
Well here is an interesting piece of information in this morning's NYTimes article:
Other suggestions surfaced on Wednesday that Mr. Foley’s undue interest in pages had previously been known. Representative Deborah Pryce of Ohio, a member of the leadership, asked the current clerk of the House, Karen L. Hass, to investigate reports raised this week in a [Republican] party conference call that Mr. Foley was once turned away from the pages’ living quarters and that the staff in the page program had raised concerns about him with the former clerk. (emphasis mine)
Well, that IS news, isn't it? And just how long have the folks on that GOP conference call known about this?!?
I mean, honestly, when you put that together with the e-mails the page sent in with the "sick, sick, sick…" notation and the questions raised there, aren't you beginning to see a bunch of huge red flags that ought to have been considered together as a big pattern of behavior on the part of former GOP Rep. Foley that warranted more than simply sweeping it under the rug…again…for political expediency's sake?
Since Fordham's resignation from Rep. Tom Reynolds' (R-NY and chair of the RNCC) staff yesterday, a new flurry of statements and counterstatements has been flying. Thought it would be useful to connect some dots. From the NYTimes:
“I had more than one conversation with senior staff at the highest levels of the House of Representatives, asking them to intervene when I was informed of Mr. Foley’s inappropriate behavior,” Mr. Fordham said after resigning from Mr. Reynolds’s staff. “I have no congressman and no office to protect.”
Mr. Fordham said he had informed Mr. Palmer of the concerns while working for Mr. Foley, after the House clerk, Jeff Trandahl, approached him. Mr. Trandahl told him, Mr. Fordham said, that pages had come forward with accounts about Mr. Foley’s behavior. Mr. Trandahl, who resigned his position last year, did not return calls on Wednesday.
The accounts did not include accusations of overtly sexual advances and did not involve e-mail or instant messages of the sort that surfaced last week, Mr. Fordham said. Instead, they encompassed reports that Mr. Foley had been “way too friendly” toward the pages, he said.
Mr. Fordham said that he could not recall the specific date of his meeting with Mr. Palmer, but that it was between 2001 and the end of 2003.
A spokesman for Mr. Hastert, Ron Bonjean, issued a statement in Mr. Palmer’s name saying, “What Kirk Fordham said did not happen.”
Again, there is no reporting on any paper trail on this. For a Congressional official to not have paper documentation for CYA purposes is unusual, frankly — although in cases where sexual harassment or worse are feared, in the corporate world, anyway, there is often an effort to try and sweep the problem under the rug and avoid liabilty within the business entity by NOT documenting anything in writing — keeping everything verbal, so it's harder to trace for a potential litigant. Some serious questions need to be asked about this — and about how things must be handled in the future in terms of documentation — because members of Congress ought not to be given some protected status when it comes to the safety of the teenage pages who work in their halls.
Howard Kurtz has some more notes on Fordham this morning as well.
So you had the top aide to the House's senior GOP campaign guy trying to keep the seedy details out of the media. No wonder some critics are charging cover-up. That's what's driving this whole thing, the sense that key Republicans were more concerned with the politics of the Foley mess than protecting the teenagers he was hitting up online.
That's a good summary of some of my questions, I'll say that much for it.
Rep. John Shimkus (R-IL) says the pages were more protected in the page program than a lot of kids are in their own homes. I'm sure the upstanding parents who sent their children to participate in this program are feeling loads better about it now — and that Mr. Shimkus' constituents are feeling loads better about the high standard to which Shimkus and others in the Republican leadership hold themselves in caring for the children under their supervision. Nothing like "we're better than a lot of people who sexually abuse their own kids" as a standard, eh?
Perhaps Shimkus should read the Chicago Tribune, with whom I agree wholeheartedly in this sentiment (something you don't hear from me very often):
Young people have served as congressional pages for 177 years. The best way to protect them is to severely punish anyone who takes advantage of them.
Absolutely correct. Members of Congress should be treated no differently than any other member of the public when it comes to protecting children from predatory sexual harassment or other behaviors. Period. No one should be given a pass in terms of the law just because of their status, their power, their connections or their ability to sweep things under the rug — and the Republican leadership in Congress should get this message loud and clear from everyone, because what has occurred up until now is simply unacceptable.
Sydney Blumenthal has a review of this, and reading through the Foley contacts in the article is truly nauseating. The WaPo has even more — reading the two together is disturbing, and shows a clear pattern of behavior in terms of Foley's actions. Something the Republican leadership in the House could have discerned from requesting an investigation into this when intitial questions were raised about Foley — something they did NOT do. It took a news organization to take this problem seriously…how's that, Denny?
And Denny Hastert is ducked an interview with a non-wingnut radio announcer who planned on asking him tougher questions than what he got from Hannity and Rush. Hmmmm…crappy leadership and a chicken. Lovely.
Let's review, shall we: (1) Foley may have been turned away from the pages' living quarters at some point. (2) The staff of the page program has raised concerns about Foley and impropriety of his relationships with young pages. (3) There are news reports that Hastert and others in the Republican leadership were notified as early as 2001 about problems with Foley and the pages. (4) E-mails are turned in by a page to Rep. Alexander's staff and others with the notation "sick, sick, sick…" coming from the page. (5) The House Republican leadership does not disclose this information to the House page board but, rather, it goes through the political hierarchy of the leadership via Shimkus, to Reynolds, to Hastert…and no further. (6) After learning about all of this, Reynolds still pushes Foley to run for re-election in his district. (7) Reynolds' chief of staff (now resigned) goes to Florida to help Foley do damage control, and to deliver a message from the NRCC chair that Foley has to resign only after ABC news begins to report on this issue and investigate the matter — which leads to even more egregious internet correspondence which shows a clear pattern of explicit sexual contact with minors in the House Page program. (On one occasion, during a vote on the House floor.)
Does that about sum up what we have here? Have I missed anything? Blergh. Had enough?
Oh, and a big thank you to Keith Olbermann for raising the accountability issue with regard to FOX's mis-labeling of Foley as a Democrat on O'Reilly's show. Turns out they tape the show hours in advance…which just makes the whole thing even more egregious, doesn't it?
Related posts:
- Connecting The Eyeliner Dots On the Rove Role In DOJ Firings?
- Wherein Lies the Fort Hood Intel Failure? Connecting Nidal Hasan’s Dots
LeadershipWhite House Threatens Freshmen Who Won’t Vote For Supplemental- Why Does Johnny Isakson Want to Kill Sarah Palin’s Baby?
- And Now, a Few Words from Rep. Alan Grayson





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Fitz
She shoots, she scores!!!
The crowd goes wild.
Oh and go click on Imm’s Zazoo condoms link from tha last thread, I just laughed myself silly
JUSTICE WILL BE DONE.
And this from this morning’s Wall Street Journal: Republicans Caught in a Storm:
Re Democratic Senate:
Webb is now speaking of Iraq as “an occupation.” Yay!
President Clinton will have a fundraiser for Webb in a couple of weeks.
Sure wish he’d help Lamont out more.
Look, it’s pretty easy to figure out. If the Republicans can’t take reports with titles like “Bin Laden Determined to Strike in US” and powerpoint slideshows that say “Al Qeada is gonna attack in a month or two” and figure out that Al Qaeda is gonna attack, then they sure as shootin’ aren’t gonna figure out that a guy with peepee in his hand standing outside the pages’ dorm is perv.
Had enough?
And Foley was reportedly drunk when he tried to get into the pages’ dormitory.
But don’t you think that Hastert is toast already? George Stephanopolous on ABC last evening said that he had not talked to a single person on Capitol Hill, R or D, who thought that Hastert would be Speaker again — and in his view Hastert would be gone by the end of this week (today and tomorrow, right?).
If Hastert does take the fall, will this go away in the public’s mind — or is there enough momentum to drip-drip-drip some other falls — Boehner and Reynolds, among others?
yam @ 6
OK, That’s the one I love.
That’s the comment I would like to plagerize and use as my talking point today.
You just made sale here.
Dennis bin Laden? Is there a cave under Hastert’s house?
Prf,
I think Boehner and Reynolds are toast.
Reynolds was holding on by a thread for re-election anyway. I gotta ssume that this will cause Rahm, Howard, whoever, to scrape the bottom of the campaign funds barrel and find a little more $ to throw up some ads to kill him off completely.
So this could be a wholesale decapitatoon of the Housed leadership. The screwed up badly trying to pin it on Fordham and now it’s backfiring on them.
Plus, i posted a link near the op of the last htread, supposedly they feds are looking at reports invvolving kids in Fla. too.
I think this will play out into next week. Some kid who was intimidated into silence, will see all this and spillhis guts to his parents.
btw, thought everyone would get a kick out of the connect-the-dot elephant. *G* Couldn’t help myself!
http://thinkprogress.org/
Opens mouth long enough to change feet…
Thinking about Hastert bunkered down, I’m trying to find out where my Representative, Don Young is hiding. So many of these GOP Reps are used to coming back to their safe districts at the pre-election recess, and avoiding all debates but the mandatory minimum, avoiding comment about loose threads they may have left untied back in DC, and showing up only for the safest of speech and interview formats. Short of those safe zones, a lot of them are open to accusation these next two weeks for hiding from their constituents.
We need to keep spotlighting, writing letters to editors, working for our progressive candidates, and putting in 14-hour volunteer days all through the first week of November.
GAWD, is this speech bad. “The dog ate my NCLB credibility!”
Mr. 18% JAR weighs in:
http://thinkprogress.org/
Great one yarn!
Sort of more relevant to last thread, but I have been having lots of one-on-one intense political discussion lately. Using my values, and the values of our candidate Carol Voisin, (ala Lakoff) to sway voters.
A student’s parent went off on the “they’re all corrupt” meme and I took off with it. Said I completely disagreed, that there are a slew of great candidates with value and urged her to visit Carol’s website to see if, in fact, her values matched up with her own. Talked about how I am involved in my first campaign specifically because of values and asked how people like Foley, DeLay, and Hastert represented her interests? She had no answer. Said she’d rather not vote then vote for someone who is corrupt and said she’d visit the website. Progress, one person at a time.
Another was a left-leaner who had the same message, they all suck, changing the party won’t change the system. In her case I explained Crashing the Gates, and that it would take time, but again hit her on values. By the end she said she’d vote even if it was only on our race. Progress, one person at a time.
And more from the interesting Wall Street Journal article:
Wetterling will get more exposure on Saturday with her nationwide platform. Meanwhile, the R opponent made a remark just slightly more concerned about children than Tony Snow’s “naughty e-mail” remark:
Bad, naughty, go sit in a corner for 15 minutes and then come back and play with the children.
Disgusting.
Anne at 14 — well, I bet that has Hastert’s campaign manager jumping for joy. *snerk*
So Hastert has gone home to his fortified house- has locked the door and thrown away the key. The man mountain paces back and forth and neighbors feel the earth shake. What ta do- what ta do.
It’s clear that once the parents who originally complained said that they were satisfied- The man mountain figured he was off the hook- he had not a moment of concern about the hundreds of parents who had NOT complained- or the hundreds who were yet to complain as he left this finely tuned genetic mutation in the house of representative without even instructing the moral idiot to stay away from pages.
Let’s face it Denny- ya fucked up- and now yer waiting behind closed doors to see just how much of your irresponsible behavior comes out so you can figure out whether you can respond to it- or whether you should follow your death wish and give it up.
Give it up Denny- give it up. Buy yerself five or six whole cows and retire.
Christy: Excellent post, as always.
[grammar police] First para after second blockquote:
sexual harassment or wore are feared
worse?
[/grammar police]
When Jesus looks upon the life of George W. Bush, I like to think that he will view it as, just a Colon.
From TPM — Mark Foley, Republican Sexual Predator, had a history with Pages going back to at least 1995; and 1996; and 1997 . . .
boosh: “I thank the teachers for teachin’, the parents for lovin’ and the students for readin’.”
I swear to all of you, that was the worst speech of his life– he doesn’t know the subject!
if it ain’t about terrarism or evildoers, he is clueless.
Faux News indentifying Foley as a democrat.
Just trying to be fair and balanced!!!
Who didn’t see this coming? After the emails were exposed, you knew it was going to get worse and worse for the Republican leadership.
Once you start pulling a single thread of this kind of misconduct, it’s only a matter of time before the entire sweater will become unraveled.
Wow!
Glenn Greenwald absolutely nails Howard Kurtz of the WaPo:
Howard Kurtz’s role in the Foley story
It would be impossible to post just a few quotes from Glenn’s analysis. No one sentence is more important than all the others. Read it all.
OK, a teaser:
and just one more:
The WSJ has cut them loose. I wonder how the placated parents are feeling about their Kool-Aid now?
Also, the STUDDS STUDDS STUDDS folks are out trolling the blogosphere today. I wish someone in the media–maybe Our Keith?– would fire a shot of CRANE CRANE CRANE across their bows.
And who else is checking their passport for a Bizarro-World entry stamp upon seeing Newt Gingrich wringing his hands at all the terrible, terrible Democratic scandals? I’m guessing that a man who married his high-school teacher AND his intern has some insight into inappropriate relationships, but I’m not sure I want to hear that insight…
Has anybody said “heckuva job Denny”, yet?
How many heckuva job jagoffs have we collected now?
KO’s Special Comment tonight is being promoed as…Hypocrisy in Washington
Oops. Time to slow down and give credit where credit is due.
Christy, the connect-the-dots elephant is terrific!
But I’m afraid to get out a pen, lest I see some truly disgusting goings-on under that elephant.
looseheadprop, I don’t mean toast (Boehner, Reynolds, Shimkus) in individual elections. I want the toast of resignations, one week at a time, over the next 5 weeks.
Well on the one hand, the goopers want to build a wall to protect us from Mexicans- but they don’t wanna do shit ta protect pages from fucked up goopers. Go figure!
Ed*ard Teller @
9
That would have to be one heck of a spider hole.
Christy,
Someone should do a whole “connect the dots” activity book with the events of the last 6 years. It’d make a great drop-off piece for door-to-door canvassers to bring along for the kids while talking with the parents. It’d be especially great for Colleen Rowley’s campaign, but also good elsewhere.
Connecting the dots is such a great visual metaphor – easily understood, and easily applied. The evidence that the republicans in power can’t seem to do it just piles up higher each day – and the mess with Hastert and the House leadership is just the latest mess.
Heck, you’d probably have to leave a book for the parents, too! Fun for the whole family!!
What the goopers need now is somethin like the wolves video they used with such great success in 04– but instead of wolves the fearsome creatures must wear turbans,look gay and speak mexican. That should save congress for em.
GOP is the Potemkin values party.
afterthought @
34
That’s lovely.
Of course, Howie Kurtz would accuse you of “red-baiting” for that comment.
Yesterday one of the news channels was repeatedly showing a clip of Hastert taking off his coat- an virtual circus tent- and sitting down in a chair at a meeting.
The pathetic looking chair shivered as the man mountain settled his portly bulk into place- one could hear the wood beginning to crack and split– meanwhile- aids were positioning a crane for the grim job of getting the man mountain up again.
Has anyone seen anywhere any apology from any of the Republican leadership to any of the pages who were caught up in this? Any sense of remorse at all? Anything of that nature? I’ve been trying to find that in any of their statements, and I’m coming up with a blank on this. If anyone remembers something like this, I’d appreciate a link…because I think that is a HUGE gaping hole, and absolutely appalling, but I don’t want to level that charge without being able to back it up — and I don’t want to miss something on this. There has been so much written and said inthe last week, but I haven’t been able to find anything that says “I’m sorry” to these kids or their families from any of these people. Thoughts?
Just had a thought, from reading a term over at AmericaBlog:
The Republicans are no more qualified to conduct a War on Predators than they have been capable of conducting the War on Terrorism. We need new generals in both.
(meme-testing)
Experts have computed that if Hastert were to resign, retire, and move to the border–the first 10% of the wall to protect us from Mexicans will be in place.
rwcole @
33
LMAO.
rw at 36 — I know you probably didn’t mean it to sound this way, but sometimes people have weight issues for a variety of physiological reasons that they cannot help, and those sorts of comments about heavy-set individuals can be very painful for them. Having a dear friend who is morbidly obese due to such an issue, I know this sort of thing really makes her wince, and I just wanted to point that out for everyone to think about when talking about Hastert. Thanks.
I don’t know if its been posted yet Redd, but Keith O will have a new comment at the end of his show tonite!
This Foley thing leaves me feeling like I’m waiting for the other shoe to drop. Dunno what it could be but I feel like there’s going to be something coming from it.
Saw Rep.Chris Shays in debate on CSPAN this morning. I just love the way he tried to spin “what did Democrats know and when”. Sounded like he came there straight from FauxNews.
Prof @ 38
On NPR’s Wait, Wait Don’t Tell Me this weekend, someone said that the War on Drugs has created more drug users and the War of Terror has created more Terror. I shudder to think what their latest endeavor will produce.
Christy Hardin Smith @
37
Hastert’s original statement had some sort of lame comment which might be mistaken for an apology. That’s all I can remember.
Christy– Foley is the only one who has apologized for anything, and that was just to his family and his constituents, iirc.
http://www.wistv.com/Global/story.asp?S=5477137
Prof @ 38
John, in my view, just doesn’t get that the WoT language is right wing propaganda, and by adopting it, progressives lose. But then, he may have a different view of progressivism. Actually, I’ve never heard him talk about it.
One can imagine if we use that approach that we believe Democrats just need to be better Republicans, and I’m not sure how that helps us.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 37
I agree 100% Christy, HUGE gaping hole. I have seen zero wrt anything remotely approaching an apology. Apologizing implies they did something wrong and that contradicts their dummy defense. They didn’t know anything, therefore, they don’t have to apologize.
MATTHEWS: But you‘re not challenging his character here or word? Is that right? You don‘t challenge his word here? You think he might be telling the truth?
LAESCH: I will challenge his word. I‘ll get out there and say so. On page 186 of Dennis Hastert‘s book, he says that he listens to everything, and, you know, he knows everything that is going on. Use his words. Apparently he forgot, but on page 186 of his book, he says he listens to everything and he remembers everything.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15141833/
From the last thread:
gbear @ 34
There were a lot of good responses, but I’d like to make a point I didn’t see there. The key here is that these are self-identified value voters. These are the same holier-than-thou people for whom gay bashing is a supreme act of moral rectitude – the ones that are motivated to turn out by state constitutional amendments to ban gay marriage. They are going to simply blame gays in general for this scandal; we’re already seeing “gays are likely to be pedophiles” from the some of the wingnut sites.
We’re never going to get these people to vote for Dems, they are committed (just as many of us, for much better reasons, would never vote for a Republican). That having been said, the good news is that they are a small minority and there are a lot more voters who do see the corruption of power.
Bush mumbling about child safety? Fat pitch. I hope Wetterling can slam that notion down. Good grief, that is stupid.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 37
Shimkus has at least expressed remorse. From the St. Louis Post-Dispatch today:
Of course, this is part of a broader interview where Shimkus tries to turn this around on the media. Still, he at least acknowledged the existence of the pages and some personal remorse that he couldn’t keep them safe.
Redd–good point- I must confess that every time I see Hastert I am most struck by the size of the guy– it overwhelms any other rational judgement. It is ironic that he was once a wrestler who typically starve themselves to make weight. Denny is apparently now making up for it.
Another possible meme:
What we need in Washington is a War on Corruption.
According to the AP story: Voters Say Scandals Will Affect Votes :
And also:
Pachacutec @ 47
absolutely effing spot on…. thank you pach!
It’s beginning to seem to me that Foley used the friendly e-mails and invitations to seemingly innocent events like dinner and ice cream while these kids were in the page program, as a way to identify those who might be easy pickin’s after they left D.C. Once they left the program, it was all-IM, all the time, and I’m betting that Foley thought those IMs would simply vanish into the ether, never to be seen again.
It has “predator” written all over it, with all the planning and seduction and premeditation in there, too.
Hastert can’t get his story straight. He says if they had known they would have done something, but they did know and nothing was done.
I’m still not feeling comfortable with the FBI’s role in this, and can’t reconcile Gonzales prioritizing the cracking down on sexual predators and use of the internet for that purpose with the “nothing to see here” response from the FBI after CREW sent them the e-mails the same day they received them.
MayDaze @ 50
MayDaze, thanks a lot. That is a real deal breaker, as I understand it, from the perspective of objective and accurate polling.
Christy – did you mean to say “Again, there is no reporting on any paper
trialtrail on this”?I don’t recall anyone saying anything remotely consoling to the pages or their families Foley apologized to his family and his constiutents. Others are just talking about the Republican Party. I haven’t even heard anyone in the MSM say anything about the victimization. All they seem to be able to muster is their disgust over the behavior. It is a very sad retreat.
Here is link to House Ethics Committee:
http://www.house.gov/ethics/
… including list of members, and links to Ethics Manual, Member’s Handbook, and House Rules
Also, today’s Press Statement says “The Chairman and Ranking Minority Member intend to address the media today, at 1:30 pm, in Room H 321, The House Radio and TV Gallery”
I agree 100%.
That strongly suggests WH complicity in the cover-up, at least for the last three months (that’s when CREW gave the FBI the emails they had).
Christy Hardin Smith @ 37
When Hastert released his very first statement last week, I called his office and pointed out it did not include anything along the lines of “I am sorry that we didn’t recognize those red flags at the time and prevent this from happening to more of our young people.” The staffer tangled with me and insisted the statement was very contrite; and I invited her to point me to the paragraph that expressed any sentiment like that. I let her silence sink in.
I’d suggest you do the same, if you are trying to document that there is no such apology. Call each office and invite them to point you to the apology paragraph. Then print the paragraphs they themselves point you to.
Christy –
For some reason, the link I included @ 52 doesn’t appear when I posted the comment. (It showed up in preview, but not when I submitted it.) It may be a problem from the Post Dispatch side.
Here’s the link to their “Metro East” section, where it’s currently the top story. If you don’t see it, try searching their site for “Shimkus” and it will pop up with the title “Defiant Shimkus Says He’ll Retain Post.”
The GOP let Foley treat the page program like his personal box of chocolates. The GOP let Halliburton treat Iraq like its own personal money farm. The GOP can’t be bothered to respond to warnings of sexual harassment any more than they could be bothered to respond to warnings of terrorist attacks.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 37
Republicans? Apologize for being Perverts and Hypocrites?
That would be like water apologizing for being wet.
Republicans have no Shame, only Lust — Lust for Power, Lust for Money, and Lust for Innocent Children.
Slightly OT, but did anyone catch Paul Weyrich on Nice Polite Republicans “All Things Considered” yesterday proclaim that it’s a well know fact that “gays are pre-occupied with sex.”?
Made me want to jerk the radio outta my dashboard and fling it out the window!
Christy Hardin Smith @ 17
Nothing like a little toxic waste spreading in your direction, right? What were Darth Cheney’s approvals, again–below 20 percent somewhere?
John Casper @
61
When did the Department of Justice request that Google and other search engine Web sites submit search engine queries to the Department of Justice?
The “War on …” thing does not need to be co-opted by Democrats; it’s ineffective as a policy, and even worse in execution. It’s a bumper-sticker that signals, “black hole for your tax dollars – lottery winnings for contractors and consultants.”
I am thrilled that Patty is getting to make the Saturday address. She is a great person. But often on policy issues alone she can be, charitably, less than dazzling. but on child issues she is passionate. And persuasive. And her ads here in MN are going on. The NRSC is now attacking back with ads against Patty, and they are dark grainy ads.
She is only 3 down in the lastest poll. I live in her district. If Amy Klobachar takes down Kennedy (puke), Collen Rawley takes her district, and Patty takes down Bachman (rich fundraiser for republicans), MN will be great place.
Oh and Hatch can defeat Pawlenty. Going to be very close.
Christy Hardin Smith @
37
Really, why do “the beasts” deserve an apology? Apologies would step all over the victim-blaming, which is the real GOP strategy.
On another note, I’m still in shock from having said at least twice this week, “Well, I agree with Bay Buchanan.” Maybe there’s something that Begala and I can take for the trauma.
One of my major “political” donations of 2005 went to CREW. In retrospect, the money was passing well spent & they’re getting another check in the near future. Good on watchdogs of all varieties!
KO tonight, watch it…he will have a go at it…again
Just had a call from some republican committee urging me to vote absentee immediately. Are they desperate to get what votes they can before the bigger story comes out, or are they planning to rf the elction via Diebold?
selise @ 55
ditto and I hope for the day that the “GWOT” is dropped from our vocabulary entirely.
Cozumel (49), Laesch didn’t bat any eye when he more than once stopped Matthews from putting words in his mouth. That was the first I’ve seen Laesch and he interviewed like a no-nonsense guy. We need many more of those.
Christy Hardin Smith @
11
first the CIA guys failed to connect the dots re 9/11.
now the CYA guys fail to connect the dots re Maf54.
let’s not feel compelled to color between the lines on this one.
Wrt to Foley, 3 Oct 2006 according to the WaPo as far as siezing his PC.
Feds order Foley documents preserved
angie @ 46
When he’s copped a guilty plea, I’ll consider responsibility assumed.
Ned Lamont had better put out a “Joe Lieberman is not interested in protecting our children from predators” ad IMMEDIATELY!!!
DeeinBigD @ 43
And where did Shays get his talking points? Not from FauxNews, but from an e-mail sent around to Republican Congressional offices his morning!
In a rare lifting of the curtain, ABC has obtained the talking points for the day that were circulated in an e-mail from the press secretaries of Hastert and Boehner. ABC’s blog The Note obtained them and has published the e-mail. (Someone in one of the Republican offices on the Hill must have gotten disgusted and sent it to ABC.)
It includes this spin, which is similar to what you quote from Christopher Shays:
and
Read the whole GOP talking points over at ABC. Usually, we aren’t able to see the actual documents that the Republicans circulate in the morning to their troops (called the “Gang of 500″ in the e-mail).
Giving due credit, I read about this first over at America Blog: Boehner and Hastert today blame the children who were the victims , where John A points out that the taking points e-mail aims at discouraging teenagers who have received IMs from Foley, or their parents, from speaking out now, for fear of being investigated at the request of the Republicans.
How low can these people sink?
What about the press coverup?
Seen on bartcop:
http://www.radaronline.com/exc…..secret.php
Doesn’t look good for Denny:
http://hotlineblog.nationaljou…..v_m_1.html
There is one other slimeball that should be included in this pig wallow. Why not ask Newt the Nasty what he knew and when he knew it. The date of 1995 keeps popping up.
Guess who was Speaker then and guess who was the main instigator of the corruption.
Hayduke @ 20:
there is more than one meaning to colon
Christy Hardin Smith @
37
This is so important. Foleygate is an icky sex scandal, and that’s why it’s getting so much media play. But there are other things going on here.
One of the first reactions from the pages I read about was that they were afraid Congress would eliminate the program over this. How does this relate to Christie’s question? Follow me:
The pages were afraid they would be eliminated because someone was caught abusing them. (not because someone was abusing them; because someone was caught abusing them) The pages were afraid they would be eliminated because they know the Republican leadership will project blame on the pages for the leadership’s failure in its feduciary duty.
The Republican Party doesn’t know what feduciary duty means. They are elitists in the worst sense of the word: It’s all about what have the commoners done for them.
The Republicans are not in Washington to serve. They are in Washington to be served. Why on earth are the pages not apologizing to Hastert and Boehner for causing this embarrassment? That’s the question Hastert, et al, are asking. That’s the apology they are contemplating. And the pages know it; they are afraid of being eliminated.
This sense of elitist entitlement — pre-revolutionary France type aristocracy — is at the base of so many of our country’s problems right now. It’s what lets congress gut the clean air act, screw up public schools, attempt to destroy Social Security, and send our precious service people over to die and be maimed to gratify President Baby’s ego. They matter. We don’t.
And any apologies they expect in this matter should be coming from the pages: Thank you, sir, may I have another.
“I’m still not feeling comfortable with the FBI’s role in this, and can’t reconcile Gonzales prioritizing the cracking down on sexual predators and use of the internet for that purpose with the “nothing to see here” response from the FBI after CREW sent them the e-mails the same day they received them.”
THIS story and the one on Americablog about it being a Repub who notified of the “naughty emails” are memes that need to be heard in the MSM. Maybe a post about these two things that we can then all Spotlight to the media.
Not only does it cancel out the Rethug talking points that this is “political” and “when did the Dems know, but it very distinctly separates the behavior of the two sides. It also throws into the WH’s lap.
It was a Gooper who spilled the beans. And when CREW found out they notified the FBI the SAME DAY! Why didn’t the FBI do anything til Foley’s resignation? Drop the bomb on these lying fuckers who covered a Predator!
JupiterPluvius @ 35
He could do that, but he’d be exhibiting about 150 years’ worth of historical ignorance in the process.
EvilDrPuma @
88
Yes. That was my point.
I’ve gotta disagree with this:
Prof @ 54
Please, please, no more War On Something. I’m sick of it.
And they are all just ways for Republicans to frighten the country into spending money to “solve” the problem.
Off topic, but I need to vent. It’s looking more and more like the Dems are going to win 51 Senate seats, but Lieberman will win (new polls show him way up). If that happens, I have no doubt Lieberman will formally switch to the Repubs and give them the majority.
FRACK!!!
How do we make this scenario clear to Connecticut voters? How can they not see that Lieberman will go Repub after November 7??
Any discussion of Trandahl’s role would not be complete without noting that he went straight from the House job to the National Fish and Wildlife Foundation (a gov’t supported org.) and now refuses to discuss Foley.
Nobody is suggesting foul play, but one would be naive not to wonder if this plum job was not some kind of “insurance” for keeping his mouth shut.
Anybody smell something “fishy” here?
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/10/2/18643/3951
Prof @ 38
This is the perfect meme. But maybe a bit wordy. Rove/Gingrich would go extreme. Scene: HR 1556, emergency WoT vote. Foley nearly misses his time at the podium because he is trying to score a date.
Announcer: How can we trust them to defend us against terrorists if they are too busy trying to rape our children?
Strong resemblance between Hastert and Bernard Law–coincidence? I don’t think so.
Had to share this You Tube I came across today:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y…h? v=yIMBXZul6oA
I see the little old lady (in blue) as a Democrat, and the inconsiderate, rich guy in the Mercedes as yet another asshole Republican.
DrBB @ 93
Guilt has a way of eating away at your soul….
DrBB @ 93
Bingo!
Paging darkblack!
Law photo
Best example in our local statewide November race – a formerly secure GOP seat in the state legislature – of voters hjere connecting dots re GOP corruption:
WASILLA — Vic Kohring, a small-government crusader whose hardworking conservative label has earned a devoted Valley base and a reputation as a tireless campaigner, is also normally seen as practically unbeatable.
Now Kohring faces a potential hurdle as he goes for a seventh term: his connection to an FBI investigation involving Veco Corp., allegations of potential corruption and members of the Legislature.
He also faces a challenger with some name recognition of her own: former legislator Katie Hurley, at 85 the grand dame of the Democratic Party and known as the “Mother of Alaska’s Constitution” for her role as chief clerk at the drafting of the document in Fairbanks 50 years ago.
Conscripted by her party in August to replace a sudden candidate vacancy, Hurley entered the race so late she nearly missed getting her name on the Nov. 7 ballot.
But given this fall’s political climate, there’s a chance Hurley could go all the way, said researcher and political pollster Jean Craciun.
“I think she might actually beat him,” said Craciun, CEO of Craciun Research Inc., a 26-year-old Anchorage polling company.
link:
http://www.adn.com/news/politi…..3401c.html
If anyone is in a position where they have to respond to wingnuts parroting the “Studds” counterattack line, TPM Muckraker has a very good post about how a responsible party (the Democrats) responds to a situation like this. (Hint: it wasn’t with stonewalling and concern for elections above all else.) And Billmon explains how the wingnuts are lying about how “those Democrats” voted against censuring their page-chasing member (more Republicans voted against censuring theirs, among other things.)
GrandmaJ @
70
Thanks for the update. Donation will go out to Patty today!!
Trying again with link to #95.
Just to add interest to the story, I saw this this morning – I haven’t gone out looking further myself. From Making Light, in the most recent thread:
Fox and AP are full of, if you will pardon the expression, slow thinkers? (Christy, ‘mentally retarded’ is not being implied. They’re smarter than Fox and AP, IMO.)
Connecting the dots , like voting, is just so sexy!!!
Ed*ard Teller @ 97
Hate to interfere with a good pun but the point of the July 10 Tenet revelation is that the CIA in fact DID connect the dots.
It’s just that Rice, Rumsfeld, and Ashcroft didn’t do anything when Tenet told them.
“Failed intelligence” is part of the cover-up.
punaise @ 77
Guess there were more important things to be worrying about that summer, like vacations.
Most recent Zogby Poll shows no effect from the Foley scandal. It’s possible that this thing won’t directly effect much other than Foley’s seat- and perhaps Hastert’s (although it’s still early).
What may be effected is “intensity”. That is- fewer goopers will volunteer for “get out the vote” efforts. Some goopers will stay home- etc.
Midterm elections tend to turn on turn out- and that could be a factor here.
I’ve been reading that Shimkus story again, and another item struck me as interesting:
I think some of Shimkus’ anger may be that he has discovered that he has been kept out of the loop by the Speaker and/or Speaker’s COS, but since he’s a good GOPer footsoldier he will suck it up in public and point that anger at the media and Dems. If it looks like he’s going to lose in November, however, or if documentable proof comes out supporting Fordham’s story of 2003 conversations with the speaker’s office, I fully expect a torrent of righteous indignation coming from Shimkus.
Hastert blaming Bill Clinton. MSNBC.COM Top story.
Hastert rejects pressure
Hastert asserted that any Republicans urging his ouster are playing into the hands of Democrats and blamed his problems on the media and Democratic operatives, even suggesting former President Clinton might somehow be involved.
“All I know is what I hear and what I see,” he said in an interview with the Chicago Tribune on the eve of the ethics meeting. “I saw Bill Clinton’s adviser, Richard Morris, was saying these guys knew about this all along, If somebody had this info, when they had it, we could have dealt with it then.”
measure up @ 74
Depends if they count votes before the election :)
Actually I am a little serious here, it is legal to count absentee votes received before the election, and to let the results slip out? Then they can brag that they are ahead.
Billmon’s most excellent summation of the guiding principle of today’s Republican party:
“What Would Nixon Do?”
here’s a very interesting article from the RTD on Foley:
http://www.timesdispatch.com/s…..9190982723
pontificator @ 91
Some of us have been saying this for weeks, here and elsewhere. It has been quite obvious that:
1. Lieberman is preaching to the Republican choir. This explains his verbalizations particularly over the past 2 days.
2. Repub money via Rove does not come without strings
3. His wife is becoming a more powerful pharma lobbyist and needs his help to ensure their common (elegant) retirement
4. Ned’s campaign is in a total meltdown for reasons that have been well-documented on political sites
5. The personal estrangement between he and powerful Dems (Kennedy, Kerry, etc.) is not easily repaired
6. The Clintons are all too quiet on this
Let’s not forget that CREW gave the FBI the emails in mid July, and so far Gonzales did nothing, including for four days after ABC broke the story last Friday. At the very least (and there are rumors of an earlier FBI notification) this report in July needed to spur AG into action, since cyberporn was involved. However, nothing was done, and i have no faith that AG will do better now. This requires a special prosecutor, will the WH give us one?
egregious @ 108
Not in any jurisdiction that I’m aware of. The most they can do is verify the signatures and check you off the voter roll, so you can’t come in and vote a second time in November. The ballots remain uncounted until election day.
Of course, lots of folks try to figure out what the “absentee turnout” means for their side. Used to be that high absentee rates meant good news for Republicans, figuring that these were votes from old retired conservatives. Nowdays, with long commutes in the Bay Area and LA, lots of folks in CA who work 8-9 hours and commute another hour each way have signed up as permanent absentee voters, which makes the absentee turnout projections much more complicated.
A culture of official prevarication has infected the public discourse in our country for decades.
Always optimistic, I’m of the opinion that the Age of Mendacity entered into its death throes on September 29, 2006, when the bald-faced lies and fetid corruption of our current ruling elite were rubbed in the faces of the American people.
The Era of the USG Big Lie — 11/22/63 to 9/29/06.
Now, let’s connect the dots on election rigging and Dick Cheney’s role in paralyzing America’s air defense system on 9/11…
egregious @ 109
It can’t possibly be legal. (In VA, for example, absentee votes are reported on election day, listed as the “Central Absentee Precinct” in the results for each county.) Doing it illegally to guide where to focus GOTV and vote-suppression, maybe, but not publicly bragging about it.
What may be public, depending on the state, is an overall count of absentee ballots cast in different counties, which campaigns can legitimately use along with demographics as an indicator of how well their GOTV efforts are working.
Zogby on msnbc says the thugs are in a free fall acc. to his polling.
He says if Hastert goes, it will get worse.
What I find most interesting about this whole scandal is how the blogs, the mainstream press (with the usual exceptions, of course), and the Repubs themselves are going after the GOP leadership.
Not the Democrats. Nor should they. By not saying anything (this time), they reinforce the fact that it’s a Republican scandal. Leave the spotlight on Denny and pray that he doesn’t resign.
Republicans, give ‘em a little rope…
George @
95
Can’t get that link to work for me, George.
One of the factors to be considered is that Hastert wanted to retire this year but clusterfuck talked him into running again so that he could have his bestest bud with him to the (ugly) end.
In the back of Hastert’s mind is- “this is the perfect excuse to get out and say it’s for the good of the party”.
tfitznc @ 112
you want to make this claim? – you gotta provide some links.
egregious @
105
Well, your right, it was a bit of a cheap shot in the service of a rhetorical device….
wow, you almost have to feel sorry for the gop (almost). they could not have played this whole thing more wrong if they had tried. and the sad irony of it is that the foley mess is the only thing keeping the horrible news out of iraq off the front page. talk about being between a rock and a hard place.
George @
101
George! that was great!
Redshift @
99
Great post by billmon. And when people respond with “Well, what about Reynolds, then?” one can always come back with “Well, what about Lukens, then? Or Duke Cunningham?”
I’m usually against the “race to the bottom” type of argument, but this time I’ll make an exception.
goodness, Snowball’s pirouettes are pretty shaky today…
From the Beacon News:
He began to take calls at 8 a.m. Tuesday from his rustic estate in Plano, stopping only for a 10-minute lunch break. By late afternoon, slumped in a brown, leather armchair in his living room with a portable phone glued to his ear, he was answering many of the same questions posed during press conferences Monday in Washington.
But when asked what he wanted to say directly to his constituents about the scandal, he stuck to setting the record straight on what he knew about the e-mail exchange and when he knew it.
“What we did is exactly what we had planned to do if there was this type of situation,” Hastert said.
http://www.suburbanchicagonews…..S1.article
Peterr @
32
Don’t forget the “Find the WMD’s” puzzle…
It takes a hell of a shot to bring a Pachyderm down. Although I am not one for animal violence in any way, shape or form, this is one Elephant which needs to meed its end as quickly as possible!
rwcole @ 106
Don’t be discouraged that the polls are not yet showing the effect of the scandal. We still have five weeks left before the voting. Politics is like comedy, timing is everything. There will be a constant drip of new revelations, and more of the blame game.
At this point it looks as though the Dems will take the House handily. Of course, the planned “October surprise” is yet to be seen.
Had enough?
In 1994, the Rethug$ (read Gingrich) foisted the Contract
OnWith America, promising, among other things, to pull us back from the brink of corruption, to clean house.If they don’t, they went on to say, throw us out.
Here’s a little teaser from CHB’s featured rant this morning:
Kip Carter, his former campaign treasurer, remembers a football game in Gingrich’s district. She was walking Gingrich’s two daughters back from the game and cut across the parking lot when she spied the Congressman’s car.
“As I got to the car, I saw Newt in the passenger seat and one of the guys’ wives with her head in his lap going up and down,” Carter says. “Newt kind of turned and gave me this little-boy smile. Fortunately, Jackie Sue and Kathy were a lot younger and shorter then.”
That’s just the tip, so to speak, of the iceberg. Read on for the true flavor of Newt. It seems he was really jealous of Clinton, not disgusted by the Oval BJ’s.
http://tinyurl.com/fgq33
Gingrich has always puzzled me. He’s such a hamster. How did he ever get any power?
May–Yeah timing is important- ideally, this thing would have come up a couple of weeks later- there is a risk that it will be “old news” by the election. Goopers are playing “beat the clock”.
tfitznc @ 112
selise @ 121
Please review the context of the discussion- i.e. whether Lieberman will causcus with the Republicans or just jump ship all together.
To be more clear, I was reviewing to the polling sites, on two levels. First, there is a clear statistical meltdown (see TPM, electoral-vote.com, Slate (mystery pollster), etc. Second, there is IMO a broad-based view (outside FDL) that the race doesnt matter.
“In Connecticut, incumbent Sen. Joe Lieberman (D-CT), who is running as an independent, is ahead of Democrat Ned Lamont by 50% to 40%. This is a grudge match if ever there was one, but since both will join the Democratic caucus if elected, it has no relevance for control of the Senate” [from electoral-vote.com today].
“Did you miss anything”?
Yes, I believe that in addition to the “sick, sick, sick…” commentary on the initial emails given to Rep Alexander there were accounts of other inappropriate behavior, and a secondhand report of MULTIPLE inappropriate advances by a Congressman that another page complained about. THis is obvious and damning evidence of negligence, in my view, but seems to be continually ignored.
So, there were several reports of bad behavior contained in the initial email. It wasn’t about one page and his “family”.
I call for Alexander’s resignation here.
Lieberman is unlikely, in my opinion, to break his pledge to vote for dem leadership. He may be a bigger pain in the ass than he would have been otherwise- but if he were to break that pledge- he would be toast.
Pish tosh! There’s only one red flag these lunatics can see: “Democrat”.
With Foley, they see a red, white, and blue flag.
tfitznc @ 133
thank you for the reply and especially for the links – that’s all i wanted.
selise @ 136
u are most welcome
In the category of “what did he say?”
Meanwhile, Hastert said on Laura Ingraham’s talk-radio show this morning that he did in fact tell leading conservative Paul Weyrich that he would step down for good if the scandal becomes all about him. At the same time, he suggested that it wouldn’t be in the GOP’s interest for their leaders to leave, making way for a Democratic sweep. “I said look it, if this thing – if this got to a point where it was all about me and I have to explain everything, yeah I’d step down. But I said, on the other hand, if I fold up my tent and leave and others have to fold up their tents and leave, that they would, uh, then where does that leave us?”
Perhaps a minor question already asked but was Foley’s unseemly behavior only confined to Congressional pages? Sure, they are something of a captive population but there are a lot of 16 year olds out there and Foley has been active this way for years and years.
Shorter Denny Hastert: If I resign, then the terrorists win!
Foley may have been coming on to every 16 year old boy he met- anywhere on earth- but none of that is politically relevant that I can see.
rwcole @ 132
Good point. But I think this story has everything to stay in the MSM spotlight – sexual predation (the biggie), abuse of office, constantly changing stories, etc.
If the Repugs were smart, Hastert would take responsibility and resign, and then they would come up with a “reform plan to keep it from happening again”. Not so far, so all we can do is hope they continue the circular firing squad.
>Lieberman is unlikely, in my opinion, to break his pledge to vote for dem leadership
I must disagree, because I see Joe saying something like this: “For the good of the people of Connecticut, and to advance thier interests, I have decided to remain an independent and caucus with the Republican Party. I have been assured that I will retain my seniority, etc. etc.”
If I were Lamont, I would be speaking as if Lieberman has already made this decision (the “presumed close”). Like “Well, you know Joe will become GOP if it’s a one-vote majority” and “Senator Lieberman, who will no doubt align himself with the Republicans should the Democrats win 51 seats,… “
Make this conventional wisdom, so Joe must address it (and deny it, in his own way) at every chance.
May
Goopers problem is that the problem is not confined to Hastert- there are at least more vulnerable gooper leadership members who could go down with this thing.
Hastert has to ask himself “If I go down- will this thing be over- or will the whirlwind just move on to the next gooper on the list?” With another three goopers to go- the questioning could well last until the election- and Hastert’s resignation would be taken as an admission of guilt.
It’s a tough one- I’m not sure how
Rove would play it—probably “stand tough”.
rwcole @
141
It would be marginally relevant if illegal, as adult/16 year old sex is in some US jurisdictions.
But I agree that the much bigger story is how the GOP House leadership covered up sexual harassment of teenage employees by one of their own.
>I’m not sure how
Rove would play it—probably “stand tough”.
I agree. Dig in and white-knuckle it is all they’ve really considered all along, on any matter.
“When your only tool is a hammer, everything looks like a nail.”
areader
Don’t think ol Joe wants to do this or that he WILL do it.
He has explicitly run on the promise to the voters that he will vote for dem leadership. To break that vow would be to win under totally false pretenses. It would lead to at least a recall movement and would eliminate any political future he might have in elective politics.
Remember- he can’t win running as a gooper in Connecticut.
The most recent Zogby has Lieberman at 46, Ned at 44.
The poll your quoting, Rasmussen, October 2, uses an interview method, which is very unusual in my experience. The previous Rasmussen sample September 14, showed Lieberman at 45 and Ned at 43.
What should Ned be doing in your opinion?
Whether it is a “grudge match” or not, Ned is significantly better than Lieberman on Iraq, Bush, and Choice. I’d hardly call that “irrelevant.”
Last week Lieberman voted to end habeus corpus. What good is the Bill of Rights without habeus corpus? Justice Stevens is ?87??? and Joe voted for Alito.
Louis Freeh to head up investigation acc to Roll Call per cspan and Hastert will have a presser at 145.
http://www.rollcall.com/
Update on that RNCC chair: Congressman Tom Reynolds (R-NY) has stopped hiding behind kids. His new human shield is the First Lady.
aReader @ 142
Exactly
rwcole #147
Two points I’d like to note… 1. – A sitting US Senator cannot be recalled. 2. – Joe is noting if not adept at “rationalization” and “justification”. I see him doing what is best for Joe, and rationalizing it by explaining its best for the people of Connecticut.
via Kos, prolly already mentioned here:
rwcole @ 144
Well, that’s the way they’re playing it. I think it’s a mistake, but we’ll see.
For this to “go away”, at least one head has to roll. I think they could limit the damage and the extent, timewise, by doing as I posted. And I’m please as all get out that they don’t see it.
rw and areader…
It sounds like your speculation (Denny et.al. will just hang tough) is correct. CNN is reporting this. From a strategic perspective, I don’t think they can do anything differently. And, I’m thrilled with this choice! Keep the “coverup” in the news as long as possible…
I’m with several other posters who questioned the possibility that the coverup goes higher than the leaders of the House. Particularly when we know that this regime is so controlling. I would think that the emails given to the FBI would have triggered a note to Gonzales. Also, that Rove, Bolten, Cheney, and Harriet Miers would have been notified. I have a feeling that the leaders were told to “sit on it”.
I usually take Wayne Madsen with a dash of salt but he’s nailed some things over the years…
http://www.waynemadsenreport.com/
Can the GOP can rig enough e-voting machines to overcome this, if true?
according to Snowball’s presser, both chimp and dick say that denny should stay…
Shorter Paul Weyrich: I was for Hastert’s resignation before I was against it.
angie @ 117
Sorta like ol’ Denny is plugging the drain hole, eh? Shades of Augustus Gloop…
rwcole @
147
And yet, that is what he is doing. I think Lamont should highlight that more–Joe Lieberman is running with backing from the GOP, with funding from the GOP, with love letters from Darth Cheney. What on Earth makes anyone think he’s going to vote Democratic after that? His promise? Please! Joe’s promises aren’t worth a lark’s fart.
punaise @ 152
Zogby dates/numbers are incorrect per pollster.com
Latest zogby, September 25, has Joe ahead 46 to 44.
Last week Joe voted to end habeus corpus and retroactively pardon torture.
tfitnc #132 — I’ll see your IMO and raise you IMO.
The Lamont-Lieberman race is being watched closely in fly-over country, and by people who’ve had enough of being sold out by DLC Dems, by people who want Dems to be able to clean their own house and then clean the Big House.
That race most certainly does count, and the attitude of the old school Dem incumbents did a 180 after the primary, about reaching out to the grassroots and netroots. I have friends who are IT folks inside campaigns; they are watching just as intently as those of us in the ‘roots.
I think the primary results reinforced for us that polling has limitations, and that Lieberman is a self-serving wiener who doesn’t give a rat’s hoot for the will of the people or democratic (little d) principles.
rwcole @ 141
It speaks to two issues.
First, how many lives has Foley damaged? This may not be “politically” relevant but, of course, one of the criticisms of the Republican leadership is that they viewed Foley’s predelictions only through the optic of what was politically relevant.
Second, it could establish a history of sexual predation pre-dating the current scandal and further undermine the argument that Foley’s activities could somwhow have remained “unknown” for so long.
John Casper @ 161
Ah that it were true! These are the latest from TPM et al.
CT-SEN Rasmussen Oct 5 Lieberman (CFL) 50%, Lamont (D) 40%
CT-SEN Zogby/Reuters Oct 5 Lieberman (CFL) 53%, Lamont (D) 33%
Hmmm…Louis Freeh. Family man. Regular church attendant. Rumored to be an Opus Dei fan. And a big sniffer in Bill Clinton’s underwear drawer.
well, especially if lamont is down in the polls… we can do our part to help… hopefully RevDeb, scarecrow and i (all in MA) will be going to meriden CT to canvass for ned on saturday (we won’t know for sure until tomorrow)… any one living nearby want to join us? it will be fun and you will feel good for having done it.
please email me at speakeasy dot net and put fdl in the subject line (to make sure i don’t miss it).
now, i’m off to the local world can’t wait protest… later pups!
SILENCE TORTURE = COMPLICITY
don’t be silent.
Only one poll counts–the one they take on Election Day.
Lamont needs to come out swinging on this stuff.
Rayne @ 162
I’m with you 100% that LIEberman needs to go and that NED is the better candidate for CT and the USA. But, I was born and raised there and (again IMHO from afar), NED’s folks have run an inept campaign right out of the primary gate.
Polls look tough for Lamont. He’s moving the wrong direction and Joe’s got 50% with a gooper taking a few. I wouldn’t conclude that he’s dead- but he’s a long shot at this point. Can he outspend Joe down the stretch? Does he have a more compelling message? Beats me.
DairyMaid @ 166
Though I disapprove of snooping, sententious scolds, I think that a snooping, sententious scold might be just the ticket in this case.
Dr. Bong @ 159
I heard Weyrich say on NPR yesterday that homosexuals are well known for their, and I paraphrase here, “overzealous sexual appetite.”
Even Michele Norris did a double take on that one.
I seriously doubt that Foley only started chasing teenage boys when he went to DC. He probably has been doing it since he was a young man, which means about thirty years. There should be a lot more victims out there, although I suspect they mostly won’t want to speak up.
… come to think of it, Ned Lamont might do well to advise CT voters that they are stuck with Lieberman for six full years if he wins. At least a president can be impeached. A Senator cannnot be recalled.
Something like “Do you want six years of ‘loose cannon’ Joe, with no oversight?”
“The GOP: Rewriting American History, One Page at a Time.”
Here are more ads for the GOP we’d like to see…
Someone needs to ask Paul where he gets his information about homosexual appetites.
Weyrich said, “Gays are obsessed with sex.” Norris said, “I think you need to make it clear that that’s your opinion, and that there are people listening to this program who strongly disagree with you.”
Weyrich said, “It’s not my opinion, it’s the opinion of psychologists and sociologists and blah blah blah.” Norris repeated firmly, “That’s your opinion.”
I would just note that I have never heard a gay person on the radio talking about Paul Weyrich’s sex life.
Mel Martinez has decided to donate his Foley-gotten gains to the Catholic Diocese. Do I need to point out the irony? I love Florida
Rayne @ 163
I’m in flyover country. Today I sent Hillary back a donation card( her 37 cents) and wrote(big letters) that she would get my money when I see her side by side with NED.
I guess as long as you ignore my comments, you can can proclaim whatever you want to be “true.”
Now for the second time, what is behind the numbers?
Why is Joe gaining and Ned losing?
I’m old fashioned and really really like habeus corpus. This race isn’t “irrelevant” to me.
mc @ 172
I heard that I think. When asked what proof he had for such a claim, he sighted unspecified but well known “psychologists, researchers, and studies” probably put out by the same people who deny global warming and who said that smoking was good for you. I was kind of hoping that Norris would ask him, “So you don’t have much of a sexual appetite? How sad.”
ReneND — heh. You go, girl!! Brava!!
tfitznc — “NED’s folks have run an inept campaign right out of the primary gate.”
One word: Dangerstein.
JupiterPluvius @ 171
I’m with you. I’m just wondering if Louis’ scolding has a partisan slant. And I’m curious about his loyalty to his buds at the FBI, who may be implicated as ostriches as well.
FDL is always so careful about details.
And I know that the name came from another source
but the name of the new clerk is HAAS
not HASS
one rhymes with a body part
one sounds like the sound a doctor tells you to make when he says “Open your mouth and say “ahhhh”
Small point, but an important one.
Saying and spelling people’s names properly is more polite.
having said that
how about Hastert keeping everyone waiting for an hour for his presser?
CNN has been running clips of former pages telling their stories along with top Republicans running away from accountability while the banner is “Foley Fallout”.
can’t buy this stuff.
way to stay on message Karl.
Unless Hastert does something drastic at this presser, he will look impotent…
Where is Bob Livingston when you need him?
Don’t remember him? He was supposed to be the Repug Speaker of the House (post Clinton) before he (Livingston) got caught in a sex scandal. After one or two others had to drop out for sex scandals (including Henry Hyde), the GOP went on bended knee to Hastert, asking that he take over as THE safe choice to be Speaker of the House.
The logic must have been, “How could someone so fat and ugly be involved in a sex scandal?”
Now we know: he likes to watch! But he will never tell…
Wonder if Hastert has been properly prepared for this press conference. Someone has been letting him go out and speak to the press without preparation lately and he has paid for it with contradictions and innanities. If he bungles this one- the blood will not just be IN the water- the blood will BE the water.
A little blue pill . . .?
John Casper —
Over at MyDD, there is a theory put forward that Lamont was so strong in the primary because he was a movement candidate that interested all the power and money and strength of the progressives in the party. After that win, he just became a regular candidate and began focussing on local issues and meeting the needs of the local Dem infrastructure. That was necessary because the general voting electorate (as we know) is much more conservative than party primary voters. Further, the intense progressive national focus has necessarily dispersed as individuals supporting Lamont in the primary look increasingly to the political races in their own districts.
The Connecticut local scene is however, still Joe’s turf in a conservative way — Joe is the local, known candidate and Ned is an unkown (at least insofar as how he will act as a Senator). One campaign theory would be for Ned to completely re-nationalize the election. Talk about torture and Bush and etc. That frankly may be the only way, given trend lines, to move voters off of their comfortable Joe vote.
I’m worried about the backlash on the gay community. There’s behind-the-scenes stuff going on, involving whom is in the closet and which Senators have closeted gays on their staff. Get ready to see some really nasty stuff aimed at not only the gay community, but all of us here on the blogs. Stand tough everybody.
anybody else tired of seeing Hastert’s ugly mug plastered over cnn.com ?
it’s the pits: “And-you-lean-a Jowly”
Official: Hastert to take responsibility
WASHINGTON – House Speaker Dennis Hastert will take responsibility for the unfolding page sex scandal but insist he will stay on as leader of House Republicans, a House GOP official said Thursday, as leaders of the ethics committee weighed when and how to act. At a news conference in his home district in Illinois, Hastert will also ask the Ethics Committee to consider new rules so that anyone making inappropriate contact with pages be disciplined. In the case of staff, they would be fired; lawmakers would be subject to expulsion, the official said.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200…..MlJVRPUCUl
Fresh thread, gang.
dead last @ 185
I always wondered about that. Who did Bob Livingston piss off and why?
Why did Newt get a pass to slink away while old Bob got strung up?
immanentize — this Foley scandal is a good vehicle for renationalizing, and Lieberman all but gave it to Ned.
Any Dem candidate who has a reaction like Lieberman’s should be spanked. Lieberman’s trying to use experience as a competitive edge, but frankly, good ethics and compassion for victims don’t resound through Lieberman’s experience.
Look at Ned with the kids he’s taught, with his own kids; he leads by example. We need that 51st vote to be a guy like that.
I am beginning to suspect that GOP Rep. Foley may have a lot of “dirt” about other members of Congress? He might make an excellent witness in the Tom Delay trial? You remember Tom Delay, the former House Whip and Foley’s protege? Or maybe Foley was the Whip? Excellent program last night by Moyers on PBS about the Abramoff/Delay/Scanlan group? Too bad some of them have been already sent to Big House. GOP Rep. Foley perhaps could have been a character witness for these folks. Abramoff et. al., do not forget to mention your friendship with Foley to the guys in the Big House; I am sure everyone will want to give you a warm greeting!!
I think Hastert is going to serve as the levee preventing the total washout of GOP leadership (and I am not making fat jokes) that is feared will ensue if he steps down.
I think that at this point, they are damned if they do, and damned if they don’t. There was a very small window of opportunity to be in front of the story, and it may not only be closed, but nailed shut.
Interesting – but not surprising – that the media can ferret out the tiniest of details on the Amish school shooting and do all kinds of homework on their faith and practices, but they cannot seem to bring themselves to educate the public that Foley’s sexual orientation has nothing to do with him being a predator, other than that if he were straight, his victims would have been female pages.
With the Amish school-shooting story, the media have talked to religious scholars and experts, educating the public on who the Amish are, but with the Foley scandal, the “experts” and the people the media is seeking out for comment all seem to have resumes that have Focus on the Family or the Family Research Council on them. Do the media believe that the public is being served by making no effort to debunk the impression that this is a gay thing?
This is one strange world we are living in.
immanentize @ 188
Thanks very much imm.
Your explanation makes sense.
It contradicts the “total meltdown” that was put out above. Furthermore it is consistent with Ned’s 6% name recognition last January.
The numbers so far have showed a tightening of the race. The latest numbers, both Zogby and Rasmussen, now show Joe pulling away. There might be several causes, but this recent move, since after September 25, is certainly cause for concern. It’s very possible that Ned’s campaign may be making mistakes.
Rayne @ 194
agreed!
They are damned regardless. The door closed days ago, basically when it first came out, when they might have had a chance to mitigate the damage – though whether they could have actually mitigated the damage is purely speculative. Hastert, et al., needed to step up and take responsibility immediately rather than blame the media or anyone else and announce they would investigate every and all allegations and pursue them to the end, where ever they led.
That is basic organization crises management learned from the J&J Tylenol poisonings, and they failed.
EPU at 199 — Amen. That is absolutely correct.
John Casper @
48
I’ve been doing some Googling – obviously not much since I’m still on this thread, but here’s what I’ve found so far:
http://abcnews.go.com/images/U…..tement.pdf
Nothing about the victims.
That’s it. There were four to six pages of links, depending how I did it. I used the search string:
mark foley apolog sorry remorse parents victims hastert reynolds boehner
and some minor variations.
There sure isn’t a lot of text out there that has those terms all together in one place. If anyone among the names I used apologized, I think there’d be several references to it in the news.
Good catch Cujo, I forgot about Foley, when I responded to Christy.
egregious @ 109
depends on the ballot type
when my county used mark-a-vote cards for every voter in the county, the absentee ballots recieved before election day were counted about 1:00 pm on election day. The outcome was pretty much decided right there, because the AVs are from a representative cross section of the voter population.
You gotta understand that there is a lot of testing and adjusting of the counting machines going on before hand. The candidates have a right to witness the testing and the counting, so your concern about “Bragging” is valid, but unavoidable. Mostly the result isn’t bragging, it’s mostly about panic and last minute GOTV efforts
anybody who thinks tampering is possible in this stage is wrong. The ballots are a paper record, and are subject to audit. There just ain’t any hidden tricks to be used at this stage
with electronic voting, the process is different. people like me who vote absentee thru the mail still use the same cards, and those cards are counted in the middle of the day as before.
Some people who vote absentee at the ROV office (Registrar Of Voters) cast their vote on an electronic machine that can’t be counted until the close of the polls. The number of absentee ballots cast on the machines at the office is negligible. The bulk of the absentee ballots are cards that can and will be counted before the polls close
all of the electronic machines used in the election have a paper “reciept” (is it really a reciept if you don’t give it to the voter ???), and those “reciepts” are also audited
but the whole point is that the “regular” vote doesn’t matter. every race will have an established “margin” when the cardstock absentee ballots are counted, and that margin doesn’t change very much when the whole canvas is added, no matter what type of voting method is used
I can call the office about 2:00 pm on election day and learn the results of any race on the ballot (cuz I know somebody there … actually I know a whole lot of somebodys)
just so you know: the ROV office looks like a (insert ethnic slur here) fire drill on election day. Ever seen a room full of monkeys trying to fuck a bunch of footballs ??? That’s what happens at the local ROV office on election day. Think of the worst day you could imagine at work, and then multiply by 10. Phones are ringing off the hook, people are running around EVERYWHERE, and there is a group of tourists walking around watching everything you do. It’s not a fun place to work. Nobody said democracy was pretty
Ed*ard Teller @
9
dunno, but the taxpayers did dig a cave under Cheney’s residence…