
In the GOP pattern of behavior throughout the Bush Administration (and beyond, frankly, but let's stick to recent history), the public pronouncements and the behind-the-scenes honest facts don't match up. Again.
And this time, it wasn't soldiers at risk from lies and the cover-ups — it was teenagers entrusted to work as pages in Congress, and a Republican leadership more interested in keeping smarmy Uncle Foley's secret "in the family" than in making certain every page serving in the House stayed safe from the hard cruise and grooming e-mails, with the GOP leadership's outrage reserved only for the after-the-fact time when they got caught with their hands in the cover-up jar.
Glenn hits the nail on the head here:
As much as anything else, that is what this scandal is about — GOP House Leaders prancing around as the Protectors of our nation's children from Internet Predators while, at the same time, apparently knowing that there was such a predator in their midst. And they not only failed to do anything about it, but they actively worked to conceal the behavior (by, as noted below, ensuring that all Democrats — including even the Democrat on the House Page Board — were blocked from learning about these accusations). As Hastert put it at the top of his Press Release (emphasis in original): “At home we put children first, and Republicans are doing just that in the House.”
It is this same pattern of behavior, over and over again, putting the Republican party's interests ahead of the public's.
– Whether we are talking about children serving as pages in the House whose safety took a back seat to protecting the GOP public reputation through covering up for Rep. Foley no matter the cost to the kids:
Top House Republicans knew for months about e-mail traffic between Representative Mark Foley and a former teenage page, but kept the matter secret and allowed Mr. Foley to remain head of a Congressional caucus on children’s issues, Republican lawmakers said Saturday.
But news reports about the exchanges led to the disclosure of e-mail correspondence with other former pages in which the discussions became more and more sexually explicit. Shortly after he was confronted by ABC News on Friday about the subject, Mr. Foley, who represented a south Florida district, resigned from the House.
The revelations set off a political upheaval, with Democrats and some Republicans calling for a full investigation of Mr. Foley’s conduct and whether House leaders did enough to look into it. Members of the Republican leadership sought Saturday to detail how they had handled the case in an effort to defuse the situation, even as it was emerging as an issue in Congressional races.
Among those who became aware earlier this year of the fall 2005 communications between Mr. Foley and the 16-year-old page, who worked for Representative Rodney Alexander, Republican of Louisiana, were Representative John A. Boehner, the majority leader, and Representative Thomas M. Reynolds of New York, chairman of the National Republican Congressional Committee. Mr. Reynolds said in a statement Saturday that he had also personally raised the issue with Speaker J. Dennis Hastert….
The tap dancing and finger pointing underway in the Republican leadership is appalling. And the rush to set up a "hotline" for worried parents eleven months after the leadership learned of this problem is way too little, much much too late.
At what point did the leadership say to themselves "Hmmm, here we have an elected official in his 50s, flirting with a 16-year-old and asking him to send pictures. That's creepy and inappropriate, and perhaps we should investigate further than just telling everyone to keep it quiet and hope it will go away." Answer: only after the media exposed the problem months after the fact. Heckuva job, Denny.
House Speaker J. Dennis Hastert (R-Ill.) was notified early this year of inappropriate e-mails from former representative Mark Foley (R-Fla.) to a 16-year-old page, a top GOP House member said yesterday — contradicting the speaker's assertions that he learned of concerns about Foley only last week.
Hastert did not dispute the claims of Rep. Thomas M. Reynolds (R-N.Y.), and his office confirmed that some of Hastert's top aides knew last year that Foley had been ordered to cease contact with the boy and to treat all pages respectfully.
Reynolds, chairman of the National Republican Congressional Committee, became the second senior House Republican to say that Hastert has known of Foley's contacts for months, prompting Democratic attacks about the GOP leadership's inaction. Foley abruptly resigned his seat Friday.
House Majority Leader John A. Boehner (R-Ohio) told The Washington Post on Friday that he had learned in late spring of inappropriate e-mails Foley sent to the page, a boy from Louisiana, and that he promptly told Hastert, who appeared to know already of the concerns. Hours later, Boehner contacted The Post to say he could not be sure he had spoken with Hastert.
Yesterday's developments revealed a rift at the highest echelons of House Republican ranks a month before the Nov. 7 elections, and they threatened to expand the scandal to a full-blown party dilemma.
Only after Reynolds's definitive statement did Hastert concede yesterday that he may have been notified of some of the questionable activities of Foley, 52, who had co-chaired the Congressional Missing and Exploited Children's Caucus. Hastert said, however, that he knew nothing of the sexually explicit instant messages that became public Friday when ABC News and other news outlets reported them. The messages apparently were exchanged with youths other than the 16-year-old.
Hastert's aides learned in the fall of 2005 only of e-mail exchanges that House officials eventually deemed "over-friendly" with the Louisiana teenager, the speaker's office said yesterday in a lengthy statement. "While the Speaker does not explicitly recall this conversation" with Reynolds, the statement said, "he has no reason to dispute Congressman Reynolds's recollection that he reported to him on the problem and its resolution."
Boehner and Reynolds said their offices learned of the Foley e-mails months ago from Rep. Rodney Alexander (R), who sponsored the page from his northeastern-Louisiana district….
Let's talk for a moment about what a person honestly concerned about the well-being of the teenagers involved would have done: (1) talked with the page in question; (2) talked with the parents of that page; (3) talked to other pages; (4) an actual, thorough and real investigation; (5) contacted outside authorities with no political axe to grind to conduct an independent investigation to assure that nothing untoward was happening; (6) pretty much anything but a cover-up and an admonishment to treat the teenagers with whom this grown elected official was flirting with "respect." (Hello GOP Leadership, in the corporate world, this sort of brush-off of a sexual harassment problem with one of your partners would get you slapped silly with a civil lawsuit. Do you think the rules do not apply in Congress or that the children who serve there are less worthy of protection than adults in the workplace? RollCall has more.)
What did the Republican leadership actually do? No one has any clear picture of that at the moment, because they are all running around in circles pointing the finger at each other, with no one standing up and taking any responsibility whatsoever for their failure of leadership or concern for the kids who were placed at risk by pervy Uncle Foley's masturbation and grooming advances. Josh Marshall has a sort of chronology going on this — it really needs a vast flow chart at this point with all the finger pointing and backtracking — and it doesn't look good for most of the GOP leadership. Pathetic.
But when you pan out a bit and look at the broader context of the Republicans and their consistent CYA behavior versus choosing actual honesty with the public, it is not a pretty picture:
– Who could forget George Bush's "Mission Accomplished"? Certainly not the families of all those soldiers killed and wounded since May 2, 2003.
– Or the praise in his "Brownie, you are doing a heckuva job!" statement as the mess of Katrina was still underway.
– Or Condi's "mushroom cloud" that the Bush Administration already knew could never be;
– CIA leak case, anyone?
– To this morning's revelation of the Bush Administration keeping the whole story about Bush Administration failures from the 9/11 Commission:
…If true, it is shocking that the administration failed to heed such an overwhelming alert from the two officials in the best position to know. Many, many questions need to be asked and answered about this revelation — questions that the 9/11 Commission would have asked, had the Commission been told about this significant meeting. Suspiciously, the Commissioners and the staff investigating the administration’s actions prior to 9/11 were never informed of the meeting. As Commissioner Jamie Gorelick pointed out, “We didn’t know about the meeting itself. I can assure you it would have been in our report if we had known to ask about it.”
The Commission interviewed Condoleezza Rice privately and during public testimony; it interviewed George Tenet three times privately and during public testimony; and Cofer Black was also interviewed privately and publicly. All of them were obligated to tell the truth. Apparently, none of them described this meeting, the purpose of which clearly was central to the Commission’s investigation. Moreover, document requests to both the White House and to the CIA should have revealed the fact that this meeting took place. Now, more than two years after the release of the Commission’s report, we learn of this meeting from Bob Woodward….
And there are so many more examples, that I can't even list them all in a single post. So. Many. More.
Aren't you asking yourself this question: What else do we not know that the GOP is hiding from the public? And aren't you tired of all the hypocrisy, the lies, the cover-ups and the CYA? It's time for some accountability…America simply cannot afford to be shoved in the back seat by the GOP any longer, while they put themselves and their party's hold on power front and center in every decision.
America deserves to come first.
Had enough? It is high time for accountability — and the only way to ensure that is to have Congress controlled by the Democrats. The Republicans have proved that they cannot be trusted to do their jobs, to uphold the Constitution or to investigate their own problems.
Restore some balance in our government and some oversight between our branches — vote for Democrats.



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FITZ!
Who wants to wrestle? Maybe Denny can coach us!
YEEAAAHHRG!!!
OK, now to read the post. ;)
somehow the meme of Archbishop Dennis keeps arising …
Heard of protecting forests, clean skies, the middlde class? Now the Repugs say they protect children. Every time they assert protection of something or someone, you can bet they’re lying. But if you say something often enough, the uninformed public will believe it. Get rid of these liars. It’s time for Hastert to go!
who could have anticipated the breaching of the Levi’s ?
Just watched Skeletor Kristol get hammered by Shepherd Smith on Fox. He keeps saying add more troops. Why doesn’t Shep ask him WHERE THE FUCK those troops are going to come from? AND WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO WIN?!
/tantrum
*ilson46201 @ 7
They’re Wranglers
It’s me again. I just watched Meet the Press and was disgusted. DeWine was given 66% of the time and then also was permitted to interrupt Brown’s every comment, even his closing statement. Russert consistently told Brown he had 25 or 30 seconds to respond to a question or a DeWine answer, never set a time limit on DeWine.
EPU’d from last thread.
On the Foley coverage this morning I noticed no one challenging Bartlett or any of the repug heads in terms of follow up on the answers.
The question should have been,
“If they say they saw the e-mails and then did an investigation why did they NOT find out about the instant messages?
And if they did truly investigate and find out about them, why did they not ask for Foley’s resignation then and proceed with a criminal referral?”
That’s what I would have asked.
Republican insiders said Reynolds spoke out because he was angry that Hastert appeared willing to let him take the blame for the party leadership’s silence.
A House GOP leadership aide, who spoke on the condition of anonymity for fear of losing his job, said that Reynolds realizes he has taken a shot at his leader but that it is understandable.
“This is what happens when one member tries to throw another member under a bus,” the aide said.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..01265.html
This is getting good.
Hastert was a teacher – he, of all people, should know about responsibility in all this…
cando @ 10
yep, tossing a life line to Mikey?
OldCoastie at 13 — in most jurisdictions, teachers are mandatory reporters of suspected sexual harassment or abuse. Hastert certainly should have known better. (Although it has been quite a while since he was teaching — perhaps all those years in the GOP leadership stable caused him to forget his ethical obligations to protect children…)
Kissinger sounded absolutely beaten and miserable and almost nonsensical. No wonder Bush is in a world of shit (WOS)with senile old war criminals like Kissinger on the dole for opinion……
I am just waiting for The Sandman to come out and start giving these assclappers the hook.
-GSD
OldCoastie @ 13
and a wrestling coach (hot, sweaty men grappling and grasping…)
Christy Hardin Smith @ 15
yes, he should have and it disgusts me.
*ilson46201 @
17
Imagine Denny in a singlet?
Hastert:
*Hey, he didn’t fuck anyone … what’s the big deal?*
Twisted Martini: you just broke my brain.
Jane, I resign. I’m done.
That 800 number is nothing more than a Republican collection point for additional incidents that they can then attempt to head off at the pass without anyone else knowing about.
eww! where’s the eye bleach?
let’s get ready for the SMEAR . . .
oh well NAMBLA-DE-DA!!!
nothing to see here; move along.
IOKIYAR!
;-P
Twisted Martini @ 19
You’d have to make it a doublet.
-GSD
Twisted Martini @
2
ewwww……
i’ll need to evict the resultant visual before arriving at the farmers’ market
cando @
6
oh…the Healthy Forests act – “announced” by Shrub during a long-scheduled visit to the Pacific Northwest; his visit just happened to coincide with an immense forest fire. Caused by arson.
Shrub’s minions re-wrote the law and administrative regs to practically mandate logging federal lands after forest fires.
The result: light it, burn it, log it.
Set forest fires. Wait until the timber sales of the burned forest. Log the standing trees.
Leave a moonscape.
In the PNW conifer forests, a vast proportion of the biota (living matter) is in the soil and a significant amount is in the standing wood. The PNW ecosystems are adapted to and dependent upon periodic fires.
Extensive logging of burned wood after fires removes the nutrients in the standing wood and greatly accelerates eroison of the soil: nifty way to wash and log away the nutrients required for forest regeneration.
Healthy Forests = Light it, Burn it, Log it.
No Child Left Behind = We Molest Schoolkids.
War on Terror = Overthrow the Republic.
————
the farmers’ market is calling…heirlooms and stone fruit and berries and salmon.
oh my! :)
Twisted Martini @ 19
do they make them in XXXLarge ?
*ilson46201 @
5
Yeah, Archbishop J. Dennis Hastert of the diocese of Northern Illinois.
From the early thread
Denny Hastert in a . . .
Christy –
Have you read the “Adam Walsh Child Protection Act of 2006″? What are it’s penalties? If it makes internet solicitation a felony, then the ENTIRE Republican Leadership engaged in a Criminal Conspiracy to coverup a felony commited by one of their own.
EPU’d from yesterday –
shooogarp @ 128 — from Glenn:
http://glenngreenwald.blogspot.com/
Christy Hardin Smith @ 15
Christy,
Any ideas as to what reporting requirements there are, if any, concerning the need to notify law enforcement about what Foley did? Since these pages are students at the House school, it would seem that the House would need to notify the school administration. Are there any rules at all on these issues at the federal level? Or is it make them up as they go along?
*ilson – not enough X’s…
Twisted Martini @ 19
oh.my.goddess.
blech
i think i’ll need to put up whatever comes back from the market. i won’t be hungry all week.
The only campaign slogan needed” Had enough yet?”
windje @ 29
Forget the singlet, he needs a mansierre!
And the question needs to be asked, why did they refer the problem to the head of the NRCC, instead of the House Ethics Committee?
Suggested answer:Because they first needed to contain the political consequences before dealing with the ethics and the welfare of the pages?
orangejumpsuit @ 36
Aravosis asked this very question yesterday on CNN.
The only problem I have with this commentary is that it’s 100% partisan (of course). Fact is, this is politics, it’s humanity, and it happens on both sides of the isle.
Yes, I’ll agree the Repbulicans apparently are more outwardly arrogant and self-righteous about their corrupt and unethical behaviors, but elected Democrats aren’t saints, and this is what this commentary implies.
It’s the system that is the problem here, more than which club it’s members claim to be members of.
Given these facts, I would agree that what we do need a return to is that ‘balance’ of power, the so called ‘checks and balances’ that are supposed to exist in our government rather than the one-party rule that exists at the moment.
But that’s still way short of actually fixing the roots of our bigger problems with our government system – that being that money has corrupted it beyond comprehension – whereby our representatives do not represent us little people, but rather those who lavish them with weath and power.
Having “Democrats” controll congress won’t fix our problems, as this commentary seems to imply.
Changing the system so that our self-serving representatives can’t profit personally by the system is the only real meaningful step that can be taken in that direction.
Simon
Fresno, CA
orangejumpsuit @ 36
And to protect the page’s privacy.
Same reason they gave for not investigating more when they learned of this A YEAR AGO.
Simon – tell me, when was the last time you saw a Dem molesting children and then having the Democratic leadership actively working to cover it up?
AZ Matt at 31 — well, generally, mandatory reporters are given some training in terms of what signs/red flags you look for in potential abuse cases. Here in WV, teachers are given continuing education discussions at various points in looking for physical signs (bruising, shying away from touch, sudden changes of behavior) as well as other indicators for physical and other abuse. Hastert may not have had training in terms of looking for predatory signs for grooming and other “off” signals from a potential “abuser” — but any of the former US Attorneys who serve in Congress or on the staff should have had that training from the child abuse cases they have prosecuted at any time in their legal tenure.
Don’t think I saw this one mentioned yet, sorry if it’s a dupe:
http://www.tcpalm.com/tcp/flor…..17,00.html
I’m guessing Hastert’s singlet would have to be a triplet or quadruplet, at least. Quint- or sext-, in a pinch. (Ouch)
I haven’t read much from the GOP “leadership” about being outraged or surprised by this… in fact, I find the most damning part is that they aren’t surprised. they are spending all their time passing the blame. I would think the first thing soneone would say about a congressman put in charge of a child sex commission would be one of shock and anger, and I haven’t really seen statements condemning Foley. Also, the GOP specifically felt it was important enough to pass a law making 18 the age of consent for internet (sponsored by Foley),,, so either they passed a bill so Foley wouldn’t have any competition while he was cruising, they/he knew what was being done was CRIMINAL and they didn’t do anything about it but cover it up, and/or they are into the same thing.
Steve at 44 — neither have I, which is part of why I’m so disgusted with this whole mess of a story. If this wasn’t a surprise to the GOP in Congress…then what else have they known and how long have they known about it? And why was keeping Foley in this seat so much more important than the safety of the pages for years?
Christy Hardin Smith @ 45
well, I guess because power is more important than principle…
Senator Dodd is using my analogy with the Catholic Church in the GOP Leadership’s mishandling of this scandal !
Simon, have you read “Crashing the Gates”? We can only fix the govt in incremental steps and step 1 is electing Dems to reactivate checks and balances. Step 2 is ActBlue, essentially, getting progressive candidates within the party.
“oh…the Healthy Forests act – “announced” by Shrub during a long-scheduled visit to the Pacific Northwest; his visit just happened to coincide with an immense forest fire. Caused by arson.”
While the Biscuit fire was HUGE, and the Healthy Forests act a sham and a pay-off to the timber industry (thanks rubber stamper Walden!), I do believe it was started by lightning.
Is there any truth to the rumor that the wingnuts “outed the page” in retaliation?
Steve @ 50
If they haven’t yet, they’re working on it – you can be sure!
Nothing to see here, people. Move along. Just fulfilling Our Leader’s mandate in the No Child’s Behind Left Alone Act….
Christy @ 41,
That is my understanding in working with young people here. I work in a position were if I suspect something I must report to law enforcement. For instance, a school does not investigate, law enforcement does. I think most states have similiar requirements on reporting. But in the Federal District and on Capitol Hill??
Great post Christy. Listening to Wolf this morning, I realized I may have inadvertently used the wrong first name for Mark Foley in the previous thread. Anybody who can correct, would much appreciate.
We got a strong reminder this week of why this election to replace science and medical research-hating Republicans matters so much. Please support stem cell research, everyone, and the candidates who support it. We’ve lost so much ground in the last 5 plus years on so many fronts. We must take back our democracy from The Deciderer and his Rubber Stamp Congress.
Republicans beguile with lies then do their worst….
Hemlock for Gadflies @ 52
that’s awful … funny! … but awful
I just can’t shake the image of boosh and the rethug congress using the “snowflake” children, elizabeth smart, adam walsh & his dead son, and lacie peterson & her unborn, slain child as props for their “protecting the children above all else” legislation.
They use them and actually allow abuse of them.
The worst kind of con job is just another day in the lives of these low life, power at any cost “leaders”.
Here is what concerns me.
It’s the plumbers that ensure all the dirty little secrets come out on their own schedule.
*ilson46201 @
47
Great catch *ilson.
I hope Dodd and others emphasize “hierarchy” and “Archbishop.” I want all those Roman Catholics voting blue in November.
What do Dr. James Dobson and Focus on the Family have to say about the GOP (Grievous Old Pederasts) cover-up to enable ongoing pedophilia? How is Dobbie gonna make this one fit into the Values Voting scheme?
ilson@51 I have only seen one mention of it and now I can’t fine the source. I assume if it has been done, it is the usual name, address, phone # so the death threats will find a home. Sick, sick
rat bastahd @ 49
Hi rat -
Thanks for your observation! I do believe the Biscuit fire was started by lightning.
The fire(s) I’m referring to are fires which burnt a different area of Oregon (can’t recall if east or west of Cascades, but think it was around Roseburg….)
I think it may have been 2002 or 2003…..
Sorry for my lack of precison; thanks for your keen observatons.
The details are on the stumps list at the native forest council website (and soewhere in my old email inboxes) but I don’t have the time to grab them this morning.
If desired, I can find them later on. This “convergence” of arson and pres photo-op/timber industry policy was widely noted by enviros, IIRC.
The MSM missed it completely, natch… (Oooh, look at the smoke and fire. Hey – is that a shiny object! Look – big trucks and planes! Whee – video!)
I digress.
*ilson46201 @ 51
That would be a major political misstep, in my opinion. One of the few things the Republicans have in their favor at the moment is that the victim doesn’t have a face. It’s one thing to hear “16-year-old boy”. It’s quite another to see a kid who really looks 16. Also, the kid isn’t talking at the moment, which helps the GOP. The last thing they need is for him to say, “My friends John and Josh and Sam and Stu all told me they got the same kind of e-mails.”
Rasmussen poll on Bush Job approval ratings — slightly down to 40 percent, just prior to avalanche of news wrt to “In Denial”
Rasmussen: Bush JAR Oct 1
Fair enough, as far as it goes, but isn’t there another layer to this? Look at how quickly Alexander, Boehner and Reynolds (at least semi-independently) were willing to throw Hastert under the bus yesterday. Many times, we’ve seen the GOP leadership in the House or the Senate or at the party level circle their wagons, but the Foley story blew up too fast for them to do that quickly enough. Thus we see that there really isn’t a Republican party, not in the sense of showing any overall unity when the shit really hits the fan. We’ve known that for a while about the base–that the corporatists and the fundamentalists would cheerfully kill each other’s grandmothers if there was enough gain, and that any essential unity was purely provisional until they felt that they had securely taken control of the whole shebang. In the last two days, we’ve seen incontrovertible evidence that the party leadership is no less fractured and no less willing to eat itself if taken by surprise.
Seems to me that the objective now should be the exploitation of the fractures we’ve seen–the inconsistencies and contradictions that popped up because the GOP House leadership didn’t have its story sorted out. They’ll try to sort it out now, of course, but if the initial contradictions become the focus of the discourse, it may well be too late for that.
Or, as a certain therapod might say:
Attack! Attaaaaack! Attaaaaaaaaaack!
But, but Time says the RNC remains calm and will outGOTV all comers;
http://www.time.com/time/magaz…..37,00.html
OldCoastie @ 13
Doesn’t that conclusion assume either good faith or competence on Hastert’s part?
Child abuse is kin to no political party. This crime against humanity is partial to no economic, ethnic, or social strata.
Excellent as usual Christy
Um, can I just throw out a lil’ question here?
IS THERE ONE SEXUALLY WELL-ADJUSTED ADULT REPUBLICAN ANYWHERE ON THIS FREAKING PLANET?
Simon at 9:38 am, if you continue to read FDL, you’ll learn that there are some of us, who were raised Barry Goldwater Republicans, sprinkled in with the majority of life time Democrats. Above all, however, we are Americans who believe in the Constitution and the rule of law.
Twisted Martini @ 19
That’s it, I’m becoming a hermit.
EvilDrPuma @ 71
I’m really hoping darkblack puts in an appearance today.
Twisted Martini @ 35
No, it’s a bro!
Newsweek’s Richard Wolfe and Evan Thomas on Bush Admin struggling to spin away from Woodward:
Newsweek on Woodward
Why hasnt Foley been arrested as would any one else?
OH, AND AS LONG AS I’VE GOT CAP LOCKS ON – KEEP THE FAITH, THE PEDOPHILE ENABLERS ARE NOT IN THE CATBIRD SEAT!
Simon @ 38
I must point out that the attempted coverup–including the failure to even report this issue on the Democratic side of the aisle so that the Dems might try to protect their pages–is itself one hundred percent partisan. Hastert and company have made their bed, and it’s time to bloody well make them lie in it.
moeman @ 66
I read it. Pretty stunning. Snowmobiles???? For the first time I thought, maybe the voting machines weren’t fixed. Maybe they did locate all those GOP leaning people and get them to the polls. Do we have that kind of science behind us or do we just depend on righteous indignation, rage to get people to the polls?
Oklahoma kiddo @ 68
that’s true. what is going to be troubling to the “base” that crows about their values though, is that it appears that this coverup is part of the intrinsic values of an all powerful party. They aren’t exactly the paragons of virtue that they purported to be. I do believe that there are some that will be very angry that it did not remain covered up.
Oklahoma kiddo @
68
Agreed. And along those lines, last night while watching CNN, I caught part of a segment on PredatorGate. It seemed CNN had put up a phone number for people to call and leave a message about the scandal. Every call I heard was livid. No one defended or minimized or rationalized this away. No one.
*ilson46201 @ 47
Good! That analogy has some legs.
kirk murphy, I also believe it was the Biscuit fire Bush was visiting (with Walden) when they announced the Orwellian Healthy Forests act.
Anyone know anything about this?
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/100106Y.shtml
A previously undisclosed nine-page memorandum drafted in June 2005 by Defense and State Department officials urged the Bush administration to seek Congressional approval for its detention policies. The memo so angered Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld that his aides gathered up copies of the document and had at least some of them shredded.
ooh – here’s a reference on the Bush/Arson conjunction of August, 2003 –
The Oregonian is the state’s major paper.
[the copy of the Oregonian article is stored on portland indymedia, which is…well…nevermind]
I belive the “B&B” complex fires were not shown to be caused by lightning or known accident, but those reference await the market.
Bush visit/arson article – Oregonian
Forest fires’ timing sets tongues wagging
08/27/03
MICHAEL MILSTEIN
An emerging whodunit in Central Oregon hovers amid the smoke draping the east side of the Cascade Range.
Can it be pure coincidence, locals are asking, that two wildfires sprang up in view of the spot where President Bush planned to promote his plan to thin forests for wildfire prevention?
And that they both appeared just as his plans emerged?
“I think everyone in the community here is wondering that,” said Judy Wattier, who works at the KOA Campground just east of Sisters, where business is in the doldrums because of the blazes that have covered almost 40,000 acres in the nearby Deschutes National Forest. “Everyone I’ve mentioned it to can talk about it for hours.”
There are whispered conspiracy theories, even rumors of mysterious black helicopters clattering over the forest shortly before the fires were spotted the afternoon of Aug. 19, two days before the president’s visit.
But perhaps folks can be forgiven for that, because there really were black helicopters clattering over the forest.
“Typically the Secret Service does all kinds of aerial surveillance before the president comes in,” said Don Ferguson, an information officer for what have become known as the B&B complex fires. “They pretty much know the location of every tree.”
The president had planned to speak in Camp Sherman, but the fires forced the evacuation of the small resort town about the time he would arrive. He flew over the blazes in Marine One and spoke in Redmond instead.
U.S. Forest Service Chief Dale Bosworth, Oregon Gov. Ted Kulongoski and White House press officers fended off questions from reporters at the speech about the curious timing of the fires. “It would be inappropriate for us to speculate about that,” presidential spokesman Ken Lisaius said.
Ferguson said he’s taken several calls from area residents saying they think the fires appear suspicious.
This much is known: No lightning that might have sparked fires had struck the area for at least 11 days before the twin blazes were sighted, according to the Northwest Interagency Coordination Center in Portland. The Central Oregon Dispatch Center in Prineville first suggested lightning had hit a few days before, but meteorologists checked records and dispelled that.
Trees or debris ignited by lightning may smolder for a few days before blooming into a blaze. But 11 days is an awfully long time to wait.
“It is unusual, but not unprecedented,” Ferguson said. A lightning-caused fire near Ashland sputtered for 10 days before taking off earlier this year, he said.
The coincidences multiply considering the two fires erupted about 10 miles apart at almost the same time, although winds that whipped through the region might explain that. The Booth fire started near Round Lake, a camping spot next to the Mount Jefferson Wilderness, while the Bear Butte fire began in the wilderness, away from roads.
The Central Oregon Arson Task Force will investigate the blazes, but flames have kept officers from beginning their inquiry.
Lightning starts about 15 percent of wildfires, according to the National Interagency Fire Center.
People start the rest. Michael Milstein: 503-294-7689; michaelmilstein@news.oregonian.com
*ilson46201 @
7
Now they are all working on the fly to try and selvedge the situation. Watching these people work off the cuff while trying to fabricate a new spin makes me a bit loopy. Perhaps they will learn to buckle down and cut off criminals who come unbuttoned at the office.
No matter what we now have a new addition to our wardrobe, the Tin Foley Hat.
Tst, tst, and anyway, that is the same thing as Clinton did to Monica…anyways again Bill was hitting on Demi Moore. What a bunch of cynical-hypocrites-low life people the Republicans are.
Hush money? Here’s a post, linked at HuffPo, that claims that the National Repub. Campaign Committee received $100,000 contribution from Foley.
Foley contribution: report
I haven’t seen this confirmed anywhere.
angie @ 79
Absolutely. You are correct. The Republicans are surpassed in their brutality by only one thing, as far as I am able to discern. And that would be their seemingly innate proclivity for hypocrisy.
Oilfieldguy @ 57
Oilfield Guy and Christy: I posted late last night on the scampering cockroach thread that an editorial defense in the St. Petersburg Times stated that the boy had shown the e-mails to a staffer of Rep. Alexander when he got them and asked if they “crossed the line”. The paper’s editors had a copy of this e-mail last November! If that plea for help was ignored or pipelined into the STFU/Coverup it seems to have been, then there is definitely grounds for prosecution starting right there.
I am a mandated reporter here in Florida and we are told every year, in no uncertain terms, that it is not OUR job to determine the truth of accusations made but simply to report them to the proper authorities and let them investigate. You can even report anonymously if you feel so inclined. It was the same when I lived in NYC. I can’t believe that Washington, DC has laws that are that much different.
And now that ABC is reporting that at least 5 other pages have come forward, this sounds to me like a world-class, career-ending, prosecution-engendering scandal to me.
From Atrios:
Oh my. Payola?
snowbird42 @ 75
There is a blurb on one of the many online papers I read this morning (maybe the Palm Beach Post?) that Florida authorities and the FBI are working out the jurisdiction for that right now.
rat bastahd @ 82
rat bastahd, i believe you are absolutely right. I think I’ve been confusing which evil forest-raping policy was “announced” on Bush’s different uses of Oregon as a backdrop for Armagededdon imagery. Thanks for keeping my fuzzy forest mind on the path of accuracy.
Might I make the observation and perhaps generalization, that abuse of kids, by so called adults, is NOT religion or gender specific?
Dennis Hastert will be stepping down soon for “health reasons”.
-GSD
My prediction.
Good synopsis, Christy!
All this brings me back to my late childhood/early adolescance in ways I’m not prepared to discuss here. But since that time, I’ve been wary of people who volunteer at schools, scouting, child and youth coaching and church youth activities. That plus working (earlier in my life) for thirteen years in public safety (fire, police and corrections administration) makes me very, very, very angry at the GOP and their handling of the Foley matter from day one to this very second.
The pressure needs to be applied for the resignation of Boehner, Hastert, Reynolds, all members of the House Congressional Page Program and every member of congress or congressional employee who had knowledge of Foley’s conduct and failed to take the matter as seriously as you would want it to be taken had your own son or daughter been solicited.
I sent this to my representative, Don Young, yesterday:
Dear Rep. Young.
About a year ago, House Majority Leader Dennis Hastert was told that Rep. Mark Foley was implicated for soliciting sex from more than one 16-YO page. Hastert has acknowledged he was informed of this. Rep. John Boehner has also been aware of this, as have other high-ranking members of the House GOP leadership. No investigation occurred, past the point of several attempts to hide the facts and placate the victims.
How do you think this serious situation should have been handled by your party’s leadership? How should what appears to be potential lawbreaking and protection of pedophilia within the leadership of your party be dealt with now? Do you plan on making a statement soon to reassure the parents of young people attending your campaign events that their kids will be safe?
Feel free to use the letter as a model to send to your representative.
Found this at “Datalounge”:
“House Republicans were in a quandary today as to how to handle a controversial new bill entitled “No Congressional Page Left Behind” proposed by Rep. Mark Foley (R-Fla) in the hours before his resignation on Friday.
Mr. Foley’s bill, which mandates “close oversight” of congressional pages by House members, could become a proverbial hot potato for Republican lawmakers with only weeks to go before the midterm elections.
In the hours after his resignation, speaker of the House Dennis Hastert said it was “unlikely” that Mr. Foley’s “No Congressional Page Left Behind” bill would become a law.
“As House Republicans, we don’t want to touch Mark Foley with a ten-foot pole,” Mr. Hastert said. “Even though he’d probably enjoy that.”
Eureka Springs, AR @
84
Do you think this scandal will defoliate the majority party in the House?
GSD @ 93
Perhaps it will be to return to his first love: coaching high school wrestlers.
I need your help!
I was just thinking about my far-right war-mongering parents. They love to pass along little chain mails (racist, pro-war, etc).
Well I just thought up one for them.
I am weak with HTML, so I need assistance in creating this:
I’ll leave it to you to make it look cool and inviting to fools (and others). A Web Form would be ideal, and I also need help figuring out how to host it securely.
I want it to display different year’s results, IOW if the war is still going in 2010, your family is affected thusly.
My favorite entry will receive an Amazon (or other) gift certificate for $50.
The GOP is the party of child abuse. Cutting funds to children’ social support programs is the worst form of abuse.
Dobson and the other xtian wackos; they just love physical punishment of school children. 300,000 children physically punished in schools ‘02-’03.
Most beaten with wooden paddles. family values, you know. Sick
windje @
29
Wow, Watertiger is so good at photoshopping!
We really need a better class of pols for her to practice on. Think of the photoshoppers, voters, for the love of God. I can’t take any more almost-nude Denny Hasterts.
CNN — John Roberts asking Dana Bash — are Dems more focused, more disciplined? A. Yes, determined not to be swift-boated again, and fighting back. so then Roberts replays the Clinton response to Chris Wallace. John King: now the WH is on defense. Condi defends, but Hillary responds to defend her man. (!!)
John King: fight, fight, fight.
Dana: fire up the base.
Stephen Parrish, CPA @ 96
Wouldn’t bet on defoliation. Perhaps a mild pruning by the voters. I seriously doubt Hastert will resign. These folks just don’t own up to anything. I say let the leaves fall where they may.
balrog,
Add into that mass email, “in ____ years your child will be eligible to be predatorized as a page in the Republican House of Pedophiles.
via Atrios:
Oh My
From the New York State Democratic Committee:
Rep. Reynolds’ NRCC received $100,000 from disgraced Rep. Foley in July, after he learned about Foley’s inappropriate emails with minors
As reported yesterday, Reynolds declined to report the inappropriate emails to authorities or act on them — now we may know why
During the same period Rep. Tom Reynolds was keeping Mark Foley’s inappropriate emails with minors secret, his campaign committee coffers received a $100,000 donation from Foley, it was revealed today. Reynolds has come under fire for knowing about the inappropriate emails for many months and covering it up to protect his colleague who has since been forced to resign.
This thing is just blowing up all over the Grand Ol’ Perverts!
The issue here is not just lying or covering up: it’s the complete denial that there is anything like truth. They have followed postmodernism to an absurdist conclusion.
For these guys, all speech is necessarily obfuscation. Lying is no different than truth telling.
It doesn’t matter what you say about Iraq or New Orleans or 16 year old prey or old folks without medication or gay folks in love or nukes in Iran or anything else. There is no connection between speech and reality. It started by perverting faith (Jesus is whomever they want him to be this week.) and has reached the point where there is no underlying reality to hitting on 16 year-olds.
Even voting is not about truth. Diebold has made that part of the neocon narrative. MSM evening news? Judith Miller? Bob Woodward? It’s all narrative, not connected to the real.
Colbert was right: reality has a well known liberal bias. This is not because reality has changed. It’s because the Rovians don’t care about reality. They only care about a narrative that will support their power and control.
For an interesting look at the epistemology of the right, check this out.
rat bastahd @ 103
I like it, but since all children of today are subject to the draft while few are likely to be Pages I think the War bit is the heavy hitter.
angie @ 79
Angie…I had a woman boss when I was 15, working in a small clothing store for kids.
She cornered me in the back room and I quit. I told my mom, and she said, “But she goes to our church!”
My dad (who thought church was horrible, and went to all the Little Richard concerts he could until LR became a preacher)was seriously angry at this woman. That’s a great feeling to have, someone angry on your behalf, instead of shocked that you would even think that an upstanding woman…etc.
among the many pathetic cya statments that have come out i am particularly angered by the attempt to blame the lack of investigation on the parents of the one boy because they didn’t want to “pursue the matter”. now i can understand that they may not have wanted to get caught up in a public scandal, but that doesn’t excuse the gop leadership from seeing if there were ANY OTHER VICTIMS. just because the kid who recieved the kinda odd, but not outright sexual, emails didn’t want to make a big deal out of it is NOT an excuse for letting the whole thing drop and sweeping it under the rug.
Oilfieldguy @ 89
Well, this might go either way. Was Foley paying hush money on his own volition? Or was he being blackmailed? Or was this just an “understanding” that suited both motives? And to what other Repub party officials would a “contribution” of $100,000 typically be reported?
Balrog @ 98
e.c. @
108
Thank you and well said. As one who was serially sexually abused at age 13 by a 33-y.o. teacher/mentor, I can say the nondisclosure impulse is overwhelming. You’re in a state of somewhat-disbelief about it yourself, and as Al-Anon people would say, it’s “alanonic” i.e. the denial and weirdness infect those around you also.
All strength to that young man whose embarrassed IMs with that asshole are now all over the world. And to all the pages and ex-pages sitting and thinking what to do or not do as we speak.
By the way, I don’t intend for this (Balrog@98) to be a mass email.
I want it to popularize on its own. We all know how fast fun little sites of playful kittens and stupid dogs travel the Net. Often I’ll copy my wife the minute I get something fun only to find she already read it.
If you can’t tell, I am very passionate about this. I’d sure appreciate the help of the group on this both in enthusiasm, suggestions, and technical support.
Thanks all!
What will we tell the children?
-
Has anyone heard whether anyone at the White House knew in recent months about Mark Foley’s conduct?
Twisted Martini @
8
Yesterday C-SPAN showed a presser of “band of brothers” vets running for congress. Jack Murtha was with them. A reporter from Fox News asked, in a gotcha kind of way, would they be in favor of sending more troops to Iraq. Murtha took the mic and said something like “There aren’t any more troops. So it’s ridiculous to even talk about that.” It stopped the media types cold.
rat bastahd @ 49
I believe you are right about the lightning. We live only about 100 miles south of the biscuit fire and the local news reported that consistently.
Impeachment Happens @ 110
Yes. This may be the one thing that shakes them out of their fat and happy stupor.
This will hit home.
All over our wonderful country this morning, over 700 American families who were, until this weekend, honored to have had a child chosen to be a Congressional Page, are wondering how to ask their kid about his or her experiences in DeeCee at the Page School. Nice way to spend some after-church kitchen-table family time, eh?
Heckuva job, Denny.
Murtha’s the Man!
It’s the Lying CYA Cover-up GOP Hypocrisy…Again ~ As my nana used to say: “Go with what you know”
Otherwise with a loyal Repugnant judge and lawyer, Foley will plead down to ‘TAILGATING’. *wink
CNN asks, will Rummy by replaced? A. Certainly not before the election.
You go to the elections with the albatross(es) you have, not the one you’d like to have.
Condi Rice ignored all the warnings
Cheney lied us into the wrong war
Rumsfeld mismanaged it
Bush picked/tolerated all of them.
snowbird42 @ 75
You know, Peterr brought this up yeterday, and I believe he was speculating that there might be a number of jurisdictions where that might apply.
grandpa john @ 34
New slogan: We all agree Enough! Vote Democrat!
Lou Costello @ 120
‘TAILGATING’
A subset of ‘No child left behind?’
My daughter was a page for the OK Senate statehouse. The Senator was a personal friend of mine, who has since died of cancer. His wife now holds the seat. This scandal has cast a pall over the entire program. Sleazy sumbitches.
windje @ 124
No childs behind left.
sofistic @ 122
Looks like he made a good guess. Check post 90 above–sounds as if there are questions of federal vs. Florida jurisdiction.
sofistic @
122
Please look upthread at Priscilla’s 10:21 am comment.
Balrog @
112
This should be some kind of flash app.
New thread
Balrog @ 117
That’s gotta be hard. The worst I can saw about my mom is she hates my hair.
But I still am fascinated by people’s belief systems. I mean why THIS scandal? Why not the lies that took us to war or the incompetence of Katrina or the IOU to the Chinese, or our new found belief in torture or, or, or, or, or…you know?
Is it the gambler’s mentality of ‘just one more hand and things’ll start turning around?’ Does it say more about the person who still believes at this point than it does about anything Bush & Co., say or do?
I think the proper response to the Kristol and Fox news types who advocate sending more troops is: “Are you advocating instituting a draft? The National Guard has been called up, the reservists have been called up, and troops are on their 3rd rotation over there. If you’re advocating more troops, are you call for a draft?”
New thread, kids.
Lessee now …
If the newer pages were being warned about this guy, that puts it going back a couple of years, at least.
If the e-mails and IMs go back to 2003, that’s four years, at least, that Foley was trolling among the pages.
Then there should be more than five pages that were hit on by this SOB.
(I would think that the e-mails and IMs would make it federal, given that it runs into interstate communication.)
Twisted Martini @
129
Sounds great. Flash travels at viral speed too. Who can help?
My age-addled memory isn’t solid on this, but how might this page scandal relate to the fact that Boehner beat out Blount for the majority leader spot last February? Could it be that Boehner was more willing to participate in party cover-ups? Just brainstorming, but I wonder now what else the Republicans are keeping silent on?
If they won’t come clean on child abuse or sending troops to die in an unjustified war or protecting businesses that participate in the sex trade and forced abortions, is there anything horrible enough for a Republican to just say no to?
Harry @ 85
A couple of readers took issue with my previous post, which, I believe, perhaps wasn’t clear enough about what I was trying to say. Both seemed to miss the nuance of my post.
I was agreeing, and clearly stated, that a return from a one-party system to the ‘checks and balances’ which are supposed to exist, was a good step in the right direction.
I also stated that Republicans appear to be more arrogant and self-righteous, if not crass about their corrupt behaviors than Democrats are.
The gist of my post, that I was trying to make but admittedly may not have done a very good job of is this.
The commentary of this thread appeared to me another example of the ultimately partisan rhetoric I see from both progressive and conservative arguments. In this case: Republicans=bad, Democrats=good. It’s presented in a very black and white fashion this way.
But the truth is (and the point I was trying to make) is that politicians are politicians and our current system of government encourages corrupt behavior on both sides of the isle, and it happens on both sides of the isle, albeit perhap a little more often and blatantly on the Right side. But it does happen on both sides.
I didn’t mean to take this exact case of Foley’s actions to imply that a Democrat has done the same exact thing (as one respondent to my post seemed to interpret), notwithstanding the fact that just because we don’t know of any examples of this doesn’t mean it hasn’t happened – all politicians attempt to cover-up any bad behavior – but rather that bad and otheriwse unethical and/or immoral behavior is not exclusive to Republicans and that again was the simply message I got from the commentary. As if simply putting Democrats in power would solve all our problems.
The point I wish(ed) to make was that our problems with our government are much deeper than Republicans=bad, Democrats=good or vis versa. That the roots of our problems lie within the greater system itself, which not only supports, but encourages corruption and a lack of reprsentation of the people.
It bothers me that mainstream commentary on both sides of the fence rarely seem to focus on this, the real problem. Instead it’s this Democrats are good, Republicans are bad, which so missed the point.
I’m not disagreeing that taking back the system isn’t a process of small, incremental steps and I agreed that a return to ‘check and balances’ is a good step in that direction. I’m just saying that it’s a short sighted approach which fails to acknowledge that the real problem here is that big money has corrupted our government, and it’s corrupted both sides of the isle.
Our representatives, while talking nice pandering rhetoric when it’s personally beneficial to them to do so, like election season, fail to walk the talk in between.
Our problems are rooted in money much more so than idiology. Until we take private/corporate money interests out of the equation, and prevent policitians from being able to cash in on their positions, then nothing is going to change.
Fact is, our elected representatives, in large part, do not represent their constituents but rather big money benefactors. They’re out to do what’s in their own best interest rather than what’s in the best interest of the good of the people.
Of course, this is obvious to most people and it is mentioned now and then. But few mainstream pundits and bloggers ever talk about it – David Sirota is one BIG exception…he gets it…that “it’s the money” that’s corrupted the system and on both sides.
Yet even on most of the “A-list” progressive blogs the prevailing narative is still little more than Democrats-good, Republicans=bad. If only we kick the rats out, everything will be peachy. That’s never been true before, and it certainly won’t be now. Kicking the current rats out only ushers in the next generation of them because it’s not the people we elect, but the system they operate in which is the root of the problem.
We should be talking about changing the funding structre of elections – publicaly funding them, outlawing lobbying and creating ethical rules and oversight which do not permit our policicians from profiting personally from the actions of the government. Like Dick and George and the rest who privately make millions as a result of the official actions. And like many Democrats who also privately profit as a result of this war due to their associations with war profiteering companies, energy companies, etc.
I’m simply trying to say that the focus seems to be on the wrong, and most superficial elements rather than going right for the root of the problems we are facing.
Get the money and profittering out of government so that our elected officials, on both sides of the isle, can only be there for one reason, to represent the people rather than to get wealthy as it pretty much works now.
Yes, perhaps some of our Blue Netroots candidates (whom I’ve donated to numerous times), once elected, can and will make real changes for us. But we thought that about Obama too, didn’t we. It seems we elect them, but then they enter a system that is currently wired to screw us all and they can’t help but play by the rules if they want to survive, and no real progress happens.
That’s my point. It’s not Democrats=good, Republicans=bad. It’s our system=bad and we need to fix it first.
Simon
Fresno, CA
In response and agreement with post #108…regarding why decent loving parents would prefer to put this issue to bed. So true, that putting children through a rigorous investigation is another abuse. It’s invalidating and embarrassing and any decent parent would think twice. Look at the way the republicans respond to victims of their policies??? It’s pretty obvious that this kid would risk an republican attack.
Furthermore, I would ask any of you who doubt how difficult such an investigation would be …to picture the following.
I would like all of you to imagine your most wonderful sexual experience. The best sex you ever had. Got it in your head. The details all there. Now I would like each of you to post the details with your real name and address listed. Then I would like you to go next door to your neighbor and relay your fantastic sexual experience to your neighbors. What do you think?? Are you all up for it??
Don’t post the details…none of us want to hear them, but you get my point?? And I asked you all to share something pleasant. I didn’t ask you to share your worst, most God awful experience, which would have added to the queasy feeling in your stomach.
That’s why sometimes, the best parents, validate the kid, put their arms around the kid and tell them they believe…then they teach them how to be safer and if needed to counseling. When it comes to sex crimes the courts are not the easiest way to go. I understand why people would hesitate. I have been an advocate and sat through many SA trials. It’s not easy and it doesn’t always bring justice. I understand both sides of the coin on this one.
Ruh Roh Raggy…
Monica was 19. Do you recall how that relationship began. Do you recall her bending over and showing the president her thong?? That’s a little bit different, and while I absolutely agree that the power differential means he should have walked away and that he definetly has some pathology here…it’s not the same. Not close. She was not 16 when their relationship began not from any report, her book included.
GRANDDAD DELBERT @ 137
Ah yes, I remember it well — when Clinton had a tryst with 23-year old Monica. The GOP SCREAMED that she was a CHILD. I see — but 16 isn’t a child now?
And Monica wasn’t 19. Well, she was SOMETIME, but not when she was with Clinton.
Frank Probst @
63
in my best Limbaugh voice:That kid was asking for it- look how he’s dressed! If he didn’t object, it couldn’t have been harassment. And his behavior- he was obviously asking for dirty-old-man love, wearing those tight pants and hanging somewhere sleazy like Congress. The place has a reputation. This is just one more reason we need to keep teh ghey out of public schools, so they can’t use their sweet, sweet cans to tempt our honest and hard-working politicians.
All together now: Blame the victim! Blame the victim! Blame the victim! I bet he’s a terrorist sympathizer.
Simon — it’s pretty obvious you are not up to speed with the facts on the ground since 2003.
Ned Lamont is a perfect example of the direction that grassroots activists are taking right now within the Democratic Party. We already know — without your further elaboration — that the entrenched power base in both parties is corrupt and must be replaced.
We already know that internet-based collaboration and direct representation, is enabling this change; this blog and its commenters exemplify this paradigm shift, by brainstorming old ideas and new approaches and making direct contact with candidates and incumbents.
We get it. But we have to start with removing the existing highly-corrupt majority before we can take the next steps, like unseating less desirable Democratic incumbents for those who are more transparent, more progressive.
Don’t think we are not already working on the next step; many next-generation candidates are working out here in the grassroots right now, cutting their teeth on this first wave. I can testify to that, have at least a couple of friends who are going to run in 2008 and for whom I would give my right arm, but need to find their sea legs now. While volunteering for 2006 campaigns, they are learning how good campaigns are run, how to canvass and GOTV, how to work with the media, how to frame their position on issues, how to organize a base of support — and then look out.
And while they may now be registered Democratic Party members, they are first of all fellow human beings and American citizens, who take their citizenship seriously. Watch for them, because they will upend partisanship.
I’m very up to speed, I’ve not only watched heavily but participated and contributed a good deal of money to the cause.
Again, my observation is that, as evidenced by not only this post on this blog but the subsequent one, Dems=good, Reps=bad. That’s the inescapable narrative which I think misses the point of the larger problem.
I’m not meaning to put down this blog, or it’s readers, per se, I’m simply observing a fact.
The emphasis is that my side is good and the other side is bad, when the real problems are rooted in the system itself; the money.
I’ll grant you that if the current crop of upcoming policians (who again, I have supported financiall, including Lamont) can really make changes to the system down the road, then that’s great and I hope it’s the case. I wouldn’t be donating money to them and supporting them in other ways if I didn’t believe this was the right way to go about it.
But it continues to bother me that few ever talk about the root problems with the system itself. Instead it’s D’s=good, R’s=bad, or vis versa on the other side of the fence.
Simon
Simon at 146 — there are less than 5 weeks to go before the mid-term elections. A wholesale overhaul of the system takes more time than that and, at the moment, I’m working with what I have to change on both large and small scale for the better. If that’s not fast enough for you, I’d suggest you do some work on the issue as well. The more fo us the better — but the framing for the next five weeks is going to be focused on electing Democrats because I see that as the next logical step in a long line of necessary ones. If you don’t agree, that’s fine, but you cannot make all of the changes all at one time — life simply doesn’t work that way outside of dictatorships or fantasyland, and I want to live in neither. I’m trying to work toward one realistic objective at a time, sometimes weaving in several at once where we can, but it’s an awful lot to juggle at once. It helps when people pitch in — griping from the sidelines gets us nowhere. Hopefully you are one of the “pitching in” types — if not, then try volunteering for a candidate in your area that you think can make a difference. And see what a difference in perspective that can give you.
Geez…how many times do I have to say that I AM supporting the current work, donating quite a bit of money to the current cause and supporting these candidates, and that I do AGREE that you have to do things one step at a time.
All I was doing is commenting on a general narrative that I have seen for EVER on these things. For the past three years on blogs it’s been D’s/good, R’s/bad. I never said it’s just the next five weeks. It’s always been this way.
I’m simply saying that I personally think we should all focus, over the long term, on addressing the fundamental problems here in our system.
Over the long term, I’ve not seen that.
That was my point.
People get so defensive over the slightest sense that someone isn’t falling in lockstep with their narrative.
For Pete’s sake. I’m a progressive who supports all of the ideas on this and similar blogs (and donated financially to them), who has donated repeatedly to our candidates and spent a great deal of time supporting them in other ways, and when I simply wish to voice my believe that people aren’t, in my opinion, talking about the fundamental problems but instead we/good, they bad, I’m made to feel like I just don’t get it.
Thanks for welcoming my opnion here.
Simon.
No doubt Foley will use all the free time he’s suddenly acquired to do the traditional: write his autobiography and present his side of the story.
I bet it would be a real page-turner.
What I have trouble understanding is the following. If the GOP leadership knew about this some time ago, did they really think it wouldn’t come out eventually?
The bottom line is that they’re so much more in the sh!t now than had they dealt with this some time ago. This will have an impact on the elections, either with the specific race in Florida (which they’re now stuck with Foley on the ballot) or re: the culture of corruption. The timing is so much worse than a year ago, it makes zero sense.
I guess what I’m saying is that I’m having trouble believing the GOP leadership would be *this* stupid. I know that’s probably blasphemous in these parts, but…that’s where I am.
There’s a great diary on Kos right now from downwithtyranny, describing an ad campaign for combatting the hypocrisy — go Blue America!
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/10/1/15554/5046 (full disclosure — I’ve already made my own contributions.)
http://thinkprogress.org/2006/10/01/newt-foley/
Good one Newt!
The Rice/Tenet/Black meeting should have been in their appointment schedules? If not there, why? If there, why did the Commission not ask about it?
Simon– I appreciate very much what you are saying. We do have to get the money and the relentless pursuit for power out of our politics and return to the basics– serving the people and the Constitution and turning our back on fascism and empire.
We have lots of work to do in our young country and regaining balance in November is a good and necessary first step. After living thru these last 6 years, I pledge to never let my guard down again and to hold the pols accountable thru whatever means I have. A change is gonna come; there will be no rest for the weary. Constant vigilence is what we must be about.
Shouldn’t that be Mr. Foley’s “No Congressional Page’s Behind Left Alone” bill? Or is that too straight(?)forward(?)- straight and forward seem like such inappropriate words at the moment!
GOP stands for Gross Old Pervert.