I saw this movie last night. It was a rip!
I like screwball comedy when the actors don’t play it or mug overtly for laughs. The actors here, including Greg Kinnear, Steve Carrell, Abigail Breslin and Alan Arkin all play their characters pretty straight, through desperation, humiliation and ultimately through acceptance and reconciliation. Oh, here are some reviews.
The narrative arc quickly takes the characters on a road trip, the ever ready metaphor for an inner journey. The characters suffer a series of humiliations, confrontations with those things they most dread. I think that must make them Democrats or something.
There are some subtle political elements in the film. At one typically excruciating yet subtly, insanely hilarious moment, Bush appears in a television screen at a press conference, standing next to and defending Rumsfeld. The final sequence, in fact, the destination of the family’s trek is the "Little Miss Sunshine" children’s beauty pageant, which must be seen to be believed. I kept thinking TBogg had been part of the writing of this screenplay, or maybe TRex. In fact, TRex called me during the movie: good thing I had the phone on silent or the others in the theater would have kicked my ass.
Anyway, the characters just kept going, on pretty much their own terms, no matter what setbacks they encountered. I can’t tell you how, shall we say, aware I have been over the last two days of the issues raised by Digby, Glenn Greenwald and others linked by Jane earlier today. I know Christy is keeping us focused on GOTV because the alternative to not fighting is unimaginable, even if politicians in Washington who should know better are not fighting at all.
I’ve been talking and listening to a lot of people in our movement whom I respect deeply, who have varying reactions ranging from full on partisan warfare, no disunity in the ranks (and these are not shills, but real, principled progressive activists) to calls for calling out the Dems who are pulling a Claude Rains. I have even floated some ideas to well placed party contacts of mine to suggest ways we can work together to do effective, offense based messaging, drawing on lessons from our ABC/Disney experience, and have not gotten anywhere. The party is leaving us on our own, as far as I can tell. I agree unreservedly with the sense of stupefied disgust, revulsion and outrage given voice by members of this community in response to Jane’s earlier post. In fact, those words don’t begin to express my disposition here.
Here’s where I think I come down on this, and this has been no easy couple of days for me: I will not quit. And I will not pretend that making this country a country that tortures is okay. I will not swallow hard and clap louder for the party and I will not take to the sidelines, or write in such a way that might lead others to despair, slow down, or quit.
I’m a fighter, because in this age, a person of conscience must fight. So I’m going to stay focused, especially on great candidates like Tony Trupiano and others in our Blue America entourage. When Jane made me a front pager, I made a confession to the community that I had been initially a supporter of the Iraq invasion, and that I recognize I was wrong. I felt the community had a right to know, and to discount my judgment accordingly, as people choose. I remind them of my error again tonight.
But here’s what I also took from that experience: I will not drink anyone’s Kool Aid again and I will not ignore the voices of those who were right, like many of our commenters here were, when I was wrong. Neither will I ignore those nagging doubts in the back of my head when these big issues of historical moment are in play.
I viscerally believe that the DC Democrats are wrong, on the politics and on moral grounds, as they strategically retreat on torture and on the whole national security "all in" Karl Rove is pulling. I hope that Bill Clinton’s vehement push back on Faux News will set something of an example, somehow. Hey, like those characters in the movie, I proceed with hope, the belief in the possibility of things unseen.
But no matter what, I’m going to keep doing what I’m doing, and I want to ask you to do the same, to volunteer locally, to help out our Blue America candidates as volunteers, or phone bankers or donors or whatever. Because those people are standing up, and if we quit or flag in our efforts, we’re betraying them and betraying victims of American torture. Moreover, to soften our resolve is to betray ourselves, and that we cannot afford to do.
Fuck these people. For my part, I choose to keep fighting for our people. Thank God for Howie Klein.
Shit: I thought I was going to write about the movie, and look where I ended up. But I can’t blow smoke at you people: this is what’s on my mind. Talk about whatever you want to talk about. This is an open overnight thread.
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Pach!
Lookie what we have here.
Road Trip!!!
Yep. And everyone’s gone to bed or is getting laid.
Pachacutec @
4
Oh. Well, I guess I should…go to bed.
Maybe….. everyone is doing what Markos told us to do… turn off our computers and get out and talk to our neighbors…
Maybe we need to declare a Road Trip to Washington, D.C. so we can parade in black pointed Abu Ghraib torture hoods up and down Pennsylvania Avenue.
I’m so pissed I could just spit.
LMS is kickass. Every actor in it just did a stupendous job. How they persevere reminds me of a time when I was young and had just lost my job. An older woman said to me, “Enjoy the fall, the water’s fine.” There comes a time when you have no choice but to roll with the inevitable. Thoroughly enjoyable film.
They’re still yammering downstairs…let’s see if we can drag any of them up this way.
some of us aren’t dear …(damn) ….
ahem, just busy spreading the word about Dave’s great postcard design and trying to start an avalanche of mail to Senators this week … see Dave @98 last thread for the image and make some copies – at least for your own Senators, better yet for all of them.
katymine @ 6
Sounds good to me.
I intended this post to go up half an hour ago, but it was set with the wrong time stamp, and I did not get it fixed til late because I got, er, busy.
Awesome movie…
And since we’re doing true confessions, I was disturbed greatly by the Iraq invastion…and did nothing. I finally have starting writing letters to the administration (which I firmly believe are ignored) just so I can someday have something to tell any grandchildren I might have. That I can say that at least I stood up and objected, if nothing else.
I loved Little Miss Sunshie!
Loved it! Loved it!
It seems to stike a chord within all of us, perhaps all of our family dynamics.
It’s poingnant, how the average kid is just dancing – we all know what it is but she doesn’t — she’s just dancing, like her Grandpa taught her.
The made-up to look like sex goddess girls and their parents walk out– they have the nerve to be offended!!!
Speaks volumes about out society these days.
But hope is renewed when they all defend her.
Now that’s a family!
Pach …. don’t rub it in honey … some of us are flying solo these days!
Rub it in honey? No, I can’t say I did.
Right on, Pach. Glenn Greenwald — same thing.
Unlike our fearless leader, others live and learn from their experiences, and the ability to grow and change is cultivated and treasured.
Great post. And yeah, thank god for Howie Klein.
I found Little Miss Sunshine quite enjoyable. As Pach suggests, it is not a bad metaphor for the Democratic Party. I nominate the younger of the two father figures (the one whose daughter is competing to be Little Miss Sunshine) for the Chuck Schumer/Rahm Emanual role. Don’t talk about [suicide][homosexuality][the War]!
knew that was coming …
;-> Pach
My (democrat) neighbor and I did our 2 mile walk with Miss Dog tonght….AZ has cooled down and my neighbors have come out of their monsoon heat hybernation. Wearing my “Had Enough” ” Vote Democrat” T-shirt doing my surpentine walk through my subdivision.
Siun, you served up another one, but I’ll let this one just shoot past.
trying to work with you dear …
Siun—think you should quit while your still…oh never mind.
katymine @ 19
I was out and about with my Ned Lamont tee short on today.
Hey, Pach
Getting past my bedtime, great post!
Pachacutec @
4
(Stabbing out a cigarette and stretching languidly:)
It’s where we all end up, Pach, no matter where we start from. We can’t quit.
Pachactec,
AMEN! Thank you for your wonderful post. Especially…
“But no matter what, I’m going to keep doing what I’m doing, and I want to ask you to do the same, to volunteer locally, to help out our Blue America candidates as volunteers, or phone bankers or donors or whatever. Because those people are standing up, and if we quit or flag in our efforts, we’re betraying them and betraying victims of American torture. Moreover, to soften our resolve is to betray ourselves, and that we cannot afford to do.”
——–
I saw Little Miss Sunshine, too, and like your description of it as an allegory. It’s a gritty and bittersweet movie, and achingly funny. Steve Carrell is a revelation – who knew?
RGB – I’ll behave now … really.
silly needed after today …
Mommybrain @ 25
I hope Luke is asleep.
This torture business makes me just sick to my stomach. But, I agree with Pach’s view, we have to keep on working for election of the best available candidates. I have adopted Vic Wulsin, have given a bunch of money, and will send a bunch more, all through Act Blue, so it shows up as a netroots contribution. I am also giving to Joe Sestak.
I picked these two from the great candidates Howie Klein identified. Wulsin actually called me, dialing for dollars, and I told her we found her on this site, and that Klein was the reason we support her. I hope this will have a longer term impact.
I want my country back!
I guess that’s one thing about liberals: we may fuck around, but we. . . fuck around. At least we can get laid.
Oldcoastie is making some excellent points on the thread below about how to stop or slow down the torture bill. Part of the answer, if seems, is to force them to admit or deny the specifics regarding how far interrogation can actually go. Put riders or amendments in the bill saying, for example that rape is off limits, or that torture of the sex organs is off limits.
This is, in my opinion, a wise strategy – if Bush wants clarity in the law, let’s demand a few clear limits – like rape. Get specific about what they can’t do, get graphic, make them deny it, put them on the defensive – this is how you win this battle.
If there are any moderators in the house – I think you might want to delete #135 in the previous thread
Pach & others…. would a big push by us this week have any affect?
So many times I feel that I am screaming and screaming and there is no one there with ears…that will hear…
katymine @ 33
I expect that question will be kicked around a bit in the next 24 hours. I don’t yet know what will happen.
Right on. It’s easy to point to the off-the-charts craziness running the Repubelican party (let’s start calling them the “Republic Party” shall we?), but we must never be lulled into a false sense of complacency by so-called Democratic enablers. Names like Clinton, Gore, Kerr(e)y, Schumer ain’t gonna cut it. We KNOW that now, since they have been shoving cocktail weenies down their throats for many, many years now. And what do they have to show for it – our country is being run by a chimpanzee, and an evil one at that! True colors are already coming to the fore for 2008…
Hillary sure is putting together an All-Star team. I mean with Terry McAuliffe at the helm, what could go wrong?!?
http://politicalwire.com/archi…..l_bid.html
Hey Hillary, I hear Bob Shrum’s not too busy. He has alot of experience and has raised tons of money also. That’s what really matters, at least that’s what Chuck and Rahm say.
Seriously though, looking at McAuliffe’s Wiki entry really helps clarify what is wrong with these people. Just glowing talk about his fundraising ability and all the money he has made in his life. No mention of the disintegration of the Democratic Party under his control. Howard Dean has alot of clean up to do.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_McAuliffe
I hope the problem is that they just don’t get it. They make so many foolish moves though, that I’m beginning to wonder if they do get it, and are actually posing as Democrats to hijack true democracy for their mega-corporate masters. Man, I hope I’m wrong. Thank god for Howie Klein indeed, and for the Internet!
I posted this earlier today, but I wanted to mention it one more time in case it might be of interest.
Christy was asking earlier today for ideas about how best to harness our collective talents and efforts in order to help Democratic candidates in the 2006 elections and beyond.
I have a modest idea that may have real potential for extending the reach of firedoglake and growing the FDL readership.
Right now, most readers here have found their way to FDL via other websites or the stray mentions in the mainstream media. I think that there is a gigantic untapped audience for FDL.
I believe that the progressive movement would be extremely well served if we could get the word out about FDL to others in our respective communities. My suggestion is to add another item to the FireDogLake CafePress website:
FireDogLake Business Cards.
We could put a side banner up at the main FDL website mentioning the business cards and the FDL campaign. The cards could then be purchased by FDL readers and distributed to friends, acquaintances, and strangers in towns and cities across the country. They could be left in elevators, waiting rooms and lobbies everywhere that we travel…
The business cards would have the website address, the FDL logo, and a few pithy lines about FireDogLake that would be intriguing enough to draw in potential readers, e.g. “FireDogLake – The Website George Bush Doesn’t Want You To Know About” or one of any of the thousands of better slogans that we could come up with together.
It would be a way to reach out to others who might not find their way over to FDL on their own, increasing our numbers, our strength, and our voice. FDL outreach.
masaccio @
29
masaccio thanks for that comment. It’s that kind of stuff that makes it all worth it and puts everything in perspective, even Pach’s…well, er…liberalism?
These guys say they pay attention to the public, to the polls, and yet, the polls are saying that 63% of the public think torture is wrong. Almost that same percentage think the Iraq invasion was a mistake and is going badly.
All the Dems have to do is stand up and say, very, very clearly: “torture is wrong, denial of habeas corpus is against everything in which we as a nation believe, and the Iraq invasion and occupation is a horrible mistake which we were led to by administration lies. This administration’s cruelty and incompetence is killing the people we claimed to liberate, and it’s killing our own soldiers for no damned good reason.”
I think that could fit into a 30-second ad with room to spare.
Long time lurker, first time poster. I just wrote the following to send to my senators, but figured I’d send it out for criticism first (please be gentle)
This is a letter that I never thought I would have to write. America does not torture. That is a sentiment that I never believed would be questioned. But now it has.
America has a long history of treating prisoners (or in current terms detainees) much better than the enemy. Hessians in the Revolutionary War were amazed that they were treated as well as they were. George Washington made a point to declare that we would treat POW’s better than our own were treated (which was dismally). In WW2 Germans were trying desperately to surrender to our troops, rather than soviet troops, because we treated people humanely.
But now we are willing to codify into law language that says that certain types of torture are allowable, and pretend that this is in accordance with Geneva Conventions because we don’t attempt to re-write those conventions? And this is in furtherance of a program that can’t be disclosed by the CIA because it would undermine national security.
Well, if this program is necessary, then that means that we, America, must torture in order to maintain security. I don’t buy this. I am all for tough tactics in fighting terrorism, but there needs to be a standard of law that separates us from petty dictators and tyrants. The ongoing argument seems to be more like a ’24’ episode, that we need to be able to torture people based on a ‘ticking time bomb’ episode. Well current law already deals with the issue via executive order or presidential pardon. I have heard many military and former intelligence officers, including Colin Powell speak against this legislation and I am willing to believe them.
Our war against terrorists is a serious issue. In no way do I diminish the threat that we face from terrorists. But we can not forego our principles and our ideals in that fight. Allowing the executive branch to interpret what actions, and what does not, adhere to the Geneva Conventions is a cop-out. The lack of Habeas Corpus for detainees also is abhorrent to the ideals of this country.
Yes, we must come up with rules under which we treat accused terrorists. Existing military tribunal laws are a start. But we can not abandon the constitutional framework that is the basis of our society.
Colin Powell is right that we risk losing our moral standing in the world if we enact this law. Please stand against this and confirm America’s commitment to the law as written by our founding fathers.
In closing I write this as a New Yorker that has felt the destruction of 9/11 and wishes that we can bring to justice the people that inflicted such great destruction on us. Within the law.
for crying out loud & continue to fight:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..00928.html
WTF? btw, they are taking comments on this article; scroll on down and share your thoughts.
*xyz @ 36
Interesting idea.
technicolor 39 — nice letter.
Nice job, technicolor. To make it even more powerful and likely to be read, write it by hand.
And welcome!
technicolor #39:
“Please be gentle”
Gentle?!? I’m an American and “gentle” isn’t in our vocabulary anymore! Now take a deep breath as I submerge this board you’re strapped to!
Thanks all. I plan to write by hand and then fax to all congress (house and senate).
If you haven’t seen it, Sean Paul made a post card you can print and send to your senators:
http://agonist.org/sean_paul_k…..ar_senator
Angie, reminds me of when everyone was trying to say what an objective, non-partisan reporter Carl Cameron was after the excerpts of him kissing Bush’s ass in a pre-inteview session were made public. What in god’s name is wrong with these people? As atrios would say, more zombie lies that will not die.
Hey Bonkers,
Oooh, ohh you nasty boy.
Oops, or nasty girl. Sorry, don’t know if Bonkers is a girl or a guy :-)
I just received this email (I’m only posting the first paragraph) from Nancy DiNardo, Chairwoman of Connecticut Democrats. Do you see anything missing?
Dear Democrats:
The City of New London and the League of Women Voters hosted the first debate in the race to take back the 2nd Congressional District on Monday night. Joe Courtney did a phenomenal job of highlighting his opponent’s many shortcomings and explaining why he would do a far superior job serving eastern Connecticut. As I sat in the audience, I realized once again what an incredible team of Democratic candidates we have in Connecticut – a team that will challenge the status quo and work with dedication to better our State and local communities. I look forward to attending Diane Farrell’s, Chris Murphy’s, and John DeStefano’s debates and to once again watching as our Democratic nominees offer up sound alternatives to their opponents’ failed policies and broken promises.
Yes – that’s right. Ned Lamont’s name is missing from the roster of Democratic nominees. I’m fuming…
Just curious…
Seems like there has been more attention given to FDL in the corporate media recently (especially Ms. Hamsher’s marvelous performance with KO). Is this a result of adding a Press Secretary?
technicolor @ 39
technicolor:
Good letter. I wish I were so eloquent. A couple of minor stylistic points:
First graf: make “But now it has.” read, “But now it has been.”
Second graf: capitalize “Soviet”
Fourth graf: change second “episode” to “scenario” and insert comma after “Colin Powell”
Last graf: change “New Yorker that” to “New Yorker who” and change “can” to “could”
As you see fit. Not to detract from the fact that you have written a good letter.
bonkers @ 35
I’m going to start calling them the “Principate Party” and see how long it takes before one of them gets it.
technicolor @ 49
A guy, but that doesn’t matter. Now stand still while I hook these electrodes to your fingers and put this black hood over your head!
This is from the letter I sent to the White House last week:
“Any individual detained by our forces needs to be treated in the same manner that we expect our forces to be treated if detained themselves. To do any less places our troops in unnecesary danger, reduces our standing in the world, and weakens the democracy our soldiers are sworn to protect…I strongly urge you to support our military and the legal provisions that protect it.”
I figured it had a better chance if it sounded like a disaffected supporter, rather than a committed oppoonent. Plus I couldn’t resist telling them to support the troops. What’s good for the goose…
“Little Miss Sunshine” was the first movie I’ve made an effort to see in a theater in years and it was worth that effort.
It was one of the best movies I’ve seen in a long time(and it reminded me of several trips my family made when I was a kid).
Jane, there is some further discussion/elaboration on the merits of adding business card outreach in the comments on Matt O.’s thread earlier today. I think it would be a great way to reach out to spread awareness. In person communication is so powerful, and business cards carry great weight with most people – they help to lend a sense of authenticity and authority to what could otherwise be wrongly written off by some as an entirely ephemeral internet phenomenon. Giving out business cards is a way of saying to your friends, family and acquaintances that there is a real flesh and blood movement in their midst.
My other idea is to have a self-identify kos/fdl/progressive blogger day or week, where we all wear, for example, orange bracelets, so we can find out who in our offices, churches, towns, and other communities are part of the progressive blogosphere.
Otherwise, I could be in an apt or office next door to another commenter and never know our common bond. A national blogger day or week would function to knit us together by giving us a chance to find out who, in our day to day lives, is a member of the progressive internet community…
If you want a good movie to watch, may I suggest this:
http://video.google.com/videop…..mp;q=press
*Note the Pakistan connection with today’s news.
EvilDrPuma @ 53
Ooooo…I like that! Very appropiate.
When Jane made me a front pager, I made a confession to the community that I had been initially a supporter of the Iraq invasion, and that I recognize I was wrong.
I’m in that same boat, so I can sympathize. I was intensely skeptical and suspicious in the run-up to the invasion, but when push came to shove, I figured Colin Powell wouldn’t pull a war out of his ass, and that Saddam must have had something to hide or he wouldn’t have been so evasive. We all know how that turned out.
The main thing is that we kept our eyes and minds open and learned from it. People in American politics are deathly afraid of allowing new facts to change their opinions about something. So we have a stubborn third of diehard Bushies that will never admit to us that they backed the wrong horse. That’s on them and they know it.
And it’s funny how the media still continues to enable this administration, in obvious and subtle ways. It’s systemic, and all you can do is get the truth out.
Thanks for your input. Will make changes and then send to Congress on Monday. First question is that I was planning on sending to all congresscritters. Will this make a difference or should I just send to my own representatives.
Well, I just watched IRAQ FOR SALE. That’ll put a crimp in your evening.. I’m with you KEEP UP THE GOOD FIGHT!
EPU’d, reposting:
I understand there’s a first-person description of waterboarding by Margery Kempe (late medieval English religious writer.) Of course, back then they used linen fabric instead of cellophane. I’m sure that first-person descriptions of the use of other techniques could be found, with which to enlighten senators and congresscritters. They could then filibuster by reading all of them into the record, just so everyone would know what was intended. Nope, no one hiding under that desk …
[still steaming…]
We’re in for a longer process than many of us can imagine. Number one priority is voting dem in Nov to turn both houses around, even if it means electing some DINOs. After that we can attempt getting progressives elected. But first and foremost — change congress! Bush policies must not be allowed to go forward and those that are already in place must be challenged. I won’t even get into the decades involved in righting the wrongs he has perpetrated throughout the world. Let’s begin by changing congress in Nov.
After the Abu Ghraib scandal broke, didn’t the members of congress get their own viewing of many more photos and videos? I seem to remember seeing video of them on tv, coming out of the room where they were shown the full depravity of that prison, and they were pale and shaken.
My question to each of those elected officials is this: how many of those acts would be legally permissible if this new compromise passes?
technicolor @ 61
I would encourage you to send it to all of them. Some may ignore it but it may resonate with others.
Cheney’s stealth fundraiser yesterday in Rochester, NY incited a decent turnout of protesters, about 250 peeps. We rallied in a park and had a short march to the venue where Deadeye was speaking. We were not harassed at all directly across the street (just filmed); there was just a line of cops in that block spaced about 20 feet apart.
My favorite moment was when the rich Republicans donors came out of the Convention Center directly across from us to board a
busmotor coach, and our crowd took up the chant “SHAME ON YOU, SHAME ON YOU!” There was a tiny group of College Republicans supporting Dick, and the sign down front in this photo is accidentally comic. To be continued…TheOtherWA: Well, I guess they became hardened or inured to the violence… can’t feel it, smell it, touch it.
“it’s ok. trust us. but, you can’t see the photos because they are classified due to obscenity, etc. and we know how sensitive and how compassionate you are! trust us, we know what’s best for all y’all…”
Just got back from seeing “U.S. vs. John Lennon.”
It’s really heartbreaking to see the activism of the 60s and 70s and then to leave the theater to an America at war and on the verge of shredding the Constitution… with life just moving along as normal.
I think I’ll strap my sons surfboard to my back and rent a dunk tank.
Your Leonardo Ass/Elbow illustration comes to mind again. I can’t find a way to post it in this comment (I saved it, and look at it often. It’s my talisman of sanity in a world gone mad), so maybe you can repost it for those who are new, and dedicate it to all the DC Dems who can’t manage to oppose torture, for f*ck’s sake.
ccmask @ 70
That triggered the thought in my mind that a mannikan being waterboarded would not be a bad idea for a torture float. Make it graphic.
So, I struck up a conversation with someone about politics. I had seen this person once or twice and felt it was time for a temperature check. He sure looked like an extra crispy rightwinger to me.
He said he didn’t feel real comfortable talking about politics or current events because he just didn’t really know enough to defend a position.
At least he knew enough that swimming in a sea of talking points is not bathing in wisdom.
I sort of scolded him. People are dying because of political and current events. We have no choice but to wield this power as thoughtfully as possible, and that means staying informed.
Glenn Greenwald’s blook, How Would A Patriot Act, the title, is a challenge to he who is holding the blook. Your country needs you, what are you gonna do about it?
Pachacutec @
4
I’m here again. I couldn’t sleep.
op99 @ 67
Thanks for the story. If they were Young Repubelicans, that guy with the crew cut and his mouth open should be holding the sign in question. The modern day Republic Party is filled with men living in the closet. How does a male prostitute posing as a journalist get White House clearance with seemingly overnight stays?!? Still can’t believe this wasn’t enough to bring these freak-a-zoids down.
op99, those people really were R’s, not parody protestors?
Bwahahahahaha! “We (heart) Dick”
Way to go, kids. And you just made my night, op99. :)
The points are as follows:
1) The legislation would have passed no matter what. That’s what happens when the other side has 55 Senators.
2) Let’s assume that Bill Frist and John McCain drafted a REAL anti-torture bill and somehow got the other 53 GOP Senators to vote for it. Does anyone really think that Bush would sign it, much less obey it?
3) If you want to get legislators with backbones, work on taking the money out of politics: http://www.publiccampaign.org.
Pachacutec @
4
Oh, honey, I wish.
Instead, I will keep fighting.
Because while there are no guarantees we will win, if we do not fight a loss is guaranteed.
soyinkafan @ 71
You mean this?
The U.S. vs John Lennon:
http://www.theusversusjohnlennon.com/site/
*Guess we need a reminder…
op99 @
67
Those kids are out of uniform…. where are their desert cammo, where are their combat boots?
Why are they here, dont they know that there is a war and our fearless leader needs them!
katymine @ 81
“Chickenhawks: The Next Generation.”
Well, gang, I’m off to bed, to sleep, even.
Thanks Pach! You the bomb.
Nites Pach….
katymine @ 81
Don’t expect “those kids” to be in combat uniforms. They are in training at their elite schools so they can be the next wave of civilian “administrators” to hit the Middle East–this time in post-invasion Iran, to run the country into the ground in an incompetent, crony-filled, Katrina-esque mockery of an occupation. And they will get paid a lot more than the guys and gals in combat uniforms.
g’nite Pach! sleep well!
btw, the postcard campaign at the Agonist origniated here with Dave’s great graphic – in the last thread – wanna make sure Dave gets props for the great effort!
Hope all of FDL will join in!
Bonkers – you asked about recent media coverage and having a press sec (being me) … so far, the coverage has come out of the blue or thanks to a number of people’s efforts. FDL is clearly leading the way with feisty, smart and on target activism and that gets noticed.
One thing that happens a lot with PR is that a lot of what happens is kismet – spreading the word around, getting info out and available, slowly building the visibility – which is what we’re working on. So we should see more as we keep at it.
Pachacutec @ 79
I believe I do, but the link won’t work for me. God, I love that graphic. It gives me fits of giggles every time. And I need those giggles – I’m 40. I bought everything Marlo Thomas and Sesame Street and Arlo Guthrie taught me, just as my parents intended. I’m still so spitting mad at Ronald Reagan for sending this country backwards from those golden years, and then we get this faux-Texan criminal. Thanks for being FDL, y’all.
We do have to just keep on keeping on, with or without a glorious filibuster on this painfully obvious issue. First get a Democratic majority, then push for a Houseful of Conyers and Murthas, George Millers and Debbie Wasserman Schultzes.
Op99 – so how was the event? and did you have any luck with the press coverage stuff?
Oh neurophius, I forgot they are in training to play touch football with bundles of 100 dollar bills It looks like Bush is not going to make the NOLA Monday Night Football game a photo op.
NOLA TShirts –
FEMA the other “F” word
F – find
E – every
m – Mexican
A – available
Katrina gave me the best blow job I every had
Here’s the original blogspot archive with the haloscan discussion.
This was apparently one of my first pinch hitting front pagers. Jane and Christy were desperate and the rest is
tragedyhistory.Continuing coverage of Deadeye Comes to Rochester: I believe Cheney’s visit was unintentionally helpful to the Act Blue Democrat Eric Massa, who is challenging Rubberstamp Republican Randy Kuhl. Massa got a lot of free face time on the local news broadcasts in response. Massa’s big challenge has been building name recognition, because his bio, character and dynamism are so superior to Kuhl (who under-polled Bush in winning the district in 2004), that once people know who Massa is, he is favored over opponent (who is noted for threatening his ex-wife with 2 shotguns). Here’s some TV coverage:
http://www.10nbc.com/index.asp…..y_id=20240
http://www.13wham.com/mediacen…..oId=180010
The sad thing is that there are many people out here that think that Torture is OK. My boss, who I respect in many ways, is alright with torture as long as is it is done by the US, because we are the ‘good guys’.
The very sad thing is that I have worked with this guy for more than 17 years. I must admit that I was pretty apolitical for most of the nineties. Guess I came aware during the early Bush admin when they started changing edo friendly laws by fiat, rather than by new legislation.
But even now when I try to bring up the problems of this admin, he will not admit any problems. I just can’t figure out any way to get to him (he spends a lot of time on the road and apparenty listens to a lot of right wing talk radio}
Is there a point in time when the affronts to the Constitution and Geneva become worthy of radical responses? Yes, and that time is not in our future – it’s in our past. This gradual erosion of decency has a purpose, and we all know what it is – to codify standards of behavior that were, until very recently, unthinkable. Each time an issue is raised, say another tape from UBL, or wanna-be terrorists-without-boots, the calls for a more radical stand on behalf of Americans is raised. We all discussed this months ago – bring a crazy idea into the fore and take it for a spin. Await the inevitable outcry, and gradually pull the idea into a slightly less-horrifying form, bat it around some more. By the end of the fight, a bunch of influential folks say, “well, at least we got some of the really bad shit out of this particular piece of public policy…”. What is left is the foundation of a truly heinous idea.
There will come a point when the only avenues left to decent people is to show these policies for what they are, and describe them in graphic terms.
We need to begin now.WTF are we waiting for?TV ad: A masked man water-boards another man (a swarthy fellow, for example) who is wearing a diving mask. The dunkee is surreptitiously forced under water and held for x interval, 3 or 4 times. After the last dunking, the victim peels off his mask, looks into the camera and breathlessly says, “Imagine this without the mask. This is what has been, and is being done in your name, by order of The President of the United States”.
TV ad: Another swarthy gent sits at a table being questioned by masked figures. When he refuses to “cooperate”, he is given a shock via electrodes attached to his fingers. The process is repeated several times, and finally our victim extends his wired hand towards the camera and says, “Imagine these electrodes attached to a more sensitive body part… Courtesy of the Central Intelligence Agency and the President of the United States, with the blessings of the US Senate and House of Representatives”.
I have my doubts that any media outlet would run them. And with the current climate of cowardice pervading the Democratic Party, I have my doubts that a single prominent Dem would stand by them. But, as we may find out in the coming weeks, once the Red Cross has interviewed prisoners @ Gitmo, they have the benefit of being, well, true.
We are hungry for truth. I feel like all the lies that have been told by these pukes are mine. In fact, they are mine and ours. Every moment that passes, men and women of position are duty-bound to act, and it is our responsibility to remind them if they stray. They have.
katymine @ 91
Or
FuckEMAll.
This article by WaPo’s R. Jeffrey Smith, the top journalist regarding the Military Commissions Act of 2006, just went up about half an hour ago. It offers some fresh details and perspective.
neurophius @ 86
Amen to that. These patriotic boys and girls have to get into Wharton to ensure their future incomes and their ability to contribute to Republican candidates and set up lobby shops, just like their beloved icons.
After all, there’s Jebby to elect and one-party rule to preserve. Onward and upward in resume-building fashion! When are they going to get that goddamned embassy finished so that all of us can use it to pole-vault over to K Street? Ungrateful brown bastards, not working fast enough to guarantee our careers.
Army? Fuck that. We’re on the fast track to the White House, if we can just get those Patrick Henry College assholes out of the way, first.
montag @ 98
Really, can we blame them for hearting Dick?
The only problem I have with your approach is that you seem to be rationalizing hitting your head against a brick wall.
Vote? Sure. Fight?? ABSOLUTELY!!! But that donkey is good ‘n’ dead. Voting for Democrats today is almost an act of desperation, that’s what it’s come down to, kinda like trying to stop a speeding bike by tossing spaghetti into the spokes.
Yes, we are on our own. We always have been. The establishment is the establishment and it’s going down in an orgy of torture and fear. The American experiment is over, so what do you do now? Our responsibility is not to save the Democrats but ourselves, our families, our communities, and so on. START A NEW EXPERIMENT, if we can. Hell, maybe a new Congress would be a beginning. But mainly it’s get-right-inside time, that’s what it is.
You’re heard about the “run out of the house bag”? I think we need one for our heads, too: when you see how hopelessly corrupt the supposed good guys are, when you finally understand it isn’t going to get any better, no matter what you do — when you “run out of the house,” so to speak, what’s in that bag? What are you really made of? What replaces the old identifications?
Deadey Comes to Rochester Part 3: Here’s some more photos on our excellent local progressive blog. That’s me with the lime green sign – the slogan came from FDLer Brownandserve. The biggest hit was my slightly modified version of Oilfieldguy’s suggestion “They Call Him Dick for a Reason.” That got lots of laughs, thumbs up, and honks. (In fact I felt like a hooker on Lyell Avenue.) Angie’s “Friends Don’t Shoot Friends in the Face” was a smile-generator, too. Thanks all y’all who made suggestions, it was an embarrassment of riches.
Wigwam – that article is amazing – looks like at least one WaPo reporter took Froomkin’s words to heart! essential reading for everyone!
Note this section:
“It replaces the old broken” military trial system ruled illegal by the Supreme Court with “a new broken commission system,” said Marine Corps Col. Dwight Sullivan, the chief defense counsel for the Defense Department’s Office of Military Commissions. He said “it methodically strips rights” guaranteed by laws and treaties and appears to be unconstitutional.
Juan del Llano
Pardon?
Siun @ 88
Thanks for the reply. That’s great these recent appearances have been “out of the blue.” Can’t wait to see what the next few months/year will bring after all these seeds you’re planting begin to sprout!
I like that – “fiesty, smart and on target activism.” Pretty much sums it up!
I’m reminded of our two football cheers from college:
For offense: “PROGRESS, PROGRESS, AMBULATE OVER THE LINE!!”
For defense: “RETARD THEM, RETARD THEM, MAKE THEM RELINQUISH THE BALL!!”
I’m going to keep these words in mind until Election Day.
“I had been initially a supporter of the Iraq invasion, and that I recognize I was wrong. I felt the community had a right to know, and to discount my judgment accordingly, as people choose. I remind them of my error again tonight.”
Pach, takes real guts to stand up and say things like this. Wish it were more common (particularly in places like DC).
Reminds me of that presser when asked about mistakes he had made, Junya in his child-like fibbing way tried to sell the idea that he just off-hand couldn’t remember any.
Everybody knew he was lying, but he was given a pass. And so it goes.
Seems like giving the Repugs a pass is considered “decent” Democratic Beltway political behavior.
For these folks, Truth evidently is no longer a valid coin of the realm.
Op99 – Looks like you did a great job – ain’t hitting the streets invigorating?
and check wigwam’s link to the new WaPo article at #97 – great info
Siun @ 102
R. Jeffrey Smith has been a monster as far as this torture business is concerned. For the past month and a half he’d have articles every other day. And they were all excellent, insightful, professional articles.
I guess that the way I’d put it, he is one of the few MSM journalists that can tell the difference between big and little. He always went to the heart of the matter, and didn’t let side shows take his focus off what’s important.
Then suddenly after a week ago, I didn’t see anything by him over this past week. I had a tinhat theory that he had been pulled off because he was pissing off Republican leadership by keeping his eye on the ball.
All I can say is that I’m happy to see him back. He and Marty Lederman are my must-read dudes on this stuff.
It is a lovely film. I have worked with the directors, a husband and wife team, and they are marvelous people. Talk about family values – is Cyrus married? Do he and his wife work together? (disclaimer – I don’t work with my wife) How many times has Rupert been married? Valerie and Jonathan are exceptional human beings. They deserve every praise we can convince them to believe (they are notoriously humble).
erquirk @ 105
Um, not the catchiest of cheers. Did the football players even understand what you were saying? I guess there’s one word in there I’ll still have in my mind as long as we keep seeing Shrubya and the boobtube.
Following up on the discussion here (including the “Dear Senator” postcard) and my guest post a few days ago, a suggested TV ad (from the end of this post):
Wouldn’t that be a good way to beat the Republican fearmongers on their own supposed home turf?
EvilDrPuma @ 82
My friend Jen (pictured beside me) whose brother is serving his 3rd tour in Iraq, forayed with me into the RepubliKid corner and asked them that very question. The answers are, “mumble mumble mumble I’m a junior I’m a girl mumble mumble.”
Here’s a cut and paste from a rochesterturning comment thread about my little chat with them.
Swopa! great ad idea !
and thanks for putting Dave’s postcard image up … seems like a good thing to spread around.
(and great IROC pic on your site!)
But sometimes, a Democratic candidate will stand up and say what needs to be said, and you realize that the party is worth supporting after all. Like John Tester in his debate with Conrad Burns today:
Can’t get much better than that!
erquirk @ 105
This reminds me of the time in highschool when we were censored for our float that said “Eagles Take Your Medicine” with a large Tylenor bottle (this was when the Tylenor poisening was at its height). Granted it was in poor taste. But it was, funny in a sick way.
Back from dancing my ass off in a redneck dive where my band used to play. Really want to see Little Miss Sunshine. Pach you really grabbed me with this post, thanks.
Now to savor some comments before I collapse into bed…
(I sat in a little on bass – dang am I rusty!)
op99 #112:
Kill ‘em with kindess, eh? Almost never fails.
A friend of mine just sent me a copy of this excellent article, “Torture’s Long Shadow,” from WaPo by Vladimir Bukovsky. It’s from last December, but you wouldn’t know that unless someone told you.
Sharkbabe @ 116
Speaking as a fellow bass player, it’s nice to play an instrument where you can be rusty and no one notices, isn’t it?
Siun @ 107
Yes indeedy – made some new friends too.
Relating the protest back to Pach’s excellent post, there was a HUGE anti-torture sentiment at the rally. It was a very diverse crowd, from high school kids to grannies, and multi-racial. If we were representative of Democrats in general, then there is a big reservoir of visceral opposition to torture that could be a driver of voter turnout if exploited. So big-shot Dems, make this a signature issue – it’s not only the right thing to do, it’s good politics too.
pontificator @ 114
That is so refreshing. Thanks for sharing that. I was liking Tester anyway, but might have to visit Act Blue again after that one!
http://www.actblue.com/page/blueamerica
bonkers @ 119
That’s because it’s so damned hard to find a bass player. You guys are heavily sought after. The good ones always seem to be booked already.
On the war on terror:
The respected Israeli military historian Martin van Creveld argues that it is “the most foolish war since Emperor Augustus in 9 B.C. sent his legions into Germany and lost them.” Not a few regard Iraq as spelling the beginning of the end of American dominance in the world.
http://fairuse.100webcustomers…..on030.html
Meanwhile, President Bush named a delegation of business leaders to visit Lebanon and help the war-torn country rebuild following the Israeli-Hezbollah conflict. The White House said the delegation will meet with Lebanese Prime Minister Fuad Siniora and visit areas bombed by Israel.
http://mensnewsdaily.com/2006/…..li-border/
ccmask @ 124
Ummm, that would be the “I’m gonna make big bucks on rebuilding what the US helped to destroy” business group, yes?
ccmask @ 124
Lets see, negotiate Cost Plus contracts
Double bill for meals and supplies just because they saw the same person twice in the same day
Leave $100,000 trucks on the side of the road burning because their are no spare tires…
Didn’t Figure if they are that stupid… Iraq & Katrina redux…
FDL, rocks w/passionate action. Listening to “Sabicas-Rock Encounter with Joe Beck.’ Fitting music for thread. Jonathan Turley, Georgetown U. on countdown this week was incredibly clear on USA Torture. Big Dog w/KO was lightin’ it up. Folks in my neighborhood are pissed and unforgiving. Never again!
pontificator @
114
YAY! He needs some serious kudos and financial support for that! That man is one of us! Go TESTER.
op99– good on you and thanks for protesting for all of us and thanks for sharing the pics and your impressions.
Sharkbabe, you are just cool.
Okay..this one is bad. Hopefully Jane is sleeping peacefully…..
Washington Post Endorses Lieberman
by LynnS
Sat Sep 23, 2006 at 11:05:40 PM PDT
E&P is reporting tonight that tomorrow’s WaPo will endorse Lieberman for Senate:
The Post noted that “the critical question facing voters in November, as opposed to party leaders now, is who would make the better senator — which is why we welcome Mr. Lieberman’s decision to remain in the race. He would be, by far, the better choice for the people of Connecticut.” It even asserted that Lieberman had been making “sharp criticism” of the president on the war for years — likely a surprise to most Democratic voters in the state.
ccmask – wtf! what are they thinking!
damn …..
ccmask @ 129
Pardon me while I go throw up.
ccmask @ 124
I guess all the dead bodies must be either taken away or mummified by now… wouldn’t want to offend the delicate constitutions of those vultures that bushco is sending, would we?
Damn the wapo for the second time tonite, ccmask @ 129!!!!!!!!!!
“Let me be clear. I don’t want to weaken the Patriot Act. I want to get rid of it,” Tester said.
Did I drop acid tonight and forget? An actual viable dem is actually saying this?
I have a dream: that some single voice will be the thing that turns the dem pussyhood horror show to kickass opposition on a dime.
ccmask @ 129
Verification of the reason I call them the WaPoo – good for puppy training and bird cages.
Sharkbabe @ 133
I dunno, Sharkie. Did you chew on a little piece of paper for a really long time? Or let a little purple barrel melt on your tongue? Or…
(Oh, forgive me. It’s Saturday Night!)
I found the Lieberman one on a diary at DailyKos. Jane is gonna be pissed.
ccmask @ 123
Hmmmm. Invading Iraq in March 2003 to win midterm elections in November 2002. Clever man that Karl Rove!
Sharkbabe @ 133
I have been on Jon Tester’s email list for over a year. I get emails every week with strong statements just like that.
Even evaluated moving to Great Falls, MT
I work from home, just need an airport with enough service to get to my clients….. Really like MT Gov Brian Schweitzer
Well, ccmask, in the meantime while sweet Jane is sleeping, I went back and erased my g’nite from my last post because I read your 129 I am pissed right now and so are we all.
Pissed off beyond all recognition. POBAR.
Sharkbabe @
133
Thanks sharkbabe – and on that upbeat dream of yours I bid all a good night.
I think France ruined Bush’s Osama surprise. Notice the last 2 weeks he is declaring that we need permission to go into Pakistan to get Osama. And notice how confident he seemed at the UN speech and the Bush & Mush press conference. His swagger was back.
This reminds me of a story of a lady that won the lottery. I thing it was several million dollars. Anyway, she decides to wait to tell her husband on his birthday. But his birthday was like 6 months away. Can you imagine! The poor bastid going to work everyday, cutting the grass, snaking the toilet….Then she tells him on his birthday. I thought that was insane. But imagine if the story was true and Bush was holding it for the October surprise?
If true, he can forget that noise right now.
There another diary at Dailykos saying that Dem indicments are the October surprise. That should them off the waterboard…
This torture issue is worth fighting over. Torture is evil. Period.
And from a political perpective, standing up against evil will help you get votes. In this case, it’s a clear example of why the GOP in no way represents Christian values. Just take it right at them.
Mock up ad, check it out (10 seconds): http://www.geocities.com/ddunn…..index.html
angie, blush and your coolness is 100x mine. I aspire to so much of the thoughtfulness realness passion expressive power I see here.
Speaking as a fellow bass player, it’s nice to play an instrument where you can be rusty and no one notices, isn’t it?
Yeah but no consolation when you’re a self hating perfectionist…however, good news is I’m losing that bullshit, just enjoyed myself! Quel concept.
That’s because it’s so damned hard to find a bass player. You guys are heavily sought after. The good ones always seem to be booked already.
Wow. Excuse me while I go preen. And play some scales.
Wow. Excuse me while I go preen
Well, goodnite folks.
ccmask @
129
That seems like sort of old news, given that WaPo endorsed Lieberman when these same two candidates ran against each other four months ago. (I’ve heard unconfirmed rumors of a third candidate, but nobody seems to notice.)
oops.
Anyway, Wapo Lieberman endorsement feels like a physical blow. I should know better, but I’m stunned.
As a long time and frequent reader (although not before a participant) here, I have to say I am frustrated and more than a little disappointed by what comes across as an attitude of “yes it’s bad, but…” about the complete Democratic abdication on the torture issue.
I guess I’m with Greenwald, Digby and others in seeing this issue as different in kind than many of those on which Democrats have capitulated in the past. Partly because the serious moral boundary this issue crosses for the country — making us a nation in which torture is expressly approved of in our name by our representatives, and past practitioners of illegal torture are expressly let off the hook. But equally because of the reality that this is the kind of change in law that will likely never be taken back, no matter what majorities Democrats may someday have. As history makes clear, granting new rights to politically unpopular groups is something that happens only rarely in our country, at times where dramatic events (the Depression, WWII, the civil rights movement) create an opening. Once the moment passes, an erosion of those rights (see, for example, the ending of welfare as entitlement and the curtailment of rights and dramatic increase in the penalties for criminal defendants) usually will not be reversed. (Which is not to say that all future presidents will torture — individually they may not, but I see little likelihood that a future Congress will think it worth the heavy lifting to significantly limit the president’s discretion to do so, significantly enhance the victim’s opportunities for review, etc. — it hasn’t happened in the criminal context, and I think most Americans hold our home grown criminals in greater regard than accused terrorists).
Obviously, the context in which the issue has been raised is a setup, deliberately designed by Rove to leave Democrats with no good options. But the fact that it is a setup does not mean to me that the Democrats get a pass for allowing it to happen, rather than using every tool they have to prevent it. For all those that will be tortured under this law (and I don’t doubt that some torture would happen without it, although plainly more will happen with it — all those CIA agents who stopped participating because of concerns about liability can now get back to work), and for all the damage it will do to our international standing, to the safety of our own soldiers, and to the ideals of our country, I frankly don’t think saying “gee, they kind of set us up on this one” really cuts it.
Which is not to say I expect everyone to agree with me that allowing this to become law would be one capitulation too far by the Democrats. But it disappoints me that the response of many (not just here but elsewhere in the progressive blogosphere) seems to be to try to contain the issue and cheerlead and cajole us on to other topics — even before the vote has happened! A position that demeans the importance of the issue to those of us who think that Democrats should know, before they act, that allowing a permanent presidential right to torture without possibility of redress to be established in this country is not okay with us and will cost them support.
love you ccmask, sleep well
Pachutec, as usual, nails the trouble with our party and politics. It is a leadership vacuum. When we identify a leader who can truly represent the majority or center, which is what we are, then we are getting somewhere.
Then this leader will have to chastise this current mob mentality in the U.S. This leader will have to explain the purpose of government and push for transparency in government.
I believe this kind of scenario will be achieved over time, but we have to remain active. Kudos to all and Pach, thank you for your hard work.
Regarding political ads, I worry sometimes we get too isolated in our own sphere of influence, we forget who we really need to connect with in ads nowadaze. It’s these people that are easily swayed, not intellectually curious, complacent, and so on. Let’s call this person John Q. Nascar.
Talking about the Geneva Conventions violations, or election fraud here at FDL is no big whup, since most are well-versed and opinionated on issues like this. However, it is very likely that John Q Nascar doesn’t even know what the Geneva Conventions are. The Republic Party knows this all to well, and has exploited it over and over in their messaging. The Repukes strike up the “mighty Wurlitzer” and appeal to base human emotions.
Because of this opinion I have, I had this thought to do an ad campaign titled, “In Your Name.”
Imagine very sad dramatic music over horrific shots of injured kids in Iraq or mothers with blood all over their clothes screaming in agony over the loss of their child. Maybe some for troops coming home here in caskets or grieving families. Anything showing the reality of war.
Maybe a voiceover saying that under Republic leadership, this is happening “In YOUR Name!” “This must stop now. Vote Democratic.” Essentially saying as Americans, all this killing, maiming, torturing is happening in your name. As a parent, when I see these images, I literally get nauseous. I cannot imagine this happening to my family, and to think a military, president, and congress, using tax money I have given them, are doing this!!
I feel like a more universal message like this crosses so many political, class, gender, and age divides, that a lot of John Q. Nascars might change their minds. Sure, there’s the 25% or whatever that’ll vote Republic even if Bush burns a box filled with baby kittens on live TV, but there’s another 25% that have some conscience. They just need a little nudging. Getting just a portion of John Q. Nascars to vote Democratic (and not the DINOS!) might be enough to take over Congress and POTUS for a long time, regardless of what Diebold trys to pull. Anyway, just a sleep-deprived stream of consciousness…
(Weird. I keep hearing melodic minor scales coming from somewhere around here…)
Hey, anybody seen Sharkbabe lately?
I know Pach is coping some ZZZ”s. But thanks I needed that. After Reid’s rollover, I was so fucking pissed! I emailed him and my senator(Bingaman) To say it was time to fish or cut bait. If Dems don’t protest this torture bill, I have my doubts about them. When they grow some cajones and fight? Instead listening to the dipshits inside the beltway?
I’m just an old guy who was in the Marines over 50 yrs ago. But Goddammit, I want my country back!
My grand kids deserve better.
Saw Iraq for sale tonight. Really pissed me off. And then I started to cry.
What in the hell have we become?
jello5929 @
142
Now that’s what I’m talking about. Somehow, we need to slap people upside the whatever, and reaffirm the meaning of virtue. It should matter how we convey it, but when the country sits still for torture, a bright, harsh light is called for.
Nice, jello.
Nice, lawslinger.
Nice, Bonkers – to convince Sir Nascar to “Vote Democratic”, and have it be in stark contrast to ReThugs, first the Democrats need to be worthy. Otherwise, we might as well say, “Vote Green”. Just sayin.
Great to see that BigTime and the Oligarchs got a fine FDL welcome in Rochester, op, terrific pix, thanks for the link!
Glad also to hear that Eric Massa got some media time due to the visit — perhaps the King’s future fundraising schedule will be a little more stealthy due to your efforts. Liked your bright green sign!
========
Had Enough?
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Every Sunday from 11am to 1pm PDT, KPFK (streaming from kpfk.org and broadcasting on 90.7FM) in LA has an excellent progressive talk show, Ian Masters’ Background Briefing. Here is his lineup for Sunday, 9/24/06:
1.1) CONFIRMED: Ambassador Akbar Ahmed is, according to the BBC, “probably the world’s best-known scholar on contemporary Islam.” He is the former Pakistani Ambassador to Great Britain, and has advised Prince Charles and met with President George W. Bush to consult on Islam. He is now Chair of Islamic Studies and professor of International Relations at American University in Washington, DC. Dr. Ahmed is a distinguished anthropologist, writer, and filmmaker. He has been actively involved in interfaith dialogue and the study of global Islam and its impact on contemporary society for many years. He is the author of “Islam Under Siege,” and “Discovering Islam: Making Sense of Muslim History and Society,” among other titles. His most recent book, written with Brian Forst, is “After Terror: promoting dialog between nations.”
1.1b) CONFIRMED: Chris Fair is a senior research associate at the United States Institute for Peace’s Center for Conflict Analysis and Prevention, where she specializes in South Asian political and military affairs. Prior to joining USIP in April 2004, she was an associate political scientist at the RAND Corporation. Much of her research has been concerned with security competition between India and Pakistan, Pakistan’s internal security, analyses of the causes of terrorism, and U.S. strategic relations with India and Pakistan.
1.2) CONFIRMED: Damon Linker is intimately familiar with the rise of the theocons, working as he did in the center of the theoconservative world as an editor of its flagship journal, First Things. That experience gave him resolve to write a critical history of the movement. His new book is “The Theocons: secular America under seige,” in which he describes the inner workings of the “theoconservative” movement–a group of mostly Catholic intellectuals who view American society in sometimes apocalyptic terms, whose ultimate goal is “the end of secular politics” in America.”
1.3) SEMI-CONFIRMED: Mai Yamani is an anthropologist, and research fellow in the middle east programme at Chatham House. Among her books are Changed Identities: The Challenge of the New Generation in Saudi Arabia and Cradle of Islam: The Hijaz and the Quest for an Arabian Identity. She authored a recent article, published at opendemocracy.net, entitled “Mecca: Islam’s cosmopolitan heart,” which held that the historic, open and inclusive tradition of the Hijaz is a truer beacon for 21st-century Muslims that the arid Wahhabi dogma of Saudi Arabia’s rulers.
Live From the Left Coast (second hour):
2.1) CONFIRMED: Rajiv Chandrasekaran is an assistant managing editor of The Washington Post, where he has worked since 1994. He previously served the Post as a bureau chief in Baghdad, Cairo, and Southeast Asia, and as a correspondent covering the war in Afghanistan. He recently completed a term as journalist-in-residence at the International Reporting Project at the Johns Hopkins School for Advanced International Studies, and was a public policy scholar at the Woodrow Wilson International Center. His new book is “Imperial Life in the Emerald City: Inside Iraq’s Green Zone,” described as “as extraordinary vivid and compelling anatomy of a fiasco.”
2.2) CONFIRMED: T. Christian Miller is an award-winning investigative reporter for the Los Angeles Times. In ten years as a professional journalist and foreign correspondent, Miller has covered four wars, a presidential campaign and reported from more than two dozen countries. He has won numerous accolades for his work in both the U.S. and abroad, including the Livingston Award for international reporting, one of the most competitive and prestigious reporting prizes in American journalism. Miller was the only journalist in the U.S. dedicated exclusively to covering the Iraqi reconstruction. In nearly two years of following the money trail, Miller’s groundbreaking work has been followed by the expulsion of a top Pentagon official, the cancellation of a major arms contract and the initiation of several investigations. Miller’s recently published book, Blood Money: Wasted Billions, Lost Lives and Corporate Greed in Iraq has won widespread critical acclaim. The Washington Post called it one of the indispensable on Iraq. Prior to coming to Washington, Miller was a foreign correspondent based in Bogot, Colombia where he covered that nation’s guerrilla conflict and its connection to Washington’s war on drugs. In 2000, Miller covered the presidential campaign of George W. Bush.
If Sen. Stevens could put a secret hold on the pork database bill, why can’t somebody with some huevos put a hold on this evil piece of crap?
ccmask @ 129
Not surprising and I don’t think CT voters could care less what the WaPoo editorial board thinks.
Ok I know I asked this up thread but WHY has there been little push back on the Torture issue, considering McCain is my senator, I knew this stupid stand was going to be a give bush want he wants play.
WHY WHY WHY …. and if we did it now….
Going to have a board meeting of my DFA group tomorrow and Monday is the PDA monthly meeting… I can mobilize the ground game here but need some sort of action plan…
When America fails to be good, America fails to be GREAT
Lawslinger – nodding … welcome to late night and to commenting – we need your voice!
and all that equivocating is why I call FDL home … we still believe in calling them on their nonsense.
HufnPuf – tears and rage here at what is going on but also resolve that we’ll keep fighting
TeddySanFran @ 154
Great name for a band. ‘Night all.
nite nite op99…. ya did good today!
I am signing off and saying g’nite. The hell with Hiatt and his new golden boy Michael “axis of evil” Gerson and the rest of the macacas. Endorsing Lieberliar after all this…
throw the bum out!
next thing you know, the editorial bunch will endorse Allen.
lawsinger– thanks and welcome!
hufNpuf– no Marine deserves to cry 50 years later. we should be better by now.
sweet dreams, all.
katymine @ 158
Yeah, McCain isn’t my Senator, but it seems to me that if he does have the best interests of the US in mind, has a personal interest in providing effective protections for current and future soldiers, and is truly shocked at what BushCo wants to do, he’d stay hard on this. What did he receive to induce the el-foldo?
sleep time here too …
don’t forget Dave’s postcard image – print it out and send/fax or email it to your Senator – last thread, #98 if I recall.
newtonusr, there have been rumors here since the Kerry asking McCain to be his running mate rumors days…. that it actually happened but BushCo offered him a better deal….. I have heard this from several sources here that Cheney is going to resign due to health reasons …. probably next year and Bush will appoint McCain… since our dear McCain is such a nice guy…. he will get confirmed and there you go…. heir apparent with the promise of having Jebbie as VP in 08
There you go…. the next generation of Bush dynasty!
Siun@159. Thanks I needed that. I just get so discouraged at times. But an old, old, ex Marine shouldn’t cry. In addition to tilting at windmills, I,m a Cubs fan. Zambrano won his 16th. tonight. And hit his 6th homer. 707. And nite y’all.
All my neighbors heard me banging my piano today too. (That’s banging in the non-sexual sense, pervs.) Voi che sapete, Laura Nyro, West Side Story piano score, Don’t Know Much, etc.
Man just to sing and enjoy. My generation is the last to grow up with/care about/hassle with big acoustic pianos. I don’t care if I end up on a grate, my Steinway console with be there too.
katymine @ 165
so sad
so likely
so probable
g’nite all
Siun, remember if anyone is going to do the postcard thing at a registered Democratic club that they need to print at the bottom:
“labor and supplies donated” so that the FEC cannot snag ya…
katymine @ 165
I’ve had the same thought (Shooter’s health), but I still think it’ll be Jeb as appointed Veep. But McCain folded with the signing statements a few months ago, so maybe you’re right…
For those of you who are upset about Wapo’s endorsement of Lieberwurst:
As my lovely mother used to say, “Consider the source.”
For those of you who consider it unconscionable that the Democrats in Congress haven’t spoken up about McCain’s contemptable hypocracy in the form of a bill for Fuckwad:
What happens on Monday and for the rest of the month will give much greater clarity to their inaction. It is important for us to speak up now. It is, at least, theoretically, a workable strategy for them to be silent until now. What has happened with Congress and the Cheney Administration so far is elaborate Rovian Kabuki. I am under no illusion that the Democrats won’t screw up or be weaselly immoral wimps. What happens next will make it more clear.
Whatever they do, and whatever happens, I believe Pach testified loud and clear:
We keep going doing what we can best do: supporting Progressive Candidates.
No matter how bad it looks, don’t get distracted by Karl’s Shiny Objects.
Thank you, Pach, for your clear, sane voice of leadership.
Josh Marshall has a post about Broder’s new article at WaPo:
http://tinyurl.com/pyfdy
says he thinks that Broder has lost his mind!
http://www.talkingpointsmemo.c…..009940.php
Just so you know… I listen to a Libertarian Radio Talk show host some days who is VERY anti Bush & Anti Iraq war… he has lived here all his life so he knows stuff more than I do…. His take on McCain is that McCain is a super uber WAR Hawk and he is more so than the PNAC guys… which is really scary…
My hope is that McCain will need to retire due to his health… how much more of his face can they carve off due to skin cancer?
jinny @ 172
jinny – I’m with Josh. Broder is certifiable now. There are 14
liesmistakesidiocies in the first 3 paragraphs!op99 @ 160
Op99:
You were wonderful. You are doing what we all must do. What a contrast between the folks in the pictures of the Cheney Kids and those of your group. Sleep well….
sheez, I’m tired and typoing, me to bed too.
lawsinger, you rock.
I feel strangely hopeful tonight, that Rove and Cheney are nothing, and humans and humanity are everything, and still can and will fucking bury these hideous twisted fugly evil fucks in the end.
Night.
Oh, and fascisti: Fear the Peanut.
‘nite Skarky, and the rest of you across the pond. i gotta go do some work……
nite all…. depressed myself enough as it is…
lawsinger @147 -
I haven’t been around that much lately, but I do know that the folks at FDL have not been capitulating on the torture issue, or any other issue regarding the BushCo criminality. In fact, the crowd here has been hitting it extrememly hard. All one needs to do is look through the threads (especially Jane’s from earlier today) to see and feel the disgust and anger emanating from every posted comment.
We are working our a**es off, individually, and in concert, to end this neo-con nightmare
we’ve been living in for the past six years. The Democrats in Congress are (mostly) cowards. And some of them are pigs (see under: “Schumer” and “Emanuel” in your Dictionary of Sleaze).
We know that backwards, forwards, sideways and upside-down.
But we also see glimmers of hope flickering in the night sky, named Feingold, Leahy, Murtha, Waxman and Conyers.
So we are banning together to come up with both practical and creative strategies and tactics to get the message to our electeds that we will not take one more goddamned minute of their squeamishness. We want our country back, we want our Constitution honored, and right now we don’t have a lot of choice about which party to support. We’re not caving in with anything resembling “Well, it’s bad but not that bad…” or any other such nonsense.
I hear your frustration loud and clear, because I feel it too. It keeps me up at night, and shadows me during the day. And I’m pretty sick and tired of feeling like my choices lose in almost every election. But I’m not giving up, neither is anyone else here.
As I’ve been reading through the comments over the past hour, I’ve been putting together my Senator Do You Approve of Torture? postcards
and getting them ready for Monday morning’s mail. I also talk to every single person I happen to brush shoulders with and reinforce that giving up in the face of daily assaults on our Constitution and our dignity is NOT an option. And I’m giving my hard-earned money to every ActBlue candidate – and every not ActBlue candidate – I think can use my help.
I also happen to serve on the board of directors for an organization whose first and foremost mission is registering voters, and educating them about issues so that they can cast an informed vote.
Sometimes, all of that exhausts me to no end. And still, I don’t sleep at night!
What I’m not doing is throwing in the towel. It’s not my nature and it wouldn’t accomplish anything. I’m not supporting Green Party candidates or so-called “independent” candidates this year because that would just be like running for the hills.
So, please re-read Pach’s post, and tell me that we’re not all in the same boat, rippling through rough waters, fashioning whatever new navigation tools we can come up with.
I don’t know about you, but I’ve got my sights set on that green patch of land way yonder. Since the seas have been stormy, it ’s hard to see through the mist and the fog. Which means that patch of land might actually be closer than we think.
I’m forging ahead.
katymine @
6
It isn’t like Markos commanded and we obeyed. We had our plans already. But I’m turning more and more people in the area on to the netroot phenomena.
It is ten days until our borough and town elections!
Up here this past 36 hours it has been more like we’ve been energized on some local elections coming up the first week of October. Big discussion last night on the “adopt a voter” idea, then action today. Our school board and borough assembly could both go either way. There is so much in flux.
Pounding signs in the ground on a blustery day and helping people write letters to the editors.
That’s what we’re doing over the weekend……
fahrender, you’re a treasure – like so many here whose words and energies I have enjoyed & been strengthened by in all kinds of ways, day in and out – anyway go enjoy your work and do it good, baby
Dave Broder must be on the verge of soiling himseld in public and talking with large rabbits.
It is really scary how the establishent is melting into a pool of stupidity.
-GSD
I know ET… I was pulling Pach’s chain… he had posted this at 8:07 PDT and I was the zero at 8:39… he was wondering where everyone was…
My boyfriend and I were impressed with all the Dem signs in AK… there was a guy with a State Rep sign in his truck at the Reluctant Fisherman at Cordova… I was wondering if Cordova could be called the Berkley of AK?
((((((katymine))))))
maybe tomorrow will be the day neofascism commits its inevitable fatal error
let’s not forget the greek playwrights have a 100% accuracy record
never lose hope, or should I say,
KEEP THE FAITH, LOVE AND HUMANITY AND CIVILIZATION CONQUER HATE AND TORTURE, ALWAYS HAVE ALWAYS WILL!
WaPo endorsed Lieberman?
BWA HA HA HA HA!
:)
And now, A brief message for the world
…Better days ahead.
;>)
darkblack @ 185
Time for a change, this SOylent Green is tasting funny.
-GSD
{{{{Sharkbabe}}}
Thanks…. it has been hard listening to my boyfriend’s description of what he is seeing in NOLA… he is one of those big teddy bears with an even bigger heart and there are times he cannot even talk about it…
He said a co-worker turned the mattress over in her hotel (upscale chain) and it was all moldy and this was on the 12th floor… that the buildings are a mess, he had to drive 10 mines to find a grocery store…
The city just laid off a 1/3 of their transit workers. The issue is there is work but there is NO place for the workforce to live in. The issue is that the FEDs (FEMA) have to provide specifications for building so that the City, County & State planning boards can submit plans for funding but the FEDs have not delivered the specs so the local goverments get the blame for not doing anything because you have BushCo going around saying …. well we ALOCATED XXX dollars but the lie is that word. ALOCATED does NOT mean distributed…
katymine @
183
ROFL! Cordova Berkely axis? When I pulled in there 33 years ago, people with “Sierra Club Go Home” signs on their pickups crowded the parking lot outside the high school to get in to vote with the fishers’ union to spend big money to keep the oil pipeline from happening. People who hated environmentalists outwardly slowly became environmentalists inwardly over the next 20 years. Worth a book, the paradoxes of Cordova.
katymine @
173
Plenty. I remember a patient who had a bandage covering one side of her face, kind of. Remove it and you could see sinus cavities. Amazing cancer survivor, from a reservation in NM in the 1970s.
Is it the “freedom” to torture or the “liberty” to decide what torture “is” that George W. Bush really wants?
Bush and the Cheney Administration want Congress to give them “immunity” or “amnesty” from any possible prosecution for past torture or war crimes. They’ll charge a few “bad apples” at Abu Ghraib, but they’ll cover for the Attorney General and the Secretary of Defense and the “officers and gentlemen” who gave the orders to use “alternative interrogation techniques” beyond the bounds of that “quaint” old Geneva Convention.
They say they won’t torture, but only they will have the right to say what “torture” actually “is”.
Like Lady Macbeth, our Commander-in-Chief wants to wash the blood from his hands. He can do it legally through a supine Congress, but morally?…That’s another issue. The stain is too deep, the stench too intrenched.
Mr. Bush said he had “three Shakespeares” on his summer reading list.
I’ll bet “Macbeth” wasn’t one of them.
WaPo is saying this so that they can keep channels open to all in the BushCo. regime. Maybe with some pressure from the BushCo. regime.
And, speaking of contests, anyone want to wager a bet that Lieberman (after he loses to Lamont) will be appointed as Ambassador to err… somewhere.. Maybe like starts with…
Plan for a Democratic Party sweep in November: Have the Congressional Democratic leadership in both the House and the Senate come out bright and early on Monday and shut down the Torture Bill.
Shut it down, filibuster, raise Cain, yell and pin the “Republican compromise” to their asses and their asses to the wall. Unified message is essential. Get it done.
ET, I was seeing a lot of changed attitudes just like AZ. They keek saying its a Red state but it is registered 1/3 dem, 1/3 rethug & 1/3 indi. We hve lost so many to the Iraq war, lots of Vets are pissed. This the first year that Kyl has to campaign, it is almost fummy
Whig
I’m hoping for a unified Dem response, too. The takeover of the US by Fundies is a shame on us for letting it happen, but the whole planet pays for our inattention to our own principles.
Somehow, I gotta believe that McCain is not for torture. I also believe that Graham, Warner, and most Senators feel the same, and would love the Dems to simply make it impossible for BushCo to have its way here. “Sorry, Dick – what could we do?”
What we need is a courageous Senate, but if we have to rely on obstructionism to halt this global atrocity, so be it.
http://www.time.com/time/magaz…..96,00.html
==Jane Hamsher, who runs the piquant online hangout Firedoglake, and other bloggers have started the “roots project,” in which they employ nonweb political tactics like writing letters to the editors of their local newspapers. “We can hammer the New York Times and the Washington Post forever,” Hamsher said, but “candidates are more influenced by what we’re doing in their own backyards.”== []
[]==If the Democrats win in the fall elections, the roots of that victory will not be on the Net.===
Oh yeah? Who sez?
And, geez “piquant online hangout Firedoglake” … Looks like this guy had to get out his thesaurus..
http://www.editorandpublisher……1003156107
‘Wash Post’ Endorses Lieberman for Senate — While Hitting War on Front Page
===Just as the Post editorial page was endorsing the pro-war candidate in Connecticut, the paper’s front page carried a report that painted the war in the worst possible light. It opened, “The war in Iraq has become the primary recruitment vehicle for violent Islamic extremists, motivating a new generation of potential terrorists around the world whose numbers are increasing faster than the United States and its allies are eliminating the threat, U.S. intelligence analysts have concluded.===
Not the first time that a WaPo editorial has been out of touch with occasional truthy reports…
piquant
adj 1: having an agreeably pungent taste [syn: savory, savoury, spicy, zesty] 2: engagingly stimulating or provocative; “a piquant wit”; “salty language” [syn: salty] 3: attracting or delighting; “an engaging frankness”; “a piquant face with large appealing eyes” [syn: engaging]
WordNet 2.0, 2003 Princeton University
I like, though… Good get! Article misses the point, of course.
For What It’s Worth
There’s something happening here
What it is ain’t exactly clear
There’s a man with a gun over there
Telling me I got to beware
I think it’s time we stop, children, what’s that sound
Everybody look what’s going down
There’s battle lines being drawn
Nobody’s right if everybody’s wrong
Young people speaking their minds
Getting so much resistance from behind
I think it’s time we stop, hey, what’s that sound
Everybody look what’s going down
What a field-day for the heat
A thousand people in the street
Singing songs and carrying signs
Mostly say, hooray for our side
It’s time we stop, hey, what’s that sound
Everybody look what’s going down
Paranoia strikes deep
Into your life it will creep
It starts when you’re always afraid
You step out of line, the man come and take you away
We better stop, hey, what’s that sound
Everybody look what’s going down
Stop, hey, what’s that sound
Everybody look what’s going down
Stop, now, what’s that sound
Everybody look what’s going down
Stop, children, what’s that sound
Everybody look what’s going down
Buffalo Springfield
Maggie
for dick..
Happiness is a Warm Gun
She’s not a girl who misses much
Do do do do do do- oh yea!
She’s well acquainted with the touch of the velvet hand
Like a lizard on a window pane
The man in the crowd with the multicoloured mirrors
On his hobnail boots
Lying with his eyes while his hands are busy
Working overtime
A soap impression of his wife which he ate
And donated to the National Trust
I need a fix ’cause I’m going down
Down to the bits that I left uptown
I need a fix cause I’m going down
Mother Superior jumped the gun
Mother Superior jumped the gun
Mother Superior jumped the gun
Mother Superior jumped the gun
Happiness is a warm gun
Happiness is a warm gun, momma
When I hold you in my arms
And I feel my finger on your trigger
I know nobody can do me no harm
Because happiness is a warm gun, momma
Happiness is a warm gun
-Yes it is.
Happiness is a warm, yes it is…
Gun!
Well don’t ya know that happiness is a warm gun, momma?
All I got.
Pach man! What a difference a year makes.
Half way thru Olbermann’s book. Page 107, dated November 17, 2005, begins a terrific punishing of Libby-Lip Ted Wells, and his stinky attempts to use Woodward’s disclosure of knowledge as vindication for Scooter. The piece closes,
Ted Wells, Scooter Libby’s attorney, Today’s Honorary Worst Person in the World!”
Can’t wait for Keith!
I saw a comment recently asking what happened to the forwarding icon for individual posts. I also saw a response mentioning the Spotlight feature that forwards posts to the media.
Did anyone see a response regarding the little envelope for forwarding individual posts to any email address? It was a nice feature.
Good morning.
The President and the Law: a letter to the NYTimes editor from Sen. Feingold.
Alaska Update
Ten days to our municipal and borough elections. In the Matanuska-Susitna Borough, the most rapidly growing area in Alaska, forty miles north of Anchorage, the right has consistently been thwarted over the years by the nutjobs who get fundamentalist backing to be elected to posts where their idiocy, mendacity or lack of a plan quickly sets the right’s agenda back to square one. I live in Mat-Su (sometimes called “Mad-Zoo Borough”), and we’re in flux over the many borough assembly and school board contests. The school board could be taken over by a crew who want home school vouchers increased and private school vouchers initiated. Don’t get me started on how old they want my grandkids to believe the world is.
On the state level, the Republican lockhold on both legislative houses won’t be whacked unless the FBI probe into big oil bribes makes headway. But there are some exciting races.
In my old district, state Rep. Vic Kohring, whose election signs read “HARD WORKING – CONSERVATIVE” – is being challenged by an 84-yo woman who is one of the sole living icons of the Alaska Constitutional Convention. Katie Hurley (http://www.alaskademocrats.org/ht/display/ReleaseDetails/i/864274 ), who has served in the legislature before, never gave up her progressive credentials 30 years ago when the state Dem organization put itself hostage to big oil to get union jobs on the Alaska pipeline construction and crude production bonanza. She fought the corporate shills of both parties through the early 1980s, then she went back to private life.
Now Katie is back in public life, challenging a guy whose smarmy image of a folksy elected ombudsman for the far right is being jarred by the fact that he was the first legislator whose office was searched, and documents seized by the FBI in their late August bust. My favorite race, because I’m so close to both Katie and Vic. Katie is walking far more miles than Vic from door to door, which is pretty friggin’ cool. Part of the reason might be that Vic’s wife moved to Portland, Oregon years ago. He spends a lot of time out of district.
GOP gubernatorial candidate Sarah Palin has finally secured a big media ad buy from the slimy mitts of GOP party chair Randy Ruedrich (http://mparent7777.livejournal.com/12244940.html ), whom Palin disgraced a while back in an executive branch ethics fiasco. She’s already ahead of Alaska’s Joe Lieberman – Tony Knowles – by at least 12% in the polls. But, unfortunately for the tens of thousands of libertarian-minded rural Alaskans who will help pull Sarah over the top, she’s probably politically aligned somewhere between Alito and Scalia.
The race here which could have national impact may be tightening up faster than anyone predicted. I’ve been told a poll was taken mid-week which puts Diane Benson 10 points behind US Representative Don Young. Diane can’t afford a pollster. Young’s are keeping quieter than he is.
Don Young is probably the most vulnerable candidate still under the radar of the media. More importantly, he is still under the radar of the left blogosphere and our ability to quickly change the dynamics of a campaign.
Even more important and bothersome is that Young’s charismatic challenger, Diane Benson (http://bensonforcongress.com/ ), has elicited nowhere the interest from places like FDL (ET now huffs and puffs!) as her possibilities merit.
Alaska is the biggest small town in the world. I’m hoping more people realize that leveraging Diane Benson’s campaign might turn out to be a very shrewd investment for Dems with backbone.
katymine –
Are you still up? I know it’s late, but as usual, I’m late to the party.
Just wanted to say that Mr. K8 and I (barring any unforeseen difficulty, like a return of acute pain for me) are planning to be at the PDA meeting Monday night.
We may not make it until closer to 7:30, but I’ll be the woman limping in with the cane — I’ll peer around the room looking for someone with the Firepupster gleam of patriotic battle-readiness in her eye! Then I’ll know it’s YOU.
Hope to see you there!
And, katymine?
If you’re still there, just wanted to mention that we’re also going tomorrow (Sunday) night to see Senate candidate Jim Pedersen at the “Taste of India” Restaurant.
Any chance you’ll be there, too?
Even more important and bothersome is that Young’s charismatic challenger, Diane Benson (http://bensonforcongress.com/ ), has elicited nowhere the interest from places like FDL (ET now huffs and puffs!) as her possibilities merit.—Something to mull over, eh? I’ll bet that as things have begun to shake out and we’ve seen successes like Ned Lamont’s, a lot of challengers look better now than they did when time was first getting pledged.
I wrote a diary on the Feingold letter over at DKos, just because I think it’s too important to get lost in the Sunday brew. Hope I don’t fly off the page too soon!;)
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/9/24/63138/2815
Good morning FDL. I’ve got the coffee brewing, and will, hopefully, be home to watch the talking head shows (Looking forward to Bill!)
Here’s the line up from the Washington Post
Oh my, Bob Newhart is also going to be on! Must tape that. (DVR thingie, not tape)
prostratedragon @ 203
thank you for that. a good and hopeful read for first thing in the morning (well second thing, coffee was first thing).
prostratedragon @
207
pd,
thanks for reading my rant and for the link. I voted. preaching to the choir territory X 10 when I was there…
Ooops, it’s rude of me not to say hi to everyone else!
I’m about to tumble into bed, but had to read at least this one thread tonight before turning in.
I’m happy to report that this time the reason I haven’t been around for a few days ISN’T because of pain/medical problems or other unhappy situations.
We’ve finally been able to get out and go to meetings. And Thursday night at a local district Dem meeting I was finally able to hook up with someone who could plug me into the “phone banking from home” scenario for local candidates.
In specific, I start working for Herb Paine, who’s challenging that weasel in the House, John Shadegg, but a nice and good guy, Jim Larson, Democratic candidate for AZ state senate from our legislative district was there at the meeting, and he asked me to do some work for him, too.
And then there’s our candidate for Sec’y of State, Israel Torres, who’s a stand-up guy and is urgently needed to toss out the GOP shill currently occupying the office, who seems to engage in passive-agressive tactics in regard to non-GOP voters, IMO. I want to connect with the Torres campaign as well. All three of these candidates are true progressives.
It’s so great that there is work I can do from home — disability be damned!!! Not only is it extremely gratifying to connect with others and fight, fight, fight — I find it’s a way to keep fear and depression over the state of things at bay, to just throw myself into it, doing the little bit I’m able to, but doing that little bit as well as I can.
Pach’s topic tonight was thus fortuitous and satisfying — so a hearty thanks to Pach and all you wonderful Firepups. I regard this community as my moral and emotional “political homebase.” You’ve all kept me sane for so long now — and I credit y’all with giving me the continued inspiration to dig deep into the energy well and spread the word into my own community.
Bless you all! And a great and fruitful Sunday!
Mrs. K8 @ 211,
Amen, sleep comfortably – and the firepups are guarding your door ’til…
Mrs. K8,
thankyou for the good news. i’ve also found that action is the best tonic for despair. take care and good night (good morning for me!)
Pach — yours is an important message, and I want to amplify it. I wrote a post over at Kos that argues that we have plenty of powerful ammunition to use against the Republicans, and that we should not be hesitant in using it directly, as bloggers. This is exactly the wrong time to allow our frustration to cause us to let down. The key, however, is to recognize that the Dems are unlikely to save themselves, and that the leadership is even less likely to show the way.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyo…..195858/232
But a related point is that there is much the blogs can do if we stop beating our heads against the wall the leadership has erected to protect them from party’s strongest advocates. While I support your efforts and things like the bloggers meeting with Clinton, etc, it is simply too late to expect a major turn around in Dem strategies and leadership; if they’ve basicaly tuned us out for whatever reasons they have, we should also function mostly independently; accept the reality and get on with what we do best.
With the tools on this and other blogs, and particular the ability to spotlight articles and call for mass contacts of officials, we have the means to affect framing of issues and thus the election outcome even if the Dem leaders put their heads even further in the sand. And more important, we are willing to make arguments that the nominal party leaders are not capable of making.
Our efforts should be directed right at the electorate, and only indirectly at the leadership. We can work with individual candidates who get it, but efforts to affect the leadership are not likely to succeed, until we succeed. Their constraint has always been lowest common denominator factor, as well as their own DINO instincts. We should never have thought otherwise.
I keep reminding myself that there is a reason people like Schumer and Rahm are the “leaders” of a losing party, but to see it, one has to turn the equation around. The reason the party keeps loosing is because too many in the party falsely think these guys are leaders. We’ll have to fix that, but after the elections, not before.
beard5 @ 208
Well, that’s a dismal lineup. I would be surprised if there is a single Dem willing to make a strong pitch against the Toture enabling bill. It’s inexcusable that Face the Nation has only McCain. Stan Greenwald will tells us the CW among so-called Dem strategist.
Well, a very foggy good morning to y’all. Foghorns punctuating the stillness, few bird calls today. Peace & blessings to one and all.
Oh hi Scarecrow–you were on fire with your comments posted yesterday. Do you mind if I crib from you for an LTE?
Charlie Rangel on Chavez at the UN:
“You do not come into my country, my congressional district, and you do not condemn my president. If there is any criticism of President Bush, it should be restricted to Americans, whether they voted for him or not. I just want to make it abundantly clear to Hugo Chvez or any other president, do not come to the United States and think because we have problems with our president that any foreigner can come to our country and not think that Americans do not feel offended when you offend our Chief of State.”
Charlie, I don’t care whether I offend such a “chief of state” as W. Hugo Chavez is as manly as you or I, I think. Are you suggesting he can’t be honest and manly when he humorously presents his continent’s concerns? Is Hugo supposed to STFU when he delivers his nation’s annual position statement at the UN?
WTF is your issue with this passionate liberal, Charlie?
Go hug Joe, Charlie, before John McCain leaves you sloppy seconds.
Good morning to the morning crew! Instead of foghorns I have the sound of some cars and trucks and one paryicularly angry barking squirrel.
scarecrow,
i’m with you, especially wrt to thinking and acting independently – but you loose me at the very last line:
this is the message i’ve gotten in 2000, in 2002, in 2004 …. and i now think it is a mistake. each time our efforts are deflected and our momentum gets squashed.
can’t we do both?
Old Sow @ 216
Good morning, OS. Nice to see you. Crib away. If you’re referring to the late post on one of Christy’s threads, my Kos post (link above) is a cleaned up, expanded version.
selise @ 219
I share your frustration, but since I am not in favor of kidnapping and rendition, I see no practical way to change the Democratic leadership before the elections. We have to work around what’s there. As Rumsfeld says, “you go to elections with the “leaders” you have, not the ones . . . “
It won’t be morning here for awhile. One big wind and the leaves will go “poof!” Very warm, though, after a chilly summer.
Saturday I saw dozens of cranes and swans, hundreds of ducks and maybe a thousand geese. They are headed your way, doggies.
This partucularly sad reality is what has me so distressed. If the current Dem leadership won’t fight about torture, why should anyone vote for any Dem in November?
Like I said many posts ago, I do not think that our Dems are against torture but made a strategic decision not to fight –
I think they support torture because deep down they want to believe they are in a fight more important than WWII or the cold war.
Ed*ward Teller — I think the Rangel issue was worked over a few threads back (Friday?), and the opinion seemed split between those who think Chavez is more or less right and we should say so and those who think Chavez is MOL right but it’s foolish for Dems to let the Republicans hang the highly unpopular Chavey around the Dems neck. Rangel is no wall flower and has been incredibly outspoken against Bush. So for those with the second view, he was the right person to speak out and so that we don’t argue about who supports Chavez (which is the equialent of arguing about which party supports terrorism, in today’s stilted political conversation.
For what it’s worth, I’m glad Rangel spoke out, but he didn’t check with me.
immantentize @ # 223:
Like I said many posts ago, I do not think that our Dems are against torture but made a strategic decision not to fight –
I think they support torture because deep down they want to believe they are in a fight more important than WWII or the cold war.
confusing. First paragraph references dems specifically, but to whom does the 2nd paragraph refer?
Thanks Scarecrow. I’ll read at kos before I get too busy. We have a weekly paper here and I am starting to get the ear of one of the editors, so I’d be wel advised to keep that channel open.
ET, when we moved to our location in Maine one thing I did not anticipate would be that we would no longer be in the flight path of the geese! Now that’s a sound I seriously miss. (Eyes filled with tears) It’s like an audial magnet that pulls me from whatever I’m doing to watch the wing pass across the skies. (I’ll listen closely and see if I can hear it throgh your words.)
And as to the Rangel’s Chavez comments, all I can say is sheesh. If world leaders aren’t free to speak the truth on UN sovereign soil, or even in the streets of New York, why do we even bother with the (ruse of) diplomacy that we ostensibly support. Truth is truth. Perhaps there are varied ways of expressing it, but hello………politics mystifies me.
scarecrow @ 224
What is it you are glad Rangel spoke out for or against, scarecrow?
MCTE – more confused than ever……..
immanentize @ 223
I don’t think the American people support the use of torture; they might excuse it under extreme conditions, but when asked flat out, “Do you think the US government should engage in torture?” I think the American people would overwhelmingly reject it. They showed that in the Abu Ghraib saga, and when that was the issue, Bush’s popularity plunged.
The key Dems made a mistake not framing this, because of their fear of how Rove would frame it. So the Dems seem stuck with their mistake.
But we aren’t. All the more reason for the progressive blogs to reframe this as Bush dishonoring American values, traditions and prestige. IMO, we need to do what blogs can do, even when our party makes what we see as a mistake.
O.M.G. i haven’t laughed so hard in i don’t remember when. scarecrow, thank you for that… you have no idea how much good a long belly laugh did for me. i’ve been feeling pretty bleak these last few days.
i wasn’t thinking about the chances of winning. i was thinking about what we lose by not fighting our “leadership” when it matter to us.
each time we fight (win, lose or draw) we learn something – something that we can bring to the next fight.
each time we don’t fight, especially over something that really matters to us (like torture, judicial oversight of prisons and wiretaping) a little something dies in us. and without that little something, we can fall into despair (or worse, apathy)…. and then mobilizing for the next fight gets harder, not easier.
Just woke up and this post brought tears to my eyes. Haven’t read the thread yet but I wanted to add, if no one had yet, the lyrics to a very short song from Bernstein’s Mass
I can’t tell you how often I have gone to this well and drunk deeply. We all need to now.
morning RevDeb!
ET — I didn’t draft Charlie’s statement, so I don’t want to endorse every word. But I’m glad he spoke up, because I believe by doing so, he made it very hard for Republicans to claim that Democrat are aligned with a leader who is very unpopular with many Americans and who was just seen with other world leaders who are unpopular. The Rangel view is, I assume, “we don’t want to defend ourselves based on perceptions of these other guys.” That’s the part I agree with.
Que, scarecrow? That’s total BS.
I asked you what it was Chavez might have said which might have merited a severe response like that from Rangell. I don’t feel your # 232 comes close to an answer. I’ll read it again, but..
ET and scarerow — I mean that I believe most Democrats simply agree that the President should have the torture option during the time of war.
This is not just a bad strategy, it is a bad set of beliefs. I think the DEmocratic leadership has come to believe that such techniques are necessary — they may not support torture generally — but they have completely accepted the War on Terror subtext
It is the only explanation for their behavior because in my view, torture is not something about which one may compromise — it is not something which can be allowed as an aspect of political “strategy.” Only people who don’t really mind it that much could make these calculations.
Good morning, Old Sow, beard5 and all. I’ve been in such a state of grief — yes, that’s exactly what it feels like — these past few days that I couldn’t manage to write one syllable here.
But I take heart in the comments of pach, scarecrow and so many others — as well as in Sen. Feingold’s letter to the editor in today’s NYT. At least one Democratic leader is taking a stand on SOMETHING that matters deeply.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/09…..ref=slogin
I’m working two jobs these days and don’t have time to phone bank or walk the block so I’m starting my day with another contribution to ActBlue. I’ve suppported Lamont, of course, Wetterly, Patrick Murphy, John Tester and a few others. If there’s someone in your state you believe in, let me know and I’ll send a few dollars their way.
My fellow turds and countrymen, talk to our neighbors, half of them are the fucks who keep the fucks in office in office, the other half are only half better. The world claims that Americans are assholes and they’re right. This country enslaved or annihilated any non Euros they laid eyes on, stole and paved over land east to west and then some, carried on like pious righteous pricks for a few hundred backward years and with every slow small humanitarian step we shower propagandized praise and glory; but those pricks begot more pricks and here we have it the land of pricks. What kind of people put people like this torture administration in office in office and let them stay there and stay there as chances to remove them pass by and by. It’s hard to see Democrats as so different than their foe when they refuse to see how bad things already are, and difficult to believe that Americans aren’t really the worlds assholes when were floating deaf and blind patriotic turds in the toilet, just take a whiff.
If one must go, go Citgo.
Morning Rev, I hadn’t even read the post, always come here to say hi first, so thanks for directing me upstairs. May I say P*A*C*H.
So many of the comments yesterday expressed the deep despair that threatens to throttle down our energies. Nothing like a little boost. I have not been a DEM for many years, registering as either I or G. We’ve been lucky to have Greens willing to do the hard work of organizing and campaigning in state wide races, and I’ve been privileged to vote for them as a means of party building and enabling them a place on the voting menu the next time around and enabling them to get financial assistance in their campaigns. We’ve only managed to get one (I could be wrong) state rep elected thus far, but even that’s hopeful.
I can’t see what lies ahead, and don’t want to let the fog of anger and despair nail me to the floor. So it will be back again to the phone banks, and back to standing on Maine’s Bridges for Peace (ours is 12-1 Sundays) and to all the public gatherings. I don’t have much $$ right now (really slow year for us), but volunteer energies are worth a lot too. I’m jujst not ready to be tarred with the brush of this Zeitgeist.
Feingold’s letter really isn’t all that good. OK, he doesn’t agree with Yoo. That is all we get from that. He prefers Congressional power to executive power –
So?
I know it is a letter to the editor and we can’t expect much from such forms, but I expect more from Feingold. By the way, what does he think of torture?
Why the Feingold crickets?
immanentize @ 234
You’re absolutely right.
Torture. Ah, free torture, with a big blessing for the companies who will learn to both specialize in this and control our political discourse in the near future. I’m panting in excitement over the possibilities.
My broker will be awake in 30 minutes. If she can’t find the right places for me to invest, I might hire somebody to waterboard her. Anyone want to watch?
Human torture is undeniably wrong and is unproductive often enough to give it a “Michael Brown” award for elegance.
scarecrow @ 228
I made this point on one of the posts here a week or so ago. Here’s the MO: Dems ALWAYS allow Rove and the Repubs to frame the debate, thinking they can win on the reasonableness and rightness of their argument.
But they can’t it never works. And they’re so think they still don’t get it. I said in my post, on each and every topic Dems have to seize the issue and frame it the way they want to and make the Repubs debate it on their terms.
Imagine if Feingold or Murtha or Kennedy has taken a strong stand against torture as being the antithesis to who we are as Americans. (Are we barbarians or Americans?) Put the Bush crowd on the defense and let them make an argument for torture.
It’s media training 101. No matter what question the interviewer throws at you, you use it to bridge to your message.
selise @
209
Now that was a shot across the bow. I wonder if Captain Queeg heard it whistle past his ear? And now we’ll see if (any) Democrats back up Russ Feingold To.mor.row.
It may be just talk, but I’m definitely gonna keep an eye on the news.
immanentize — you may be right about buying into the “terror subtext.” There is an alternative explanation, though. The Dems assumed that with three respected military-related Senators plus Powell and other generals opposing Bush/Cheney, the Dems could rely on them to fight the fight and avoid the Rove strategy. They didn’t count on the right-wing blowback against the Senators, which put tremendous pressure on the Senators and forced them to retreat. So it became a problem of how to frame their retreat as a “compromise.”
At this point, the Dems should have realized that McCain was rolled by the WH and the rightwing, and said so (discrediting McCain in the eyes of all sides), and then attacked the “compromise” as a sell out of American values and honor, but they didn’t and missed the opportunity. We don’t have to accept this outcome. We can still frame the compromise in those terms.
And selise — we’re very close. I’m not arguing that we should do whatever the leadership says — when have I ever advocated that! — but only that we shouldn’t have a strategy that is premised on changing the leadership or its strategies before the election. If you want to throw tomatoes at Chuck and Rahm the next time we see them, I’ll at least hold the bag. (The arm ain’t what it used to be, after throwing about 10,000 pitches as a little league coach.)
Morning all — working on the talking head thread. It’s raining and gray here, which suits my mood this morning. (FWIW, my wingnut father-in-law, who is a veteran of WWII and Korea, is also disgusted by the torture bill. The in-laws will be here for close to two weeks, so I have a feeling you guys will be getting lots of stories.)
Ed*ard Teller @
233
Que, scarecrow? Y porque, tambien?
immanentize @ 238
I agree that it leaves a lot to be desired and it’s not the letter I would write. But it’s the only pushback to Yoo’s position that I’ve seen from a Dem in national office, so I guess part of me’s thinking, at last, something from someone. But again you’re right. There’s no passion behind the words.
Scarecrow at 242 — I know that version well as it is the only one that keeps me from utter dispair — perhaps, that is how it went down, I think — but then, as you say, it all depends on this
Which is an utterly idiotic thing for them to think. They had YEARS of examples to see exactly how this would go. Digby got it, right? So, our different characterizations comes down to: are the Democratic leaders Morally corrupt or so stupid they never learn anything from experience? Nice choice for our leaders.
I will stick with morally corrupt because it is easier to predict the behavior of such people than that of the completely stupid.
(Of course, Scare — my hopeful heart agrees with you in large part and my best head thinks it was a combination of the two but you gave me such a fine opportunity to rant a bit — thanks).
Ed*ard Teller @
217
Ed*ard:
did you read the Time Magazine interview with Chavez? Somebody back up the way linked it. Great interview. Chavez chews Bush up and spits him out. Politely……
Christy, moderators — good morning.
For the last few weeks, I get a large grey box obscuring the thread around comments 236-237. When I asked about this before, others said they got the same thing.
Is this something Jaime can fix? Thanks.
Pach, my friend: maybe you can keep going, but right now, I’m feeling pretty well kicked in the stomach about this. I think I’m going to turn off the computer and take a few weeks away from politics.
If the election were this Tuesday, I wouldn’t bother going to the polls. And that’s something I don’t say lightly, because I haven’t missed voting in an election in decades.
It’s taken a couple days for this to really sink in, but the clincher was the way Harry Reid and other Dems have pretended that McCain, Graham, and Warner actually forced Bush to abandon the worst of his torture program. I’m sick to my stomach over that.
Martin O’Malley and Ben Cardin can win or lose without me; I honestly don’t care right now. Maybe I will again in a few days or weeks. Or maybe not.
musicality
I agree with that feeling:
but we really should be able to expect — and receive — more.
Morning Christy. I expect that you’ll be planting a few seeds too during that lengthy visit with your in-laws!! You go girl!!
immanentize
Always happy to help. Ranting is sometimes good. I’m off to breakfast. A little cafe down the street that makes awesome pancakes, with real maple syrup. That and the Sunday NYT. I always finish with Rich, and then I will be ranting.
fahrender @
247
Being chewed up and spit out here until the Sunday morning thread begins or my last question to scarecrow is freed from fdlgtitmo because I challenged sc on Rangell’s Imperialist defense of the worst president in our history.
immanentize @ 238
He made one point. It’s good. It’s what his colleagues either don’t get or aren’t williing to stand up about. If nothing happens this next week to bolster that message then maybe you have something to be underwhelmed about. Meanwhile, please give him a break.
Do you notice any other Congresscritters making Feingold’s point? Do you remember what happened when he tried to get them to censure Fuckwad?
scarecrow @ 242
thanks for the clarification…
if i understand michael nagler correctly, according to gandhi – the guna of rajas (illadvised action, anger) is preferred to that of tamas (inaction/cowardness).
this part of the lecture really resonated with me (9/19 lecture starting at about 14:55)
scarecrow at 247 — hmmm, no idea. But I’ll mention it. I’m not seeing it — which browser and computer are you using? Jamie will want to know…
RT @ 248
I hope you can get over it. Otherwise, chalk another one up for Roveco.
Regardless of what Feingold might say next week, it is too late. There was no reason not to be out there every day (even if the strategy was to let the Republicans lead) clarifying the issue and bolstering the Republican LEADERS’ hand by decrying torture. Big speeches next week just prior to passage will probably be full of sound and fury (y’know the rest).
Republican leaders of us — sheesh! They are leaders, Dems are not. Nice optics.
RT @ 248
is there something you can care about now? a local anti-war group, church, social justice action?
we don’t have to choose between electoral action or no action. there is a lot of work to do… and whatever you can do is all for the good.
peace on your heart.
Damnitall, we bought this f*cking party, we OWN it.
Just as Eli Pariser said back in November of 2004 – we grassroots activists busted our *sses and did yeomans’ work that the party failed to do. Since 2004, we have worked our way through the ranks and in many cases, actually took over the entrenched old school party.
But the work is NOT done; we are only now at the point where we implement generational shifts at the level of elected officials. Jon Tester in MT, Ned Lamont in CT, pick another grassroots candidate…it is with the insertion of these people into more seats that we begin to undo the existing power structure.
And THEY know it — both the entrenched elected officials of the old school party, and the opposition that counts on them. They are scared sh*tless.
Here’s a pointed example: Bill Clinton didn’t get his anger on until AFTER the grassroots rose up and created a furor over the 9/11 farce on ABC/Disney, AFTER meeting with progressive bloggers. He could have come out the day after the program and blasted them, but he didn’t. That’s because he got the kick in the ass, even if provided by proxy through Daou.
So Big Dog appears on Faux, reams that cheesy dork Wallace a couple of new bodily orifices, and lo, we are pleased. But the opposition is terrified — enough so that they unleash the OBL uncertainty principle within 12 hours of the Clinton interview.
Did you notice that at all? Did you see that they HAD to change the subject? Clinton was chewing up too much airtime, sucking the air out of their narrative — because somewhere along the line the Big Dog read the blogs and heard from the netroots that he must, WE must ATTACK, ATTACK, AAATTTTAAAAACKKKK!!!!
WE took over the narrative. We created the reality. We f*cked with them.
And I for one am not about to give up, not even in the case of torture. If anything, this is where we need to put on our very best game.
This is yet another St. John’s Dark Night of the Soul; we need to regroup, think deeply but quickly, and get back to the game. Because if we cannot master this test, we will not be able to handle the machinations necessary to purge the government of negative forces under a new progressive majority, will not be able to handle the the gamesmanship required to operate as an effective majority.
It’s OUR party, bought and paid for. We need to act like it and start kicking *ss and taking names. Right NOW.
Tomorrow morning I’d like to see calls to every Democratic Senator and Representative, telling them we need more and better tactical manuevering — like the insertion of a poison pill in a bill that negates the damage of this past week on the issue of torture.
Are you up to it? I know I am.
Ed*ard Teller — I understand your anger at Rangel and the other Dems who appeared to come to Bush’s defense against Chavez.
But here’s the problem: while Chavez is very much the kind of countervailing force we need to pull in the opposite direction against fascism, he could also be highly disruptive if he believes he has no limits. What could he do to a progressive majority or a progressive president here in the US if Chavez did not get his way? We don’t know yet, but we must tell him now that he does not have carte blanche.
And it’s simply bad form to be as openly contemptuous on the soil of his target. Period. Rangel was not defending Bush as much as he was protecting the office of the presidency of the US, and not just against verbal attack now, but against other assaults in the future when Bush no longer tarnishes the White House. I would expect similar reaction from any other legislators around the world if someone came and insulted their presidency on their own soil, regardless of how much the actual president is despised by their countrymen.
Ed*ard Teller @
210
Thanks, ET. ‘Tis tough to fight despair, isn’t it? See y’all—need a bit of rest.
prostratedragon @
203
Thanks! I recommend that everyone read that short but to-the-point letter by Feingold. For anyone who wants to read a fuller version of where this is all going, I recommend: http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/1984/
Ed*ard Teller @
217
And, as leader of the Fourth Reich, Bush is Chavez’s leader too, but he criticizes the Reich’s leader at his own foolish peril. God bless America.
Charlie Rangel thinks this is his country.
As history (both recent and ancient) has shown he’s very much mistaken.
This country is for genocidal white protestants. Everyone else is the “Third World.”
Little Miss Sunshine is an enormous hit. Per-screen-average throught the roof. As an indie it’s this year’s Sideways. But it’s far more political. In extremely subtle ways it takes on the whole neo-fascist meme of “Family Vaules” and examines them in an actual setting. This means, of course, that the film does not attack the family it depicts for being “dysfunctional.” It functions quite well in point of fact, as it’s diminuitive heroine proves.
Shorter Jennifer Senior:
Okay, so they’re right. But do they have to be so darn SHRILL?
Christy Hardin Smith @
256
Christy — I use a Mac, and Firefox. Thanks for responding.
But at work I use a pc and Bill Gates, who provides less service. e.g., I don’t get “edit this comment,” so it’s a good think I never make tipos.
just my opinion, but; any time someone refers to someone reviewing a film they ruin it and society. reviewers are the lowest form of humanity. they are patronizing little minds that don’t have anything better to do than to try to understand and comment on someone else’s work. this is the same thing a preacher does, pretend to understand something they are not capable of, for it was created by someone else’s mind.
Please, reviewers are something we should attempt to eliminate in this world, because their opinions are their own, and should never be posted, that is mentally criminal.
reviewers are people that do not have a life of their own, and live vicariously thru the work of others. they have no reason to be
Rayne #261
Seems to me that its rather “bad form” to try an assassinate someone – reportedly twice.