Login Here 
Joe Lieberman's latest Iraq speach is a dilly, a must-read for anyone who can still find humor in the matter (which I must confess I am a bit beyond). He nags and whines about those who will not tolerate differing views about the war without ever acknowledging that he's the one who ran around calling its opponents a bunch of traitors (I think here he is sticking his fat scolding finger in the face of those on the left who are tired of what his "leadership" and "experience" have bought us and want to give him the bum's rush out of the party -- we're traitors for bucking a GOP President but we must be tolerant of Joe's views, get it?)
But the truly remarkable part comes when he tells one of his patented LieberLies about Ned Lamont's position on the war (do I see the greasy fingerprints of Dangerstein on the manuscript? Methinks I do). Ned Lamont supports the Kerry-Feingold resolution that does not call for the "immediate withdrawal of troops" as Joe LieberLies. Joe then tries to insinuate that Democrats like Hillary Clinton, Bill Clinton, Joe Biden, Chris Dodd and 80% of the Democrats (who didn't vote for the amendment) back his vision of perpetual war, when in fact nothing could be further from the truth.
Let's remember that 13 who caucus with the Democrats voted for the Kerry-Feingold amendment:
- Daniel Akaka
- Barbara Boxer
- Dick Durbin
- Russ Feingold
- Tom Harkin
- Daniel Inouye
- Jim Jeffords
- Ted Kennedy
- John Kerry
- Frank Lautenberg
- Pat Leahy
- Robert Menendez
- Ron Wyden
And this is what he says about people who support this bill:
This is a plan for giving up in Iraq. For giving up on Iraq's hopes forbecoming free and independent. And for giving up Iraq to the sectarian militias, to the terrorists, and to the Iranians and Syrians who wouldexploit the resulting chaos.
Let me explain why his plan is not just a bad idea, but a formula for defeat and disaster.
Yes Joe, do please give us the benefit of your experience and wisdom, your superior judgment. You've been right about so much up to now.
Joe just threw 13 Democrats under the bus in order to save himself. He talks about the problems in Iraq at arm's length like it wasn't his best thinking that got us here. When are the Dems going to speak up and stop Joe from running against the party? He is a frigging train wreck that trashes everything he touches. No wonder he's Karl Rove's BFF.
No-show Joe's re-election strategy: It's Everybody Else's Fault. He will say anything, do anything to keep power, and gives no reason why he's got any better ideas now than he did when he danced us all into this mess in the first place.
Spotlight
Support this site!
Keep
up with news
Advertise on Firedoglake
Send
us your tips
Make us your homepage
About Firedoglake
Advanced search
RSS/XML Feed
Jane! Ned! Byron Dorgan! Batiste, Eaton, and Hammes!
FDL!!!
Oh Angie. At least I got to SEE your zero!
piquant!
or is it pecan?
the Pequod?
FITZ!
epu’d; witness written statements from the DPC hearing today are up at the DPC website.
Batiste’s is a PDF file. Just click on their names and it’ll take you there.
http://democrats.senate.gov/dp.....g.cfm?A=38
Joe-Bama!
So much going on today…don’t have time to write but I wanted to pass this on. Just got it sent to me. Listen and enjoy!
http://warehouse.nimbit.com/er.....ntonBJ.mp3
Bravo to those 13 Democrats. A pox on the rest.
I’d like to also humbly suggest a permanent pox on the phrase “Nothing could be further from the truth” for the following reasons:
1. Chances are, something could be further from the truth than whatever it is.
2. People seem to use it a lot when they are lying. I’ve noticed defense lawyers use it quite often when talking about their guilty-ass clients, and celebrities are fond of it when the need to Deny Something arises. (”The tabloids say our marriage is on the rocks, but nothing could be further from the truth.” Divorce papers are filed the next week.)
3. Wingnuts like to use it. It pops up in the Letters to the Editor a lot, as in, “Liberals call Bush a bad president, when in fact nothing could be further from the truth.”
This is my humble suggestion.
Joe Lieberman threw all those dems under the bus, but if he wins in Nov (perish the thought) Pelosi and the rest will just welcome him back in the door, like a prodigal son, even though he does us much more harm by being “the moderate(read bushco loving neocon) democrat”.
Not to mention that he probably goes to the dems’ caucus, and then goes running to his good friends Cheney et al, and blabs everything they talked about.
Hey, did anybody else get told that the Toll Free phone number for congressional switchboard is disconected ???
what’s up with that ???
1-888-355-3588
doesn’t work any more
any body know why our representatives have cut off our access ???
See Ned Lamont’s letter to Joementum before his speech:
http://nedlamont.com/news/1540/
Ouch!
Marion in Savannah @
12
_____
Beautiful smackdown.
_
#11: yeah, it’s because the switchboard doesn’;t have a permanent toll-free number and, according to the operater i spoke with last week, never has.
those toll free numbers are set up[ by lobbying and interest groups.
senator allen doesn’t understand why he would use the N word
here’s a free clue senator
CUZ YOU ARE A FUCKING RACIST ASSHOLE
hope that helps senator allen’s self awareness quotient
Ummm, I read the AP article on the speech. Besides the lying lies re: Lamont’s stance on the war, Lieberman wants to triple the troops imbedded with the Iraqui army and increase the number of troops. Now, after the article re: “detaining” 4,000 of our troops (because there’s precious few bodies in the wings) where did he suggest these large numbers are going to come from? Did anyone mention the word, DRAFT, in response? Were there follow questions allowed or did Dangerstein hurry the good Senator away?
lisa @
9
I can only think of one permanently correct usage for the phrase:
‘Neoconservativism… Nothing could be further from the truth’
,
freepatriot at 14– does he have some new caca statement about the Salon article? Do you have a link?
Someone: Please ask Bill Clinton why he continues to support Joe (even if tepidly)! Does he think Joe will win? Does he see the relationship as “bipartisan”? Does he not understand how divisive Joe’s campaign is for Democrats?
brendan @ 14
so here is something we could fund ourselves, maybe ???
how much would it cost to start our own PERMANENT toll free number ???
democracy doesn’t work without access
btw, Inigo Montoya is me, sorry about the sock puppet post, I was playin around in epuland late last night
Hello, My name is Inigo Montoya, you killed my father you son of a bitch, prepare to die
Not just EPU’d but friggin’ disappeared. I posted a comment on the preceding thread 40 minutes ago with none of the code words which bring moderation. Still waiting for it to show up there. Wazzup?
I’ll restate it without the link to Juan Cole. Not OT, though, ’cause of Lieberman’s accusations about cut-’n-runners.
Does anybody here know whether somebody or some group has cached comments by all the GOP congressmen who called for US withdrawal from Somalia after the Battle of Mogadishu? Or all the comments about Clinton’s lack of “timeline” or “exit strategy” in Bosnia and Kosovo?
For instance, here’s John McCain right after the Battle of Mogadishu - “Clinton’s got to bring them home.”
The bitter truth we may all have to face is that the lies and manipulation of the administration have put us in a situation from which there will be no easy or simple solution. Retired Gen Batiste said today that if we leave, major civil war is likely to erupt, worsened by the desire for Kurdish independence, against which Turkey will fight tooth and nail, and Iran is just waiting in the wings.
That being said, resigning ourselves to staying forever is not the answer, either. More troops is not the answer, since we are already stretched to the breaking point. Some kind of international crisis council? Come on, Joe. The international community told us from the get-go that this was a folly, and we thumbed our noses at them – gee, I wonder what their advice would be now? Our own “reasonable” military people were arguing against this thing, and maybe if you had been open to listening to the reasonable people, had stood up for what was right, we might not be painted into the most expensive and dangerous corner in recent memory.
“Reasonable people can disagree?” Now, there’s a new Lieberpolicy; too bad it’s years late, huh?
This stuff no longer amuses me. Joe’s not worthy to be the gum on the bottom of my shoe, but he’s as annoying, that’s for sure. Just where was Joe Lieberman when “reasonable people” were trying to be heard? Standing by with duct tape to shut them up. The best thing Joe could do from this point forward is to admit that he doesn’t have a clue, and that all this meandering through the finer points of foreign policy is a lame – really lame – attempt to find something that people don’t hoot and holler him out of town for saying. Give up, Joe. Please.
Ed*ard Teller @ 21
Check out Glenn Greenwald - he’s got all the quotes you’re looking for.
darkblack @ 17
It really should be called pseudoconservatism.
Jeffords is NOT a Democrat (and for future reference neither is Bernie Sanders)
it must be terribly difficult for any political hack to admit that everything they say in fact, is a lie.
and Joe can’t tell anyone that he has always never been a republican
he is in a crappy place. it is what happens when one does not fix the seat in the outhouse, but continue to use it anyway.
On another Senate-race front - in case there’s anybody who hasn’t heard:
George Felix Allen’s rabid racism has made a foray into the MSM - the original research/story was done by Salon and has reached the AP, local Virginia press - and just now, CNN. This stuff is so egregious, so damaging I’m shocked the MSM has picked up any of it. Of course, macaca vehemently denies everything. Says he doesn’t remember ever using the “n” word - uh huh…
Salon’s got it well documented, though. A bit from Salon:
http://www.salon.com/news/feat....._football/
http://www.dailypress.com/news.....s-virginia
Urgent church/state separation action item–click.
Ed*ard Teller @ 21
glenn’s posted a bunch of them.
Beauregard Janglez @
25
Jeffords caucuses with the Democrats so yes his re-election is important to them but you are right and I will make note.
MS @ 19
He supports Lamont
Period.
Media Alert
As advertised on MSNBC TV, Keith Olbermann will have another SPECIAL COMMENT on Countdown tonight - apparently it’s about Clinton’s “critics.”
ET —
See Glenn Greenwald post on this topic, if you haven’t already:
http://glenngreenwald.blogspot.....html#links
anne #22,
From my comments at the end of the last thread re: Batiste:
1) There is a civil war right now.
2) Moving our forces out of Iraq does not mean moving them out of the area. They could still influence and moderate events in Iraq.
3) An important point I harp on is the issue of heavy weapons. Currently, the Iraqi military doesn’t have them nor do any of the militias. Whoever gets them will win the civil war. How many Iraqis die or regionalizing the conflict like whether or not there is a civil war are moot points. These things are already happening.
While I agree with the generals criticisms, I do not agree with their solution: stay the course on steroids or with their prognosis. It could be as bad as they say but the likelihood is that it will not be.
Beauregard Janglez @ 25
Bo Jangles. Heh.
selise, Anne, — geeze — please don’t post something when I’m about to do the same thing! One of us in not paying attention!
Technically, no. Based on his comments on Larry King the other day, he doesn’t care who wins in Connecticut — he’s taking a “they’re both fine candidates, may the best man win” stance.
everhopeful @ 32
Our local Fox affiliate reported on Clinton-Chris Wallace thing last night by saying that Clinton was “angry and offensive.”
_
Jane Hamsher @ 37
BRB, Jane ; )
scarecrow @ 36
Well, at least you two took the time to provide a link - I just took the lazy way out - *g*
scarecrow @ 36
thanks for the giggle!
better three answers than none - anne is just too quick for us!
OT from a previous thread:
selise @ 42
at the end of the webcast there was this statement:
for more information, contact the senate recording studio at 224-4977
i called the number and asked if they would give a copy of the film to c-span to broadcast… was told that usually the request is made from a senator’s office, but that they would transfer me so i could make the request (don’t think that was effective).
any fld vermonters - would you consider calling leahy’s office to ask them to make the request for a copy of the film to be given to c-span for broadcast? i think leahy’s office might be the best bet (kennedy and feingold might not, if they don’t want to be embarrassed by their absence).
Like Carolyn Urban before me, I just spoke with a Leahy staffer, and the his press person is working on getting this up.
Beauregard Janglez @ 25
Also, Beauregard…what did I miss? To what does this comment refer?
BobbyG @ 38
Maybe he meant that Clinton was angry and Wallace was offensive…
Lisa at 9,
I agree completely. And while we’re at it, can we for the love of God give a final burial to Mark Twain’s line about rumors of his death? It was clever the first time, but somewhere around the millionth usage it ceased to amuse.
KING: Are you supporting Lamont?
CLINTON: I am but, you know, my — I don’t have the same view of this as some people do. My view is Connecticut is an unmitigated blessing for the Democrats because Lieberman has said if he wins he’s going to vote with us to organize the Senate.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRA.....kl.01.html
O/T - Some great creative mind got paid to come up with this idea:
_____
CINCINNATI (Reuters) — A car commercial proclaiming a jihad on the U.S. auto market and offering “Fatwa Fridays” with free swords for the kids is offensive and should not be aired, Muslim leaders said on Sunday.
The radio advertisement for the Dennis Mitsubishi car dealership in Columbus, Ohio, has “a whole jihad theme,” said Adnan Mirza, director of the Columbus office of the Council on American-Islamic Relations.
“They are planning on launching a jihad on the automotive market and their representatives would be wearing burqas … ,” Mirza said. “They mentioned the pope in there and also about giving rubber swords out to the kiddies — really just reprehensible-type comments.” …
http://www.cnn.com/2006/AUTOS/.....index.html
_
everhopeful @ 26– he used that word, wish some of us that knows it had it on tape or in writing though. More people will come forward, I am sure of it. What is clear is that many are simply afraid of the backlash that is sure to ensue if they speak up. It could get very ugly. So far though, the NRO and the Weekly Standard have not been…erm… all that supportive of the racist liar. He is imploding all on his own. Gives me renewed faith in “what goes around, comes around.”
Webb has stayed out of the entire thing; bravo for him. GO WEBB!
Woops.
Beauregard @25…never mind ;>)
DairyMaid @ 42
that is SO effing cool! before today, i didn’t even know how any of this was done - so i just started calling c-span this morning… if today, by working together, we can get this on c-span so other people can see it, i will be so pleased. many thanks and fingers crossed!
I’d like to get a sense of how extensive (and overlapping) our use of Spotlight is. Are lots of us doing this? And I was wondering if we could divide and conquer. E.g., everyone would focus on the obvious target audience, but in addition, each group of us could have special regional assignments to assure broader coverage.
E.g., folks in NE could send to national TV anchors, panelists, and locals in our region, such as CT, etc; folks in West could send to major newspaper reporters, editorial boards, and local outlets, etc; and folks in the middle could hit political/Whitehouse/legal reporters. Just suggestions, but we honestly don’t know whether we’re sending 400 spotlights to the same small group of 20 reporters or covering 400 different recipients.
selise @ 1:49 pm - I left a message for you on the prior thread at 1:28 pm.
Greenwald is GREAT on this! Thanks, friends. But he only covers the craven GOP cut ‘n runners and Somalia. What about Bosnia and Kosovo? I’m sure it is out there.
Also, what did Joe say at the time re Somalia, Bosnia and Kosovo?
Still on C-SPAN 3, where they’re running the Family research Council Value Voter conference live. MakaKKKa Felix is supposed to talk sometime. They just introduced James Dobson with a live band playing the theme from “Rocky.” C-SPAN is hosting some diverse altenative universes today….
scarecrow @ 50
Since you gave me that great tutorial, I feel confident I can get it to work, but Ihave to say, that I have NEVER received a single email back from CNN, Hardball, or our beloved Keith…so I don’t know if they just delete delete delete or what? From where I sit, it is hard to tell how effective it is. Of course, I have been writing presonal email not spotlighting posts…so maybe that is different?
Stephen Parrish, CPA @ 51
got it, thank you!
scarecrow @ 50—-
Me too. I want to know who to address some of these things to, for one thing. Who will immediately delete it? Who will be intrigued? Do you all send the same message to different people in the same newspaper or network?
It appears the US CIA set up a bounty hunter system in which it paid millions of dollars to Pakistanis to capture and turn over to US suspected members/supporters of al-Qaeda.
With such an incentive system, it seems highly likely that the detainees we now imprison include a large percentage of completely innocent people, as opposed the “the worst of the worst,” as portrayed by Rummy and Bush/Cheney.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/200.....n_cia_dc_1
Anne @ 43
It’s probably more of FOX’s dog whistle rope-a-dope…’Offensive‘ in place of ‘offended‘, to be corrected later in a sub rosa fashion after it has been hamfistedly assimilated into their viewership’s jingoist world perspective.
windje @ 24
Only in polite company
;>)
Joe’s campaign reminds me of the landmine detector, tippytoeing through the field with his fingers placed snuggly in his ears.
He looks very reasonable to those who are afraid of loud noises.
angie @ 47
Yeah, I was gonna mention how much I liked that Webb was staying out of - then I forgot - thanks, angie, for bringing it up.
Also, Felix is now trotting out a bunch of buddies who are saying they never heard macaca making any such comments. Of course, according to a great blog post at kos, these “witnesses” for Allen have also been the receipients of numerous “favors” from him. Love it!
I posted this paragraph from the Salon.com article on Allen yesterday, and nobody commented on it. I think it is the most damaging statement yet about how scary Allen is:
Shelton said he also remembers a disturbing deer hunting trip with Allen on land that was owned by the family of Billy Lanahan, a wide receiver on the team. After they had killed a deer, Shelton said he remembers Allen asking Lanahan where the local black residents lived. Shelton said Allen then drove the three of them to that neighborhood with the severed head of the deer. “He proceeded to take the doe’s head and stuff it into a mailbox,” Shelton said.
Anybody else see it the same way? I’ve yet to see this particularly disturbing episode highlighted anywhere…
angie @ 47
Aparently ABC spent an hour recording the Dr (can’t remember, but think his name is Shelton) today and asking him what he could remember about Allen. ABC are going to broadcast this this evening. The Dr’s friend called into the Ed Shultz radio show and Ed told him that he would like to speak to the Dr when he’s available.
Hugh @ 33 I left you a response on the last thread
scarecrow @ 50
I thought about that too, but it really serves the same function as angry letters and lit-up switchboards did back in the day (= last month, lol), only with links. So, the more the merrier, no? Especially if everyone personalizes.
It is very significant that Lieberman mentions Iran and Syria in the same breath as Iraq. The “Syria-Iran” axis is a new neocon rhetorical staple introduced this summer. Lieberman is still continuously updating his speeches to keep abreast of the latest neocon trends.
When is Allen scheduled to appear before the group live on C-SPAN 3, The Family Research Council’s Value Voters Conference? We may be treated to one of the classics in American hypocricy and hubris.
is there anywhere I can get a list of the Dems who were at the hearing today?
Professor Foland @ 64
Yep. Would be interesting to see how closely Lieberman’s latest is tracking the latest from Glenn Beck or National Review.
Ed*ard Teller @ 60
It’s been all over kos since yesterday and I posted it at #27 above - yes, EXTREMELY DAMAGING - the creepiest thing I’ve heard - and there’s a lot of really creepy stuff about him. This part of it MUST get into the MSM - I will e-mail to KO - don’t know who else will listen.
darkblack @ 57
I very much enjoy your graphics :>)
Oilfieldguy @
58
OFG you are a gem.
Apropos the NIE: I support the efforts to pressure legislators to pressure the Administration to release the thing. But, here’s the very best we can hope will come of that:
In response, the administration releases a highly redacted Executive Summary that spins the juicy details (cf Tony Snow) in a way that buys the Administration just enough ambiguity to claim it technically wasn’t lying since April.
The big lie of 2002 was that there was “no doubt” that Iraq had CBW (chem/bio weapons). The 2002 NIE proved that this was a lie (there was PLENTY of doubt), but only in the footnotes and appendices not immediately released to legislators. In other words, the best we’ll get (again) is a modified limited hangout. At least until it no longer matters politically.
What we really need to do is pressure the NYT and/or WaPo to print the whole damn thing, with minimal redactions of passages that could pose obvious risk to sources and methods.
This NIE is the Pentagon Papers on steroids…too bad the papers of record have long since been practicing journalism on barbiturates.
Of course, a leak to the blogosphere could also do the trick. Jane, Christy, how fast can you grow gills?
windje @ 69
Thank you
:)
hat-tip and high-five to everhopeful.
Joe’s so worried about the shortage of freedom in Iraq that he’s helping the president to export ours.
Someone in my neighborhood is cooking a roast and the smell is making me very hungry. I hate when that happens…
Which hearing, OldSchool?
The DPC had Dorgan, Bingaman, Rockefeller, Durbin, Reid, Schumer and Clinton for a teensy bit at the end when she lobbed her stay the course ?. (Dayton did not show). The other hearing had Leahy only– the habeas corpus one.
link to the DPC hearing and the written statements of the military guys here.
http://democrats.senate.gov/dp.....g.cfm?A=38
Ed*ard Teller @ 60
Tweety on Hardball about to discuss Allen’s racial slurs.
I just got back from video taping Ned’s response to Joe’s Iraq speech and Q&A session, at Naples Pizza in New Haven.
Naples is to Ned as the Rathskeller is to the Beatles; it was awesome to see Ned back in the venue where he gave probable the first well-received speech he’d ever made, back in early April.
This time, Ned appeared very (should I say it?) “senatorial”. He looked like the leader we’d all hoped he’d become. His speech was short and to the point, and he had a bunch of people speaking on the Iraq war in a sort of “round table” format.
Then the reporters asked a few questions, but all too quickly Ned had to move along to his next appearance.
However, on the sidewalk he stopped and answered questions by the radio and print media. The topic was Ned’s deadline to pull out of Iraq.
One reporter would ask, “Do you support an immediate pullout like Sen. Lieberman says?” and Ned would say, “No, of course not. But we DO need to begin the process, and the only way to do that is to set a deadline”.
Then another would ask, “So are you saying you’ll want all troops out by July 1st as Joe said?”
“No, I said it’ll take a year more or less. But we need to get STARTED on a plan.”
“So do you mean you’d want all the troops pulled out by July?” asked another; until I wanted to scream and collectively knock the media’s heads together! Don’t these people HEAR?!? When they ask a question, do they already have the answer they want written on the paper, and ignore whatever the candidate is saying?
I was SO upset I had to go and eat a fine lunch with Branford Boy at an Indian restaurant to calm down.
Actually, I wasn’t THAT upset; I was just hungry. And he was buying.
Video is almost done uploading to my PC, so look for edited highlights later tonight.
scarecrow,
James Dobson’s talking about Hugo Chavez right now on C-SPAN 3…
darkblack @ 57
ET at 60–I thought for sure last night that that anecdote alone would put Virginia in the win column by this morning. Obviously I was wrong–as you point out, it’s surprising how little play it has gotten. Disturbing barely scratches the surface. Words fail me.
The interesting question is: is there any chance a police report was ever filed for it (even as an unsolved) that would corroborate at least that the incident took place, if not necessarily Allen’s involvement? If I were an enterprising young reporter in Virginia I might go looking through the newspaper and police archives of the time…
New diary at kos - apparently George Allen is about to launch a Swiftboat campaign against Webb:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/9/25/16268/6568
Note to Ned, and all Democrats plagued by the question of deadlines by the media:
All homework is done on Sunday Night. The point is for the Iraqi government to begin to govern. This message will not come from this Administration who believes government exists to drown in a bathtub. Set a deadline and let’s get busy getting shit done.
Ed*ard Teller @ 78
That must be the most uninformed, unenlightened talk this year.
It is not possible for a Dobson to even pretend to understand the paradigm that forms Chavez’ view of the world. Nor does his constrained view of Christian charity allow him to comprehend why a Chavez would sell heating oil to New England charitable distributors at significantly below market prices, just to help them get through the winter.
Oh, this should be good - Tweety, after the commercial, is hosting a “debate” - is it fair to bring up all these “old allegations” against George Allen (and other candidates)?
ISLAMABAD, Pakistan (AP) - Pakistan’s president says in his memoir released Monday that he had no choice after the Sept. 11 attacks but to switch from supporting the Taliban to backing the U.S.-led war on terror groups or face an American “onslaught.”
Gen. Pervez Musharraf, in his book “In The Line of Fire,” also criticizes the U.S.-led invasion of Iraq, saying it has made the world “more dangerous.”…
_____
Didn’t this Paki get The Memo?
Relax, Bushzis all agree, everything is just fine.
_
CT Bob — thanks for that report. Glad you were there. Sounds like the next Senator from Connecticut has got his act together.
Just a guess, but I think what was happening in those exchanges is that at some point in the past, Lamont mentioned July 1. Months ago, that would have been “about a year from now.” JL then takes that out of context and implies/alleges that Lamont said “immediate” or something else. What the reporters may have been trying to do was to get an unqualified “no,” which would then be reported as “Lamont backtracks from previous commitment ot get our troops out by July 1.” It will be interesting to see how Lamont’s actual statements are reported on tonight’s news and tomorrow morning’s papers. If you report and/or put up the youtube with the actual statements, we can help send to reporters to help them along in getting it straight.
readerOfTeaLeaves, from last thread:
Absolutely, borrow at will.
BobbyG @ 85
Will the necons think this “upagainstthewallmotherfucker” diplomacy is a bad thing?
Jane,
I think you’re pretty swell too. I just hope our efforts pay off in November. If they do, I’m flying to wherever you are, because I owe you something.
Here’s my distillation from Glenn Greenwald’sc great post re the GOP talking point that Clinton cut ‘n ran from Somala in spite of heroic attempts by the GOP to “stay the course.” Thanks, Glenn!
I’m off to call the local right-wing shows which were pimping for the upcoming Fox interview last Friday. Then off to work. See ya all at late night.
Here’s short Glenn Greenwald:
Clinton on Wallace interview:
“”They were all trying to get me to withdraw from Somalia in 1993 the next day after we were involved in ‘Black Hawk down,’ and I refused to do it and stayed six months and had an orderly transfer to the United Nations.”
Most Republicans and conservative dems like Lieberman wanted IMMEDIATE withdrawal after the Battle of Mogadishu (October 3-4, 1993).
October 6-8, 1993:
Kay Bailey Hutchinson – “I can no longer support a continued United States presence in Somalia…… but a step backward is sometimes the wisest course. I believe that withdrawal is now the more prudent option.”
Dirk Kempthorne - “if the Somalis are now healthy enough to be fighting us, then it is absolutely time that we go home. . . It is time for the Senate of the United States to get on with the debate, to get on with the vote, and to get the American troops home.”
Bob Dole, speaking about a caucus with the GOP leadeship – “if the Somalis are now healthy enough to be fighting us, then it is absolutely time that we go home. . . It is time for the Senate of the United States to get on with the debate, to get on with the vote, and to get the American troops home.
Jesse Helms –“ the United States has no constitutional authority, as I see it, to sacrifice U.S. soldiers…..the time to get out is now.”
John McCain – “we should come home.”
Pres. Clinton on October 8, responding to GOP demands for rapid withdrawal – “Do we leave when the job gets tough or when the job is well done? Do we invite the return of mass suffering or do we leave in a way that gives the Somalis a decent chance to survive? Recently, Gen. Colin Powell said this about our choices in Somalia: “Because things get difficult, you don’t cut and run. You work the problem and try to find a correct solution.” . . .
So let us finish the work we set out to do. Let us demonstrate to the world, as generations of Americans have done before us, that when Americans take on a challenge, they do the job right.”
John Kerry – “I am jarred by the extraordinary sense of panic that seems to be rushing through this deliberative body, and by the strident cries for a quick exit…We should not panic and flee when the going gets rough. If we are going to withdraw, we have an obligation to do so in a responsible manner, in a way that does not undermine the operation or leave the Somali people to a worse fate.”
Ed*ard Teller @ 60
Well, now we have a better idea why Allen doesn’t like the idea of hate crimes legislation…
CT Bob @ 77
Mmmm, Naples. I whiled away many an hour there on pizza and video games when I was in college.
Video: Protesters interrupt Senate Gitmo heaing
http://tinyurl.com/qy75g
two beers @ 4
Something happened on the Pequod that I wouldn’t mind seeing happen to Lieberman…
Lou Dobbs coming up on CNN with reports on evoting dangers and a Colorado judge’s ruling today? Also on border insecurity at ports and borders. Also the war on the middle class by borrowing from foreign lenders.
jinny @ 93
I just saw that via Raw Story, how did they get the video??? How do we get the video of the whole hearin???
Apparently Cindy Sheehan was there too!!!
Anne @
22
Reasonable people can also think that you are an obnoxious shitbeard, too, Joe. Jackass. Lying jackass.
Just want to say to Christy and all who were posting today during both the Judicial Committee “hearing” regarding the Bush administration’s attempt to gut on Habeas Corpus and then the testimony given at the Senate Democratic Policy Committee…
Thank you, thank you, thank you. I could read but not post from work and it meant a great deal to be able to follow those two events as they were unfolding.
The SD Policy Committee event was stunning - it felt very much like a Watergate Committee hearing. Those are incredibly brave men and the truth they shared was searing and devastating. Let’s see what the MSM does with this. Will they go along with the Rovian swiftboating - or will they do their jobs for the first or second time (Katrina maybe) in the past six years and tell the American people the truth about the disaster unfolding in Iraq? No, we probably can’t unlaterially pull out right now - however as a country, we can start making decisions based on reality and start holding the administration accountable. And we can make sure we go back to the checks and balances type of government the Founding Fathers established for the experiment in democracy.
I was surfing around various blogs and FDL was the only one I could find that was following this two historic events.
And finally - Washington Post how do you feel about your 2nd endorsement of LieberLiar after the hearing this afternoon - juxtaposed with LieberLiar’s BS “Iraq policy” speech? Yeah, I thought so.
Anne @ 22
There’s a catch, though: Lieberman is not “reasonable people.”
Juck Loe Fieberman!
What is the SHORT answer to why Lieberman is so very supportive of the Iraq War?
ACTION ALERT!
A copy writer at Apple has set up this web site and it’s worth looking at.
Please take a moment to look at this site and make a pledge if you can. It’s not a pledge of money so it won’t cost you anything.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 101
My short answer is that when it comes to foreign policy he’s pretty much a neocon.
dab from CT @ 99
just in case you missed it, we also have mp3s of the judicial hearing you can download and listen to on your own time…. sullivan really was inspiring. here’s the link.
i also put up a fair use notice: “material posted here is for educational and research purposes which we believe constitutes a ‘fair use’. if you are a copyright holder and object to any material posted here, please contact us to have it removed.”
hope that is ok. if any lawyers here think i’ve done anything i shouldn’t, please let me know.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 101
He’s feeding at the trough of Saudi oil, as all National politicians are.
I can’t wait ’til November, when Joe receives his second crotch-punching from the voters of Connecticut. I can’t wait ’til January, when the Capitol police forcibly eject his mewling, bleating husk from Senator Lamont’s office. I can’t wait ’til February of 2008, when Joe is sitting alone and friendless in his darkened basement rumpus room, alternately weeping and slamming back scotch, as CNN calls the New Hampshire primary for Feingold. I can’t wait for November 2008, when bearded, disheveled Joe, a little the worse for wear, again sits in his now foul-smelling basement rumpus room, crying piteously as CNN announces that Feingold has beaten the crap out of Brownback or Frist or who-the-hell-ever the hapless Republican nominee is. I can’t wait.
Cozumel @
39
I’m looking for the link…but I heard Clinton say he supported Lamont, unless I was hallucinating.
Nora Ephron seems exasperated today:
“How does it happen? How does one of the smartest men ever elected president end up sandbagged by Chris Wallace? Is this what one docudrama does to the guy? I don’t think so. I’m afraid this is classic Clinton, Clinton the monologist, Clinton the guy who used to keep his White House houseguests up until 4 a.m. while he went on and on about what the press was doing to him. What a waste. On top of which: Clinton calls George Bush “43″? Is he so confused about his role in the Bush family constellation that he has adopted their nicknames for one another?”
everhopeful @ 103
My short answer - MONEY, AIPAC and he thought it would be the path of least resistance.
everhopeful @ 103
Money, AIPAC and he thought it would be the path of least resistance. Money and AIPAC will keep him in the position he is in now.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 101
Joe never met a war he didn’t like. Check his voting record. He votes in favor of all wars. The Iraq war is just the most recent.
Should one engage in a Dr. Phil drive by analysis of a goddamm @#$% hiding behind his mommas skirt relishing in the goring of those he tattled on and perhaps benefitting from the sale of brass knuckles from the nearby flea-market?
Do we have time to engage in such mental gymnastics, or care to listen to the cirque del soliel contortionist explanations of rubbernecking foreign policy.
Lookit. Our military recruitment is down. Way yonder down. Sixteen federal agencies are singing the chorus of current American policies are terrorist multipliers.
More of them.
Less of us.
Bush is losing.
He say’s, “Stay the course.”
Lieberman say’s okiedokie.
Some ask why.
We say bye.
[Mod Note; there are some words our hosts really don’t like…know what I mean?]
Sorry for duplicates all my comments disappeared without notice of moderation.
“He proceeded to take the doe’s head and stuff it into a mailbox,” Shelton said.
What was Allen doing killing does?
In addition to his racism, is he also a poacher?
Also, whither Bambi?
cleter @ 106
707 - OMG - the visuals….
Oklahoma kiddo @ 108
I agree with her on one point–it was classic Clinton. Was he sandbagged? It depends on how you look at it. He deliberately walked into an ambush (Faux News–you can’t tell me he wasn’t expecting this) and then stomped the bejeezus out of the people that were attacking him. They can spin it as Clinton being “crazed” or “angry”, but they have yet to say that any of his statements were “inaccurate” or “wrong”. I’m still counting the whole interview as a big win for the Big Dog.
Did *ilson buy “IHateJoeLieberman.com” because if Joe wasn’t such an asshole loser I would buy it just to spew about how disgusting I think he is, but that’s just me. This batch of politicians I think are the worst in all of human history. Maybe I’m over-stating it but I wasn’t around for the fall of the Roman Empire,I only have this current time for reference.
Just an FYI for everyone — from today’s Democratic Policy Committee Hearing, tomorrow morning on C-Span’s Washington Journal, Ray LaHood (R-IL) is on tomorrow 7:30-8 am ET and Byron Dorgan is on 8:00-8:30 am ET. Thought there might be some folks who would be interested for tomorrow. :)
LindyH @ 107
He said he supported Lamont - but…
KING: Are you supporting Lamont?
CLINTON: I am but, you know, my — I don’t have the same view of this as some people do. My view is Connecticut is an unmitigated blessing for the Democrats because Lieberman has said if he wins he’s going to vote with us to organize the Senate
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRA.....kl.01.html
Frank Probst - I watched Fox roundtable after playing the “sandbagging” and they immediately went into full spin lie. Of course I count it as a big win as well becuse he fought back and had factual truth on his side.
KING: Are you supporting Lamont?
CLINTON: I am but, you know, my — I don’t have the same view of this as some people do. My view is Connecticut is an unmitigated blessing for the Democrats because Lieberman has said if he wins he’s going to vote with us to organize the Senate.
_____
Want some strawberries, whipped cream, and syrup with that waffle?
_
Eureka Springs, AR @ 119
_____
My local Fox5 affiliate anchor last night said Clinton was “angry and offensive.”
_
Frank Probst @ 115
Oh… I can’t say Major Dog was sandbagged either. And I think he took care of bidness. But I do wish that he and Senator HRC would start kicking the Bush’s where it hurts. On Iraq. Just for starters.
Now we get to witness the vile morphing into the absurd as George Felix Allen Jr. will now claim that he is being attacked because he is Jewish.
Sometimes I think I am sleeping off a mushroom buzz and it is still 1982…things are just so wierd.
Lieber-schnitzel is just a waste of toilet paper.
-GSD
Oilfieldguy @
111
@#$% = Republican
Bobby G - Funny because that is how I felt about Chris Wallace. Another point about watching Fox (it was my second time) Does anyone else find their choice of colors a bit hard on the eyes? They are very close to how I remember ABC’s from years ago. Makes me squint and almost frown. No pun intended about the rest of their content.
Eureka Springs, AR @ 125
Yeah, Chris Wallace is a smarmy little weasel. He was indeed “offensive.” And Big Dog bitchslapped him down pretty good.
_
I noted the other day how much I hate the phrase: “reasonable people agree”, meaning if you don’t agree with the stated viewpoint you are unreasonable.
That little fuck Tony Blankley uses it on NPR’s Diane Rehme show all the time. Makes me want to just reach through the radio and strangle him.
Moderator,
yes, I guess I do know that some words may bring offense to your sensibilities. And I will not belittle them, because I begin sentences with coordinating conjuctives and sometimes practice in comma splices.
You should see some of the my self edits ;/
BobbyG @ 120
Now you’ve made me hungry.
If you’re registered at WaPo, you might want to e-mail the racist George Allen doe’s head article to everyone you know - we can make it the most e-mailed article and get some extra buzz. This man is so vilely, horridly racist he deserves to be exposed to the world!
http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....00558.html
[Whether you intended this as humor or not, knock it off. We don’t play those sorts of nasty word games on this blog. Period. — CHS]
I honestly believe that there should be accountability for LIARS.
Whenever a Politician Say’s something either on TV, in the houses or Parliament or quoted in written articles then they should be made to stand by their word.
This culture of saying that what is not true is really starting to get on my nerves. It is so common that Lying is becoming accepted. It should not be.
The public should not ever accept Lies from those in Parliament and those in Parliament should have a bit more respect and virtue than to be nothing more than bald faced Liars.
Call them on it every time.
Whether it’s from the Left or the Right there’s nothing worse than a fucking Liar.
I realise I’m dreaming if I ever think that Newspapers, Radio and TV heads and Politicians will ever stop their deceit. But nonetheless, the public should not accept it.
PS. Look how we beat down the Ombudsman at the WP when she wrote that the bribes were a Bi-Partisan issue when it clearly wasn’t.
Thats the sort of thing we should be doing every single time, over and over until they get it into their pea sized brains that we know they are Lying and we will not accept there bullshit.
OK, rant over…as you were… ;-)
everhopeful @ 130
…and if you are not registered use “bugmenot.com” to get a password (also handy to post several comments under different names) not that I’d ever do something like that ;-)