
Guest Blogged By Tula Connell
Carl Garrett, a paper mill technician in Canton, N.C., needed gall bladder and shoulder surgery. So his employer, Blue Ridge Paper Products, came up with an increasingly less- than-novel solution: Send him overseas for surgery.
India, in this case.
Garrett volunteered to go. But let’s face it, how much of an option did he have? Let’s see: Agree with your employer and take your chances overseas, or risk paying out-of-pocket costs for the entire surgery in the United States? Duh.
But Garrett has a union, and the union didn’t stand for what the media and others have euphemistically dubbed “medical tourism.” The USW International Union (USW) persisted until management backed off the plan. The USW and Blue Ridge will work together to find an alternative within the United States.
Paul Krugman has done great work demonstrating that the U.S. health care system is so broken, our nation spends far more than other western industrialized countries on health care while far fewer of its citizens have the health care they need. Sen. Bill Frist got egg on his face last week for inadvertently acknowledging the disastrous state of the U.S. health care when he said it’s worse than the care prisoners get at Guantanamo: GITMO prisoners get "24/7 medical care—better than many Americans."
Exporting our jobs. Exporting our bodies for health care. All of us face these attacks on our health care, jobs, retirement and more, yet too few of us are represented by unions. But unions make a difference not only on the job, but in shaping the direction of the nation. Which is why the Bush administration has made destroying unions a priority.
And an impending decision by the National Labor Relations Board (NLRB) could alter the definition of supervisor and potentially take away the right to join unions from up to 8 million nurses, building trades workers, newspaper and television employees and others. Jordan Barab has discussed the issue in detail here.
We can’t elect NLRB members. But we can elect, and un-elect, the politicians who make those appointments. And the union movement is making a massive effort to fight Bush’s onslaught because like all progressives, we’ve had enough.
Here’s some of what the union movement is doing now.
Working America, the 1.5 million-member AFL-CIO community affiliate, is mobilizing its rapidly growing membership to make a difference in the 2006 elections. Working America was created in fall 2003 to marshal the power of workers who don’t have a union on the job. Since June 2006, Working America’s more than 250 locally-recruited canvassers have reached out to nearly 200,000 working people each month around economic issues. Two of three people contacted in the door-to-door canvassing join Working America.
The majority of Working America members (70 percent) identify themselves as moderates or conservatives, one-third are “born again” Christians and one-third are National Rifle Association supporters. While many may have responded to divisive wedge social issues in the past, they are very concerned about the economics of their jobs and lives—health care and jobs top their list of concerns. In 2004, Working America members voted 68 percent for John Kerry for president, compared to 30 percent who voted for President George W. Bush. In fact:
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Last year, 70,000 Working America members mailed handwritten letters to elected officials. Online, Working America members have sent more than 500,000 e-mails and fax messages to elected officials on issues such as Social Security, minimum wage and the Central American Free Trade Agreement (CAFTA)
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In Ohio’s CD 6 primary in May, a last-minute push by Working America’s 78 canvassers helped propel a write-in victory for Democratic State Sen. Charlie Wilson—and Wilson’s write-in votes surpassed Rep. Ted Strickland’s (D) votes for the same seat in 2002.
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In Pennsylvania’s SD 19 this spring, Working America recruited 7,500 new members in two weeks—tripling the labor program’s reach and electing a Democrat in that district for the first time in 100 years.
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More than 400,000 Working America members live in CDs with the 20 of the highest priority House races.
Getting swing and conservative voters to cast ballots benefiting their pocketbooks is just one part of the union movement’s mobilization this fall. The AFL-CIO union movement ramped up its get-out-the-vote efforts among union members—and even before Labor Day:
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Placed more than 1.3 million calls to union members and their households.
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Sent more than 1.1 million pieces of mail to our members and members’ households.
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Printed more than 2.6 million Labor 2006 customized issues fliers for walks and worksite leafleting.
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Developed 264 different resource materials for activists’ use through the online “Working Families Toolkit.”
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Recruited more than 20,000 new activists through mail, phone, online and legislative actions.
We all know women are among the key voters in this election, as they have been in the past several elections. And we’re trying to make sure they vote for their pocketbook issues as well. After all, more women than men live below the poverty line, according to the U.S. Census Bureau and the Bureau of Labor Statistics and in a recent AFL-CIO Ask a Working Woman survey, an incredible 97 percent of the more than 26,000 respondents said affordable health care tops their concerns, a figure that crosses age and race lines.
So we’ve set Oct. 10 as the day when women across the nation can begin to take back the 2006 election campaign dialogue for working women and their families. That day, working women across the nation will gather for hundreds of “Stirring the Pot” events—dinners and other small gatherings—where they will talk about how to get more women to make a difference and vote, as well as write letters and postcards to other women to remind them to make their voices heard by voting. Union members who sign up to host these events receive a guide to help get the discussion going and keep it on track around the issues most important to the lives of working women.
Issues like Social Security, which the Bush crowd is gunning for as soon as the elections are over.
We’ve had enough. And we’re doing something about it.
Tula Connell blogs at AFL-CIO Now
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KO!
Arr! I be second! And me healthcare plan is awful!
EPU’D
TO SEND THIS THREAD TO MEDIA TARGETS:
scarecrow: Click on Spotlight. Under the column marked Targets, click on each one you want and click on add. When you have 10 in the right hand column, hit next. On the next page, add your commnets, fill in the form, and hit preview. Type in the special code and send it.
—–
You can do 10 at a time only. You can pick addressees in print papers, tv or radio. You can select to send it nationally, regionally (type in a specific State), or pick a search word. Once you put in these options, hit update and then start adding the targets!
Welcome, Tulah, thanks so much for letting us know about “medical tourism.” Anyone who doubts the value of labor unions in this modern era need look no further than this story of “exporting bodies” to know we really need to work harder to support them.
I hope “stirring the pot” day goes really well. It’s a great idea.
Christie – Check out this link for another attribution to Talk Like a Pirate Day. This was the letter to the Kansas Board of Education re Intelligent Design; that is, the worship of the Spaghetti Monster whose advocates are known as Pastafarians.
http://www.venganza.org/
I also think this story is well worth “spotlighting” to your favorite journalists, per ccmask’s comments in #3.
How in the hell can medical care plus a long-ass plane flight be more economical that a good old-fashioned US operation?
Ya think they might be counting on some jingoistic xenophobia decreasing the numbers of patients agreeing with the operable prognosis?
Re an earlier thread and vote-by-mail: In OR it is signature-verified. I’ve been called in once to do so as has my wife, can’t remember which election. What I haven’t found in a quick search was what type of machinery was tabulating the vote…?
On topic: Carol Voisin’s campaign is devoted to getting quality, reasonable health care for the 600,000 Oregonians who don’t have ANY!
On Torture, this bore repeating: In an elegant essay in this week’s Boston Globe, columnist James Carroll put it this way:
“Justice is measured in every society by how the worst malefactors are treated — the worst not only in culpability, but in capacity for general harm. The best way to combat terrorism is to wrap accused terrorists in the cloth of the law they would rip asunder. More important, to legalize the abuse of a class of prisoners is to prepare for the abuse of all.”
“Medical tourism?” What’s next? Will we refer to unemployed people walking the streets as “inadvertant tourists?” Or “employment tourists?”
When you get laid off, will your boss tell you your job has been “touristed”? “Sorry Bob, but we’ve touristed the whole plant to sunny Bangalore. But on the plus side, you’ll get some self-paid family time.”
fitz…hurry.
Also check out this link for more info, including the important ruler, Gluteus Maximus, who had everyone in his kingdom convert to Flying Spaghetti Monsterism.
Sorry for the OT levity.
It’s the lobbyists, not any particular party.
Stir the pot! I like that.
I don’t have a problem with flying to India for surgery when a delay doesn’t compromise health and saves money. A friend of mine once tried to research oral surgury of some sort but gave up due to insufficient info on the web sites she found but it would have been cheaper including airfare than staying in the US and paying through the nose. I think she still needs the surgery.
I can totally believe that going abroad for medical care could be less costly. I had friends who lived in Alaska for many years and they did all their dental work in Thailand. However, it’s never quite what it’s written up as, and there are many reasons why it would be better for the US to clean up our own medical sector.
Sirk @ 13
Elections cost big money, which is provided by lobbyists.
Public financing of elections has to be cheaper to the taxpayer than the corruption we have now.
Earmarks ain’t free, and the costs to the taxpayer of getting lobbyists to contribute has got to be a significant multiple of the contribution.
Old Sow @
15
Having had cancer surgerly 4X now I can say that having the support of your friends and family, your dogs and your familiar surroundings are as important as anything else in your treatment.
The thought of flying to another country to have it done is absolutely barbaric.
Blood clots after surgery are sometimes a problem.
Sitting on a plane for hours, days after a surgery just seems like trouble.
OT and WTF – What’s In A Name?
-via huffpo
i’m willing to believe that medical tourism has some inherent flaw that makes it fundamentally objectionable, but i’ve not heard anything like that. in fact most of what i’ve heard about medical tourism is positive. there are definitely reasons why it’s not always the best option, probably most often whether or not the patient is comfortable with it.
i do agree, however, that some one with insurance shouldn’t be forced to go to another country for care.
How the fuck are the pharma companies gonna keep all the caterers in business if we reform healthcare? Think of all those uneaten ham and cheese croussaints! The Horror!
It’s interesting that by and large, traditionally, MD’s have voted Republican. Radiology is being more and more outsourced. Republicans (corporations) are very pro-sending jobs over seas. More bang for their buck. And who cares what happens to American workers? Be they programmers or doctors. Or for that matter, clerk-typists. NAFTA, CAFTA, Republicans and the DLC are the scourge of the American worker.
Jane Hamsher @ 17
Jane, sorry to hear that. Is that something that has been known at the lake? First that I’d heard.
Tula,
Welcome to Firedoglake !
thanks so much for such an informative post -
am all over the Stirring the Pot idea – right up a country gal’s alley –
one of the most active folks in our small town – is a stone winger -have been trying for some time to lasso that energy (and that contacts list*g*)- about the only thing we agree on is the importance of voting – after reading through the materials I sent her the links, gave her a call and made the pitch
“Hell Yeah !”
see y’all on the 10th
fyi- 60 Minutes did a segment on ‘Medical Tourism’ – spotlighting India & Thailand – the premise being the cost effectiveness – wonder if info is still in their archives
Kathryn@5- Thanks for the link. I played the spaghetti monster game…that was fun. And the letter was great.
I am stepping out officially as a health care professional and consumer…
The insurance industry sorta, kinda wants to do a good job for their clients– if they’re healthy folks. Some states are smart enough to hire good people to intervene when the citizens have their backs against the wall and they insist(’cause they and the good state professionals hired bother to read and understand the law). Too many people have no coverage and are afraid to divulge their illnesses.
It’s time for America and her citizens to lead and not lag behind.
Oklahoma kiddo @ 21
ReneND 24 — I’m fine, the first time was in 1993 and the last time was 6 years ago. I pay a fortune for medical insurance but watch it closely and am doing well with it.
Thanks for your concern, though.
Ok Kiddo – Thought of you earlier today. This guy (from Fort Smith) just started a blog within a blog. His past comments have been interesting and he certainly is flying solo as a thinking voice from fs. Commenters talked him into doing this so he might be worth watching for semi local input.
http://www.arktimes.com/blogs/billikenman/
Kathryn in MA–never apologize for levity!
I don’t know if anyone here travels a lot but there is a deal on Southwest.com. It’s called the “DING” program. You go to the site and sign up for Ding. You type in the airport you travel in and out of and download a small program. Once you do this, you are ready to receive airline deals. Today, while I was online, I heard DING! So, I clicked on the Ding logo on my toolbar and opened up the deals they were offering today. They are one way deals for as low as $39.99. My brother ses it all the time and he said that you can book it and change the date later without a fee. You’ll have to check on that though. So far, I haven’t had a chance to use it but it dings 2 or 3 times a week. Someday I’ll get lucky. Yesterday was San Francisco for $89.
Just thought I’d post this in case anyone wants to get an operation on the fly.
Jane-no wonder you are such a strong soul. Going to hell and back will do that to a person. Guess I shouldn’t be surprised at all-All I gotta do is look at what you write, what you do and who shows up around you.
Besides, there’s the dogs.
Ok-enough of this.
But thanks to everyone here.
Echoing this guy @ 20, I know many people who have traveled to India for medical and dental work. And why not? Even with the cost of airfare and even with passable health insurance, many surgeries can still be performed for less money in India by doctor’s trained with the same medical skills, using the same drugs, and operating with the same equipment as in the US.
The problem isn’t that some people might do this or even that some employers might try to force it. The problem is that health care is so expensive in the US that it is being outsourced overseas. The problem is that the government has shown so little interest in the health of Americans that an fourteen hour plane flight sounds like a good idea if you need to get a transplant. The problem is that there has been no regulation to keep the HMOs from rigging the system to the point that we cannot afford American doctors.
I say, go to India. Save your money and send a message that you don’t want to underwrite an industry (the insurance industry that is) that’s bilking the American public.
Just bring malaria pills with you.
When I heard this story on NPR last week it began by extolling the luxuries of the 2 hospitals in India certified for foreign patients and ended with lamenting the plight of this poor man who would now have to pay out of pocket for his operation since the union had quashed this all expense paid medical junket.While I applaud NPR for covering the story, the tone was questionable. What was never explored was the poor quality of the insurance policy and how typical this is for the average union worker.
Jane Hamsher @ 27
whew! And double whew! Good news there. I always feel like I’m playing “kechup” ’round here.
ccmask @
25
Where’s the game? I didn’t see it. Aarrh.
fyi- 60 Minutes did a segment on ‘Medical Tourism’ – spotlighting India & Thailand – the premise being the cost effectiveness – wonder if info is still in their archives
I saw that! A lot cheaper, even including recuperating at an Indian beach resort for a couple of weeks afterwards
I’d do it if I had to pay for it out of pocket where ever
I don’t have a problem getting prescription drugs from India either (and have), waaaay cheaper. I occasionally get shingles and take Aciclovir for it. Here it’s about $250 for 20 tablets, doctors visit for a script, add another $100. India (via in Internet)? $40, includes shipping and NO script needed.
“It’s time for America and her citizens to lead and not lag behind.”
Yes. angie. I like it.
OK, fucked that last post up somehow.
Our med. insurance is probably typical: we pay up the nose imo for half-assed coverage. We are healthy and yet it doesn’t cover the stuff we’ll definitely need at our age (like an IUD), or corrective eye surgery. Skipped dental altogether and have a 6 y.o. that’s definitely going to need braces. Will still probably pay less then if I had ins.
The system is gamed, worse it’s just plain wrong! So some people get filthy rich in the business – wouldn’t bother me if we treated everyone with a semblance of dignity. To be such an obscenely wealthy nation and to have almost half the population without ins. and/or going broke trying to pay a medical bill is unethical, unmoral, and uncompassionate. I sometimes just shake my head in disbelief in the direction of our nation.
Leslie: here’s the game. I used the link @5 and also read the hate mail.
http://www.venganza.org/worship/fsm-game/
Oklahoma kiddo @ 22
OK K — I completely agree with you backthread about Colin Powell. He could have resigned and he didn’t. A day late, a dollar short.
As for outsourcing health care — I’m concerned about the recourse/options if something goes wrong overseas?
And, for example, Ford says it spends more on health coverage for employees than on steel. In Canada, it doesn’t have to pay health for workers,so the plants there will not be affected by the lay-offs. Really fixing the whole health care situation here will affect everything.
ruffian @
32
Thanks, ruffian.
Yeah, the dogs. They’re true shit-kickers. And great support.
My insurance expressly DOES NOT pay for anything preventative, or for a physical or any kind of screening. Or anything congenital or preexisting. They would not pay for Zyban to help you quit smoking. They would, however, pay to remove a cancerous lung. They would pay for heart attack treatment. But not for correcting a congenital heart abnormaility. Except in babies. Babies they are ok with. Contraception, no.
Eureka ‘Swashbucklin’ Springs, AR @ 29
‘Swashbucklin’…
I’m liking it. Gonna bookmark it. Thanks.
“America doesn’t own the patent on right and wrong, and good and evil. Under Bush the American ego has become too big, American arrogance has become too out of control. The world is laughing us, those that aren’t so mad they want to kill us.”
OT. The Mass. Democratic Governors primary is over and the race has gone to Deval Patrick.
He is great campaigner, had a strong ground game and used the world wide web to his advantage.
He has a strong, strong chance of taking over the Mass. Gov’s office after 20 years of Republican rule in blue, blue, blue Massachusetts.
-GSD
Old Sow @
42
I couldn’t agree with you more. GM, Ford, much of the old steel industry, they were all burdened with huge healthcare costs for retirees and employees. But did they lead and lobby the government for healthcare changes?
Hell no.
They took the cowards way out, cutting and slashing hoping they would get to some business config that would be sustainable. How’s that working for you Bill Ford? Rick Wagoner?
Guess what, the 800 Lb gorilla didn’t leave the room while your eyes were closed. He just got heavier.
What the hell is wrong with the AFL-CIO in Connecticut? Why is John Olsen still holding out for neocon/fascist Joe Lieberman?
The AFL-CIO needs to make a statement. If they give a crap about ordinary Americans and progressive values, they need to kick the Lieberman habit in Connecticut.
Old Sow @ 42
I’m always mystified that large employers in the U.S. haven’t been lobbying hard for universal healthcare for years now.
RE:Ford and GM-maybe the pressure needs to come from some of the big institutional investors, like CALPERS. They will never get shit for returns on GM or Ford stock until it is fixed.
Redshift-
I too am mystified by that.
Having had cancer surgerly 4X now I can say that having the support of your friends and family, your dogs and your familiar surroundings are as important as anything else in your treatment.
The thought of flying to another country to have it done is absolutely barbaric.
Hi Jane, I didn’t realize that you were fighting through this. I’ve lost some good friends to cancer, and I want to say I totally support you and would like you to think of me as one of your friends.
~ifthethunderdontgetya, frequently concerned, sometimes a bit trollish, but never a concern troll
Well, I think that little bit of history calls for a collective hug for the Lady of the house. Sorta explains the “fearless” part, doesn’t it?
Take care, m’lady.
Hey, head over to amazon and give Frank Rich’s book a good review. Don’t feel bad if you haven’t read it — it’s pretty similar to his coluns. And we all love those. The righties showed up early to trash it. Let’s show ‘em who’s the boss of the intertrons.
Tiptoe, through the Tula.
Dang, dating myself again.
In the US, the physicians are required to have a license, regulated by each state. If they are on a hospital staff, their credentials must be verified–medical school attendance, current license, and the national practitioner databank is checked for malpractice claims. Yet, even with all this regulation, sometimes the bad apples aren’t turned up.
Also, most hospitals are regularly inspected by various organizations, including the Joint Commission. A lot of requirements must be met to get their accreditation.
Even with all that regulation, medical errors happen.
So, my thought about having procedures overseas–I hope that’s not going to become the norm. Also, buyer beware…
Kathryn in MA @
11
Any relation to Biggus Dickus?
Jane
Wow. That’s a key puzzle piece.
The depth and breadth of your human understanding is quite extraordiary in the blogosphere.
Your tempered inner strength must be enhanced by your battle with cancer.
Thanks for sharing.
Ms. H–good to have you back in the house.
scarecrow-
humbly left you some additional requests for explanation in the last thread.
cleter @ 47
My bet the insurance lobby has more money. Clinton deserves credit for trying to take on one of the two largest elephants (health care and the War machine) in the American room.
OfT from the NYT’s White House Drops a Condition on Interrogation Bill
The “flower,” emailed this to me. lotus’ ISP and FDL are not playing well together. lotus can read, she just cannot comment.
Balrog @ 55
He wanks vewy highwy in Wome.
I’m waiting for BushCo to announce that they’re closing Walter Reed and sending our vets overseas because their care is too expensive here. And we need another tax cut.
Big hugs and much love to you Jane.
Kathryn in MA @ 12
Never, ever apologize for lightening the mood. The stress levels I maintain these days are unhealthy, and humor helps mitigate that.
And…I’ve been following the growth of the Spaghetti Monster congregation since 2005.
John Casper @ 58
Thanks JC and Petal Moma*g* – but will they give up on immunity? Will Dems actually be able to stop the republicans from granting it. I hope Senator Reid was correct when speaking with Pachacutec and others a few days back.
I commented this for lotus, who emailed it to me. Casper.
I was hospitalized for 10 days while vacationing in Germany, and could not fly for 2 weeks after that. Believe me, following a surgery, you are still sick and weak. So the trick for medical tourists would be the flying back part – how’d you like to suffer through a 20 or more hour or so trip from India in coach when your’re at half strength? (I asked my nice Herr Doktor to write an order that I had to be able to recline for my flight home, so voila – a $2500 business class ticket that my travel insurance had to pay for.)
cleter @
64
I still spew when I see that scene. He has a sister…
Eureka ‘Swashbucklin’ Springs, AR @ 68
Eureka, would you have a link? I must have missed that.
Sorry I don’t. It was in comments. This was about the time Blogers met big dawg. He mentioned a conference call with several folks and Sen Reid. Glenn Greenwald may have been in that list as well. Perhaps he has a post on it.
Eureka ‘Swashbucklin’ Springs, AR @ 73
Thanks. I’ll search.
Here’s the link to Glenn Greenwald’s post on the conference call with Harry Reid:
http://glenngreenwald.blogspot…..html#links
Another thing about my hospital stay in Germany – although all the physicians more or less spoke English (and mercifully I understand medical Latin, so we made do), none of the nurses did. I shudder to think what might have become of me without my German friends who advocated for me when I was in no position to watch out for myself.
A couple of week ago, someone commented here asking for advice on responding to conservative acquaintances on the subject of healthcare. (Sometimes I have quick responses, but other times I need to ponder things.) I don’t remember who it was, but s/he said their view was that if healthcare and insurance companies are making a lot of money, and some patients are getting screwed, well, too bad, that’s the way it’s supposed to work.
My suggestion would be to say “so, then, you accept that the free market competition isn’t a more efficient way to run the healthcare system?”
If they disagree or are flabbergasted, explain:
Free-market competition is good at producing efficiency because companies make more money that way. But if making money doesn’t align with the result you want, then that doesn’t happen.
Insurance companies have become very efficient at denying coverage and avoiding sick people, rather than efficient at delivering good healthcare, because it’s easier. So if insurance companies making a lot of money by screwing people out of coverage shows is an example of the free market at work, that proves the free market isn’t a good way to provide healthcare.
So I posted civilized comments disagreeing with your site on illegal immigration and they are erased, even as some of your folks respond to them. Perhaps, you could clarify your policy. I mean even rush limbaugh allows some dissent on his show. Is this a junior stalinist site? Have i interupted (what’s a nice word for “circle jerk” site)?
Perhaps your commenters could explain where the fear comes from, and if they can do it without using the word “troll” they get a toy.
Seriously, to erase me and then even say “what dude” in French may qulify for eloquence in this circle (see above) but really. What gives here?
To assume that a nation having two languages is not even a debatable subject? To pretend illegal immigration will not strain social services is absurd. Yes, I know corporations are bad, too. But who do you think wants these folks here–corporations! Yes, I know im full of fear, but then Im not asking anyone to erase your comments. And it is true, you may win this time but you will give bush his amnesty and your party will join him in the ash heap of herstory.
I say good day.
scarecrow-
at the risk of not getting the last word…I’ve said my last peace on our blogversation on the last thread if you want to eyeball it.
Kak @ 65
Actually, they are closing Walter Reed (as part of the Base Realignment process.) They haven’t mentioned sending the vets overseas, at least not yet.
angie @ 26
Angie
What it seems like is that if you have a pre-conditioning illness you get treated like you are a criminal, it is held against you. That does make people scared and hesitant to get the treatment or even screenings that they should be getting. Many times there is no control over what you get and sometimes you don’t know why you get something. One brother of mine has MS. Why does he have MS, he doesn’t know and his doctors don’t really know. He is lucky he has insurance and when he takes mediacl retirement he will be under the State of California’s retirement. I would guess we all know people in this situation, afraid of what might happen without inusrance. It should not be that way. And Bush’s stem cell research policy, he has no heart!
Redshift @ 76
Insurance companies have become very efficient at denying coverage and avoiding…
Same thing with hurricane coverage, as in Katrina. They charged through the nose, raised their premiums year after year, and when the disaster finally hit, they simply refused to pay.
“That was wind damage, not flood damage, my esteemed customer/victim.”
And as long as the insurance companies keep paying off the government, no one is going to hold them to their bargains.
T- @ 79
I saw it, and I’m fine that you have the last word.
Redshift, I agree with your 8:00. I would just add, physicians ignore the laws of supply and demand. They pay their dues to their union, the AMA, who artificially restricts the number of physicians who graduate every year, so physicians can earn more. Then these physicians, overworked, because of an artificial shortage, they caused, make a huge number of errors. Then they complain about the high cost of their mal-practice insurance.
Ifthethunderdontgetya-
-And as long as the insurance companies keep paying off the government, no one is going to hold them to their bargains.
Keep firing the jerks every two years till they get the idea! Make them Walk the Plank!!
tharrrrr be a new thread arrrrrrrgghh
Shiver me timbers and avast! Off to new plunder!!! Off to the new thread!!!!
dude1 at 8:04 pm, if the mod was really pissed at you, they would have banned your IP. They didn’t do that. Maybe if you dial back the rhetoric a touch, and just stick with content, things will work out.
We need all the help we can get.
ccmask @ 37
Grazie, mille grazie.
rat bastahd @
8
excellent.
Carroll’s column is at Truthout
and
Boston.com.
thank you, rat bastahd!
Wow, I mean AAARRRRGGGGHHHHH!!!!!
Late night just disappeared. I got home from a fourteen-hour workday, was reading TRex’s thread. I went to refresh it and got an error msg. Interesting………
Hey ET – Late night did vanish … I’m guessing it will be back soon – it’s vanished in admin as well and I sure hope Trex has a backup!
ET, me, too. Methinks TRex might be tinkering with it. let’s ask, shall we?
TREX, quite fu*king with it. It’s good, already.
Hi Siun
Siun,
Love ya. Keep up the good work, mate!
What happened???, I went to go look at that talking cat video T-Rex posted and then *poof* no more T-Rex post…
I get to keep talking Piratican for another two hours, doggies. We’re in a strange place up here right now at night called an Arctic Lunar Solstice or something. The moon won’t be dipping below the horizon at all for weeks. So nights are not quite dark. Pretty cool…
A student walked out on a lecture early today, so I took him aside and told him that if W was his prof, he’d be lashed with a cat ‘o nine tails and keel-hauled for a stunt like that.
Har-de-Har-Har-HAR!!
Thanks ET and hi Mommybrain!
I’ve been checking in admin but the post is quite completely gone at the moment … hopefully Trex will be able to repost it!
gotta sleep here so g’nite!
Siun, don’t know how often he checks email this late at night, but I sent him one.
gotta date with my boyfriend Jon Stewart…so goodnight me harties…arrrrrr
Well, while waiting for TRex’s post to appear again, look at this from War and Piece:
“Terry Gross’s interview with Pastor John Hagee, founder of Christians United for Israel, who believes Armageddon is coming soon, is extraordinary. Doesn’t sound like Rice’s “birth pangs of a new Middle East” was an improvised statement, but code meant to nod to these folks.”Laura Rozen at War and Piece
[……]
OT, but thoroughly recommend October’s “NY Review of Books”
http://www.nybooks.com/
Cheney: The Fatal Touch
By Joan Didion
much more, too.
Since we are all EPU throw backs may I recommend Dylans new cd Modern Times ! Dayam Bobby Dayum!
Wow… I thought it was me… I put in a comment and hit submit and poof everything was gone…
called trex and its back … enjoy!
The Canton mill in question is supposedly employee owened so…just saying.
Big Biz is still bad.
my body lies over the ocean –
my body lies over the sea –
my body lies over the ocean –
now bring back my body to me !
bring
back
bring
back
bring back my body to me, to me!
bring
back
bring
back
bring back my body to me!
they sent my gall bladder to bombay
to make a repair or three
“there’s damage extensive, and the states are expensive!”
now bring back my body to me!
bring
back
bring
back
bring back my body to me, to me!
bring
back
bring
back
bring back my body to me!
then they sent off my liver to china
and my pacreas to tuscanny,
they sent off one kidney to brisbane, one to sydney,
now bring back my body to me!
bring
back
bring
back
bring back my body to me, to me!
bring
back
bring
back
bring back my body to me!
Jane: Thanks for the opportunity to guest blog and reach out to FDL’s great visitors! I enjoyed it a lot.
And many thanks to Jordan for inviting me to fill in for his labor spot.
Jane Hamsher @ 4
An engineer from India worked for 20 years to become a US citizen and succeeded and then his job was shipped to India.
A tech support job was sent to India and the woman who had the job said OK, I’ll go too.
India said thanks but no thanks. We have standards for new citizens that you don’t meet.
Had enough?
Cozumel (37): Where the heck do you live? Acyclovir 800mg #30 is $25 on drugstore.com and here in southern CA even an urgent care visit is about $60 or a PCP visit $40. If you were my patient, we’d call in the Rx for free after a quick phone consult. Jeepers, you’re paying through the nose.
Kathryn in MA @
12
It’s okay, much needed today. Wonder if Jane or Reddhedd have ever thought we might need a ‘hate’ section, say open in the wee hours for hilarity, not Hillary.
When I first heard of this corporate scheme to outsource medical operations of their employees, my first thought was, what about their families?
I have yet to see any indication that family members (husband, wife, parents, children, etc) will have their travel and lodging expenses covered so they can travel to be by the bedside of whomever has had surgery overseas.
Maybe this issue is covered in some article, but the idea that an employee will be forced into having surgery overseas without any family members present by their side, if true, should make every loyal, patriotic U.S. citizen’s blood boil, especially where the children of employees may be involved.
We are talking about pure evil here folks, in which the bottom line of some corporation cancels out the humanity of everyone. Oh wait, the Bush administration is setting a fine example of this type of conservative “humanity” since they are the corporate presidency. And the conservative Republicans, and evangelicals, cheer as their type of “humanity” rages unchecked throughout our beloved democracy.
It is time that we “outsource” all the Republican, evangelical thugs who are responsible for spreading this cancerous brand of conservative “humanity.”
Nice discussion at Keith Olberman’s show