matter of the defense team's ability to review what turned out to be a rather small stack of documents in time to cross examine Cathie Martin. From emptywheel's notes: "Walton: I thought we were talking about reams and reams of documents. With all the lawyer power you got over there I don't think you'll have a problem." D'oh!
Moreover, with even greater animation, Walton declared it would be "suicide" for Libby not to testify in his own defense if he wants to make a case about his faulty memory. That, after all, was the point and the presumption behind all those months of painstaking CIPA hearings. Walton's opinion matters, not only because Wells will need almost every close call on matters of law to go his way to create as much reasonable doubt as possible, but because, at least subliminally, greater confidence by the judge in the prosecution could very easily seep imperceptibly into the minds of jurors. And while the jury does not see this backstage legal wrangling, the press does, and as mentioned, Wells needs to win the public perception war to give Bush as much possible incentive to pardon as possible. I don't envy him: Wells has a helluva tough job.
So, to sum up on Wells, I have a great deal of sympathy for his situation: he's not been dealt a strong hand with this case, and to try to win this one, he has to try to complete Hail Mary pass after Hail Mary pass. He's struggling mightily to pull it off. In my view, he's just not doing it, so far. Still, it's a long trial process, and all he needs to do is make one big connection one time, one "if it does not fit, you must acquit" moment that at least one juror can hang onto, and he could win. You never know. He is a highly able, highly accomplished attorney, by reputation one of the best in his profession.
Pat Fitzgerald:
I'll keep this one a bit simpler, if only because Fitzgerald tends to keep things simpler, at least in his questioning, his opening statement and his other communication, especially in front of a jury.
Let's start with what Reggie Walton said of him on the record, outside of the presence of the jury, calling him one of the most scrupulous prosecutors he's ever had before him. Everything about Fitz, in front of the jury and away from the jury, screams "straight arrow." It seeps through everything, and he carries himself as one who feels he does not have to rush his case, overcomplicate things or resort to gimmicks or histrionics.
Of course, he gets to choose what cases he will bring to trial, so he has the luxury of waiting until he has everything lined up. He does not come across as a gambler, which is why it must have really killed him to take a flier in Fleischer, buying a "pig in a poke" by granting him immunity on the blind.
Fitz may keep things simple, but as a presence, there's nothing really all that simple about him. There's a bit of opacity swirling around Fitz, and it's not just his office's perpetual "no comment." It's also just Fitz. He may sit in repose with his hand on his chin, or fingers absent mindedly tugging at his ear, but his mind is wide awake. Something's going on in there. I've found that people who come across this way actually can gain a power advantage in their interactions with others, as long as people feel or sense that what is hidden can be trusted.
Though openness can create trust and gain the confidence of others, opacity also has its power, if only because people want to figure out and are drawn to a person of mystery. If the mystery comes across as possibly nefarious, however, then all bets are off. That's why Wells' early loss of ground with the judge in the credibility sweepstakes versus Fitz is bad for the defense: to make Fitz look shifty, the defense is going to need some help somewhere from the judge.
One underestimated Fitz ability is his talent for telling a story. "Tell me a story, daddy!" says the young child at bedtime. The daddy sweepstakes are all about trust and taking the jury where you want them to go, and so the power of narrative is critical in the process. Fitz told a rather tight, linear, simple story to the jury of the case with his opening statement, in calmly compelling language, especially in contrast to Wells' epic and confusing opening presentation.
Wells is a thunderer, and if you're going to make that work, the audience needs to buy in to your story of injustice and outrage, and must find your American Idol power crescendos compelling and perfectly tuneful. Fitz, on the other hand, is going for the steady dad image, the one you can quietly trust to take care of you and sort everything out for you at the end. He croons in quieter tones that come across as more natural, less forced. Walton talks to the jury; Wells seemed often and in his opening to be talking at the jury. Fitz also talks to the jury, doing his Atticus Finch thing. As Harper Lee suggested, juries can really appreciate that, even if, in To Kill a Mockingbird, Atticus, arguing for the defense, lost his case.
I shared an elevator ride with Fitz the morning of opening statements. "Let's go, Mets," I offered, knowing I could not get anything of substance from him even if I tried. He has this way of talking that comes across as almost shy, with his lips a little tight on one side of his mouth, not wanting to betray too much (I was wearing my media badge, too). Nevertheless, he chatted me up about the Mets, the pending start of Spring training and the disappointing end to the football Giants' season through six floors. He carries a kind of humble air about him that must be maddening to defense attorneys, though behind it all clearly lurks a killer instinct and a kind of missionary zeal for the cases he chooses to pursue. Fitz is not a man to be misunderestimated in a courtroom.
So, who's the daddy? (Do I sound like Maury Povich?)
Thus far, Walton has kept his handle on the attorneys and the process, and the jurors really seem to like him. He needs to ride this case out and keep from being reversed, and though I'm no judge of the legal aspects of all that, from what I can gather from the legal brains running around, he seems on reasonably safe ground so far.
Wells is trying hard to be the daddy, and has perhaps the toughest job to establish that kind of credibility, but he's also hit some bad notes, and it's begun, in my view, to hurt him (and his client). He has time to make all this up, however.
Fitz seems to me to be ahead in the daddy sweepstakes: if he's channeling Atticus Finch, well, Atticus is the idealized dad, after all. The press is not buying the idea that Fitz is an out of control prosecutor, floated earlier by Team Libby and the Barbara Comstock disinformation operation, because the decision not to indict Rove completely undercuts that narrative.
We'll see how all of this unfolds, but I'll probably be back in the courtroom tomorrow to check in again with the jury, watch how they're responding, and see whatever wrangling ensues among these three sturdy egos during the inevitable arguments over Ari Fleischer's testimony.
Stay tuned!



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Fitz! Pach!
EPU’d, but not off topic:
I learned quite a bit about immunity from lhp’s great post this morning. Anyone who skipped it should go back and check. And Elizabeth de la Vega’s reminiscences of protest, upheaval and illegal government activities from 35 years ago jostled my memory about these times as much as anything I’ve read recently. I remember a lot, but we all forget things for one reason or another. Thanks, Ms. de la Vega. Marvin Gaye, indeed. Played CJ and the Fish for my kids on a road trip last summer. They’d never heard him before. Eventually we were all singing “One, two three, four, what are we fighting for?”
Re the queries on whether or not juries are intimididated by all the Gucci lawyers at Libby’s long table (do they sit him as Jesus among the Apostles?), from my experience on juries, they are a bit, but not nearly as much as they are impressed by the competence of same and of the prosecution. One faux pas toward or deliberate slighting of the jury or jurors can screw up the best defense or prosecution bigtime.
I’m looking forward to having a defense attorney joining the fdl blogging next week. She’s gotta blow our minds to outdo Marcy’s Thursday briliance.
And, I’ll add in now – thanks Pach. I liked your running commentary even better than your late night Billie Holiday clip, which was priceless.
Sorry, not clear. In the paragraph beginning “Though openness” under the Fitz section, Walton’s should be Wells’ (I think you will see, refers to the defense atty, not the judge)
bg @
3
I don’t understand, though I appreciate the edits! Can you repeat?
Team America is the daddy.
bg: Nevermind, I found it.
Thanks!
BTW, thanks for all this, TEAM FDL, winning, all around.
Looking forward to the second week of Fitztivus.
Merry Fitztivus to All.
The Libby Trial Has Two Daddies.
Eli @ 8
Um, and at least two mommies. You know, if anyone says FDL is not being fair, like giving every hand up/out to the defense, well, ESAD.
Jane and Marcy will be on AAR Phoenix on Cynthia Black’s show Action Point at 2ET,11 PST.
Live stream here:
http://actionpointonline.com/
Eli @
9
We’re having a gay ol’ time.
Thanks Pachacutec! What a superb word portrait and I especially enjoyed your M&M moment and the mental image you invoked of sitting between Redd and Nina. I do so hope the defense team observed the three of you in the courtroom, adding further to their angst and trepidation.
Thanks for the insights. You folks posting at fdl have put together a wonderful team of complementary perspectives. Others have said it or something like it, but I will add my voice to the claim that “if you are not actually making history (and I think you are), all of you are doing a fantastic job of recording and commenting on it as it happens.”
More thanks from Greece, and I am looking forward to Jane’s return to the scene in Washington. It is great to see that she has been back to posting over the last day or so.
The Law is the Daddy, and from your narrative, it seems like Fitz and Walton are consciously on the same side, and Wells knows he’s stretching a weak hand.
My own hope for the proceeding is that enroute to proving the prosecution’s case, we find out that the administration knowingly took the country to war on a lie, and the attack on the Wilsons was motivated by their determination to protect the knowing as much as the lie itself.
Maybe Tommy Yum, if he’s hanging about, can compose and FDL theme song based on the Flintstones song?
Anyone hear anything updated about Esten?
History, yes. People have been promoting their favorites to play Fitz, but when Jane produces the movie, who will play the various FDL roles?
I also want to say a big Thank You to the FDL team for covering this most important trial and explaining in clear terms what is actually happening with no spin.
OT Further adventures in reading the New York Times.
In an article entitled Saudi Officials Seek to Temper the Price of Oil by Jad Mouawad, the case is laid out that:
All the usual arguments for this are trotted out. The Saudis want a stable price. They want a price that will not cause the world economy to wean itself off oil. They wish to protect their investments (OK, I may have added that one). Low prices weaken the Iranians.
Even Cheney’s November 2006 trip to Saudi Arabia is thrown in. This is the one where the Saudis summoned Cheney because of their displeasure over Iraq and Bush backing of the Shia government over the Sunnis. The author doesn’t give the background and admits he doesn’t know whether oil was discussed. Given how pissed the Saudis were at the time, I doubt a pro-American oil policy was what was topmost on the agenda.
My real beef though is that Mouawad never explains why Saudia Arabia backed OPEC production cuts last fall (favoring higher prices) when the price of crude was ~$60 per barrel. Now $50 per barrel is OK. What changed?
Mouawad also observes that speculation in commodities markets, weather and political turmoil are major determiners of price but that “consumer pressures ultimately hold sway.” What is absent from these remarks is production. Currently, the amount of oil in the markets is good and the flow appears stable. It is this which is keeping prices down. And yes, if there is a war somewhere, the US economy heats up, or if the weather gets too cold or too hot, this could change, but for now this is where we are.
The most likely explanation for the Saudis’ actions is that they can see where the market is, realize that they can live with it, and have decided to proclaim that this was their intension all along (even if it wasn’t).
Parenthetically, the article quotes Amy Myers Jaffe and identifies her as “the associate director of Rice University’s energy program.” Rice University is the home of the James A. Baker III Institute for Public Policy, and Myers Jaffe runs its energy unit. She was also a member of the Economy and Reconstruction working group of the Iraq Study Group. I have no problem with her being quoted. She is an expert, but one with close ties to James Baker. In a discussion on oil policies and prices, that is a connection worth noting.
If Walton wins the Daddy role, it won’t hurt that Fitz is a natural as a older brother.
bg @ 17
My experience is that it is always unfortunate to cast one’s or one’s friends’ roles in history before or while such history happens. That is a significant part of why this trial is happening and is being covered so well here.
One thing at a time, please…..
Pach – this is an awesome piece! Thank you … it’s so great to get the feel of the courtroom along with the legal maneuvers – and you put us all right there!
Siun @
11
Help! i get this error message:
Siun @ 22
Especially the comparisons between Walton and Wells.
Pach -
Another great piece, thank you and enjoy the coming week!
Kathryn in MA – it works for me but I’m on IE … one sec,I’ll find the other link
Try this one: http://1480kphx.com/
Siun @
27
so far so good…then click on what?
Kathryn in MA @ 28
Try Listen Live in the menu on the right.
Hugh @ 19
They may also want to indemnify themselves against appearance of collusion with the Bushies, especially since Bush wants to more than double the size of the strategic reserves. That will take oil off the market (about 800 million barrels’ worth), thus putting upward pressure on price. Not much pressure, given the proposed rate of increase, but perhaps enough to get the market and the hedge funds speculating again. That speculation was one of the major reasons for the price increases last year.
How this affects profits depends a lot on who’s got what contracts with the producers (because the speculation affects almost singularly the spot prices), but those aren’t often known because of confidentiality agreements.
Someone’s going to be making a bundle on this move–no wonder Cheney was smiling at the mention of this in the SOTU.
Siun @
27
works!
ember @
20
or, certainly, as the favored son…
Listening to Jane and Marcie on AAR! Go, Ladies!
FWIW, another MacOSX user who tried 1480kphx.com, there’s a listen live link, but it still puts up streams that look very PC-centric, so no joy up in Boston-land. Anyone able to listen on OSX, and if so with what, please?
(((Jane)))
i hear something … scooping the mainstream media – displaced by bloggs CHS and MTwheeler!
firedoglake markos came to gether to release MTW’sbook
jane hamsher she sounds fantastic
marcy on
Yup! Marcy & Jane!!! Go Girls!!!
you got it Kathryn!
S.O.S. from MA @
34
yup, pick the “other one” on the first open window and then pick the one that is not windows media and it will play thru itunes
S.O.S. from MA @
34
I’m OSX 10.4.8 and did the same as #29 above…
fascinating publishing experiment loves the book they are covering the libby trial
taking calls
S.O.S. from MA @ 34
I use Firefox and WMP for the stream.
OT but please go listen to this:
http:/www.electricpolitics.com and listen to interview with Bruce Fein
Very scary. What to do?
click the 1480 link, then choose the nova-something in the popup window… then pick the NON wma link
for os 10.4
S.O.S. from MA @ 34
When you click Listen Live, a window should open that has a link on the bottom for the VLC player for Macs. I’ve used VLC on Linux (Ubuntu), but not on a Mac, and it works pretty well on Linux.
blogosphere can publish quickly in time for trial unlike a traditional publishing houses arent set up to do
great writers great researchers can promote it quickly get it to #1 on amazon – Keith O’s book GlennGreenwald’s book.
Jane!!! Do internet television!!! Please!!!
[listening to the stream now]
edit: there, found the link I was looking for…”YouTube wants to pay you” — here’s the business model!!! FireDogLakeTV!!
can have an effect on the market outside of the blog why not wiht our own writer. look for talent within the blogosphere and outside. new projects? sticking to books at this time
YIKES!
Welcome, Phoenix people…
Trial lawyers usually make a concerted effort not to try to compete before the jury with the judge for the role of “daddy”. In fact, that almost always backfires. The real competition is always with the opposing lawyer, because the jury will — usually very early in the process — pick one lead lawyer as the trusted guide or story teller to lead them or explain to them the narrative of the case.
Neither side’s lawyer wants to be the “judge of the law” and so wisely they leave that venue entirely to the judge. Instead, they want to be the trusted explainer of the facts to the “judges of the facts”, the jury. The most compelling psychological force at work in a jury is the desire to right a wrong — that is different than the desire to do justice. So, each side attempts to shape the narrative of the trial’s facts in a way that simultaneously tells the story of the wrong and shows the jury the way to right that wrong.
The most effective means of accomplishing this, and all experienced trial lawyers know this, is to tell a story that leads the jury to conclude for themselves what they must do. It is always a mistake for a lawyer to tell the jury that they must do this or that. You want to cause the jury, by the shape of your story, to ask itself your questions, not the other side’s questions. To make that happen, a trial lawyer must frame the facts and present the evidence in a manner that makes his/her story the most trusted story or narrative. Probably more effort goes into this part of pre-trial preparation than another abstract aspect of preparation.
Jane’s background on FDL mentioned Natural Born Killers (got cheers) started FDL 2 yrs ago to keep media responsible.
Breaktime – Jane did great! Marcy coming up.
I guess from here on out, no one new to fdl will be misunderestimating you, Pach. A very informed and ejoyable read.
It’s interesting to think of the dynamic in terms of who claims the trusted father role, but also to think of the dymnamics of the triad as a whole. I think you paint a picture of a situation that works against Wells on two accounts.
One relates to the contrast between having two of the three in the triad being African American. From the nuanced details you describe, it appears that Walton’s personal characteristics, as well as the fact that he is the judge, tend to offset if not expose the contrived aspects of Wells presentation that otherwise might be more distinct and compelling.
The other aspect relates to my sense that as it relates to the perception of observers, consciously or not, Walton and Fitzgerald form a more congruent pair than Walton and Wells. This is perhaps an overstatement and a reach, but I have the sense that people tend to align with who they perceive represents the majority. I think the meaning of align in this context is subject to more clarification, but having a judge as one of the two is a favorable association.
I think both of those points compound to isolate the impact of Wells’ arguments.
And then there’s the evidence.
.
Jane sounds great – super good points being made by Cynthia about the role of the media and Jane’s discussion of reaching out beyond the blogs with all the good writing and research to people who are not online all the time.
CynthiaBlack-jeff cohen baghdad confidential – not only administration to took us to war but also the media
Jane- exactly that is whatthis book is about.
break for ads
OldCoastie @ 39
Tnx!! iTunes on, commercials for NovaM Founders Club. Advertising a similar deal to AAR Premium… Anyhow thanks!!! :)
Thanks. What were the rules given to jurors about what they could and could not do while off?
Christy gets mentioned, famous in Phoenix now!
Well put.
Your comment also recalls to my mind Wells’ last statement of his opening, which, paraphrased, went something like, “The only way I lose this case is if you don’t follow the evidence according to what the judge says.” He was contrasting this course of action, if I recall aright, with a course of action whereby jurors punished Libby because of any negative feelings about Iraq.
This drew an objection from Fitz away from the jury, and a generic admonition to the jury from the judge that arguments by attorneys are not evidence.
Wells did not follow your advice here, which tends to fit with my impression of him as a tad reckless.
Cynthia says book a breakthrough book – available info, dogged citizen investigation – how received?
Jane – little intrest but christy and jane got passes to trial giving lie to meme that bloggers fact free. marcy’s live blogging, Christy’s legal experience…
introducing march and TNH business consultant – what can be more American? civic minded taught
kind of column that arose out of Napoleonic censorship – made her interested in alternate publishing such as the blogs
kathryn in MA and others–thanks for info-can’t get broadcast… but thankful for your comments!!!
S.O.S. from MA @
34
Hi S.O.S from MA
I’m using a program called Flip4Mac to listen to the stream. if you do a google searchon it this page comes up- http://www.flip4mac.com/ It lets you listen to windows media player streams
I remember that fight between meteorblades and emptywheel. Thanks for reminding us, Marcy. You were right – Judith Miller is NOT a journalist.
Cynthia – recognized propaganda in hte media?
Marcy – dispute with Meteor Blades over Judy Millers incarceration and Gov input into the media. Gov is clearly attacking journalists – trial showing that Cheney comfortable getting word out on MTP
ralps @ 64
Ya, tnx, I have flip4mac, but it didn’t kick in as it usually does with WMA stuff. Anyhow, iTunes is doing a fine job for me…
Ed*ard Teller @ 65
How was that ever even in dispute???
Cynthia – remembering build-up to the invasion and feeling that something was wrong but Cheney obscuring – this book untangles all that.
Marcy – same with Plame, WMD
cynthia – mentioning digby – echelons of bloggers marcy and fdl the tiffeney of blogs. Cynthia reading digby’s book review with Amb. Wilson’s comment
Cynthia is doing a great job on discussing the book and how great the info in the book. She is pretty hyped on the book.
Eli @ 68 — I wasn’t listening to that fight, but I’d bet that meteorblades was either a credulous liberal or a neocon…
Cynthia Black mentioning Jane’s and Markos’ publishing house – name? Baster? what does it mean?
S.O.S. from MA @ 71
He’s a Kos frontpager, so the former would be a lot more likely than the latter.
I missed that dispute, so he may have just been making an absolute case for journalistic privilege, which I think was badly misinvoked in this instance.
Meteroblades is an oustanding liberl writer and thinker. His reputation online is stellar. This was an honest debate/disagreement. He’s also an occasional commenter around here, though his home is dkos and perhaps The Next Hurrah, if I recal correctly.
PS – i never did streaming before – i got it to work by also clicking on it
Tunes and clicking I Accept on whatever legal speak
“Vaster” books, for our budding, “vaster” left wing conspiracy.
OT – CNN breaking news. 250-300 insurgents killed in massive fighting near Najaf.
Sitting here in shock at the fact CNN is actually covering this in semi real time.
(Armando “I co-founded the Civility Society with Tacitus so now he’ll be nice to me” would probably also fall into the “credulous liberal” category…)
Pachacutec @ 76
Vaster pussycat, kill kill.
Eli @
68
Well, as Scott Ritter points out in the current edition of “The Nation,” the exact same machinery Marcy wrote her book about is being trotted out on Iran right now:
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20070205/ritter
And our next wave of Judy Millers and Scooter Libbys are being shepherded into their new jobs of propagandizing us once again, exactly as Marcy and many others have chronicled re Iraq. And all but an isolated few of the Dem leadership are going along with it. So far.
Read Ritter’s article, which is currently the most viewed and e-mailed item at their website.
I hope the ladies bring up IRAN!
Pachacutec @
76
Excellent!!
I am in heaven girls on the radio Pach on the page all at the same time
Eli@73 — tnx for info. I, for one of many, found all that posturing “I yam a Journalist, so I must protect my source” way overdone. I’ll have to read dKos more :)
Armado’s judgment with Tacitus was incredibly flawed, in my view, but his choice, however much it mystified me, was based on his good faith conviction, from all I can gather.
Sigh.
Lindy @ 33
it works in dresden, too!
pret-ty amazing.
this ol’ luddite is just not believin’ it.
Ed*ard Teller @ 80
Even with a neverending supply of willing media whores, I just don’t see how starting another dubious war is going to be to the Republicans’ advantage.
Drumming up a war with Iran might have worked if there had been no disastrous Iraq invasion, but invading Iran is like Surge X 100, and will be about as popular.
Pachacutec @ 74
I agree, but, if I remember right, he was concerned about what ended up being non issues, whereas Marcy believed the veracity of accounts of Miller’s overall context as a person which meteorblades seemed to feel weren’t germaine.
BTW Eli, it’s good to have you hanging about again.
Pach, I have been waiting for your post & you did not disappoint. But tell me, are Fitz’s eyes as soulful in person as they are in his pics?
S.O.S. from MA @ 83
Speaking very broadly, my personal opinion is that “protecting your source” is meant to shield whistleblowers, not dirty tricksters.
Pachacutec @ 84
I just don’t understand how anyone could have a “good faith conviction” about a snake like Tacitus. I *think* there *are* some genuinely civil and principled bloggers on the right, but Tac is not one of them.
Oy. I just realized that I, too, will be only about 15% efficient tomorrow after I start reading FDL. Not that I’m complaining!
Go, FDL women!!!
OT — Newsweek has its cover story on the website: Black Hawk Down. With pictures of the 12 KIA. Note the cutline. So many of the photo captions credit National Guard.
Bush has got the US in a terrible situation. The Guard who should be protecting us here at home are bogged down with regular military in Iraq.
The choices are terrible: they’ll slaughter each other with us in the middle…or they’ll slaughter each other.
George W. Bush. Worst world ruler ever.
Marcy – saying now they are covering the trial in the Prettyman CH and Jane will be here to watch Cheney sweat. (cb laughs) marcy didn’t mean it to be a running commentary but can’t help herself. people aren’t paying alot of attention in gov. (maybe if they had been attention before….)
Jane – Marcy blogging from vast store of knowledge gives bolding, comments
Cynthia saving the count
“Sergent” also citizen jouralist getting the voice of katrina out. “unreportednews.net” says the ladies are good people
Eli @ #86,
It wouldn’t help either party, but unlike Iraq, most of the onus of what will inevitably be the most colossal failure in the history of American foreign policy – eclipsing even Iraq – would fall on the Democrats currently “exercising” control of one of our branches of government. And rightly so.
Pachacutec @ 88
Thanks! I’ve been busy/distracted working on moving my blog to WordPress, and now I’m doing a bunch of archive cleanup.
Um, this is maybe not the best timing, but if you or someone has the keys to the blogroll, could you update the Multi Medium URL to http://multi-medium.net? Thank you kindly.
Pachacutec @ 88
I was just thinking that. I missed Eli and Punaise batting the ball back and forth.
chady: I’d say “penetrating” eyes, more than “soulful.”
Eli: Exactly. That’s why I was so mystified. He’s so hard headed with his convictions, in ways I have often admired, that I could not fathom this particular incidence of blindness, but there you have it.
i heard a little rumor that there’s a party here this afternoon teeheehee
Ed*ard Teller @ 94
If the Democrats are stupid and insane enough to get stampeded into this again, we need to primary the living shit out of them.
Also, there was a lot more political risk in opposing the Iraq invasion than there would be in opposing an Iran one. For one thing, there’s zero public appetite for it, and for another, the Democrats control Congress, so a new AUMF can’t pass unless they allow it (well, okay, there’s Joe – but they could still filibuster), so there’s less risk of them winding up with egg on their face in the event of a glorious success. And, of course, the history with Iraq demonstrates that the chances of them being egg-faced by a glorious success are really vanishingly small.
question re the bureauocracy of publishing – Jane – considerable but they aren’t challenging that
question to Marcy re timeline on her book – started as comment to Jane at YKos – Sept and Oct 3or4 months ago editor helped with outline flew to bangkok then came back and started writing furiously while Jane and Marcos started up publishing house
Jane – speaks to turnaaround time tho don’t want to do that intensely again
Cynthia – book packed = really good food as opposed to chinese
Eli: we’ve been planning a thorough overhaul of our blogroll but haven’t gotten to it yet. We were a bit delayed by recent events, but I hope we’ll get to it soon.
The overhaul comes because some stuff is dated and it’s gotten a little dusty.
Thanks, ember! It’s good to be back. I probably won’t be around a whole lot until everything’s in order at my new home – my cleanup goals are rather… ambitious.
question re trial whether trial more than Libby ie cheney rove dumbsfeld. gives a call out to Nina Toteberg before break
Pachacutec @ 101
Ah, like the twin Oliver Willises.
Are you going to synchronize with Atrios’ “Blogroll Amnesty”?
We were talking about it before he announced that. Heh. It made me laugh.
What’s the date again?
Pachacutec @ 105
Feb. 3, IIRC. Somehow I think everyone will still be too distracted with LIBBY MADNESS.
hey the radio show sounds good. the media argument was well-made.
(On the other hand, if everyone pares their blogrolls down to just blogs that they read, that’s probably bad for me…)
Has anyone else seen the defense exhibits here from AP?
I found this one of particular interest to the assertion that the VP had seen the report re: Wilson’s trip to Niger.
Does this verify that the VP’s was aware of the result of Wilson’s reported trip?
Pach! Jane! Marcy!
This is absolutely wild. Dashing thru your post, Pach, then trying to keep up with comments while listening to Jane & Marcy live, and waiting for the next dash our local Cooper’s Hawk makes, trying to snag a meal at our bird feeders just outside the window. AAAaaaaarrrrrggghh!
Lovin’ every minute! & my sweet guy, instead of asserting his right to complain at my hogging the toobz, hands me a nice hot cuppa mocha latte. Now, if the hungry hawk could just catch up with an unwary starling, he could share in our feast, and we’d all be happy (minus scooterstarling a-course)…
Gotta make sure the popcorn’s lined up for tomorrah.
Jane, Marcy, you sound fantastic!
eli @ #99,
If the Democrats are stupid and insane enough to get stampeded into this again, we need to primary the living shit out of them.
I respect your comments today as always, but I’m not sure a lot of people, even here, yet realize how near and inevitable we all are to this. It is going to be deja vu all over again, glowingly so.
Hugh @
19
We won’t get to it by that date, I’m sure.
250 Iraqis killed in Najaf during Ashura which commemorates the teaching:
The tragedy of Karbala taught humanity a lesson that standing for the truth and fighting unto death for it is more honorable and valuable than submitting to the wrongful, especially when the survival of Islam is at stake.
Earlier reports:
Ashura/Najaf
The text below is the English report here it is close to the Arabic text. Western reports are getting the nature of the group completely wrong. They are a breakaway and very violent Shia cult saying they are Sunni is an extremely stupid mistake it is the sort of extremely stupid mistake that western journalists incapable of reading writing or speaking Arabic routinely make. Those stupidly mistaken western reports then filter back to Iraq and sectarianism is further inflamed. Iraqis are being killed becase of stupid American and British not fact checking with Iraqis. The idea of a Sunni extremist group living in that part of the country is completely stupid and only somebody with zero knowledge would wriite it.
Saba
Najaf-Clashes-Update 1
Six gunmen arrested, 17 soldiers wounded in Najaf clashes
By Haider al-Kaabi
(Adds casualties, changes datelines)
Najaf, Jan 28, (VOI)- Najaf governorate media spokesman said six gunmen were arrested during on-going clashes between security forces and an armed group in Najaf while a medical source said 17 soldiers were wounded during the operation.
Najaf-Clashes-Update 1
Six gunmen arrested, 17 soldiers wounded in Najaf clashes
By Haider al-Kaabi
(Adds casualties, changes datelines)
Najaf, Jan 28, (VOI)- Najaf governorate media spokesman said six gunmen were arrested during on-going clashes between security forces and an armed group in Najaf while a medical source said 17 soldiers were wounded during the operation.
“Iraqi security forces arrested six gunmen during an operation that started today at dawn and targeted the stronghold of an armed group called “Supporters of Ahmed al-Hassan” in al-Zarga area just outside Najaf,” Ahmed Deiabil, Najaf governorate media spokesman, told the independent news agency Voices of Iraq (VOI).
The spokesman said “Iraqi security forces clashed on Sunday at dawn with followers of an armed group called “Supporters of Ahmed al-Hassan” just outside Najaf.”
The fierce clashes erupted, the spokesman pointed out, when the security forces raided al-Zarga area to arrest Ahmed al-Hassan.
“The area is now under siege by the Iraqi forces backed by U.S. troops,” Deiabil added.
Earlier, a security said Iraqi security forces clashed on Sunday at dawn with followers of an armed group called “Supporters of Ahmed al-Hassan” in the Shiite sacred city of Najaf.
The security source added “the assault was to arrest the group leader Ahmed al-Hassan but the strong resistance led the Iraqi forces to ask for support from the U.S. troops.”
According to the agreement that transferred the security responsibility to the Iraqi army in Najaf on December 25, the Iraqi security forces may ask for support from the U.S. forces.
He added “the U.S. forces immediately took part in the offensive while U.S. choppers and warplanes bombed the resistance pockets in the area.”
“The clashes left casualties from the two sides (the forces and the followers),” said the source but declined to give a specific figure.
“Ahmed al-Hassan Supporters” is an extremist Shiite armed group that sought leadership over other Shiite groups after its leader claimed to be a deputy of the Shiite twelfth Imam, the Awaited Mahdi.
Al-Zarga area, the stronghold of Ahmed al-Hassan Supporters, is a rural area that is located outside the Shiite sacred city of Najaf.
Only last week, Iraqi security forces launched a wide-scale campaign to stem this extremist group.
Najaf is 168 km in southwest of Baghdad.
A medical source told VOI “the clashes left so far 17 wounded, all of them Iraqi soldiers, who were hospitalized for treatment in Najaf.”
The casualties among the armed group fighters were still unknown, the medical source added.
GorillasGuides is updating from Iraqi sources:
http://gorillasguides.com/2007…..mment-2254
awesome job by Marcy and Jane!
and welcome aboard listeners to Cynthia’s show!
Last comment – mentions how Libby et al spent hours on the cover-up and Tom Cruise and not the national security – that’s the scandal.
our ladies off the air but next person up talking up YKOs saying Cynthia would be great reporting from YKos2 – she would consider it if opportunity arises.
Ed*ard Teller @ 111
I don’t have a whole lot of faith in the Democrats’, shall we say, substandard spinal history, but it is still very difficult for me to imagine how they could go along with this, even at their most craven.
They *have* to know that Iran would be an even bigger clusterfuck than Iraq now that BushCo. has amply demonstrated their complete lack of martial competence, and that it would have far less popular support.
Opposing Iran is a political freebie if ever there was one.
Kathryn in MA – Thanks for the comments on the radio program. I was glad to follow along via your efforts.
kathryn in MA – Thank you so much!!
MARCY! JANE! VALERIE! and kudos Air America!
Except the Clinton machine still dominates the national party money machine, and Hillary is running as Margaret Thatcher. So we have to put people power back in effect in the lead up to 2008.
njr @ 112
The Saudis aren’t philanthropists.
Pachacutec @
121
I need some fresh air and exercise….
i’m happy to serve – PS can we all meet up at YKos2? i may take a train out of Boston – any others from MA? i know RevDeb has her reservation.
Pachacutec @ 121
In 2002, half the Dems voted for invasion because they were afraid not to. We have to make sure that in 2007-08 they’re afraid to vote *against* it.
I’d like to think that once the pollsters start actually gauging public support for an invasion of Iran, that the Democrats will come to their senses, but they have already shown themselves willing to buck public opinion to go along with the Republicans. But there are just so many layers of stupid to doing that now.
bellesouth @ 109
That does look important. I wonder why it wasn’t higlighted when the witness was on the stand? Maybe because its worded to say a memo was given but doesn’t specifically say Wilson’s trip was in the memo?
Eli and ET – re:Dems on Iran…Edwards made a pretty bellicose statement on Iran while in Israel last week at a conference…
never underestimate the D’s ability to cave in to the “gotta be strong” meme
Siun @ 127
That’s the irany – I blogged it probably a year ago, that the Democrats always look their weakest when they’re trying to look strong.
choochmac @ 126
I believe it wasn’t mentioned during the trial because it is not relevant to the issue of whether Libby lied and obstructed justice. But I do believe this is the kind of stuff we’ve been waiting to find out about.
is a plan in place to have a follow up Plame session at Dkos2?
I think the Murtha experience has shown us that, when the myth of the 60’s McGovern campaign collides on matters of war with the polls, then it takes polls plus nasty, brutal, people powered pressure to get the right results.
It took the Lamont campaign and lots of brutal bashing of Dems like Schumer and Emanuel to get the party to talk about Iraq before the elections, and we had to fight for every inch.
The same DC/K Street party still holds power, so we’ll have to fight again.
The sponsors of Cynthia Black’s show Action Point pay for her hour on the Nova M network every Sunday. DFA-MC is one of the sponsors. Cynthia is one of our members and has some really GREAT segments on voter integrity.
If you want to help keep Cynthia on the air, please donate to DFA-MC at http://www.dfamc-org. The sponsorship of Action Point is the groups LARGEST expenditure.
katymine @ 132
She was a great host. That was the first time I have heard her. I try and tune in to the station when I am in Phoenix but don’t get there on a regular basis.
AZ Matt… I stream it via the internet when I am on the road. They have some really good weekend local hosts such as Jeff Farias Truth to Power Hour on Saturdays, About Face and Action Point.
bellesouth –
I think your discovery got EPU’d. You should repost on the next Plame thread when EW is around. She would know for sure if it’s the smoking gun.
FYI, did you know that Marvel Comics has a super hero named Shamrock Fitzgerald?
ack – train from Boston Chicago takes all freakin day! and a plane 2 1/2 hours. well, there goes my carbon footprint
choochmac @ 135
Thanks! I think I have definitely gotten EPU’d Big Time! Horrors!
Here’s another possible smoking gun:
It is all there in the defense exhibits from the first day of trial! Have we seen the real thing before. And then there’s Craig Schmall’s saying that research shows that Cheney and Rummy were made aware of Wilson’s trip.
Here we go again:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01…..r=homepage
This is from Craig Schmall’s e-mail about his FBI interview. I am now just realizing that not only was there early 2002 and 2003 memos done for Cheney and Rumsfeld regardign Wilson’s trip but Craig faxed these memos to Libby in June 2003.
Thank you for writing such an interesting and informative report.
Hey I have question. Has anyone looked into the date where the VP office was filling in the conservative commentators to see if it matches the Secret Service records released for Jeff Gannon? I’ve been meaning to look into it but have been busy. I don’t know what the real point would be, but it would be another interesting aside.
bellesouth @ 140
But Cheney didn’t know anything about Wilson’s trip. He said so on MTP ;)
Pachacutec @ 97
I’d say twinkling eyes. There is always a little light of humor in them.
looseheadprop @
144
Heh. Not when he’s pissed off.
It seems to me that the choice of Wells to go after the passionate and wronged persona is a miscalculation. If the charges came about because Libby and the Administration as a whole had a passion to justify their past actions, if the charges came about because Libby and the administration were vain and arrogant and felt that they could manipulate the story and the media because of their positions of authority, if the charges came about because Libby and the Administration had the massive ego to believe that anything they did was justified because of the positions they held
then
going big in the passion and outrage drama will only underline these sins that brought about this trial.
I think a little more humility and control by the person who “speaks for Libby” would work better to convince us all that Libby and the Administration were in control of themselves and their own egos and were acting with seriousness and consideration for the common good.
as it is, the massive ego and drama of the advocate seems to reflect the massive ego and drama of the defendant…and that’s not going to work.
is Libby a humble public servant or is he not?
if he is, then his advocate should reflect this in his personna.
kin — You’re right, if Libby hired Wells as his attorney.
I suspect the real client is Libby’s Defense Team, which may include the Veep in spite of his comments that lead us to believe that he has not donated money to the fund. The Defense Team merely looks like it works for Libby; in truth, it works for the RNC and the Cheney Cabal. Comstock should have been the hint there.
And Wells is putting on a show, the drama and the string of bright shiny objects intended to keep us from seeing what they are really doing — in this case, they are trying to suss out what it is that Fitz has on them all, Libby being used as bait.
Wells speaks for Libby; Libby spoke for Cheney. A puppet manipulated by puppet…
Rayne @ 147
I haven’t heard whether Lynn Cheney has donated to the defense fund, so who knows?
Oh choochmac, you have The Knack…you can think like a Republican!!
Doesn’t it hurt? ;-0
And the daughters Cheney, too; we like them, says Wolfie. Bet Elizabeth could pony some out of the money we’ve paid her as a government employee, don’t you think?
Sorry, but there really isn’t that much to guess about.
1. Walton is the “Daddy,” using your term, and the judge is federal court is always the Daddy. I’m curuious where this take on criminal trials comes from, cause I’ve never heard anyone explain the dynamics of a criminal trial that way. And if you think any experienced proseuctor or defense attorney is going to try to take “daddy” status away from the judge, well, IMO you’re plain wrong.*
I won’t even agree that between Fitz and Wells that there is a competition to be the “daddy.” As to who in a criminal trial has the harder of job of making their case to the jury – it is always the defense, cause the first thought in the jurors mind is that the person wouldn’t be there if someone didn’t think they did it. That is a very serious disadvantage to be starting from.
2. Appeals. And what are the courtroom prognosticators basing their “reasonably safe grounds” opinions on? He is on “safe ground,” not “reasonably safe ground.”
3. Good defense lawyers don’t give a shit about public perception, they care about putting forth the best defense possible. Prosecutors occupy a political office, so they might care about public perception (and they have more stringent rules to follow in how they relate to the public), but, given Fitz’ lack of public communication, it would seem that the evidence is that he cares about prosecuting the case to the best of his ability without regard for public perception.
4. Trials really aren’t all that complex – the underlying subject matter might be complex, for instance in a tax or securities fraud case, but the trial itself isn’t. You make it sound like something that needs to be demsytefied when anyone who has watched a TV trial show nows the basic rudiments of what will happen here (not that its good law, but the concepts of what the prosecution and defense do, and the flow of the case sorta works).
I’ve written that I thinkt he CM does a shitty job of covering trials b/c they make it seem like an edge of the seat drama with disaster waiting upon every ruling of the judge. They’re not, and I don’t know why you would buy into that theme.
________________________________________
* For all you who watched Judge Ito’s performance in the Simpson trial, consider it an aberration – that is not how real judges act, at least in federal court.
Rayne @ 149
Well what’s the point of being head of an nepotisic (if that is even a word) adminstration if you can’t directly enjoy the benefits?
I don’t suppose there’s a plan for saner heads to take over if the insane heads use one of their shiney objects to get us into Iran and out of the courtroom.
A call for Nancy Pelosi on the red phone.
I have to remember that good old Ashcroft was the firewall for Republican crime and punishment before Fitz took over and things got out of hand.
TheOtherWA @
42
I used Safari to launch WMP.
Rayne @
147
Libby is being used s bait! Hah!
James Moore refered to Fitz as an “Irish Alligator”.
So Cheney and the rest of the cabal are trying to study how this alligator attacks.
They are finding out – directly and with total success.
How must it feel to be Libby?
How must it feel to be Cheney?
Who will flip?
this is one of my favorite parts of a trial. i have been transcribing superior court trials (mostly criminal) in massachusetts for over twenty years, and a good judge will give you goosebumps. if this judge sounds good now, wait till we get to the charge on the law — the “boilerplate” can be awe-inspiring, particularly the Webster charge, if it’s used in DC, which defines reasonable doubt.
go justice go!
I’m not sure if it has been noted in the comments already, but Judge Walton also presided over the Sibel Edmonds case.
with over 20 years experience transcribing massachusetts superior court criminal trials, i cannot tell you how many times (let’s leave it at “way too many”) i’ve seen defense attorneys engage in this type of behavior. in almost every instance it was a case where the case against the defendant was ironclad. it is my impression that this tack is taken not for the current trial but for the appellate record.
i don’t know about the courthouse this is taking place in but in massachusetts courthouses it is clearly posted that “no aspect of the law or any matter may be discussed in elevators or other public places” (jurors may be present and overhear). as much as we all appreciate your words of encouragement to fitz, it is best to restrain oneself in a court of law, even if you’re still out in a public area. god help us if they have to declare a mistrial and start over again!
John Forde (156) — the really stupid part is that Fitzgerald is an open book, with so many big cases under his belt. They should already know very well how he works. And you know they have him and his team bugged and wired every way to Sunday; if they’d do it to Quakers, why not Fitz?
Cripes, that’s one thing they learned to do better than Nixon. No more f*cking tape recorders.
I suspect part of what’s going on isn’t just fishing with Libby-bait on the hook, but fishing for time. Time enough to get affairs in order, whatever those are.
edit: karen marie (160) — forgot to add thanks much for that insight. From your lips to the ears of the cosmos…
Kathryn in MA @ 137
thanks to al gore, you can calulate the impact and purchase an offset – here….
it’s not very expensive….
karen marie @
160
Oh, don’t worry. I’m quite circumspect in this regard. I wouldn’t have tried to discuss anything of substance no matter what the context or setting.
karen marie @
159
Interesting. That fits with Marcy’s observation of a bit of a slip wherein Wells spaoke as if he expects an appeal, implicitly conceding an eventual conviction.
Of course, all good attorneys lace the record with any number of appellate opportunities, including some without real merit just to cover all their bases, but I had not considered that his dramatics might not be intended for the jury, and not intended for the gallery/media, but intended rather for the record, for the sake of appeal.
Does that kind of scenery chewing really make it onto the transcripted page, somehow?
Pach – The histrionics aren’t for the appeal, but much of what is taking place (particularly all the objections and sidebars) are for an appeal. If you don’t object, then you can’t appeal the issue, which is why defense attorneys (and prosecutors, though to a lesser extent), always seem to be objecting.
Pachacutec @ 12
Ole Fred (”Scooter”) Libbeystone gets outsmarted by his dog (”Dick”) again and gets locked out of the (white) house!
Libby starts out with a huge disadvantage- He works for Dick Cheney. Fitzgerald ought to drop the name ‘Cheney’ as often as possible in this trial, because the VP is perhaps the most universally disliked person in government. Even the wingnuts don’t seem to have anything nice to say about him. If I were in Judge Walton’s shoes I would declare Libby guilty, for no other reason than he is Cheney’s Chief of Staff.
I don’t think Wells is using Libby as bait. He wants to find out what he can about Fitz’s case in order to defend Libby.
The shiny object phenomenon is an element of almost every criminal defense. The defendants, even the innocent ones, rarely have a straight linear story to tell — if they did, they probably wouldn’t have been indicted. Being indicted doesn’t mean you’re guilty, but it almost always means your story has a lot of holes.
As for Wells, I cannot overemphasize this: the name of the game is “reasonable doubt.” He doesn’t have to prove Libby innocent, he simply has to get the jurors to have doubts that have some basis in fact about whether or not he is guilty. A defendant can be acquitted even if the weight of the evidence is against him: witness, O.J. Simpson.
How much doubt do you need to sow for it to be “reasonble”? Age old question. Under the law, it’s not enough to create some implausible scenario under which Libby “might” be innocent. There has to be some evidence supporting innocence, even if the weight of the evidence supports guilt. Given the non-linear stories most defendants have to tell, getting 12 jurors to find reasonable doubt is hard. But even one juror who has doubts can hang a jury, and buy the defendant more time as the government decides whether to retry, plea bargain, or give up.
So Wells is going to try as many things as Walton allows him to in an effort to find the fact or facts that permit at least one juror to have enough doubts to refuse to convict.
litigatormom:
Hey, gurrl! How was the bus ride home?
Beneath all the trumped-up ‘reasons’ for going to war with Iran is the neo-con rational for maintaining a continuous state of war so the executive can sustain its claim on the powers of the executive in a time of war. Bush has said many times that the war on terrorism is a l.o..n…g….war. But in the event that the war on terrorism may not be seen as a war at all, or in the event bush is forced to withdraw from Iraq, it becomes necessary to have a hot war somewhere else, and Iran is the next candidate.
Pachacutec @ 169
It was okay. We actually got back to NYC a little ahead of schedule. Annoying to wake up and see that the NYT article on the march was on page 21, though!
What great writing! I’d love to observe this trial, but can’t. After having read your article, I almost feel like I was there. Thanks!
Isn’t the recent revelation that the White House felt it could “control” Russert interesting with respect to the fact that Libby claimed that he heard about Plame from Timmeh. Could it be he was counting on Russert to cover-up his perjury?
Pach speaks to his audience when he writes, not at them. He doesn’t talk up or talk down. His rythm is conversational. I don’t think he fits anywhere on the daddy scale except that he is clearly a perceptive and expressive man. Great post Pach.
Who’s Your Daddy?
From answers.com
Use of the phrase implies a boastful claim of physical or sexual dominance over the intended listener. Comedians suggest that the phrase is frequently spoken by men in a Freudian outburst during sexual intercourse.