
RevDeb sent me a link to an article from 2003 about the death of President John F. Kennedy that contained a portion that I wanted to share with all of you today:
It was not the product of party or ideology; rather the reverse. For all his amused affection for his brawling fellow Democrats, Kennedy was a skeptical partisan at best. "Sometimes," he said more than once, "party loyalty demands too much." He was even more skeptical of ideology. Liberals, he said, "tend to underestimate the importance of winning"; conservatives too often "close their eyes to society's needs." Predictably, he was viewed with suspicion by both the left and the right. Liberals eschewed him for Adlai Stevenson at the 1960 Democratic National Convention; conservatives stampeded to Lyndon Johnson at the convention and to Richard Nixon in the general election. But Kennedy did something no politician had done at least since Theodore Roosevelt. He electrified much of a generation, many of whom had previously neither known nor cared about politics and government.
His famous call to "ask not what your country can do for you" is now so well known it's a cliche. Who remembers today how radical a departure that was from the lunch pail political rhetoric of the 1940s and '50s? Who had ever run for office before by asking us to give rather than take?
Politics in the 1950s — at least in image — was the province of greasy, balding fat men with wet cigars and wide ties. They were the ward heelers and aldermen and lodge brothers of a Ralph Kramden America, leavened out with the occasional plutocrat or statesman. They brokered candidates in smoke-filled rooms and wore funny hats in chaotic conventions where they thronged as much to get away from their wives as to choose our leaders. Younger political hopefuls had to butter them up or buy them out and wait their turn to run. Elections were "delivered" by "passing the word." Predictability was political gold. New ideas and faces were suspect, and politics usually catered not to the best in us but to the worst.
Onto that scene sailed John F. Kennedy with a gospel of sacrifice and vigor. The youngest president ever elected to the White House took us in a whole new direction. He invited artists and musicians and Nobel laureates to the White House because he said he wanted to celebrate the best in our culture. He played touch football and unleashed a fad for 50-mile hikes, because, he said, we had physical challenges to meet as well as mental ones.
He'd been a cipher as a congressman and only mildly attentive as a senator, but he grew with his responsibilities. He called for a New Frontier that would test us with something like the challenges our grandparents had met. He was hip and funny and smart as hell. He took the world situation seriously, but unlike most of the old pols posturing around him, he didn't seem to take himself seriously at all. He was almost flip about the pain of his lifelong back problems — made worse by war wounds — and the tragedies in his life. "Life isn't fair," he told us "but government should be."
Kennedy's genius as a leader was to appeal not to the worst that is in us, but to the best — and to make that appeal tug at our heartstrings and our brains at the same time, planting little ideas that if we would only stretch a little bit further, that we might be able to reach a star.
President Kennedy's famous acceptance speech to the New York Liberal party nomination in 1960 is ever inspiring. But it is this segment that always lifts me out of my chair and onward toward a duty to my nation and my fellow man, and toward a better version of myself:
I believe also in the United States of America, in the promise that it contains and has contained throughout our history of producing a society so abundant and creative and so free and responsible that it cannot only fulfill the aspirations of its citizens, but serve equally well as a beacon for all mankind. I do not believe in a superstate. I see no magic in tax dollars which are sent to Washington and then returned. I abhor the waste and incompetence of large-scale federal bureaucracies in this administration as well as in others. I do not favor state compulsion when voluntary individual effort can do the job and do it well. But I believe in a government which acts, which exercises its full powers and full responsibilities. Government is an art and a precious obligation; and when it has a job to do, I believe it should do it. And this requires not only great ends but that we propose concrete means of achieving them….
Many of these same immigrant families produced the pioneers and builders of the American labor movement. They are the men who sweated in our shops, who struggled to create a union, and who were driven by longing for education for their children and for the children's development. They went to night schools; they built their own future, their union's future, and their country's future, brick by brick, block by block, neighborhood by neighborhood, and now in their children's time, suburb by suburb.
Tonight we salute George Meany as a symbol of that struggle and as a reminder that the fight to eliminate poverty and human exploitation is a fight that goes on in our day. But in 1960 the cause of liberalism cannot content itself with carrying on the fight for human justice and economic liberalism here at home. For here and around the world the fear of war hangs over us every morning and every night. It lies, expressed or silent, in the minds of every American. We cannot banish it by repeating that we are economically first or that we are militarily first, for saying so doesn't make it so. More will be needed than goodwill missions or talking back to Soviet politicians or increasing the tempo of the arms race. More will be needed than good intentions, for we know where that paving leads.
In Winston Churchill's words, "We cannot escape our dangers by recoiling from them. We dare not pretend such dangers do not exist."…
This is an important election — in many ways as important as any this century — and I think that the Democratic Party and the Liberal Party here in New York, and those who believe in progress all over the United States, should be associated with us in this great effort. The reason that Woodrow Wilson and Franklin Roosevelt and Harry Truman and Adlai Stevenson had influence abroad, and the United States in their time had it, was because they moved this country here at home, because they stood for something here in the United States, for expanding the benefits of our society to our own people, and the people around the world looked to us as a symbol of hope.
Hope is very powerful. Hope in the hands of a people who are inspired to reach even further toward a dream of a better society is more powerful still. Let us all take President Kennedy up on his challenge, and rise up together to reach for the stars.




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JFK, R.I.P.
Here’s another bit of history, courtesy of my friend Cathy:
“Frederick Douglass, the renowned abolitionist, began life as a slave on Maryland’s Eastern Shore. When his owner had trouble with the young, unruly slave, Douglass was sent to Edward Covey, a notorious “slave breaker.” Covey’s plantation, where physical and psychological torture were standard, was called Mount Misery. Douglass eventually fought back, escaped to the North and went on to change the world. Today Mount Misery is owned by Donald Rumsfeld, the outgoing secretary of defense.”
John FITZgerald Kennedy!
Thank you for giving both of these pieces a bigger audience.
Many of us were alive to remember the hope that was palpable when JFK was elected and was shattered when he was killed. I don’t know who or what will step into the void that we still feel these 43 years later.
May he rest in peace and may the hope he inspired keep inspiring us to do better and be better.
Christy,
Thom Hartman has used Kennedy’s “I believe also in the United States of America” speech you concluded with a few times on his program. It was taped on audio, possibly on video. Hearing JFK say it with utter conviction makes an indelible impression.
JFK, RFK and MLK.
Where would our country be if these lives had not been taken from us?
Thanks for the thread, Christy, and right on!……”Kennedy’s genius as a leader was to appeal not to the worst that is in us, but to the best — and to make that appeal tug at our heartstrings and our brains at the same time, planting little ideas that if we would only stretch a little bit further, that we might be able to reach a star.”
Grandmaj from previous thread: Sophomore, 6th hour Chemistry class. And your comment was so appropriate — for four days the world stopped.
History is a great vehicle. Kennedy’s gets polish after tarnish. Again and again.
My father is the same age. He was so thrilled to have a young president, one his age, when JFK was elected.
Jackie was only 34 when he died. One thing that has impressed me was her quick study on the “state funeral.” I wonder how many of us would have had the ability to plan that in the immediate aftermath of the/her experience of Dallas?
I give her a lot of cred for what she came up with.
Kennedy was the beacon for so many Catholics and Hispanics in my region. It was a tragedy to lose him so early, regardless of the lead up to Vietnam. Polish, tarnish. Polish.
“Politics in the 1950s — at least in image — was the province of greasy, balding fat men with wet cigars and wide ties.”
…….sounds like Boss Tweed.
RevDeb — thanks so much for sending that article along the other day. It’s very well done, and was a great read. Much appreciated.
The State of the Union address is usually a big statement of policy prescriptions, and the rhetorical takes a back seat to the political. But JFK was a master of blending the two. Here are a couple of interesting – and timely – excerpts:
From 1961, just a few weeks after taking office:
From 1962:
From 1963:
Partnership and accountability in governing, holding the nation’s ideals up to the world, and leaving fear astern . . . Timely indeed.
In the words of the funeral liturgy, “Rest eternal grant him, O Lord, and may light perpetual shine upon him.”
ccmask @ 9
Or Rush Limbaugh.
Thanks for the memory. I saw him campaign in Springfield’Ohio from the back of a railroad car. Probably the last time in American history that was done for real, and not as a publicity stunt. I watched the address on TV as an inexperienced ward attendant in the psychiatric wing of Columbian Presbyterian hospital. It was a cold winter. Cold in Washngton and there was ice on the Hudson. I was one of the Stevenson supporters, and was slow to warm to him, mainly because of his reluctance to push ahead on Civil Rights legislation (though we know how hard it was to get anything through the Southern-controlled caucus). His death marked all of us. I was working at the Peace Corps in Washington at the time, where a lot of people had known him personally. His death was devastating. Seems so long ago, now, and yet still like yesterday.
Peterr at 11
Not SOTU but one of my favs:
“For in the final analysis our most basic common link is that we all inhabit this small planet, we all breathe the same air, we all cherish our children’s future, and we are all mortal.”
(Speech at The American University, Washington, DC, 6-10-63)
My favorite, “Profiles in Courage”
Jack
Christy Hardin Smith @
10
The printed out article was in one of my Thanksgiving files so when I went through planning for this week’s service, I read it and remembered why I printed it out. It was one of those pieces of writing that transport you to another time and place. So well done. You read it and then sit with it for a while. I am SO glad that it was still available on line. Thanks for sharing it with everyone.
Meanwhile, I see that Giuliani has filed his paperwork with the FEC this week. McCain is going to run. Mitt Romney is obviously going to run.
Why?
Why is any one of these individuals planning to run for president? What does any of them think he offers? Is it just that they feel entitled, or have nothing else to do?
Sheesh.
EvilDrPuma at 17 — ego?
Christy Hardin Smith @ 18
Pretty much. And that’s one reason that none of these wannabe candidates holds a candle to JFK. Sure, Kennedy had an ego, but he also had ideas and purpose. These bozos just think they deserve the job for its own sake.
Throw the bums out.
EvilDrPuma @ 17
There are so many promising types that you wish would run for office, yet every presidential cycle we seem to end up with a choice of trying to figure out who is the lesser of two evils.
I can’t remember ever casting a vote in a presidential general election that I was happy with. A few inspiring votes cast in the primaries, but never in the general.
Repbilicans, however, truly were thrilled to vote for Reagan.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 18
With WIllard, its all about his chiseled jaw and good hair. Beyond that he’s got nothing! Really, NOTHING. He just cut the budget to screw the homeless and mentally ill. There is no way that the activists in MA aren’t going to hold up every glaring misdeed and non-deed of the past 4 years up for the country to see. There’s no there there.
For all his flaws, JFK knew the power of words and challenged his countrymen to aspire to be an example to the rest of the world.
looseheadprop @ 20
“The soft bigotry of low expectations” was at work there, and tell me that isn’t ironic. Then we got Bush the Lesser, proving an evolution toward “the hard bigotry of no expectations.”
I agree, though. I was too young by ten years to vote in 1976, but Carter was the last presidential candidate I could say I would have felt genuinely proud to vote for. That’s thirty years ago! And the GOP talking heads are trying so damned hard to stuff a Hillary Clinton candidacy down our throats, as if we’ll believe that (gender notwithstanding) she’s the best we can do.
43 years ago we were all pumped-up, because at O.L. Slaton Jr. High at 1 O’clock, we were going to have an assembly featuring the “Velateens” … a very hot band.
There was a lot of grumbling in the hallways when the P.A. made the announcement for everyone to return to their home rooms.
trinityone @ 22
Yes, and who is doing that now? Really doing that–not indulging the cynical parody that BushCo has brought.
JFK had flaws. As far as I can tell, they never hindered his performance in office. Bush is nothing more than the sum of his flaws.
I remember well that day 43 years ago. I was in seventh grade science class when the school PA system told us that the President had been shot. Everyone put everything away quietly. When we passed through the halls, my homeroom teacher was in tears. We went home early that day and for the next four days we were all glued to the tv.
The images that come back are the black riderless horse with the backwards boots, the horse-drawn wagon with the coffin, and little John John saluting it as it went by.
The memories still bring overwhelming sadness to this day.
This is one of the problems empires suffer. The emperors never measure up to the supposed splendor of the empire.
When we were a republic, many of our leaders, like the last of them, JFK, did measure up.
Since then, one disappointment after another.
I know he’s taken a beating at FDL, but here goes: Obama might be the closest these days to JFK. Sure he’s cast a stupid vote in the Senate, but read his books, listen to him on the stomp for other candidates, consider his unusual background, and come to your own conclusions.
But please: keep an open mind.
One of my heroes (Trudeau and Clinton included).
I can only imagine where America would be today if this great man didn’t die (on the day I was born FFS!) so soon and so tragically.
I won a company value award a few years back. The prize was a painting of JFK. I see it everyday when I sit down at my desk at home. He still inspires me and this thread does to.
Thnx Christy.
OT– Dangerstein was chatting with Mrs. Greenspan on msnbc– the title below his mug said “democratic strategist”
Andrea said that Nancy can’t count votes (wrt Murtha).
blech. I sure hope they get rid of both of them soon.
angie @ 30
That’s two laughs in two words.
JFK Speech on Secret Societies and Freedom of the Press
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v…..&eurl=
I know EvilDrPuma– I nearly fell over from the sudden rise in blood pressure and total contempt.
bittersweet: the date of JFK’s assassination is also my wife’s birthday.
Those who have tried to extinguish the eternal flame will burn in eternal hell for their efforts. ~ me
No more killing, or it’s over, and the mystery won’t matter anymore ~ Kris Kristofferson
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3rxm17Soz3c
I think perhaps one of our greatest tasks is restoring the reputation of government as a force for good. Republicans have gotten a long way by being relentlessly anti-government; worshipping the so-called “free market” while asserting that government is the problem, telling people that their tax money belongs to them, and that all of it is wasted. And as much as they have pushed those falsehoods, they have falsely characterized liberal views as being automatically the opposite of theirs (if they’re anti-tax and we’re not, we must be pro-tax; if they’re for small government – hah! – and we disagree, we’re therefore for big government.)
I hope that out of the floodwaters of Katrina and the corruption laid bare we can rebuild an understanding of the place of government. That, to paraphrase Arthur C. Clarke, government should be just “as large as necessary.” That the free market is efficient at producing things that are profitable, but if profit does not align with social good, it will not produce social good. That taxes are the price we pay for maintaining our civilization, and while no one likes paying them, taking advantage of their benefits while asserting no obligation to contribute is wrong.
While government by the people has often been imperfect in the past, and the tools of mass communication have frequently been used to undermine government and help the powerful escape its strictures for their own benefit, I believe we have an opportunity to use the new tools of mass communication and participation to make government of the people, by the people, and for the people more of a reality than ever before. I believe this is the task, the duty for our time.
punaise @ 34
Are you married to Jamie Lee Curtis or Mariel Hemingway?
John Fitzgerald Kennedy. I remember thee. And it will remain thus. Abraham, Martin, Bobby, Yitzhack Rabin and Anwar al-Sadat. And Rachel Corrie. Precious people to me.
This is a very good question, it’s just too bad that it is impossible to find what the aspirants really think.
Lots of people have a higher opinion of their worth than can be justifiably derived from their past performance. I’m reminded of a study that hints that the less well informed, more dogmatic individuals may not have the wit to assess their own shortcomings, while their intellectual betters may see their own flaws and are dissuaded from seeking higher position in society. A perverse kind of sorting that winnows the wheat from the chaff, and then trows the wheat away.
angie @ 33
I wasn’t going to sully a JFK thread, but with this reminder I may as well utter my daily affirmation now:
my contempt for Joe Lieberman will never subside.
Thanks, Christy, for your memorable article on this,the 43rd. anniversay of JFK’s death.
Those of us able to remember that black day certainly have it etched in our consciousnness:
It was early on a Friday evening in Germany. I and my husband, a U.S. Army officer stationed in Frankfurt, had joined 2 Army friends for dinner at our favorite restaurant. Word swept through the room about the fatal shooting of JFK. Everyone was stunned, shocked into mass sadness. Germans waiting on the tables had tears rolling down their faces. (Later during that weekend, German residents everywhere had candles burning in their windows for the fallen American leader). President Kennedy had visited Germany in the recent past, giving his famous “Ich Bin Ein Berliner” speech…..He was appreciated and loved there.
- Valerie Sanford, Los Angeles
Peterr @ 37
both. we live in Utah.
as i was driving in to work today, i recalled this day 43 years ago. i was wondering if anyone else would remember. and then i came to the lake for some refreshment and i got my answer. thank you revdeb and christy
I was sitting in the cafeteria at college having a cup of coffee. The noise of conversation dropped to zero when the announcement came over the PA. It remained silent for the rest of the day, and was somber in all my classes for the next week.
Redshift @ 9:11:
From the end of the 1961 State of the Union:
Controversy can be healthy, and proud public service is a badge of honor. Today, the administration outs undercover public servants like Valerie Plame Wilson, stifles dissent and even discussion within its own ranks (see NASA, NIH, CDC, FDA, and anyone involved in climate study), and measures service by proximity and loyalty to the current occupant of the oval office.
How sad.
We can do better, and I do not doubt that we will.
punaise @ 42
Thank you folks, we’ll be here all week . . . try the turkey.
Camelot. Oh I yearn for Camelot. Never again to be.
jeffreyw @ 39
I remember reading about that study, too. It dovetails nicely with the studies that say depressives actually have the most accurate perceptions of themselves; everyone else thinks they are better than average on everything.
Oh, man. Just got the list of participants in a forum in which I’ll be participating in a couple of weeks…and it’s quite the intimidating list of folks. Yikes! Guess I’d better get to work on my speech…
kristinejoy @ 48
Speaking as a depressive (I’m fine at the moment, thanks!), I have to call that a pretty cynical conclusion. My self-perception when in a funk are in no way accurate–they’re just negative. I suppose that becomes accuracy in comparison to an overblown estimation, but perhaps a more objective assessment would be better still?
Christy Hardin Smith @ 49
You’ll impress the hell out of ‘em.
My parents are of the same generation as JFK and Jackie Kennedy. I’m looking at a photo here on my desk of my sister and I going to Easter Mass in about 1966 looking like little Jackie clones with our white gloves, hats, and dresses with matching jackets. In our house, we loved JFK and RFK because they were like us – ethnic, Catholic, hard working, and a respect for human dignity regardless of social level. They were very good men who had their heads and hearts in the right place. Mom can still be brought to tears over their deaths, even today. I was too young to remember JFK’s death, but remember how horrible 1968 was with the losses of both RFK and MLK. I don’t think I could appreciate what was going on but I remember my parents’ reaction and the feeling that something important was over.
Like T-Rex, I wonder what our country would be like today if the Kennedy boys and MLK had lived. It’s rare to find the needed levels of strength AND compassion in single people.
if we look back at the ‘00 elections and think “what if..?”, do that in reverse and think back at the ‘60 election and think “what if”…
think Cuba missile crisis with Nixon on the button, and the world could have been a barren wasteland…
I surely did sully the thread with those names, punaise.
sorry, all.
I was a tot at home in D.C. on November 22, 1963 and saw my mother crying and watching tv– she never did either in our presence; she was always too busy caring for all of us. My dad was shaken, too. I had never seen my parents so sad ’til then.
There was a deep quiet and sadness in our home for days.
He was a giant to so many and a beacon of hope.
Evil at 51 — I’m honored to be asked to participate in this, frankly. It’s a conference that the Eisenhower Foundation is putting together on poverty, race and the media and on the issues that do not get nearly enough discussion in our society these days. My ongoing discussions regarding Katrina aftermath and on child abuse and neglect and other issues on class and social justice apparently caught someone’s eye over there — but the list of folks who will be speaking to these issues over the course of the day is really a wonderful one. Looking forward to hearing everyone else and talking with them about all of the issues we’ll be covering on panel discussions.
dachoste @ 53
Thankfully, we don’t live in that parallel universe.
OT
What ever fate Rumsfailed has in store, he can’t suffer enough.
I may write a play , I’ve got the title and the opening line :
” Rumsfailed’s First Day In Hell “
{ The Devil }
Donald, you come to Hell with the soul you have, not the one you want.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 49
I’m having a hard time coming up with anyone who would intimidate you, Christy.
Now the list of folks who would make you want to stand up and deliver your very best . . . that list gets pretty long pretty fast. Just off the top of
my headthe thread, I come up with angie, Impeachment Happens, witchywoman, RevDeb, Ed*ard Teller . . .Go get ‘em, Christy, whoever they are and whatever forum it is.
kristinejoy @ 48
Depressives have the most accurate perceptions of the world. They have no illusions. They see the world as it really is.
43 years ago today I was a callow freshman at our small town high school, 700 students in four grades, and there was nothing from school that day I remember other than the grim news.
What I can remember from those days are the numbed looks on tear streaked faces, the stifled sob from Cronkite, the bloody dress Jackie wore, the photo of the hasty swearing of LBJ, the salute from the forlorn child, the muffled drums down Pennsylvania Avenue. I’m crying now as I type. For what we lost, and for where we are today. That man is still president.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 55
We know what you’re capable of, and I for one am glad to have the likes of you making public statements on those issues. You’re going to do yourself proud.
Biodun @ 59
If I really believed that, I wouldn’t just be depressive, I’d be suicidal.
JFK also saw the Fed for what it was: http://www.john-f-kennedy.net/…..r11110.htm
America: From Freedom to Fascism (1h50m)
http://video.google.com/videop…..;q=freedom
I remember where I was the day Kennedy ws shot. I was five years old and my Mom was ironing and listening to the radio broadcast from Dallas when she suddenly broke down in tears. I remember saying, “Mommy, are they going to shoot us all?”
JFK’s death was my loss of innocence.
6 years after his murder, I watched the first moonshot lift off from, what was then, Cape Kennedy. 20 years after his death, I joined the Peace Corps. And now 43 years later, his words still mean so much to me, and my country.
RevDeb and Christy, thanks.
Thank you RevDeb and Christy for memorializing this sad day. My fourth-grade teacher stepped out of the classroom, returned red-faced to dismiss us from school, telling us something bad had happened to the President but not to listen to older kids on our way home. Then she started crying. I arrived home to find my nana crying in front of the black-and-white, on which Walter Cronkite who also appeared to be crying. Mom arrived home shortly thereafter, crying. Dad, too. Everyone but my four-year-old brother was crying that day. He and I really bonded; I’d had little use for him before. But, that day, being away from crying grownups had real value.
Riderless horse.
Cassion.
Drums.
Fatherless lad saluting.
Pain on brothers’ faces.
Like yesterday.
CHS 55 — I note that Ambassador Wilson has been a previous panelist for the Eisenhower Foundation. Think of it this way: you’re following in the footsteps of friends.
You’ll do fine, Christy. Just be yourself, a mother, a writer, a lawyer, an experienced prosecutor — and passionate about what you believe and what you do.
Ever notice how it’s mostly the political and social liberals that get murdered?
Oklahoma kiddo @ 67
If that is true, it’s because it’s mostly the political and social reactionaries who think a gun has the power to solve a problem.
Two days later …… The shock of seeing Lee Harvey shot live on TV.
That’s went TV officially turned into an 800 lb. gorilla.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 67
A mere statistical aberration. You know. Like the ‘04 exit polls.
FDR:
My very first involvement in Democratic politics was in the fall of 1960 (I was 12). JFK did a campaign stop in Mt. Clemens MI. My local Democratic committee asked me to play their calliope at the rally, mounted on a trailer with a gas engine run blower (not steam). I played some marching songs and other patriotic airs.
The Kennedy campaign people had arranged for a band to accompany them. The calliope was so loud that it was drowning out the band a block away.
I was asked to stop – a pre-presidential command non-performance.
I was in the library (were I had been when the Cuban crisis resolved) when the news came in 1963. It felt like the world had ended, That hope had died.
one world ended on 11/22/63 and another one began that took me through Vietnam. God, do I miss that person…especially, when I see or hear the current wasted form who comes from crawford…
Christy … Just picture everyone in their under ware.EvilDrPuma @ 68
I was trying to think of an American Right winger that has been killed by someone other than his own people, George Wallace maybe.
EvilDrPuma @ 50
Objective assessment of self-perception? Good luck with that.
And this is established in the literature. If you ask people to rank themselves compared to others in the room, or predict how well they will do on a test, people who test positive for depressive symptoms are more accurate in their self-assessments than the typical population.
My comment says nothing about the ravages of an illness so painful that it incapacitates and kills.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 67
On the other hand, if a rightist monarch (all monarchs are rightists) gets shot, it can lead to a world war. Look at World War I.
I’m a very hard sell when it comes to conspiracies. But I have never found satisfaction with the Warren Commission’s conclusions surrounding the death of JFK.
Bush is a comma in a Hague sentenance.
This is what I keep trying to say. What part of “electrify much of a generation, many of whom had previously neither known nor cared about politics and government.” do the Democrats not understand?
I remember Kennedy and I remember King – they knew how to speak – it’s as simple as that. There is no one being considered for the Democratic nomination who comes within a country mile of having the necessary quality. Whoever says Obama simply doesn’t get it. The man is tongue-tied and tentative. Forget about Obama; forget about Kerry; forget about Gore; forget about Hillary; forget about Edwards. You can argue their relative merits but not one of them has more than 10% of what’s needed.
WAKE UP DEMOCRATS! YOU’RE BLOWING THE BEST OPPORTUNITY IN DECADES!
RevDeb at 26 said:
The images that come back are the black riderless horse with the backwards boots, the horse-drawn wagon with the coffin, and little John John saluting it as it went by.
Thanks for bringing another memory so very clear to me today that I have tears in my eyes. I, too, watched that horse during the funeral procession, and I watched that horse prance, and fight the bit and the man holding him. The soldier never wavered and the horse went along. It so reminded me of Kennedy’s energy. And I longed for the horse to get away (this was a 17 yr old horse lover talkin) and fly across the fields and be free of earth and all the pain here.
I wonder whatever happened to that horse after the funeral. I hope he had the greenest of pastures, and the best of hay, and never saw a saddle or bit again. O.K. I am crying even more.
Oh, yay! The Peanut’s Christmas dress just arrived in the mail. :) But I’m a little worried it will be too small in the size that I ordered because she is so tall. Will have to wait until after nap time and try it on her…
obsessed — apparently you didn’t catch this speech in January?
Christy 81 — not to worry if it’s too short; could whip up a little underskirt with a matching/complementing trim along the hem. Keep me posted, this kind of thing only takes about 30 minutes to whip up.
As for speechifying, nobody in recent memory could beat Barbara Jordan in my estimation.
Rayne at 83 — I got her those cute little snowflake tights to go with it — they have an adorable little red ruffle on the behind. hehehehe She is going to look so adorable in it, but she has sprouted up another inch or so since I ordered the dress. Eeep! How do you keep up with them at this age and clothes?
Christy — best of luck sending the ‘prettiest dress ever’ back, no matter whether it fits or not. Once a pretty dress is on the prettiest of little princesses, that dress does NOT come off. My daughter has a 7 yr old princess with imaginery friends and she must always wear her prettist of princess dresses when ‘entertaining her friends.’
sofistic at 84 — Barbara Jordan was amazing and mesmerizing when she spoke. The only person that I can think of who comes close in public rhetorical ability would be the Cuomo speech to the DNC back in the 1980s. I can remember sitting transfixed in front of our television, soaking in his speech. Wonderful stuff. One of these days, I’ll have to see if there is a YouTube of it floating around somewhere.
dachoste @
53
Nixon would have invaded Cuba waaaaay before then.
The dress is adorable – like a little Missie Claus! Did she get the purse, too?
I was only 11 at the time, but Novemeber 22, 1963 is a day that will burn in my memory forever. After hearing in Homeroom that the President had been shot, we were let home early and we were glued to the TV for the next 4 days. Those of us who were old enough to remember those following days do so with a sadness that has been unrelenting over the years. I will think again today of the future that we collectively lost and how it could have been had Jack, Bobby and Martin not been taken away before their time.
Peterr @
58
Yikes! – but, thanks, Peterr. If I intimidate anybody here, please understand that it is only to get practice for the real work of intimidating the opposition.
Off topic, but I hope some here might be interested in helping this woman, or at least helping spread the word about her situation
Please help Lee Kitchen, and help spread the word
You know, this describes Mr. Patrick J. Fitzgerald, and probably why some of us like him. I think one of the Kennedys was his dad’s hero.
JoyB at 89 — no, didn’t get the purse. That tends to end up being a “weapon used on the dachshund” sort of thing at this age. *g* And I figured that PJ (our doggie) deserved a Christmas present of her own…so I didn’t order the purse. lol
I can’t edit, so let me just snip it down to the part I meant to compare to FITZ:
Teddy at 9:36
My earliest memory.
the boots, backwards in the stirrups.
I was 3.
At my Grandmothers house.
CHS 85 — heh. Good question. Kids always seem to have a growth spurt IMMEDIATELY before an event for which one has already spent an inordinate sum of money to dress them.
And it gets worse. My daughter has a recital in two weeks; her black pants that were too big in the waist in late September are now too tight, even though she LOST 10 pounds. Go figure.
And shoes. OMFG. I have to buy her new dress shoes she will probably wear once, and they’ll be too big for me. She outgrew a pair of athletic shoes inside a month; no problem, since they fit me, but now I have to buy a pair of black dress pumps and they’ll last about two wearings and maybe 6 weeks.
As for the pretty red dress – eh, let it be. If she’s got the little ruffles that are meant to be flashed anyhow, you’re all set, not worth the hassle. But please, Christmas, get here fast before another growth spurt!!!
Christy – brace yourself for the American Girl Doll force in future years
punaise at 98 — shhhhhhh…I’ve got another year or two before that even becomes an issue. Although Santa (in the form of the lovely UPS man) also delivered some presents that I need to sneak and tuck away before little miss snoopy wakes up from her nap…
Horsey’s gone now too:
http://www.equinenet.org/heroes/blackjack.html
There’s going to an awful lot of happy kids this Christmas. But there will be a whole bunch of little ones who will miserable. You can be poor, but if you have a loving family, then Christmas can still be wonderful. But if you’re a kid from a dysfunctional, and especially an abusive and violent family setting, Christmas will be like any other day. Horrible, horrific and horrifying and most likely very painful. I have a special place in my being for these poor little souls. Please don’t forget these tiny guys.
Bustednuckles — you’re only months older than me. This is one of my earliest memories, too, black and white television, the boots in the stirrups backwards, my mother looking sad, the caisson passing. I seem to recall drums marking out a slow cadence.
I remember the same kind of look on my mother’s face after the Apollo launchpad fire; I was old enough to ask what happened at that point, though, already in school.
I wanted to compliment Christy on her post on Iraqi military training. This is a story that really needs to get out. Bush throws around slogans like there is a real content to them but they are just fig leaves for disaster. Anything beyond the most cursory examination of programs to “train the Iraqi army” is enough to expose the empty rhetoric at their core.
As for John Kennedy, he was a very flawed man and President but he was perhaps the last President who was able to appeal to the better angels of our nature in a way that did not make us feel self-conscious and foolish.
OK at 100 — we’ve got 12 stockings to fill up this weekend for the Salvation Army, and another four or five backpacks to fill for kids at the local Mission as well. It’s a rough holiday season this year for folks on the margins — so if you can afford to help out, I know most organizations could really use a little boost this year. At least that is true for the ones around here.
punaise @
98
I’ll say this much about Hanna Andersson clothes and American Girl products. Their qualty is quite high, and when our daughter went through those phases, any returns to those two companies were handled quickly and courteously. Both companies have been fairly (AG) and unfairly (Andersson) criticised for catering to white tastes and being patronizing when dealing with racial issues and stereotypes, but they’ve dealt with those issues.
May I sully this thread with the Gossip Chatz question WaPo took from some EssEffer (sockpuppet!) about the Great Purse Snatch of Buenos Aires?
Biodun @ 28
Obama is in bed with a very dirty influence peddler in Chicago. I don’t care what he says, I care what he does. And what he does either does not impress (as in his lackluster record in the Senate) or actually disturbs as in his suspect connections back in Illinois.
One of the most moving speeches I’ve ever seen and this is going to come as a shock was from Dubya. It was before he was governor of Texas and was a about baseball. I think it just played locally. It was basically about how relationships may come and go, relatives pass, and wars come and go. But to a baseball fan, it’s something that’s always there, a constant. I’ll never forget it. He probably didn’t write it! LOL
Rayne @ 101
I’m still cryin’, remembering .
I’m guessing the pickpocket didn’t even know he was ripping off a president’s daughter–just thought she was a rich American tourist with cash.
what a rude shock then, to find out that the credit cards were maxed out
Batting 1,000 this morning!
I really am startled the GossipChatzers took this one….
I was in my sixth grade classroom when the news came. They rolled these huge TV’s into the classroom and we sat there all afternoon in shock, teachers crying in front of us. The father of one of my good friends was an FBI agent and I remember her saying that there was a lot of tension in her house for weeks afterword.
But the weirdest thing was the atmosphere at home. My John Birch Society republican/history major dad was in some strange combination of gleefulness, shock, and sadness. It was, like everything else about his life, unpredictable and conflicting. Not that I have any stuff, mind you.
thanks for this one.
twas just about NOW, eastern time.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 100
This is so true. As a former foster care social worker, I urge all you to think of giving to a fostercare agency in your area. Even such simple things as duffle bags and luggage, as so many kids end up on the doorstep of their next (5th…10th…15th) placement with all their possessions in trashbags.
Okay, everyone else who submits questions must be on the road, since I got a GossipChatz three-peat:
kristinejoy @ 112
This is the saddest, most moving holiday donation idea I’ve ever heard. I’m motivated.
I met JFK Jr. once.
In fact, he graciously took a few hours out of his day to advise me on a magazine startup I was involved with. What I took away from that meeting was the sense of civic obligation he had; he met with many like me as a matter of course, as his civic duty. Say what you want to about the Kennedy’s, but civic duty seems to be the family tradition. That seems to be so obviously the core of this JFK speech, and is what we so clearly lack as a nation now.
Which gets us back to the current reigning clan, the Bushes. The thing about George Bush is that he could have called us to greatness again. He had the opportunity. In fact, Bush has had more opportunities than any president since Roosevelt to call this nation to greatness and has failed every one of them. He does not have it in him; he has been the disastrously wrong man for the time. In fact the realists of the world are now having to admit that the disasters of the time are in large part due to him, going back to his failure as Commander in Chief to protect this country on 9/11.
It is not so much a matter of hubris. That implies a certain level of character that can be undermined. He is a man without any discernible character at all. His religious blather is a pose designed to create the outline of character where none existed before. And he is such an empty vessel he may even believe it himself.
But after all is said and done, it is obvious that George W Bush is but a muddling failure hoisted upon the world by a corrupt political machine that, in its current incarnation, can never ever be allowed to regain power again.
I am a Democrat because of John Kennedy.
That election was the first I really remember, and it must have been really hard on my rock-ribbed Republican father to vote against the Catholic (if he did, he really loathed Richard Nixon) but my mother was a solid supporter. It was just clear that he was the brightest star in the heavens, and I still feel the power of his call to service. It led me to ROTC during Viet Nam, even though I hated the war. As Kennedy taught, by example and word, it is a mark of citizenship to answer the call of the Nation in its time of need.
Funny how the temperament of the President affects the times, probably through the press, but consider Kennedy, Nixon, Reagan and the current Bush. Kennedy worked the press in ways they probably didn’t expect. He could do a press conference at the drop of a hat, with a command of the language, wit and a reasonably clear idea of what he wanted to say to them.
Nixon walked out to the podium and one immediately imagined him checking to see if he had toilet paper stuck on his shoe, or that he was hiding something. And then he lectured the press as if they weren’t capable of understanding what he was saying. There was always the sense that he thrived on contentiousness and if he didn’t get it, he would manufacture it.
Reagan was so highly stage-managed in a faux Gary Cooper-ish, aw, shucks, way that it was always difficult to know what he thought (probably why the press enjoyed the banter and ignored the lack of substance). But, the aura he wanted to generate was, “hey, things are great,” and the press and the people bought it.
This current president is both small and mean-spirited and even more obsessed with winning for the sake of winning than even Nixon. He’s openly hostile and threatening to the press and this latest election showed that he’s also openly hostile to half the electorate. He’s lied to everyone, he’s the most inarticulate President in modern history and seems never to have grown up.
So: Kennedy–general feeling in the public of optimism and belief in the possibility of beneficial change (which improved as time went by).
Nixon–contentiousness in society, adversarial relations between many subsets of society and a sour mood about where the country was going.
Reagan–everyone either terrified by Reagan’s jabbings at the Soviet Union or lulled to sleep waiting for him to get past, “Well, I uh, I uh, I uh….” But, everyone thought things were great, even when they weren’t.
Bush–the most politically divided time in the country since the Civil War, and never another time where more people were ashamed of and embarrassed by their government than now, and never a time in modern memory when there was so much uncertainty about the competence and mental stability of the leadership. More public bitterness and rancor than I can recall. Bush has turned family Thanksgiving dinners into battlefields, same as he’s done for a good part of the world….
Christy Hardin Smith @ 85
You avoid the temptation to shop ahead. In the past 18 months Littleprop has growm almost 4 inches. And her waist size keeps pluctuating. So my old habit of buying things to put on the shelf at the top of the closet for her to “grow into”, not workin’ anymore.
We are now at a point where we go shopping for the outfit less than a week before the event
JoyB @ 95
Yes, on all counts
TeddySanFran @ 114
I used to work for FamiliesFirst which is headquartered in the bay area. They also have a good history of supporting gay foster parents, even in Fresno, where I used to work. But there are many smaller agency doing good work. On that topic, there are organizations working with gay youths on the street and getting them back into the system through specifically recruiting gay foster parents to foster them. This has proved to be a difficult undertaking, unfortunately.
Thanks for the thread, Christy. Better half arrives home soon and in the interest of getting laid tonight, I’m relinquishing the tubes pre-emptively.
montag,
I picked up a book at the Kennedy Library that was a collection of all his writings with press gaggles and everything else. Reading his answers to the questions posed to him by the press is no less inspiring than the “big” speeches he gave. The man was amazing in his grasp of issues, sense of humor, understanding of public service and leadership abilities. The book is called Let the Word Go Forth, copyright 1988. It’s a keeper.
retirin’ at 121 — good luck in your quest. Planning is always good, having her arrive home with her favorite music going and a clean kitchen? Almost a guarantee, just so you know. ;-)
Looseheadprop – regarding your comment at 20 – I have to disagree about the ‘lesser of two evils’.
I think that both John Kerry and Al Gore would have made excellent presidents. Say what you want about the campaigns they both ran, but actions speak very loud to me. The actions John Kerry took both during and shortly after the Vietnam war speak volumes. Ditto to Al Gore’s clear passion regarding Global Warming and his unambigous support of the Internet and technology.
These two men are giants compared to Bush, Cheney, Romney, Giulani, McCain, Allen, and any other Republican you or I can think of.
nicely summarized, ccobb & montag.
We need to also remember the limitations put on Al Gore in his thirst for service during the Vietnam War, having a pop in the Senate, and the agony that presented to LBJ.
randiego @
124
I’m with you on Gore, but Kerry was, and is, deeply flawed. Saying he’s a giant compared to Bush, Cheney, Romney and friends is setting the bar pretty low.
Yes, Kerry’s actions during and after Vietnam were exemplary, but the fact that you have to dig back that far to find examples of his leadership is telling. I just think he’s been in the Senate too long, and that’s muted his natural leadership ability. He was an infinitely better choice than Bush, but was in my mind 4th or lower among the available Democrats (I was a Wes Clark guy, FWIW.)
Anyway, not sure why I’m joining in this particular topic 2 years after the fact, other than it’s the day before Thanksgiving and I’m stuck at work.
Christy – thank you for this thread. I was only two when Kennedy was shot, but even at that age I understood well the significance, by absorbing the effect it had on my family.
The best selling record album of all time (prior to Dark Side of the Moon I think) was the album of Kennedy’s speeches. I’m now the proud owner of the one my family owned and listened to.
new thread upstairs – there’s a pop quiz…
Hi Christy and ‘pups -
Christy, thanks for your clear and moving remembrance.
I look forward to the day that public service – rather than private profit – is again the fundamental objective of our Executive Branch.
Thanks to all who shared their memories of those very dark times here. One of my earliest memories is John-John and the riderless horse.
I was so sad that he had lost his Daddy – being only three, I could not imagine a greater wound.
I’m not sure our nation could endure any greater wound than JFK’s assassination. When I look at what has happened in our national values since 1963, I’m not persuaded that America did endure JFK’s and RFK’s assassination.
Langley, however, flourishes.
————-
Christy, whatever panelists may be there will be fortunate to hear your clear reasoning, careful and precise expression, and passionate concern for those most in need.
I wish I could be there to watch people learn from you.
Tony – okay a good point about Kerry, but still – compared to the smirking fratboy jackass that we ended up with, he looks pretty good.
I think he would have found himself – those leadership abilities – had he been elected.
montag at #117: Right on! This kind of analysis is precisely why I’m hooked on FDL. Brilliant, cogent postings (Christy, Jane, Trex, and others), and thoughtful, thorough, analytical comments like yours.
One of the most moving things I’ve ever seen:
The people lining the streets in DC on their way to see JFK lying in state. Our house was near the Library of Congress and if I remember right, there were people going by for 3 days. All us kids in the neighborhood were shocked, had no way to make sense of why this happened.
On that dark fateful day I was on a train from Baltimore to New York City to join friends for a long planned bon voyage celebration of a former classmate who was moving to Paris. As I was boarding the train an anxious father approached me with his teenage daughter in tow. To her great embarrassment he explained it was her first solo trip to New York and would I “mind very much keeping her company”. I remember her red face when he assured me her mother would be meeting the train at Grand Central.
We boarded and I asked her if she had a seating preference, meaning window or aisle seat. She said the club car would work just fine and no sooner than we had settled she pulled out a pack of Camels and ordered a Coke. I laughed (and relaxed) for we weren’t that distant in age. She was a high school senior and I was in my first year of grad school.
When our train pulled into Philadelphia a group of Nuns boarded and made their way down the aisle. My young charge suddenly addressed a middle-aged Sister: “What’s wrong,” and touched her arm gently. Tears streamed down the Nun’s face.
“The President was shot in Dallas” she said sadly as she clutched her Rosary beads and moved on to another car. A younger nun held a transitor radio to her ear and another fought back tears streaming down her face.
We held out hope he would survive yet as the train pulled into Grand Central the faces of those waiting on the platform signaled the worst.
My young charge and I held hands in the crush to exit the train and find her mother. A trio of my friends greeted me and gave us the bad news, confirming all our worst fears. Our President was dead, murdered by a madman – perhaps I should say murdered by mad-men.
I wrote up my experiences that weekend in a blog post three years ago. A black bleak day and weekend.
My kid is the same age now that I was when JFK was assassinated.
She looked over my shoulder just now [at the illustration] and asked me “who is that daddy?”
I wish she could read these comments and understand.
But I will quote her following classroom assignment:
Dear Bush,
I need you to make world peace please and if you can’t do that just make friends with the other preisedent or find something that you have in commen or something like other than fighting and more like making peace.
[two hearts as signature]
I have to go bawl now.
EvilDrPuma @
68
That holds true for the assassination of Yitzhak Rabin, as well.
There is no doubt that there was a conspiracy behind the murders of JFK, RFK, MLK, JFKjr, and even MalcomX.
These leaders all represented the people and not the military industrial complex that wants war and money. All were gunned down by “nuts” … gimme a break. If you belive that I have a nice bridge to sell you.
We live in the illusion of a Jeffersonian democracy… but whenever a charismatic leader steps forth they take him out. No one can challenge their agenda and their power.
The are in the government in the intel services, in the military and we are powerless against them. They control everything and step in when they have to.
They only took in a trillion in Iraq.. but are looking for more appropriations… right about now.
While I remember JFK with very positive feelings, a read of Sy Hersh’s The Dark Side of Camelot is really needed to understand the reality of that politics, those times. The assassination was the very tip of an iceberg. Once you begin to understand that Jack Ruby was a government agent, you begin to understand where people are coming from who wonder at the events of 9/11. In those Camelot days we thought the official story was more or less the story. How naive.
Obama is in bed with a very dirty influence peddler in Chicago. I don’t care what he says, I care what he does.
I care less about what he says or does than about HOW HE SAYS IT. I don’t want another Republican president in 2008. Call me shallow but listen: I’m not THAT old (52), but I’m obviously the oldest one here because you guys just simply DO NOT GET IT – Obama cannot speak – period – maybe he’s better than Kerry and Gore – but in terms of what it really takes to become president – he’s not even close. You need to find some old video of Kennedy or King to see what I mean.
I think that both John Kerry and Al Gore would have made excellent presidents.
I think so too – but we will never find out because neither one of them has the charisma and communication skills to make it to the White House.
Sometimes I get sick of hearing about the Kennedys. It’s like a tape which repeats or an advertising campaign.
But, the comments on this thread have been heart-breaking and inspired and that is something worth reading.
It doesn’t pay to be too morose, but memorials are to briefly recall the past, to recall the battles won & lost, the great personages, the moments which shaped us as individuals and as a country. JFK, MLK and RFK are forever together in our hearts and memories. We continue the ‘war’ for peace and prosperity for all.
Thanks fdl.
obsessed @ 142
Okay, I think I’m going to get EPU’d here, but I disagree with the above opinion on Al Gore.
I think Mr.Gore has undergone a metamorphosis since his run for the White House. He’s shown he’s not afraid to call things as they are. He’s also shown that he has the ability to relate to a crowd, as seen in the presentations of the material he explored in “An Inconvenient Truth”. He jokes, he provokes thought, and he speaks truth to power. His previous woodenness has given way to a concerned husband, father, grandfather and patriot who wants to see that our world will turn back from the brink for his kids, their kids, and the generations yet to be born. I think this is his time, even more than when he ran for President. I think what happened to him in 2000, as he quoted his father, “shook his soul” and “let the glory out”.
I can only believe that it is time for America to embrace a President that has learned from his own mistakes, is humble enough to realize he may not have all the answers, but has America’s best interests at heart, not his own. Our next leader must have a stomach of cast iron, a backbone that won’t quit, and the intelligence to grasp and implement what needs to be done. We need a statesman to clean up the mess of the last six years. I think Mr. Gore is the only one with that ability.
IMHO, YMMV,
-S
Well, I voted for JFK in 1960. First Presidential Election, except that my mom had allowed me to make the X on her ballot for FDR in 1944.
I certainly remember 22 November 1963, Found out about it when I arrived at a service station where I had an appointment to have my car greased and oiled — and the mechanics were all crying over the little table radio. Twas a poor grad student and Civil Rights Organization employee in those days, so no TV yet. Had to go visiting to see the funeral and all. But I do have a somewhat different take on Kennedy. (And I would agree, read Seymour Hersh’s book — or Richard Reeves more recent political treatments.) For instance, I actually doubt whether Kennedy had the skill to move Civil Rights legislation through congress — but Lyndon Johnson did have those political skills. Johnson was culturally an old New Dealer, Kennedy had been understood as weak by Eleanor before the 1960 election, and she never really changed her estimate before she died in 1962. This isn’t to take anything away from the impact Kennedy had on many Americans, particularly my generation just coming into political participation, and who knew the sleepy old types from the Eisenhower years, and delighted in the generational change, but Kennedy simply did not have the kind of centering political philosophy such as the New Deal around which he built his administration. Johnson, on the otherhand more or less finished the New Deal — Medicare, Medicade, Updated Social Security and of course Civil Rights. Kennedy could not arm twist Congress, because his sexual life was something of an open secret in Congress, and he was thus vulnerable. Johnson had the goods on everyone, thus he could threaten with the best, including Hoover. So while it is right to remember what we all lost that day, it is also important to temper it all with good political analysis.
Man, this is the second Kennedy remembrance I’ve come to.
Weird.
I was telling my husband how you think of Kennedy and his class and elegance when with world leaders and then flash to today and chimpy abroad. Groan.
This is where we’ve come from Kennedy’s vision of a great America. Chimpy.