Comments on: We’re Now in Stupid Land http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/ Firedoglake weblog Thu, 16 Feb 2012 09:55:33 -0600 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.2 By: steve gilliard http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-417133 steve gilliard Wed, 13 Dec 2006 00:27:45 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-417133 <p><a href="#comment-416811"><em>kitty @<br /> 78 </em></a></p> <blockquote><p>Steve - odd that you use the word “them” when referring to Americans. Isn’t it “us”? </p> <p>Anyway - going after Sadr now is like lopping a head of the hydra.</p> <p>back to work for me.</p></blockquote> <p>Because it’s a neutral discussion of events. Not one where I take sides</p> kitty @
78

Steve – odd that you use the word “them” when referring to Americans. Isn’t it “us”?

Anyway – going after Sadr now is like lopping a head of the hydra.

back to work for me.

Because it’s a neutral discussion of events. Not one where I take sides

]]> By: Kahoneez http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416965 Kahoneez Tue, 12 Dec 2006 22:48:16 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416965 <p>Oh it’s great to see how people tap dance around trying to manage or fix this home invasion. Sadr is part of the RESISTANCE and the U.S. lapdog media can go along with Bush’s imperialism agenda and label anybody who is resisting U.S. occupation as “radical” ohhh or “militant” ewwww or ‘anti-american” eeek, because the FACT of the matter Sadr is anti occupation and the exceptable facts of all human beings, everybody has the RIGHT to resist occupation of a foreign army, unless of course U.S. occupies your country and changes the reasoning several times. however the facts remain the same Bush’s home invasion to control iraq’s oil, just as the British did in the 1900’s will meet with resistance, and SHOULD.</p> Oh it’s great to see how people tap dance around trying to manage or fix this home invasion. Sadr is part of the RESISTANCE and the U.S. lapdog media can go along with Bush’s imperialism agenda and label anybody who is resisting U.S. occupation as “radical” ohhh or “militant” ewwww or ‘anti-american” eeek, because the FACT of the matter Sadr is anti occupation and the exceptable facts of all human beings, everybody has the RIGHT to resist occupation of a foreign army, unless of course U.S. occupies your country and changes the reasoning several times. however the facts remain the same Bush’s home invasion to control iraq’s oil, just as the British did in the 1900’s will meet with resistance, and SHOULD.

]]> By: presque vu http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416869 presque vu Tue, 12 Dec 2006 21:59:02 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416869 <p>I’d like to see a tabulation of the categories of missions the soldiers have been sent on, since mission accomplised was announced. Not that they’re big on providing details, but for a while there was talk of destroying caches of weapons. </p> <p>Are we handing out guns to the Iraqis we’re “training” with the left hand and confiscating these from the same guys during their off hours as militia with the right?</p> <p>How about a list of activities the troops have been asked to do?</p> <p>Build permanent bases<br /> Guard contractors<br /> Revenge contractors<br /> Destroy weapons<br /> Blow stuff up<br /> Hand out cash<br /> Hand out weapons<br /> Search for kidnapped soldier/bridegroom<br /> “Train” security forces</p> <p>What’s missing?</p> I’d like to see a tabulation of the categories of missions the soldiers have been sent on, since mission accomplised was announced. Not that they’re big on providing details, but for a while there was talk of destroying caches of weapons.

Are we handing out guns to the Iraqis we’re “training” with the left hand and confiscating these from the same guys during their off hours as militia with the right?

How about a list of activities the troops have been asked to do?

Build permanent bases
Guard contractors
Revenge contractors
Destroy weapons
Blow stuff up
Hand out cash
Hand out weapons
Search for kidnapped soldier/bridegroom
“Train” security forces

What’s missing?

]]> By: kitty http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416811 kitty Tue, 12 Dec 2006 21:10:48 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416811 <p>Steve - odd that you use the word “them” when referring to Americans. Isn’t it “us”? </p> <p>Anyway - going after Sadr now is like lopping a head of the hydra.</p> <p>back to work for me.</p> Steve – odd that you use the word “them” when referring to Americans. Isn’t it “us”?

Anyway – going after Sadr now is like lopping a head of the hydra.

back to work for me.

]]> By: rumi http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416599 rumi Tue, 12 Dec 2006 18:24:43 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416599 <p><a href="#comment-416522"><em>jayt @<br /> 55 </em></a></p> <blockquote><p>well, since it’s slow, maybe I’ll post my take on the ISG Report:</p> <p><i>fwiw, my summary of the ISG Report is as follows:</i></p> <p> “Boy, is this fucked up. This Iraq thing is, um, really fucked up. So let’s keep on doin’ what we’re doin’ only this time with feeling and four-part harmony. We’re gonna make a quick list here of the ways in which this thing is, um, well, fucked up. We really gotta try harder. With feeling!. And if that doesn’t work, even with extra feeling and four-part harmony, WHO CARES?! At that point, Mr. President, it’ll be 2008, and your ass will be safely out of Dodge. We’ll see to it.”</p> <p> Signed,<br /> Your Friend,</p> <p> Jim Baker”</p> <p>With appropriate apologies to Arlo Guthrie and all - there it is.</p></blockquote> <p>..and everybody can join in when it comes around again,….here it comes….<br /> ..almost here..coming ’round…here it comes…</p> jayt @
55

well, since it’s slow, maybe I’ll post my take on the ISG Report:

fwiw, my summary of the ISG Report is as follows:

“Boy, is this fucked up. This Iraq thing is, um, really fucked up. So let’s keep on doin’ what we’re doin’ only this time with feeling and four-part harmony. We’re gonna make a quick list here of the ways in which this thing is, um, well, fucked up. We really gotta try harder. With feeling!. And if that doesn’t work, even with extra feeling and four-part harmony, WHO CARES?! At that point, Mr. President, it’ll be 2008, and your ass will be safely out of Dodge. We’ll see to it.”

Signed,
Your Friend,

Jim Baker”

With appropriate apologies to Arlo Guthrie and all – there it is.

..and everybody can join in when it comes around again,….here it comes….
..almost here..coming ’round…here it comes…

]]> By: jinny http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416577 jinny Tue, 12 Dec 2006 17:58:36 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416577 <p><b>Webb Family Birth Announcement</b></p> <p><a href="http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/12/12/125314/86">http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/12/12/125314/86</a></p> Webb Family Birth Announcement

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/12/12/125314/86

]]> By: LimaBN http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416561 LimaBN Tue, 12 Dec 2006 17:45:07 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416561 <p>Is it too late to give the place back to Saddam Hussein and say, “Here - you take it. Guess things weren’t so bad on average, when you were in charge. Fewer deaths, less torture, adequate food, santitation, clean water, schools for the kids. Good luck with it. Oh - and don’t forget to keep the oil coming.”</p> Is it too late to give the place back to Saddam Hussein and say, “Here – you take it. Guess things weren’t so bad on average, when you were in charge. Fewer deaths, less torture, adequate food, santitation, clean water, schools for the kids. Good luck with it. Oh – and don’t forget to keep the oil coming.”

]]> By: Mary http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416560 Mary Tue, 12 Dec 2006 17:44:36 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416560 <p>Great stuff. I haven’t read all the comments and I’m tight for time, so I apologize if I am repeating things here.</p> <p>First up, if you get a chance read thise great NYT op ed piece which actually recognizes why some of our enemies in the area are our enemies and what can be done about that, in our mutual best interests.</p> <p><a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/12/opinion/12press.html?_r=1&oref=slogin">http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12.....ref=slogin</a></p> <p>Next up, Sadr’s nationalist credentials also mean he is agaisnt too much entanglement with Iran, but to an outside observer, they sure seem to have been courting him hard. Hakim, otoh, has strong ties to Iran, so throwing our lot in with him, while continuing belligerence with Iran, is going to be *interesting* at best.</p> <p>Given that Iran has Hakim in the mix, why do they seem to be making efforts to be nice with Sadr? Think maybe they can tell which way the wind blows in Iraq? Iran tieing all cooperation to US withdrawal from Iraq put al-Sadr in a spot where he has to give Iran a head nod. </p> <p>As demonstated by the recent World Public Opinion poll<br /> <a href="http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/articles/home_page/275.php?nid=&id=&amp;pnt=275&lb=hmpg1">http://www.worldpublicopinion......p;lb=hmpg1</a><br /> Iraqis support for the attacks on US Soldiers has grown in lockstep with the Iraqi perception that the US isn’t leaving. Iraqis and Americans both favor a timeline, while Bush and his pick for Iraq do not. </p> <p>Having a campaign to “pick off” al-Sadr is not going to win us those hearts and minds we supposedly need for stability. </p> <p>*sigh*</p> Great stuff. I haven’t read all the comments and I’m tight for time, so I apologize if I am repeating things here.

First up, if you get a chance read thise great NYT op ed piece which actually recognizes why some of our enemies in the area are our enemies and what can be done about that, in our mutual best interests.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12…..ref=slogin

Next up, Sadr’s nationalist credentials also mean he is agaisnt too much entanglement with Iran, but to an outside observer, they sure seem to have been courting him hard. Hakim, otoh, has strong ties to Iran, so throwing our lot in with him, while continuing belligerence with Iran, is going to be *interesting* at best.

Given that Iran has Hakim in the mix, why do they seem to be making efforts to be nice with Sadr? Think maybe they can tell which way the wind blows in Iraq? Iran tieing all cooperation to US withdrawal from Iraq put al-Sadr in a spot where he has to give Iran a head nod.

As demonstated by the recent World Public Opinion poll
http://www.worldpublicopinion……p;lb=hmpg1
Iraqis support for the attacks on US Soldiers has grown in lockstep with the Iraqi perception that the US isn’t leaving. Iraqis and Americans both favor a timeline, while Bush and his pick for Iraq do not.

Having a campaign to “pick off” al-Sadr is not going to win us those hearts and minds we supposedly need for stability.

*sigh*

]]> By: Dr. Bong http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416551 Dr. Bong Tue, 12 Dec 2006 17:37:26 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416551 <p>Close, Busted.</p> <p>:-)</p> <p><a href="http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/the-bright-shiny-object-defense/">Linky</a></p> Close, Busted.

:-)

Linky

]]> By: Fini FiniTOOBZ! http://firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416549 Fini FiniTOOBZ! Tue, 12 Dec 2006 17:36:57 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/12/12/iraqis-consider-ways-to-reduce-power-of-cleric/#comment-416549 <p><a href="#comment-416535"><em>EvilDrPuma @ 65</em></a></p> <blockquote><p><a href="#comment-416534"><em>jayt @ 64</em></a></p> <blockquote><p>and Fini - may I take this opportunity to compliment you on your compassionate (Christian?) approach on the thread regarding the death of Jeane Kirkpatrick the other day?</p></blockquote> <p>I’ll have to second that. The worst I’m going to say is that I’m sorry she wasted her life with such blinkered ways of seeing the world.</p></blockquote> <p>Thank you to both of you. I just hate it when people refuse to see the humanity in a person, no matter how reprehensible they behaved while here, they still are mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers and friends to others who may have lived a beautiful life but now are in pain due to the death of their loved one. </p> <p>Also, you have to respect someone that achieves an office such as Ambassador of the United States. People who serve in those positions do not necessarily espouse the policies of the administrations they represent. We do not know if she argued against Reagan’s atrocious Latin American policies in private. Either way, her soul is in the hands of God now.</p> EvilDrPuma @ 65

jayt @ 64

and Fini – may I take this opportunity to compliment you on your compassionate (Christian?) approach on the thread regarding the death of Jeane Kirkpatrick the other day?

I’ll have to second that. The worst I’m going to say is that I’m sorry she wasted her life with such blinkered ways of seeing the world.

Thank you to both of you. I just hate it when people refuse to see the humanity in a person, no matter how reprehensible they behaved while here, they still are mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers and friends to others who may have lived a beautiful life but now are in pain due to the death of their loved one.

Also, you have to respect someone that achieves an office such as Ambassador of the United States. People who serve in those positions do not necessarily espouse the policies of the administrations they represent. We do not know if she argued against Reagan’s atrocious Latin American policies in private. Either way, her soul is in the hands of God now.

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