
What is it with "journalists" named Bob who don’t understand what it means to BE a journalist? According to the NYTimes, the AP, CNN, and Bob Novak himself, Karl Rove and Bill Harlow were two people with whom he spoke about Valerie Plame Wilson.
Well, duh!
How long have we known both those breaking news facts? For-ev-ah! But the real news nugget — his initial source for the information? Nada, zip, zero. Guess he’s been taking lessons from the Booby Woodward School of Journamalismnessdom (via Jane):
So the list of suspects becomes much longer now that we know the date that Woodward first talked to his source, and stretches from Cheney’s office to Rove, WHIG and the rest of the Bushbots.
KING: What would you have done if the source had said, "Don’t tell him," and you were subpoenaed to deposition? Would you refuse?WOODWARD: That is a situation I have not had to deal with in this case. But of course, when I went into my aggressive reporting mode, I didn’t know exactly what was going to happen.
Now, if I hadn’t done that, and the source had said, "Keep quiet; it’s confidential," then the special counsel in this case, Fitzgerald, wouldn’t have known, I guess, and I would have stayed out of it.
Right, Bob. Scooter Libby’s being charged with perjury because he said he thought he told reporters he had heard it from other reporters, even though the reporter he says he thought he heard it from (Russert) says he didn’t. So Woodward’s notes say that he might have asked Libby about Plame, and this on June 23, possibly before he talked to any reporter and certainly any other than Judy Miller that we know of.
What, exactly, are the chances that Libby’s lawyers are not gonna subpoena the only journalist who potentially told him about Plame’s identity? Bobby’s secret would have come out one way or the other, if Scooter is planning any sort of defense short of insanity. And I’ll bet that’s how Bob twisted Mr. "X’s" arm, which it sounds like he most assuredly did, journalistic privilege be damned.
So, what we have here is Bob Novak, doing the same damn thing. Willing to spill all the beans to Pat Fitzgerald, journalistic privilege be damned, and from what sounds like pretty early on in the case — with Fitzgerald already knowing who his sources were from the get go (Hmmm…anyone else having a moment of respect for the FBI agents that did the digging on this…very impressive.).
But trying to spin this as something else entirely: in Novak’s case, he’s trying to cover some Administration ass by going back to their "it was about the trip being a boondoggle" malarky. (And where have we heard that before? Oh yeah, on that annotated article in Dick Cheney’s handwriting…) Hello, Bob, you don’t just casually drop the CIA into conversation with a partisan journalist, no matter what Booby Woodward may have told you at a cocktail weenie party.
And remember that whole weird "my source and Woodward’s source are the same" stuff?
But does Novak actually report any of this information on original sources or what his testimony was or anything remotely new or useful to the public, after already having spoken with Fitzgerald, the FBI, Fitz’s team, and the grand jury? Hell no!
And since Novak thinks it was all about a trip and all, oughtn’t he just report everything, sinc it’s no big deal? And haven’t we already been down this tedious lack of logic road with Woodward? Yeah, I thought so. This almost makes one long for the Judy Martyrdom Road Show — at least she was a little more dramatic and inventive and there was that odd, tete-a-tete with Scoots for breakky. (Almost, but not really. Now I’m queasy.)
Emptywheel has a fantastic piece of analysis on the he said, he said aspects of all of this. And Swopa asks what may be the most important questions of all — one that I would LUV to see someone ask Novak with the microphones on: "Who was the first person to tell him that Joe Wilson’s wife worked for the CIA? Did he know this when he spoke to his supposed "primary source"?"
Oh yeah, baby — now THAT would be some juicy news. If you could get an answer before he stormed off the set, that is.




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fitz
Some good Joe here;
http://observer.com/20060717/2…..onason.asp
Did Novak spell her name Valeria? (Sorry if I’m not getting the joke).
Cujo — it’s a typo. I’ll fix it.
I assume Novak is trying to lay the ground work for Bush not reappointing Fitzgerald or issuing a pardon.
Even Scarborough ain’t buying:
what’s the frequency, Bobbeth?
I’m a one trick pony on this: The only person who matters is Cheney. Does anything that came out of this make it more or less likely that Cheney is the source? What are the odds that Fitz is after Cheney? It’s the only thing that really matters, IMHO.
So is Fitzmas over now? Or will there be something under the tree on or near the first anniversary?
OT and maybe old news… nyt, link at huffpo, reports that Susan Collins and WATB co-sponsored/shoved a bill through the senate last night to rename fema and have it report directly to the king during times of national disaster. Never mind that the king was too busy sleeping to respond…
I vow to learn how to provide a link…
lotus at 6 — that reminds me of a child sex offender that we charged a while ago who decided to take his case to trial and demanded the right to take the stand in his own defense (against his counsel’s better judgment, I might add). His story, he was checking on his step-daughter and he…well, he accidentally had sex with her. (I’ll spare you guys the gory details…but even now, that he thought a jury would buy that makes me laugh out loud. Moron.)
Anyway, no one but an idiot would believe that a high level security clearance holder would just accidentally be talking with journalists about highly classified information during an orchestrated campaign against that person’s husband. Yeah, right.
How close are the connections between Novak and Team Libby? It might just be an attempt to lower the signal to noise ratio.
Bit NOLA at 9 — everything, and I mean EVERYTHING, that I have been hearing says that it is not over as yet. And as Fitzgerald has made no announcement to the contrary, I’m going with what I’ve been hearing until Fitzgerald or someone on his team tells me otherwise.
Yep, no way Novakula was gonna tell us anything actually worth hearing. Just another opportunity for him to obfuscate about what really happened.
And OT – I wouldn’t call myself a big fan of Rahm Emanuel, but this is some good snark:
ember, just cut and paste the link into your comment, wordpress will do the rest for you….
Fitz turned out to be a Repug plant, so you can stop licking his balls now…oooh, how convenient, he just haaaad to wait until after the 04 election…now he just haaaas to wait til after 06 to put Scooter on trial…it’s not called being thorough – he’s been letting Rove and Novakula get their stories straight with each other and cut generous deals as ‘prosecution witnesses with immunity.’ What a load of shit – I wonder if he and Rove had lunch and decided to make Scooter the fall guy. Watch him take a high paying job at Carlyle once his DOJ coverup job is over.
Dana Milbank not so sorrowfully predicted it “over” last nite on KO. I will not put down my hopes or my Fitzbanner til he or Christy says so.
So there.
FITZ!!!!!!!!!!
Christy – love the picture of the hippo yawning. Have you checked out the (predictable) comments from Jonah Goldberg who has declared Fitzmas to be over? Correct me if I’m wrong but that Grand Jury is still in session. Any thoughts to the future of this investigation?
Reality at 16 — and your source for that information is…? Link…? Um…yeah, I thought so. Unless and until you have something solid on that from a reputable source, peddle it elsewhere.
Stand back from “Reality,” folks, this gonna be something to see.
Wish I could type fast.
pgl at 18 — wish I could give you guys some solid information, but I do know that the grand jury is still in session and still working.
OT:
I think this is a great read, simple and one would imagine effective. Don’t accept failure like conservatives do – its not a blame game – its for making things better:
http://www.tompaine.com/articl…..stupid.php
It’s The Conservatism, Stupid
Paul Waldman
July 12, 2006
Now we know not to go telling Bob Novak any super duper secrets. He’ll fold like a sheet. There’s one journalist who’s had his very last “scoop”! What a man!
Leslie in CA – that was great! Loved the “going in circles” part.
Reality’s source is Wayne Madsen. Concern trolls will be out in force after old Wayne decided to once again make shit up out of whole cloth. people will be demanding we respond to Wayne, or else….?! I refuse to link it.
Reality….your 16
Heres a link for you
http://billmon.org/archives/002518.html
EPU’ed OT
If we don’t fix the voting machines (via DNC DCCC intervention), all the roots work we do won’t count, because the election will be stolen again. Poll Monitors won’t matter because the machines will be rigged. Is there something wrong with my logic here?
I know no one wants to talk about ‘votes not counting’. But correct me if I’m wrong, if we don’t fix this, what else will matter?
Discuss among yourselves. There are links at my site. Thanks. Please return to your scheduled program.
CHS says: Rude and insulting comments will not be tolerated. Period. And if you continue, your IP will be published and you will be banned. Is that clear?
Christy, that’s an absolutely brilliant image. You think maybe if you explain it using pictures, the press will figure out they’ve been had by Novakula?
Hope,
Have you heard from your husband?
no one but an idiot would believe that a high level security clearance holder would just accidentally be talking with journalists about highly classified information
Having grown up in an area where lots of people had clearances, even unto the higher levels, I will add that if you have one in the higher levels, you aren’t going to be talking about the highly classified stuff, unless you want to meet law enforcement up close and very personal. (Even children learn not to ask things like “what does your father do?”) So the whole notion of someone high up in the maladministration ‘accidentally’ letting out the identity of a NOC is just so wrong; the ‘leaker’ had to have known exactly what they were doing.
I think Novak hasn’t been in the spotlight lately and he’s feeling left out.
*ilson, how about doing your patented magic right about now?
emptywheel at 30 — I thought a truly representative image might be useful, yes. But as to whether it will sink in — who knows?
Reality,
I can identify an honest man when I look him in the eyes and evaluate his actions. I can identify a dishonest man from a stench that wafts across endless miles of death and destruction and the pyre made of our Constitution and conventions; I’ve seen and heard plenty from those liars for the past 5 years.
Pat is an honest man– never, ever have I wondered or cared about his pol affiliation. Pretty rare, these days, eh?
ditto lotus…. Commence trexing….
Ah, CHS herself fixed his wagon.
Don’t feed the troll, just bounce him.
The investigation is over when Fitz says it’s over and not one minute before.
Love, love, love the hippo pic!
Thanks CHS,
I can’t imagine Fitz not wrapping up the big presents, and hope that Fat Baby Rove still has to face the music someday.
I seem to recall back at the beginning of this story (how many years ago?) It was reported that two White House employees were shopping around the “Wilson was sent by his wife” story to six Washington journalists. One of them was Andrea Mitchell. I forgot if I ever knew the others.
The notion that someone told Novak inadvertantly seems preposterous just on the face of it.
Christy 13
If Fitz showed up at Novak’s deposition with the correct three waivers, as Novak avers he did, in, what, 2004, that means he’s known since at least then who leaked.
That he’s kept the investigation open this long after ID’ing those sources, means that there is something else that interests him, no?
And I always have to come back to the ruling of one of the judges, regarding Judy Miller’s status, where pages of info were redacted, and where the judge was supposed to have said that there were national security issues at stake.
We can rule out Fitz keeping the investigation open just to try to entrap people into perjuring themselves, right?
That would be way, way beneath him and stupid, too.
OT – baby hippo:
http://www.cs.drexel.edu/~ummaycoc/baby_hippo.jpg
Oh, gleex, I got distracted by the kerfuffle there, but yes, that’s a great piece you linked to — thanks!
Leslie in CA 14 – dats funny! but sad because of it’s truth.
twolf — not quite as cute as Tai Shan, but right cute. You sure have a great store of animal pix!
lotus, yes, it’s called google images ;)
As for Fitzmas being over. Maybe, maybe not. I think he let go of the idea of ever charging anyone with leaking fairly early because of the graymail stuff. Libby’s lies and obstruction were so blatant, he had the makings of a sure conviction. Rove was a little more slippery, and he couldn’t be sure he could convict beyond a reasonable doubt, so Rove got off. Also, Rove cooperated.
When more facts come out during the Libby proceedings, all roads will point to Cheney. But I think Libby will be pardoned after the mid term elections.
Then, perhaps, if we’re lucky, some day George Tenet will step forward and publicly sing. Otherwise, we may never know the whole story.
What is it that has the Dow down 126 again —
Iraq?
Israel?
Iran?
Microsoft?
the trade deficit?
All of the above?
immanentize @ 15 I think it might just work?
link to Susan Collins and po jo liberman’s bill to dismantle fema and have the new agency report to the prez.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07…..2fema.html
perfect, ember!
Um, the answer to my Down question, perchance . . .
AP: Israelis attack just 10 miles from Beirut
lotus
Isn’t the shorthand for that “regional war in the Middle East”?
lotus @50,
Lol,you just reminded me of one of FARK’s headlines about the latest price hike . ‘The latest reason for the price hike is(shakes magic 8 ball)….
Ah, I guess you got there before me–but not necessarily before the Israelis.
I do bleeve it is, emptywheel, I do bleeve it is. And where the fuck that takes us next, I don’t want to think about.
Reality,
Fitzmas is over when Pat says it is over. Considering that weeks ago the President announced that the “investigation” is over, yet only this week does Pat notify that one small section, the section relating to Bob Novack’s direct testimony is over, speaks volumes.
It is obvious from the above, that Pat did NOT notify the president of any end to the investigation. At the time of the president’s speech, I posted that the way the president said “the investigation is now concluded” sounded more like he was giving Pat an order, rather than reporting information that Pat had given him.
Pat famously has not leaked about this case. But from time to time he, in a legal and appropriate way, put information out into the public realm which had the effect of countering false stories and spin.
This new nugget from Novack, that one tiney portion of the investigation is now over (weeks after the President told us it was all over)suggests to me that all the president has managed to do with the
order to shut downannouncement of the conclusion of the investigation and talk of maybe not “reappointing” Pat as Special Counsel (as if he even could)has merely succeeded in lighting a fire undor ole’ Fitz (who has been a teensy bit preoccupied with Mayor Daley’s bunch of hooligans and now the gov.’s bunch of patronage abusers).So, it seems that the President’s attempt to intimidate Pat may have, once again, backfired and might have instead had the salutory effect of focusing the tall man’s attention on his “other job”
I think the Dow just keeps going under 1100 every so often so that the Press can have another big headline for Bush:
Dow Clears 1100 Hurdle! (for the twenty second time)
OT- Got contacted by the Lamont folks today wanting me to write to papers so I did. Here’s what I came up with:
Joe Lieberman wants Connecticut voters to believe that he is a true Democrat and that it is foolish to characterize him as “in bed” with the Republican administration. It’s hard to take this assertion seriously having seen the Senator in his debate with challenger Ned Lamont. From his continual use of the folksy Reaganesque “There you go again” to his incessant and quite churlish charges of flip flopping he showed himself to be quite willing to use the tactics of his Republican colleagues. He all but accused Mr. Lamont of “Cut and Run” mentality.
He insists that Mr. Lamont is running a one issue campaign. This is not true but it must be clear even to the Senator that the occupation of Iraq is the pressing issue of the day. And what is his defense of supporting this catastrophic enterprise? He believed and still believes it was the right thing to do. Further he claims credit for being principled and for crossing partisan lines to show his support for the failed policies of the current administration even though that support is squarely at odds with the will not only of his constituency but with the National polity.
One can only assume from his constant pointing to his ability to bring home the bacon that the Senator believes that being the breadwinner for Connecticut is all the representation he is required to perform. Is pork the only price the people of Connecticut will demand from a representative who will not represent the will of the ordinary citizenry? I hope they will hold their political power at least as dear as their pocket books.
If you’d like to do the same, the Lamont site makes it easy just go here.
Well, I don’t want to get back into that head-nodding problem I had earlier today, imm, but I betcha got something there.
Snip,
the way the president said “the investigation is now concluded…
Sounds an awful lot like Mission Accomplihed.
OOPS. Sorry for the lisp at the end.
It ain’t over until the fat men (Rove and Novak) sing?
I’m still calling for a Fitz Presser to set things straight…
Perception is murky in dem deceptive waters.
B.S. Librul
I’m not sure Pat will ever announce that anything is over. He stated in the Libby press conference he will only ever comment on people named in an indictment. I took that to mean that on everything else, we can expect silence.
I’m thinking that all this “free at last” blecherous belting by Novakula has more to do with possible obstruction charges for he and Rover. Recall that the FBI elevated the investigation after learning that Rovakula had “talked among themselves” shortly after the CIA request to DOJ to open an investigation.
I’m thinking that lots of Rovers GJ inquisition was about these phone conversations and that after the last one, PJF threw in the towel. IANAL, but prooving obstruction/conspriracy sans wiretap or docs between two people is a true he said/he said situation. No way that holds up in front of jury.
I’m thinking that something’s brewing – still – based upone two neat little phrases: “at this time” and “relating to me”. Added together, these tell me that Fitz has no plans to charge Rovakula for obstruction or conspiracy to do so. Has nothing to do with leaking classified into .
Just my opinion – I could be wrong.
Late to the party comment: Thanks sincerely Christy for the previous post. You’re one righteous babe.
Glenn Greenwald had a good post yesterday entitled, “The paramountcy of neoconservatism and Joe Lieberman”. He uses the neocon frame to pull together why Joe is the favorite Democrat of so many Republicans. They’re all neocons and their first allegiance is to the neocon agenda. As that agenda fails, neocon rhetoric becomes more extreme. It is not that their ideas failed, it is that they were failed by those who were not extreme enough in applying them.
But what I found compelling about Greenwald’s argument is the idea that normal distinctions between liberals, moderates, and conservatives have broken down and been supplanted by the dichotomy between those who are neocons and those who aren’t. Libby, Cheney, et al in the Plame Affair represent one arc of this trend. You either agree with the neocons or you are the enemy of the neocons. Wilson disagreed and Wilson became an enemy. The CIA wasn’t in lockstep with them. The CIA was the enemy.
So back to Joe. Remember how Joe decried any criticism of Bush in a time of war? That wasn’t the patriot talking. It was the neocon. No criticism now or ever because the neocon war is an endless war. Dissent the foundation of a functioning democracy when put up against neocon values of agreement or else is told to take a hike. You don’t want to give aid and comfort to our enemies, do you, well do you? Under such circumstances opposing views even when they are held by a majority of Americans are portrayed as fringe.
And finally to Joe and Alito. Lieberman in his vote on Alito had a choice between his moderate-conservative values and those of not disagreeing with the neocon powers that be. We know which of these counted and which received lip service only.
I think Greenwald is on to something here and that when Lieberman talks about principles that go beyond Party he is really asserting the primacy of his neoconservative views over those of all others, even his constituents.
Busted at 62
That’s exactly what I said at the time!
egregious at 31
Yes! I’m happy to report he calls every-other-day. He’s well, but busy with severely injured soldiers on every trip to Iraq. I’m so grateful he sleeps in Deutchland. Thank you so much for your concern, and thank everyone for all of the kind thoughts. I depend on them.
Anyone have anything to say about my comment at 28?
Hope at 28: As of 1/1/06, in California there are no more paperless voting machines.
Hi Hopie — glad to have that good report. Yes, as to your cyber-voting-rigging comment — I think about it daily (at least) but don’t have the first clue what to do about it.
Hugh 67
I agree, peel back so much of what has happened and you see this frame over and over and over…………
Larry
lina at 70
I know, I know. Brad blog has a great post on it.
…un-hi-jacking the thread…
Hope…. So glad to hear your husband’s safe! I really don’t want to hijack this thread, but I do not believe that the voting machines are the biggest voter issue. The failure to reauthorize the voting rights bill and the identity card requirements for voters will do way more damage to minority and poor people’s votes than out and out fraud. Indeed, if you can prevent progress people from voting, the Republicans will never need a fraud-based machine fix to their loser elections.
I am not unsympathetic to the concerns about the misuse of technology. I just don’t think the total % of votes that can be manipulated without clear law breaking — and disclosure — is anything like what people are trying to do with “legal” voter suppression.
Hope at 28: Here in The Other Washington (the more sane one, I like to think) we are going to all mail ballots. No more polling stations, period, which means no more Diebold machines. But I am wondering what this really means. How are mail in ballots counted? (Not having seen one, I don’t even know what they look like. Punch cards?) Does this lead so some other possible manipulations?
I, for one, am just terribly depressed about how everyone except Libby seems to be getting off scot free. Yes, I know that things aren’t really “over”. But I really think Libby will be pardoned, Fitz (bless him) will not issue any more indictments, and no one except the participants will ever really know what happened, and they aren’t going to be telling.
Hilde
I very much agree with you about those two little phrases.
Pat tends to imbed a lot of backstory into carefully chosen phrases, which only ever seem to make sense in hindsight.
When you do find out what he was actually referring to, for me, it’s always a “smack self on forehead” moment.
Those phrases are just a little TOO precise.
Also, do we know if Novack signed a grand jury immunity waiver before he testified? In the US Attorney’s office where PJF learned how to do his job it was SOP to request the waiver of everyone. Only if someone baulked,do you then get into this “target letter” “no target letter” will we/won’t we let him testify analysis.
if he signed a waiver (and I have no idea if he did) it could be (having a nice time inside my imagination today) that his portion of the investigation is over, because a true bill has been returned and is under seal.
I actually doubt that is the case, but it’s fu to war game all hte possibilities
On July 10, William E. Moschilla, Assistant Attorney General of the United States, sent a new letter to Senator Schumer defending the NSA spying program in light of the Hamdan decision.
I don’t know whether this has been discussed here.
The new Moschilla letter says that
More in next post. Note sure why I have errors on page.
lhp:
…So, it seems that the President’s attempt to intimidate Pat may have, once again, backfired and might have instead had the salutory effect of focusing the tall man’s attention on his “other job” …
I doubt intimidation was ever the intent here. That’s not Bush’s MO (he’s too stupid for that) and Fitzgerald doesn’t blink (I worked with him here in Chicago 2002-5 and nothing fazes the man). What’s telling to me is Shapiro stepping up for pressers. Fitzgerald is avoiding being asked questions he strategically can’t answer. Fitzgerald hasn’t folded up his tent. He’s just never been on his own clock (I wish someone would release the number of hours spent on the Plame case instead of saying the investigation has gone on “for years”; from the perspective of “billable” hours, the investigation has lasted about 3-4 months, which is remarkable.).
And “the” grand jury is not still at work. “A” grand jury is still at work, as it should be.
Fitzgerald, once and for all, is not a partisan or a tool. Even his friend, Comey, who was a partisan (and a bit of a tool), got eaten up by the machine (although he landed nicely). If Fitzgerald were a marked man, he would have been out on his ass years ago. His next job will still be in government, I’m sure — either USAtty of the SD of NY, some NYC terrorism post, or head of the FBI. The law dramatically limits what justice can be imposed, but he’ll do the best he can.
Continuing:
The new Moschilla letter goes on to argue that “Congress left open the question of what rules should apply to electronic surveillance during wartime.”
Next, the letter reverts to the argument that the President has inherent constitutional power, no matter what Congress says.
Finally, the Moschilla letter cites something that “the Government did not argue and the Court did not decide in Hamdan.”
lhp, you always manage to reassure me about Fitz.
Any puppy news yet?
Inconceivable! … Well, not really
;>)
I can’t wait for the meeting tomorrow! Cuz I represent lots of Hippo Chris
http://ga1.org/jeffcookforcongress/index.html
check me out men.
Hope 69
I, too, am worried about the voting machines.
I cling to the following items for hope:
1. A couple of states have passed pretty good election laws. (Montana & New Mexico, for two)
2. There are ongoing lawsuits at the state and local levels to disallow certain machines and use paper ballots in others.
3. There are lawsuits against the voting machine manufacturers.
4. Georgia is not going to have those picture ID’s this time around.
I’m sure there are other rays of hope.
Meanwhile, we are going to have some of the elections stolen because the margin isn’t wide enough. We are going to have to work like crazy to win by big margins.
Meanwhile, find out if your precinct can hand-count the ballots at the precinct level – - in public – - and post those results at the polling place. Then if what is reported from the central tabulators differs, you have grounds to challenge.
Sounds as if the White House thinks that the Fitzy menace is all over and they are now getting on with the messy business of re-writing history.
If Clusterfuck is convinced that the investigation is over- then he no longer has any excuse for not commenting on Rove and other’s involvement. Presumably he will say that Rove has been cleared by the great federal prosecutor Fitzy- so there is no reason for further action- despite the fact that Rove DID out a CIA agent. The upside down nature of the Clusterfuck world continues- and americans continue to buy it. It makes ya wanna spit nails- but that’s how it is.
Jack Balkin on his blog has briefly analyzed the new Moschilla letter: Bush Administration to Justice Stevens: Drop Dead
Deo
Re: Fitz’s Deputy taking the press conference after the City HAll case verdict. Don’t read anything into it. pat was out of town when the verdict hit and didn’t get back in time
Sorry, the correct spelling is “Moschella” (with an “e,” not an “i”).
lhp — just so. My guess is that Novak was granted immunity way back when, only leaving the question of whether he committed perjury. And from what Novak says about how much Fitz knew BEFORE he testified, only a complete fool would risk indictment by not coming completely clean right away (Rove, anyone?). I used to tell my clients that when they were granted immunity, they should tell about every crime they ever committeed starting with stealing change from their parents when they were 12. Perjury is always indictable later if need be, so it is a yawner that Novak’s little corner of the investigation is “complete.”
lotus dahlink…what about one of our ‘email campaigns’ to our Sen./Reps DEMANDING that they talk to the DNC and DCCC and make them
DO SOMETHING!? No more ‘take homes’ of the voting machines; No more NOT enforcing the rules and laws that already exist; Make THEM contact the media. This is HUGE.
I don’t want to spend another 3 days after the election unable to get out of bed because I’m so depressed and upset about the outcome.
Really lotus, what else is there? There are some phenoms here at FDL, I don’t see why we can’t fix this before November. Do I seem crazy here, or unrealistic? Please tell me I haven’t drifted over to the ‘dark side’.
Rant Over.
The new Moschella letter is also discussed over at The Next Hurrah
Having grown up in an area where lots of people had clearances, even unto the higher levels, I will add that if you have one in the higher levels, you aren’t going to be talking about the highly classified stuff, unless you want to meet law enforcement up close and very personal. (Even children learn not to ask things like “what does your father do?”) So the whole notion of someone high up in the maladministration ‘accidentally’ letting out the identity of a NOC is just so wrong; the ‘leaker’ had to have known exactly what they were doing.
It is inconceivable that a DC jury would buy such a story. No place in the world is less sympathetic to that arguement.
FYI for anyone who tried to click the Needlenose link above and couldn’t get through — the site was down for about 45 minutes (I’m not sure if it was the FDL traffic, or a fierce comment spam attack that started this morning, or both).
But it’s back up now. So come on over.
I have something to say about your comments in 28… get over it. There seems to be some kind of mass delusional behavior in thinking that the vast majority of American’s are Democrats and the only way that they could possibly lose an election is that it was stolen. Maybe, just maybe in the last election a small/medium size majority of people didn’t want to vote for Democrats, thus a lost election.
I live in Cook County just outside Chicago where Democrats practically invented election fraud, cronyism, multiple voting, dead voting, etc. We are the bluest of blue counties and we still had 30-50 thousand ballots thrown out that were not considered valid. But Democrats one big time here so there was no investigations.
The bottom line is that our elections are not perfect but for the most part, they give us an accurate reflection of what the people want. I’m all for improving the process but we have to get over this “stolen election” nonsense.
BTW… I hope your husband stays safe.
To every thing,
spin, spin, spin,
there is a season,
spin, spin, spin . . .
Hilde @ 66 nailed it, IMO, on both the two little phrases and also on her comments regarding the last post.
Keep the water boiling, Christy. That’s the only way to remove the impurities.
(And Christy, you’ve got mail . . .)
Peterr..
You up next?
Nope, Hope, you be very much in the light! The problem is on my end — the only sort of imagination I seem to have is empathic. So I have to wait for others’ good strategic and tactical ideas — and I thank youse phenoms for ‘em.
Prof #77
I pointed out a while ago that the actual language of the AUMF only goes up to detainment but that once detainment occurs it has nothing more to say on how that detainment should be carried out and expressly denies reading any implied powers beyond those that existed and controlled such detainment before the AUMF. Mary pointed out to me that Sandra Day O’Connor in some contorted reasoning had cited the AUMF to square the circle with regard to detainment in Hamdi. I would certainly like to know how this reasoning on detainment can be stretched to cover anything in the NSA wiretapping program but then I’m no lawyer or Administration hack. It seems to me that Moschilla is basically saying that we lost Hamdan with the AUMF but won Hamdi with the AUMF so from now we’re citing Hamdi and act like it’s not irrelevant to the issue. But as I said IANAL.
It’s interesting to hear this Novak thing coming up now. Every time I see any MSM coverage of Fitzmas, I wonder if they are trying to get out in front of something. Why would they do anything that gives Plamegate more legs, unless they are trying to head off some news that may be breaking.
OT:…(not attempting to hijack thread, just a story that caught my eye)
Another ’sudden death’ for someone connected to the enron scandal, some house cleaning going on ?
From Yahoo News
Reports: British banker found dead
http://tinyurl.com/ryhzq
SRV – If you have a tied (less than .5 percent margin) election and voting machines with no way of being audited or a recount undertaken, what do you do? Just give it to whoever screams the loudest?
SRV-Fan– we have a problem and there is no getting around it til we face it.
International monitoring might be a good place to start with our “democracy”.
Nearly everything else has been stolen and misrepresented, why not elections?
Hugh, for not being a lawyer, you pretty much nailed it OTH.
I really have a hard time believing that he got Plame’s name out of Who’s Who. If that was the case, why didn’t he refer to her as Valerie Wilson? Bob Novak doesn’t strike me as a proponent of gender equality.
lhp:
Fitzgerald was not out of town for that presser. I know because I was in the office that day. Nothing he’s doing is unpredictable.
There was hardly a peep out of anyone until the 2000 election debacle. We can improve it oursleves without the help of “international monitors”. What makes them more trustworthy? Like they don’t have an agenda?
When you have simple requirements like a photo ID called “racism”, it makes it difficult to change the system even after improving the actual voting mechanism.
Deo#103…OK….why don’t you give us your opinion, about WHY Fitz dicked around with Rover for so long…What would be Fitz’s motavation, especially if what THEY say about Rover is true, that he didn’t plea out
SRV –
if the machines work, you don’t need to change the system. If you’re using a machine that produces no paper trail and can be easily hacked, you might as well be voting in Stalinist Russia.
Deo,
No Pat does not blink. He has never blinked that I know of, and I have followed his career since his first day in the Southern District.
That being said, intimidation is exactly the MO of this administration. It always has been. I know that many people had hopes that Pat’s next job would still be in gov’t (either SDNY or FBI or even AG), but I think that will not happen under this administration. They know that cannot trust him to cave in to their wishes, the safest thing for them to do for their own sakes, is leave him where he is where at least most of activities are constrained by the geographical jurisdictional limits of his office.
I think his “next job in government” comes in th enew administration, UNLESS, things get SOOO bad for this admin, that they promote him as a way of riding his shoulders back to some credibility.
That’s how Comey became USA in NY and how he wound up as Dpeuty AG. The adminstration needed someone with his own reputation for rectitude to counter the folks on Capital Hill screaming for Ashcroft’s head.
Similarly, Comey was the universal merit candidate in SDNY after a disasterous attempt by Pataki to install a politcal croney of his into the jewel in the crown of the DOJ.
You guys may hate Schumer, but he saved the SDNY from some serious politcal crony invasions. Twice. He also almost singlehandedly saved us from some really disasterous judicial nominees. And got dumped on by his fellow senators for doing so.
Back in the day, when the CIA was in trouble for having all sorts of criminals on the payroll and scandals were so bad there was talk of sutting is down, they tranferred Judge Webster, who was the FBI director and a man of renowned integrity over to run the CIA with the idea tht he would restore some lustre of respectibilty in the short term, and hopefully be able to make lasting reforms.
If President Bush believes himself to be circling the drain, he MIGHT promote Pat to Ag or Homeland Security of somesuch kinda position, in order to have Pat’s own respectibilty cast a glow over what’s left of his admin in an attmpt to save his own shrub ass.
This post has me fuming. Everything this gang of criminals does angers me and delutes our energies further. I think that must be part of the ‘plan’.
I’m a little more hair-trigger than usual given my current situation, but I’m hoping that SOMEONE will do a post or guest post on the “very real potential of vote fraud”.
I swear on a stack of Bibles I will not mention this again (in this thread).
SRV fan at 93…I think you are very wrong. And thanks for your good wishes for my husband.
OT:
Do you buy Citgo gas?
Well, in Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Minnesota, Missouri, Nebraska, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, South Dakota, and parts of Illinois, Texas, Arkansas and Iowa … not for much longer.
lina…
I agree with you, even though I am a software engineer and I think it’s possible some day to do this thing right electronically. Until then, simplicity is not such a bad thing. My county outside Chicago has always used punch cards and I have never had a problem. Sometimes people are just stupid and incompetent… (like in Florida).
My main point is that I have not seen evidence of rampant fraud, nothing that invalidates the system or recent elections. I see it as paranoia.
I swear he’s just baiting me…
DEO at 103,
You SAW him in his office that day? Because you are contradicting someone who has never ever lied to me (that I know of) and is in an abosultely iron clad position to know.
Let it go, Hope. Turn your mind to the fascinating comment that follows yours.
Deo
What time of day?
Hope, without national standards, it is hard for local county officials to know for certain what to spend money on. I just had this conversation with my own county auditor yesterday.
What you CAN do is to encourage the use of paper ballots where they are available: absentee ballots, and optical scanner ballots, in this county. And help to get the vote out. The more people who vote, the harder it will be to steal any election, because real numbers will tend to swamp any tampering. Talk to your local officials, and local Democratic Party people, and let them know you care about this.
National standards will come when the grassroots in both parties demand them.
With best wishes for your husband’s well-being, I return to regular programming.
Watching Dana Milbank announce that it’s all over but the Scooter on KO last night, I thought: that’s funny. Was there a Fitz press conference that I missed somehow? Oh well, I must not have the penetrating vision of the Washington Wise Guys. Or maybe he’s just making stuff up because he has no idea what Fitz is doing.
Deo
DEO
you there?
Dear America,
We told you our world view would lead to flowers and candy and democracy and joy and peace.
-The Neo-Con Kewl Kidz
Deo
Come out come out where ever you are.
I’m am not mad. I need info.
LHP and his famous oldie covers:
Deo. Deeeeeeooo, Daylight come and I wanna go home.
lhp 116, not so s/he wants us to notice, I bet.
Deo
Come out come out where ever you are.
I’m am not mad. I need info.
Larry @ 95,
No, I’m not up next, but I’ve got something cooking . . .
OT, but thought we all could use a little optimism on this thread – just reading a post by kos that makes me think maybe even the Senate is possible for us in November:
NJ – Senate: Menendez Continues to Rise
by kos
Wed Jul 12, 2006 at 10:00:34 AM PDT
Strategic Vision (R). 7/7-9. Likely voters. MoE 3% (6/16-18)
Mendendez (D) 43 (38)
Kean 37 (36)
Across all polls, Mendendez’ once anemic numbers are rising steadily. While he’s not out of the woods just yet, it looks increasingly unlikely that New Jersey voters will cast their lot with the Republicans.
[And then there’s this comment further down the same thread (these are only educated opinions, mind you, mixed with some encouraging polling reports, but I’m feeling a little bit positive with comments at dkos like this)]:
Chances of taking the Senate improving daily (1 / 0-)
We are unlikely to lose any seats.
We are now odds-on to pick up PA, MT and MO.
Toss-ups: OH, RI and PA.
VA: Expect to see this race with polling margin-of-error soon.
(And they didn’t even mention Tennessee – which I think is still close(?) No real facts here, but I think there’s reason to be a little more optimistic – and DONATE generously to the candidates of your choice!)
GSD at 117
What about the sex? You told us there would be sex.
people actually involved in the mechanics of elections abominate paper ballots because they are so people-intensive to count — it takes forever! “scanned paper ballots” provide a quick tally as well as a permanent human-readable record…
Mary Mary quite contrary, how does your garden grow?
Lotus,
My new friend Deo is gonna casue me to lose a lot of sleep tonight
HSAT — But what was promised was sex with a dog, I am not interested….
Neocon sex, I doan even wanna think about — ptui.
Hey Jerry, leave Mary alone — you were a bad boyfriend. And STOP WEARING THAT YELLOW TIE!!
Hope,
Unfortunately the sex angle was squashed by that killjoy Rick Santorum.
-The Neo-Con Kewl Kidz
imm
you don’t know what you’re missing…
Methinks Deo ain’t no friend, lhp. Methinks Deo be one o’ them there agents provocateu(r)(se)s.
Did you give a puppy report that I’ve missed?
lhp — Why lose sleep — is it really a critical point? I guess if he was there it means one thing for the strategy question, but not necessarily?
Not a bad idea: “Transfer Secretary Rumsfield to Iraq” Wouldn’t it be nice if he took some responsibility for the situation and actually tried to address the problems -
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/…..24920.html
Royko says at 102
The Whos’ Who argument to me has always pointed to me that the leaker knew what he was doing in this sense: He refused to give the actual name. If technically true (although I’m not really buying it) that Novak got “Plame” there, the leaker might have led right up to her name and when Novak asked for specific info the person said words to the effect of “I can’t give that to you, but her maiden name should be easy to find out”. Otherwise, why would he have to look it up? If the leaker didn’t know she was covert, why not give the name?
Of course, this doesn’t explain why Novak said at one point “they gave me the name and I used it”…so more than likely he’s full of crap as usual.
eew…INsanetorum and that poor, dead, fetus that he brought home to his family. Isn’t that against the law? I’m losing it over these morbidly, delusional, greedy pig-fucks that run the government. Someone get me a valuim , stat.
Maryland has just completed putting all of the voter registration on computer, so that at the polls, the election judges do not have to look first through a hard-copy print-out of the names, and then through a box of cards to find yours.
I’ve signed up to be a judge at my local polling place, and will have training at the end of the month.
What is disturbing is that, in testing the computerized voter rolls, the system was not finding people known to be registered. Now, if this happens on election day, the voter is supposed to be given a provisional ballot, and allowed to vote.
It will be interesting to see where things stand when I go for my training, but I can guarantee you that I will not be shy about asking questions.
And Hope – glad to hear your husband is okay; hearing his voice on a regular basis has to help you sleep at night. As for SRV – of course you were being baited; this isn’t about the sour grapes that come with losing, it’s about the disenfranchising of registered voters. ID cards are not designed to eliminate voter fraud, they are designed to suppress the vote.
On the bright side, my daughter’s boyfrined has just paid for an engagement ring, and I am not allowed to tell anyone (she knows, and his mother knows, but that’s it) until the ring is made and he can (this is so sweet!) ask my husband for her hand. Another couple of weeks – I am probably going to bust a gut before then!
OT on Lieberman — for fact checkers
Brochure today in postal mail
“In the August 8 democratic primary RE-ELECT (bold and different type) US Sen…..”
“U.S. Senator Joe Liberman. The choice of every Democratic woman in the U.S. Senate for his dedication to the issues that affect all our families:”
(each name format the same — done in alpha order)
U.S. Senator Barbara Boxer (D-CA)
Cantwell (D-WA)
Clinton (D-NY)
Feinstein (CA)
Landrieu (LA)
Lincoln (AR)
Mikulski (MD)
Murray (WA)
Stabenow (MI)
Boxer is quoted “Joe has been a powerful and consistent voice for a woman’s right to choose, family and medical leave, pay equity, child support enforcement, stem cell research, and measures to combat violence against women”
(no reference)
The Right to Choose
“Joe Lieberman is a steadfast defender of a woman’s right to choose and has consistently fought against the Bush Administration’s attempts to curtail this right. That’s why he received a 95% pro-choice voting record from NARAL and has been endorsed by the Planned Parenthood PAC.
The only CT person referenced is Nancy DiNardo, chair of the state D party, who is quoted as “Joe has stood tough against George Bush and protected funding for our schools, our health care, and our pristine environment. In the August 8 Democratic primary, I urge you to re-elect Senator Joe Lieberman — the choice of the Connecticut State Democratic Party and working families across our state”
At least Bill Clinton never even entertained the notion of saving the poor Rwandans from their genocide.
The Iraqis have the misfortune of having 130,000 US troops standing by as their nations slides into the latest act of genocide in a world gone mad.
Remember now, that flip-flopping useful idiot George W. Bush wrote “Not on my watch” to some some Rwandan survivor that visited the Whitehouse back a few years ago.
Not only on your watch George W., but at your provocation.
Fucking heckuva job.
-GSD
You know, I was crushed the morning of the Rove announcement, listening to the report on NPR.
Then I read online later of the exact (or as close as Gold Bars would get) wording of Fitz’s letter and “at this time” stuck out like a cow in a pigpen.
My sense of these latest spin-o-rama is this (and I dont’ know Fitz other than what I’ve read, but have no reason to think of him other than neutral at this point): The timing of the Rover release and now this from Novakula is key. Recall that the Rover release came just before or about the time of the latest WH offense to prop up the polls.
Bush was in the dumper – 30% or about – Iraq’s going to hell, new scandals popping up everyday from civil servants who had “had enough”. Things were looking grim. At some point, all the Rubber Stamps in the world won’t shore up the baseline political power needed by any president to merely conduct business as usual (much less conduct a wholesale illegal takeover of a sovereign nation – and I don’t mean Iraq). There is an argument here that continuing to squeeze the WH was putting undo stress on an already stressed out organization. Paralyzing the president and Rover (politically) would bring me great joy but there are infrastructures and systems that could be endangered by a collapsing administration given that congress served its mountain oysters to the neocons years ago.
And then, poof! Rover’s released, Bush is off to Iraq, and the same tune by the same band is commenced once again.
This is spin. IANAL but I’ve got the provenance – federal prosecution provenance – and based upon what I observed over many years, this is simply serving the prosecution: by loosening his grip on Rover’s balls (and Novaula’s to some extent), he provides the appearance of giving in to possible WH pressure to end this thing right damn now, dammit.
In other words, in a less politically charged case, you “squeeze and sqeeze until THEY blink”. I think Fitz batted his eyelashes at the WH by dropping the Rovakula conspiracy – but he didn’t blink. He couldn’t build a case on one of the key activities that was most disturbing to the FBI investigation and by not doing so, it appears that he’s cutting and running. And the WH gets to regroup – back to breathlessly keeping the spinning plates in the air.
Meanwhile…
Then again, I could be dead wrong.
Congrats Anne! What a lovely thing. Remind me not to tell you a secret, lol.
Leslie in CA 14 -
That Rahm quote is priceless. I remember the good old days when I thought he was whip-smart and loved to hear him speak on issues (Clinton days). Well, he’s still got the brainpower, he just hasn’t been using it to the betterment of the country or party lately.
Reading your comment gave me a nice flashback.
Whoa, Anne, I don’t know whether to go with your good news or your bad first.
Hell yes I do — CONGRATULATIONS TO YOU AND YOURS!
As to the new rolls — well, since YOU are gonna be on hand, I pity the gooper who tries to muck with them.
Hope – I can tell you guys, ’cause I know you can’t tell my husband! LOL! I’m biting my tongue and tonight I’m buying a Bride’s magazine to keep at the office! This is making me nuts!
sorry…IANAL? its not in my acronyn handbook.
I
Am
Not
A
Lawyer
Thanks, guys – !
kisses and hugs to Anne and a ‘Brides’ subscription that’s sent to the office…lol.
IANALBIDSAAHILN:
I Am Not A Lawyer But I Did Stay At A Holiday Inn Last Night
SRVfan 104
I’d think a photo ID would be just fine – - IF the Secretary of State of each and every state set up photo booths and applications every 5 blocks in every single town and city in this country.
Then it would be fair.
Otherwise, it discriminates against the poor, the vehickle-less, the disabled, the old and the isolated.
Think those states that are asking for photo ID’s would go along with my plan?
I didn’t think so.
Imm at 134
If Deo was correct I would lose sleep for three reasons:
1) his strategy thoery
2) it would mean someone I trust absolutely either lied to me or needed to defelct my attention
3) assuming the latter, I would go crazy trying to figure out why me attention was being deflected
All this speculation on where the Plame case goes from here may be wishful thinking. Only Pat and his team know what they got and what can be proved. Even if Libby is the end of the line, at least there was insight into the backroom dealings of Bush & Co.
OT:
From Yahoo! news:
‘Oh, of course’…Blandmaster Bush, the foremost proponent of ‘game of nations’ brinksmanship in our times.
Lincoln? Dilettante. Kennedy? Playboy. Churchill? Overweight piker.
>:-(
I never thought that I would ever feel nostalgic for Scott McClellan…At least he had the hazy quality of saying nothing repetitiously, instead of blurting gaucheries written on taint with tongue.
Just called home, no puppies yet, but the fluctualtions in body temp that signal the onset of labor have begun.
soon
Well, lhp, Deo mummed-up at the first sign of a challenge. What does that suggest to you?
lhp 134
Please don’t lose sleep over it. There’s nothing you can do about it while you sleep :-)
Strange web-weaving times, no? As in strange web and strange times.
twolf1 150,
ROTFLMAO
I wonder if someone like Rahm Emmanuel would come to FDL and let us engage him in a conversation. Don’t know what the philosophy here is on choosing guests, since I’m new, but it might be interesting…
i’m with you darkblack. tony started out making me queasy and now I just huff and puff at his fauxism. he’s a neocondriachal nutjob.
Ooo — dogs have hot flashes in labor? In those fur coats? Poor bitches.
fwiw, my mommydog tends to prefer my lap to start whelping … sweet but messy …
Got a designated pair of whelping pants, *ilson?
Here’s a
Florida election story from Vanity Fair
P.S. For some reason my embedded links always begin a new line?
O/T breaking news:
Senate just voted 87 to 11 to kill FEMA. In its place will be “EMA.” (not making this up)
Eleventy-million FTE dollars probably spent to remove the “F”.
EMA = “Emergency Management Authority”
Why don’t we name it ENEMA. help me out here, don’t have the name for that acronym yet)
Everyone
Not
Equipped
May
Apply
F EMA
Republican talking head on Hardball says Joe Wilson did not tell the truth about Iraq.
Does anybody seriously believe that?
kirby 1:48pm — could you scan me a copy of that Joe-nertia mailer to email to me? I’ll take it up with Stabenow’s office. Stabenow has been supported by Emily’s List; bet you dollars to donuts she’s not up on Lamont-Lieberman.
Lotus,
I wasn’t challenging him. I was looking for confirmation and additional information. Deo is right, almost everything Pat does has a purpose. ANd I was trying to get enough information to process.
Re: the dog.
First the tempurature rises above normal, then it dip below normal, then it goes above noraml again.
I delivered my own child in th emiddle of an ice storm. When they were taking me to the ambulance (it was a somewat drama filled delivery) I was astounded at how much I did not feel the cold. I was so hot, the sleet flet wonderful
LHP 155
Within 12 hours, I’ll bet.
Time to boil water and tear up petticoats. :)
Any idea how many pups?
1,205 DAYZ AND THE KILLIN’ GOES ON AND ON AND…
Take heart FDLers, it is becomin’ clearer and clearer that Fitz’s final target is Darth Cheney and that Rove and company have long since thrown the dark one under the bus…it’s only a matter of timin’ and I for one hope Fitz gets his timin’ better this election cycle…let’s have the last batch of indictments in August er September.
KEEP THE FAITH AND PASS THE POPCORN!!
I agree with Christy–this is a major yawner. My only two big questions are: 1. Who’s the first source? and 2. Why now?
As for number 1, if Novak’s original source was the same as Woodward’s, then it’s kind of hard to see how the disclosure could have been “inadvertant”. I suppose you can accidentally blow a CIA agent’s cover once, but twice?
As for 2, I’m even more puzzled. Novak’s piece obviously hurts Rove, whose people have been running around for weeks claiming he was cleared. My best wild-ass guess: Rove gave up Cheney, and now Cheney is trying to use Novak to get back at him.
Anyone know for sure when the statute of limitations runs out on a civil suit? I’ve heard it’s this Friday, but I’m not going to believe it until a reliable source gives me a date.
Enemic Non Emergency Mismanagement Authority.
I propose EBEM -
Everything But Emergency Management.
Equestrian Lawyers
Not
Endowed
Must
Apply
sorry for my oopsies before, y’all.
lhp,
I go with Deo was talkin’ trash and you should sleep well. I really can’t see why a person you trusted would say a lie rather than, “I can’t say.” And making sure those relationships are stable is very important. But I worry about you more than whatever a relative newby (Deo) throws out in a comment.
Stupid Repo talking head is now saying it has been proven that no classified information was disclosed in Plamegate.
I wasn’t aware that anything had been proven in this case. The jury decides that.
Little Dog
the vet thinks only two, which is a very small little for labs. But the mother has 6 teets engorged so I am thinkin 3-4
BobbyG 164
Guess they can’t blame the Feds if “Federal” isn’t in the name.
Idiots.
ifthethunderdontgetya 174
LOL!
Ding, Ding, Ding…
We may have a winner!
How about replacing “Enemic” with “Enverated”?
Couldn’t happen to more deserving chappies:
Texas tribe names Abramoff, Reed in suit
aaarrrgg—thar be a new thread
“Guess they can’t blame the Feds if “Federal” isn’t in the name.”
Maybe they want to make it so victims of emergencies won’t know who to call for help.
Is it talk like a pirate day again already?
Fascinating, lhp. I declare, the things ya learn around here.
Thanks Imm
But he would have no way of knowing that little factoid would throw me. Unless you are implying he made it up wholesale to bolster his “Pat missing the press confernce means something” theory?
Based on the public facts, I thought it was a reasonable theory, so reasonable that I went to the trouble to find out why Pat was not at that press conference.
And I checked on it very soon after the press conference occured, not as a result of Deo’s comment.
Glad I’m not a journalist.
You know, BobbyG, a rotten roast by any other name would stink as badly.
Eminently Non-Employable Myrmidon Archive.
BobbyG – ENEMA
HAHAHahahHAHAHAHHAAHAHA.
and your little dog, too 181 -
Well, in practical terms, all they’re effectively doing is in fact removing the “F”.
I’m sure, were we to read the new EMA enabling legislation, a shitload of it will be be all this ad nauseum org chart & pay & benefits crap. Just like the bill that created HSA.
Bobby G, Enervated is good.
Anne that’s so sweet! Your telling us reminds me of the fairy tale where the man whispers into the tree that the king has donkey’s ears…remember that one? LOL. Well enjoy the anticipation. Weddings are so fun. And tell us how it all goes a few weeks from now!
LOL about ENEMA; how about,
Emergency
Management
Entity
Minus
Accountability
It’s always talk like a pirate day for Flying Spagetti Monster true believers.
The Repo talking head, Ed Rogers?, is saying there’s no room in the Democratic Party for Joe Lieberman. Come home Joe, he says.
LHP 181
Our Dizzy only whelped three this time. Last year, it was eleven!
Three is so easy, and they are fat little mooses. They zoomed right past the gerbil stage.
Today is 12 days and somebody’s eyes are open!
Hope all goes well. Small litters can be tricky because there sometimes don’t seem to be enough signals to get everything pumping.
Keep us posted!
Little dog
Do you use rasberry leaf tea to push the contractions?
-ck- u r correct
lhp,
Yeah, I thought it was just bolstering….
Then again, maybe Deo went silent because s/he had to get back to the business of the US Attorney in Illinois? I hope we find out. And as Norske always says, KEEP THE FAITH….
Oscarsmom 195 -
Excellent!!!
No offense neurophius . . . but I read the blogs specifically so I do NOT have to jack up my blood pressure listening to those lying asshats! LOL
National talk like a pirate day is September 19th
Arrrrrrrr!
My husband ( I think) is way too willing to inject potosin, those contractions ar eso hard to watch.
I’m of the mind that unless I’m sure the welp is in trouble, you let her take her own sweet time (or you pull them out by hand.
my husband thinks mothers are firing living cannonballs and they should each come “on time”
Men!
Thanks BobbyG–but I realized I spelled it wrong!!
Emergency
Nincompoops’
Entity
Minus
Accountability
OK, Oscarsmom, I will shut up. Some FDL readers who don’t have access to a TV, or to cable, seem to appreciate hearing what people are saying, and sometimes it leads to interesting discussions. But I won’t force you to hear it.
Every time I see any MSM coverage of Fitzmas, I wonder if they are trying to get out in front of something.
I’ve been thinking the same thing.
LHP 169
I’m pretty sure the latest is don’t use Raspberry. Karen at WhelpWise says it actually contributes to uterine inertia. (although I can’t find the citation.)
Calcium, via Tums or Blue Bell Ice Cream, if you don’t have injectable, will help keep the muscles contracting.
Imm
you know when I saw the latin handle, htat was the first thing I thought too. Except Deo called Comey a partisan and a bit of a tool.
Pat would NEVER say that about Jim. And if deo worked with Pat in Chicago instead of NY, the only way he would know Jim well enough to asses him as a person, would be if Deo was either pretty far up the food chain and got to go to the good meetings,
Or,
had an Enron Task Force case. Comey instituted the ETF and oversaw(I use that term losely) all the cases that fit the criteria.
Dr. Bong has an eyepatch.
LHP 205
I use Oxytocin (Pitocin) only on the instruction of the WhelpWise nurse. She is looking at the uterine activity, and I’m reporting the heartbeats to her from the doppler.
If she sees pushing but no real uterine contractions or just weak ones, she suggests when to give the tiniest amount of Oxytocin or injectible calcium.
She works through your own vet, who prescribes the drugs, plus some Dopram for puppies that don’t get going promptly.
little dog
I know there is difference of opinion about rasberry tea. my husband is always trying to fix what ain’t broken.
Tea, shots, meddling in general. Yet every time there really is a puppy in distress, he disagrees with all the women and girls in the room.
He is a frusted Dr. He wanted to go to med school, his parents sent him to business school instead. Actually, I’m just glad he is not my doctor.
he is one of those pills cure everything instantly types.
Arrrggghhh. Did someone say Pirate?
My husband usually has at least 2 litters a year. He has 4 bitches and 2 studs at present. He just lost a really really old, way past breeding age bitch the week before last. We are still working on the grave marker.
many more critters than people in my house
HSAT:
Dr. Bong has a eyepatch.
and a peg leg, too ya scurvey turtle..
BTW {{{{{{HSAT}}}}}
Navy (Never Again Volunteer Yourself) 4 yrs – ‘84-’88. Being away from your loved ones is tough… but reunions are sweet!
:-)
Hang tough!
In case anyone is interested, Hardball is about to talk about Lieberman-Lamont.
Here is a URL for a picture if the baby hippo that was swept down to the ocean after the tsunami and adopted an aged tortoise as his mother. She(he?) tried to outrun him but finally accepted his friendship.
http://static.flickr.com/41/94…..22d8_m.jpg
Man, where are the Plame blog threads?
Typepad is down so emptywheel and JustOneMinute are dead, you guys ought to be taking up the slack!
Enough with Lieberman already, there are other issues!!
ummm…Jerry : we have already chewed up and thoroughly digested the latest Plame-stuff … get with the program …
I’m back. I actually have things to do other than post on this board … clients, you know.
Time? Well, my AUSA friend and I had just come back from Italian Village where I had a Caesar salad … so it was probably 1:30 or 1:45.
And all this “Pat” referencing is rich. I’ve known of Fitzgerald since he went to Regis (my brother went there and also went to Harvard Law).
Fitzgerald will always do the right thing and, unless he wants to leave, he’s probably safe through this administration. There’s a difference between Bush and Bush’s brain … and confusing the two will lead to errors.
Way EPU – but Novak’s conversations with Harlow are what makes him such a vile creep. He knew very good and well what Harlow was telling, and not telling, him. Really nasty business.
Let’s get one thing straight. Robert Novak is not a journalist at best he is a gossip columnist. With that being established one can admit that anyone with half of a pea brain knows that Novak was carrying water for Cheney and knew full well that he was doing so.
BTW GW is still clueless in DC. (Does not pass the half a pea brain test)