Crooks and Liars has the clip from the Woodward interview on 60 Minutes last night, with Woody pushing his new book "State of Denial." Interesting stuff. For example, this choice excerpt:
Wallace: When you say the Bush administration has not told the truth about iraq, what do you mean?
Woodward: I think probably the prominent… most prominent example is the level of violence.
Reporter: Not just the Sunnis against Shi'as, that gets reported every day, but attacks on U.S. And allied forces. Woodward says that's the most important measure of violence in iraq, and he unearthed this graph– classified secret– that shows those attacks have increased dramatically over the last three years.
Woodward: Getting to the point now where there are 800, 900 attacks a week. That's more than 100 a day. Four attacks an hour, attacking our forces….
Hmmmm…dishonesty from the Bush White House? Say it isn't so, Woody!
But wait, there's more. It seems that Pickles keeps her hand in the policy jar:
Wallace: You write Laura Bush was worried that Rumsfeld was hurting her husband. Andy Card told her the president seemed happy with Rumsfeld. And the first lady replied, "he's happy with this, but I'm not." And later she said, "I don't know why he's not upset."
Woodward: What's interesting, Andy Card, as white house chief of staff, every six weeks set up a one-on-one meeting with laura Bush, set aside an hour and a half to talk about what's going on, what are the president's anxieties? Smart meeting….
Woodward: And in the course of these sessions, the problem with rumsfeld came up and she voiced her concern about the situation.
Wallace: But Dick Cheney wanted Rumsfeld to stay. Why?
Woodward: Well, Rumsfeld's his guy and Cheney confided to an aide that if Rumsfeld goes, next they'll be after Cheney.
Why, Pickles, that's so…so…well, so out of public persona of you. Why, you ask yourself, would Pickles and Andy Card meet to discuss personnel matters in the Bush Administration. The answer may lie at the very end of the Woody interview:
Wallace: And Woodward says that no matter what's occurred in iraq, mr. Bush does not welcome any pessimistic assessments from his aides because he's sure that his war has iraq and america on the right path.Woodward: Late last year, he had key republicans up to the white house to talk about the war and said, "I will not withdraw even if laura and barney are the only ones supporting me." Barney is his dog. My work on this leads to lots of people who spend hours, days with the president….
Woodward: And in most cases, they are my best sources. And there is a concern that we need to face realism, not being the voice that says, "oh, no, everything's fine," when it's not. (emphasis mine)
Sounds to me as though President Happy Talk is starting to grate on people's nerves at the White House. Anyone else getting that feeling?
Oh, and the WaPo has some excerpts from Woody's book on just how bad the "secret" numbers from Iraq really are. One wonders how long Woodward has been holding on to this information instead of making it public…
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Christy!
Oversight!
Morning all — it’s a bit nippy here this morning. Warm coffee is a very good thing, indeed. :)
It’s a huge story for the CW factory in town.
Here you have their guy, a former Bush fluffer, essentially calling the president not only a liar, but nuts, and attributing concern for the president’s essential fitness for office to his closest staff members unnamed.
It won’t get much oxygen while the Foley business unfolds, and frankly, that’s no longer really a blog story. We can’t really push it, as it’s already fully launched by the networks, though we can shape it around the edges. The media are going full tilt on this because it’s got sex and sleaze.
But on the side burner, this Woodward story on 60 Minutes is very big for the beltway insider types: it represents a serious fragmenting of the Gang of 500, Halperin’s wingnuttia notwithstanding. And that’s even before you get to the rather explosive revelation of the concealing of the critical meeting and evidence relevant to the 9-11 Commission, whose content directly contradicts the Path to 9-11/ABC/Disney/Fox/Republican revisionist history about 9-11.
Henry Kissenger? WTF?
Two Fox News style questions: Can the GOP survive the accumulated weight of all the current and recent revelations? Perhaps more to the point, should it?
Here’s another, based on Christy’s dot connections: is Laura sending hubby a message through Booby? Has it come to this?
Cruisin on denial
Would that be like in a Foley BMW?
Christy,
I didn’t see 60 minutes, did they cover the Tenet / Rice meeting?
I’d hate for this story to get lost in the Foley shitstorm.
“Happy Talk” – I bet Junya came up with that one all by hisself.
Mad Dogs @
7
I doubt if Bush listens to classical music…
Mornin’ Christy –
spewed the mocha when the page loaded – hope all appreciate the level of snark in that graphic
Blumenthal on Woodward -
and I am counting on this very thing to keep the July 10th Meeting story alive and kicking
Oh and Pach, Jane says you’ll be posting on GOTV on Thursdays.
I really hope you have some positive stuff to help with the paranoia that this inspires:
Time: GOP secret weapon is GOTV (Via Raw Story)
Another link on C&L/Rolling Stone article “From an Al Qaeda Childhood to a Gitmo Cell” is another very strong reminder of why we must stop this administration. We are certain to look back at these times as a nation with disgust of our crimes committed.
cbl at 9 — thought everyone could use a morning giggle. ;-)
Pachacutec @ 4
Disagree… this is not a fracture in the beltway CW or windtalker code from manslaughter laura…I view it as just simply more sensationalism BS book marketing 101 .
*ilson46201 @ 8
In his youth, he was real interested in “The Nutcracker Suite” until he found out it twas music.
I’m glad this is getting out.
All the more reason to stay focused on winning the election next month.
o/t
via booman -
Larry Johnson does stand up – who knew ? -
You May Be A
RedneckRepublicanhttp://www.boomantribune.com/s…..17245/3279
And dishonesty from the Speaker of the House too?
And the MSM fails to notice?
Say that also isn’t so.
But in fact Dennis Hastert’s call for an investigation by the Attorney General, widely reported all last night, is a carefully crafted, opportunistic, damage-control operation whose main purpose appears to be to investigate outsiders as much as the coverup-Congress itself — probably ABC News, which broke much of the story — and investigate only those who saw the Instant Messages, not Reynolds and other Republican leaders who saw the e-mails and did nothing.
A commenter at Josh Marshall’s Talking Points Memo has analysis of the actual Hastert letter to the Attorney General.
Do your own analysis of Hastert’s Letter to the AG and see for yourself.
And look at additional material at http://talkingpointsmemo.com/ about this.
And of course Hastert and others on the Republican Child Predator Coverup can now say that they can’t comment any more because it is under investigation.
Will the MSM let him and others get away with that dodge?
In 2004, 70 percent of military personnel and their families voted for Bush. Now he’s turned Iraq into one big Gallipoli. It will be interesting to see how they vote in this mid term. I hope they get a clue. I hope the Woodward revelations stay on the front page every day until Nov. 7.
Prof at 17 — not if I can help it — I’m deconstructing that at the moment for the next post. *g*
Did the GOP toss Foley under the bus to obfuscate traction on the Woodward Revelations?
This morning on CNN Soldad tried to get in Tony Snow’s face (for once) and she talked about the leaked memo and then played a clip from a speech the president gave 3-4 weeks later saying exactly the opposite of what was in the memo.
Snow’s repsonse? Bush sees lots of memos everyday. So, where are the memos that support his speech? Why can’t they be declassified?
Something else. Everytime we get one of these leaks of “classified” material, I am brought back to what Mary4 (formerly and amybe once again, just Mary) has being saying for months about the misuse of the classification power.
I beleive that Congress can subpeona classifed documents, and under Mary’s brilliant ananilys, a document falsely stamped “classified” isn’t actually classifed at all if the power to stamp it had been misused.
And, depending on how grevious that misuse might be, and if it has put American lives in jeopardy (like in a war begun under false pretenses that made us MORE suseptical to terrorist attck)…… well who knows what crimes a federal prosecutor thinking outside the box might be able to prove beyond a reasonablre doubt.
They may have written themselves a retroactive pardon for their war crimes act violations. (I get sick to my stomach just typing that), but they still have lots of other crimes to answer for.
And Mary seems to have the list memorized. Just sayin’ s’all.
Prof at 17 – glenn has more
and christy at 19 – glad you are on it…. to help the MSM understand (and report on) what is really going on here. as always, many thanks!
Months ago I heard someone interviewing the royal family comment on how very indispensable Rove is, and Miz Laura smirked, “He’d like to think so.” That is all I remember but no one picked up on it as far as I know.
And most of the MSM also has said that the Ethics Committee is investigating, as a result of Pelosi’s motion.
Not so. There is no House Ethics Committee investigation.
CBS News got it right in one report:
There is much more in a diary over at Daily Kos.
selise @ 22
Yes, selise, Glenn has it exactly right. And for others to start turning the gears in this early-caffeine morning, here’s one excerpt from Glenn:
Prof @ 24
So after 10 days Pelosi starts asking where’s the report – seems to add legs to the story as if it really needed any more. They do the wrong thing EVERY TIME
Christy!
Wonderful post to start the week!
BRAVO! Will stay tuned and savor.
Question: whether there’s actually a House Ethics Comm. investigation or not at this point (e.g., see #24), shouldn’t we be thanking Pelosi for doing her darndest to get something going along those lines?! She sounds so alone out there…
Old Sow @ 20
That was my thought. Nothing the press loves mroe than a good sex scandal. The better to distract the country from whatever it is that may hurt the president
lhp last thread 298 — excellent. Morning meeting time!
Oh, by the way, I have the original soundtrack 33 rpm (remember rpm’s???) of South Pacific.
One of my purchases as a teenager.
Nambla-de-da . . .
freep this smoking CNN poll:
“Do you think House leaders tried to cover up allegations that Republican Congressman Mark Foley exchanged sexually explicit e-mails with a 16-year-old former congressional page?”
http://www.cnn.com/
o/t kinda
Abramoff’s entry in to prison delayed until November – does anyone know the basis for the delay ?
windje @ 26
Actually, she already started asking yesterday.
Still, the better way to keep the legs of this story in good shape is to get the MSM to understand that there are two more coverups — the House vote, and Hastert’s letter.
And counting…..
Especially if one is a beat reporter or desk editor at the Post.
How many stories, I wonder, did an editor properly refuse to publish because a reporter didn’t have confirmation – and now they both realize that Woody had the info that would have confirmed those stories, but held it so he could put it in his book.
not sure if this is on radar yet:
Foley into rehab
and does Woodward’s book or it’s notes indicate when Tenet/Black spoke w/Boobie ?
Prof @ 30
ummm…the Broadway original cast recordings originally came out on 78s … I recall singing along with them as a kid to my aunt’s disks.
lina (18), I’ve been wondering how the Republican military will vote after all that has gone before. Someone here pointed out that former military are running for elected office as Democrats. That’s true but I still see the military enthusiastically applauding Bush during his speechifying day job when telling them we are winning the war and other fables.
At this point, is it possible to obfuscate any of these things anymore? It’s more like a pile-up. A train wreck. An avalanche. A cacophony. A forest fire. Someone help me here!
This latest Iraq plus more Bush lies/torture plus Constitution/CondiLiar plus dereliction/Foley plus cover-up hairball may be the moment the whole picture comes together for the masses.
“Oct. 22, 1972: A series of top-secret cables from Mr. Kissinger in Saigon to the White House explain a sticky situation. Days before the 1972 American presidential elections, after months of secret negotiations, Mr. Kissinger had declared: “Peace is at hand.” This scumbag wants to accuse the country of “losing it’s nerve” in Vietnam. Whaddya think Henry, if we had hung in there and killed maybe a million more they would have given up? And now this low-life motherfucker is giving advice to the draft-dodging frat boy so he can “re-fight” a war he never fought. This country is getting exactly what it deserves.
As important as the possible cover-up of the Foley mess is to the country’s sense of the integrity of the GOP leadership, I fear that the love of the media for anything with sexual content will overrun the news of the cover-up of the July 10, 2001 meeting between Tenet, Black and Rice.
I realize that hindsight is 20-20, and we will never know what might have happened if Rice had sounded the alarms, interrupted Bush’s planning for his upcoming vacation, marshaled the expertise of Richard Clarke and worked this thing 24/7, but we do know what resulted from their doing nothing.
The common theme in the Foley mess and the 2001 meeting is that both were covered up to protect the hold on power and electoral dominance. As if the crimes of others in Congress was not enough to convince people that the GOP needs to be replaced, the Foley debacle ought to represent some kind of tipping point. Foley taking the Mel Gibson cure isn’t going to help, as no one believes that alcohol makes someone a pedophile any more than they believe alcohol makes someone a racist anti-Semite.
As for the cover-up of the July, 2001 meeting, that ought to be the tipping point for people to understand once and for all that this administration not only had opportunities to act in some way, but that they may have deliberately ignored these warnings, knowing that an attack would allow them to put their war plans into effect.
I would never suggest that the damage Foley may have done to these young people is not significant and reprehensible – it is an abomination that should be dealt with on a criminal basis, and those involved in keeping it quiet should also face charges.
I would like to suggest, also, that the cover-up of the Tenet meeting has caused damage that the nation may never recover from, and that has unnecessarily cost the lives of thousands of people.
I went and read Glenn’s piece and I think the following is the salient atke away.
The MSM is debating whether Hasert’s quick action to demand an investigation will deomonstate that the GOP leadership wants to get to the bottom of this and will help inooculate them from the revelation of thier cover up.
But Glenn’s right. Hassert’s letter calling for the investigation actually advances and furthers the coverup
Nice catch.
lina @ 35
So Foley is going to pull a Packwood?
Sh*theels, both of them.
msnbc – breaking
hastert is “disgusted and outraged” by e mails – house leadership rushing back to emergency meeting to facilitate investigation – hope Mr Shimkus has his bags packed
meta @ 39
a cornucopia? a plethora? a tsunami?
Calling on Henry Kissinger to help with the Iraq war is strange. Things started improving in Viet Nam the day after America withdrew. We’re now active trading partners with the Viet Namese.
Kissinger advising Bush that he should stay in Iraq because we should have stayed in Viet Nam is bizarre.
The logical, rational conclusion would be: get out of Iraq ASAP.
upurr @ 43
Prof #24 — that’s exactly why I called for FirePups and Kossacks to demand a House Ethics Committee investigation, that the vote passed in the House by Boehner in lieu of Boxer’s call for an investigation only agreed to refer the matter to the committee.
Boehner actually solicited the complicity of the entire House to bury an investigation to buy time.
We still need to demand an investigation; I should be more explicit that Boehner KILLED a House investigation with his move, that the House should be recalled to reconvene IMMEDIATELY to vote on an investigation, and that the House Ethics Committee investigation should cover the entire scope of this mess, from the so-called overly friendly emails up through the IM’s and the years of conventional wisdom on the House floor about Foley’s behavior and the subsequent lack of follow-up by the House Leadership to protect ALL pages, including Democratic pages.
Christy said:
I particularly like this part of a private and frank conversation between Rep. Murtha and General Abizaid:
Arghh Woodyword!
O/T Pajamas Media has this rather “remarkable” video interview with HoJo where he talks of “partisanship” and being “dissapointed” in the Chris Dodd et al. He claims his highest loyalty is to the people of CT (Not!). Oh and he claims 43% of voters in CT are independant. As a person from CT, it rings just a little false to my ears.
Christy,
What interesting connections your brain makes, especially at this hour! Happy talk indeed.
I fondly remembering my parents listening to that very same Percy Faith recording of South Pacific as well as sitting through the movie version of the musical. Even at the time, it had IMO a rather naive quality reflecting a time gone by or perhaps, a time that never really existed (e.g. Brigadoon).
Maybe those were simpler times when the bad guys wore black hats in all the right ’scenes’. These time are anything but simple or ‘happy’. We need a return to a more rational and less ‘faux-nostalgic’ approach to our lives.
As we have found with Clinton, Kennedy, and (subsequently) with Carter, complex times require complex leaders prepared to live in the real world; not leaders with complexes!
personally, I prefer conflagration
http://www.google.com/search?h…..p;ct=title
*ilson46201 @ 37
Ah, maybe mine are the movie soundtrack. Late 1950s.
I also think that the fact that Cheney conitued to support Rummy=Bush not getting rid of Rummy is quite telling.
It certainly fits with my Darth Cheney as puppetmaster point of view.
It explains a lot. It also makes my mouth water for whatever documents have been declassified from OVP for the Irving Libby trial.
Sigh, I wish discovery could be released, but sadly, we won’t know until things go into evidence.
Unless, Wells wants to leak some of it. Come on Ted, you lurking today? Throw us a bone. How about leaking some of your 3500 material? Please?
Sally @
38
Sally: Having been in the military myself I can testify that a soldier’s number one priority while on duty is to do what he/she is told, period, and I’m sure applauding for the cameras comes under that job description whenever Bush visits.
I’m earnestly hoping that in the privacy of a voting booth or absentee ballot, though, the military and their families will do the right thing for their country.
Prof @ 33
And perhaps even more helpful would be to make the MSM aware that they in fact are one of Hastert’s targets for the DOJ investigation.
As Glenn Greenwald has said (my shorthand), go after the folks who made this public, not the folks who covered it up.
Heh. Every time I see “South Pacific”, the first song that pops in my head is
“I’m Gonna Wash That Man Right Out Of My Hair“
Heh.
Still would love to see a GOTV effort made throughout hair salons on this theme, particularly since young women voters are most likely NOT to vote.
looseheadprop @ 47
I totally agree. I have had issues with alcohol abuse myself. And am neither a Rethug nor a pedophile.
I take issue with using alcohol abuse as an excuse for totally inexcusable behavior.
They think they don’t have to be accountable for their behavior.
snowball’s meltdown to be carried live on cnn at 1145.
heh.
gergen says the woodward book and foley is a 1-2 punch.
good morning.
Don’t fall into the trap of being an apologist for the other side. Like the VC and the NVA the “insurgents” in Iraq are unapologetic killers. To say that things go better in Viet Nam the day we left is a bit of a stretch. They are better now but there were an awful lot of people sent to re-education camps for 20 years that would argue how good things got.
Meet the new boss he;s the same as the old boss.
Slothrop @ 46
Tony Snow made a major political miscalculation this morning on “Good Morning America,” trivializing the Foley horror as “just a bunch of naughty emails.”
That’s one hell of a tin-eared thing to say. Can we run with that, please?
Also, Forti, a member of the NRCC, said re: Foley’s 2.7 million dollar campaign warchest, which is now up for grabs: “We’d love to take that money and spend it on other races.”
Compare and contrast that statement with the fact that people are forcing Republican candidates to return any money Foley may have given them.
That’s a statement that Emmanuel should make hay with–”Why wouldn’t Mr. Forti want to see that money donated to helping victims of cyber crimes?”
Start collecting all this Republican indifference to the sexual predation of children, and turn it into one, nice, long infomercial.
i’m curious how long george tenant can hold out with “no comment” on the allegations of the unreported meeting. could it be that he has finally decided enough is enough with covering for the bushies. i’m sure his medal of freedom is already starting to tarnish, and maybe he realizes he sold himself cheap buy taking so much of the fall for 9/11.
Does anyone know how ABC got the IM’s?
OT.. Ohio dirty election tricks continue..the county election commissioner moved the polling place of an Orthodox Jewish neighborhood, in Cleveland Heights, to a Christian Church. It is speculated that voters may choose not to vote in a Christian Church. You think?
upurr @ 58
Being an achoholic doesn’t make someone a pedophile. It may make one a sloppy pedophile who gets caught. So Foley is going to pull a Packwood? Sh*theels, both of them.
I totally agree. I have had issues with alcohol abuse myself. And am neither a Rethug nor a pedophile. I take issue with using alcohol abuse as an excuse for totally inexcusable behavior. They think they don’t have to be accountable for their behavior.
Rehab is a good place to hide for 30 days. Maybe he can stretch it to last until after the election. Hastert is probably wishing he could check-in someplace too at this point.
Henry Kissinger is a war criminal; it makes sense for him to be advising his brother in crime.
Heidi Collins says it’s a “shame” about Foley and “nothing has been proven yet”.
Gergen says not to jump to conclusions about a rethug coverup, but maybe it’s just negligence. Says we have yet to hear from the Xian right.
uh-huh.
why aren’t the Jersey Girls and other media prominent 9/11 Families banging on Woodward’s revelation about Condi’s 7/10 meeting ?
and oh p.s., we aren’t staying in Iraq b/c we should have stayed in Vietnam – Kissinger is simple cover for the institutionalized looting we call Iraq
looseheadprop @ 42
I think Hastert may have hoped that this would smooth things over, but I can’t see that happening once the DOJ/FBI investigators get involved. The letter asks that they investigate “who had specific knowledge of any sexually explicit communications.” That covers IMs, emails, or chats in the cloakrooms or over dinner at Mortons, and includes everyone who dealt with the pages.
From the experiences I’ve had with the folks who do investigations of child abuse allegations, these are dogged and persistent people with a passion not only against those who would take advantage of young people but also against those who would shield them.
Be afraid, Denny. Be very afraid . . .
i’m curious how long george tenet can hold out with “no comment” on the allegations of the unreported meeting with condi. could it be that he has finally decided enough is enough with covering for the bushies? i’m sure his medal of freedom is already starting to tarnish, and maybe he realizes he sold himself cheap by taking so much of the fall for 9/11.
raven316 @ 60
Murtha’s analogy to the Brits in India is a better example. They were there for 75 years, they left, there was a bloody civil war for a year, then they partitioned the country.
Clearly, base don the latest revelations reagrding pages, the campaign slogan needs to be:
Republicans: Only interested in covering their own asses.
Raven,
Still, the Kissinger as secret advisor thing is pretty weird. That one jumped out at me.
He is still a pretty high profile name. Why were they hiding him?
looseheadprop @ 70
e.c. @ 67
he didn’t just sell himself. he sold out the entire institution where he spent his career.
cbl #36 — wish I could make myself pony up the money for Woodie’s book to answer your question, but I still don’t trust the guy enough to part with hard-earned money.
I have read online, though, that he did actually interview both Tenet and Cofer Black. What bugs me is ALL of this stuff was going on, right under Woodie’s nose, during the interviews, research and subsequent writing of those execrable texts, Bush at War I and II.
Feh. He could have told ALL of this way back, Day One; he held it until a majority of Americans would support this different tack and maybe even part money for it.
Hence no cash from my pocket for it.
Anne #41 — I think a more successful tack for us on this is to contact the 9/11 Commission and ask what they will be doing to follow up on this matter of failing to disclose the 10-JUL-01 meeting to the Commission. And I’ll bet Kristen Breitweiser along with the rest of the Jersey Girls would be very happy to have the support on this matter.
cbl #44
“House leadership rushing back to facilitate investigation…”
I believe rushing back to facilitate cover-up would be more appropriate. Gotta get them in the same room so they are all on the same page with their stories. Excuse the pun.
looseheadprop @ 70
On his knees with Nixon’s ghost in the Lincoln bedroom?
looseheadprop @ 47
Bob Ney did the same thing, went into treatment for alcoholism It’s also out of the Roman Catholic hierarchy’s playbook,
which they have used again and again,to send child molestors to Alcohol/substance abuse rehab. The alcohol thing is pure bull-shit. Foley’s IM’s confirm he wasn’t drunk.lhp, really appreciated your comments about Mary Force above. I had forgotten about all her great work on classification/declassification. Also really appreciated your points from Glen about Hastert’s attempts at obfuscating in his letter.
looseheadprop @
71
Angie’s reaction @ 65 is probably a good clue. Henry’s name is not only high profile, but highly toxic in some quarters. Not just on lefty political blogs, but in certain diplomatic offices around the world.
looseheadprop @ 70
The old saw of:
The definition of crazy is repeatedly doing the same thing and expecting different results.
Repugs. Crazy. The same thing. Kissinger. Who’d a thought? *g*
cbl #66 — how do we know with any certainty that the Jersey Girls aren’t all over this? Could we know if the media has a blackout on them before the election?
Which makes me wonder if a dialogue here in the form of an interview with Christy or Jane and Kristen Breitweiser might get around any media blockade… ;-)
Bet you Breitweiser goes to HuffPo, too.
LHP #70 — after the sh*tstorm about Kissinger heading the 9/11 Commission leading to his walking away from it, I suspect the White House got savvy about hiding the criminal from sight.
But I do wonder whether the 9/11 Commission Chairmanship was a “thank you” to Kissinger for his guidance, or an inducement to stay close to the White House.
Scumsucking bastards, the lot of them.
cbl @ 66,
I think the institutional looting has been more of the US Treasury than Iraq.
Phone answering clerk at Mike Michaud’s office (Rep D ME) hadn’t heard about Foleygate. He knows now!
angie@65..Heidi Collins.”Nothing has been proven yet” WTF didn’t Foley admit doing it?
Legal question..In an AP story there was a line re: FBI checking to see if any pages are willing to cooperate with investigation.
Isn’t this case like having child porn on your computer. You don’t need the children in the pictures to cooperate to be prosecuted.
Rayne @ 73 on Anne #41 –
I think this is a great idea. We have to keep this story alive. It is the mother of all smoking guns.
What is the best way for us collectively to do this?
I agree, but I think a lot of the subsequent violence in Vietnam was a result of our presence. We propped up a very bad military junta masquerading as a government. IMO, the longer we stay in Iraq, the longer it will take them to put it back together.
Ditto what AZ Matt said; my stepson brought home photos on leave from his tour in Iraq. That country was bankrupt.
What Iraq provided was an opportunity to launder cash at a scale heretofore unseen anywhere in history or around the globe. Looting doesn’t adequately describe it; more like backing up 40-foot trailers in front of Fort Knox and making off with the contents right under our noses.
The moral cesspool of the modern day Whitehouse is getting deeper. Check out this quote regarding Bush attributed to Canada’s former PM Chretien.
“If I catch anyone who leaks in my government, I would like to string them up by the thumbs – the same way we do with prisoners in Guantanamo,” – President George W. Bush to Canadian prime minster, Jean Chretien, in March 2002. That’s according to Chretien’s closest political advisor in a new book.
As to the situation in Iraq. In the warped and perverse mind of Bush bodies lining the streets means that things are getting better.
-GSD
oh lordy, GSD.
I disagree, slightly, with Glenn’s analysis of Hastert’s letter – or perhaps it would be better to say that I disagree that it will have the effect of furthering a coverup.
I can’t see DOJ/FBI investigators saying “We’re just looking at IMs here.” The letter asks that they investigate anyone “who had specific knowledge of any s*xually explicit communications.” That covers IMs, emails, chats in the cloakrooms, or comments over dinner at Mortons, and includes everyone who dealt with the pages.
From the experiences I’ve had with the folks who do investigations of child abuse allegations, these are dogged and persistent people with a passion not only against those who would take advantage of young people but also against those who would shield them.
Be afraid, Denny. Be very afraid . . .
(trying again, as earlier version caught in the mod filters)
Rayne,
I hope your stepson stays safe. I’ve a nephew in Afghanistan so Bush’s crap is personal.
John Casper #84 — raven316 doesn’t go back far enough in time. You see, the U.S. is very much responsible for the killers in Iraq.
We funded Iraq in the 80’s (remember Rummy shaking hands with Hussein)?
We also funded the Taliban, those wonderful Afghani “freedom fighters” as St. Ronnie called them, because they were sticking it to the Soviets.
We are apologists, but not in the sense that raven316 implies; we are so f*cking sorry that we were not capable of systemic thought that could model scenarios over 20 years, that we can only think from one election to the next. We’d sown the whirlwind, and are we ever sorry for it.
Blessings for all our soldiers in the service. (my nephew too AZ but he’s in Iraq)
lina @ 35
Yup. It was prophesied here yesterday–if not Saturday.
Unfortunately for Foley, alcoholism has nothing to do with molesting children. Equally unfortunately for the House GOP leadership, it’s no dodge for covering up child molestation, either.
AZ Matt — my best to your nephew and your family; I know what a trying time this must be for you.
My stepson made it back safely, but he is not the same happy-go-lucky person he used to be. If this is all we have to worry about — a lingering case of PTSD and the hassles of the VA and other programs — then we are blessed and can only pray for this and better for the rest of the troops and their families.
But wasn’t the FBI itself part of the coverup, having heard about the story months ago? Are they just now launching an investigation, or is one now in progress and that is what caused the outing?
meta #94 — excellent point, and more reason why the House needs to demand an investigation.
Why didn’t the FBI already have a case open on Foley after CREW went to them months ago about this mess?
AZ Matt @ 80
Why not both?
Rehab or not, Foley was still working on laws about soliciting sex over the internet, alcholism is no excuse. Exploiting children should not be excused or tolerated.
On top that, warnings went as far back as 2001 to Pages about him.
Once Christy puts up her next post regarding Hastert’s efforts to derail/delay the investigation into Predatorgate via procedural shenanegans, we all need to spotlight the living daylights out of the post.
It is especially important to spotlight locally, to media in Hastert’s district.
We need to get all of the information regarding Hastert’s involvement in the cover-up squarely in front of those who will vote for or against him on November 7.
The time is now.
And the same goes for Shimkus. And everyone else involved in this coverup.
Spotlight is the tool.
Use it – and aim it locally at the districts of these scoundrels.
I guess the only thing elected officials can lose their job over, or lose an election, is sex.
From MSNBC:
Sunday House Speaker Dennis Hastert asked for a federal investigation into the case — a lurid scandal that has put House Republicans in political peril.
*xyz @ 99
Amen! The big papers around their areas – St. Louis Post Dispatch and the Chicago Tribune – are already pushing the story, but giving them a little help never hurts. And watch the other districts involved – Boehner, Alexander, etc.
Listening to WNYC this AM. To show you how delusional the junta supporters are a caller actually said that the senile madman sent enough troops to Iraq because sending more troops would have given the insurgents more targets and caused more Soldier deaths.
It doesn’t matter what they do or say their worshippers will find some way to forgive them.
EvilDrPuma @ 96
True, but looting the Treasury is far easier, just call up your bought-off congressfolks. No long flights and less dust and heat to be bothered about.
Haven’t read Glenn’s analysis yet (I’m pretty certain I’ll agree with it based on past experience), but my first reaction to hearing the blurbs of Hastert’s letter was that they were framing the inquiry to avoid any question re: what they did. (As Christy well knows, the most important part of taking up an appeal is phrasing the question presented)
Glad Glenn took it up, have to wait a bit to read up on the ‘investigating outsiders’ part, but that raised my eyebrows, too (but I’m not as astute as Glenn – I just knew it was odd and therefore meant something.)
Damn it would be nice if Boner could go down with this too – and if Ohio could get rid of Ney, Boner, and Mean Jean in one election cycle — hoo boy! (and Kilroy v. Pryce is competitive)
Great points Rayne at 7:36. I wish the TM would give that photo of Rummy shaking hands with Saddam more attention.
Hastert can’t undo his evolving story that went from…”I didn’t know anything” on Friday to…”I was probably told but I can’t recall” on Saturday.
-sigh-
It’s not “President Happy Talk” it’s Preznit Happy Talk. Can’t we all get along here…
lol!
ccmask @ 100
We go into elections with the electorate we have, not the electorate we wish we had…
Speaker Hastert’s Democratic opponent is the cute progressive John Laesch at http://www.john06.com
Wait for it. Woodward is setting the stage for his endorsement of the new improved republican candidate who will fix this mess right this time. (Snark factor 10)
Cozumel @ 106
No, he can’t. Moreover, although he’s operating on an institutional level now rather than a personalized knee-jerk level, I think he’s still doing much the same thing he was doing Friday. This is full-blown CYA mode. His Friday and Saturday excuses were uncoordinated and poorly thought out, and considering how many related or possibly related threads of information became available over the weekend and the way the MSM is playing this, I think it’s a pretty poor move to try a call for an obviously diversionary investigation at this stage.
Hastert has failed to contain this scandal. I think it will take something close to a miracle for him to gain any real control of it now.
Don’t know if it’s been mentioned at all this weekend, but the Sunday WaPo Magazine had a good read on Colin Powell.
Professor Foland says “We go into elections with the electorate we have, not the electorate we wish we had…”
Not for long, Professor :))
Anne @ 112
Meaning, one that pointed out his forty-year history of aiding and abetting coverups of war crimes and public corruption?
Maybe KO will have one or more of the Jersey girls on Countdown.
How many more days of donating to campaigns?
I don’t know Bobdog -seems like UNcovering 16yo asses is more their MO.
cbl @32 – the basis for the delay ? Supposedly still has more cooperating to do – both sides asked for a lenthier delay, for him and Kidan, but Abramoff is on his third and the judge was antsy and cranky from the 2nd (June/July?) and seems to be done with any more. Still, it did bump him to after the election.
lhp – thanks, but I don’t see any of it happening. Chretien’s exchange with Townsend and later Powell coming out, now this. I hope there is a little ripple to his effort to smack back at Harper, but I don’t expect much here – MSM still doesn’t seem that capable of completing the Highlights monthly Connect The Dots entry.
OTOH, WaPo had a lovely piece explaining that all the antiwar folk are suffering now from some psychobabble disease process involving hindsight. Oh, to be smart like the WaPo crew.
And on CREW – I didn’t realize they had already done something about Foley. CREW, POGO and Laesch – a few bright spots today.
ooh, Hastert and his newfound concern being featured by Andrea Koppel and it is not pretty… at all.
Sally: I can’t wait for Keith O, Stewart and Colbert tonite…….gonna be great.
FBI begins Foley scandal probe.
Foley
October 01, 2006 6:00 PM
Brian Ross Reports:
Mark_foley5_nrThe FBI has opened a “preliminary investigation” of disgraced former Congressman Mark Foley over the sexually explicit Internet messages he sent to congressional pages, all male high school students under the age of 18.
snip
http://rawstory.com/
I wonder what Woodward (and many more), would/will say upon seeing this?
US Set To Attck Iran Sooner Instead Of Later?
ccmask @ 119
Oh, God, yes. When the House GOP falls into a steaming pile like this, our heroes are gonna come up covered in diamonds.
If we stay in Iraq and end up winning the war, what exactly do we win? I forget…
lhp – if you are around or see this later; thoughts on Ralston as the crossover point for the Plame and Abramoff investigatons? Ever since she was questioned in Plame I’ve wondered how much coordination there might be – with a crossover lawyer as well (although I guess almost everyone DCish ends up touching some part of the Abramoff investigation)
later
I guess everyone knows already that Foley is in a treatment center for alcohol and social problems, right? MSNBC has the story on tyhe homepage.
ccmask @ 122
Iraqis won’t attack us on the streets of Peoria.
ccmask @ 119
Stewart is Jewish, you’ll have to wait till Tuesday probably ; )
ccmask @ 125
We know. We just don’t care. C’mon, this has to be the lamest attempt at image recovery since…well, whatever Hastert was doing an hour ago.
This IM conversation is up at the ABC News website, and appears to be new. What caught my eye is Foley talking about being together with a page in San Diego and asking him “did you want to foll(sic) around” Seems like we are looking at the tip of an iceberg here:
—–
“Using the screen name Maf54, he tried to lure teens who had been congressional pages into sexual conversations and acts, according to copies of messages obtained by ABC News.
Maf54: i like you a lot.
Teen: im flattered
Maf54: are you
Teen: yes.
Maf54: well I was so hapy to be with you in san diego
Teen: ya it was fun
Maf54: did you want to foll around
Teen: ok…I really need to get back to studying.
One former page says pages were warned specifically to be careful with Foley five years ago.
“I know people who had been interacting with him like that, so I wasn’t surprised. You know it’s one of those things you know is going to come out some day,” Matthew Loraditch, a page in the 2001-2002 class who is now president of the Page Alumni Association, said.
House Republican leaders were told about possible problems with Foley last year, and now they want an investigation to see how many pages may have been victimized by Foley.
“Parents are going to be wondering what’s going on. I mean, this guy has been doing stuff to kids for years, and they’re going to be worried about the kids that are in there now and the kids that want to apply,” Loraditch says.”
b4 later – ccmask – the problem is that both our definition of winning and the jihadist definition of winning involve the same focal point – US troops going home. So we’ve been neatly positioned into never being able to win, without handing them a win. Which, of course, we can’t do – bc we lose if the jihadists win. So we literally can’t win for losing.
The DC brilliance is blinding.
Of course, according to WaPo I’m just delusionally absorbed in a hindsight episode, a much more disturbing thing for them to watch than a series of CYA episodes from their DC pals.
Stop me if I’m wrong, but isn’t Melanie Sloan a member of CREW and also working with the Wilsons on their lawsuit? And hasn’t she appeared on KO’s program?
One thing I’ve been trying to figure out is wht ABC, the same dirtbags who aired “Path to9/11) broke this story so close to election time. The only thing that would make sense is if they are indeed trying to take focus off of Woodward’s book.
Either that, or they are being objective journalists (bwahahahahaha)
Steve @ 63
This all began with one questionable, but not sexual email from a page for which I don’t know how they got the story, it was an exclusive.
However, after ABC’s first report about it, other pages were emboldened to come forward and produced far more lewd IM’s and the story keeps expanding.
big protest in NYC on 10/5 re torture:
http://worldcantwait.org/
Here’s a link to the ABC article I mentioned a moment ago (with what appears to be a new IM conversation):
http://blogs.abcnews.com/thebl…..s_on_.html
One wonders how long Woodward has been holding on to this information instead of making it public…
Let’s face it, it’s a good thing this is coming out now, rather than six months ago. If it had, they would have spun it to death already, and people would have forgotten it.
As it is, it’s coming out a month before the election. It’ll still be fresh in people’s minds when people vote, and BushCo doesn’t have any tricks left up their sleeve.
Let’s give credit where credit is due. I think we should thank Woodward for keeping his powder dry until now.
I love you, Christy, but this is why I love Digby, too:
http://digbysblog.blogspot.com…..2219286389
Feeling safer?
After reading the Rolling Stone article “From an Al Qaeda Childhood to a Gitmo Cell” this morning the Foley episode seems far less shocking. I guess I’ve always seen Republicans as illuminati but never imagined it possible to whole sale the country into it. Foley had access to a lot of government information on sex crimes, that’s hideous. Republicans, the Christian right, and many others in this country so uppity about Foley but uninterested in the vast majority of other very serious crimes of this administration. Henry Kissinger, that’s creepy. I’ve been to Vietnam recently, seemed to me they make far better allies when were not bombing them. I have a very strong hunch know matter if we had stayed longer in Vietnam we would not have won. Vietnam is quickly on it’s way to competing with the top in their region of the world and is no enemy to the U.S. There are many political opportunities at the moment and all should be exploited but I have my cautions about “Memogate” episodes or not being led and manipulated more importantly the weakness of opposition leaders. Probably we in this community have a lot more impact than we realize or give ourselves credit for (after all I don’t think msm or government etc. want us or anyone else to know), from that standpoint it’s up to us to push the substantial issues.
First question and response at the WaPo’s online chat is about Hastert:
Ive been listening to Seder this morning and hes talking about Iran as it progresses toward who knows what.
Wonder if Foley was let out as a smokescreen to take attention away from Iran?
Hasterts back in WA, this am to focus on Foley,scandal wants to ck on safety for pages .He is running scared folks.
Mary — hey thanks for the comment in Late Night about Ralston.
We’re on the same page, I think. She definitely is a player in virtually anything that went through Rove’s office.
Would love to know what Fitz got out of her.
And I’d love to know how to go about pressing for an ethics violation investigation based on her comments about profiteering starting businesses in tandem with government activity.
Criticizing the “do-nothing but protect child predators” congress can only embolden Al Qaeda.
-Tony Snow
Wow. TPM Muckraker has more bombshells
—–
“GOP Rep Kept out of Loop on Foley Emails
By Paul Kiel – October 2, 2006, 11:15 AM
Uh-oh. A second member of the panel which oversees the House page program says she was never told of Foley’s emails, despite claims that her board had investigated the matter.
Rep. Shelley Moore Capito (R-WV) says she was “astounded” to learn of the emails on Thursday. And she says that had she known, she would have done more than Shimkus or other House leaders. Rep. Dale Kildee (D-MI) said on Saturday that he was never informed of the matter.
Now, there are only three lawmakers on the panel. So it appears that Rep. John Shimkus (R-IL), the chair of the board, was not only one of the first in Congress to learn of “over-friendly” emails from Rep. Mark Foley (R-FL) to a page, but the only member of the page board to know. He went to the House leadership with the problem, but apparently kept his fellow page board members in the dark.
—–
Follow the link for quotes:
http://tpmmuckraker.com/
lina (18), I’ve been wondering how the Republican military will vote after all that has gone before. Someone here pointed out that former military are running for elected office as Democrats. That’s true but I still see the military enthusiastically applauding Bush during his speechifying day job when telling them we are winning the war and other fables.
Really? The latest speeches I’ve heard on NPR, the applause when Bush’s pauses, sound forced, like “oh yeah, we’re supposed to clap now.”
cosmo @ 130
As far as I can tell it started here: http://www.dailykos.com/commen…..458/60#c60
and it busted out here: http://stopsexpredators.blogspot.com/
snowbird42 @ 139
If so, somebody is pretty desperate for a smokescreen. This could cost Bush supporters in the House.
This Old Brit @ 121
Thanks for the link.
snowbird42 @ 139
As dab from CT reminded us last night, maybe we need to start saying “Wag the Dog” before it happens…
Tony Snow: “Naughty emails…” http://thinkprogress.org/2006/…..ty-emails/
Rep. Shelley Moore Capito (R-WV) says she was “astounded” to learn of the emails on Thursday.
LOL It’s getting pretty crowded under that bus ; )
snowbird42 @ 139
Seder’s show is a “best-of” today – makes you wonder why they bother to run repeats of the talk shows, as they are completely irrelevant/old news 1 day after they originally ran. Stupid Air America!
snowbird42 @ 138
i fear it is more likely that *some* people may think an early attack on iran would be useful as a smokescreen to take attention away from foley & woodward.
Check this out:
http://www.pagealumni.us/boards/
What is that supposed to mean?????
Lou Costello @ 148
Tony Snow is irrelevant. Pass it on.
I hope someone has warned the males in the rehab center about Foley’s follies.
wow, could anything say CY(political)A more than NOT telling the page board there might be a problem with a member hitting on pages? with foley having exited stage left before the scandal really started to break wide, the gop is going to have to offer up another sacrifice at some point. any bets on who has to take the fall.
Cozumel — didn’t you know it’s a school-bus yellow Hummer H1 with 4WD they’re using these days?
Plenty of room under there.
cOSMA SAID:Either that, or they are being objective journalists (bwahahahahaha)
Please Cosmo, my lips are chapped–too much sun yesterday.
I’ve also been trying to find out what other committees Foley may have been on, but all sites seems to be slammed at the moment. Also, looking for the entire membership of the page board.
Lou Costello @ 145
So how in the hell can ABC claim this is an “exlusive”?? Geez louise!
FDL and other blogs broke this yesterday, from today’s LATimes, bold is mine.
Foley’s longtime chief of staff is now a senior aide to Rep. Thomas M. Reynolds (R-N.Y.), who as chairman of the National Republican Congressional Committee is leading the effort to maintain the GOP majority in the House. In addition, Foley’s campaign committee gave $100,000 to the NRCC this summer, campaign finance records show.
Seizing on the campaign donation, which put Foley among the GOP committee’s bigger donors, the Democratic National Committee stepped up its accusations that Reynolds and other Republican leaders were more interested in protecting Foley than investigating potential misconduct.
Rayne @ 156
I belive the wheels are starting to come off that bus.
cosmo #150 — easy there, it’s the most important holy day of the year on the Jewish calendar.
There will be a number of folks in media and entertainment who will be observing.
meta– he was on the ways and means cmte.
http://waysandmeans.house.gov/members.asp
“The problem we face is not a lack of will. The problem is an unwillingness to face reality.” — George Soros, last nite on Book tv, C-SPAN-2
And this:
– Larry Johnson, from Are you a Republican, linked above.
rat bastahd (145), for their sake, I hope our military troops are on to Bush and Company, and I hope the Democrats keep all the promises the Republicans made and failed to keep.
Professor Foland, I think you’re absolutely correct about that. I don’t think they have any more old Osama tapes to leak, what else does the WH have left except Iran?
My bet is that Shimkus will be the next to resign.
I’m thinking it will happen by Wednesday.
The fact that he apparently did not discuss the Foley emails with the two other members of the page board is indefensible.
cosmo @ 159
Their people cribbed it from the blogs before CBS or NBC got there. Hence, an exclusive.
meta– here’s info on the page board.
(emphasis mine)
http://www.house.gov/cardoza/pages.shtml
meta @ 158
Foley served on Ways and Means – the tax writing folks.
The page board is the Clerk of the House, the Sergeant at Arms, two members appointed by the Speaker, and one by the minority leader. Shimkus (IL-19) is the Chair, Dale Kildee is the minority appointee (MI-5), but I can’t figure out the third member.
Hastert Yanks Press Releases On Efforts To ‘Keep Kids Safe in Cyberspace’ From His Website
http://thinkprogress.org/2006/…..yberspace/
Maybe not so safe if it means telling the truth.
Not surprised Hastert is back in D.C. Many more ‘friends’ there. This morning some reporter was at the train station in Chicago holding up Chicago newspapers with “Hastert Folds” all over the front page. They were asking riders what they thought as they were just learning about it. Mostly, if there was a coverup, oh my… people were not happy.
So Hastert came back to D.C. to check in with PappaRove.
check *xyz at 143 for the third member.
Peterr @ 170
Third member
Rep. Shelley Moore Capito (R-WV) says she was “astounded” to learn of the emails on Thursday. And she says that had she known, she would have done more than Shimkus or other House leaders. Rep. Dale Kildee (D-MI) said on Saturday that he was never informed of the matter.
Old Sow @
82
Did you call your representative’s office yet?
Lou Costello @ 170
Nice dealing with the problem there. You’re doin’ a heckuva job, Denny.
Lou Costello @ 148
Right up there with ‘Its just a number.’
Thanks very much, peeps.
*xyz – Thanks!
Missed your earlier comment (sorry about that)
Hmmmm . . . Capito represents WV-2. That can only call to mind one question: Which district is Christy in?
“Right up there with ‘Its just a number’” is also in competition with Bush’s “Iraq will be a comma in history” (paraphrasing from memory).
Since it sounds as though some of us aren’t going to pay for Bob’s book, here’s an excerpt.
The biggest question mark was Secretary of Defense Donald H. Rumsfeld
By Bob Woodward
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, October 2, 2006; Page A01
I will not withdraw even if laura and barney are the only ones supporting me.”
One down, one to go. Sounds like a job for “the Dog Whisperer.”
*xyz @ 174
Wow!
Your move, Christy.
GrandmaJ @ 180
And in the history books, Bush will be the colon.
scarecrow @ 163
i liked this interview too…. and it’s available from several sources, if anyother firepups want to take a listen:
new america foundation **
c-span streaming
and via c-span podcast (not posted yet, expect it will be soon)
** related discussion
sounds like it was a men’s only, republican secret society…
ugh.
Woodward: Late last year, he had key republicans up to the white house to talk about the war and said, “I will not withdraw even if laura and barney are the only ones supporting me.”
Is the military his personal property, for him to ignore all advise? He sure sounds like it.
John Casper @ 167
Bird Flu. Just watch.
angie @ 187
Congressional version of Skull & Boners?
new thread: Taking the GOP CYA train
New Thread
*ilson46201 @
37
This is the kind of pissing contest I love to watch! No matter what the Republicans try to do to destroy civilized life, *ilson and the Prof are here to remind us of the finer things.
And speaking of South Pacific, what a celebration of liberal values! Anti-racist, anti-fascist, flat-out giddy over the use of power and resources to enhance the common good.
I’ve got the movie in my library. Sounds like a good time to watch it again.
Because they know some of us haven’t forgotten. By the same token, unlike Kerry and his “Nixon’s War” BS some of us also remember that it was just as much LBJ’s war as it was Tricky Dick’s. Think about that when we consider Hillary and her calculated stand on Iraq.
looseheadprop @ 71