Comments on: Anatomy of a Smear http://firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/ Firedoglake weblog Thu, 26 Nov 2009 00:11:31 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: SRV-Fan http://firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-185657 SRV-Fan Wed, 12 Jul 2006 19:24:50 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-185657 <p>Katie… One problem with your paradigm shift. Our enemy doesn’t give a damn about paradigms. Islamo-Facsists don’t care about new-age psycho-babble. They want to kill or convert you and me. They want to subjugate women and brutalize homosexuals. They would do all of this to “Jesus, Mahatma Ghandi, Martin Luther King, Martin Buber..”.<br /> I’m sorry to be so simplistic or black and white but until people on the left, and some on the right recognize that we all have a real enemy out there that must be defeated or the sake of humanity, then there is no hope. Once they are defeated, then we can carry on with this liberal/conservative back and forth. The great thing about America is that we can have these types of arguments but at some point, we have to come together because the ideology of Islamo-Fascists should be diametrically opposed to everything a liberal stands for. At least I hope so.</p> Katie… One problem with your paradigm shift. Our enemy doesn’t give a damn about paradigms. Islamo-Facsists don’t care about new-age psycho-babble. They want to kill or convert you and me. They want to subjugate women and brutalize homosexuals. They would do all of this to “Jesus, Mahatma Ghandi, Martin Luther King, Martin Buber..”.
I’m sorry to be so simplistic or black and white but until people on the left, and some on the right recognize that we all have a real enemy out there that must be defeated or the sake of humanity, then there is no hope. Once they are defeated, then we can carry on with this liberal/conservative back and forth. The great thing about America is that we can have these types of arguments but at some point, we have to come together because the ideology of Islamo-Fascists should be diametrically opposed to everything a liberal stands for. At least I hope so.

]]> By: katie Jensen http://firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183826 katie Jensen Tue, 11 Jul 2006 13:40:50 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183826 <p>This is the fundamental problem. Frankly, I did a paper in 1985 for a college class where I analyzed Reagan’s speechs for uses of power and control. The power and control wheel was created by the Duluth model for the treatment of men who are violent. (domestic violence). The power wheel basically lays out some behaviors that will be the foundation to eventual violence. On the the wheel, the use of intimidation, name calling and mind games, isolation, minimize, deny and blame (the violence), treating people as objects (womens as sex objects, prejudice, using children to get back at a spouse), the concept “I am king of the castlel…I can do what I want”, using money to financially control someone, and using coercion and threats. If you think about basic training in the military this is precisely the paradigm used. The military uses power and control…any link to violence there??</p> <p>Reagan was the beginning of this trend. I believe it was a back lash to watergate. Reagan used attack ads and lots a patronizing. His tough talk is credited with bringing down the Soviet Union but in my opinion that is a bunch of bunk. The soviet union was destroying itself for many years and we had many spies that had infiltrated their government with democratic ideas. We had Armand Hammer over there doing his thing with capitalism. But America loves a tough guy. </p> <p>As long as we continue to beat our children into submission and describe that as “good parenting”, as long as “fighting back” is seen as admirable, as long as we avoid the words of Jesus, Mahatma Ghandi, Martin Luther King, Martin Buber, etc. The problem is that the country responds to power and control. We submit to it. We honor it. We are a military nation.</p> <p>It’s tough to swallow but unfortunately, it requires a full paradigm shift and anyone making that shift…from power and control of others to personal responsibility and accountability will be attacked. That’s the way it works with new ideas. They killed Jesus…they killed Martin Luther King…there is nothing more threatening than this concept because it means that they would lose control of us. They would lose their ability to move the masses with fear and threats. We aren’t quite sure how to function without waving some kind of a big stick. The big stick keeps the wealth where they want it.</p> This is the fundamental problem. Frankly, I did a paper in 1985 for a college class where I analyzed Reagan’s speechs for uses of power and control. The power and control wheel was created by the Duluth model for the treatment of men who are violent. (domestic violence). The power wheel basically lays out some behaviors that will be the foundation to eventual violence. On the the wheel, the use of intimidation, name calling and mind games, isolation, minimize, deny and blame (the violence), treating people as objects (womens as sex objects, prejudice, using children to get back at a spouse), the concept “I am king of the castlel…I can do what I want”, using money to financially control someone, and using coercion and threats. If you think about basic training in the military this is precisely the paradigm used. The military uses power and control…any link to violence there??

Reagan was the beginning of this trend. I believe it was a back lash to watergate. Reagan used attack ads and lots a patronizing. His tough talk is credited with bringing down the Soviet Union but in my opinion that is a bunch of bunk. The soviet union was destroying itself for many years and we had many spies that had infiltrated their government with democratic ideas. We had Armand Hammer over there doing his thing with capitalism. But America loves a tough guy.

As long as we continue to beat our children into submission and describe that as “good parenting”, as long as “fighting back” is seen as admirable, as long as we avoid the words of Jesus, Mahatma Ghandi, Martin Luther King, Martin Buber, etc. The problem is that the country responds to power and control. We submit to it. We honor it. We are a military nation.

It’s tough to swallow but unfortunately, it requires a full paradigm shift and anyone making that shift…from power and control of others to personal responsibility and accountability will be attacked. That’s the way it works with new ideas. They killed Jesus…they killed Martin Luther King…there is nothing more threatening than this concept because it means that they would lose control of us. They would lose their ability to move the masses with fear and threats. We aren’t quite sure how to function without waving some kind of a big stick. The big stick keeps the wealth where they want it.

]]> By: Knut Wicksell http://firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183770 Knut Wicksell Tue, 11 Jul 2006 12:50:12 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183770 <p>Back to Murtha. We have to ask the deeper questin why Swiftboating works. This goes to this morning’s discussion over at Kos on the Olberman/Dean interview — whether and to what extent America is trending fascist. I think reason why a man as respected as Murtha can be plausibly Swiftboated is because the vast majority of the public don’t know who he is. the 23 percent of fascists don’t care, and will go with their leaders. The rest will say, there’s two sides to every question, where there’s smoke, there’s fire, etc. In short, ignorance plus laziness, plus a committed minority are enough to sink just about anyone.</p> <p>The technique was perfected by long practice on the Clintons. I don’t see any real cure for it. Americans don’t really want to govern themselves.</p> Back to Murtha. We have to ask the deeper questin why Swiftboating works. This goes to this morning’s discussion over at Kos on the Olberman/Dean interview — whether and to what extent America is trending fascist. I think reason why a man as respected as Murtha can be plausibly Swiftboated is because the vast majority of the public don’t know who he is. the 23 percent of fascists don’t care, and will go with their leaders. The rest will say, there’s two sides to every question, where there’s smoke, there’s fire, etc. In short, ignorance plus laziness, plus a committed minority are enough to sink just about anyone.

The technique was perfected by long practice on the Clintons. I don’t see any real cure for it. Americans don’t really want to govern themselves.

]]> By: Gary E http://firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183522 Gary E Tue, 11 Jul 2006 03:45:02 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183522 <p>Once we realize all of this chatter has nothing to do with politics but more about the language of the powerless….. then we can grow into what we need to become.</p> Once we realize all of this chatter has nothing to do with politics but more about the language of the powerless….. then we can grow into what we need to become.

]]> By: ironranger http://firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183501 ironranger Tue, 11 Jul 2006 03:26:25 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183501 <p>OMG, there I was just cruisin through the comments when for a second I thought lotus was talking about Barbara Bush…hind legs both in trouble…laminitis…right pastern. I’m still laughing at my brain fart.</p> OMG, there I was just cruisin through the comments when for a second I thought lotus was talking about Barbara Bush…hind legs both in trouble…laminitis…right pastern. I’m still laughing at my brain fart.

]]> By: bill http://firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183335 bill Tue, 11 Jul 2006 01:53:06 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183335 <p>This garbage is all so obvious. How is it that so many people just continue shopping the WalMart way and ignoring the truth about the right wing weasels that fill the universe with lies and hate? Are people really this stupid?</p> This garbage is all so obvious. How is it that so many people just continue shopping the WalMart way and ignoring the truth about the right wing weasels that fill the universe with lies and hate? Are people really this stupid?

]]> By: Oklahoma kiddo http://firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183252 Oklahoma kiddo Tue, 11 Jul 2006 01:11:13 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183252 <p>fran…225</p> <p>“tea party approach”?</p> fran…225

“tea party approach”?

]]> By: Mommybrain http://firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183201 Mommybrain Tue, 11 Jul 2006 00:42:10 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183201 <p>BarbaraB - I love Chakri. It goes on the list. Thanks.</p> BarbaraB – I love Chakri. It goes on the list. Thanks.

]]> By: Mommybrain http://firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183196 Mommybrain Tue, 11 Jul 2006 00:40:32 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183196 <p>Leslie in CA 222 - (gossip warning) Several of my friends worked on her 04 campaign. Well before election night, not a single one was willing to be seen as still supporting her. She tacked waaaay right at the end and supported positions on immigration and the war that would bring her votes and $$$ but not Dem respect. </p> <p>At the CDP convention in April: during the district caucus, when candidates give 2 min speeches and delegates vote to endorse one candidate, her “speech” was a somewhat manic attack on her opponent; she said absolutely nothing about herself and her beliefs/policies. After the vote (in which several of her “supporters” voted “no endorsement”), which she lost, she burst into tears. Think she can handle the big time? </p> <p>Later, she called the convention center police over and told her one of my buddies had pushed her (absolutely untrue) and asked that they arrest her. When my friend confronted her in front of the cops, she backed down. Her supporters have tried to get my club’s charter revoked at the state level because we voted not to endorse her. </p> <p>She’s big trouble. Based on my personal observations of her behavior, I don’t think she’s qualified.<br /> (end gossip)</p> Leslie in CA 222 – (gossip warning) Several of my friends worked on her 04 campaign. Well before election night, not a single one was willing to be seen as still supporting her. She tacked waaaay right at the end and supported positions on immigration and the war that would bring her votes and $$$ but not Dem respect.

At the CDP convention in April: during the district caucus, when candidates give 2 min speeches and delegates vote to endorse one candidate, her “speech” was a somewhat manic attack on her opponent; she said absolutely nothing about herself and her beliefs/policies. After the vote (in which several of her “supporters” voted “no endorsement”), which she lost, she burst into tears. Think she can handle the big time?

Later, she called the convention center police over and told her one of my buddies had pushed her (absolutely untrue) and asked that they arrest her. When my friend confronted her in front of the cops, she backed down. Her supporters have tried to get my club’s charter revoked at the state level because we voted not to endorse her.

She’s big trouble. Based on my personal observations of her behavior, I don’t think she’s qualified.
(end gossip)

]]> By: BarbaraB http://firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183187 BarbaraB Tue, 11 Jul 2006 00:35:21 +0000 http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/07/10/anatomy-of-a-smear/#comment-183187 <p>Mommybrain — My current male Siamese’s name is Oberon, Obie for short. You’re welcome to borrow it if you like. Or, if you like Shakespeare and want the name of a scamp who cleaned up his act, try Henry. Or go for something Thai: Chakri, the royal dynasty of Thailand, or Bhumibol, which seems like a mouthful (although Bhumi might work.)</p> <p>Punaise — As I recall, Elliott was one of your top three. I’d suggest “Futbol” but it might make people think you kick your cat. Or maybe “Soccer”?</p> Mommybrain — My current male Siamese’s name is Oberon, Obie for short. You’re welcome to borrow it if you like. Or, if you like Shakespeare and want the name of a scamp who cleaned up his act, try Henry. Or go for something Thai: Chakri, the royal dynasty of Thailand, or Bhumibol, which seems like a mouthful (although Bhumi might work.)

Punaise — As I recall, Elliott was one of your top three. I’d suggest “Futbol” but it might make people think you kick your cat. Or maybe “Soccer”?

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