
There are probably few people outside the Bush Administration who bear as much responsibility for selling the American public a bill of goods and leading them down the primrose path to war as Fred Hiatt. The unheralded level of cynicism with which the press is now regarded has no more deserving poster boy than Hiatt, and while we thought it would be difficult to top his previous foray into blindly narcissistic self-justification with his editorial entitled "A Good Leak," our Fred has really done himself proud today. Few can equal the lengths to which he will go to excuse the hubris and authoritarian recklessness of the Bush Administration (and thus himself) as he continues to occupy a mystifying perch atop the Washington Post's editorial page.
Larry Johnson does an appropriate fisking of the shabby and shameless piece so I refer folks to him for the sordid details, but I will address the larger issue which also seems to consume the perpetually bile-choked right wing blogosphere. Richard Armitage may have been the first to expose Valerie Plame's identity as a CIA agent, and it is apparent that he should no more be trusted with national secrets than my dog should be performing laser eye surgery. But to argue that somehow this leak -- which played no part in the concerted Administration effort to bully, intimidate and punish Joe Wilson -- should somehow excuse Scooter Libby and Karl's Rove's subsequent actions is a true marvel of wingnut logic. Incredibly it is somehow okay to rob the liquor store, shoot the owner, rape the cashier and spatter the walls with blood because someone else was caught shoplifting there the week before. It is the Sistine Chapel of bad faith editorials.
Not only can Fred Hiatt not acknowledge what most people on any given streetcorner can now tell you -- this war is a disaster and the lies employed in its sale pitch were both baldfaced and obscene -- he simply cannot admit that he was wrong. Which is just fine. As long as he wants to keep peddling this garbage, struggling against the simple truth that is apparent to almost everyone at this point -- Joe Wilson was right -- he'll keep digging his dirty little talons into the Washington Post's credibility and shredding what meager integrity they have left.
Hiatt wants to spit on his readers and treat them like they're stupid. That's just fine. We will happily sit here and take his candy away.
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Jane! Christy! Ned!
Twice in one day a 0? Can that be possible?
Ann in AZ @
1
apparently!
(EPU’d but OT, I believe)
This is your brain on Republican Logic:
Ed Rollins on CNN just now:
So, the problem with Democrats is that they are not consistent and they slap inconsistency aside.
1,258 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN JUST GOEZ ON AND ON AND…
COME ON FITZ…WHERE ARE YA??!!
who is that a picture of???
Peterboy @ 5
Right Said Fred, aka the makers of the “I’m too sexy” song.
Peterboy @
5
The too-sexy-for-their-shirts guys.
fred is in the middle or the one with hair?
Kinda makes you wonder what planet Fred lives on. Katherine Graham must be spinning in her grave - not just about this, but about her son, Donald, turning the Post into a joke.
It may only be a teeny-tiny consolation, but Fred’s hit piece is probably going to deluge Little Debbie with all kinds of mail and phone calls.
Fitz…please. We need you.
Jane,
I was really hoping you’d take this turdlette on ’cause I really wanted to Spotlight this topic back to those cocktail-weenie-addicted imbeciles at the WAPO.
Kudos! And on to Spotlighing! *g*
www.ThankYouValerie.com
Can you say Media WHOOO-OOORES
Jane, thanks for taking this up, and for referring to Larry Johnson’s fisk, which has kept me busy this afternoon.
I have one question for Hiatt: what, in your view, sir, is the purpose of a free press?
========
Had Enough?
========
Fitz, I say! (Even if it’s not a 0-type “Fitz.”)
Fitz is the reason I haven’t been too bothered by the Hiatts and wingnut bloggers with their asinine observations, although of course Jane, Larry Johnson et al. are doing the Lord’s work in smiting them.
Like I said a few days ago, even though Armitage had ‘fessed up to his chat with Novak in October 2003, by the end of December Ashcroft was forced to recuse himself and let Comey name Fitz as the special prosecutor.
Armitage’s confession obviously didn’t end the matter for the career prosecutors in the Justice Department, or for Ashcroft and Comey, any more than it has for Fitzgerald. So I don’t see any reason to think that’s changed now.
“Incredibly it is somehow okay to rob the liquor store, shoot the owner, rape the cashier and spatter the walls with blood because someone else was caught shoplifting there the week before.”
Jane - that’s a great analogy.
The fact that they have a wingnut as editorial page editor explains a lot regarding the appalling positions the WaPo has taken recently - including its Lieberman endorsement.
1. I can’t believe your dog can’t perform laser eye surgery. If you were a pundit, I bet your dog could.
2. You probably can believe the contortions they will go through to either keep from admitting they were not wrong to begin with, or it was someone else’s fault. I think the twisted logic is apparant to the vast majority of Americans, so I say let them contort away. How many versions of how many stories on how many things they’ve fucked up are there out there? Must be in the millions. But the basic story, here that they outed a CIA agent, that one never goes away. And it is the only one that matters - the only one that has any meaning (See last thread, I won’t repeat myself).
Emptywheel has an interesting analysis as well (doesn’t she always) @
http://thenexthurrah.typepad.c......html#more
I should have waited. My long post from last thread would have been
onsorta on topic here.I caught part of a talk on C-Span given by a guy a Democratic pollster (whose name escapes me at the moment), who had some very interesting things to say about where the Dems lose voters.
He said that Dems have a huge lead over the GOP on every issue that has to do with ordinary people and workplace/economic issues: health care, big business, utilities, health and safety, wages, etc. They have something like 90% of Dems, 80% of independents and a small percentage of what he called “soft” Republicans. But, he said, as soon as the focus shifts to terrorism and national security and foreign policy, that edge disappears.
He suggested that if Dems spend the next 8 weeks talking only about what Bush is talking about - terrorism - and fail to keep hammering on economic/working people issues, it could mean that these seats that look like Democratic wins could tilt GOP - and that even a 1% or 2% swing on election day could make the difference. He said the people you have to be wary of are what he calls the “late deciders” - the people who may not make up their minds until they hit the voting booth.
Something to think about, anyway.
Peterboy @ 8
The one with hair looks disturbingly like Lou Reed’s long-lost, disco-loving twin brother.
O.T. alert. Double wammy on the Sam Seder show: Ned Lamont *and* J.C. Christian, the General himself!
Lights are dimming (Ernesto winds and rain ramping up a bit here in North Central MD), and power seems tenuous - am shutting down before Nature does it for me…
Bye Anne and keep dry and cozy!
Jane, may I tell you unashamedly that I love you?
Evil Parallel Universe @ 19
Me too, but me not worry. Me cut and paste, then Spotlight to 10 of the Big Boys at WAPO.
And laughing all the way! *g*
just because Kobe can do eye surgery, doesn’t mean every dog can do ophthalmic surgery …
I am sure this has been adressed, but isnt it apparent that Novak spoke w/ Rove, alerted Rove to the fact that Armitage had leaked, and therefore provided the cover Rove/Libby needed to roll out their smear plan.
Isn’t it pretty obvious that Novak went with the name, despite the protestations of the CIA, because Rove NEEDED it out there to cover his broader push to discredit.
Is there any who doubt that Rove ENCOURAGED the publication, rather than cautioning it’s dicretion, because it served his political purposes?
How does Armitage’s name (we knew everything else) change any of this?
well, I for one, have been wearing my FDL Merry Fitzmas tshirt today in defiance…
2 people asked me today what it meant and I told ‘em.
so there, fhiatt and david broder.
ptooey. bring on the popcorn– there’s plenty unpopped thus far!!!
JoyB @ 25
Hey now! Me too!
Jane,
Given Mr. Hiatt’s sensibilities and reasoning aptitude, you might hit paydirt asking the Post to sponsor Kobe through Harvard Medical School. How were his MCATs?
Swopa @ 15
You got that right Swopa!!!
It ain’t over ’til the fat lady sings, and I’m told that Karl “The Weasel” Rove and Darth Cheney are excellent sopranos! *g*
A half-dozen posts and a thousand or so comments behind, but I still have to do this again:
Q. What’s the difference between the Washington Post and the Washington Times?
A. One has a rabidly right-wing, cuckoo-bananas editorial policy, and the other one’s owned by the Rev. Moon.
One more question: Does Fred Hiatt read his own newspaper?
To reiterate…the timing and coordination of this latest round of Plamegate damage control is worthy of note:
Washpo today pokes the Wilsons
The WSJ on Wednesday floats the “pardon Libby” zeppelin again
The Investors Business Daily Tuesday swings at Fitzgerald.
What did I miss?
That’s a fairly well-rounded and coordinated attack on the legitimacy of the case.
Fire up the big brains. You know who you are. Help me out here.
What’s up? And Why Labor Day Weekend?
I’ve got an indigo question for medaka. M you on?
Mark Shields was great tonight on NewsHour. One of the comments he made was that if the White House didn’t have anything to do with Plame and Wilson why did they set up an office to destroy their credibility. He said it better than me. The other comment was that if Iraq was the war of all wars then why didn’t they send in 500,000 troops to take care of it. Did any one else watch???
Anne @ 20
Was the pollster Peter Hart?
BushCo is trying to frame the discussion and change the subject. Actually, I’m glad to see the Dems are not rushing to get on MSNBC to take the bait about Iraq, Iran and terrorism. A few strong statements here and there about what BS it is should be sufficient (as Reid did). Boxer focused on National Security at home and BushCo’s failure in securing power plant, ports, chemical plants, etc., not addressing US’s infrastructure, stretching the miltary, etc. during her NPR interview yesterday. It was just right.
windje @
18
Marcy Wheeler is the Mycroft Holmes of our times.
they are the newfound castrati, Mad Dog @ 32, those foulmeisters who never served an honest day in their lives– not by an unhappy happenstance of endocrinological intervention, but because they are UNpatriotic American powerbrokers and warmongers.
JPL– I did and you are right on– I was woo-hooing all along!
The Rove & Co. pushback on Plamegate is all the more reason why Fitz needs to put as many cards on the table as he can, and soon. Even if it means compromising his case against Libby. I believe the nation has a greater need to know the truth than it has for the limited cause of just putting Libby in jail. Besides, Bush can pardon Scooter anytime he wants.
Right now the truth is the most important thing.
Fitz, where are you? Speak up, man!
Speaking of idiot columnists, I hope Jane has apologized to Stephanie Elliot…he seemed so sad the other day that bloggers were being mean to him!
Peterboy @ 8
There is no Fred (I don’t think). Just like there’s no Frankie in Frankie Goes To Hollywood (although it references Sinatra).
Broder took an online question from NY that sounded like one of us. Any dog-owning lawyers want to fess up?
percy @ 31
Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, cats!
Bobo is on Newshour saying the “Plame Affair” is over, it’s nothin’!
So it seems that this week’s memo/meme from Karly “The Weasel” is to “get out there pundits, suck down some cocktail weenies, and spread the word that it is “much ado about nothing” and make sure you emphasize that good ol’ Karl is a clean as a Klansman’s sheet”!
Let me tell ya’ Karly boy, that “sheet” don’t fly! *g*
mui - I didn’t realize The General did interviews. Someone should ask him whether he anticipated civil war in Iraq and see if he’s got a better answer than the Gens who testified (TESTIFIED) to Congress. ;)
OJS - I don’t disagree with you on the importance of the “truth.” But, I am pretty sure that a majority of the nation already knows what the truth is - which is Chimpco outed a CIA agent for political gain.
It is beyond Fitz, but more importantly, beyond Chimpy and a pardon or Fred Hiatt, or anyone else.
bobo, karl, dick and dubya wish it was over…
but it ain’t.
LindaR @ 3
Now, THAT’S funny.
Kurt @ 42
Stephanie? Implying that girlness somehow conveys less-than-ness?
So Republican lawyers in a Republican Justice Department, including two Attorneys General, launch a criminal investigation involving the leak of classified information regarding national security and the region of the world defined by the Republican president as central to US national security, after that investigation is requested by the CIA officials appointed by a Republican President and confirmed by a Republican Senate to investigate leaks by a Republican Administration in which some of the most senior Republican officials in the Republican White House are clearly complicit and fact witnesses and one of which is now under indictment for multiple felonies, and the prosecutor’s work is praised for its integrity by the Republican President . . . and Fred Hiatt’s point wrt to the propriety, necessity and integrity of that criminal investigation is . . . what??? Why does Fred hate Republicans?
Kurt @ 42
707!!!
As Bill Haley famously said: “That’ll be the day I die…”!
This piece needs to be spotlighted to everybody at the WaPo. I urge everyone here to take 2 minutes and write a brief note and send it out using spotlight. Hiatt should be ashamed of himself. We need to make this crystal clear to every last one of his colleagues. Sistine Chapel indeed.
Bobo was whining on NewsHour because some people said terrible things about Rummy. Now he didn’t say who or what but I’m sure that 90% of the audience said that could have been what I said.
scarecrow @ 52
… that is rich.
No, Fred is not one of those guys.
See him here.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....01339.html
Mad Dogs @ 53
You shouldn’t worry about this, as several of us visited Stephen’s posts recently and tried to explain that it wasn’t his fault that he lacked Jane’s insights and that he should just take his time issuing a retraction until he felt comfortable that everyone would have forgotten how mistaken he was.
Great stuff Jane.
I just spotlighted this to 10 of WaPo’s serious DC and Gov journalists so they can see how their solid work gets completely undercut by Fred’s mental diarhea.
Evil Parallel Universe @ 48
Perhaps, but the one and only reliable source for the truth right now lies in briefcase of the Man in the Rumpled Suit. Until then the Rove-dominated media can do a lot of harm, as it is already doing, to the Wilsons, I might add. Who, in a position of authority is coming to their defense? As we know, not the Post. The Times? Forget it. They are compromised. Who?
To use the Watergate simile, the Wilsons are left twisting in the wind and the nation still waits for justice and the truth.
Jane, CHS, SWOPA and EW all do it so well, there’s nothing to really add, but there are somethings I want to really EMPHASIZE.
1. Immediately in the questioning (per Waas) FBI investigators believed that Libby and Rove were being untruthful.
2. Immediately, it came out that Novak had two sources.
3. Armitage comes forward to the investigators (and Ashcroft was being briefed btw) but Ashcroft does nothing. Why?
4. Gonzales is called about State Dept coming forward, and asks no questions and does nothing as WH counsel. Why?
5. The President was, at the time, very publically saying that he would fire anyone involved and his spokesperson, McClellan, was also saying that Rove was absolutely cleared.
There has been a long drawn out light saber battle against the blue screen. Why? Not because Armitage came forward - but rather because ROve and Libby did NOT come forward.
And because Bush and Ashcroft and Gonzales wanted it this way.
If it had been revealed that Armitage was one of the leakers right then, there would have been a renewed push for the second leaker to be identified and for BOTH to be fired.
The delay just let them play “Pretty Shiney” and kept Rove his job, his security clearances, and kept the President from a huge embarassment right on the heels of his WMDs fiasco.
The investigation drug on because Rove and Libby lied. If they had told the truth, right up front, like Armitage - the President would have been forced to either make good on his bravado of firing (Armitage and Rove at least for Novak) or been shown, close in time and high in profile - to be a liar.
Evil Parallel Universe @ 48
EPU - I wish I had your faith in the American public’s capacity for paying attention to the facts. Ask five people, the next time you go to the mall, what they can tell you about “Valerie Plame and her husband”, thank them kindly for their thoughtful replies, then be prepared to go home and drink yourself into a stupor.
Rovian tactics, swiftboating, “the Wilsons are schemers” all work precisely because so many Americans are so damn inattentive and complacent.
angie @ 29
When spoken, fhiatt has overtones of FIE.
FIE on these media apologists for fearmongers and warmongers. Let the deaths of innocents be on their conscience.
FIE on Congressmen who are too timid to oppose actual tyranny. 1984 is here. WHAT THE BLOODY HELL ARE YOU WAITING FOR???
FIE on administration officials who took an OATH of office to UPHOLD THE CONSTITUTION and are passively letting our government drift into fascism. DOJ I’m talkin’ about YOU. DO SOMETHING.
FIE on businessmen who go along because it means they make more money and their clients make more money. Treading a little carefully as this involves people close to me.
More? Feel free to pile on.
Mary4, I agree but I also think that they didn’t want to discredit Armitage at the time because of his ties to Powell. Remember that very convincing erroneous speech Powell gave at the UN.
Here’s a good article about this.
http://consortiumnews.com/2006/090106.html
KO’s gonna cover the wapoo editorial!!!!!!!!!!!
HOboy. Olbermann has another rant coming up!!! ; )
1. Adding to the lunacy of the right, they somehow let Armitage skate. He’s an affable guy, a straight-shooter, just a gossip they say. I don’t give a crap. Armitage used to work, as I understand in naval Intel handling Seal groups. He fully understands the need for secrecy. He fully understands the downside to revealing classified info. The right ought to be yelling for his scalp. You do NOT casually disclose classified info. No matter how jolly you are; no matter how cool you are.
2. Up above, someone quoted a pollster. Seems he said the Democrats lead in all issues but security and terrorism. He thinks we ought to just talk domestic issues and leave the rest alone. I disagree.
Surrunder ground to Karl The Coward?? Like hell. We own the other ground. And I want Karl’s. Because we’re better than those clowns running things right now. We’re smarter, and we’re tougher. And we don’t run around crying like little school girls over security like Karl The Coward does. Surrender it all to the Coward? I spit on the ground. Let’s take the Coward’s Hill. It’s up ahead, and we can do it. Load up and let’s move forward.
Ghostman
Good grief, even Nora is replaying KO’s Edward R. Murrow moment. Is it possible that this is not just ratings — okay, okay — but that MSNBC is actually having a “gosh, we’re so proud” moment? As compared to the folks around WaPo today, who must be hanging their heads in shame/embarrassment?
Of course, Nora has on some silly doophus on to try to say this is just “arrogant liberal press,” and that’s why the right wing press is there, because “we’re sick and tired of the liberal press.” Boy, did KO really push their buttons.
Ron Reagan turns around and dumps on Fox network’s “jingoism.” “They were wrong about everything, so why trust them now? That’s just garbage.”
I love it when the right has on some whiny jerk.
Cuz I’m a puppet, ya know what I mean…
I do my little turn on the cocktail scene!
The cocktail scene, yeah the cocktail scene…
I live my life on DC’s cocktail scene!
Cuz I’m… Too sexy for the Facts…
Too sexy for the Facts…
Too sexy sans fact!
KO’s gonna condense his comments from the other nite in a minute!
scarecrow– that was Terry Jeffrey.
blech.
Oh, I forgot to add: Fitz himself is getting slimed every day in every way. I think the WSJ just did a major hit piece, which I thankfully did not read. However, in Fitz’s line of work I have to assume he is used to it and can take it. At least for his sake, I hope so.
1,258 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ JUST GOEZ ON AND ON AND…
“T”:
Great questions…why did the Armitage action come out now when the players including the corporate media have known about it for 2 and a half years? Why the push back against the Wilsons and Fitz now before Labor Day? And, good God, with all the shit out there to distract and confuse the voting public, why open this festerin’ sore now right before the election?
We need the big hitters to help us little folks out here.
KEEP THE FAITH AND REMEMBER THOSE KIDS SWEATIN’ IT OUT IN THE SAND OVER THERE!!!
It’s just maddening and tiresome. These pundits…and apparently now some of the blogger pundit-wannabes…are completely blind to the actual issues, which are quite important, and instead fixate on some stupid little detail, and latch onto it and just won’t let go.
Mary4 @ 47
Mary4, as a big fan of the general I have faith that it will be a better answer.
cilliza is a suck up– i have braved the elements to be with you, keith.
Chris Cillizza says the reason Rummy lies is because both sides do it. Predictable.
Your daily gas and oil prices
Average price for regular gasoline 9/1/06 in 50 states and DC
$3.00 plus 8 states
$2.90 plus 10 states
$2.80 plus 8 states
$2.70 plus 12 states
$2.60 plus 12 states
$2.50 plus 1 state
Average national price: $2.790, down $.018
Highest recorded national average price: $3.057 9/5/2005
Highest average price: Hawaii $3.337
Lowest average price: Ohio $2.544
Nymex Crude Future $69.19, down $1.07
Dated Brent Spot $68.75, down $.89
WTI Cushing Spot $69.19, down $1.07
Gas prices continue to fall. Oil is beginning to push down past the $70 mark. Long weekend, cooling economy, and no new or worsening crises.
Fred Hiatt also forgets that, but/for the investigation, we would have missed out on the opportunity to read all about “good leaks”
Leaker in Chief, a very declassified dude, hoarse whisperer of intelligence info, Mr. Nanner Nanner of National Security.
Surely his opportunity to tell us why leaks to Dana Priest were bad and she should go to jail, while leaks to Judy Miller were good and she should get an autographed copy of the NIE, is worth something to him? *g*
No one seems to clear up the points EW mentions about “operative” and “Plame” either.
We still have lots of redacts in this case and I’m not sure we ever get to see what was redacted, or that we’ll ever get to know much more about the 250 emails that stayed buried for two and a half years.
I don’t necessarily think that Fitzgerald is going to be able to open some big file up and say: Behold, here is evil.
You don’t always get to see the cards in the kitty - but that doesn’t mean there aren’t some interesting ones there.
angie @ 72
Thanks, angie, I’m awful with names, but maybe I can remember the “blech.”
blech suits so many on the circuit, scarecrow.
blech and blergh (thanks to Redd).
Doesn’t Fred Hiatt remind you of Cheney in that he never met a falsehood that he didn’t mind repeating no matter how many times it had been debunked?
Olbermann is going to comment on the editorial next up.
wapoo editorial, Wilsons’ attorney up next on Keith Olbermann
Mary4 at #61 puts the emphasis at the right place. There was a reason the President remained purposefully ignorant and didn’t put an end to the investigation in Sept/Oct 2003 after Armitage let it be known that he had talked to Novak. It would have meant exposing the Cheney/Libby and Rove operation to discredit Wilson. Remember that at the time it was reported that six other reporters had been contacted about Plame being Wilson’s wife. If Armitage went public and said he talked to Novak and Bob Woodward but denied talking to those other reporters the heat would have been on Libby and Rove to fess up and that would have uncovered their whole smear campaign.
scarecrow @ 52
Wo. You are on fire. Memo to self, stay on scarecrow’s good side.
Keith Olbermann is about to take Freddie “there is absolutely no doubt there are WMD in Iraq” apart. I want KO babies. Seriously. I’m willing to donate eggs and a womb.
annburns @ 88
I SAID, get in line. No mercy.
listening today (just a little bit), the entire right wing circus sounded… nuts-o? I can’t even think of an appropriate term - it all seems so devoid of reality…
Mary4 at 61 — amazing analysis. Never seen it said better or more clearly.
I’m finding it rather shocking that the red blogs are going apeshyte over the Brit docudrama where the presznit gets snuffed… blaming it on the liberal “culture of hate”. So would somebody explain to me how is it our fault that their great white hope has messed up so badly that a foreign TV producer would figure on a ratings windfall by producing a foreign primetime TV show about presidential assassination????? This has nothing whatsoever to do with liberals or democrats in THIS country. I’m completely confused.
JPL @ 64 - they didn’t want the leak to be ANYONE in the admin, I’ll definitely go with that.
But why hold Rove back when Armitage was coming forward?
I think they would have let Armitage take the hit and fire him if they could, but what if they had? The chorus stays on for the “other” leaker and now we “know” what happenes to leakers. If and when Rove came clean - whether in GJ testimony on down the line or otherwise - how could the President not do what he had done with the eaker who came clean early on?
No way to let the Armitage info come out and “deal” with it, without setting up a situation where Rove either has to be fired or tanks the President on down the line.
IMO, FWIW.
I still think that is why Comey was able to get Ashcroft to agree to inhouse it all. Armitage was “out” one way or another. In housing meant a different time table, and keeping it from Congress - both good for the President. It meant (despite the claims about how much “power” the Prosecutor was given) a very narrow scope could be established for the investigation, so that a lot of dirty laundry wouldn’t be aired. It was all good for the WH with Armitage coming clean. If he hadn’t - then there might have been a different set of resistance to even a Spec Pros IMO - again, fwiw.
Cilizza is kinda of pathetic, isn’t he? It’s kinda of like the schoolkid who went along with the bully saying, “oh he’s not my buddy”.
MSNBC is only viewed on expanded channels by comcast in the Atlanta area and I for one don’t want an extra box on my TV. Keep us posted.
O.T. again, but Max Blumenthal is skewering George “macaca” Allen on the Majority Report. I am afraid the General has hs work cut out for him. Interesting stuff as covered in yesterday’s post on Rove pushing the race card after the terrorist card turned dud.
scarecrow - LOL - I was going to say just about the same thing to you.
I don’t remember about the GJ judge that sent Judy to jail, but we also have a Rep Judge in Walton ;)
Go Max Blumenthal and thanks for the update, mui!
53# Mad Dogs says:
September 1st, 2006 at 4:46 pm *
707!!!
As Bill Haley famously said: “That’ll be the day I die…”!
ummmm … buddy holly is rolling over in his grave!!
melanie sloan is doing a good job on KO.
you go!!!!!!!
Urban Pirate @50 - that’s hilarious.
KO pretty much just covered what we already know (because Armitage gossips doesn’t mean there wasn’t an effort by Rove and Scooter to discredit and leak) and the lawyer said that the Wilsons are pissed…
golly– don’t know why that comment triggered moderation.
perhaps i was too happy and liberal. *g*
BTW, order Keith’s book. You’ll feel good.
http://www.amazon.com/Worst-Pe.....mp;s=books
egregious — can’t imagine you could ever not be on my good side.
angie @
72
he is currently in the emergency room being treated for the stroke he had . . . damn librule apeazing press . . .
his ‘performance’ was dreamy!
mui @ 96
Interesting visual: Karly “The Weasel” pushing buttons to and fro, but “nothin’s working the way I want it…more power, more power, give me more power…oh lordie, these buttons gotta work or we are screwedddd”!
Ya can take that to the bank! Repugs on life support and we’se pullin’ dat plug!
Incredibly it is somehow okay to rob the liquor store, shoot the owner, rape the cashier and spatter the walls with blood because someone else was caught shoplifting there the week before.
(wistful sigh) That was one of my favorite scenes from NBK.
Damn fine work, Jane. Your spirit and heart keep me going.
Please accept a virtual appreciative warm hug from me.
Thank you!
i heart jane @ 99
LOL! I Haley’d when I shoula Holly’d!
Jane, once again, please don’t use “fisking” that way. It’s an insult to the great and courageous journalist, Robert Fisk, first coined by the same right-wing bloggers who coined the term “Islamofascist”.
i heart jane @ 106
He might have burned his MSNBC bridge with that, I hope.
Keith’s book is still #18 at Amazon and it doesn’t come out until 9/11 . . .
Broder took an online question from NY that sounded like one of us.
Guilty as charged. I thought he was cool to take two of my questions, but a total prick to run the comment by the idiot reader who wanted me to “clam up”.
Washington Week shorter version: Blah, blah, blah.
McCain is an attractive maverick.
If the Democrats take the Senate, Hillary and others will take on responsibilities and have to defend their records in 2008. (No mention of why currently responsible Republicans like McCain don’t have to defend their lousy records for the last 5 1/2 years)
Lieberman is a centrist.
If an “aggressive liberal” like Lamont wins, it will give Republicans a talking point.
Joe Buck — you need to do your homework.
And then bugger off and find a blog of your own.
Cozumel @ 111
you know: i reckon we are in for some ugly meltdowns —- rgjoe style — in the next couple of months. these greasy, greedy, faux-xtians have no class. they will lose ugly!
italics off?
scarecrow @ 106
Ok now I’m happy. Who knew it could be so simple?
Exile on Ericsson St. @ 114
Exile doesn’t comment here much, but he is definitely “one of us” and my Drinking Liberally buddy. Cheers, Exile!
Exile rocks– first question outta the gate and merciless. thank you.
Amusing/disturbing/amusing PhotoShop of Lieberman at Steve Gilliard’s:
http://stevegilliard.blogspot......erman.html
Interesting article in The Missoulan on liberal blogs in Montana and their effects on Tester’s race against R Sen. Conrad Burns:
http://www.missoulanews.com/News/News.asp?no=5945
O.T. Majority Report. The General did a fine job, not as good as Lamont and Blumenthal, sounded a little nervous, but all and all, it was an enjoyable listen. I think his manliness really came through.
italics off?
i heart jane @ 107
Surely we can feel sympathy for him and his family even tho we find ourselves on the other side of the table, yes?
KO thanked Crooks and Liars but not FDL for the book action. Bastard.
Heather Wilson makes #3 worst person in the world.
#1– is the ABC docudrama blaming Bill.
op99 @ 125
dont think he wants anyone to know hes a venomous rabid lamb
Could whoever is moderating the comments for this thread please close the italics tag that appears to be open on comment 110 @ 5:30 pm through comment 124 @ 5:49 pm?
Surely we can feel sympathy for him and his family even tho we find ourselves on the other side of the table, yes?
He’ll have to wait in line behind ~ 20K U.S. casualties and God-only-knows how many Iraqi noncombatants before I can muster up anything like sympathy for that snide son of a babs.
op99 @ 125
No way, op99– he is a walking, talking best person in the world to me… he did credit bloggers in general and crooks and liars deserves major kudos everyday, imho.
Hey, My (not sure how many greats) Grandfather was a painter on the Sistine Chapel. True story, sorry no link.)
op99 — oh, it’s just a matter of time. I think when KO sees how many book orders happened following FDL’s multiple posts, he’s going to be very grateful.
‘Cuz nobody else that I read on the topic of KO’s speech across the internet mentioned KO’s book — save for FDL.
Anne re your #20 — It may be true that the Dems would do even better if the election could focus on issues other than “terror,” but I don’t see how the Dems can avoid dealing with the issue — as I see it, the WH has lots of ways of forcing the issue onto the front page every day or so, even without faking threats — and when they send out the whole team to talk about it, and in such inflammatory terms as they’ve done this week, the Dems can’t ignore it.
So take it on. Glenn Greenwald today has a post in which he argues (my loose interp) that the WH is extremely vulnerable on this issue, because (1) the Iraq war is a mess and everyone knows and believes it and (2) these same lunatics are trying to talk/scare us into the next war in yet another hostile country. So why isn’t this Johnson vs Goldwater? The repubs are risking multiple wars just like Iraq. If you think Iraq is a huge mistake, a mess, a quagmire, how about having another huge mistake, mess, quagmire, brought to you by the same liars and incompetents that brought you the first one?
So brand the Republicans as lying, warmongering incompetent lunatics that can’t be trusted with national security. Which part of this is not true? Which part would be hard to sell, given the last six years?
This may be rather Adrian Monk-ish of me, but …
For the love of God and all that is holy, turn off the italics! [gnaws on keyboard]
op99 @ 125
Well, If KO checks Amazon he’ll find this staring back at him ; )
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Mad dogs at 110, did you possibly omit a closing [/i] tag to end italics?
Egr ideas: (1) have a few words after the italic or bold stuff; (2) preview to see if the highlighted items are closed.
Reload your page, gang, not just Refresh.
The mods turned off the unclosed tag.
egregious @ 124
oh — i have sympathy for his family. for jefferies: not so much. now empathy i have — i am a PROUD LIBRULE!!
Percy and OJS - Cooking dinner, but I think I can answer both of you in one shot.
I do have faith in the “people.” And I don’t think they’re dumb or don’t care.
But, that, other than the dumb part, doesn’t matter. You, and all of us here on FDL and other blogs, get lost in the details. I obviously have nothing against that. Most people don’t participate in blogs. They get their news from other sources and don’t spend a great deal of time sifting through all the facts trying to figure out all of the links in some grand equation. Most people skip to the answer - and not an answer in the sense of a jury finding someone guilty. They don’t need a court decision to understand the “truth,” and they don’t care what Fred Hiatt or any pundit says - they watch or read the news and look at Chimpy, Cheney and Rumsfield, and listen to them, and draw their own conclusions as to whether a crime was committed/did Chimpco do something wrong. They’re looking at the big picture, they’re not looking for the details, for all the bits to be filled in. And they get the big picture - CIA agent outed - Justice Dep’t investigation - Preznit, Cheney, Rove, etc. That is all that matters. That is what sticks. Armitage, and what is said about Armitage, just won’t register or change the narrative. Plame has passed them by, no longer gets their attention, but their minds have already been made up.
And for some people it won’t be Plame, it will be Katrina, the War going badly/or the lies, corruption, incompetence. But all on a big picture level. We sweat the details, they don’t. And that is how people arrive at the “truth.”
A pundit, a TV show, nothing is going to change that bad “truth” for Chimpco. People have already made up their minds. Chimpco and Hiatt and his ilk are fighting the last war, not the present one.
Hey, feel free to disagree. I believe what I believe, you can differ.
Must. Not. Burn. Chicken.
All these comments in italics - it’s like we’re not really serious.
the italics have been long closed — please hit F5 to reload (refresh) your browser
op99 @ 125
It’s always those big guys who get all the credit. Guess Jane is just gonna have to shut this place down. Oh woe is us! :-(
/giggle off
egregious 124 — yes, but I thought that was snark; if it’s true, of course you’re right.
Jaysus, Olbermann just named “The Path to 911″ the worst person in the world. I’m deeply, deeply in luuuve.
Sigh.
Sorry, I momentarily lost track of the thousands killed, injured and/or displaced by Hurricaines Katrina and Rita. They’re in line ahead of Mr. Jeffrey as well.
Islamo-fascists.
Was Mussolini a Catholic-fascist?
-GSD
Exile on Ericsson St. @ 114
Congrats! Are you a dog-owning lawyer or did I just get lucky saying it was one of us?
Italics off???
Have re-loaded with F5 and yet?
Prof @ 147
what did you say? *g*
egregious —- not to worry! that guy had a metaphorical ‘apoplectic fit’ after being whupped in a debate…
*ilson46201 @ 141
Have done so. Unfortunately, although it was fixed once, everything re-italicized for me a couple of reloads later. *ilson, what do you get if you reload?
I F5ed - still slanty.
I did close off the italics — all is fine on my browser right now
first question outta the gate and merciless.
Actually, I can’t take credit for that one. I was the two later ones from “Rochester, NY”.
seems like I get normal text when I “refresh comments” but when I reload the page it goes back to italics… very strange…
angie @ 150
well, I was sending just this (without spaces):
but it didn’t work.
Wilson - I’ve reloaded my current page and now see that all the comments from numbers 110 through 149 are italicized.
and I wonder whether putting codes before and after my typing works
Comment to Mrs. Terry Jeffrey, if there is one and not a sticky blow-up doll with Phyllis Schlafley’s face taped onto it and stuffed under a bed somewhere–please take Terry’s nuts out of the vicegrips. His voice is killing me.
-GSD
By the way—I hold all liberal Americans personally responsible for the actions of a British filmaker.
egregious @ 136
It sure looks like I did. I even put up a post to *ilson46201 to see if he could fix it, but that post has disappeared.
WRT to the preview, did that, but it looked fine at the time. Don’t understand why it went totally italic.
Just my guess, but I’m think he’s trying to fix it and not having any success.
hit F5 again — I found another unclosed italic tag — all should be kewl now
*ilson46201 @ 154
But it’s not sticking for us. I’ve seen it go from italics to normal (apparently when you fixed it), then back to italics again. Maybe someone, in an effort to be helpful, dropped another italics tag in the thread right as you fixed it?
Wilson - now it’s back to normal - thank you very much for your help.
nope - reloaded page and went back to italics…
Exile on Ericsson St. @ 155
Rochester– good on you! Prof– just joshin’.
Maybe KO understands Crooks and Liars, since he reports on them all the time. Someone should invite him to the lake, sit by the fire and pet the dog. Maybe watch Joe’s sunset.
Bravo.
New thread from Jane
IT’S FUCKING FIXED — F5 DAMMIT !
Whew, I feel so much better now …
Now the margins are fucked up. Teehee.
Breath, big fella. Watch Joe’s sunset.
*ilson46201 @ 171
beam me up! Warp 9.
Oilfieldguy @ 167
Oh, I think he already cribs half his show off FDL, lol.
op99 @ 171
You too? LOL!
Mary4 — Brava. Excellent points, as usual.
I have two additional thoughts, neither of them earthshaking. First, Armitage knew he’d talked to Novak in late June or July but didn’t know he was Novak’s source for The Column until October. How could he not have known? My guess is he thought he knew it was someone else, because he knew about the WHIG campaign. After all, apparently Armitage did not say Valerie was an operative — didn’t even know it –or give her name, which Novak has since said he looked up in Who’s Who.
Second, all those right wing pundits who think pointing at Armitage will let the White House off the hook with the Great American Public have been playing inside baseball for far too long. They think everyone else draws the fine distinctions they (and we) do between the State Department and the Veep. Ultimately, though, Armitage was part of the Administration, and my guess is that’s all that will matter out in the hinterlands. He’ll just get added to the list of bad guys who outed a CIA agent and got away with it because of a high level coverup. Live by the unitary executive, die by the unitary executive. Ya gotta love the irony.
re margins — not no more !
angie,
Bill Clinton is at fault for all the evil in the universe for conservatives. That ABC would pander this line tells you a lot about ABC. Just as Fred Hiatt’s piece tells you a lot about the Washington Post. Most of the media have ceased to be independent and are content to be propaganda arms of this Administration. I commented on Washington Week above. It is tiring beyond words to see these “professionals” trot out moldy old talking points and pass them off as insight. If one of them zoned out in mid sentence, none of the rest of the panel would even notice. They would all be too lost in contemplating their own navels.
And don’t get me started on these internet chats with readers. I have a lot of respect for those here who monitor them but for the life of me it seems like they are mostly uninsightful fact free vehicles for reporters’ attitudes.
Thanks *ilson, yer a peach.
al-Scooter @ 129
No one in pain waits in line in my book. This is exactly how people dehumanize each other, as if a wounded Lebanese in pain means less than a wounded Israeli in pain…why. Or an American with his legs blown off versus an Iraqi with his legs blown off. War is bad for the soul, it creates hate.
Do we truly feel nothing for those on the other side of the line? I am reminded of Germans and Americans both singing Silent Night/Stille Nacht across the line in both WWI and WWII. In my own family we had first cousin against first cousin in the Civil War. Bad enough to shoot at each other, must we hate fellow humans?
We are obliged to choose the right way and set a good example even if our opponents do not. A fellow politically-engaged person with a stroke, no matter how far apart we are, deserves respect and sympathy if he has a stroke. There but for the grace of God….
——–egr, Quaker and Scottish Highlander
Peace or battle, depends on my mood. Nothing in between, yay bipolar.
Evil Parallel Universe @ 139
EPU - Just came back from my own dinner. Yes, I see the truth squirming out from under the Talking Points rock. WMD, for example, is understood by all to be a Pack of Lies, or at least a Well Intentioned Mistake. And Katrina… well no one even tries to defend the administration on that debacle.
I am at heart an optimist. I’m not surprised Ned won, and I think there’s a decent chance sane people will come to power in ‘06 and ‘08. I think Americans are s-l-o-w-l-y getting it.
BUT… the right wing has been incredibly successful at changing the shape of American politics over the last 30 years, and they have done it consistently via the Big Lie. It works. Bush is a chickenhawk. Kerry is a war hero. Put together some ugly ads and presto, the press and public are doubting his record, and this surely contributes to his loss.
Being right (as in correct) is not enough to win the hearts and minds of the electorate. The right-wing understands this. The progressives are only just starting to learn how to get out the message, how to communicate, how to run effective ads, how to fight slander.
We have to rely on more than truth and common sense. We have to learn how to be as effective at getting our message out to middle America as has been the extreme right.
Must. Not. Eat. Two. Burritos. At. One. Sitting.
egregious @ 179
Thank you, egregious. You speak for me on this one.
EPU - gotta take my son to fencing. If you reply, won’t see it till later.
Percy - I’ve written on this point at length in the past. But shorter me - the lie, whether Big or Small, only works if you are successful.
If Iraq happened to turn out the way Chimpco sold it, then the vast majority of people would not care whether Chimpco lied to get us there. But of course it is not, so the lies become important.
You can pick your lie: competence, caring, empathy - Katrina; morality/corruption - Abramoff/Delay, Cunningham/MZM; and on down the list.
They don’t have any lies left to market. They are trying to recycle some of the old ones, but now that the public knows about the lies it is a very uphill battle. Maybe if there was only one Big Lie they would have a chance, but there are many Big Lies (i.e. everything about them is a Big Lie).
And if all the extent Big Lies weren’t enough, there is a big housing bubble starting to pop. Nothing focuses peoples’ attention like economic hardships. And Chimpco will be blamed.
They were successful with their lies. The key being the past tense.
oh, poop. I ran out of time to pare down that big giant block quote at 181. I am sorry, folks! jeez… back to lurking with my dumb self.
EPU, 139: Please don’t let the chicken burn. Myself I had some fried fresh butterfish, yellow rice with dried cranberries in it, huge plate of spring greens with honey-mustard dressing. Will fix a cuppa chocolate after this.
Your point about the collective wisdom of the masses (my phrase) is well taken. The public always lags behind informed opinion, but in the main they eventually get it. However, in the case of the Bush administration and the war, the sad tragedy is the public got it too late. Three years after shock and awe they are finally coming around, while you and I were outraged and incredulous from the start. So while the collective wisdom of people is on the money in the long run, in the short run, they have missed the details (the lies and the fuckups after) and only got the picture as painted by Bushco and the media.
Polls show that the public supported Bush in the high 80’s throughout the invasion, and have finally fallen to the middle 30’s. So the polls prove that the public gets the truth but too late. The damage has been done.
And of course, what the public knows and believes is largely formed by what they read and hear, which is molded by the traditional media. I think research has shown that most people get their news from five minute summaries on TV news. So I am not calling the public stupid, but they are certainly ill-informed.
In the Plame case, I really do not know what the public believes, because to my knowledge there have not been many polls on the subject per se. I only know that Bush and Cheney are not widely believed anymore. And this helps the Plame side of the divide.
However, regardless of what the media or public believe, there is an underlying truth in the Plame case, the one that really matters. And that is my issue here. Not what the media and the public knows or believe, but what verdict of history will be when the Plame investigation runs its course. The keeper of the flame is Fitzgerald. There is no way around that, and I have to believe he knows it.
Why else do we almost always start a thread with “Fitz”? Because we know he holds the truth that really counts, not the pundits, not the media, not us, and not the public.
I further believe that Fitz needs to be aware that the clock may be running out on him. This is not like the Conrad Black case in Chicago where he can proceed at his own pace. In the Plame case, huge historical forces are in motion, and he is being swept up along with them. Whether Fitz is up to the challenge is something we are going to find out. I wish him all the luck in the world.
Now I need to go make some cocoa: Ghiradelli’s (cheap enough for me), with clover honey, soy milk, spiked with cinnamon. Enjoy your chicken.
JoyB @ 183
Nahhh…it be just fine! It’s not “how big a block you quote” but the words and sentiments you add.
Agreeing with EG is an honor in and of itself!
I lingered in front of the TV following Countdown long enough to witness Joe Scarborough “go long” with the pathetic WaPo editorial. At the point in his delivery, when he bravely stated that the entire case against Cheney, Libby and Rove was an elaborate LIE, my pulse began to race and the rage I commonly feel when exposed to rightwing spin began to surge, it simply and suddenly stopped. While entirely subjective, at this moment, NOW (finally), I believe that wingnut deception has lost its power. The awkward desperation on Scarborough’s face and in his voice was palpable. I think their losing their script, and it’s about time.
Orangejumpsuit @184
Amen. Right now the public at large has no idea why the Plame Affair matters. But professionals and thinkers know very well why it matters and how much. A system of government has been eaten hollow by termites, and Valerie Plame represents a key pillar that was holding one side of the house; if nothing else, the public at large will know something very large has gone very wrong when half the house falls off. They may or may not connect that event specifically to screwing the Wilsons, yet a much larger pall will hang over the name of this Presidency as the weather gets in, and the public at large already senses that much. If Fitzgerald is skillful in his pursuit and fortuitous in his timing, everyone will still know.
MarcLord
Amen.
This affair has brought together the finest community of collective reasoning, genuine empathy, and seekers of truth I could ever imagine. Not to mention the beginnings of a political change agent the likes of which this country has ever seen…I don’t know much, but I do know that our efforts will be successful in the long run; so do you, and that is why we are all here.
Cheers.
Great Post, Jane!
Excellent post Jane. Thanks for taking Mr. Hiatt down a peg or two. I cancelled my subscription to WaPo several months before the invasion of Iraq specifically because of Mr Hiatt’s boosterism for the Bush administration. (That and because of his incredibly lame stable of columnists on the Op/Ed page. What a snore.) Haven’t looked back! Thanks for all you do!
Rayne @114: you need to do your own homework. Do you know who Eric Raymond is? He is an intensely right-wing warblogger, who despises Robert Fisk. He used to be quite respectable among the software development community, but he has abandoned advocacy of open source for a full-scale war on liberals and “Islamofascism”. He regularly links to paranoid fantasies of the world enslaved by Muslims.
You can google for his blog if you like. I won’t link to it, because it is vile.
Yes, he wrote a dictionary, but while it started with a respectable list, he added lots of words like “anti-idiotarian” (you see, according to his ilk we all are “idiotarians”) and gave everything a right-wing slant.
I repeat: no progressive should use the term “fisking”.
gsd @ 158, yah, me too, i am also personally responsible for that british guy making a movie using my very own ‘what if’ storyline. and not one pence in recompence! i envisioned a basket of cash, and only got a bushel of peas.
love that pea soup!
OK folks, been trolling this place for awhile. I am sorry to say that what brought me here was my attraction to Jane when she appeared at the Kos convention (Wilson panel broadcast on C-Span). Since then I have enjoyed reading everyones comments. I like to read both parties position and then form a decision. My problem is this thread ignores the best information the general public has on this subject, the Senate Intelligence Report .
Just a couple of it’s conclusions…
“(U) Conclusion 12. Until October 2002 when the Intelligence Community obtained the forged foreign language documents9 on the Iraq-Niger uranium deal, it was reasonable for analysts to assess that Iraq may have been seeking uranium from Africa based on Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) reporting and other available intelligence.”
“Conclusion 13. The report on the former ambassador’s trip to Niger, disseminated in March 2002, did not change any analysts’ assessments of the Iraq-Niger uranium deal. For most analysts, the information in the report lent more credibility to the original Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) reports on the uranium deal, but State Department Bureau of Intelligence and Research (INR) analysts believed that the report supported their assessment that Niger was unlikely to be willing or able to sell uranium to Iraq.”
The report paints Mr. Wilson at best uninformed and at worst a liar.
I read Mr. Wilson’s op-ed in the WSJ the day it came out and was originally pissed. Now that as much truth as the general public gets is out there (Armitage), and the subject is now full circle to what brought me to your site, I am compelled to write something.
LindaR @ 3
The trouble with the NeoCon Republican party is that they are consistently WRONG about everything.Bush is stupid,incurious,incompetent,petulant,dishonest,mean,vindictive.Did I say stupid? Yes he is CONSISTENTLY all these things!
Jane, Well Done. Again.
I agree with you regarding this latest instance of Hiatt emerging from his spider hole for another “pronouncement.” He is grasping for some way to justify his (and Donald Graham’s) support for the invasion of Iraq as it becomes more evident with each passing day that the whole contrived affair is the absolute worst failure of foreign policy in this country’s history. The seminal charge in this so-called editorial that
“… one of the most sensational charges leveled against the Bush White House — that it orchestrated the leak of Ms. Plame’s identity to ruin her career and thus punish Mr. Wilson — is untrue…”
is not supported in his soliloquy, which does not include a single fact to support his assertion.
Anyone who has a passing knowledge of the White House Leak knows the basic facts that you detailed above. As an aside, why do people/media keep referring to this criminal activity as “the CIA leak case?” This is entirely a “White House Leak.”