
Evenin', fellow firedogs! Tonight I'm going to attempt to get us all up to speed about a situation that I suspect we're going to be hearing a lot about in the near future. This story was brought to my attention by ¡El Gato Negro!.
Where to begin? First we'll go to A. J. Kandy, who blogs at King Marketing:
ABC/Disney operates a US-wide network of radio stations and affiliates. One of these affiliates, San Francisco’s KSFO, is a die-hard right-wing talk shop whose rabidly eliminationist hosts have publicly endorsed (if not outright revelled in) torture and engaged in hate speech of all stripes. However, the station is sold to its advertisers as a “Disney” station, with all the connotations of family-friendliness that entails.
Self-described “fifth-tier blogger” Spocko decided to “out” KSFO to its national advertisers with a polite letter-writing campaign, and by exposing their hate speech on his blog with short audio clips and transcripts (which falls under the Fair Use statutes.)
This, of course, is what we call citizen action, and most of us know the drill by now. We write to advertisers and once in a blue moon, they write us back, pat us on the head and tell us that they'll take our suggestion under advisement, then go on their merry way without changing a thing. This was not the case, however, with Spocko. From a guest post at BlogIntegrity, Spocko himself can tell us what happened next:
In mid-December I got confirmation that a major national advertiser, VISA, pulled their ads from the Melanie Morgan and Lee Rogers show, based on listening to audio clips I provided them. I also think that FedEx, AT&T and Kaiser are considering pulling their ads. Visa isn’t the first advertiser who has left KSFO, multiple advertisers have left the station, especially from the Brian Sussman show. In July of this year when KSFO lost MasterCard as an advertiser someone from KSFO “outed” me on a counter-blog (which I won’t link to). This same person has also threatened me with local and federal criminal action for using the audio (which I clearly used under the fair use portion of copyright law). And because they have suggested violence toward me (in addition to talking about suing me "for everything I have”) I have chosen to remain anonymous.
As Thers has said,
Hooray, for Thers!! Oh, uh, ahem. Sorry. You were saying, Spocko?
95 percent of blog fights don’t mean anything, but I think this one does since KSFO is using the full weight and force of an ABC/Disney lawyer and copyright law against a private citizen blogger. I dared to use the audio content in question for nonprofit educational purposes (I don’t even have ads on my blog!), and thus under the protection of the Fair Use Doctrine set forth in Section 107 of the Copyright Act, 17 U.S.C.§107.
Now we go to Online Media Daily:
IN THE LATEST SKIRMISH BETWEEN big media and a blogger, The Walt Disney Company has succeeded in shutting down the Web site "Spocko's Brain."
On the site, blogger and media critic "Spocko" took issue with on-air comments made by right-wing talk show hosts at Bay Area ABC affiliate radio station KSFO. He posted audio files of hosts' comments on his Web site, and also began a letter-writing campaign that, he says, resulted in advertisers fleeing the station.
But Tuesday, Spocko's Internet service provider, 1&1 Internet, pulled the plug on the blog–a move prompted by a Dec. 22 cease-and-desist letter from ABC Radio claiming that material on Spocko's Brain violated Disney's copyright.
And that's where things stand right now. Many of us are now familiar with ABC/Disney's strong-arm fascism-in-mouse-ears tactics from the "Path to 9/11" debacle earlier this year. Here's what you can do to help our fellow blogger, Spocko: 1. The KSFO hate clips are all up at Online BlogIntegrity. Collect 'em all. Share with your friends. Spread them around. It's a veritable cornucopia of Right Wing Hate Speech. (Listen at your own risk.) 2. Go here and scroll down to "What Can You Do?" and follow the instructions. Spocko has provided us with a step-by-step plan to alert the blogging world, the MSM (if they'll listen), and KSFO's advertisers to the current situation.
I urge you all to get involved. This is an example of how we can effectively fight the tide of hateful bile that pollutes our airwaves and rots the brains of millions of overly credulous talk-radio listeners. We, of course, support the wingnuts' right to say whatever they want to say, but they must be prepared to face the real-world consequences of stoking the fires of ethnic, political, and religious hatred. If that means losing the support of their advertisers and cutting into their six-figure salaries, well, then, hurrah! We win.
Thank you and good night.
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Ahoy Zed!
Zed Zeppelin!
Evenin’, kids!
Whatup T, what’s shaking in the ATL?
See, that’s the old-school crap they can’t pull anymore. Do the lawyer-at-the-door cease-and-desist action or even take you to court and you are effectively silenced.
‘Cept it don’t work that way anymore. The audio or video or whatever is viraled around the Nets and the news is spread by huge green lizards and the Bad Guys get outed.
When I was in the communications business working for a multinational corporation, I was the guy who would stand in the internal meetings and with the big global telecoms and tell them that “the Internet has changed everything”. It was just buzz to them then. But it has changed everything. Here’s more proof.
FIFTH!
Ah, man, I spoiled Cat’s fifth. Sorry.
AirportCat @ 6
Guess not. But very glad to see this here on the front page … it was linked in the comments yesterday (can’t recall by whom, too lazy to go back looking).
Hi Mr. Rex, your work week over yet?
marksb @ 9
Indeed. I came home from work tonight, wolfed down some food, and fell headlong into bed with Juan Carlos and napped until 10:30, when I awoke with a jerk, going, “LATE NITE!! Oh, my GOD!!”
�Spocko Speaks!
Een the latest, Spocko says that hees blog, she ees going back up een around 24 hours.
He has a surprise een there as well, the Saga of Spocko, she ees about to get legs, no?
so.
..y tambien,
�Viva T-Rex!
Thanks for this TRex.
Much more coming. Soon, we’ll have a “Save Spocko” banner and brand. We expect to see these clips, along with the names of current advertisers and the whole sordid Disney tale, linked and/or hosted, at several hundred blogs by early next week.
Disney is gonna be forced to apologize to Spocko and either embrace or rebuke the hatred that their ABC radio stations spew…
TRex @ 9
Was the jerk named Rush?
This sounds like it’s right up Olbermann’s alley-oop, non? How to make sure he sees it?
In what way is blogging invading copyright? Are all blogs now going to be monitored for infringement?
marksb @ 7
Yeah, now it’s a diminished fifth.
Twisted Martini @ 4
Lordy, I wouldn’t know. Atlanta is an hour from here. I live in the only city in Georgia worth saving, Athens, or as I call it, the ATH.
Mike Stark @
12
Mike, thanks for your Dkos diary on this. It’s where some of us first heard of it.
I was gonna say the Confederacy, but didn’t want to start any fights. ATH works, go UGGA!
Mike Stark @ 12
OMG!! Mike STARK!!
I’m not worthy!
Thank you, Mike, for all you do. Dammit. I meant to include a link to your Kos diary in this piece.
Well, I am thinking that this isn’t the last we’ll hear of this story.
Mommybrain @ 15
Alright, let’s keep it chordial in here tonight, kids.
Also, Ripley from zencabin.com ees reportedly working on a JouTube video.
Eef joo want hees email just check the blog at Onlineintegrityblogspot.blogspot.com (een the post above) or email me at gatobloggerro@yahoo.com
I can also forward to joo the soundfiles and Spocko’s letter, which joo may spread around, and excerpt from, freely.
T-Rex Rox jour Mouse-Box
so.
TRex @ 17
I’ll never get used to that reaction. Ugh. (OK, shithead… yeah, I’m smiling)…
anyway – you are right on. This thing is brewing big. Ugh. This part I really hate. But shoot me an email at stark dot m at gmail. We’s gotsta get coordinated….
with all of the sharp legal minds we have at this blog it seems like Spocko could find some basis for a real lucrative law suit, or at least one that would turn up the fire under ABC Radio a bit higher. these people are criminals. period.
!El Gato Negro! @ 20
can you email me too – stark dot m at gmail? thx.
CBS just published the first polling results for the new year:– JAR’s at a whooping 30% (their poll’s record low) and Americans are optimistic about the new Congress
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories…..0862.shtml
Thanks for getting this out there, TRex. I’m hoping to have something for the YouTube tomorrow or Sunday. (If anyone has pics/vids/ideas – I’d appreciate anything you can offer. E-mail is ripley>zencabin.com)
And don’t forget that Melanie Morgan’s hubby is in KSFO management. From what I’ve read, she’s actually paid through another entity, to skirt Disney’s anti-nepotism policy. Qua!
fahrender @ 22
I’m not sure if I’m at liberty to say, but I can tell you cryptically that an incredibly well placed lawyer that leads this field has given us assurances that the fair use ground beneath our feet is as solid as granite… i wasn’t able to further inquire if that sets anyone that is actually sued by Disney up for a lucrative counter-claim…
This we could get KSFO to play the audio from this?
Evenin’, oh talented Mr. Ripley.
Goodness, quite a cavalcade of superstar guests tonight! I’m so glad I made enough fondue for everyone.
Can I get you a drink? Coffee?
Twisted Martini @
2
Zed L’Epaulette
Semper Fi Mike! Are you still doing work with the Young Turks? I love those guys, miss them since they left Sirius. I have a couple of Cenk’s rants that are fucking priceless!
TRex @ 20
Make that a fifth of cherry cordial, and I’ll diminish it quite a bit tonight. . .
In an ackbasswards way, this is a good thing. By taking the loud, heavy-handed approach, KSFO and Disney expose their hate-peddling to a wider audience and more attention; they make it harder to sweep their own conduct under the rug, and they look like thugs for manhandling Spocko this way as well. Really, Disney’s aggressive protection of its “intellectual” property is looking more and more like the way of the dinosaur (present company excluded).
Glad to hear that Spocko has not been permanently silenced in the process,too.
I’m sorry TRex, but Junya made me do it.
Junya herds cats
or
Junya’s Pocketful of Miracles
While chopping twigs at his
hogfarmranchette in Crawford, Junya took time out for a Iraq stratergy session with the former Secretary of State during the Nixon years.Junya: Howya doing there Hanky-boy? May ah call ya that?
Henry The K: Vell Mr. Preznit, I actually prefer…
Junya: Good, good! Park yer porkchops down on that stool right here next to mah desk.
Henry The K: Porkchops? I’ve never…Vell perhaps…ooof. Ahmmm…much obliged for the hand, Mr. Preznit.
Junya: Can ya see alright there Hanky-boy? Here, let me move mah crayon sharpner. There ya go.
Henry The K: Let me try to vind my glasses. They are somewhere here under your desk, Mr. Preznit.
Junya: That’s alright Hanky-boy. Ah can see ya just fine without ‘em. So, what do ya think ah should do?
Henry The K: Vell Mr. Preznit, ve can’t let the North Vietnamese vin…I mean, the terrorists vin in Iran…I mean, in Iraq. Ve vould then have Dominoes.
Junya: And we’re rootin’ for Pizza Hut! Ah got ya! Ahm with ya the whole way Hanky-boy!
Henry The K: No, no Mr. Preznit. Dominoes are like…ahmmm…Chinese checkers.
Junya: Ah could nevah figure out how to play checkers. Guess that’s why I like Pizza Hut.
Henry The K: No, no Mr. Preznit…ahmmm…other countries might fall. The next vun might be Laos…I mean, Saudi Arabia.
Junya: Now I gotcha. We gotta fight them over there before we fight them at Pizza Hut here. It’s our pepperoni or the highway.
Henry The K: Vell…ahmmm…the Viet Cong…ahmmm…I mean, the terrorists probably don’t eat pepperoni, but I’m glad you agree ve should escalate…ahmmm…I mean, vind a vay forward.
Junya: Well, that’s settled then Hanky-boy. Say there, howdy Laura Belle!
Laura Belle: Howdy y’all! Ah hope ya can stay for vittles.
Henry The K: Vell, if you insist Mrs. Preznit.
Junya: Did ah tell ya ahm going to be doing a new kinda ranching here?
Henry The K: Vell, no Mr. Preznit.
Junya: Yup! Ah kept gettin’ complaints from the neighbors 20 miles downwind about my prize pigs, so ahm gonna do something unique that no one else has ever done.
Henry The K: Vhat’s that Mr. Preznit?
Junya: Ahm gonna herd me some cats!
Henry The K: Cat herds Mr. Preznit?
Junya: Yup! They say ya can’t do it, but ahm just the honcho who can. Matter of fact, here’s some of them cats now. Here, kitty-kitty. Nice kitty-kitty!
Laura Belle: Junya, lawd have mercy! Them ain’t kittie-cats! Them are polecats!
Junya: Laura Belle, Sugarbun, cats is cats! You just watch, ah’ll herd ‘em!
Henry The K: Whew…cough, cough, vell, I like the white stripes Mr. Preznit.
Laura Belle: Don’t you boys shoot the breeze too long ’cause the grub will get cold.
Junya: What did you rustle up for supper, Laura Belle?
Laura Belle: Ah made bean burritos, baked beans, lima beans and bean muffins. And all the 3 bean coffee ya can drink.
Junya: Oh my, I’m gonna be floatin’ on air! What’s for dessert, Sugarbun?
Laura Belle: I baked ya a special treat. Your favorite, tumbleweed pie.
Junya: My oh my. Did ya hear that Hanky-boy? Laura Belle’s right proud of her tumbleweed pie. She caught and skinned it her own self.
Henry The K: Tumbleweed pie? Vell, if you insist Mr. Preznit.
And so that was how Junya came up with his new stratergy for herding cats…ahmmm…winning in Iraq.
Cherry cordial?! Are you making Junior his Shirley Temple?
(new book release?)
The Mouse That Roars “Hate”
– thanks to Spocko and TRex and Mike Stark and all who spotlight the slimes at KSFO.
– if’n y’all need yet another website, i think i can put it up on riseup daught nett – feel free to reach me there kmurphy
– good hunting and have fun!
– if a local SF’er can help out in other ways, do call – seriously.
[the slapp suit alone will be worth the price of admission, and kicking ksfo in the revenue gonads will be a giggle.]
That’s us, merry, c(h)ordial and diminished, quite a bit tonight…
TRex @
20
Guess we shouldn’t fret about it?
Stark!
I’ve admired your work for quite some time and I wanted to say thanks. Maybe you could give Scarborough some tips for dealing with O’Liely’s security :-)
Sr. Stark
stark dot m at gmail, weeth the proper symbols substituted, seems to be an invalid email addy, perhaps joo could email me:
gatobloggerro AT yahoo.com
gracias.
It may not be grounds for a lawsuit, but how about a letter to the disciplinary board? The law firm that wrote the letter is using an unfounded threat of legal action to assault Spocko and his or her ISP, and I bet the California disciplinary board would expect a clear explanation of this action.
Blub @ 25
Right now, some CBS suit is asking the musical question, “Just what the fuck are we paying Katie Couric for, anyway?”
RBG @
17
yep
Nice one, Mad D!
Virus. I kinda like being a virus. I’ll spread the word amongst my friends and family. Meager, I know, but I don’t blog.
{scratching beard, thinking about starting blog}
Twisted Martini @ 30
thinking about visiting Mr. Goode soon. Shhhh…
EvilDrPuma @ 39
Howard Stern was saying the same thing the other day about her, replaying a clip of her on the new going hoarse during a read. Funny shit, what with her working about an hour every day.
What do the call letters “KSFO” stand for, do you think? I’m guessing it’s “Klan! Shut it the Fuck Off!”
hope to be hearing a lot of more of that soon
punaise @
42
Mr. Modest.
TRex @
10
So who was the jerk?
EvilDrPuma @ 47
I sort of figured it was “All Hate, All the Time. We’re KSFO – So Fuck Off!” but what do I know? My radio experience was in the W-stations. We played rock music and made the hep cats tap their toes.
Bring back Spocko!
Incidentally, I don’t think the CA Bar Association would punish the offending lawyer in anyway. You pretty much have to steal money from a client and spend it on cocaine before they raise an eyebrow.
Nobody you know.
Mommybrain @
28
priceless!!!!!!!!!!!!
i’d never even heard of them. much grass, Mb …….
The Kenosha Kid @ 52
I think they will at least demand an explanation, and may well forward it to the complainant.
When Spocko told me what had happened I was stunned. I had been forwarding some of his stuff to a contact I had at the California Teachers Association in hopes that they would stop advertising on KSFO. (Imagine! A teachers’ organization paying for ads on a program like the Rogers & Morgan hatefest!) But CTA is small potatoes compared to the Visa credit card company, which dropped KSFO. No wonder ABC/Disney got pissed: The poor babies weren’t going to make as much money with slime radio.
I can hear KSFO from home. Spocko is not kidding. These folks are the vilest! I’ve posted some of Spocko’s comments on my blog. If you have one, post them on yours. Spread it around!
Our new friends in Congress need to be reminded of that piece of shit that Disney spewed about 9/11. Put the fear of God into them.
Very OT – But, Mrs. Shooogarp is out of town on a business trip and I’m watching the little one. Stumbled across M*A*S*H on some random cable station. Every scrap of the program is relevant to the current situation in Iraq. I know that the program is about Korea, but was a blatant analogy for Vietnam. It would be great if this program exerienced a resurgence into the mainstream media. How to do it?
shooogarp @ 58
We have a local Fox affiliate that runs M*A*S*H following their late news broadcast. I’ll actually turn on Fox for that–the irony actually improves the show (and it’s hard to improve M*A*S*H, IMO).
Via Atrios:
People like her, Joe Wilson, Mike Stark, Jane & Christy and TRex, are the “thousand points of light” that Senior was talking about.
A thousand points of blight.
Blight on the Thugs, fer shure!
EvilDrPuma @ 59
I’m going to explain it poorly, but the episode I just caught was a B&W episode where a journalist was interviewing the “cast” on what they “thought” of the war.
Shades of Malkin.
Why do I wake every day and I feel like I just feel down the rabbit hole?
Wow, thees Mike Stark hombre, he does no mess around.
El Raton, he ees scrrrewed, no?
so.
Shoogarp, those episodes are some of the best. They repeated that format several times during the run. Clete Roberts plays the reporter, IIRC.
Phila at Eschaton notes that:
Like i said, scrrrewed.
so.
shooogarp @ 63
I remember the one. B.J. gets the line that I think summarizes battlefield medicine as well as I want to hear it summarized:
“I’m not working on sick people here. I’m working on hurt young people, with essentially healthy bodies that have been insulted by ammunition.”
!El Gato Negro! @ 66
I love it when you talk dirty, don Gato.
El Gato Negro,
Yes. Chinga’od.
We will be able to get Spocko Lives tee-shirts, I hope?
KSFO does Raiders games. Why they would want to be associated with a Rush Limbaugh flagship in any way is a mystery…
Mr.Murder @ 70
Not really. It’s a money thing, I’m sure.
EvilDrPuma @ 67
Yep. Those are the ones. And it’s a “young” B.J. who just wants to go home to his daughter. I can’t imagine leaving my daughter for such misplaced madness.
Do you think I would leave my daughter to participate in a “surge” to protect the Madhi Army government of Iraq?
shooogarp @ 58
In some ways, Korea is more like Iraq than Vietnam was. Korea was another war that we, the average Americans at home, didn’t have much involvement in if we didn’t know someone over there. At least, in the case of Vietnam a great many people were arguing about it and many were protesting it. In The Bridges At Toki Ri, there’s a point where Brubaker’s wife is remarking how no one in the States even thought about the war. It reminded me a lot of Iraq.
TRex! Thanks for posting on this. We’re not going to take this kind of crap anymore, dammit. Free Spocko!
On another note, just got caught up on the Godlstein visit here last night. Poor fellow. But, maybe, after all, we were wrong to drop the house on his sister.
Mr.Murder @ 68
So you are saying they are used to myopic, deluded listeners?
Thers @ 72
The paste eater was in the house huh?
Twisted Martini @
60
Here’s a little peek into Maria’s spirit from a Book Salon just a month ago and Blue America conversation with Tony Trupiano from September. She will be missed.
Thers @ 74
Damn thread still smells like Jergen’s lotion and feta cheese. What a head-case that guy is.
Twisted Martini @ 60
She swung by here and commented a couple of times during Blue America threads. I didn’t know her, but Taylor Marsh wrote something about her yesterday so I did a Google search. Apparently, she was one of those folks behind the scenes who make radio shows and other political messaging happen.
Howie Klein knew her as well:
http://downwithtyranny.blogspo…..in-az.html
Cujo359 @ 73
I think you are right on that point. Korea was sold as a “police action” and I quote “Klinger” from the episode I just watched.
“A police action makes it seem like we are arresting people over here when it is a war where people are being killed.”
Amigos, compaerros bloggerros a la izquierda I must away for a short time.
Thees story, the Saga of Spocko, I theenk she ees picking up speed, no?
Gracias to T-Rex and all for their help.
es verdad.
I weel bbl to check een here and there, and try to get caught up on email, no?
so.
i don’t think anybody else has mentioned this but, in the Wikipedia entry on KSFO it states that ABC is closing a deal to sell it and some other radio stations to Citadel Broadcasting. El Raton is baiting and switching. kinda reminds me of Paul Wolfowitz ……..
next step: find out about Citadel.
fahrender @
82
Disney/ABC retains 52% of the radio stations. It’s a kabuki dance to put some distance between the brand and the content.
!El Gato Negro! @ 64
Vermin…frolicking in a cultural trash pile of their own making
>:(
And he even kinda sorta minded his manners.
The thing I have discovered about those Wingnut blogger guys? They’re all TERRIFIED of Jane. She strikes fear into their hearts in some deep and primal way. She was too busy to stop by last night, but I am sure that if she had, Pasty would have turned into a bat and fled screeching.
I don’t know what it is about her that they find so frightening. Maybe it’s the prospect of getting their asses served to them on a pizza by such a beautiful woman.
darkblack!
holy shite…..
TRex @ 85
maybe it’s simply that she’s a smart woman..
Kirk Murphy, esq.!
;>)
They fear her because they fear women with power and brains. It reminds them too much of Mommy. Seriously.
Twisted Martini @ 89
I think you may be on to something there.
Twisted Martini @ 89
Then it’s a wonder any of them ever troll around here. We’ve got more smart, butt-kicking women per unit bandwidth than Carter has little pills.
shooogarp @ 44
The virus is very tiny, just scraps of encoded information, but damn it can bring down a very big animal. Maybe El Raton.
UptownNYChick @ 87
No, TRex is right. She’s smart and that’s how she does it, but being put down by a beautiful woman is a lot worse than being put down by an ugly one.
Twisted Martini @ 89
Well Jane intimidates me. Not for her glowing personality or her daunting intellect or her OMG looks… but because she is so completely down to earth and friendly and unbeleivably effective. She’s taken this blog medium by storm and it’s all appeared so effortless… Even so, she’s always been willing to help a brother out at the drop of a hat. She played a large part in launching CAW and I’ll be forever grateful.
That’s the best way to fight these haters IMHO. In the 60’s the nuts shot our leaders, now they have talk shows.
Goodnight all!
Twisted Martini @ 89
Yup, that deadly, highly intelligent, reality-based, snark-rich content, delivered by a strong woman. That’s some scary shit to the mental mice that scurry around after the intellectually stale cheese puffs that have fallen to the floor.
RagingGurrl @ 95
And, the bloggers who love them just get their nuts off. ba-da-bing!
montag @ 98
More like ka-ching!, unfortunately.
Well Jane intimidates me.
Aw, Mike. A big tough Marine like you?
Heh.
You’re so sensitive.
RagingGurrl @ 95
I don’t know what I’m saying here….but…
They did kill our leaders. Meaning OUR. America’s leaders. JFK. MLK. RFK. Malcom X.
They play for keeps.
Do we?
shooogarp @ 58
Oh man, I just finished watching the entire box set and was thinking the exact same thing. Hawkeye, the voice of reason, eventually snaps in the end – the death of one more innocent life throws him over the edge, but Dr. Freedman helps him recover just as the war ends.
Not like Bush would have remorse over the deaths he’s caused, but sure wish we had a Dr. Freedman to lock him up.
Mike Stark @
94
Howdy all! You’re doing great work with CAW dude. I have your feed in my podcatcher and get such a kick out of your clips. I love it when you’re driving O’Reilly or some other local wingnut crazy. Keep it up man!
I hope y’all are reading Digby every day. Wow. Tonight, quoting Vanity Fair,
Yeah and if that doesn’t turn your stomach, he goes on about holy Joe,
Which is just amazing in the smoke-screen-turnaround-jump-shot sorta way, since we all know Joe was against the war before he was for it…or for it before he was against it before he suddenly this month is for it again…or something like that. I get all dizzy trying to comprehend these guys. One thing for sure, there doesn’t appear to be anyone sane with their hand on the tiller.
TRex @
100
I had forgotten about that Marine thing. Shit. But I don’t really have to explain do I? You must know that a hot body is kryptonite to any little soldier. Except it doesn’t make you soft. (ugh. don’t tell Jane I say such vile things.)
RagingGurrl @ 102
Cheney wouldn’t let Dr. Feedman within 50 feet of Bush. Kinda pessimistic tonight. Did I mention Mrs. Shooogarp was out of town? A five year-old lil’ shooogarp will eat you alive if you don’t have the concentration….
; )
darkblack-
“Take this plane to Euro-Disney!” [/el Raton]
everyone:
I forgot to mention that, eef joo weesh to take the files for jourself,
por favor feel free to host them and share them as joo weesh.
Also, eef joo want me to email them to joo, let me know at:
gatobloggerro at yahoo dot com.
Buenos noches
“So because St John and Junior and the rest of these macho Republican heroes can’t “face” failure, with or without an escalation, more Americans will have to die in the Iraq meatgrinder for their vanity.”
Maybe Joe Lieberman could face failure for them. With one of his faces. Since, you know, he has two of them…
Heh. “Little soldier”. You sound like you’ve been hanging out with teh General.
Don’t worry. I won’t tell Jane what you said IN THE COMMENTS SECTION ON HER BLOG. Yeah, you’re secret’s safe now! You might as well have told it to Judy Miller.
!El Gato Negro! @ 107
I wanted to put them up tonight, but I don’t quite have the mp3 posting technology down yet.
shooogarp @ 101
Those men would have changed the world. Don’t you think?
I have a gallery in Park City, Utah. Tourists. One of the great sale’s lines is; “Where are you from?” When someone says: “I’m from Conneticut.” I can’t resist the whole Lamont/Lieberman question. (Being a Firepup and all!) And 99% of the CT citizens through the gallery bring up the PORK issue. Everyone is concerned about who will bring home the bacon.
FWIW.
*says nothing and looks at the ceiling*
RagingGurrl @ 111
They did.
But the crazies on the right didn’t allow them to rule.
Which is a different story.
We need their passion.
But not their hate.
My favorite picture of RFK.
marksb @ 104
Which is just amazing in the smoke-screen-turnaround-jump-shot sorta way, since we all know Joe was against the war before he was for it…or for it before he was against it before he suddenly this month is for it again…or something like that. I get all dizzy trying to comprehend these guys. One thing for sure, there doesn’t appear to be anyone sane with their hand on the tiller.
Speaking of Lieberman, check out this trailer for an upcoming documentary on the terrible scurge of video game violence. Our good friend Joe makes an appearance, telling the video game industry it would terrible–just awful–if something happened that forced the government to come in and regulate them.
Wingers demanding video games kow-tow to their morality (for the children!) is just one more front in the endless battles against wingnuttery.
Not that it’s nearly as important or urgent as fighting against the Dark Lord of the Eternal Copyright, Mickey the Rat, who funds hate speech.
Oh, and Mr. Stark? You ROCK!
Right wing bloggers are actively advocating the killing of the democratically elected leaders of Congress and the FBI looks the other way.
Does this remind anybody of anything?:
TRex @ 110
If someone gives me the link to the files I could use Odeo to connect to them and we could put the embed Odeo player in your post above as well as give people a central location to grab embeddable audio players for their own site or links to email to people.
Oh and Trex, check your email.
Fini FiniTOOBZ! @ 118
You check yours, buster.
TRex @ 119
Awesome, thanks man. I’ll keep you posted.
Can I check mine too?
shooogarp @ 114
Yes, they did change the world, but they graced this world for such a short time, we can only guess how much different the world would be if they were allowed to rule, like you say. I agree with you.
egregious @ 121
I think you should, young lady.
egregious @ 121
If you ‘ant to but its just Vi*gra sales pitches and get rich quick schemes I bet.
[Mod note; Fini, Fini, Fini.]
I’ve been away 4 days visiting egrdaughter in the DR.
Did I miss anything, you know, first woman speaker of the House, my guy Webb sworn in to the Senate, things o that nature?
Yes I do love my daughter. She’s a little homesick and a little actually sick but was happy to see us and our many suitcases full of humanitarian aid for her school there.
You know thats twice tonight I forgot if you try to be funny mentioning popular male enhancing meds you get your comment stuck in moderation.
I KNOW I KNOW!!! Es muy ridiculoso.
Disney has always been insanely jealous of their copyright. After all they made Sonny Bono their bitch just so Steamboat Willie wouldn’t go into open domain. They also have the reputation of having the most toxic corporate culture of any major corporation. A couple of years ago I followed a couple of links to anti-Disney sites and what I read was really kind of shocking. What I found what to me was the ultimate distillation of the Disney culture was a MPG entitled gimmethemermaid.mpg on a anti-copyright website. I don’t have a current link, but a google search for gimmethemermaid.mpg should locate it. A warning though, the file is 174megs. There were a bunch of very intriguing works at that site. One that really made me laugh was a casting couch routine that some guy did with a Barbie doll.
shooogarp @ 116
Right wingers killing doctors at family planning clinics? Did I win?
egregious @ 125
?
Sounds very amazing. Please elaborate.
TRex @ 123
But this couch is soo comfortable and my email is in the next room. Maybe in the morning. I’ll read here for a few, tho.
Is everybody ok? I mean fdl wise. I know the world is still going up in flames.
Helpless Dancer @127
Thus distorting the Constitution and our culture even more. Now, culture is locked away from the public generally for a century or more.
But it benefits the Money Party. I hope the Dems (and the progressive blogging community) eventually tackle the perversion of copyright that impoverishes us all at the expense of the few. It’s gaining traction in Europe; a few countries there even have anti-copyright Pirate Parties (and no, I’m not arguing for the abolishment of copyright, but a return to a sensible balance between copyright ownership and public/cultural interest).
I’m sure the people planning Spoko’s defense are all over it, but the Electronic Frontier Foundation is a great resource to learn about your digital rights and how to protect them.
Hey shooogarp!
How’s that pony!
Um, my middle child is spending a year as a volunteer teaching school and specifically being the librarian for 500 kids in a poor part of the Dominican Republic. I have no idea where she gets this humanitarian thing :)
RagingGurrl @ 128
No. We all lose.
Where the decent people of America stand by and forget what is means to be decent. I listen to right wing HATE radio and I think who would be sucked into their deceit.
I am tired and pissed. Just know that I am a BREEDING LIBERAL.
Have babies.
Teach.
Destroy.
Good Night.
egregious @ 130
Did you leave the controls for the truck that delivers your email in the next room? Is the toob that delivers the email installed in there? Why can’t you check email with the machine you’re on here with? Maybe I can walk you through how to check it from where you’re at.
shooogarp Just know that I am a BREEDING LIBERAL.
Have babies.
Teach.
Is it ok if I have babies who teach? Or teach surgeons how to save babies?
egregious @
125
I certainly missed you egregious. I was hoping you were well as I hadn’t read any of your comments lately. I’m glad to hear your daughter is doing well and the gifts you came bearing were all gratefully accepted.
How are you doing? Are you as happy as I am that the Holidays are officially over and it’s a brand new year? :)
Welcome home, eg. TRex, I am so glad to see this issue front-paged here.
egregious @ 132
You know. Being a fellow humanitarian and all… I gave the pony away. To a friend of mine. She didn’t really believe in my imaginary pony. At first….
But she plays with it every day now.
The Democratic Party delivers!
I like this plan.
the state of CA has a nice little law on the book regarding SLAPPs – strategic lawsuits against public participation. the damages can be quite significant on something like this (treble, i believe). i’ve forwarded this post on to some friends who may be able to circulate to some enterprising attorneys in SF…
shooogarp @ 133
Does this make you a breeding heart liberal?
Now good night.
Nice to hear from you Egregious.
My prediction for 2008.
The Presidency. (Gore/Obama)
12 more House Seats/6 more Senate Seats
Start the Pool. Bold predictions start now.
Fini you funny. I’m on my laptop on wifi that doesn’t have ms outlook loaded. I have a tiny little email program for this computer for when I travel. Just too lazy to install outlook I guess. Plus its 2am here and if I start the email…..
AirportCat @
8
Hey, AC. Where yat?
WAIT.
I almost forgot. Is there a pony for 2008?
shooogarp @ 133
Yes but are you BREEDING LIBERALLY?
:-P
Fini FiniTOOBZ! @ 141
Yes.
Most definitely YES.
Nate! Thanks for your concern. December was really hard but I think in a very familiar way. I know the map of my depression very well after all these years. By comparison I had a pretty good December. Except for that number on the scale :o but if that’s the price of mental stability so be it.
Summer is actually more of a challenge now that I am aware of my manic moodswings. Some of you lovely folks here were with me on a couple of those. We’re still trying to get the meds right. Live and learn.
shooogarp @ 145
OF COURSE there’s a pony for 2008. I wouldn’t let you down.
Just sharing this for comment by this gaggle of witty folks, here:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/01/…..index.html
egregious @ 143
I hear you. I have a rule against installing software or otherwise futzing with computer settings after midnight. Too many disasters after midnight taught me the hard way. Have you looked at switching to Mozilla’s email companion for Firefox called Thunderbird?
[waves hi to Suzanne]
Nate @ 146
I don’t know anything about that.
Man, I have the nastiest old couch. It’s ripped to shreds. I have a slip cover (also old and full of holes) and a bedspread over it. And I’m starting to get a little paranoid that it’s, well, a little smelly.
However, it is 7 feet wide (which makes it perfect for sofa-sleeping, even for a tall person like me) and so very very comfortable.
My mom has offered me, like, three different sofas, but one was too short, one was too hard, and one was one of those sofas where you’re CONSTANTLY having to get up and push the cushions back into place and I haaaaaate that.
So, I keep my crappy old sofa, bless it. Someday, I’ll find one as good. Until then, I think I may just buy it a new slip-cover and try and give it a good steam-cleaning.
egregious @ 148
Oh, god. Story of my life! I feel for you. Winter is the worst time for me, the absolute worst! Going through another med change right now. Nausea and all that jazz. Not fun.
shooogarp @ 145
I want a pony!!
egregious @ 149
Pink?
I’m going to give it to my daughter.
Note the majorites that it is going to give the Dems. Bullet Proof.
These posts nearly write themselves.
Well, we knew they were lowering their standards.
mandrake @ 150
I for one am shocked and appalled that these dead and wounded officers are refusing to put their selfish interests in recuperating from wounds and remaining dead aside to help their brothers in arms in their old units. DONT THEY KNOW THERE’S A WAR ON?!?! Lazy shiftless bastards, the whole lot of em. They should roll their wheelchairs down to the recruiting office this instant and reup!
A small appeal to those assembled. I thought I saw a brief news blurb today about the Office of Legal Counsel rewriting the open meeting rules. Anyone have a link?
Grist for the mill….
They should roll their wheelchairs down to the recruiting office this instant and reup!
Yeah, and their coffins too. If Novak can get wheels for his….
Respectful Dissent @ 131
Copyright law as it stands does seriously inhibit creativity. What is it now? The life of the author plus 70 years? I hate to keep coming back to one of my pet peeves(I collect them like an old woman collects cats), but the corporation(holding copyrights as a condition of an artist’s employment)is theoretically immortal. Thus denying derivative works forever without permission.
egregious @ 161
If the IEDs weren’t enough, that would be a real morale killer, fer sure….
TRex @ 154
Dude. Every gay man I know has reupholstered their couch at least once, and in the case of my friend Richard, 4 times since I’ve known him in the last 3 years. I simply assumed this was the gay male equivalent of cleaning gutters, something you do once or twice a year just for fun.
TRex @ 154
I feel your pain. I had a sofa like that. The older and nastier it got the more comfortable it became. I still miss it.
montag @ 163
The government won’t provide the wheels tho. The troops and their families will have to pay themselves as usual. Maybe we can hold a bake sale.
TRex @ 139
It is an
enjoyable
AND
effective
PLAN.
mandrake—
I periodically have Depression Open House over at egregiousBlog. Come on over any time and write a comment, I’m happy to lend an ear or a shoulder.
Nate @ 176
Haven’t checked email in the past week either, Nate. Will do ummm… tomorrow?
Nate- I didn’t elaborate on the full story, but the guy was beyond “rude” and “discourteous”- he was a whack job who was set to blow at any moment, and he was completely sober. As I learned after, there had been several passenger complaints about him, starting from the time we were having our 4 hr wait in Philly. Got some interesting perspective from the whole flight crew on their life and times. Gotta give props to the highly professional conduct of the USAir flight crew.
egregious @ 158
Since we were talking about M*A*S*H tonight, from the movie:
SSgt. Gorman: “Goddamn army.”
Seriously. Don’t they know we all have to Make Sacrifices in a Time of War?
Valley Girl @ 169
You know he’s a Republican. Asshole.
Glad you’re home safe and sound, VG!
I’m working on a post backstage right now and wondering if I should do it for a Late Late Nite post or save it.
Hmmmmm.
People will continue to be killed for their beliefs wherever there is a breeding ground for hate – our country is no exception. Because we are not like the wingnuts, we will not cause physical harm to them, but our blows can be painful.
Disney winced at Spockos blow and struck back – that’s not a bad thing. Spocko now knows he was on target and the rest of us can help him sink the battleship. That’s what these fights look like.
MASH quote:
“You ever had one of those wars where everything goes wrong?” — Hawkeye Pierce
helluva late nite thread.
g’nite, pups, see you in the funny papers tomorrow morning!
Valley Girl @ 169
Hiya VG! A little bit of excitement it sounds like. A side of me finds it funny that what was thought of 10 years ago as “rude” and “discourteous” behavior on an airplane can often now be probable cause for arrest.
Did you get my email?
I hate flying.
My rule, out here in the west anyway.
Five hours or less, I drive. I would rather listen to some music and watch the landscape roll by…snap some photos of what will soon be gone.
I have thought about it for a few seconds and I revise my earlier statement. Ten hours or less and I drive.
Valley Girl! Hi!
Just got back from travel myself, about an hour ago.
Sorry to hear about your trouble with the moron on the plane VG. In a way I’m glad I have a disease that prevents me from flying. I suffer from chronic DVTs related to a blood disorder I have so I can’t go anywhere except by train or car. It’s worth the extra effort to drive places though because of what shoogarp said, the landscape rolling by is much more interesting and the travel experience, stopping in roadside restaurants, meeting locals, seeing the sights along the way is a much more interesting way to travel.
shooogarp @ 178
Shoooogarp… Try the train. I just this hour walked in the door in San Jose after a 3-hour train trip from Sacramento. I plugged in my laptop (110v outlet provided) at a 4 seat table, set my coffee I’d just bought in the cafe’ car down and knocked out two edited videos, a two page action plan and even watched Olbermann’s latest “Special Comment” I’d downloaded from C&L yesterday morning but hadn’t gotten to.
It has to be the most civilized way to travel. Now if I could just get US-backed Amtrak to convince GE to start building them only BioDiesel engines, it would be perfect.
I haven’t flown since before 9/11. My budget just doesn’t allow for it. I spent a career driving around all day so driving is pretty much second nature to me.
Nate @ 181
In fact, I can’t tell you how stoked I am that YKos is in Chicago this year. It means I get to take the California Zephyr. It’s a train that runs from SF, across the Sierra Nevada mountains, across the Rockies and on through the Nebraska, Iowa plains all the way to Chi-town.
shooogarp @ 178
If it will take a day or less, I’d rather drive these days.
egregious @ 158
G’night all. Sleep well…
Hey Nate, I can’t find your email address on your blog and want to email you about something, can you email me at finifinito at gmail dot com?
okay- so this weird WordPress bug appears to be back–
Nate- I responded to your comment, but it somehow got entered into an earlier comment of mine. I think this has happened to others, before. Anyway…
Haven’t checked email in the past week either, Nate. Will do ummm… tomorrow?
Nate- I didn’t elaborate on the full story, but the guy was beyond “rude” and “discourteous”- he was a whack job who was set to blow at any moment, and he was completely sober. As I learned after, there had been several passenger complaints about him, starting from the time we were having our 4 hr wait in Philly. Got some interesting perspective from the whole flight crew on their life and times. Gotta give props to the highly professional conduct of the USAir flight crew.
snip
Nate @ 189
Hiya Fini… My address is in my profile but it’s just my blog name at gmail dot com. It’s the easiest way to reach me. I have another one that I have extend all the way to my cell phone/pda as well. I’ll give you that one if we get to the point where you may need to reach me day or night. Right now that’s reserved for family and the occasional paying client though. (although I haven’t had one of those in a few months lol)
Hi folks! Spocko here. I just thought I’d drop by to say hi and that I’m working hard to keep this going. I want to use your collective intelligence on a few things. Partly on messaging partly on actions.
What I think still sticks in my craw it the way that journalists can’t, don’t or won’t defend themselves.
The FRAKING Wall Street Journal sponsors this show. Not the editorial page, but the rest of the Journal has some fine writers (Glenn Simpson) and they never said BOO to my letter! (I spent 15 hours on that sucker! You do a Google search for WSJ and Nancy Abramson and Spocko’s Brain is #1. Read the Google cache) Did they care? No. Morgan calls for Reporter Glenn Simpson to be hanged. Great. Free Speech is swell, but the WSJ shouldn’t pay money to Morgan for the privilege of telling it’s reporters to hang. How to I reach out to the WSJ publisher and say, hey we bloggers are defending the rights of your journalists to publish the least you can do is stop paying the woman who is calling for your reporter’s head.
NOTE: In KSFO-TalkRadioland controversy usually DOESN’T lead to anyone getting into real “trouble”. Sussman says “I got into trouble for demanding a caller “Say Allah is a Whore!”, but as far as I can see that didn’t even warrant a WARNING, from management. The President of KGO/KSFO, Mickey Luckoff, is a proud liberal and I’m sure he is a free speech champion, so that is how it all works. Sussman today was busy back peddling. He spent 2 hours last night using Boxer’s words to condemn CAIR. Sussman feels that “I’ll get fired if *I* criticize CAIR so I’ll just have Boxer do it. He simply says that CAIR is out to get him and how he was always taken out of context. Which is a nice snappy way of forcing me to run longer and longer clips therefore violating their copyright. Clever, no?
The SF Chronicle reporter I talked to noted that in Talk radio a controversial story just ends up bouncing back and forth with O’Rielly, or Morgan or Savage, it just leads to “Train wreck looky loo” ratings for them. They WIN with controversy up until it reaches a point where someone loses a job, a advertiser or a journalist or Muslim loses his life.
So the end game here is to make the controversy work in OUR favor. People writing the advertisers will work, until, like the Borg they will adapt. So the goal here is to NOT let them apologize their way out of this. The world needs to know that the money they generate via hate speech Is ILL GOTTEN gains. Cash generated by hate speech and violent rhetoric is tainted. So Mr. Advertiser, don’t taint your Brand with this show.
ONE BIG PROBLEM,
They asked me if I wanted to “debate” Sussman. I said no, taking on Jon Stewart’s tone to Tucker Carlson I said, “I won’t be your monkey.” and “You are hurting the country.” I’m no Mike Stark, but I also knew that the second I was off the air they would mock me and dismiss my point. It is never about “changing someone’s mind” on Hot Talk radio, so I moved the battle to another venue.
Bottom line: Right now It is SAFE for advertisers to be on violent AM hate radio. That needs to change. There are NO consequences to the HOST (The Union protects them from the new FEC fines, good for the Unions!), there are no consequences to the station: This needs to change. The Christian Right has been doing this to radio for years. John A at Americablog used the same tactics FOR the gay community against companies like Ford. His work was also an inspiration. Behavior can change.
Hate Radio does better with “controversial topics” and they get better ratings, which leads to higher ad rates. They are bullies.
I think that Hannity and Rush are more subtle and frankly more dangerous, and Media Matters, Al Franken and others have been dealing with them. They are dangerous but third and second tier hosts are more apt to slip up and therefore when their hatred, racial bias or violence toward others come out we can shine the light on them to their advertisers who DO care about what is said next to their ads.
I’ve learned a lot in this fight and one thing that we can do is help replicate this for our causes. I also need your help to crystallize sound bites. If you were talking about this in a short time for a radio show or TV, what would YOUR sound bite be? What is the most effective think you think you could say?
I’m a smart guy, but I’m in awe of the brains assembled here, I’m just a brain in a box and the I know enough to ask for help from the really big brains.
BTW. I met Redd at a John A meeting in SF, been a fan for a long time, but I’m a First Draft, Atrios kind of guy, so I’m not hear as often (Eli is my buddy and he hangs here)
Also, I haven’t told many of you about the DEEP PR anti-smear work I did against Melanie Morgan to protect Jimmy Carter from her “Censure Carter” campaign in Atlanta, but that is a story for another boring blog post. It has to do with managing Smears to candidates BEFORE it happens. Democrats need DEEP PR anti-smear workers. Karl Rove is still in office folks.
LLAP,
Your Vulcan Friend
Spocko
Valley Girl @ 188
Glad they dealt with him so well. People like him should definitely be made to endure the hassle of being on the ‘no-fly’ list. Rather than 85 year old great grandmas who happen to have middle eastern names.
Fini FiniTOOBZ! @
180
Fini- I went by plane bec. my vacation time was limited, tho I did consider driving there (Ithaca) and back. I’ve done that a few times, and I have to say I really enjoyed it. If it were not for time pressure, driving or train would be my preferred way to travel. Especially fun to find one of a kind family restaurants for meals, etc. I agree, much more interesting, and much less stressful.
Spocko- Well, I have to say that this is a great topic to find on my re-entry to the toobz. I read your long missive, and I hope the brains will give you some good input- sorry mine is a bit fried right now. But, the message has to be- hate speech doesn’t pay.
Valley Girl
;)
Spocko – thank you for taking them on.
RagingGurrl @ 196
Yeah, Spocko! Thanks! And thanks for coming by. We think this is a great thing you’re doing.
Spocko, great work you’re doing man, keep it up. I mentioned it earlier but it got EPU’d but if you would like to help spread the audio clips further you ought put them up on Odeo and send people there to get the embeddable Flash audio players to put into their blog posts about this. I can help out with this if you need some technical assistance, this is what I do for a living is produce podcasts.
BTW, you wanna do a phone interview about this?
where did everybody go?
Spocko- fwiw- I had an interesting conversation with a friend whose family left Germany during the Nazi era- he was a child at the time, but he has vivid memories of the ordeal of moving from country to country- I asked him about the use of Nazi/ fascist to describe our current regime, vs. that of Germany at the time. He said that the big difference was that the German populace at the time were fully aware of the deeds done, and embraced the facisism, whereas in the US (now), the populace were lied to and believed the lies. But, I don’t think he’s listened to any right wing hate radio. It really does seem to be the making of “educated” facists, if you see what I mean. (Sorry if this doesn’t make sense- been a long day).
RagingGurrl @ 196
Ditto both RagingGurrl and ValleyGirl.
This is the Good Fight and glad to see you’re taking it head on. I will definitely support and put together a post linking here and to the Blog HQ for this battle. If I have time, I’ll include it in a podcast and/or vlogcast.
Fini FiniTOOBZ! @ 199
I just finished what may well be the harshest most scathing post about MalKKKin and Fiends that I have ever written.
I feel good.
*lights cigarette*
I just put in some cash for Christy’s crashpad for the trial.
Anybody got a rough estimate of our total raised to date?
I miss our little thermometer. Can we have a new one?
Fini FiniTOOBZ! @ 199
Well it is 3:30 of a morning here in the east.
well i dont’ know if it will help but i blogged your troubles over on skippy. good luck spocko and keep fighting the good fight.
Ok I guess I should try and get some zzz’s.
G’night.
egregious @ 204
But its a weekend night, party time! I just developed a bit of a complex sitting in silence for ten minutes thinking I killed the thread since mine was the last comment before the pregnant pause.
So, we need a sociologist to weigh in, but… humans are social animals, and look to others to approve and affirm their views. Everyone has dark thoughts from time to time, but in the best of times, they only last a fleeting moment, because the “society” says NO. And, the “reality check” says NO. Problem is, with hate radio, those dark thoughts get reinforced and amplified- the stray dark thoughts suddenly are given social acceptability, and start to bloom. This is why right-wing hate speech is so dangerous.
Weekend night party time: my get up and go got up and went.
Some points to consider (note below:RWTSH=Right wing talk show host)
Compare RWTSH to terrorist (inciting violence, threatening assassinations)
Ask interveiwer how they would feel if RWTSH called for people to shoot him/her.
Compare assassinations of political leaders in 60’s to the character assassination by RWTSH of today’s progressive leaders and how they’re actually now calling for people to kill them – a somewhat recent escalation in vitriol because neocons are losing political ground. Somewhat parallels the events leading to the assassinations in late 60s.
Just a few thoughts…
egregious @ 209
So has mine, I’m off to bed now too firepups. Gnight!
RagingGurrl @ 210
it’s a more cowardly, passive/aggressive form of crying “fire!” in a crowded theater. they are hypocritical criminals.
That would mean it was all about you, when clearly, Late Nite is all about, well, me.
FiniFiniToobz:
Grrreat idea!
I am certain Spocko has crashed, (as I must) but I theenk joo should email heem at:
spockosemail “at” gmail “dot” com
Gracias
‘dios
so.
Spocko–a few general ideas:
First, I haven’t heard the clips (dial-up’s a misery), but I would suggest writing Dave Neiwart at Orcinus and ask him if he can help you distinguish what is clearly, legally hate speech from that which is just over the top and outrageous. He’s done a lot of research and reporting on the subject.
Maybe John Amato at Crooks and Liars can help you with the fair use issues, sort of define the absolute limits of fair use, and he might have some previous rulings on hand which you can use to at least stave off the legal beasts when they come knocking.
Next, some way, start a legal defense fund, because if you manage to drive off the legal hounds, they’re gonna come back with a SLAPP suit of some sort. Contact the Electronic Freedom Foundation and let them know precisely the sort of trouble they’re causing you. They might even be willing to help (although, right now, they seem to have some pretty big fish frying with the surveillance business).
As others have suggested, spread the stuff around–a lot. Makes it much harder to go after every ISP and web host, and it eats up their legal money.
If the local unions are protecting the local radio hosts, check with the nationals and see if they agree with supporting hate speech. How do other non-broadcast union locals in the SF area feel about their members being impugned by the right wing? What about any unions associated with the advertisers’ operations?
Know of anyone who’s been attacked because of any radio host’s direct exhortations to violence? Find `em and interview them.
And do everything you can legally to tie this can to both the station owner’s and Disney’s tails. You say the station owner is a “free speech liberal.” What kind of “liberal” makes money off that sort of thing? Seems to me that boy needs his reputation adjusted.
Bumper stickers ought to go over well in the SF area. How about something like, “Hate speech hurts San Franciscans–turn off KGO/KSFO.” After all, all politics is local.
If I think of more, I’ll try to write it down and pass it on. This is just off the top of my head.
Cheers, and good luck with it.
Dammitall,
Ay… tu perritos del fuego,
someone tell FiniFiniToobz to email Spocko and geeve heem that idea, eh?
so.
Hi montag!
Hate speech does have a pretty narrow legal definition, IRRC, so you are right to point this out. I did some net research on this a while back. I will try to find links. But, exhorting people to do hateful things is not such a “winner” in any event.
edit- actually, my net research had to do with “hate speech” in an academic environment, so I may be off the mark in generalizing.
That’s it for me, gang. Good night.
Dammit I am always here after everyone’s gone to bed.
No, I did not get your email, fini :)
Valley Girl @ 217
Hello–back, huh?
What is likely happening at KSFO is the usual right-wing spew that occasionally crosses a line–that makes it hard to distinguish what’s actionable from what’s not, but the guidelines are still out there, as you say, and it would be well to know them in detail.
I’m quite surprised, though, that this station does well in the SF market. But, there are bigots and moral defectives everywhere….
I still think that Spocko may have more luck with some sort of local campaign. Having lots of `net exposure doesn’t hurt, but the station’s ratings are what determines the ad rates and the station’s income. The only way to affect those is to make San Francisco sit up and take notice. I wonder if Spocko has let Mark Morford know about his campaign? :)
Just when I was starting to get over The Path To 911, Disney goes and pulls this crap. At this rate, I’ll never watch ABC or Disney again.
That’s good advice, montag. Hopefully Fini Fini Toobz will send it on.
I’m quite surprised, though, that this station does well in the SF market. But, there are bigots and moral defectives everywhere….
Sadly true, I’m afraid. Like I’ve said, we’re all just scared little monkeys inside. Some of us can’t get beyond that condition.
Goodnight, all.
montag- wow! You jogged my memory. Mark Morford has had some great pieces, which I found via FDL a long time back. Can’t remember which they were. But, this is a great piece of advice. Here’s his wiki, which is all I could find on short notice. I wish I could remember why I found him in the first place!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Morford
VG
Valley Girl @ 222
I’ve been reading him on the web for years, mostly because he’s a hoot. He’s sort of the Hunter S. Thompson of the sensuous massage set. :)
spocko @ 191
To recap other people’s advice:
1.) The EFF
2.) Olbermann (MAN, this would be juicy on the Countdown!)
3.) Orcinus
4.) AMERICAblog
5.) Crooks & Liars
6.) Also, Jesus’ General, if no one else suggested it.
I’m sure some of them will pick up on the story. Wider exposure of the story can only help you embarrass the mouse, although not every big-traffic liberal blog can tackle every rightwing outrage (cause lordee, it’s hard enough to keep up as it is).
KSFO, as an AM radio station in the SF Bay area, has a large area of reception. I’ve heard it on up into the Sierra’s past Sacramento and down in the Central Valley near Bakersfield. It has a strong signal.
I remember this station from back in the day (60’s and early 70’s) when it had music and real dj’s. It wasn’t my favorite station but my mom and I agreed it was better than that country and western station my Dad preferred.
Bottom line? The guy took protected property without permission of others and he is not entitled to fair use, under the guidelines of fair use. He basically stole someone else’s property and put it out into the public domain. Further, he tried to suppress the free speech of the broadcasters.
It was his choice as to whether or not keep his account open. He had seven days to comply with the order from his ISP to remove the copywritten material and he chose not to do it.
Copywrites are to protect people who work hard and make investments in their creations. What he did was the equivalent of stealing someone’s book and putting it into public domain, to steal someone’s music and put it on the public domain for free, to steal someone’s private property.
While there are many of the same individuals repeatedly posting on this blog, the majority of ethical bloggers do not agree with his sense of ethics or his twisted journalism.
He makes ethical bloggers, who like it or not, are journalists, look bad.
spocko @
191
So, what you are advocating now is to deny individuals of their free speech by trying to put them out of business?
Why didn’t you choose to remove the protected matter from your website and simply keep your blog?
YOU were the one responsible for having your site closed. You had the opportunity to keep it open….
Your situation is kind of like a massochist who walks into a bar, stands in front of the biggest guy there and says, “Hey, hit me.” When the guy doesn’t, you push him and when he still doesn’t hit you, you turn around and sue him for emotionally damaging you because he won’t hit you.
You have some issues, guy….especially with your perceptions of what is said. Are you sure you are the big journalist you have advocated to have been? Your ethics are very, very questionable when compared to those with integrity.
Good morning, pups. The NYT has Orlando Patterson and Maureen Dowd today. Patterson says that Darth Cheney used to be human… Who knew?
http://mgpaquin.blogspot.com/
I’ve got coffee and tea if anyone wants some, and I was in the mood for corn muffins this morning. They’re over there, on the counter.
Blogical Thought @ 227
BS. Do you know the limits of fair use? It is permissible to use segments of copyrighted material as illustrative examples or as historical references, and if one is using them for non-profit purposes, the selection can be more than a snippet, if necessary to accurately represent a fact. (Complete episodes of programs is still a problem, even for academic purposes. But, at no time has the poster indicated that he has used complete programs as examples.)
Second, he isn’t suppressing free speech–first, hate speech is against the law and is not protected by the First Amendment. Second, he’s tried to influence advertisers not to associate themselves with potentially illegal–and certainly, to him, objectionable–commercial content. That’s simply using the marketplace in a way that goes on all the time. Indeed, the poster has no personal means to suppress the speech of the talk show hosts of that particular radio station. What he is saying, however, is that lawyers from a large organization are attempting to suppress his speech by misapplying the existing “fair use” statutes and the DMCA.
And, if you know so goddamned much about the law surrounding this issue, why is it that you don’t know how to spell “copyright?”
“Copywrites,” my ass. Know the law regarding fair use. Then comment.
Blogical Thought @ 227
I suppose it shouldn’t surprise me that your user name has no link to a site you’d claim as your own. You have a pathetic grasp of the fair use protections and your assertions are sophomoric. In fact, they’re down right whiney.
Go read just the first paragraph of Section 107 of the US Copyright Law and get a clue you twit. Spocko had and still has every right to repost/rebroadcast KSFO’s Copyrighted (bold highlight = clue that you might want to crack a dictionary occasionally) material.
Get a life you little fascist Ministry of Information Rove-apprentice wannabe.
Good Morning, Firepups,
It’s very warm here in central Jersey–today’s high is expected to be 70 degrees. I asked Mr. NJP if we were still in the northern hemisphere this January.
Is anybody from the ‘Lake going to the antiwar march in DC at the end of January? Mr. NJP and I have made our hotel reservation–a little marching, and some time to visit some friends and some museums.
Marion in Savannah, thanks for the coffee. I brought some fresh herb biscuits. I put them next to the corn muffins, so folks can help themselves.
Work for peace, every day.
Marion in Savannah -
Mmmmmmm, mmmmmuffins! Would that be cornbread muffins or corncake muffins? It was someone at FDL (maybe The T-Rex) who educated this Southerner as to technical difference. Recently bought something labeled “cornbread” at Fresh Market; took one bite; & thought seriously about notifying them re. truth-in-advertising ;-)
njprogressive @ 232
That’s extraordinary, and beyond what anyone would describe as a January thaw. Your heating bill must be appreciative.
Good morning, all. Unseasonably warm here in Michigan, too, though not on the same scale as New Jersey’s. Belated props to LHP for yesterday’s Fitz-fix. Thanks to all the legal-types for the insightful commentary. Maybe it’s not too late for me to go to law scho……Naah!
RagingGurrl @
111
They did change the world. Their work was cut short.
Waccamaw @ 233
When I was a child in NYC my mother made corncake muffins. Now that I’m down in the south they’re cornbread muffins. I’m not much of a dessert person…!
montag @
230
LOL…….now, what “nonprofit use” is he using the full soundbytes that he put on the internet?
Do you know the definition of hate speech?
Face it, the guy stole the sound bytes. You guys are absolutely hilarious and this should be a sitcom….even funnier is you do political blogging.
Here is some guy who thinks he is a Vulcan and goes by a screen name on a website devoted to his obsession toward a woman talk show host. He threatens to sue some poster (according to his post yesterday) who he claims “defamed his screen name.” He sits around all day and collects sound bytes of the talk show host and gives up his website before he will give up his sound bytes….
Even more hilarious are the slough of people here who are involved in this drama because they can’t think of anything else to talk about….and who feel sorry for him because he doesn’t have any money because he sits at home all day collecting the talk show host’s sound bytes.
Its just too funny, though I am certain not funny for the talk show host, with the unhealthy obsession going on.
Face it. The guy is a loser…I can just see him sitting in front of his computer in his Homer Simpson undies and T-Shirt, sipping on his beer and glued to his computer while Talk Radio echoes in the background.
Do you really do political blogging? Because this is just tooooooo funny!
By the way, thanks for helping me with my misspelling.
omg! Sunday morning talk shows list a preponderance of Dems ****g**** (fauxnews the exception) May be the first AND last time it happens but enjoy!
Interesting guest from SFC on Washington Journal right now.
Good Morning Firedogs,
thanks ever so for the coffee and biscuits
in case you missed it -
3 Minutes from David Shuster on Tweety yesterday – The Cost of War
go there and click on “watch video”
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036697/
cbl @ 4:55 -
Dial-up here; any short notes on content you could provide? Tks!
Fini FiniTOOBZ! @ 159
Have it on word from the White House that they are to be resurrected for “the surge.” That’ll teach ‘em.
Blogical Thought @ 238
Tell you what. I tried to educate you, and it didn’t fuckin’ work. My mistake.
Eat shit and die.
Waccamaw,
no transcript posted yet – gimme a sec and I’ll provide you with some of the figures
1,384 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOEZ ON AND ON AND..
Citizen Montag and the Firepup Patriots:
Don’t feed the trolls…don’t acknowledge ‘em, don’t resond to ‘em and don’t speak their names. You can’t carry on any dialogue with Farenge motherfuckers who don’t understand that all forms of communication including creative and artistic endevors are NOT commoditites.
KEEP THE FAITH AND IGNOR THE BASTARDS!!
hmmm….coffee, thanks.
yup, an interesting guest on WJ and thanks for pointing in that direction. There’s a segment on at 8:30 on cloned food, which I’m afraid probably all tastes the same.
I can’t connect to your blog Marion. Hope it’s just a temporary glitch.
Tweety seems to be changing for the better lately in challenging illogical claims by guests.
g’morning all.
cbl @ 5:03 -
Plez don’t go to extra trouble but would appreciate if you could push me a link if you find the transcript. Tks.
Hey, Mandrake!
NorskeFlamethrower @ 245
Yeah, yeah, I know.
But, that doesn’t mean I like to.
Steve Earle: “But, I won’t back down.”
:)
rumi,
WJ is supposed to have session w/reporter in Iraq tomorrow; iirc – 8:30 – 9:00. Might be some interesting stuff there.
Hi, Waccamaw!
Just woke up [bleary-eyed]
[stumbles for coffee]
Suddenly, I have this premonition of Keith Olbermann covering the Army sending re-enlistment letters to dead soldiers story.
Seems like a natural to me.
mandrake @ 250
Right up his alley :-)
Waccamaw @ 239
Hope this is a trend, but yeah, not holding my breath or anything.
Reporter from the SFC just stuck his foot in a big pile…….mentioned arrest of meat-packing workers w/phony SS#s as way of dealing w/illegal immigration w/*absolutely* nothing said about what has really happened to them. Stooooooopid :-(
Waccamaw @ 249
I believe it’s this lady….btw, PJ O’Rourke at noon today.
Waccamaw -
per Congrerssional Research Svcs -
cost to date: $350B – initial estimate of $50B
$7b/ mo.
$ 1.6B/wk
$250m/ day
the report caught my attention when he made these comparisons
it would cost
$1B to screen cargo ships & aircraft -
= 4 days in Iraq
$1.4B/yr to provide 6k new Border Patrol Agents
= 6 days in Iraq
$4B to provide immunization program for our kids (something the bastards have yet to do!)
= 16 days in Iraq
conservative estimates of 25k wounded, 10k requiring long term care & financial assistance
60B shortfall for repair/maintenance of US Military equiptment
1/2 a Trillion to date – w/ plans to maintain troop levels for another 12 months will put expense at more than all other programs in Fed Budget combined
link to transcripts -
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3719710/
Waccamaw:
Food from Cloned Animals??
What kind of world are we living in?
Great post! I hope this gets picked up in other blogs.
My one question: Isn’t hate speech and call for violence something that we can ask the Dem Congressal leadership to bring to FCC attention. They cracked down on dumb things like fart jokes; this is far more serious.
Also, I bet it is the same ABC/Disney stations who are supporting the nasties like Savage in other parts of the country.
Richmond,
Gilliard front paged it
http://stevegilliard.blogspot……ut-up.html
cbl -
Tks so much!! Was it on Keith last nite (or maybe a Dem somewhere w/in the last 24) who mentioned the VASTLY unrated costs for caring for vets in coming years?
mandrake @ 256
Not one in which I have much “stomach” for living anymore…..food or otherwise :-(
Richmond @ 257
As long as Bush is in office, fart jokes (except those uttered in the Oval Office by Dear Leader) and floppy tits will be serious stuff. Exhorting the populace to assassinate non-Republican elected officials will be trivial matters covered by existing free speech rules.
It’s the Republican way forward….
Waccamaw @ 259
The biotech guy is basically saying that he hopes the FDA will listen to the comments of scientists as opposed to the protests of the unwashed masses who don’t want this (what normal human being would?) So what do we pay these people for? God, is there no end to the greed of these corporations that they even have this guy up there defend this idea?
Sorry, totally OT. But I knew you were watching CSPAN.
Mandrake -
“God, is there no end to the greed of these corporations that they even have this guy up there defend this idea?”
Loved the caller who just referred to him as a “politician” ;-)
Good morning. Some random thoughts on all the discussion above me –
MASH – It was especially good when Dr. Freedman was showing some stress after a guy he had helped was sent back to the front lines and he was killed. He said that he came back to MASH because they were the sanest people in that war. They did not hide their feelings and make believe everything was fine when everything was a disaster. ummm, someone else says everything is fine…
Trains – I am taking the train from Minneapolis to Chicago for YearlyKos. Cost $168 roundtrip and I get to read or talk or whatever all the way. Unfortunately they have eliminated the evening train to Chicago and I have to go on Sunday to be there for the first day but what a problem — to find something to do in Chicago.
Taylor Marsh on Fox News’ treatment of Pelosi. Look at this banner here: “100 Hours to Turn America into San Francisco”
Then they come out with 43% have a favorable opinion of Pelosi.
How can these people be reigned in? Seriously. They are number 8 in cable shows.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/…..37956.html
Here in Minnesota it has been the warmest winter in recorded history. We had a snow storm (10 inches where I am) on New Years Day, and it is almost gone. It rained last night. Everyone is wearing spring jackets and they have canceled broomball — there are no frozen lakes or ponds. The ‘Winter Carnival’ people will be wearing the spring finest. :)
Dang it, you guys, how many times do I have to say it? Last one to bed at LateNite *latch the danged screen door*! I come down to find troll sh*t tracked all over the kitchen.
Anyway, there’s hot coffee and I can toast you some cranberry-orange bread if you like. While I’m cleaning up (grumble grumble).
HotFlash @ 266
There’s troll shit on the floor because the intruder lost sphincter control out of fear….
Waccamaw @ 262
Yes, I got that! Did you catch it at the end where Pedro noted that the guy was a former Congressman?? Oooh, that felt good.
Waccamaw: We will have to start up a CSPAN junkie site (probably are bunches of them out there, who knows? something for everybody) so we won’t get kicked off FDL for being OT.
;)
I don’t know if anyone is collecting sites that are putting the audio clips on the web, but I’ve just uploaded them to my own website (I don’t blog….I just put them up there)
http://www.glcq.com/sprocko.htm
(I haven’t gotten around to explaining what they are, its just a list of the clips and the audio files at this point, but people are free to link to the site)
OK. Just snagged all the clips (grep, sed, and wget can be fun!). Now to notify Disney that I got ‘em and I’m figgering out what to do with ‘em! :-)
You go, Spocko!
I ran across this story over at Daily Kos the other day. A name came up there that didn’t make it over here: Zenia Mucha – Senior Vice President, Corporate Communications, The Walt Disney Company. She has a long history as a Republican storm trooper type. That Disney sees fit to use her as a Senior Vice President tells anyone who knows about Mucha exactly where Disney is coming from.
I put up a long comment over at Kos about her which you can find here. Know the enemy, because they may be coming after you some day.
This is quite off-topic, but, in this Saturday morning, I wish to recommend Sara Robinson’s reflections on the Manzanar camp at Orcinus.
The writing is both poignant and instructive.
Apropos to nothing I suppose except for how sad the world is getting; as a child growing up in the S.F. Bay Area, I was raised on the background sound of KSFO ~ but back in that day it was the home of intelligent wit and good music courtesy of Don Sherwood. I’ve not a doubt…that he’s now cringing from his grave at what the station has become. So depressing……
You can tell that this is scaring KSFO’s right-wing listeners — some of them have taken to trolling the Net to do a little pushback. We got one of them trapped in amber over at Mercury Rising; he thought he was being anonymous, but I could see his IP address plain as day.
Phoenix Woman @
276
Hey, Phoenix! I just dropped by and left a message for your “anonymous” visitor.
EvilDrPuma @ 47
Isn’t SFO the letters for the SF Airport. Somehow that makes them look bad too.
Pectopah @ 278
It is, or at least it used to be. I think it stands for “San Francisco-Orlando”.
Unfortunately, there are a gang of people out there who for usually financial reasons are on dial up – like me. I would dearly love to have transcripts of the sound clips – by using only sound clips, you are ignoring a lot of people.
Any transcrips out there I could use?
Jesus B. Ochoa @
280
I can’t help with transcripts, but there is a new diary with updated info from Mike Stark that may help provide more details.
Josiah Bartlett @ 236
Yes, but I believe the world would be so much MORE different today if they had not been taken from us so soon.
And doesn’t it say so much about what work was left unfinished when a wife of a black Senator fears for his life should he choose to run for President?
i really have to disagree with spocko. he’s at least a third tier blogger…and i should know, i’m on the “a-list of b-listers,” as shystee described it.
Blogical Thought @
227
As others here have pointed out, you don’t know much about Fair Use. As a video producer and as a board member of my local public access station, I’ve been involved in more Fair Use discussions than I care to recount. Bottom line? It’s up to the courts to decide what comprises legitimate use of copyright (note spelling) material.
The question, however, is what gives these public statements copyright protection? I listened to a few of these pottymouth rants posted at Online Blogintegrity and I didn’t hear much beyond hate talk and threats to bodily harm (illegal) and uninspired blather. Is there something original about the content that gives it the status of “original work?” Pretty damn unoriginal thinking, if you ask me.
EvilDrPuma @
47
SFO are the initials for San Francisco Int’l Airport. “San Francisco-Orlando”? Doubtful. San Francisco-Oakland you may be thinking?
Some history of this very old station, for any who may care.
http://www.bayarearadio.org/hi…..ksfo.shtml
What has happened to this station over the years is really sad. I used to listen to it when I was a kid, they replayed a lot of the old classic radio shows like Mystery Theater and The Shadow, although the music they played was for old folks.
Good luck, Spocko, I’ll be writing to those sponsors myself. Fuck the angry mouse.
Mark
thanks for the links (got many from stevegilliard and crooksandliars as well…)
just to clarify, i didn’t break the story, i read about it on another blog…can’t remember which one,sadly — might have been a DailyKos diary actually — but I think mine turns up somehow as the first trackback link. I believe Joe Conason wrote about the whole thing in Salon a month or so ago, on top of that!
In any case, my take was really more on the branding angle (i.e. how both parties were trying to get the brand equity of the other to rub off on themselves) and how that backfired…
keep on internettin’!
Be The Media used audio clips and transcripts from Michael Weiner’s “The Savage Nation” in an official objection to the FCC during KNEW 910AM’s radio station license renewal in 2005.
More here – http://www.bethemedia.org/2005…..o_cl.html.
The license was renewed anyway…