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	<title>Comments on: A Wish&#8230;</title>
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		<title>By: Ivor the Engine Driver</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-425571</link>
		<dc:creator>Ivor the Engine Driver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Dec 2006 15:42:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-425571</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;(Crossed posted from Gilliard’s because I’m tired of writing about this topic.)&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The reaction to Dickerson’s story at Firedoglake and here was truly sad. A simple, easy to comprehend story about a person trying to help a poor family and ultimately failing because the family matriarch is content being a parasite on society prompted vicious attacks on the person who was trying to help! And we’re not talking about the people who routinely frustrate us with their obtuseness, the dumbass wingnuts who couldn’t pour piss out of a boot if the instructions were written on the heel. No, the grotesque attacks on Dickerson were from educated liberals, the group that we keep telling America should be in charge of making the tough decisions. Oof. And we wonder why huge numbers of Americans think liberals have lost touch with reality.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;What can we learn from this debacle? Well, I guess we now know that not all poor people can be helped out of poverty through no fault of the folks offering the help. And quite a few liberals among us have their heads jammed up their asses, which apparently makes it tough to understand simple declarative sentences scrolling across a computer screen.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(Crossed posted from Gilliard’s because I’m tired of writing about this topic.)</p>
<p>The reaction to Dickerson’s story at Firedoglake and here was truly sad. A simple, easy to comprehend story about a person trying to help a poor family and ultimately failing because the family matriarch is content being a parasite on society prompted vicious attacks on the person who was trying to help! And we’re not talking about the people who routinely frustrate us with their obtuseness, the dumbass wingnuts who couldn’t pour piss out of a boot if the instructions were written on the heel. No, the grotesque attacks on Dickerson were from educated liberals, the group that we keep telling America should be in charge of making the tough decisions. Oof. And we wonder why huge numbers of Americans think liberals have lost touch with reality.</p>
<p>What can we learn from this debacle? Well, I guess we now know that not all poor people can be helped out of poverty through no fault of the folks offering the help. And quite a few liberals among us have their heads jammed up their asses, which apparently makes it tough to understand simple declarative sentences scrolling across a computer screen.</p>
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		<title>By: AirportCat</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-425189</link>
		<dc:creator>AirportCat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Dec 2006 03:03:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-425189</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Well, this was a New Orleans post that turned out not to be much about New Orleans … no matter, still worth the read. And thank you for thinking of us. It’s good to know. Y’all come down for Sugar Bowl or Mardi Gras, the merchants down here sure can use some business. And don’t miss Jazz Fest, either. Or Southern Decadence, if that’s your thing. We appreciate it, really.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;That being said, while the Feds and even the State aren’t being a whole lotta help, I have to say we aren’t very good at helping ourselves, except for maybe our Congressman (and many of our elected officials) who are all too ready to “help themselves”. It’s a big part of our problems here.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I’ve lived here nearly a decade now, and hated it most of the time. I hope to leave soon, and get back to Texas. But strangely enough, there are many things I will miss about New Orleans when I leave.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, this was a New Orleans post that turned out not to be much about New Orleans … no matter, still worth the read. And thank you for thinking of us. It’s good to know. Y’all come down for Sugar Bowl or Mardi Gras, the merchants down here sure can use some business. And don’t miss Jazz Fest, either. Or Southern Decadence, if that’s your thing. We appreciate it, really.</p>
<p>That being said, while the Feds and even the State aren’t being a whole lotta help, I have to say we aren’t very good at helping ourselves, except for maybe our Congressman (and many of our elected officials) who are all too ready to “help themselves”. It’s a big part of our problems here.</p>
<p>I’ve lived here nearly a decade now, and hated it most of the time. I hope to leave soon, and get back to Texas. But strangely enough, there are many things I will miss about New Orleans when I leave.</p>
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		<title>By: egregious</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424870</link>
		<dc:creator>egregious</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:56:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424870</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;For the record, we already discussed the India signing statement this morning.&lt;br /&gt;
See: Hubris, Anyone thread.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And Glenn Greenwald is all over this issue.&lt;br /&gt;
We lean on Glenn now and again.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-424642&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;mark @ 42 &lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;How come NOT ONE Democrat (or even one blog I’m aware of)is talking about these signing statements? Bush just used another one on the agreement with India and cut out what the Republican conrolled Congress stipulated.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Just because we have a Democratic Congress, can’t Bush just blow off everything by issuing signing statements? If so, WTF???&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I say they need to publicly throw down the gauntlet and start impeachment proceedings for abuse of power if he issues one more signing statement.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-424367&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;egregious @ 40 &lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-424344&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;twolf1 @ 18 &lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Bush_signing_statement_seeks_to_erase_1219.html&quot;&gt;Bush signing statement on US-India nuclear deal erases Congressional restrictions &lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Imagine my surprise.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For the record, we already discussed the India signing statement this morning.<br />
See: Hubris, Anyone thread.</p>
<p>And Glenn Greenwald is all over this issue.<br />
We lean on Glenn now and again.</p>
<p><a href="#comment-424642"><em>mark @ 42 </em></a></p>
<blockquote><p>How come NOT ONE Democrat (or even one blog I’m aware of)is talking about these signing statements? Bush just used another one on the agreement with India and cut out what the Republican conrolled Congress stipulated.</p>
<p>Just because we have a Democratic Congress, can’t Bush just blow off everything by issuing signing statements? If so, WTF???</p>
<p>I say they need to publicly throw down the gauntlet and start impeachment proceedings for abuse of power if he issues one more signing statement.</p>
</blockquote>
<p><a href="#comment-424367"><em>egregious @ 40 </em></a></p>
<blockquote><p><a href="#comment-424344"><em>twolf1 @ 18 </em></a></p>
<blockquote><p><a href="http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Bush_signing_statement_seeks_to_erase_1219.html">Bush signing statement on US-India nuclear deal erases Congressional restrictions </a></p>
</blockquote>
<p>Imagine my surprise.</p>
</blockquote>
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		<title>By: montysano</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424853</link>
		<dc:creator>montysano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:44:18 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;P J @ 115&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Did you read the comments also? Several people pointed out that the mother is clearly suffering from either chronic depression or PTSD, and isn’t getting any kind of treatment.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Sorry, PJ, but that’s just speculation.  None of us know that.  It may be true; it &lt;em&gt;probably is true.&lt;/em&gt;  But it’s also entirely possible that she’s not an admirable person, someone who refused to climb a ladder that was provided for her.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I lived in New Orleans from ‘84-’91, working at the Convention Center, which had a &lt;a href=&quot;http://montysano.blogspot.com/2006/08/if-you-dont-like-what-big-chief-say.html&quot;&gt;very diverse workforce&lt;/a&gt;.  Some people go looking for the ladder, some climb it when it’s presented to them, and some refused to put a foot on the first rung.  Human nature, I’m afraid, sometimes exacerbated by institutional rascism, sometimes not.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>P J @ 115</p>
<blockquote><p>Did you read the comments also? Several people pointed out that the mother is clearly suffering from either chronic depression or PTSD, and isn’t getting any kind of treatment.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Sorry, PJ, but that’s just speculation.  None of us know that.  It may be true; it <em>probably is true.</em>  But it’s also entirely possible that she’s not an admirable person, someone who refused to climb a ladder that was provided for her.</p>
<p>I lived in New Orleans from ‘84-’91, working at the Convention Center, which had a <a href="http://montysano.blogspot.com/2006/08/if-you-dont-like-what-big-chief-say.html">very diverse workforce</a>.  Some people go looking for the ladder, some climb it when it’s presented to them, and some refused to put a foot on the first rung.  Human nature, I’m afraid, sometimes exacerbated by institutional rascism, sometimes not.</p>
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		<title>By: P J Evans</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424830</link>
		<dc:creator>P J Evans</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:25:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424830</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;montysano @ 115&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;em&gt;And I do think that one of her main points was that the mother was a perfect example of the effects of generations of rascism and being a ward of the welfare state.&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Did you read the comments also? Several people pointed out that the mother is clearly suffering from either chronic depression or PTSD, and isn’t getting any kind of treatment. Steve said, there, that that’s the point he was making. Also they pointed out that Dickerson could have talked to social services much, much earlier, if she’d really wanted to help.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>montysano @ 115</p>
<p><em>And I do think that one of her main points was that the mother was a perfect example of the effects of generations of rascism and being a ward of the welfare state.</em></p>
<p>Did you read the comments also? Several people pointed out that the mother is clearly suffering from either chronic depression or PTSD, and isn’t getting any kind of treatment. Steve said, there, that that’s the point he was making. Also they pointed out that Dickerson could have talked to social services much, much earlier, if she’d really wanted to help.</p>
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		<title>By: Christy Hardin Smith</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424827</link>
		<dc:creator>Christy Hardin Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:20:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424827</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;montysano at 115 — sorry, we’re just going to have to agree to disagree on this one, then — because it seemed like some clear use of language that I found to be condescending, frankly, about these people’s situation.  Look, I’ve been in the frustrated to the point of wanting to smack someone upside the head point with former clients and with folks I’ve prosecuted.  Trust me — I have SO been there.  But, and perhaps it’s because I was just at that conference in DC last week on poverty, inequality, race and the media that the Eisenhower Foundation put on and I’m more sensitive about the language usage as a result — but the Dickerson piece just hit some bells and whistles for me in my reading of it — both the first and second times through.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;This may just be one of those personal perspective things — but, for me, I had a problem with the piece, as you could no doubt tell from my reaction to it.  And that may come from the fact that I get e-mails all the time from decent folks who have been displaced due to Katrina who simply want, more than anything, to be able to have a home.  And are having a whole lot of trouble getting to that point theese days — because of one snafu after another, with paperwork, with perceptions that they are dealing with in new neighborhoods, etc., etc.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>montysano at 115 — sorry, we’re just going to have to agree to disagree on this one, then — because it seemed like some clear use of language that I found to be condescending, frankly, about these people’s situation.  Look, I’ve been in the frustrated to the point of wanting to smack someone upside the head point with former clients and with folks I’ve prosecuted.  Trust me — I have SO been there.  But, and perhaps it’s because I was just at that conference in DC last week on poverty, inequality, race and the media that the Eisenhower Foundation put on and I’m more sensitive about the language usage as a result — but the Dickerson piece just hit some bells and whistles for me in my reading of it — both the first and second times through.</p>
<p>This may just be one of those personal perspective things — but, for me, I had a problem with the piece, as you could no doubt tell from my reaction to it.  And that may come from the fact that I get e-mails all the time from decent folks who have been displaced due to Katrina who simply want, more than anything, to be able to have a home.  And are having a whole lot of trouble getting to that point theese days — because of one snafu after another, with paperwork, with perceptions that they are dealing with in new neighborhoods, etc., etc.</p>
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		<title>By: Christy Hardin Smith</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424815</link>
		<dc:creator>Christy Hardin Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:13:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424815</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Peterr at 113 — while I do appreciate the kudos, I should never have begun with “Are you daft?”  That was uncalled for on my part, which is why I apologized.  SIGH  Must remember to take that deep breath and count to ten before typing in future.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Peterr at 113 — while I do appreciate the kudos, I should never have begun with “Are you daft?”  That was uncalled for on my part, which is why I apologized.  SIGH  Must remember to take that deep breath and count to ten before typing in future.</p>
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		<title>By: montysano</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424813</link>
		<dc:creator>montysano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:12:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424813</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Christie @ 112:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I read both; sorry, I’m not getting it.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;There was a real sadness to Dickerson’s tone; she got no joy out of the situation.  It just was what it was.  And I do think that one of her main points was that the mother was a perfect example of the effects of generations of rascism and being a ward of the welfare state.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Christie @ 112:</p>
<p>I read both; sorry, I’m not getting it.</p>
<p>There was a real sadness to Dickerson’s tone; she got no joy out of the situation.  It just was what it was.  And I do think that one of her main points was that the mother was a perfect example of the effects of generations of rascism and being a ward of the welfare state.</p>
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		<title>By: selise</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424811</link>
		<dc:creator>selise</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:11:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424811</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-424796&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;Peterr @ 113&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;from the choir, here’s an “amen!”.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-424796"><em>Peterr @ 113</em></a></p>
<p>from the choir, here’s an “amen!”.</p>
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		<title>By: Peterr</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/19/a-wish/#comment-424796</link>
		<dc:creator>Peterr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 19 Dec 2006 21:05:18 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;#comment-424778&quot;&gt;&lt;em&gt;Christy Hardin Smith @&lt;br /&gt;
                110              &lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;Okay, apologies for losing my temper.  But do go back and read Gilliard’s piece that I link above.  There are ways to say some people need to get off their ass and do some work and stop expecting everyone else to take care of them without resorting to dog-whistle references and lazy speech.  Which is what Dickerson did — especially if you compare her article to Herbert’s, as Gilliard did, side by side.  Just go read them, look solely at the choice of language, and think about the very different images they are painting.  And do accept my apology for being altogether too crabby — I try not to pop off in the comments, but every once in a while, my redhaired temper kicks in.  Just ask Mr. ReddHedd…  *g*&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Christy, with all due respect . . . &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Popping off in the comments is an &lt;em&gt;ad hominem&lt;/em&gt;-filled foaming-at-the-mouth rant.&lt;br /&gt;
Popping off in the comments is disparaging the opponent’s right to exist.&lt;br /&gt;
Popping off in the comments is treating the opponent as less than human.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Popping off is not what I can ever remember seeing from you. What I see, as in the exchange above, is an impassioned, compassion-filled argument based in reason and personal experience. You call others on their bullshit, and make it clear you don’t want said bullshit going unaddressed. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Above all, you set a fine example for the rest of us. Thanks!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="#comment-424778"><em>Christy Hardin Smith @<br />
                110              </em></a></p>
<blockquote><p>Okay, apologies for losing my temper.  But do go back and read Gilliard’s piece that I link above.  There are ways to say some people need to get off their ass and do some work and stop expecting everyone else to take care of them without resorting to dog-whistle references and lazy speech.  Which is what Dickerson did — especially if you compare her article to Herbert’s, as Gilliard did, side by side.  Just go read them, look solely at the choice of language, and think about the very different images they are painting.  And do accept my apology for being altogether too crabby — I try not to pop off in the comments, but every once in a while, my redhaired temper kicks in.  Just ask Mr. ReddHedd…  *g*</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Christy, with all due respect . . . </p>
<p>Popping off in the comments is an <em>ad hominem</em>-filled foaming-at-the-mouth rant.<br />
Popping off in the comments is disparaging the opponent’s right to exist.<br />
Popping off in the comments is treating the opponent as less than human.</p>
<p>Popping off is not what I can ever remember seeing from you. What I see, as in the exchange above, is an impassioned, compassion-filled argument based in reason and personal experience. You call others on their bullshit, and make it clear you don’t want said bullshit going unaddressed. </p>
<p>Above all, you set a fine example for the rest of us. Thanks!</p>
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