Yay!

Ned! Roots!

And of course, Jane!

Stick a fork in her — she’s done!

Boxer is my Senator, and while I’ve sung her praises many times, she’s got some ’splainin to do, as to why she’s out in CT campaigning for DINO Joe.

Ditto for Big Dog.

Having watched Boxer turn on Curry up close, sadly I am not surprised … there’s a lot of venom in that lady and it’s not aimed at the right targets.

Bravo Maura for taking her on!

Lieberman’s “short ride” comment was terrible, but his vote on cloture for Alito was a thousand times worse.

Boxer should be *ashamed* of herself.

This is why we have to make the Gopers lament along with all who would enable them.

Remember, Boxer voted for “Bankruptcy Reform.”

Sure is interesting that Jowls seems only to have time to campaign at those sanitized, no-public-attendance, friends-only events.

Must’ve learned it from that kiss mind-meld with the Decider.

Remember all the roses we sent to Boxer a while back (I was not on FDL at the time - it was through Kos), I want my rose back.

I am grumpy.

Maura !

It’s amazing to me that Boxer will try an old saw about how the press/constituents have it all wrong.

I’ve strongly supported her in the past. I’m completly disgusted by her antics of late.

The repeated denial that he even made the statement is annoying. The New Haven Register needs to either make a pointed comment that it stands by its story (i.e. call him a liar) or retract the story.

In related news, the increasingly unhinged Washington Post notes today that Lieberman “is facing a brutal primary challenge from antiwar businessman Ned Lamont.”

“Brutal”? Medic, I need help for a stage 3 WATB over here, stat!

We’re going to need a gurney to carry all these waffles.

;>)

Heh,heh,heh,

And The Jane Hamsher’s of the Left take yet another chunk out of an ankle.

Bravo.

This is further proof that Joe Lieberman will not rest until he’s damaged the careers of as many Democrats as he can.

Bravo Maura!!!

Well, that was bracing!!! Those Senate club members don’t like being questioned at ALL, do they?

Kudos to CT Bob and Maura for bringing the voice of CT constituents right to Barbara’s face.

I don’t want my roses back-that was for the courageous stand she took regarding election protection when no other Senator would.

But I’m not gonna be sending any more roses if she’s gonna take the Rape Gurney Joe position that compromises a raped woman’s medical care.

Wait, wait one minute! Where were the Lieberman supporters? All I see are Connecticut bloggers!

*ilson,

the Senator’s insistence makes it kinda tough to blame it on ’staff’ now - jeebus

btw, neither Senator had their shiny happy campaigning face on - looked more like they do when trying to explain why a local base was being scuttled - ah good times

and Jane Hamsher wherever you are - Boxer’s ‘misstep’ today more than validates your use of the phrase ‘incumbency protection racket ‘ - good gawd, even a career liberal like Boxer is subject to it’s sway

Another Mauralicious moment!

Gaaah! I saw a link from the page with Froomkin’s column to an op-ed by Arlen Specter helpfully entitled Surveillance We Can Live With and I made the mistake of looking at it. Oh, my brain hurts. What a load of whiny crap.

President Bush’s record of seeking to expand Article II power has been a hallmark of his administration. The president and vice president have vociferously argued that the administration had the authority for the program without any judicial review. Bush’s personal commitment to submit his program to FISC is therefore a major breakthrough.

Really, Arlen? A personal, voluntary promise was such a major breakthrough that you didn’t think it was necessary to actually require it in your bill and actually make it binding on him or on any future illegal presidential program? Doesn’t that tell you something about the level of power-grab you’re rolling over for, that an informal promise is a “major breakthrough?”

And the conclusion is worse:

In my opinion, it is intolerable to let this matter drift indefinitely. If someone has a better idea for legislation that would resolve the program’s legality or can negotiate a better compromise with the president, I will be glad to listen.

Arlen, as the chair of the Judiciary Committee, I thought you might be aware that we have these things called “courts,” and that most matters where someone is accused of doing something illegal don’t “drift indefinitely” until Congress decides to make them legal. I’m sorry you’ve decided to agree that such a thing is too hurtful for King George to be subjected to, but perhaps you could just suggest that if he just followed the law, there would be fewer of these “public outcry” things “drifting” around distressing him.

Just a thought, seeing as you’re supposed to be a big cheese on this whole “judicial” thing. I know you don’t want to lose your comfy chair, but I think you might want to think a little more about how “he gave in and allowed the world’s greatest democracy turn into a dictatorship” is going to look next to your picture in the history books.

Bless you, Maura.
Bless you, CTBob.
Bless you, Jane.
Bless you, Spaceboy.
Bless you Kobe, Katie, and Lucy.

GO Nedmentum!

Hard to decide which is the greater disappointment. Democrat Boxer, for her kiss-ass approach to Joey L., or Democrat Hillary (and her husband) for supporting the Bush Middle East War. Of course the most frightening betrayer would be Clinton, because she appears to be but a heartbeat away from the Democratic nomination for the grand-prize in ‘08.

Boxer saddens me.
She’s been so right on many things, including the electoral college votes and the Iraq War. It is just depressing that she has to go into politician mode here in order to do a courtesy call for Joe Lieberman. I mean, it goes with the territory that she has dissemble a bit. But in some ways, she seems to be as genuinely out of touch as Joe. What does Marcy Kaptur see that Boxer doesn’t?

I believe some corporate donors got to Boxer. As someone above mentioned, Joe is calling in all chits on this one, and somewhere a donor was called and called Boxer. Boxer said there were ‘other considerations’ in supporting Joe.

I suggest we should look there. Any common donors? Big Pharma?

Indeed, CT Bob, kudos to you also.

Perhaps some Pooper Scopers instead of roses this time for Senator Boxer.

Sue at 19:
Wait, wait one minute! Where were the Lieberman supporters? All I see are Connecticut bloggers!

Maybe the let them sneak out the back door so they wouldn’t have to be seen with him…

I still cannot believe I voted for that man Senator Lieberman, to be Vice President.

This is all part of the 98% incumbancy that goes along with Congress… They don’t want the boat rocked for anyone, even those who undermind the party.. because if THEY can get tossed, then any of them can.

God forbid that they run on a platform instead of party.. and using party to stay in office is exactly what they are doing!

We need to remove EVERY representitive in Congress and hold NEW ELECTIONS on a level playing field, and on platforms, not parties.

Another sad thing is that Joe is sure to have told Boxer by now that Maura is a Lamont supporter out to embarass him, so she should just ignore her.

yeah … to think he could have been one heartbeat away from President Albert Gore …

are they trying to tell us that they don’t care about us?
yes.
why? because we have no one else to vote for.

if we don’t each start writing voter initiatives for each of our states to overrule what they are doing in our government, we are not going to have a government. One like Lebanon or Iraq perhaps. pretty close to that now

Dear Ms. Boxer:

That performance with Joe Lieberman today was shameful. The two of you looked like a couple of Republicans caught up in the Abramoff scandal. Running away from the press. Then you try to cover your ass by misquoting rape-gurney Joe. Honestly you looked embarrassed to be there, and you should be. Your performance was entitlement politics at its worst. I hope whatever favor Joe called in from you was worth it. You made a complete fool out of yourself and disgraced yourself to all California voters that elected you.

Oh my god. Aside from the rape/contraception issue, why does Boxer give a blanket endorsement anyway? Why is she so adamant that Joe is the best man for the job? She’s sounding ridiculous — all blather. Joe should win… because, just because!

Long, Long ago a therapist said to me “we do the best we can at the time and when we know better, we do better.” Guilt is wasted energy.

Well, we ALL know better know don’t we!

This isn’t going to make Boxer look any better, but it sounds more and more like she’s a typical bureaucrat who puts the words of her colleagues above what she’s hearing from constituents. I’m sure Lieberman’s people have been working the Democrats in Washington, spreading misinformation about how the angry online activists are trying to make an example of good ol’ Joe. They’re all on the same team, right? Why would Joe ever lie to his fellow Democrats? *koff*koff*

I swear, everyone who runs for office in our party really needs to be forced to study the history of political intrigue. We’ve got a bunch of wide-eyed rubes who come to the dirtiest halls of power in the country and don’t seem to understand the least bit about power struggles. I say a copy of I, Claudius and Macbeth for every newly-elected Democrat from now on.

Mark at 13

wrt ‘brutal’ I think a reason so many Sen.s called today ‘have no positiion on the bill yet’ is so that if they came out w/position against Arlen’s coverup, that would quickly be labeled ‘extreme’ , or ’shrill’ etc. Liberal, of course, is self-explanatory. To wit: Ted Kennedy.

Opposes. Will fight. (He’s already the target of ‘liberal’…and doesnt’ care. Minimun wage, same thing. He stands up. And anyone who joins in gets tarred. Shameful.)
——
To the topic: I just hope this makes enough of splash to wake a large portion of CT citizenry/voters. Can’t wait to see how Courant and others play the visits.

And then I come back to my own personal opinion, which is every abortion, no matter when performed during pregnancy–this is my personal view–is unacceptable and is, in its way, a termination of potential life.

Guess who said that on the floor of the Senate in 1999.

If that’s how Lieberman feels, then fine. He’s entitled to his opinion. But Boxer, Planned Parenthood and NARAL are out of their minds for thinking that he’s worth their unwavering support.

I just removed my email list name from Barbara Boxer’s pac: PAC for (NO) Change.

Someone on another venue posted the thought that, perhaps, the big dog, and inclusively, Boxer, are there to prevent Joey from going “independent”.

If the democratic party wishes to stop appearing weak on defense, they had better start showing ‘merica how to fight, even if dirty. No prisoners.

Let Ned stab Joey in the heart. Make it a big play. If Joey tries to run, twist the blade, dammit.

The party can start to shed it’s “weak on defense” mantle by “killing” Joey.

Wow. Excellent work by the two citizen “reporters.” They were polite throughout, but still weren’t pushovers. I’ve seen countless “professional” journalists never be able to do that.

Jumpin’ Joe at the end: “You not gonna stop!” No he’s not. And either are we. Don’t know what Maura and CT Bob do for day jobs, but the press certainly could use more people like you. Thanks again for the efforts and hopefully you’ll rub off on the plastic TV people that gather around these events as well.

Boxer really took a black eye today, and deservedly so.

She thinks she’s covered by giving a nice speech at Ykos and posting a few diaries, but accountability is a daily thing.

that was BEAUTIFUL. Just because Boxer has been great to us in the past doesn’t mean she gets a free ride. She has a job to do too. This is called oversight — of our employees. WAY TO GO.

This video has legs. You watch — it will be all over the internet in a few days and the Senator will have to respond — either change her position or hunker down. This will have an effect.

Kudos to all concerned. Great work.

Now I will go and call my senators.

Boxer’s PAC takes money from progressives and shifts it to corporate shills. Her PAC should not get your money. Give it to Blue America:

http://www.actblue.com/page/blueamerica

So did I, Peter.

1. Well…impressions can sometimes be inaccurate…but…my impressions of Lieberman and Boxer was that those 2 sure seemed mighty uncomfortable on that stroll. Pragmatically, maybe they were warned that they’d face a gauntlet of Lamont folks. Still, that was some nervous body language to my eye.

2. I didn’t pick up on any throngs shouting for Lieberman along the streets? No crowds of joyful supporters? No cheers and hollars? If accurate…not a good sign for Lieberman.

3. Maybe the Lamont team just needs to gin up another commercial. Show those telling denials from Lieberman/Boxer on his “short ride” statement. Then put up on the screen the quote, in bold from the newspaper, like Ms. Hamsher does above. And then, a solemn voice-over asking the audience: “Who do you want to protect you in Congress? A liar, or a Lamont?”
(ok, that’s probably too agressive for Mr. Lamont)
Ghostman

E-mailed those paragraphs from New Haven to Boxer. Gave it the subject of “Want to Reconsider That Endorsement?”

No, I don’t expect much of a response. But maybe it might tell her something.

I hope other senators show up. The more the incumbents shill for holy joe the more ridiculous they make themselves look. Did anyone hear about the rethug congress critter from CT telling reporters that holy joe is good for CT?

I gave up on Boxer’s PAC after she voted for the Patriot Act Renewal and she tried to justify voting for it in a diary at KOS.

HoJo’s opinion of all us lowly voters really shows on his face in this clip. You can just see him thinking, like the Chimp-in-Chief, how much easier dictatorship would be.

Two things:

First, shows how out of touch the DC club is from real people,

second, shows how powerful this new medium is to have this info up in minutes and directed at the progressives all around our country.

DC club better beware….

I live in CA, so Boxer is my senator. I called the DC office — twice — was always cut off after 2 minutes of canned crap. I finally called the Sacramento office and my voice was shaking, I was so angry. I let loose. Don’t worry — I told the man who answered I wasn’t talking to him, but I was as mad as hell at BOXER. He understood. I have a funny feeling, though, that if that crap is happening at her DC office, a LOT are calling. By the way, the person answering the phone didn’t even ask if I WAS a constituent of Boxer’s. So — call — even if you don’t live in CA. (Boxer doesn’t LIVE in Connecticut, and she is there, campaigning for that liar, so why can’t anyone else CALL her office?) And be sure and say you don’t appreciate Boxer LYING about Holy Joe.

It’s a bit late for the NH Register to retract that story. It has developed substantial legs. Even the Lieberman campaign would have to explain why they did not go on the record sooner about being misquoted.

Ok, but what does Barbara do now?

She can still say, plausibly, that Joe lied to her. She took him at his word. But having been deceived, rather than merely misinformed, Barbara has to respond as strongly as she has been wronged. She needs to rescind her endorsement.

Well, THAT short walk went well, didn’t it?

Like a slow-moving trainwreck!

Keep it up, CT Bloggers — they can run but they can’t hide (forever, that is)!

Barbara Boxer may not be a typical DLC vichycrat but I bet she is scared shitless that a Lamont victory will cause Corporate America to double down on the Republicans. If Corporate America’s most reliable Blues State DLCrat can be defeated, does a 30 year old lobbying strategy of playing both sides of the aile and usually backing the incumbent make sense????

I think the Netroots has to play good cop/bad cop. Keep the Democratic Leadership honest as to key party principles at all times while at the sametime reassuring them that the NetRoots/new progressive basis is ready and mature enough to pick up the slack from a lose of corrupting Corporate cash.

Yeah… and worse. He (Joey) could be running for president today, by virtue of his veep luggage. Now… that would be a different kettle of fish. A potential seamless political transition from Repug to Demo.

Shell - YEA! calling now.. It’s phone every Senator day anyway.)

A suggested follow-up to “the Kiss”: the largest foamboard one can buy, with the New Haven Register’s title banner (I know there’s a real name for that but it has slipped my mind) and date across the top, and the quote Jane just gave, blown up in big letters readable from fifty yards.

Confronted with that, at least pols and journalists won’t be interested in being filmed claiming Joe never made the quote.

Let’s refresh Joe’s comments on the subject, shall we? From the New Haven Register:

Does anyone know if Leiberman has directly challenged the Register quote — i.e. asked for a correction or anything — or is he just relying on the memory hole?

Joe and Boxer could just take a ’short ride’ to a friendlier venue…couldn’t they?

For Joe, that short ride home is coming real soon now. And he’ll be crying the whole way, “But - I WAS RAPED!”

This is post is linked to Rawstory’s front page, the word’s getting out.

Per ghostman, I agree, Joe looks exhausted and defeated.
I think Boxer’s seen the latest poll numbers. She was defensive and prickly, and Joe hid behind her and let her do the talking.
Great video!
What jacqrat said at 11:58 above.
I hope someone can get to Joe’s people and see if he stands behind her reinterpretation.

I called Boxer’s office here in SF twice today the first time I asked if she had a position on the Spector bill and told him how her stumping for that obscenity in Conn. has hurt her reputation with me and then after I saw the clip I called and asked if its true that she approves of his emergency rape victims simply going to another hospital, of course she has no current position on Specter’s bill and they had no answers. What a shame, one of my heros turning out to be just another pol.

Great work CTBob and Maura and Jane, thank you!

Looks like those two just sucked on some sour patch kids while at the candy store.

LOL

Ever since that worthless Fitzgerald caved on Rove, I’ve been too despondent to even log in and change my screen name from obsessed back to depressed, but this Boxer debacle is the last straw.

I don’t know what they’ve got on her, but let’s face it - the whole system is broken - they’re all crooks and hypocrites.

She sounds like Scott McClellan in the video clip.

And you know what? Fitz was a fuck from Day 1 - he’s just as guilty as Time, WaPo and NYT in the conspiracy to allow Bush to be re-elected by suppressing the Plame scandal.

I am so disgusted I could spit

Way to go, Maura! And thank you, Jane, for publicizing this. Boxer ought to be ashamed. As a CA Dem, I am ashamed at our senators. We can do better. (Cindy Sheehan, maybe?)

OK, I just saw her answer to the rape gurney question, and she’s definately off my list,and I will send her a “your actions have consequences” letter this evening! Slimy Slithering Salamanders, where does she get off saying he’s pro choice when he’s said he thinks embryos are the same thing as a person. sheesh!

By the way, I’ve just donated to Lamont again and called all of Boxer’s offices. They all have different people answering who will listen to your blood-spitting rant and pass it on to their demented boss. Only the DC is hard to get through to. Call them all and let off some steam. Here’s the link:

Give Boxer Hell

Did either of them get asked any questions about Israel/Lebanon today?

depressed formerly obsessed, even you, with all the terrific comments you have written do not get to call Fitz a “fuck” and just expect me to read that without a comment.
I am sorry you are down, but there have been numerous posts from Christy, emptywheel, and others going over the filings. Fitz is kicking Ted Olson’s ass. Rove has flipped on Scooter.
Yeah, there’s no media coverage of it, but Rove isn’t out there saying Fitz screwed up.
I’ve learned a ton from many of your fine comments here and at tnh. One weak one doesn’t cancel out all those other fine ones. This is a marathon not a sprint. Have you seen Lamont’s latest poll numbers? He’s beating Joe in the Primary and dead even in the general. The voters are telling Naral and PP and the unions to put their endoresements where the sun don’t shine.
Valley Girl quit FDL. Did you know? Remember Karen Allen. She left too. I don’t want to lose you too.

Eureka: We should ask Mr. Pryor if he might be contemplating a change of heart concerning his unconditional “love” for LIEbertwit…

I just got off the phone with Sen. Boxer’s San Diego office. I asked the staffer about the Lieberman quote in the New Haven Register. He said that they “have no statement on that issue” and that they attempt to keep political and governing issues seperate. I pointed out that her stated support for Lieberman implies a governing philosophy aligned with his.

Anyway, I was very polite, as was he. I’m not sure that her staff are all aware of this story so it would be good for CA firedogs make a call to her offices today about this topic. She’ll know that the issue has gotten a lot of people’s attention and that word spreads *fast* in blogtopia.

Barbara,

I want my rose back.

It’s pretty pathetic to see Boxer try to “clarify” Lieberman’s comments, when he was only a couple of feet away. What she was saying sounded like nothing more than talking points put out as damage control straight from Lieberman’s office.

Boxer also should have the political sense to have simply said, “Joe’s right there, ask him what his comments meant.” That wouldn’t help her as to why she’s stumping for him, but she’d look like less of a lackey than she did by parroting weak excuses.

I’d like to wait for an open thread, but I’ve had good experiences asking for help freeping Michigan polls here before, and this poll has a tight deadline, so here’s another one:

http://www.lsj.com/apps/pbcs.dll/frontpage

You have to scroll down toward the bottom of the page, to where it asks “If the election for governor were held today, for whom would you vote, Dick DeVos or Jennifer Granholm?”

I think you know what to do. Poll closes at 7pm EST. Thanks for your help, hope I’m not too much a nuisance.

Tomorrow is primary day here. And of course I am voting in the Democratic primary end of things. But the interest for me will be what “kind” of Democrats and Republicans will be chosen. I want so badly for my state to return to its historically progressive, (and caring for the downtrodden) and rightful political place! John Steinbeck’s ghost lives here. Though Steinbeck was born in Salinas and raised in California… he is one of us.

John Casper,

Valley Girl quit FDL. Did you know?

No I did not know that and it hurts to hear it. A wonderful lady.

Re: Depressed.
I am not foolish enough to say Cheer Up.

Mr. Casper has some valid points though.

The fact that RGJoe has a big wet spot in his knickers is quite entertaining for me.

NCJim - yea, I want my rose back too. She has taken stands that we applauded in the past but let’s review them. Were they ‘easy’ already decided votes or issues where she could voice opposition without consequences?

Standing with Joe, probably because of some pressure from somewhere (ooooh let me guess) speaks of her fear of losing her funding.

That speaks volumes to me. Did she vote for the support of Israel having the ‘right’ to defend itself? No questions asked? I bet she did.

61, the header on a newspaper is called the flag. :)

Yeah, that was fun this morning.

Maura forgot to ask for her rose back; she didn’t think she was even going to ask a question, but she had the opportunity and simply winged it.

And winged Boxer, too, from the look of it!

I’ve got more video to edit, but I gotta finish up work and then head up to Waterbury for the post-Big Dog Ned-fest they’re having.

Did anyone notice my voice waiver right at the end? That was an entire morning’s worth of nerves that poured out, which built up after being that close for that long to Holy Joe.

Jeez…that guy is creepy!

See ya later!

Thanks to Maura and CTbob for having the metaphorical huevos to do that!

And just a word to those who don’t want to bring down someone like Boxer, because of her progressive credentials: In California, it is EXTREMELY unlikely that a Republican of any stripe could beat whoever the Democratic nominee would be in any senate race. Having a REAL progressive in that officially endorsed Dem slot is extremely unlikely to be a threat to the party. There are just WAY too many Dem voters in the state who would never vote Repub.

So by all means, do not have any fear whatsoever to threaten to “lieberman” either Boxer or Feinstein.

(I actually like Boxer’s positions on most issues, but her unwillingness to even show the courtesy to RESPOND to my emails has really pissed me off. She, like Holy Joe, seems to think that her position is an appointed one and not an elected one).

Did you all see this great snark from Arianna about Big Dogs visit to Conn…..LMAO

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.....25706.html

A Liar or Lamont…

Nice soundbite Ghost…

Larry

What on Earth was Joe hoping to accomplish today by having, what, a press conference in a closed candy store on a Monday morning?

What a waste of political capital to bring in a US Senator for a rinky-dink event like that.

I’m glad it was rinky-dink, but doesn’t anybody on his staff have any judgement?

You know what is interesting is watching Joe be so meek and defensive compared to the past. I recently watched this documentary in which he is interviewed about his contribution to the fall of the American Accounting industry and he was not as scared as he was when he was confronted today.
interesting

Okay. I just spoke with a very nice and polite staffer at Boxer’s Sacramento office. Of course he couldn’t “say anything” but he was open-minded and I felt he truly listened to my complaint about the senator’s appearance with Joe Lieberman today.

Also, I gave him the url to FDL and told him the video was up here. I got the idea he was interested and might come check the thread out.

I basically told him what I truly feel, that Barbara Boxer deserves better than she’s getting from Joe Lieberman and that the only thing that makes sense to me is that Joe’s people must have lied to Barbara’s people about what he actually said about contraception for rape victims.

im very happy that you are getting this all on video…..because i wouldnt believe it if i didnt see it.

From today’s Froomkin, with regard to the Saudi visit to the Oval (emphasis mine):

Michael Abramowitz and Robin Wright write in The Washington Post: “The Saudi foreign minister personally urged President Bush yesterday to intervene to stop the violence in Lebanon, the most direct sign of mounting frustration among key Arab states with what they see as a hands-off U.S. posture toward Israeli strikes against Hezbollah.

“In an Oval Office meeting yesterday afternoon, Prince Saud al-Faisal said, he delivered a letter to Bush from Saudi King Abdullah asking for U.S. help in arranging an immediate cease-fire, a stance U.S. officials have repeatedly rejected on the grounds that it is premature. U.S. officials would not comment directly on the request, saying only that the two sides discussed the humanitarian situation, reconstruction and how to end the violence.”

While there’s no evidence that the visit will have any effect on U.S. policy, it is worth noting that Bush cut short his planned stay in Crawford to meet with the Saudis.

Two things he’s cut pig-farm trips short for are: first, Terri’s Law and, now, Lebanon reconstruction discussions with the Saudis.

He is the Saudi’s President.

Yeah CTBob and Maura, Rockin’ in SONO!

that was a smart move giving the Boxer staffer the link to the video here — it’ll get passed around in the office — staffers love to see stuff about their boss !

This is the fax that I sent: Dear Senator Boxer: You were wrong today when you misstated Sen. Lieberman’s comments about rape victims. I’ve attached the actual New Haven Register article for your recollection. Please don’t twist the facts, that’s what the GOP does. Rape victims already have enough problems to deal with.

CT Bob & Maura…

Thank you for the great film footage. Also, I would like to apologize for the arrogant, condescending treatment you received from Senator Boxer. I am ashamed to be her constituent today.

Busted at 12:56, yeah I really don’t know all the details. She was moderating on a thread with a lot of trolls….. I know she had some issues with how much time she was spending here versus her job responsibilities. Karen Allen was one of the big starters of the netroots, before they were called that. She really invested a lot in Ohio politics and imho it was her activism that probably helped Jane, Christy, and Pach think up the whole idea of netroots along with Kos and others. I often hope they still lurk here.

the candy store event was just a media availability — Babs and Joe were hurrying off to a private FUNDRAISER — that’s the real reason for the trip to CT

Here’s a shorter version of the Boxer/Lie news clip;

WARNING %^$@#* foul language.

Joe on the question of whether he’d support Lamont or Schlesinger in the general:

“I don’t answer hypotheticals.”

Can we please please please please get some unified follow-up on this ridiculously puerile rejoinder?!?

Hadassah: Joe, if it rains tomorrow, should we cancel the picnic?

Joe: I don’t answer hypotheticals.

H: If the whole engine needs rebuilding, should we just get a new car?

J: I don’t answer hypotheticals.

H: If those dishes are clean, will you unload them?

J: I don’t answer hypotheticals.

Screamin’ heap o’ crap, I’m tired of it.

The effective journalist’s reply to the “I don’t answer hypotheticals” is

“Yes, you do, all the time. It’s what any thinking, PREPARING entity does: consider hypotheticals. You simply don’t want to answer THIS hypothetical? Why NOT!?”

Ok. I feel better now.

Well, not really.

But everyone here is swell. :)

P.

this video saddens me. I think Boxer is a great Senator, but she is dead wrong on this one. Oh well, we can’t have it all.

CTBob and Maura, you both put on a clinic of being polite and firm!!
Way to go!

puppethead 77:

It’s pretty pathetic to see Boxer try to “clarify” Lieberman’s comments, when he was only a couple of feet away.

No kidding! That was my first thought. I expected little Joe to lean his head on her shoulder and start sucking his thumb. Pathetic.

Running from the press. Running from answering questions.

Barbara Boxer is making a joke of herself.

She thinks that by speaking in a serious measured voice, she can lie to the people of Conn.
Then she and Joe run for cover.

Kudos to CTBob and Maura - this is genius work.

Thank you for exposing Boxer as yet another politician who will say anything to cover her ass.

She is a huge disappointment.

As far as people leaving, Nov. 2004 took a huge toll on many people — especially those who gave their heart wholeheartedly to the process.

And ohio was the worst. Those who were (and still are) angry about Ohio and where yelling that there was fraud on every level there, and the silence of the dems (especially places like Kos) was absolutely defeating.

They will find a new level of helping, but probably will not put themselves on the frontlines anymore. Sad.

Surprised it hasn’t been poited out here - where in the hell is anything close to a “meltdown” here? She didn’t even seem rude, just sticking to her story. She’s wrong about the “short ride” comment and that deserves attention, but…WTF?

Don’t be so hard on Sen. Boxer. We need all the friends in D.C. that we can get.

Working in the Senate together, I would imagine that Senators would become close friends. Since she knows him on a personal level, she doesn’t believe he could say something as crass as “it shouldn’t take more than a short ride”, and believes him when he said he was misquoted.

This is why it is so important to get Joe out of Congress. He has a corrosive effect on the other Democrats. Getting Ned in there will hopefully turn the tide.

And you know what? Boxer’s trip won’t get Joe one extra vote. Anybody who is familiar enough with her won’t be voting for Joe anyways.

Giving Sen. Boxer a hard time may make us happy, but will it make her more likely or less likely to support progressive causes in the future?

(Oh, and GO NED!)

Great one Penman at 12:56.
Joe tells the whole CT Dem party to go Dick Cheney themselves with his “Plan B,” and then he is stunned when people are understandably pissed off. The CT Dem party is PAYING for a primary that Joe says is a waste of money.

DR your 106

With friends like Boxer who needs enemies. I say TRex her.

Was that Chip Reed from NBC near the end? Big dogs are out indeedy, if so.

woof.

This is a great clip that displays the Democrats in DC lack of strategy and unity.

America needs leadership FAST!

Condi Rice is in the middle east where she will work hard to avoid peace. “We don’t want a cease fire right away” says Ms. Rice.

Hey- she could have worked hard to do nothing from right here couldn’t she?

Yes, it was angie.

Kurt at 84: Keep in mind that it’s not just about replacing someone who’s “mostly good,” it’s about being able to make a credible threat that they might be replaced to put pressure on them so they don’t assume they can get away with not being good.

DR@106 screw Boxer…who cares if SHE is happy. She is also replaceable.

John Casper #96:

I miss them, too. Like Busted, I hope they’re still lurking.

VG’s thing must’ve happened when I was out of town. I just assumed she was on vacation. Damn!

I just got off the phone with Sen. Boxer’s San Diego office. I asked the staffer about the Lieberman quote in the New Haven Register. He said that they “have no statement on that issue” and that they attempt to keep political and governing issues seperate.

Somebody should sort of let Boxer know that politics, in a democracy, is the way the people hold people like her and Leiberman accountable for the way they govern. Her perception (or to be fair maybe just her staffer’s perception) of a split between politics and government sums up the whole Beltway/incumbency mentality ….

Bravo to CT Bob and Maura for doing what Boxer should have done, speak truth to power!

I am very disappointed in Boxer, but I guess she proved that being part of “the establishment” was more important to her than waiting to see who we in CT decide to be our next Democrat Senator? Her active stand against the Iraq war means nothing now! Her premature support for Lieberman will cost her a lot of trust and respect. These values are not easy to earn when you’re a politician, and I think suspicion will forever follow her like a dark cloud. It’s like that old saying, “friendship is like French China, once it’s broken it can be mended, but the crack is always there!”

But DR —

Yes, as senators, they DO become FRIENDS. But they should not put that above all else. They should be beholden to their constituents. (After all, we don’t pay their salaries to be FRIENDS.) And talking about FRIENDS, you saw what Friend LIEberman did to FRIEND Clinton in 1998. Face it — there comes a time when the TRUTH comes above friendship. (Or, in LIEberman’s case, his friendship with GOPers.) Besides, if I had a friend who acted that way, they would not be a FRIEND anymore.

Yep rw, when we kidnap thousands of people it’s “extreme rendition” and then we torture them in secret prisons, because it’s legal under the AUMF. When Hezbholah kidnaps two Israeli soldiers it’s terrorism. Once everyone in the Middle East and the world figures this out, they’ll realize just how lucky they are that W is POTUS.
I suspect this was the gist of Condi’s message.

Well, if it’s politicking and not “governing” she was doing in Connecticut, who paid for the trip? Were Boxer aides present? Were they working on their day off?

Was this a “comp” day for RGBabs?

Boxer has spent “political capital” today on someone who does not deserve it. Lieberman is not a progressive, but Boxer is. And he won’t gain anything from her visit!

Think about it: His support doesn’t come from the progressive side, and it looks more and more likely he will lose the primary. So in the general — if he actually does get that far — he will try to appeal to the decidedly nonprogressive side. All those voters are going to remember he had that liberal Barbara Boxer campaigning for him!

I would love to someday find out the real reason Boxer went to Connecticut today. He isn’t worth it. He doesn’t deserve her support. So why is he getting it?

And also —

“Giving Sen. Boxer a hard time may make us happy, but will it make her more likely or less likely to support progressive causes in the future?”

Huh? So, speaking our feelings to senators might make them likely to become RWers? That is really a F-ed idea!

TeddySanFran @ 120:

Well, if it’s politicking and not “governing” she was doing in Connecticut, who paid for the trip? Were Boxer aides present? Were they working on their day off?

Was this a “comp” day for RGBabs?

I have been wondering the exact same thing since the day it was announced that she would be campaigning in Connecticut.

Boxer and Clinton are only stumping for Joe as an insurance policy. If he ends up holding his senate seat as either a dem or an independent- they want his vote for leadership. It’s logical.

To all who are out there doing this stuff:

EXCELLENT WORK!!!!!!!

Thank you for representing us peons, the voters!

I have renewed faith in democracy in America.

That was fantastic, gutsy, professional and real reporting.

Too sad about Boxer.

But for once something good comes from MTP: “Tony Snow Apologizes For Stem Cell Comment” http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/....._Cell.html

Boxer is my Senator, and while I’ve sung her praises many times, she’s got some ’splainin to do, as to why she’s out in CT campaigning for DINO Joe.

The “splainin” she has to do can best be accomplished via a primary challenge. She needs to go. This is her repeated failing. It isn’t just Joe but on other issues for which she lends a tin ear.

Boxer needs to go. She’s not as bad as Lieberman but then, anyone that will ride Joe’s campaign plane into the ground is bad enough.

I faxed a copy of said article to every single one of her senate offices. I even took the courtsey of highlighting, bolding and enlarging the direct quote, just so she isn’t mistaken in the future.

I think we have a strong clue here to how Joe “clarified” his position to be okay with NARAL. If Boxer’s statement is based on input from Joe and his staff (which seems likely), his story is that what he meant was that hospitals should be required to provide transportation to another hospital that provides emergency contraception. While that’s bad (and I certainly wouldn’t call it a “pro-choice” position), it’s somewhat in line with how abortion is treated in many places — hospitals that don’t provide it are (in theory) supposed to provide transportation to ones that do.

Now in fact, this is appalling on many levels, because it backs up the false antiabortion position that emergency contraception is actually abortion. But it also begs the question, if this is what Joe is claiming privately, why hasn’t he ever stated it publicly? I’m betting he’s trying to keep it mushy to avoid pissing off Catholic voters, but the idea NARAL would accept that private “clarification” and give their endorsement is appalling all over again.

by rather strict law, official Senate staffers and equipment may not be used for partisan political purposes. that’s the point of a separate campaign organization and funding. Boxers CT trip was purely political — her official staff should have nothing to do with it. they are to deal with legislative matters and constituent services, not political campaigning!

rcauthon at 116 — actually, the staffer in her Senate office is correct. They are not allowed, by federal election law, to discuss campaign issues on the public dime. But what you can ask is for contact information for someone on Sen. Boxer’s political staff, or for an address for political correspondence, and you are more than within your rights as a constituent to expect a response on that. But her Senate staffer was exactly right to do what s/he did — they are severely restricted in what they can say or do regarding campaign issues or any political activities.

I’m just sorry I washed the hand that shook both Maura’s and CT Bob’s last Thurday night.

elrod @ 125 –

That is far too simplistic. I’ve followed Boxer’s career for ages, and I first became aware she is Jewish in the last couple of weeks through comments like yours. HoJo wears his religion on the outside of his clothes, but Barbara Boxer seems to separate church and state very well.

FEINGOLD is also Jewish — no excuse.

more riled.

This video confuses me…

does this mean Sen.Boxer supports rapists blatocyst rights?

Dr Bong - Great name btw. Pryor is another Liebernon Democrat who needs a lot of pressure as long as he fills that seat. Sure would like to find a real candidate to run against him asap.

OT: Whatever else you might want to say about the Chimp, he’ll be in the history books for bringing down at least one country (if not more):

http://billmon.org/archives/002561.html

Back momentarily with something a bit more positive.

no Congresscritter is on a time clock — voters decide on job performance, not hours clocked. Senators decide their own work schedule which is subject to the whims of the Senate leadership as far as presence needed for voting…

And Barbara Boxer did say, when she was in the green room at YKos (where Jane and I got trapped in the corner with RBG by the vast travelling horde of Boxer’s staffers, and the pack of press trailing along in her wake) that she and Lieberman are “old friends.” Being loyal to your friends is admirable, and is only human. Doing so at the expense of your principles and those of your constituents is something that Sen. Boxer’s voters have a right to ask for explanation or clarification on, should they choose to do so. THAT is only politics.

But do be nice to her Senatorial staffers if you call her offices — ask for contact information for someone on her political/campaign staff. The Sen. office folks are not, by law, allowed to answer any questions regarding her campaign activity. But someone on the political side of her offices — that’s someone you can pin to the wall and require an answer from, and I’d bet that her office staffers weren’t counting on people asking for that information. If you get a name, address or phone number for someone on her political staff, let us know — I’m sure either I or Jane can make the time to place a call ourselves and ask a question or two for our readers.

Thing is–if I was a right winger who wanted to hurt Lamont–I’d send mainstream CT voters to this video and let then hear the “I nearly shit myself” comment at the end–it looks and sounds like a Lamont supporter who had the melt down. Did this comment really have to be included as news-worthy? Maybe the editor could keep her/his eye on the prize–i.e conveying that Lamont is actually of Senatorial caliber.

Wrong?

Clueless?

Misled?

Deceived?

Hi all,

Way to go CTBob and Maura.

My thoughts, FWIW. Keep the criticisms of Boxer on topic.

We’re disappointed in her choice to come support RGJoe. She will have to earn back our trust. She’s obfuscating of the women’s issues - minimizing Joe’s comment as well as his cloture vote.

What that does however, is move her from “favorite” status to “suspect”. You may all feel different, and that’s ok, but she is still a leader fighter for our issues. She is NOT a DINO. She is NOT a TRAITOR. Her loyalty, while misguided, is admirable.

Give her hell, for sure. This was a stupid gambit. I guess she owed Joe big-time. But keep it civil, and on-topic. We’ll need her AFTER 8/8.

DR at 1. Although I don’t see it on this thread, I think there are a lot of fdl’ers who share your position on Boxer. Her record and credentials are impeccable given the current state of Congress, but she has made an error in CT.
I still think Vichy Dems for example, DiFi, Whinerman, and Schumer from real blue states such as CA, CT, and NY are by far the more serious problems. Once they cave, and they have, it puts enormous pressure on people like Boxer, Feingold, Kennedy, Kerry, and some others to say nothing of the pressure it puts on red state Dems such as Ben Nelson from NE.

I just called my Senator Mrs. Boxer’s office and let her staff have it with both barrels.

Duccio 140

I wondered that myself.

I thought it detracted from an otherwise stellar job.

Lest we despair, mimikatz quantifies that the monetary tide is turning:

http://thenexthurrah.typepad.c.....ms_ca.html

Looks like the Chimp really does need to lawyer up. Too bad for him. Christy, Mary, LHP et al are on the side of the angels. And Grover Norquist better watch his step next time he tries to cross K Street.

i must congratulate the people here. this is truly a progressive group!

CHS 131 –
OK. Duh, the whole Al Gore making phone calls from the White House thing, right.
But I still suspect most of ‘em don’t see much connection, if any, between governing and politics. Viz. the GOP, which has given up even the pretense of trying to govern.
And the Dems, too, I guess — i.e., we don’t have any power, so we can’t do anything to influence policy.

OMG
Real journalists for a change.
Polite and persistent as you turn those screws and make ‘em sweat.

Great job.

SJONZE @100

this video saddens me. I think Boxer is a great Senator, but she is dead wrong on this one. Oh well, we can’t have it all.

WHY can’t we have it all? Is there a lack of Democrats in California? Are there no progressives able and willing to run for office? Would being aggresively pro-choice actually hurt a candidate in CA?

I’ve been looking at the numbers from the 2004 elections that the Secretary of State has available online. Boxer won an uncontested primary in March 2004, with only 2,556,298 in favor of her. A whopping 4,448,761 votes were not cast. All Republican candidates combined only recieved 1,888,697 votes.

In the Generals, Boxer received 6,955,728 votes. (57.8%) Bill Jones the Republican received 4,555,922 votes (37.8%).

I humbly submit that she can be aggressively challenged, and if the challenger wins the Primary, could easily beat the Republican in the Generals.

I’m curious - how big an event was this at the candy store? who was there besides the Lieber-Youth?

DR - I keep reading this support Boxer anyway and find it increasingly difficult to consider. Boxer is perpetuating a lie (to herself and us) about Joe and she is not a good friend to Joe right now by allowing this to continue. Insincere and dishonest so called friends are not respectable Senators.

Even among old friends, in politics, there is always a quid pro quo.

So what’s the return for Boxer?

From the Last Hurrah article:

Dems have traditionally been competitive if they were outspent only 2 to 1, because the money is generally spent more efficiently.

You mean the Democrats don’t give 15 percent to the candidate’s spouse off the top?

Smith Kaufman is the name on Boxer’s PAC Web Site contact page

PAC for a Change
c/o Smith Kaufman
777 S. Figueroa St., Suite 4050
Los Angeles, CA 90017

Or to reach us by email:

info@pacforachange.com

Is this of any help?

Chairmanships in both the House and Senate get voted on by colleagues. Democrats sense victory so folk angling for Chairs become real real helpful to colleagues who in turn are beholden. I dont know if that’s Babs case but its a reasonable conjecture …

When Lieberman loses, it will send a message to all incumbents that they are going to be held accountable for their words and deeds. No more free ride because there are brave souls telling the real story.

Boxer is my senator, and I think she is one of the fiercest fighters for us. I’d like to hear what she has to say.

I think Boxer has made a mistake going to Connecticut today to support Lieberman. I don’t believe she’s done any great harm to her political career. Her good moves far outweigh the bad, and I’m totally willing to believe she made the decision to go either a) based on faulty info, or b) because of some nefarious secret HoJo has on her.

You’ll notice, she’s defensive, quiet, unsmiling — in short (pun intended), unenthusiastic about doing her supposed duty here.

If she recants, as far as I am concerned, all is forgiven.

Kurt -150 and other disillustioned CA constituents:

What about Maxine Waters if she can be persuaded to challenge Barbara Boxer for her Senate seat?

Just musing here, in a galaxy far, far away…

A Headline from the Future:

“Maxine Waters and Cynthia McKinney Win White House.”

I offer just wee glimpse into what the future looked like to me as the decade clicked from ‘69′-’70′. Admitedly only in Jr. High and niave, maybe. But some things just should be on the table. This is one among many other similar scenarios. Just something to cogitate, ruminate, and activate.

Maxine for the DiFi seat — I’m there.

Otherwise, I love my Senator Boxer. I don’t want her gone, I just want her free of the HoJo monster!

“…either I or Jane can… call…”

Mine would be a simple question. Really. Ask Senator Boxer if loyalty to one old and dear friend trumps doing the right thing. That is: is Joe Lieberman’s feelings more essential than stopping the carnage in the the Mideast and the Israeli rampage? Which could, not incidentally, eventually lead to a war which permeates the world. And kills our children.

progressivepam — watch the video and see what Boxer has to say !

ROFLMAO!!!!!!! Watching Neocon Joe squirm just made my day. Thanks. I needed that.

Anne Holliday 161 -

I don’t think it would be easy for Maxine Waters to win a senate seat in CA, as blue as we are. She’s perceived as extreme and somewhat wild-eyed.

I love her, personally, and would vote for her in a heartbeat if she ran but I don’t think she will.

What about Maxine Waters if she can be persuaded to challenge Barbara Boxer for her Senate seat?

Only if we can get Marcy Winograd to replace DiFi first.

“Maxine for the DiFi seat — I’m there.”
Put me down too.

I would vote for Maxine Waters in a heartbeat. For EITHER of the 2 senate seats.

DiFi is currently running unchallenged this year though. Boxer isn’t up for reelection until 2010.

OT - internets as tangled tubes shirt for ted stevens:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/i.....otostream/

-via boingboing.com

Off Topic/On Topic - I guess it depends on how you view the topic.

http://law.shu.edu/guantanamot.....ort_1_.pdf

These are remarks delivered at Woodrow Wilson School, Princeton University, Feb. 2006 by P. Sabin Willet, an atty for a Guantanamo “detainee.”

The whole set of remarks are worth the read and not that long. A part of the closing - and a request that you go read the whole.

“Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold,” Yeats wrote. “Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world … The best lack all conviction, while the worst Are full of passionate intensity.”

The best lack all conviction. We make wars for lies and the best do not demand the truth. We watch our young men killed, maimed, paralyzed every day and the best do not demand an end. A habeas corpus judge rules that innocent men are held at guantanamo and eight days later the Congress abolishes habeas corpus. The best lack all conviction. We drop bombs on villages in Pakistan oblivious even to our own interest. Do we think the dozens of women
and children slain that day had no fathers, brothers, sons? Do we not think that for every
enemy it struck down, America in that bombing gave birth to a dozen, two dozen, to fifty
people sworn to hate us forever, sworn to believe forever the worst that is said of us?

The best lack all conviction. That is the problem.

A nation that hides behind the high water mark and permits its stewards to act like animals so
long as they do it just over the horizon is not a strong nation, but a puny and a feeble one. And it is a damned foolish nation if it does not think it will soon reap at home what it sows abroad.

The rule of law is not coming back on its own. It will come back only when the best get
conviction again. When you go out and grab hold of it by the ears and drag it back. In the
ballot box and the courtroom and the newspaper and the classroom and the public street.

This probably wasn’t the most powerful or even most devastating part of the remarks. But it does explain why, even though Boxer has been a very good and strong support on many issues, she hasn’t earned a bye on supporting Sen. Leiberman.

Another part of the remarks include this story:

During the Viet Nam war, a protestor stood outside the White house, with a candle. Every
night, for weeks. He stood in the cold, in the rain. One day a reporter came up to him, and
asked, “Do you really think, with your candle, you’re going to change White House Policy?”
“No,” he said, “I’m sure I won’t change White House policy. But that’s not why I’m doing
this.”
“Then why are you doing this?” the reporter asked.
“So that White House policy doesn’t change me.”

Feinstein was challenged in the primary by two candidates (whose names I forget, having voted for one of them myself!) but those candidates got 14% of the vote in the CA Dem primary.

There is a GOP candidate and a Green candidate for Feinstein’s seat this fall.

Loved Arianna’s snark about Big Dog’s (anticipated) endorsement of Lieberman!

Favorite line:

“Sure, Hillary and I know how to triangulate. But, compared to us, Joe Lieberman is frickin’ Euclid.”

Blank Kludge @ 162

Great speech from McKinney here.

Diane Feinstein is also a Senator from CA, and some of you guys are calling for a primary challenger against Barbara Boxer?

Get your priorities straight.

So Barbara Boxer has a blind spot for Holy Joe. It won’t matter after November.

Joe Lieberman just makes a fool of himself by talking about Ned Lamont having out-of-state donations while bringing in a California Senator to campaign at a closed diner. The more out-of-state friends that Lieberman brings in, the lower he’ll sink in the polls.

Mary, thanks for the link at 172; I am wondering about the reference to “bombing villages” in Pakistan though. IIRC the US did do that once in a disputed border area, which imo is actually Afghanistan.

♥ MAURA! ♥ MAURA! ♥ MAURA! ♥

eeway are not oorthy way!

80% of Joes contributions are from out-of-state as compared to Neds 70%

I would vote for Maxine as a senator in a heartbeat. But whoever said it about CA being too chicken is correct. Oh, how I wish CA would stop being so weak. (And if you don’t believe me, look at the gov.) CA used to be brave — what happened?

I think I detect some Aymara magic in those hearts …

Get even with Barb Boxer…ignore her Pac and opt-out of further emails. After her lousy performance today in CT with Joe-no-mo, she’s persona non-grata.

If you listen to this clip you hear Boxer say…”what Joe meant was…”

And so why are is she in CT explaining what Joe meant, when Joe hasn’t bothered to clarify his statement in an open manner?

and to DR (176)…you’re right, Feinstein is more offensive than Boxer, but what’s the point of a representative government if not to challenge our elected officials when they blatantly sell out in this manner?

The point is both Feinstein and Boxer could use the kind of challenge Jane Harmon had in her primary that at the very least, woke her up to the fact that she needs to pay attention to her constituency.

In the end, I’m amazed at the Boxer apologists who go on about how bad Lieberman is, and in the next breath criticize those who challenge Boxer for putting her principles aside to travel out of her way, and stand in solidarity with a man we all agree is a creep.

Dru - we bombed a village resulting in numerous civilian casualties … due to rumours that al quaeda folks might have been there …

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4608784.stm

Why the sea change? Why at this time? First it’s Senator Feinstein’s permission to compromise the Constitution by confirming the dangerous union between the Pentagon and intelligence-a union that would not stop for any ~G__-damned piece of paper.

Now, Senator Boxer appears to have been a pod victim as well, moving unreservedly about assisting the quasi-neocon Leiberman any way she can.

So, here in the blue state of California, both senators suddenly take an ideological detour to protototalitarianism on our behalf? I feel abdominal pain.

Please Barbara, take away the pain and explain.

Kobe needs to share some of his pumpkin bread with the poor little starving hamsters running in the wheel that powers the FDL Server …

Shell @ 180 -

“CA used to be brave — what happened?”

bunch o’ red staters moved in, made a bunch of money and changed our blue-ishness….

Some initial results of our calling campaign:
Senate 2453, regarding eviscerating FISA
FOR:
Specter–sponsor
AGAINST:
Kennedy
Feinstein–own bill
Durbin
Bingaman
LIKELY AGAINST:
Leahy
“WAITING TO HEAR FROM CONSTITUENTS”
Collins
Snowe
PEACH COBBLER:
cbl, to Cornyn staff
HOLDING OWN HEARING on Wednesday:
Schumer
FOLLOWUP by B.Muse:
Burr
Dole

NO POSITION at present:
Johnson
Thune
Collins
Snowe
Cornyn
Isaakson
Chambliss
Grassley
NelsonBill
Martinez
Clinton
Schumer
Jeffords
Bayh
Coleman
Brownback
Byrd
Boxer, but she’s busy in CT :)
Lieberman
Obama
Feingold
Graham
Kohl
Kyl
Biden
Sessions
Domenici
Levin
Stabenow
Salazar
Allard
Hatch
McConnell
Bunning
Murray
Cantwell
DeWine
Voinovich
Warner
Allen, soon to lose to Webb :D
Coburn
Wyden
Menendez
Lautenberg
Lincoln
Pryor
Hagel
NelsonBen

STATES WITH NO DATA:
Alabama
Arizona
Hawaii
Idaho
Louisiana
Maryland
Mississippi
Missouri
Montana
Nevada
New Hampshire
North Dakota
Rhode Island
South Carolina
Tennessee
Wyoming

STATES WITH ONE KNOWN/ONE UNKNOWN:
Arizona
Connecticut
Delaware
Indiana
Iowa
Kansas
Massachusetts
Minnesota
Ohio
Oklahoma
Oregon
Pennsylvania
Texas
Utah
West Virginia

Dru - from the timing of the remarks (Feb 2006) I think that was probably in reference to this:

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/.....index.html

The drones sent in that killed civilians. Pakistan claimed it as their territory and Afghanistan did not, afaik.

Just a guess.

I just wrote to Boxer. I told her not a single Californian elected her to use their money visiting 49 other states and campaigning for her friends. I told her to get back to DC and restore the rule of law in the U.S.. I told her to go provide some oversight on that crooked executive branch. I told her to go do something Californians actually want done. I asked her to explain why she is using my tax money to go to Conn. and campaign for someone who is not even a Democrat. (I expect no reply.)

thanks siun; that is what I recall; I just found it curious that the article chooses to sum up with a reference to bombing villages in Pakistan which happened once, when the US has been bombing Afghanistan for 5 years.

Mary, thank you for the link at 172. Very much on topic, I would say.

Yesterday and today both I have had all kinds of problems with the site. I thought it was bc of our storm issues and my laptop service yesterday - or maybe an extra big volume from Soros, but I don’t know what the problem is today.

Just me?

Dru - I think it was bc it had just happened.

DR @176

and some of you guys are calling for a primary challenger against Barbara Boxer?

Get your priorities straight.

My priorities are fine, thanks for asking!

I am a California resident. And I want my elected representatives to, well represent me. I do not want them wandering around, 3000 miles away, endorsing people who have locked lips with the most fascist President this nation has ever had. When I ask my very pro-choice senator why she is willing to support Rape Gurney Joe, I expect her to answer me…and to not ignore me. And when I have to go on to the internet just to find out why she is supporting this man, since she won’t respond to any of my direct inquiries, I really don’t want to see her badgering a CT voter, and outright lying about what Lieberman actually said.

If my senator can not represent me, and can not answer my questions, and feels the need to support a veritable Republican candidate against a very Progressive challenger, then I am going to exercise my rights as a citizen and get involved.

My priorites are fine. Get your own priorities straight.

Mary 192 - pokey loading here on my end too…

It seems to me that FDL is creating a new paradigm for progressive political blogging. It involves taking politics from the keyboard into the streets. What happened today at the Boxer event is a good example. This will create more stress for the inside-the-beltway crowd.

“Lessons Learned” :: it is highly doubtful that Boxer went to CT on taxpayers dime — such trips are routinely paid for by political funds such as Boxers PAC or by Joe who wanted the favor. In fact, it would have been quite illegal for Babs to travel on taxpayer dime for partisan election work…its a felony.

Mary, I am having difficulties as well.

Mary 192 -

Very slow for me. Sometimes gives an error message and won’t load at all.

I see.

So getting rid of Boxer is now the new Crusade, since the Lieberman Matter is already settled. And Boxer has to go because she supports Holy Joe’s losing campaign, and everybody says she misstates Holy Joe’s position on reproductive choice and women’s health.

That she is one of only a handful of progressive Senators, and that she is a tenacious fighter for progressive causes in the Senate matters not at all. It’s all about Holy Joe, and her desire to see him win the Democratic nomination in Connecticut. She has to go.

Or maybe it does have something to do with Boxer’s Progressive cred and her tenacity. Maybe that’s why she has to go. Too dambed uppity?

The fact that she has mouthed off plenty to members of the regime, that she has challenged the liars and their lies, the fact that she has raised plenty of hell for them and vows to continue to, and the fact that she received the third highest vote total in the nation in 2004, is all reason for the other side to want her gone, but wouldn’t it be more fun, really, to have Dems take her out, rather than Rs?

Of course it would.

So yeah, let’s take her out. She’s just wrong after all. Let’s take her out in 2010 when she’s up for re-election. And let’s just leave DiFi be for this election, let her continue to support Bush and his cronies and make deals with Rs and vote against her constituents’ interests and keep the Middle East debacle going.

After all, DiFi isn’t campaigning for Holy Joe, though she loves him dearly.

Oh. And somebody upthread said Boxer voted FOR the excrement called “Bankruptcy Reform.” That’s a lie. Flat out. She voted AGAINST it.

Oddly enough, so did DiFi.

Dems who voted for it include:

Reid (NV)
Baucus (MT)
Bayh (IN)
Biden (MBNA)
Bingaman (NM)
Byrd (WV)
Carper (DE)
Conrad (ND)
Inouye (HI)
Johnson (SD)
Kohl (WI)
Landrieu (LA)
Lincoln (AK)
Nelson (FL)
Nelson (NE)
Salazar (CO)
Stabenow (MI)

Clinton (NY) did not vote

Quite a wall of shame.

Still, Boxer’s gotta go!

Boltin’ Joe is showing these folks, his friends and colleagues, that the so-called safe districts they’ve managed to redistrict themselves into aren’t so safe anymore. You can only push people so far before they start to push back. I’m still surprised it’s taken us so long to start shoving.

I participated in the CA redistricting that, for the first time, put all precinct information into a computer for the purposes of drawing safe districts, cramming in as many dems as possible, even if the districts were unwieldy.

After all the numbers were in the toobz, we’d amuse ourselves by creating districts that looked like our dogs, our exes, a tomato (for Steve Peace’s assembly district - remember Attack of the Killer Tomatoes? check this out

http://www.killertomatoes.com/.)

and still keep it a Dem district.

We were young and easily amused.

I couldn’t comment on last night’s late thread, was redirected to a YouTube link. I’m using Safari.

Mary 194; Ah! that makes sense; thank you. It was a very moving piece, glad you shared.

Mary & OldCoastie—me too.

PS Dru- if she was pragmatic, it might also have had something to do with the fact that Pakistan has nuclear access and tight ties in high places with terrorists. In a perfect world, you’d worry equally about all civilians you murder; in a notsoperfect world, you might worry even a smidge more when their country has people who already don’t like you and who have access to info and materials that can cause catastrophic damage.

Glad the loading thing isn’t just me - hope is means a gazillion people are following through on Christy’s call to arms and the youtube of rising star Maura and Boxer trying to defend a sheepish Leiberman, standing a few feet away and looking scared to say anything bc he might screw up. Esp with the cameras from some big guns around too.

Took over three hours to download youtube on this post. Worth the wait and unfortunate for Babs. ” I am not a strategist for this campaign.” lmao

DR @ 176:

Diane Feinstein is also a Senator from CA, and some of you guys are calling for a primary challenger against Barbara Boxer?

Get your priorities straight.

So Barbara Boxer has a blind spot for Holy Joe. It won’t matter after November.

Sure, by November, the bruise of Boxer’s support will have faded. But not my memory of what she did today. Sorry, I can’t buy into the battered wife mentality so popular in politics. Thus, I’ve withdrawn my support for anything Boxer does, says, etc. now and in the future.

Mary 192 - me, too, pokey. I thought it was my poor computer and the 112 degree days we’ve been having with no ac.

She’s my senator and I’m usually proud about that but not in this case. I’ve contacted her office a couple times about supporting Lieberman. I guess I’ll have to call her again!

Mary, did you notice a story last week (maybe linked at Raw Story) that the government took all of Hamdan’s own handwritten notes from him, arguing they needed them to investigate the suicides at guantanamo?

oh Mommybrain! 112 and no A/C?!? YIKES!

I thought this morning I might have to break out a sweater as it was only 86, but now we are back up to a balmy 106…

(couldn’t do it without the air conditioning, I’m afraid and am terrified of a blackout)

I’m a bit put off by the gloatiness and venom directed at Boxer.

It reminds me of the childish worshipfulness that turned a lot of people sour on the Dean campaign in 2003. “I’ll never support that man because of all the obnoxious idiots who are supporting him.” - anyone who was around SmirkingChimp.com in 2003 read that a hundred times. I think Dean’s supporters contributed to the “unhinged” meme that caused such absolute and instant implosion of Dean’s campaign the night of the Iowa caucuses, when Dean was captured in that horrible video we saw over and over and over some more for the next 3 weeks.

Making matters worse, MSM types and Lieberman campaign types can and do sniff around here. Anything unhinged-sounding can and will be used against Ned Lamont.

Such as pretty much this entire thread.

So I urge a bit of restraint among Ned’s supporters. We should think of ourselves as Ned’s representatives, because they CAN make us out to be. WE WANT NED LAMONT TO WIN THIS ELECTION! Let’s please be sure we are helping him, not hurting.

bobo

Mary thank you for linking to that article. Hard to hang my head in shame lower than it already is, but that did it. Very powerful and a must read, imho.

fwiw, I never want to hear a Democratic candidate support anything approaching Gitmo and our practices there as HoJo has. It’s as black and white an issue that the war is for me. The part in her talk about terrorists also struck a chord that resonates with me and is worth remembering. Thanks again; glad she is on the case.

(very sloooow connecting and refreshing here)

Mary @ 172

This probably wasn’t the most powerful or even most devastating part of the remarks. But it does explain why, even though Boxer has been a very good and strong support on many issues, she hasn’t earned a bye on supporting Sen. Leiberman.

You humble me. I agree with this. I am corrected.

I M @ 212 - while I’m disappointed in Boxer, (and believe there is more going on here than meets the eye), she still is the Senator I rely on…

eventually we will forgive but probably not forget… so, getting myself really angry is a likely a waste of energy…

ChePasa @200

After all, DiFi isn’t campaigning for Holy Joe, though she loves him dearly.

DiFi is up for reelection this year. The primary has already happened. It’s too late for a strong progressive candidate to oppose her from within the Dem party. I’m all for someone running against her in 2012.

Blog is slow loading for me today too.

And anyone else noticing the influx of Boxer concern trolls? Poor Babs, those mean bloggers are calling her names and taking her wubby!

Boxer is not a bad senator…but she is ignoring her constituents…just like Lieberman is doing.

I’m not saying Boxer has to go. But she has some explaining to do, that’s for sure.

Sorry I don’t see the original comment proposing Boxer should be replaced. I don’t like the character she reveals with her support of Joe at all and think the world may be better served by one with more integrity and resolve. As a former constituent of San Francisco I always thought such wonderful constituents should be represented by a genuine progressive. If not in California, where?
That said, DIFI should be the top Dem on the CA replacement list imho. So sorry I ever voted for her and found it extremly difficult at the time (even for Mayor). I wouldn’t welcome DIFI in AR, But would jump for joy over a Boxer in this climate.

new thread — Billary !

Christy at 140:

Thanks for that information about what staffers are permitted to discuss. I called back the San Diego office to get a name of a political advisor or contact. The staffer seemed like he hadn’t ever gotten that question before, and didn’t know any names himself. He ended up going to barbaraboxer.com, and PACforachange.com (both URLs resolve to the same website). Here is the link to the “Contact Us” page.

http://www.barbaraboxer.com/footerlinks?id=0002

I also mentioned firedoglake.com, and he visited the site while on the phone with me. His reaction was hard to read, but I sorta felt I had to apologize for the “Meltdown” headline so he would give it a serious look, and not assume it was a fringe-y site. You know, full of “angry far left libs”

Its all about the Incumbent Party!

I don’t read gloatiness here so much as giddiness that we, the ordinary people so often left out of the Beltway political calculus, are becoming more difficult to ignore.

If that turns off potential supporters for Ned, I don’t know what to tell you-because that, to me is the essence of this campaign.

…another impression of the conversation with the SD staffer: To provide a little context, I mentioned Lieberman’s statement as quoted in the NH Register, and was trying to find a polite way to describe it when he said that he “was well aware of what he (Lieberman) said, sir.” I may be overinterpreting his tone, but I wonder whether her staffers feel similarly on this topic. Assuming that they work for her because of their own and political views, they might not much like seeing her take this stand for Lieberman. It certainly is costing her some.

I see that there are others like me.

Citizens who think it’s past time to get rid of Boxer and Feinstein.

They are no more progressive Democrats than their ‘good friend and colleague’ ‘Rape Gurney’ Joe is.

For those who still don’t get it here is an exercise for ya. The next time you see either one of these ‘corporate dems’ estimate how much the clothes they are wearing cost.

If your a guy and don’t have a clue get a female friend to help.

Res Ipsa Loquitor…

OldCoastie –

I guess you are correct about California — but, but … I heard everyone who WORKED was leaving CA — for the South. Funny how that line works, isn’t it? CA is still the … something like 7th in the WORLD … on size of economy.

But yeah — everyone is leaving CA. LOL

Yo Bobo! I’m a constituent of Boxer and I’m not ‘gloating’.

I’m pissed. Really, really pissed off at the arrogance of this woman and what it tells us about the ‘culture’ of D.C.

If you think your ‘let’s not give the ReThugs ammunition’ argument holds water you have not been paying attention. They make up whatever they need in that regard.

So, I find you argument specious and not very progressive at all.

And I’m not about to STFU at your request or anybody else’s.

‘Nother point: this thread is turning a joint appearance in a @%^*!% closed candy store into a major campaign event for Joe.

The time for giddiness is August 9. The time for sorting out how we feel about Boxer is 2008.

Please let’s calm down, stop the high-fiving over how our side “got” Boxer, bury the Boxer films, and focus on winning the election. There’s a primary coming up.

bobo

I liked the oversized bouncer who at the end morphed into a stand up comic thanking the crowd for their attendance at his comedy act. After the door was closed I’m sure the talent agent asked boxer and hojo….., “Say, that was great. What’s the name of your act.” And they answered, “We call our act The Aristocrats.”

Peace,

CTBob, you are my hero!

YOU ARE A LIVING GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The fact that Boxer is stumping for HoJo indicates that she either has lost touch with her supporters or is involved in some kind of political machination. Either way it doesn’t look pretty. I don’t want to bring Boxer down; she’s been one of the better senators. But she must be made to realize she’s made a huge mistake. She’s really pissed off her core supporters without gaining any new ones.

This was not the Barbara Boxer I saw at Yearlykos in Nevada. Sad, really sad, to see a very good Democratic senator spend all so much political capital, only to end up short changed.

Holy Joe isn’t just a sanctimonious sleaze, he’s a coward.

These politicians aren’t ready for what’s about to hit them this political season. It’s as if they think they can bullshit their way through this and those days are over, I would say.

My sense of BoBox and BigDawg is that they may be trying to cut a deal with JoMo is they support him in the primaries and he loses handily he will not run as an indy and support the dem candidate.

I can’t see them support Joe as ann indy so this may be the end of their support for him as a democrap.

If BoBox the flaming libral can’t swing this for JoMo and Big Dawg.. he should read the handwriting on the wall… CT dems do not want him to represent them… and go away and spend more time in shool.

I would be really suprized if dems campaign for JoMo if he runs as an indy. If they do… perhaps the idea of the democratic party representing the people needs to be reconsidered.

The most telling comment was from the heavy-set guy at the end who stopped the reporters from following up the tunnel:

“We’re done.” Yeah, in more ways than you think!

kb.

weeder - I did not see that re: Hamdan. I had seen some general pieces about several detainees having to turn over writings and I think they were taking notes from lawyers as well? There was some allegation that there had been a conspiracy to die.

Hmmm - this is interesting. I email my reps all the time about stuff, and I get back the usual carefully nuanced form letters depending on the topic.

I just received this email:

Dear Leslie in CA:

I have forwarded your email to the appropriate campaign committee for response.

Sincerely,

Dan Hammer

Correspondence Director

U.S. Senator Barbara Boxer

Since my original message is not included, I can’t be sure what this is alluding to, but it’s clearly an individual response, which I’ve never gotten before.

The only thing I can think is that this has something to do with the fairly lengthy email I sent her about her campaigning for Joe. It will be very interesting to see if I hear anything further from them. Maybe Boxer is taking the criticisms more seriously than we think?

LOOK what JUST arrived in my Inbox!

Dear Ms.

I have forwarded your email to the appropriate campaign committee for response.

Sincerely,
Dan Hammer
Correspondence Director
U.S. Senator Barbara Boxer

Too little. Too late.

Personally, I’m amazed to see ol’ Joe actually in the presence of another Democrat, and not his usual Republican buddies.

In a way it’s telling that at least Boxer sticks up for one of her party colleagues. When was the last time ol’ Joe stuck up for one of his?

Boxer. don’t walk into dog poop ith your eyes wide shut.

Even, my Lab knows not to retrieve an anus.

I’m not certain where anyone got the impression that either I or Jane was calling for Boxer to be replaced. Because we haven’t. What we would like, however, is a coherent explanation as to why she is supporting Joe Lieberman’s candidacy since the positions that he has taken on a number of important issues have been at odds not just with Barbara Boxer’s stated positions, but often with the Democratic Party at large.

And, we’d like Ms. Boxer, as well as other Democratic officials, to pledge to support the winner of the Democratic primary in CT — you know, support the will of the Democrats in Connecticut who will be casting their ballots. Whomever wins. Because that is called representative government — and Joe Lieberman is trying to cheat his way around the primary system, and ought not be rewarded for his craven grab at power.

And, just for kicks, we’d like the will and the voice of the voters — in CT and all over this nation of ours — to be listened to by our elected officials, instead of dismissed as something which goes against the incumbancy protection racket. I do not think it is too much to expect the same character from our Senators and our Representatives in the House that we would require from ourselves or our children.

So for every person who is coming here to gripe about anyone asking questions of Barbara Boxer (or Chuck Schumer or anyone else for that matter), I say this: THEY work for US, not the other way around. The sooner you and they get used to it, the better, because we are no longer going to sit still with a pat on the head and hope for the best. That’s what got us George Bush and, frankly, I’ve had enough.

Leslie @237 and veruca @239

Just got the very same e-mail from Barbara Boxer’s office.
Wow, this is a strange message, and sent to us (I guess hundreds of us, according to the San Jose Mercury) AFTER her appearance at the very same event we all asked her to reconsider.

Shell 180

What happened was Ronald Reagan got elected Governor in ‘68. California Politics have been an embarassment ever since.

btw as much as I love Maxine Waters, she would get creamed in a senatorial election.

correction
Leslie @238

Sonoma –

I believe you, BUT … I moved to CA in 1975 and it didn’t SEEM that way then. But come to think of it, when I had only been here about 2 years, the horrid Proposition 13 to gut taxes for homeowners was on the ballot. I think you are correct. Time to get CA back to its rightful place as a progressive state.

And I agree with you about Maxine — in addition to her politics, she is black. The nuts can’t have THAT, can they?

I am very pro-Boxer. What I saw on this video was very disappointing but she has accumulated too much political capital in the past for me to disown her based on this one bad decision.

I can only assume that those who are ready to throw her under the bus weren’t as big fans as I was in the first place. And elections bring out people’s passions. That’s perfectly fine, but I hope at the end of the day she gets judged on her whole body of work.

I am also very pro-Maura, by the way. Keep up the good work!

Boxer is well on her way to becoming Feinstein and Feinstein is on her way to being a Republican.

What the heck is Boxer doing with her hands when she is speaking? clenching her fists to her chest?

Steve @ 248:

I can only assume that those who are ready to throw her under the bus weren’t as big fans as I was in the first place.

That’s where you would be so very wrong. When it was announced that Senator Boxer was going to campaign for Leiberman, I was shocked and horrified. I didn’t want to believe it. I wrote her a letter, pleading for her to reconsider. I told her the truth: I told her that she was someone that I thought of as a hero and a role model. I made everyone I know contribute money to buy her roses. Now, I am taking a lot of heat for coming out against her from friends and family. I know I have a tendency to be way too idealistic but at the end of the day it’s honor and integrity that mean the most to me. The way Boxer acted today just kind of sealed this feeling for me. I feel embarrassed that she is my representative and that I was so blind before. I am questioning my own judgment. I am ashamed.

Boxer is my senator also. Why B, why? The Establishment or Principle; what’s it going to be Senator?

The anti-Boxer mentality around here is often like that of a very nasty mob. The personal insults and the calls for her removal (read the thread if you missed them, or don’t) are ridiculous and self-defeating in the extreme, but yes, passions are high, and anyone who says Joe’s OK with them is gonna get slimed.

Joe is not OK with me, but I’m not in Connecticut, so I can have only the most peripheral influence on the outcome at best.

Barbara can take on a whole roomful of punks and win, I’ve seen her do it, so I’m not concerned about her ability to match wits with the best. She’s quite capable.

I doubt she will be able to give any of you the answer you want, however.

So.

Trash her all you want. It’s not going to do a bit of good in the larger scheme and it may well set back the cause of genuine progressive reform.

And please leave DiFi alone. Don’t question her. Don’t denounce her positions. Don’t ruffle her perfect coif.

I really do hope that after the CT primary Barbara does take some of you on one on one or in batches. And I hope she shows you exactly what she can do.

ChePasa at 253 — I’d love it. She already tried it with Jane at YKos, and it didn’t go so well.

Perhaps you should knock that sanctimonious chip off your shoulder and realize that most of us want the Barbara that we all love — not the sell-out Barbara who is subletting her own principles for a hack like Lieberman.

But if Barbara Boxer wants to come on FDL and explain her rationale, we’d love to have her. Any time. Unedited, unfiltered, whatever. We only want the best of and for her — and shilling for Joe Lieberman? Not a bright, shining moment. If you can’t even admit that to yourself, then you should ask if you are talking as someone interested in politics or as a fanboy or fangirl — because reality sometimes comes in a whole lot of shades of gray that you aren’t even bothering to admit exist. And being honest with someone that you have cared about when they are making a huge mistake is a what you do when you care. Otherwise, you are simply a sycophantic echo chamber, and look how well that is working for both Bush and Lieberman…

I think Bob and Maura are the Heros of the Day. If Barbara Boxer had an IOU to Joe and is paying up, thats the nasty thing about IOU’s you never get to chose when they get called in. But as the sayin goes you lay down with dogs you get up with fleas.

[ Moderator: we do not make such remarks about dogs in this blog! In fact, dog is our middle name.]

was she actually trying to say that if there was a hospital “next door” that…something….

aww fuckit.

You call that a meltdown? Looked to me like an attempt to answer a question from some rude reporters to a very complicated issue.

Im very pro-choice. Hell, even call me pro-abortion if you want, and I understand how complicated this issue is. You want women to have choice, but you dont want to force people (hospitals, doctors) to perform abortions if that goes against their religious beliefs.

Id say rape victims shouldnt be taken to those hospitals in the first place, if poossible; They should lose public funding if they dont change the policy; Planned Parenthood should recieve extra state funding; Somehow you should work out care for victims in an emergency situation where they cant wait or be movied if they need an abortion and end up in a catholic hospital, Plan B should be over-the-counter…. I would do everything I could though to avoid forcing a catholic hospital to perform an abortion. I think Lieberman is correct.

And this is taking one statement out of context and blowing it out of proportion. Sometimes you cant come up with the right words to say exactly how you feel. Thats what happened here. Lieberman’s comment sounded harsh, but he didnt mean it that way.

DigDug :: Liebermans remarks came up precisely during discussion of public funding of hospitals but where Plan B would have to be administered if requested. Holy Joe thought the Catholic hospitals should get the cash but send the ladies on a long walk (or ride) to get Plan B.

[note to self: why cant the LieberLiars send better trolls?]

DigDug at 257 — Plan B does not cause an abortion. It prevents an egg from being released during ovulation — it’s emergency birth control. And if the rape has occurred close to ovulation, every second counts. As someone who was raped and, mercifully, did not get pregnant, but spent two longs weeks praying that I wouldn’t be…every extra second that you have to endure the terror and anguish and everything else that goes along with a violent, brutal rape…is a second too many.

And if neither you nor Joe Lieberman can see that, then you must be one of the lucky people who doesn’t know anyone who has ever had to survive that kind of physical and emotional violation.

Hmm, I’m thinking Deborah Bowen in 2010.

Boxer, Feinstein, and Pelosi are all part of the club now. Maybe if the state dems didn’t consistently send NoCal millionaires to DC they wouldn’t be disappointed.

Wow. Excellent work by the two citizen “reporters.” They were polite throughout, but still weren’t pushovers. I’ve seen countless “professional” journalists never be able to do that.

Jumpin’ Joe at the end: “You not gonna stop!” No he’s not. And either are we. Don’t know what Maura and CT Bob do for day jobs, but the press certainly could use more people like you. Thanks again for the efforts and hopefully you’ll rub off on the plastic TV people that gather around these events as well.

This is the “journalism” of the future. Plain citizens bringing their video cameras to political events and asking “real” questions in a polite way. The traditional media has to play by some rules which apparently means having to pander to politicians and cover for them by not asking real questions. Joe Lieberman cannot believe that a journalist would not “give up” asking real questions. Real questions that he does not want to answer. Grow up politicians! The days of excluding citizens is over!

Send your sentiments to Sen. Barbara Boxer.

http://boxer.senate.gov/contact/email/policy.cfm

Barbara “Go To The Hospital Next Door” Boxer.

Christy @ 243 and Jane if you’re listening,

FDL & friends went to a 3rd rate campaign event held in a closed candy store, and conducted an intrusive interview of Boxer that tried to get her to express disagreement with Joe. She denied there was any disagreement, said you misinterpreted Joe’s remark, and offered a different interpretation, which you failed to effectively refute. She won the exchange, our side lost. But you put the film up on your blog anyway.

I’ll say one thing, it is the perfect campaign film. For Joe Lieberman. It shows Boxer deftly swatting aside unwanted questions. It shows Boxer sticking up for Joe. It shows Boxer offering a relatively innocuous explanation for Joe’s abhorrent statement defending the religious right’s wish to impose their twisted morality on any rape victims they happen to get their hands on.

Seriously (I’m not playing to an audience because they’ve all moved on) do you really want this film in circulation???

I’ll shut up now,
bobo

“Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold,” Yeats wrote. “Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world … The best lack all conviction, while the worst Are full of passionate intensity.”
***********************************

Maybe Yeats was wrong. Maybe the worst lack all conviction. Maybe the best are full of passionate intensity. No?

Bobby St. Chomsky @ 267:

I’m still in awe of your previous (The Aristocrats!) comment.

its disturbing to see Boarbara Boxer be so dismissive of the truth….and she keeps asking the same people she is now working against to continue to pour money into HER PAC.

“…most of us want the Barbara that we all love — not the sell-out Barbara who is subletting her own principles for a hack like Lieberman.

Talk about “sanctimonious.” Ha. If she isn’t just the way you want her, all the time, burn her.

You and Boxer disagree over Holy Joe, and you’re trying to take it to the mat — with her — while she’s doing her thing, her way. You really don’t like it, so some people around here want her out, o - u - t out, and that would please the Rs just fine, wouldn’t it? They hate her mouthy, uppity self, and you know it.

And though you talk trash (”Meltdown! Clueless! Idiot!”), what’s the point of it?

You want her to explain herself? Well, why don’t you get that big fat honking chip off your own shoulder and listen to what she says?

You’re maybe not gonna like it.

But… so… ? We’re all grown ups, aren’t we? And we can disagree about some things, can’t we?

I wrote Boxer as soon as I’d heard she was going to endorse Lieberman. (By the way, I guess I’ve discovered I’m an anti-Semitic Jew all of a sudden). I told her she’d been one of my heros but that she’d lost my respect for supporting him given his support of Bush, his labelling anti-war Dems supporters of terrorism, and his abortion stance.

And may I suggest…..Shmoe-Mentum

“I almost shit myself.” -CTBob

Gold.

Stumbled on here. Am pleasantly surprised at how many astute dems there are and we still have Bushism.
RE Lieberman, he supports Israel more than he does US. Boxer is an enigma.But probably tit for tat

Excacty, Franco: they are replaceable. They’re lightbulbs in a marquee and nothing more.
That’s precisely the point they fail to see. They’re both thinking exclusively of losing his precious connections, influence and positions on committees, and NOT on the core fact that they themselves are inherently replaceable by design. The elite DC chess club is only illusion; if they ever stop doing the people’s business, if they betray their constituency, then they are GONE with Monday’s garbage. In a democracy, rejection is the cost of betrayal. It’s a lesson they and everyone else in DC should be reminded of every mother****ing day.
The biggest, loudest, most aggressive action I’ve seen from Pelosi to date was the protest against the FBI office search; again, a manuver to protect the principle of privilege. This trend is really disturbing. Now for Boxer to even waste precious political time and influence to rescue this vichy ass is deeply insulting. We’ve got ENORMOUS problems in this country which are far more important that saving this one cork-spoiled Pinot Noir from the Titanic’s wine hold.

wow. YouTube is immediate and contextual and provides the ability to get direct quotes out to netusers so quickly the politicians don’t have time to spin or get their stories straight with their handlers before replying and looking like idiots.
Barbara is my Senator too, and she’s clearly WRONG when she talks about the Short Ride.
We got us a mess of money talking, thru Barbara, Hillary and Joe. We know Money Talks.

We don’t want to listen to money. We want to listen to reason. At least I don’t want to listen to money. I want dems with guts too. Boxer’s one gutsy person, but she’s on the wrong side now.

troll

squiddy @ 274:

if they ever stop doing the people’s business, if they betray their constituency, then they are GONE with Monday’s garbage.

That is one of the things that has bothered me the most. (Above and beyond the 32 things): Lieberman’s belief that it is okay to agree to disagree with the majority of his constituents.

Well her questions aren’t damned “heroic.” They are, however, admirable and useful for increasing the knowledge base.

BOBO –

“OUR” side lost? You are not on MY side, child. Now, go do your homework.

Folks what more evidence do you need?Don’t give your support to Boxer the next time around.She gets our money then she runs off and supports JoeMO.Is your contributions being used properly ? I am sure we can get a capable Dem who will support our cause. forget Boxer.

Has anyone read Tom Hayden’s article on his experience(s)with the powerful Israeli lobby? I’m surprised no one has made this connection between Boxer and Lieberman.

Does anyone else think that it diminishes the credibility of an otherwise important piece of film to keep the camera running while this guy says, “I almost shit myself”? I mean, if I wanted to show this video to anyone who was undecided about Lieberman, or anyone outside the little blogoverse or whatever we’re calling it, they would certainly remember the last few seconds. Why leave it in there? This is exactly the kind of thing that drives people away from those “internet wackos.”

Common sense. Come on.

Joe L was the first to suggest going to war with Iraq which has impowered Iran & virtually given them controle of Iraq The drug plan that gives money to insurance & drug companys. He has got to go.

Che Pasa is one of those people who goes to other blogs and makes a pretty big point of trashing other blogs, especially FDL.

Just so you know.

Boxer,

I am by no means a single issue voter. If you don’t support a woman’s reproductive rights and a woman’s right to privacy, then you don’t support it. But please don’t tell lies to cover up Liebermans’s shameful record of being anti-choice and anti-woman. The voters of California and the voters of Connecticut are smart enough to know that Lieberman said what he said and meant what he said. You are not helping anyone by lying in order to smooth over his comments and make Lieberman seem more appealing to voters. Either people will vote for him or they won’t, but don’t try to slither your way into Connecticut and confuse people with lies. I’m sure you and whatever intern reading this letter know exactly what lies I’m talking about at the Candy store where you cowardly dodged the simple questions of a few bloggers and reporters.

You are fast losing my vote. I’d rather you not reply to this message at all than reply with a prewritten form letter. That will gaurantee that you lose my vote.

“Im very pro-choice. Hell, even call me pro-abortion if you want, and I understand how complicated this issue is. You want women to have choice, but you dont want to force people (hospitals, doctors) to perform abortions if that goes against their religious beliefs.”

DigDug: Plan B is not abortion. It’s a medical prescription and pharmacists should NOT have the right to refuse to fill it based on personal beliefs.

Boxer has just lost my support.

AFAIC Boxer has been a hero… out on skinny branches, all by herself, again & again on issues that mattered. W’s Supe nominees, Bolton, Enron/Ca. Energy Ripoff, NSA shit, Ashcroft…

Over and over, since W’s junta began, I’ve watched her speak passionately and consisely on issues that matter. Also watched her get beat up unmercilessly by wingers for doing so.

I have highest regard for Barbara Boxer. Right up there w/Howard Dean, Feingold and possible a couple other dem lawmakers. She’s a fighter, she’s got guts, and she’s principled.

I hope Lieberman gets his ass kicked… no use for him whatsoever. If Barbara has her reasons for supporting him, I disagree. But she’s earned the right (and much more) to so express herself and at the very least get polite disagreement from the progressive community. Especially a hi-profile site like FDL, IMO does a disservice and commits disloyalty giving place for Boxer bashing. She deserves a lot better.

If Dem minority was Boxer clones, we’d be in hell’uva lot better shape today. God Bless Barbara Boxer.

These two ordinary citizens show up where the canidates are and ask the tough (Nerve racking im sure….bravo) questions that all of us including me just rant about on blogs and comment sites. We should all be ashamed, and aspire to be more like these two and probably others we are not aware of.Anytime one of these liars does a meet and greet with we the people, WE THE PEOPLE should get in thier face and ask them as the cams are rolling about issues they always skirt.I fully believe that guerilla ambush tactics like this are what its going to take for them to be seen by joe public for who they really are. Keep up the fight everybody and Im gonna buy a camera tomorrow and seek out the liars here in Michigan. Peace

frist! and first nonetheless!!!

JDM writes:

If Barbara has her reasons for supporting him, I disagree. But she’s earned the right (and much more) to so express herself and at the very least get polite disagreement from the progressive community. Especially a hi-profile site like FDL, IMO does a disservice and commits disloyalty giving place for Boxer bashing. She deserves a lot better.

If progressives followed your logic, then we’d all be voting for Lieberman. No politician deserves a pass when they screw their constituents over, particularly Democrats. If I had been the one questioning Boxer I would have said, “How dare you answer your supporters’ legitimate concerns with such BS! We’re not some group of Ralph Reed supporters placated with pretty speeches about freedom and the 10 commandments. For goodness sake, treat us with a little more respect than that.”

The only explanation I can come up with for Boxer’s support of Lieberman is that she’s politically ambitious and, like all the other Democrat clones, she’s bought into myth that Republican-light policy trumps progressive policy on the national stage. For these kinds of politicians it’s all about achieving the office rather than making a case about policy or direction. Stupid. Even if Boxer became, say, the President she’d be mired in GOP engineered government shutdowns and bfuscation from day one. What good is an office if your policies are swinging in the wind and largely irrelevant? Take a look at the most popular and successful Democrats. They got into office with platforms people believed in; they didn’t make up some “vision thing” after they assumed an office. Social and economic movements articulated and made popular by activists and politicians make successful political offices. Popular and intelligent policy ideas guard politicians, in large part, against brutal political attacks. Until Democrats figure this out, they’ll continue to be frustrated and continue to lose.

ALl politicians are politically ambitious, and will support whatever they need to do in order to get re-elected.

Both major parties in this country are full of members with this attitude.

I don’t know why this suprises anyone anymore.

On another note, however, not every politician should be forced to fit under the ‘entire’ umbrella of one party either. Everyone should be an individual and be able to think for themselves and not have to follow a party platform 100% of the time. It becomes like a herd of sheep at that point.

Just expanding on ChePasa’s response to Subway Serenade:

Boxer voted against, not for the bankruptcy deformity.

Boxer and Lieberman have teamed up to do a lot of good things, unfortunately it’s time for Joe to Go.

Fighting against Boxer now would be cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Wow! I finally got to see this vid.

“I just shit myself.”

Classic, classic, classic.

I imagine that by now, Joe and Babs are shitting, too.

Dude… if you think Boxer’s comments to Maura were “rude,” then us Dems REALLY don’t stand a chance against the Repuks attack machine that’ll be in full force come November as it was in 2000 as it was in 2002 as it was in 2004! Let’s stand up and get a SPINE for a change. I’m NOOOOOO fan of Lamont, who has no spine (see his performance in the debate), but definitely am for electing solid, hard fighting Democrats!

I’ve made very clear here and elsewhere that I think Jane’s (and other bloggers’) attacks on Barbara Boxer are wrong and counterproductive. Some of the anti-Boxer hysteria I’ve seen here on this thread is foul and disgusting and could threaten any progressive reform in the future.

Some folks don’t like to hear it.

Boxer is one of the best friends — actually, one of the only friends — progressives have in the Senate. Attacking her for her support of Lieberman may feel good right now, but we’re in a much bigger battle over the long term, and she has been one of our biggest champions. We have very few of those in office, you may (or may not) have noticed.

Christy and Jane have said that they aren’t trying to get her out of the Senate or silence her strong voice in opposition to the regime, they are merely criticizing her support of Lieberman in this primary season.

Unfortuately, their criticism has led to a wide range of irresponsible and deeply offensive (not to mention erroneous) charges against Boxer and calls for her removal from office (right here in this thread and elsewhere).

I think that’s shit.

Maura & CTBob, you rock!

Eva

Boxer is one of the best friends — actually, one of the only friends — progressives have in the Senate

As the old saying goes, with friends like her, who needs enemies?

Boxer talked about Lieberman getting an endorsement from Voters for Choice, which I’m pretty sure is no longer in operation.

Is she saying that Lieberman should be re-elected because now-defunct pro-Choice organizations (once) liked him?

“Unfortuately, their criticism has led to a wide range of irresponsible and deeply offensive (not to mention erroneous) charges against Boxer and calls for her removal from office (right here in this thread and elsewhere).”

I haven’t read all the posts in this thread, but I’ll just assume there are some offensive ones. Fair enough. However, if progressives don’t begin to hold politicians accountable for their actions, then we might as well fold up the tent and go home. There is simply no excuse for Boxer’s support of Lieberman. So many progressives have devoted their time and treasure to throwing out a truly awful politician in Joe Lieberman. They’ve moved the country and the Democratic party forward. It’s a huge setback to discover Barbara Boxer, of all people, shitting all over that. I don’t see anything wrong with giving her an earful or even sending her packing if she continues down the road she’s on.

I don’t see anything wrong with giving her an earful or even sending her packing if she continues down the road she’s on.

And what road is that? You cannot demonstrate by reference to her votes in the Senate that she is on any “non-progressive” road at all. And that’s what matters, not whether or not you agree with her support of Holy Joe Lieberman. I don’t agree with her support of Holy Joe, but I’m not going to throw her under the bus over it, nor, I will wager, will most Californians — if they gave a flying hoo-hah in any case. Which, I can guarantee most do not.

And yet there are folks on this thread who want her gone. You imply she should go if she stays on this “road.” What road? Why?

Why slime and disparage her, falsely accuse her, get worked up into a lather over her “cluelessness” and “mistatements”, become indignant when her Senatorial office will not respond to the outrage of constituents over her support of Lieberman, and so on? I’m not saying that you personally do this, and Christy and Jane specifically disavow any intention on their part to do it, but by golly, this counterproductive behavior infests this and every other anti-Boxer thread I’ve seen here and on other sites like head lice.

Why?

She’s not up for reelection till 2010, and by then she may want to retire, or the Senate may be abolished, or who knows what all might happen. And we can be pretty sure that the fulminations against her are of little consequence to her now.

But what’s the upshot? Why is any supposed “progressive” chopping wood and carrying water for those who really do want her out of office: Republicans?

And that’s what I see happening, all these furious attacks on her by supposed “progressives” serve only the interests of the Republicans in the long run. They are the only ones who benefit from Democrats and progressives attacking their own.

Barbara is not “shitting all over” anything. There is a fundamental disagreement over her support for Joe Lieberman; it’s a disagreement, pure and simple, and rational people try to solve disagreements rationally — or they let them go.

Boxer voted to give Bush war power to invade Iraq. Call her a cloth coat Repubican.

Boxer famously voted against the War Resolution — DiFi supported it. Call tpx an uninformed agitator.

Boxer voted to give Bush war power to invade Iraq.

Oh she did, did she? My mistake.

Oh, but what’s this I see: the Senate vote on HJ 114!
(Otherwise known as the Iraq War Resolution) and would you look at this:

She voted NAY.

And lookee here:

Senator Feinstein voted YEA

Enough of your foolishness.

Senate IWR vote

This is just one example of the kinds of false accusations that seem to creep into every anti-Boxer thread. Funny how that works, eh?

Dear Che Pasa,

I get your passion and upset in your posts, but you are not yet reaching me.

If you truly want to have a positive influence here and get posters to get your perspective, which I believe you do, I suggest you experiment with putting more attention on modeling what you are talking about.

You ask:

“Why slime and disparage Boxer, falsely accuse her, get worked up into a lather over her cluelessness and mistatements?”.

I would ask you:

“Why slime and disparage the passioniate expressions that are here?”

You write about your concern about all the “attacks” on this thread, and yet your posts, to me personally, read as the most attacking of all.

I feel talked at rather than talked with in your posts. If inaccuracies are posted on this thread, I would request that you respectfully point them out.

You would gain credibility for me if you were in ownership that you yourself are “getting worked up into a lather” here. I, myself, love the passion that is here. It gives me great hope.

You want “rational dicussion”. Show us what they looks like. Lead us. Be the change you want to see.

You seem to suggest that many are polarizing against Boxer here, but are you not polarizing against us in these comments?

You write: “This counterproductive behavior infests this and every other anti-Boxer thread I’ve seen here and on other sites like head lice.”

For me, this is the most productive and positive and encouraging thread I have read for a long time. It is total Good News!

Can you treat my perspective with the same respect and that you want us to show to Boxer?

Michael T,

Re: Your post at 306

I have no respect whatsoever for anyone who falsely accuses and disparages a fighter like Barbara Boxer. You see the accusation dismissed in the posts above your own? Well, page through the thread, and you’ll find plenty of that sort of thing, and it is nauseating, disreputable, and deeply offensive, and no, I will not respect it or anyone who posts garbage like that.

I wish some of the passion directed against Boxer here (and elsewhere where she is being attacked on so-called progressive blogs) was being directed at Republicans — or at Vichy Dems — like Diane Feinstein who deserve it, but no.

Nobody wants to do that, they want to make up some sort of fight with Boxer, deny her cred as a progressive, get her out of office and falsely accuse her. All because of her support of Lieberman.

DiFi supports Lieberman, too!

Quite likely we will continue to talk past one another on this issue, because I believe it is fundamentally important to identify and support your real friends on the key issues. Barbara is our friend on most issues. And I am defending her. Not that she needs me to, she’s quite capable of doing it on her own.

Let me put it to you this way: How does trashing Boxer and lying about Boxer and calling her names do anything to unseat Lieberman? In my view, it doesn’t do anything to help Lamont, but it could do a great deal of damage to Barbara.

Now who benefits from that?

Not progressives.

Che Pasa:

“And what road is that? You cannot demonstrate by reference to her votes in the Senate that she is on any “non-progressive” road at all. And that’s what matters, not whether or not you agree with her support of Holy Joe Lieberman.”

I think it’s pretty clear what road she’s on. She’s travelled to CT as a token lefty to provide a kind of liberal legitimacy to Lieberman. It’s nauseating to see her sell out whatever principles she’s stood for in the past to help a sycophant of the “unitary executive” get re-elected. Sure she has a voting record I’m grateful for, but that doesn’t amount to much when she’s essentially complicit in torpedoing one of strongest grassroots movements to involve Democrats in their political system. Her support for Lieberman puts her on a road completely at odds with the people who’ve done more for the Democrats at this time than anybody, namely us. It’s another betrayal in a long list of them and it’s time we starting holding these representatives accountable.

“Senator, if you’re not thinking abiout what happens after the Primary, why are you collecting signatures?”

Exactly. That’s a great question that Joementum simply can’t answer.

Che Pasa @ 296/305/307:

fully agree… exactly what I would’ve said.

Michael T. @ 306:

I would ask you:

“Why slime and disparage the passioniate expressions that are here?”

Because “passionate expressions” alone are nothing more than that, and in this case most of ‘em false (lot of misrepresentations here on Boxer’s voting record).

We’ve had 5 years now of “passionate expressions”, yet if anything W’ & co. more emboldened than ever. News of just lack week alone floors me.

Given almost full time effort by good porting of net-roots blogoshpere working to get good dems elected, sliming our currently elected elite really sucks… not only plays into hands of Limbaugh type charactarizations of “liberals”, but sadly I’d agree with ‘em in this case.

Firstly we need people w/their principles in the right place, and 2ndly people who stand & act on the former. Currently, such meaningful dem representation is nearly void.

Boxer is one of few shining lights.

I’m rather disappointed FDL moderators have not intervened to clarify here.

If the supposedly most liberal of states can’t have true blue liberals as its Senators, then what hope is there?

I always thought of Boxer as the more principled Democrat. I guess both her and Feinstein are not worthy.

Boxer, you live or die politically on strength of character. You’ve lost so much with this endorsement that you’ll probably lose next time you’re up for reelection, regardless of your big money contributors.

“Firstly we need people w/their principles in the right place, and secondly people who stand & act on the former. Currently, such meaningful dem representation is nearly void.”

I would totally agree with this! And such a person has come along who fits your qualifications. His name is Ned Lamont.

And yet your “shinning light” is campaigning for a man who does have have his principles in the right place and who is not acting on them.

For me the true shinning light is one who has the courage to step outside the box and support other shinning lights.

I totally get and understand and appreciate the outrage that has been expressed here. It is healthy and invogorating.

It is time for all of us, in my opinion, to start to hold a higher standard.

Of course, I appreciate Boxer’s great votes and courage in specific situations. I do not doubt her qualifications as a Progressive and I have not seen others do that here either.

Yet, her active support of a very pro-war candidate, does not work for me, and I am going to speak up about that.

Where you see danger, I see opportunity.