
(Image by darkblack)
Granted, this whole Jason "I write Steve Gilliard’s emails so he doesn’t have to" Zengerle flap has been flogged by both sides of the issue to the point that surely, everything that can be said has been said. To me, it seems safe to say that we can leave this matter to the paste-addled Lost Boys of the Right to hash out indefinitely. But before we abandon the topic altogher, Billmon has weighed in on the issue, and the points he makes are worth repeating.
It sure has felt like We Hate Blogs Week between Zengerle, Brooks, Siegel, and the like. Billmon seems to know why:
OK, so now I’ve given you all my disclaimers. But I still haven’t explained why I’m even talking about this stupid crap. The reason is what happened over the weekend: i.e. the major slime job in Newsweek, and David Brooks’ ridiculous column in the New Pravda. The campaign against Kos, which I’d originally dismissed as just another pissy TNR vendetta, is starting to look more and more like a coordinated effort: a Swiftboat operation. At the very least, it’s snowballing into a more systematic media attack on Left Blogistan, which makes it my fight as well as Kos’s.
I’m not suggesting Karl Rove (or some other GOP mastermind) is behind this, or even that there is some kind of cabal of neocon/dino democrat-leaning journalists orchestrating it. But the m.o. very much resembles the classic Swiftboat strategy: start some vague, unsourced allegations echoing in the blogosphere, then persuade your ideological allies in the corporate media to start firing on target — based on the flimsy excuse that "people are talking" about the "issue." Rinse and repeat.
(snip)
But none of this seething animosity would have mattered, or made it into print, if Kos hadn’t committed the mortal sin of becoming too big and too visible to ignore. When you combine the relatively successful launch of his book — which took a sawed off shotgun to the leeches attached to the Democratic Party’s flabby underbelly — the huge media coverage of this month’s Yearly Kos convention, and (last but hardly least) the role of the netroots in boosting Ned Lamont’s primary challenge to the TNR’s pride and joy, it’s clear that Kos has turned into a much more formidable opponent than the Dino Democrats bargained for.
Maybe it’s just a coindidence that the media attacks started almost as soon as Yearly Kos ended, but I doubt it. Either all that favorable media coverage pushed the pretty boys at the TNR and the Times over the edge, or somebody, as they say in Godfather II, pushed a button.
(second snip)
Really, this is a pathetic excuse for slander. The TNR brigade should have taken their lead from Instapundit, and stuck to slyly relaying spurious rumors about Kos’s sexual orientation — while pretending to disparage said rumors. That’s how you get to be a big name smear artist.
The real question in my mind is what the attack puppies are trying to accomplish. Surely they must understand that in the end, there is no such thing as bad publicity for a blogger. Ann Coulter has built an extremely lucrative career out of being attacked in print by her opponents. Does the TNR really think Daily Kos’s traffic and ad revenues are going to do down because of this? If so, it may explain why the fucking rag is withering away: an absolute lack of business sense.
(final snip)
Whether that’s good or bad for the Kossaks I don’t know — I suppose it depends on how much credence you give to Gandhi’s old saw: "First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win." In the real world — and in imperial America, too — the truth is that sometimes they ignore you, then ridicule you, then fight you and crush you like an overripe eggplant. We’ll see if that’s true this time. Either way, though, it looks like the battle between the netroots and dino Dems is going to get very down and dirty indeed.
(Posted by billmon at June 26, 2006 08:09 PM)
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ah ha! Fitz!
Hi TRex.
Frecond?
My initial reaction to the TNR hit piece was this: “Boy, the success of YearlyKos sure scared the shit out of someone!” After reading Billmon’s analysis (among many others) it looks like I was right.
“There are too many of us for you to take out altogether. Strike one blogger down, and fifty more will rise up to fill the void.”
Words of wisdom!
TRex! You did/do radio? Where, WUOG?
the pic is greatness.
Dr. N, I’m at the NPR station here. I host ‘All Things Considered’ and a late night classical music show (which I’m hosting right now) called “Night Music”.
Are you from Athens? Oh, wait, you used to live here, didn’t you?
the pic is greatness.
Innit? I had to BEG darkblack to do it.
I prolly should have asked Jane before I used it tonight, but I don’t think she’ll mind.
Amen TRex….
I am on the road this week, having conversations with people at the hotel “happy hour”. The country going down the tubes and what to do, what to do… and I pipe up…. “are you doing anything?”
“Doing anything?” ….. Ya, are you doing anything to make change happen?
Wow…. I saw a glimmer of a light go off… And then I did my….. “If you are not hearing what you want to hear, then you must not be saying it”
If you are not seeing what needs to be done, then you are not doing something to make it happen!
September 12 my name will be on the ballot become an elected Precinct Committeeperson. Doing something!
One blogger is easy to dismiss – s/he’s crazy.
Two bloggers are easy to dismiss – they’re a whacked out couple.
But can you imagine three bloggers . . . four bloggers . . . can you imagine, a hundred folks a day, coming to a blog, and singing their song . . .
“You can get anything you want, at Jane and Redd’s Firedoglake . . . “
Yep, we got us a movement, all right. The FDL Anti-Monarchy, Constitutional Accountability, Public Servant-loving Movement. Any all you’ve got to do to join is jump in on the chorus the next time the thread comes around. In harmony.
“You can get anything you want, at Jane and Redd’s Firedoglake . . . “
Be afraid, evildoers. Be very afraid.
“We’re here because we love our country and believe that it can be restored to greatness and we’re willing to work together to make sure that it happens.”
Amen…
Trex, who’s playing Baby Jesus?
still getting a chuckle out of “special needs voters (Republicans)” from last night
ahhhhh Trex! I love a man who can type “parvenu”!
and a perfect post to end today
So is Kobe the Holy Ghost or GodtheBlogfather?
Amen Brother.
What I lack in smarts I make up for in size.
And I’ve got your back.
siun, the HG is a bird.
Trex, who’s playing Baby Jesus?
That’s some liberal blogger dude. What’s his name? Kaz? Koop?
well opdear … I did remember that – bird or tongues of fire (which I always like better)
Strike one blogger down, and fifty more will rise up to fill the void.
Not me, I’m too lazy; but I will post comments.
Excellent post otherwise (other than that snide remark about “nice” people)
Oh, the curly do is throwing me off.
“There are too many of us for you to take out altogether. Strike one blogger down, and fifty more will rise up to fill the void.”
Hydradoglake?
Obi Jane Kenobi?
Jane is the Lord Almighty, Kobe is the Son, and Christy is the Holy Prosecutorial Ghost.
That’s my story and I’m sticking to it.
Trex … you’ll have to join our media team for next YKOS! My best cohort is a former npr gm and we had a very good time encouraging the npr folks who covered – and an extra wonderful time with Adam Burke who I now have a tremendous crush on (oops … I did not say that!)
Hi TRex- someone in comments earlier today asked for a special TRex category so that it would be easier to find your previous articles. Is it okay if I do that? Would you add that category to your posts? thx
I’m trying to stick to a strict no-blogwhoring diet, but I do have a Kobe pic and a Jane pic up from Jane’s visit to Pittsburgh Drinking Liberally.
(Hmm, “Kobe Jane Kenobi” works even better…)
well, when you become TRex, Inc., just remember to throw a bone to us little folks who were there at the beginnning…
Tweety on Colbert.
more ot … ahem …
one thing that’s been striking to me dealing with te media recently is how far so many of them are from getting it … not so much on the koolaid bit but on the basic journalism 101 score as well as complete befuddlement over anything open source
The number of unsourced, innuendo-based, not-even-a-pretence-of-fact-check pieces is just pure bad form – and that’s from our “friends” And many think that if they report something on their “blogs” they don’t have to do any of the usual due diligence – they seem to think calling it a “blog” absolves them from any basic journalistic responsibility.
love the virgin jane, but you better include three poodles wrapped in swaddling clothes for the picture to be complete.
who are those people in the picture supposed to be?
It doesn’t matter here who your parents are . . .
. . . except, of course, for the fact that if you’re here, they probably did a good job of raising you to think for yourself, teaching you to be open to the wisdom of others, and instilling a love for your neighbor.
Kind of like Greta.
In that sense, who your parents are matters a great deal.
Having said that, there are a whole lot of folks out there to whom I need to say thank you . . . but I don’t know how to contact them. If you all could pass these thoughts along to the appropriate people from me, I’d appreciate it.
Eli – gorgeous pic of Jane … that’s a keeper!
Ah, yes… is that WGAU? Anyway, cool. You don’t go by some lame-ass Sinjin (St John), do you? ;-)
There was a British PBS program, on the launch of Operation Barbarossa — Hitler’s invasion of the Soviet Union.
It read a passage written by a German Officer, who said something to the effect that the Wehrmacht was like an elephant attacking an ant hill — millions of ants would be killed, but in the end, the ants would overcome the elephant and pick it’s carcass clean.
Karl Rove and his wing nut minions will never defeat us, because we are vast — we contain multitudes.
We are like ants . . .
We’ve been playing whack a mole for way too long with them.
About time the roles were reversed. And there’s getting to be a lot more of us than them.
Game on.
I’m assuming I count among the we who are legion who scare the wee-wee off (out of) they who are more powerful than we. When we actually do something, we who are legion, then. I don’t know. I’ll be really happy?
Let’s do something why don’t we?
Do I have to be a patriot though? I don’t wanna.
hell yes! count me in!
….You can get anything you want, at Jane and Redd’s Firedoglake
Eli – gorgeous pic of Jane %u2026 that’s a keeper!
Thanks! I got a great picture of Jane laughing… right after we moved from outdoors to indoors, and, um, before I changed my camera settings…
Chris Wallace just put Colbert in a headlock.
And vice versa.
Good Lord.
ELi,
Better?
http://i67.photobucket.com/alb…..epirx1.jpg
Chris Mathews, aka Tweety on Colbert
nice shots eli! that’s my arm behind kobe. wow. i’m having my 15 minutes.
“And we’ve got your number. You can move forward with us, or get dragged behind us. The choice is yours.”
What’s more, we don’t care what choice you make. We’ve got access–to a computer. And we have a pretty damn big megaphone.
ELi,
Better?
Heh. I tried it like that, but I liked it better dark.
i can’t write worth shit, but i do have a overactive imagination…
trex, you sure know how to turn a phrase…oh, the pictures i have in my mind right now……
Tweety: Hardball is trying to get a little bit of truth out of a pol. You gotta keep squeezing and squeezing– not the balls but the brain.
He comes off like a doofus and when asked what his political persuasion was said I don’t wanna tell, make me!
Beautiful pic– tis the essence of Ms. Jane, Eli!
Great post TRex!
Thanks, angie! And squirrel hiller! I’m not 100% sure which one you were – what were you wearing?
Ah, yes%u2026 is that WGAU? Anyway, cool. You don’t go by some lame-ass Sinjin (St John), do you? ;-)
St. John was my first serious boyfriend, but that was waaaaaaay before either of us even thought about going into radio. Lord, that was 16 years ago. Whew!
Time flies when you get old.
Well done, TRex. Well done. I too was plucked from obscurity in the comment threads.
TRex, another fine post. Nice to be hanging with all ya’ll on the Group W Bench.
I’ll tell you, when I was in San Francisco this weekend, the fog was so thick that the chip in my skull couldn’t receive instructions from Kos’ satellite. I was overwhelmed and disoriented with options. Thank God, the fog burned off in the afternoon and I was back “on point.”
I don’t think I’ll be going back any time soon.
Okay, shift’s over, amigos!
Gonna run to the store and procure some dinner, then I’ll check in from home.
Thanks for coming!
TRex, wait! You forgot to take my list with you.
It feels like a coordinated attack to me. Bush, Cheney. and Snow doing that multiple versions of the same talk thing they did before the war; pundits from the right all hitting the same targets at once; everyone banging out the same message on multiple fronts.
Seems like the Rovian orchestrated, Full Monty, with only slight twists from every other time.
It’s not called paranoia when they’re shooting real bullets.
Oh man… the world is too small. I’ll shut up now.
TRex, you just keep the hits coming. Thanks for another great post.
DB #51:
Mark Twain once remarked that he’d never spent as cold a winter as summer in SF. Drop back in September-October, and you’ll be dazzled at the beauty.
punaise at 27:
well, when you become TRex, Inc., just remember to throw a bone to us little folks who were there at the beginnning…
We represent
the Lollipop Guild
the Lollipop Guild
the Lollipop Guild…
Hee hee!
The picture is different. It seems odd to say it’s different, but it’s DIFFERENT! Like baby Jesus, do you think they hate Kos cause he’s got personal power, compassion, wisdom and is real? They don’t know what they’re missing. It’s not too late for them to come along is it?
Mickey #54:
Agree, Rove called out lefty blogs in one of his speeches the week before. From a communications standpoint, they really know how to bring it.
We represent
the Lollipop Guild
the Lollipop Guild
the Lollipop Guild%u2026
Hee hee!
Lollipup Guild, I think.
I just wonder why they can’t play this dirty against the Rethuglicans. WTF?
I just wonder why they can’t play this dirty against the Rethuglicans. WTF?
With what army? The Democrats are at the wrong end of the megaphone.
I prolly should have asked Jane before I used it tonight, but I don’t think she’ll mind.
Either that, or she’ll be too deeply disturbed to ever post again. One of the two.
(Even so, that’s no excuse for not even making the attempt)
With what army?
I dunno… The New Republic?
Fantastic post, great link, and darkblack for the win!
The corporate media/Beltway Dems/corrupt powermongers wish they were only “observers.”
Mrs. K8—Norske’s been around but perhaps not with the same frequency as he used to. His last post was yesterday
Your question reminded me of something I’ve been meaning to ask for a while.
Does anyone know what happened to Grandpa? Anyone know how to reach him?
I dunno… The New Republic?
I hope that was sarcasm…
Eli – Lollipup Guild, I think.
LOL. that saves us from becoming Lolliputians
off to watch Gaul take it to Iberia (tape delay)
From Rove’s lips to TNR’s ears. The timing of Rove’s speach works for me, and we know how effective PiggyRove is at getting out what he wants gotten out by his minions on the right.
LOL. that saves us from becoming Lolliputians
And the moderators save us from Trolliputians.
Eli #63: Got a mirror handy?
As I live in the greater Phoenix area, the morning Arizona Republic printed in their OP/ED section, their support for the Sentator from CT. Our favorite Joe Liberman.
http://www.azcentral.com/arizo…..e2-27.html
Warning: For those who have a weak stomach, please avoid this article.
Personally, TRex, I’d prefer to see Brooks “dragged behind” us.
Moderator comment: rest edited out. Jane has said very clearly that she doesn’t want anything advocating violence posted- Period.
I think we need to be very mindful that the attacks come not from Rove but from the neocon wing of the dems … like TNR.
Wonderful post TRex, especially the last paragraph. It’s true…”We’re here and we’re coming in”.
We also have our great sense of humor to ride us through any rough spots. Nothing annoys them more than our laughing at their ridiculous and transparent attempts to stop us. And, seriously, we’re not going away until we change things for the better.
Eli #63: Got a mirror handy?
We are not an army, if that’s what you’re getting at. The blogosphere seems big and loud and important when you’re inside it, but most of the people watching CNN and Fox News don’t even know it *exists*.
In terms of getting message/narrative out, the media trumps the blogosphere without even breaking a sweat. We’re narrowing the gap, but it’s still huge and I think it always will be.
In retrospect, I probably should have typed “his most recent comment”
Actually, one caveat to my last post: If the media overreaches and utterly discredits itself, the US media situation will emulate that of the Soviet Union, where everyone knows Pravda and Izvestia are government lies, and turns to the samizdat to find out what’s *really* going on.
Second caveat: I think a larger percentage of *influential* people are aware of the blogosphere and what it’s saying, and it definitely gets under their skin, or else TNR/Brooks/et al. wouldn’t even bother.
eli 48
i was wearing a button that said “an insult to primates everywhere” with a pix of guess who in the middle. i rode my bicycle also.
Phoenix … heh!
I had a long chat with my mom in New Haven yesterday and she was raving about Lamont and the attention he’s drawing. Said she was at a big shindig on the Green and Lieberman’s folks were having trouble giving away their flyers while everyone was lined up to see Ned!
I mentioned that nasty Lieberman flyer that we all talked about yesterday and she said “oh, that’s what that was … I threw it out … I never read that junk.”
I should note that a month ago she was not so sure that Ned could make an impression and she was worried he couldn’t win New Haven – now she’s telling all her friends to vote for him – and when anyone spouts the “greenwich millionaire” line she asks what’s wrong with that and how much money do you think Joe’s socked away!
Deborah—No, we’re not going anywhere, much to the annoyance of the haties of the wingersphere. I will just pray for them…it pisses them off and does me good. ;)
yow
za
-and i’m a guilder.
thanks
i was wearing a button that said “an insult to primates everywhere” with a pix of guess who in the middle. i rode my bicycle also.
I need clothing colors. I recognize people by overall big-picture gestalt.
I should note that a month ago she was not so sure that Ned could make an impression and she was worried he couldn’t win New Haven – now she’s telling all her friends to vote for him – and when anyone spouts the “greenwich millionaire” line she asks what’s wrong with that and how much money do you think Joe’s socked away!
Shorter CT voters: “You had me at ‘Someone’s running against Lieberman.’”
It was not long ago that if someone on NPR or cable made a reference to blogs, someone would feel the need to explain to listeners what they were talking about. And there were damn few references to them. I didn’t really discover them until the 2004 campaign.
I think their spread is viral, and mostly apart from regular media. We don’t depend on Tweety to get the word out. Finding a blog where like-minded people congregate is an aha! experience, especially if you live in a conservative part of the map.
When I read that so many YK attendees were not, ahem, young, I thought it was hardly coincidence that people who graduated from high school in the sixties and seventies were still idealistic, still trying to save the world a small chunk at a time. We are not going gently into the ominous deepening twilight all around us. We have had enough. And some of our children are joining us.
TRex, I really appreciate this post. You summed up so beautifully what has been passing for groupthink on cable and in print during the last few weeks. The barrage of snotty criticism is new, and I think you’re right about the reasons for it.
Darkblack is a genius.
Eli – I’m not saying that we trump the media yet (if I thought that I wouldn’t work in media relations) but look at the cable viewership numbers and contrast with the big blogs reader numbers and we’re closing fast amongst news junkies. And YearlyKos got a lot of very positive attention out there beyond the blogosphere.
Evening. I think it’s good that all weathered the attack. Rejoice. But don’t let your guard down! Remember: Never Underestimate Your Enemy
No doubt an attack was mounted. This time the attack was weak; disorganized. Some guy creates false emails, while another writes an OpEd piece that makes childish references to lambs and so forth. Scattered attack. BUT:
They’ll be back. They’ll come back harder, stronger, and better organized. You’ll need to learn to counter their next attack in better fashion than you did this time. The critcal review: the left, progressive Democrat response was also scattered, diffused. Learn from this. You can, and you will.
Consider the last many days as a shell that fell wide. But they’ll learn to zero in. But for tonight, you deserve some accolades. Job well done. But….it’s not over.
Ghostman
“We are striking fear in the hearts of all the right people. We’re coming over the barricades.”
So, TRex, now that you’re over the kewl kid hurdle and headed to pundit-dom, how does it feel? Tell us how it feels to be a Townhousian.
Rabid lambs want to know.
Great post, I think this really does signify a turning point in the balance of powers.
I also liked this bit from Billmon’s excellent post:
That aside, I think he’s dead on that the DLC/neolob/oldschool consultancy is starting to hear their deathknell as they watch us gain power and momentum. So, yes. The long knives are coming out.
i just wanted to add my two cents as far as the sliming of the left side of the blogosphere is concerned. it (the liberal blogosphere, yearly kos etc.) doesn’t need to be defended. it just is. and what it is is fucking beautiful. the sound you hear is jealousy, plain and simple. defend it if you want but it speaks for itself and the wit and humor drown out all the no talent losers in the msm. does anyone honestly think we need to stick up for wolcott? get it? blogostan is the ultimate meritocracy and our side has all the merit. case closed. fuck the trolls, fuck the sell-outs and fuck the critics. they all add up to a sock full of shit. just do what you do and ignore david brooks and the rest of the trolls. if you defend you are attacked.
I’m not saying the blogs have no presence at all, but I think their total readership is a very small fraction of the electorate, especially compared to the mass media.
I don’t really know what the big blogs’ readership numbers mean, because I don’t know how you truly identify unique readers.
The truth of the matter is that we are the real patriots. We’re here because we love our country and believe that it can be restored to greatness and we’re willing to work together to make sure that it happens.
yup. and no manner of watb crying is going to make assholes like me go away.
I was always struck by the fact that getting into the blogs and getting somethig out of them is really quite easy if you simply READ and follow some links for a month perhaps.
And L Blogistan is loaded with talent, passion, ideas, ethics and cutting analysis. Why don’t these people over there wise up and learn something? All they have to do is use their little mouse…
So they either have studied this thing and see how it is and how it grows and how is could rattle this cage… or they just are dumb as the lamp post and can’t even see what is right in front of their eyes and have to stomp on it from pure unadulterated paranoia.
The latter seems so hard to believe so they must really be running scare that the people have a way to join hands across america… instead of across their own street and this smells like trouble for them up there in DC.
Curious here to see how big the blogistan can grow and stay the same… without getting hierarchical and celeb pundit like. Cheeze they all ready had Kos on MTP!
I’m going to bed…. bye
Left Blogistan-”We are legion”
Right Blogistan-”We are lesions”
-GSD
Hi Teddy- I sent you an email earlier, asking for a personal favor. Has it turned up?
eli 88
i had an olive denim jacket and black bike trousers with black bike shoes. glasses askew and goofy brown hair. caucasian. female. all teeth. scar on nose.
Ghostman – I think the key thing is not how “you” do but what *we* do.
In fact, I wrote the following in a response to the nonsense at Ezra Klein’s today:
…………………………..
Just a bit of background –
The Zengerle story was launched by the Suellentrop piece in the NYT which originally relied in part on false information posted by “Petey” on another blog. As the media coordinator for YearlyKos, I requested and received a very solid correction of that information by the NYT and now Ezra has also posted a correction as a later post here.
The reliance on unsourced and un-checked “information” – esp “information” from parties with a dog in the fight be it animus toward Markos or something else – in this whole uproar is a very good lesson in how far journalistic ethics have fallen.
Stephen’s comment about our internalizing of the media message is very important and should be noted. It’s fascinating to see so many jumping to the tune of the smear campaign – for that is what this is – rather than considering what and why is driving this story. With CTG and YKOS making a big impression beyond the blogosphere, the powers that be are hitting back – and it seems that many here are very willing to add their weight to that hit.
Are there questions about Jerome’s past – seems so – and I’m sure they will be addressed when and as they can be. But the point of the attack is not to hurt Jerome, it’s to hurt Markos as the representative face of the blogoshere. We may all understand that identifying Markos as “the blogosphere” is a sign of how much “they” don’t get it – and we may have varying personal opionions about Markos (I like him but disagree with him on a bunch of stuff) – but the apparent willingness to ignore what is really going on here – a serious attempt to discredit the blogosphere – shows that a lot of “us” need to learn a bit more about how the game is played.
The best responses to this whole thing have come from the wide array of blog readers who have fought back with humor and baaa’s and gone on with their work to change the political discourse in this country – they understand that our work is not dependent on or dimished by either the possible flaws of one person or the approval of the big boys.
posted by: siun | Jun 27, 2006 12:34:44 PM
You know, I made some comments such as this two days ago over at Crooks and Liars and got jumped on as being a troll or a closet Repub. It’s nice to see unity, but me thinks there’s people out there who A) haven’t yet learned to properly focus their rage and B) haven’t learned anything about the the Right’s smear tactics. Don’t get caught in their fake controversies and just flat out roll over them with truth and power. Did people already forget your your other great post TRex? I know blogs have short attention span, but damn people, that was just last week.
gsd 99 -
ewwwwwww!
hee-hee-hee…
And L Blogistan is loaded with talent, passion, ideas, ethics and cutting analysis. Why don’t these people over there wise up and learn something? All they have to do is use their little mouse…
This is one of the many things that pisses me off so much about the Dems. They have this huge, incredible open source resource just dying to help, and all they can think of is to hit it up for money.
i had an olive denim jacket and black bike trousers with black bike shoes. glasses askew and goofy brown hair. caucasian. female. all teeth. scar on nose.
Ah, okay. I think I may have been looking at the wrong arm, then. I was looking at a bare one. It was nice meeting you!
Eli @96-
While our numbers may be small percentage-wise, the influence goes the other direction. I can no longer count how many times co-workers have come up to me and said, ‘hey, you read blogs. What’s really up with xxx?’
While our numbers may be small percentage-wise, the influence goes the other direction. I can no longer count how many times co-workers have come up to me and said, ‘hey, you read blogs. What’s really up with xxx?’
Oh, how I hope that’s so. My worry is the vast, vast millions of uncritical, unquestioning lumps who get *all* their info and opinions from the TV.
nodding to zzyzx … it’s like in the early tech days when everyone would ask “what computer should I buy” coz you were the resident techie …
Hey Eli – your fave books include some of mine – Queen of Angels – awesome and the Gap Series was a rush! Eon scares me to this day but I’ll have to check your others. Any chance you read KSR?
remember that 70% of those “vast unquestioning lumps” don’t like Bush
it’s funny, billmon’s point. he says it beautifully, but i’ll try my hand: any asshole with a website can say anything. the truth or falsity of the statement made is neither here nor there. then a “legitimate” news source can “report on the controversy” leaving aside any discussion of the underlying statement’s veracity.
that’s it. it’s happening to my family right now. my wife is being defamed by an anonymous poster who has made horrible accusations against her. a prominent magazine in her field took these accusations and reported on the controversy without examining the issue at hand.
it sucks. i can tell you, it sucks when SBVFT does it, and it sucks when it happens to you. i won’t bore anyone here with the details, but please do come on by my site and leave a supportive message should you be so inclined. i’ve been a light but regular poster here for a while, and i love this site.
When the threat gets real enough, the SPEW starts flowing. The attacks are a sign of success and fear. Nothin’ to do but keep the hand on the rudder and to keep on keepin’ on…Respond, not react, I guess…but the work goes on.
eli 96
“…their total readership is a very small fraction of the electorate, especially compared to the mass media.”
i dont think thats the point. check out malcome gladwell’s “the tipping point.” he writes of “social epidemics” and devines three basic forces: “the Connectors, the Mavens, and the Salesmen.” blogs like this almost epitomize his notion of connectors as a vital force. not by numbers but by symbiotic influence.
Eli @ 96
But when it comes to winning elections, the size of the electorate is almost an afterthought. What matters is the size of the group you get to show up on the Big Tuesday (or send in their absentee ballots before then). That’s a whole ‘nuther kettle of fish, and the correlation between newsjunkies and voters tends to be quite high.
Ghostman @ 92 is spot on with his crystal ball. The vicious, old school newspaper wars of earlier in US history are moving to electronic communications, and folks are just figuring out how to fight the battles.
They’ll be back, and we will be ready.
darkblack is such a friendly genious. And Trex is well, Teddy asks the most amazingly pertinent questions that I would want to know. With all due respect.
Eli -
In terms of getting message/narrative out, the media trumps the blogosphere without even breaking a sweat. We’re narrowing the gap, but it’s still huge and I think it always will be.
I don’t think we need to beat the media overall. But the reason people like TNR are sweating is because we’re seriously competing with them, the pundits and “opinion-makers.” Not on TV, yet (though I’m sure Kos’ MTP appearance has something to do with all this), but thoughtful bloggers are being referenced more and more in mass-circulation print publications (especially those with web versions.)
Real news reporting takes a lot of resources, and even bonehead TV like Fox takes a lot of people with talent and training. But for “opinion” journalists, blogs are disruptive, a revolutionary threat, because you don’t need connections or years of toil in a low-level magazine job or whatever, you just need to be able to write well and have a bit of luck getting noticed.
Eli, I hear you, and agree. Which is why I urge everyone to widen the circle by reaching out to family….friends….anyone who might listen, and tell them to make up their own minds, but at least do so from a wider range of perspectives. Telling people to find out more without telling them what to think seems to work pretty well, at least it has for me.
Plus, it helps that there are so many good writers on the left…..
FDL is really great. But what they’re doing is scaring people who don’t have time to figure things out and who are easily swayed by the incessent terror talk. My boomer age, successful sister just won’t see a Michael Moore movie. Oh, those feverish bloggers, I just won’t go there. Neat trick, huh?
This is one of the things I respect and admire about the lefty websites in the blogosphere. The cream rises to the top and it is harvested to use in a variety of places in terms of guest posting, etc.
On the other hand the wingnut welfare system seems to take their cue from more blue-collar environs and gets it totally wrong. In ore smelting, the creative process helps isolate impurities that can be seperated from the pure metal in the form of slag. Unlike cream, this slag is ususally sloffed off to be put to other uses.
Instead, the wingnut welfare system mixes this slag back into their product before casting to produce an obviously inferior and contaminated product. The wingunts try to pass of their product as Grade A material, but it is being mainly produced from the slag that others ususally consider as waste. This waste should have been put to more useful purposes (I hear the Army is recruiting).
Hey Eli – your fave books include some of mine – Queen of Angels – awesome and the Gap Series was a rush! Eon scares me to this day but I’ll have to check your others. Any chance you read KSR?
Greg Bear is almost always outstanding – his best stuff is truly mindblowing. Have you read Darwin’s Radio or Forge Of God? Or Brin’s Uplift trilogies? Iain Banks? Octavia Butler (RIP)?
I assume you mean Kim Stanley Robinson? I have not read any of his, I’m afraid.
I love the worlds and universes sci-fi inhabits add a whole new level of creativity to them – it’s such an open-ended genre when it’s exploited by people of imagination.
Robert- that’s awful. Sorry you are having to go through this. I’m not sure what the remedy is, but I was libeled (minor) by a disgruntled person on the faculty who was upset that I gave his kid a B-. At first I wasn’t sure what to do- finally went to a lawyer, who told me exactly how to respond in writing. But this case of yours sounds much much worse. But, can bloggers be prosecuted for libel?
wow – KSR cited by the good folk here at fdl and on HuffPo – all on the same day
oh shit pesto burni
grs 103 – well said.
I have a a feeling a least to some degree what Siun said up thread is true. I think the blogs start treads or ideas and sort of get them going. Traditional media picks them up and does more (or not).
It seems like the ideas go back and forth in a way. Some originate here. Some are debunked entirely here. There is sort of a give and take. I think the blogs are growning in influence because the power players are almost certainly reading them. I find similar language and topics being reflected in some traditional media that seems more than a coincidence. of course that is only in some and certainly the ones that don’t have an obvious Right wing bent like Faux news. If I were a reader of right wing blogs I might find the same thing, but judging from some of the loonacy that FDL has linked to in Wingnuttia I suspect they are being ignored and are in their own world.
Having said that I have heard many new items “first” from FDL. It is always interesting getting Jane, Christy and all the commenters opinions on the topic du jour. I love it when my right wing, Limpbaugh listening boss comes up with a topic and I slap him down with “Well what about this?” and it is usually an angle that he hasn’t thought of. I like that.
Unfortunately to many of the Limpbaugh items I just say “whatever” the guy is a comedian and says the rediculous things.
Long winded as usual. Must sleep now. turning into a pumpkin! Peace to all of you!
siun #77:
Fortunately, Dems don’t need to be as good as the GOP in messaging – an awful lot of people are grooving on reality now. Dems just need to be good enough. If the M$M had its way, Boy Howdy would’ve gotten a 10-point bounce ex-Zarqawi. He got one point.
That (absence of a) delta is freaking important. It means that the big, bad M$M is being gradually tuned out by the public at large. If the Dems can just demonstrate the ability to fog a mirror, they can win a lot of seats.
I can’t tell you how much I hope I’m wrong. The mass media is an enormous and powerful blunt instrument – I’m hoping that maybe the blogs can be an effective and well-placed scalpel, but right now our own *party* (mostly) doesn’t even listen to us.
Robinson – yep. My all time fave though quite different from Bear (who I’ve read all of) and I am determined to get our dear EPU to read Banks! Brin didn’t every really connect for me and I have to confess to no reading Butler.
I’ve been on a nonfiction kick recently but I always go back to KSR’s Mar’s trilogy and his Pacific Edge to remind me of what I want for the future.
Let’s not forget the Rove Attack Machine is in high gear and they are out for blood. The blood in the water is what gets the blood cultist right wingers to the polls. So the Republicans like Herr Rove/Bush/Catkiller Frist/and Fat Denny Hastert with the perpetually closed eyes want to make the next few months a rolling chumfest of hot button issues.
Here they come.
*Flag burning
*Gay men smooching
*Head chopper terrrrrrists
*Communist/liberal media that want to destroy Chimpy and Gimpy
*Traitor Dem’s like Murtha(there is a Swiftboating of him right now for a phony quote)
*Jesus and his massive gun collection that he uses to target parctice on vegans, gays, Commies, pinkos, fruits, nuts, flag burners, The Dixie Chicks and garden variety salad tossers
*Judges who piss on the bible
*Bird flu
*Evil black men and boys who hate Christians and who will start the race war with help from Allah
*Gay judges with the bird flu
*Black men(Except Michael Steele, Lynn Swann and Ken Blackwell they are OK with Uncle Karl Rove and the Republican Chimp Squad) burning flags and abducting white women
*Evil bloggers and their rabid lamb-people hybrid minions
*Democrat People who hate ‘Merika and are athiests and Wiccans too
*Muslims
*Muslin–because it sounds like Muslim
*Men porking dogs
There are a few I have left out, but the campaign is underway…..
Everybody has to keep on their toes and never defend, just return fire and aim low.
-GSD
Years ago I read a commentary on folks called “opinion molders.” Can’t recall article or author. In that day, a smalltown barber or a restaurant waitress could be the source & the resource for helping formulate what becomes a group opinion–”meme,” if you will, though not all buy that term. It’s easy to see how ALL barbers could be opinion molders, perhaps unfortunately because of the copies of “Police Gazette,” “True Detective,” & “Old West” magazines scattered about.Then the cool medium arrived & Huntley Brinkley, Cronkhite & Hugh Downs (or Johnny Carson) became almost national opinion molders.Now we have another shift in the media paradigm. Print & radio hung on (hanged on) as TV took over. Now TV tries to hang on as the PC & laptop take over. The older media of the papers & magazines become Art Forms, so their practicioners become observors, caretakers & conservators. But the last hangers on still wannabe opinion molders. TRex nailed it with “opinionati,” as in literati & poetasters, buggy whip salesman & telegraphers. We come not to praise the old media, but bury them. So piss off, twits, & make way for reality therapy.
That (absence of a) delta is freaking important. It means that the big, bad M$M is being gradually tuned out by the public at large. If the Dems can just demonstrate the ability to fog a mirror, they can win a lot of seats.
But how many seats will they leave on the table? Will it mean the difference between just narrowing the gap, and actually retaking one or both of the houses?
Also, ironically enough, I think the level of disgust with the Republicans might work *against* the Dems, because they’ve caved so many times, even though Independents (the swing voters they’re *supposed* to be pandering to) are almost as disgusted with Bush as we are. That’s where the polls already were when they folded on Alito, f’rinstance.
OT – Since we have NPR people here, I heard a great piece on NPR today abdout the “Cut and Run” mantra as an election tool and how the Dems can combat it: frame Iraq for the OCCUPATION that it is. The Republican strategist was quite flustered by the suggestion, and you don’t get too much flustering on NPR.
Here’s the bit from All Things Considered. It’s how I see it and it makes sense to make sure the debate is framed this The sheep don’t see it like that and the Right sure as hell doesn’t want them to. The Right still has them believing “fight them over there so we don’t fight them here” and now the “cut and run” mantra is the schtick.
al – Scooter – we better hope you are right since the professional Dems are continuing to miss all the opportunities. That’s why I’m so interested in YKOS – people powered politics is clearly essential.
And Kirk – come back! another KSR fan? (I admit to rabid fandom and reread Mars at least once a year)
Brin didn’t every really connect for me and I have to confess to no reading Butler.
Oh, read Butler. Fantastic storyteller, with some intriguing moral ambiguities and power relations (esp. Bloodchild and Xenogenesis trilogy). Parable Of The Sower is powerful and disturbing, kind of like an extreme extrapolation of where the Republicans are taking us.
Eli- as an independent, I’ve long felt that D’s and R’s are just different sides of the same face. There is a commonality to both parties that undermines the greater potential of our grand experiment. (think of how the labor movement was essentially crushed, from the beginning, and used but little-rewarded by the Dems. Or how the education system, from the start, was geared to producing reliable workers)
Blogs are the first thing I’ve found that give me a thread of optomism to grasp- thin, yes, but tangible all the same.
I think the fact that Hillary hired Peter Daou shows quite forcefully how respected and feared “the blogs” have become.
Jonah Golberg smelt.
-GSD
GRS @130-
Yes, that was Lakoff vs. Luntz. Quite entertaining, in that finally a GOP mouthpiece was teamed up with a capable opponent from our side.
OT -
I would like to tap into the collective wisdom of FDL on a fact-specific question. The answers to this question, I believe, may also help me, and the FDL community, to begin to engage with a larger question about how we share our values in our day-to-day conversations.
The question is: what would be the most effective way to speak with my high school classmates about politics at my 10-year high school reunion? By way of background, I grew up in an extremely small midwestern town. I subsequently traveled to a large coastal city for college and have stayed there basically ever since. I was well respected in my graduating class and fairly apolitical throughout high school.
My general goal now is to (i) encourage the Democrats in my class to become politically engaged on a local and national level (ii) give my apolitical classmates a sense of the extent to which the Bush administration has harmed America, and (iii) perhaps change the minds of the Republicans in my class, and, if they are beyond such efforts, at least show them that I am a progressive Democrat who will not back down.
This question is of broader applicability because I believe that we at FDL are likely all constantly confronting the question of how best to discuss politics with our friends, colleagues, acquaintances and loved ones, many of whom may not even be aware of our political leanings.
I believe that it is of the utmost importance that we speak out against this administration at this point in time. But it is critical that we do so effectively, in a manner that actually helps to educate and change minds. I would be curious to hear both the advice of other FDL’ers on this subject as well as any personal anecdotes that they might like to share.
Eli #129:
If you want the glass of water to be half-empty, that’s what it is.
I could’ve spent the summer of ‘04 at the beach and been much happier than I was pounding pavement for J. Forbes Kerry. All life is a risk.
I see trends coming our way, but I don’t know if/when they’ll converge. “Chance favors the prepared mind,” however.
Eli- as an independent, I’ve long felt that D’s and R’s are just different sides of the same face. There is a commonality to both parties that undermines the greater potential of our grand experiment.
The Democrats are too dependent on corporations for their campaign funds, and it shows in their votes – the corporations *always* win.
The reason I so desperately want Lamont to win is that the netroots really need a high-profile “scalp” to say, “If you want to win, you need us on your side.” If we can get leverage, we can take over the party from within, by either scaring the Dems into behaving, or replacing the ones who don’t.
If you want the glass of water to be half-empty, that’s what it is.
It’s not really a question of want. We’re always going to be David against Goliath, so our aim must be very precise.
The truth of the matter is that we are the real patriots. . .
I am here because if I weren’t I’d be a total depressive by now. I want to believe there is hope. When I come to Left Blogistan, I do believe there is hope.
I’m an atheist, as I’ve said before. That doesn’t mean I see no mystery in this world. I get chills when I contemplate the following: Our constitution is grounded in a reverence for the will of the people. If there was a common American religion at one time, it was this: the belief in the will of the people.
And this is the opposite of a belief in the will of God as the fuel of the engine of democracy. The rights of kings were justified and explained by the systems of religion, belief that the monarch was chosen by God. In that system, the crown did as crowns do and the people fell in line. Against such a system, the words “we the people” are an amazing, outrageous demand for respect and statement of dignity.
The chills I’m talking about creep over me lately when I think about what trouble our country is in. New Orleans and surrounds wiped out. Public education dysfunctional. A huge percentage of the people can’t get healthcare. The middle class is on the verge of irrelevance; housing, the repository of much middle class wealth, is not safe from collapse. The president breaks the law with impunity, even brags about it. I get chills thinking about this because this president was not elected.
He is president not by the will of the people, and the country is going to hell. I am an atheist. I don’t believe in magical causes of nonmagical things. But I’m finding out that I believe in the original intent of the constitution’s framers. Power derives from the consent of the governed. Otherwise things get perverted.
The will of the people. The consent of the governed. We talk about those things here. We are the people, and this is the new commons, the new village green. Long live Left Blogistan.
Eli@139-
Your lips to G-d’s ear!
Your lips to G-d’s ear!
Yep. Lamont’s an exception – I think the House is the low-hanging fruit here. *Every* seat is in play every election, and the cost of entry is lower, both in terms of how much the netroots need to help, and how hard/easy it is for a progrssive to enter the race.
Lamont is also good because he’s partially self-funding, which is kinda like training wheels for us.
That doesn’t mean I see no mystery in this world. I get chills when I contemplate the following: Our constitution is grounded in a reverence for the will of the people. If there was a common American religion at one time, it was this: the belief in the will of the people.
Hell, I got choked up watching fricking *Schoolhouse Rock* on tape when they’re talking about the Constitution and the Declaration and the Melting Pot and American ideals and all that stuff that used to mean something.
finally catching up on my FDL from the last few days, and just wanted to let Peterr (can we call you “rock”?) know how much I enjoyed his piece, from whatever day that was. And an Arlo Guthrie fan, too! I have vague impression you (Peterr) are from SF Bay Area (I grew up there, or more accurately, finished high school in that general locale before moving away …)
TRex, I hear a soundtrack of power tools (not to be confused with the tools at PowerLame or whatever that site is called) when I read your posts … maybe it’s your brother’s band bleeding over?
As if on cue.
(Snip)
“WASHINGTON – House Republicans intend to hold votes this summer and fall touching on abortion, guns, religion and other priority issues for social conservatives, part of an attempt to improve the party’s prospects in the midterm elections.”
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/200…..ive_agenda
-GSD
grs #130 and zzyzx, I heard the Luntz and Lakoff exchange too on NPR this evening. It was very short, as I recall. Hardly got going, but Lakoff made his point about the Occupation well, and Luntz did seem flustered. I don’t know why NPR does some long boring interviews without much substance, and then when there’s a big issue like this one–cut and run/war vs. occupation–it’s “oops! out of time!”
Hi, VG–hope you’re holding up. So much late night moderating for you.
gsd 128 -
perhaps we don’t to have to fight them by picking of one leech at a time.
perhaps we can just keep pointing out the swamp
“All the GOP offers you is fear.
Had enough?”
(ok – I can’t do slogans…)
siun 132 -
saved the pesto! whew..
fessin’ up to my co-rabidity here (hope no one tells the CDC…) love ksr (and the Pacific Rim arc and..)
but my favorite living storycrafter is still Ursula K. LeGuin – magical, evocative, lyrical views of our world in far off places…
but my favorite living storycrafter is still Ursula K. LeGuin – magical, evocative, lyrical views of our world in far off places…
Yep. Absolutely fantastic storyteller. I loved Earthsea, and I usually can’t stomach wizards-and-dragons fantasy.
Tell us how it feels to be a Townhousian.
I, like, totally have no idea. I’m not on that mailing list at all. Didn’t even know it existed until I read the Zengerle article.
I think it’s an invitation only thing, like gmail.
Old Pastehead Goldstein is stamping his wee hoof for a list of the people on that list, which I don’t understand. Why does he care? It’s a MAILING LIST. Rock bands do that all the time.
Just like a rightard, though. They’d rather wet themselves over our people’s list than just make their own. Duh. How stupid is that? Is there a rule on the books somewhere that we all have to write in a vaccum without discussing things?
Oh. I’m being stupid. They’re mad because they didn’t think of it first.
You would think that stupid people would get used to being outwitted.
GSD #147:
How dare they call it the “American Values Agenda” – we need to call them on that crap! At best, it’s Conservative values (what’s that – 30% of the American population?) and at worst it’s Fascist Anti-American Theocratic Lunatic Values.
But it’s nowhere near American Values – letting them get away with that framing, even when placed in quotes, has got to stop!
Oh. I’m being stupid. They’re mad because they didn’t think of it first.
More like they’re mad because we thought of it too.
No way they can be this coordinated and lockstep without some kind of central talking-points-propagation distribution system.
Wish I could talk all night to you smart, interesting people, but, alas, must work tomorrow.
Hope to see you then!
Long-time wallflower signing out.
We’ll have to see if the M$M are willing participants in a charade, are now the deer in the GOP’s headlights, or are finally recognizing that they’re in a war of their own.
Checking the news, I see from TPM that the GOP congress wants to pass a resolution condemning the NYT. So much for all that goodwill that Judi piled up for them.
The Inhofe’s committee wants to take on the AP for putting together the article about climatologists’ consensus that An Inconvenient Truth is scientifically accurate. They criticize AP’s methodology, though there are some who say the distinguished members can’t even spell it.
And, of course, Fox News has been granted a monopoly on reporting from Gitmo.
I report, you M$M lurkers deciderate.
We’ll have to see if the M$M are willing participants in a charade, are now the deer in the GOP’s headlights, or are finally recognizing that they’re in a war of their own.
I pick A. Advancing the Republican narrative is Job One, as handed down by their corporate parent companies. Which, BTW, are large enough that they don’t exactly have to depend on the profits of their media arms when they have to choose between money and loyalty (see: Gannon, Jeff, ignoring of).
Everyone ought to read the link of GSD, 148. There it is. Their game plan. Mix in some personal attacks on blog-land…and you have the R team moves all in writing.
Suggestion: don’t let the R team define the agenda! Don’t let the R team keep us on the defensive. The Democrats need to draw up their own agenda, and announce it loudly. Sure, it won’t get to the House floor….but it’s the message that counts.
You now have the playbook. Attack! Good evening, Ghostman
James Inhofes’ brain matter would not cover a Ritz cracker, even spread thin.
Also, check out the James Webb smackdown of George Felix Allen Junior. It’ll make you smile.
Looks like Webb ain’t gonna get no swiftboating, he’s gonna torpedo those clowns.
Felix Allen is in for the run of his cracker eatin’ life.
-GSD
GSD, where did you read the Webb “smackdown” of George Allen? I’m in Va.
siun said,
“I think we need to be very mindful that the attacks come not from Rove but from the neocon wing of the dems %u2026 like TNR.”
I’m not willing to rule Rover out of the picture. The Kingpin Kos/rabid lamb crap coincided with a speech by Miss Piggy blasting bloggers, and both came shortly after the visible success of YearlyKos and Markos’ 15 minutes of MSM fame. I don’t know much about these TNR “neocon Democrats” but I don’t see much that is Democratic about them. And I’m sure Rove is not above working with the dark side of the Democratic Party to accomplish his ends. I don’t doubt that Ben Nelson and, yes, Joe Lieberman are receiving his input. And certainly, while Nelson may not know what a blog is, Lieberman has to be quaking in his loafers about the left blogosphere’s support for the Lamont campaign. So some of these threads do intertwine.
Remember, just because you are paranoid does not mean that nobody is plotting against you.
Damn, I forgot WordPress doesn’t like punctuation. :{
LindaR at 142 — I’m a bit more mystical sometimes, but you don’t need magical causes to see why that impropriety caused things to go wrong. At minimum, a president seeks to benefit the people who put him in power. (A good president seeks the office because he wants to benefit the country as a whole, but I think it’s self-evident that’s not what we’re dealing with now.) So if the people who put him in power aren’t the people, then the will and welfare of the people are of no consequence, and the causes he pursues are not those of the nation.
Rarely, perhaps never in this country, have we had such a graphic illustration of the difference between the consent of the governed, the demands of the mob that speaks loudest, and the desires of those who crave power, and why the first is what the Enlightenment required of a government.
neurophius @161:
I gotta go with Occam’s Razor on this one. I don’t think the DLC wing of the Democratic party is above dirty tricks, as long as they’re against vilthy filthy traitorous liberals, and not those fine, upstanding, noble Republicans who are to be emulated at all times.
*x – there was a post here on Friday evening by Peterr addressing your question. Many interesting responses. Go get em..
Dana — it’s up at the Webb site:
http://www.webbforsenate.com/p……php?id=57
Eli
Occam’s Razor–the conspiracy theorist’s nemesis
Dana,
Go here:
http://www.dailykos.com/storyo…..184033/792
Dana #160:
Not GSD, but here’s a repost of the Webb release:
http://www.webbforsenate.com/p……php?id=57
DKos has Allen’s reply, pretty weak IMO.
Hey, Dana — I kept meaning to ask — did you ever hear from my DFA friends?
Occam’s Razor%u2013the conspiracy theorist’s nemesis
It’s what I shave with every… um, other day.
So Eli, you think this crap is coming straight from the DLC? Who is the DLC these days, anyway?
Eli—you like Greg Bear? Have you read “Almost Adam” by Petru Popescu?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/searc…..rds=Almost Adam
Give me more books like that. Please!
Most of the way through this thread I am mindful of Jane Hamsher speak… Something like….I don’t want to take over the role of MSM. I want them to do their job well.
So Eli, you think this crap is coming straight from the DLC? Who is the DLC these days, anyway?
Hell if I know – Al From, Bruce Reed, Chuck Schumer, Rahm Emanuel (if the latter two are not formal members, they might as well be).
All I’m saying is, it’s not like Rove owns the patent on Swift-Boating.
Most of the way through this thread I am mindful of Jane Hamsher speak%u2026 Something like%u2026.I don’t want to take over the role of MSM. I want them to do their job well.
I would love for Media Matters to become unnecessary.
And very well said to you too, Mr. Trex.
Eureka Springs
Lapdogs paints a pretty dismal picture of the current state of the MSM. I wouldn’t look for a lot of improvement any time soon, certainly not before November 2006.
Redshift @ 163 — well said.
neuro #172:
Try here:
http://newdonkey.blogspot.com/
All the DLC you can stand. And so much more.
Thanks again, doggies…aarrrffff…
Congratulations, and back at you, Ed*ward Teller. Glad you got published—blog-doggies (and blog-kittycats) affect the cm discourse yet again!
Margot, Almost Adam does sound interesting.
Ever heard of Hunting The Ghost Dancer, by A.A. Attanasio (amazing at his best – this is maybe a notch below, but still very good)? The almost-extinct Neanderthal is a very mystical, enigmatic, powerful being. Umm, I’m afraid that’s about all I can remember after all these years. That, and it’s a pretty good read.
LindaR – thanks, you provided great inspiration.
Hi –here’s some of tomorrow’s chats on WaPoO. Questions can be submitted now to beat the rush!
Chris Cillizza, Politics, at 11 eastern:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..01351.html
Federal Diary columnist Stephen Barr and Colleen Kelley, president of the National Treasury Employees Union, about government employee unions at noon:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..00731.html
UNICEF Ambassador and actress Mia Farrow about Darfur at 2pm:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..01087.html
no trend info but this looks encouraging, via TPM:
what’s the conventional wisdom – an incumbent at less than 50% support is in trouble? should Lincoln log off?
Neuro … I guess I don’t see the Rove touch as central. I think we like to see Rove as the mastermind because we may not want to see the full array of entrenched power that we are dealing with – including some of our “friends.” TNR used to be a progressive magazine and would still claim to be democratic and centrist/liberal – their readers think they are liberal – etc.
People powered politics is an equal opportunity threat to any entrenched power – and that is why they are afraid. They don’t need marching orders from Karl to recognize that we may disrupt their little tea party.
Over the past week, we were countering the neocon dems, today we had to deal with rumours pushed by “campaigns” who were claiming to be mistreated by YKOS (a story accepted and published by a friend – later corrected after being called on it) – there’s a strong current of pushback and if we simply focus on the righthand push, we may get ambushed by the friendly pushers.
HA! Don’t paint me as a defender of the media. I just don’t think they will be replaced until computers and television merge a little more. Net neutrality included.
I would, however, concede that if you injected him with sodium pentathol, Rove would tell you that he’d much rather the Dems continue running DLC/DSCC/DCCC candidates than progressive, strong-spined ones.
*x #138: Sounds like you haver a good plan for your high school reunion. My only demur is that I would let any dang reasonably moderate Rebuplican stay a reasonable moderate Repbulican. All of those kind of folks I know are not happy campers. I’m not sure what kind of advice to give them, other than to politely suggest that the Bush wing of the Republican party has to be defeated. Subtly remind them that they are lowest form of politcal life in the US today, they are just reaaly really patetic sad cases (do this in a *nice* way). And that it is a machine and that after Bush is gone there will just be another front person. I think McCain is auditioning for that now. But that is a side issue. I think the national front person thing is exagerrated. Moderate Republicans are treated like slime in local and state party too. So, rather than alienate them, I would just motivate them to do something to clean up that cesspool in their party, and maybe also to rescue the moderates from being less than zero. Of course, if one is ready to jump ship, go for it.
As for the Bushnaughts, best thing to do is to politely and respectfully destroy their arguments in front of the others. Just be a good courteous example of whatever you are.
There are some moderate Republicans in my party. Not much to talk about anymore. I’ll say “See, we used to be able to talk politics, but then those nuts declared total war. Too bad huh. I didn’t want to use the strategy of destrying everyting Republican everywhere and always, but, hey, what else can I do.” Yep, after a few minutes, that is what I say, either implicitly or explicitly, and then we gotta switch to another topic.
My number one priority is to get rid of BushCo. If I can’t convert a Republican, then, if they are sane, I try to convince them have to defeat BushCo within their own party. Or learn to be happy being a complete political nothing for the rest of their lives.
#189: meant to say: There are some moderate Republicans in my *family* (not party, except people talk politics so much, seems like same difference sometimes).
Israel is threatening to cut off water and food to Gaza per BBC video coverage …
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5122056.stm
Bush Signing Statements—All O’m
Did anyone get this already? I found it linked at Wikipedia
wesgpc and Eureka Springs –
Thank you – very helpful!
VG – replied to your e.
siun
Thank you for the wise words. Although I’ve been a Democrat for almost 35 years and was very active during much of that time, I am not really attuned to what is happening in the party right now or how it is likely to shape what happens in 2008. I would like to change that.
One of the most powerful arguments against the excesses of the Bush administration (to be used on Republicans who may be capable of rational thought – and there are some such) is to ask whether they would feel comfortable with, say, Hillary Clinton (choose their “worst nightmare” dem) having the same powers to which Bush lays claim, e.g., warrantless wiretapping, poking through bank and telephone records, maybe even declaring you an “enemy combatant”. You would be surprised (OK, maybe it would not surprise you at all) at how many of them have never looked at “the other side of the coin” this way. The current attack on the NYT? Say the Dems win big in ‘06 and ‘08 and go after right-wing talk radio with the same gusto? Would they like that, or feel it was a gross violation?
#191: So, what’s with the criticism of the short attention of the blogosphere? Did the Likud Gaza withdrawel last any longer than the typical blog issue. Or how about the BushCo hot button issues, like snake marriage, space alien human homosexual unions, and banning flag sex? How about consistent Bush policy on North Korea. That comes in one week spurts and then is gone until the Crazy Leaders wants the Frat president’s attention again. Maybe it the modern PR social engineering approach to policy of the reactionary parties in US, and Israel (and now Canada too I guess) that drives our attention span.
I owe siun a bag of chocolate mints.
The current attack on the NYT? Say the Dems win big in ‘06 and ‘08 and go after right-wing talk radio with the same gusto? Would they like that, or feel it was a gross violation?
The more paranoid among us take this as evidence that they do not expect to relinquish control. Ever.
#196 Airport Cat: I guess that might work, when you are dealing with a borderline wingnut. For anyone willing to extend themselves and consider other opinions, I prefer the direct approach: reactionary wing of Republican party is wrong about everything.
I don’t think it would be a stretch of the imagination to think that if and when they see power slipping away from them, they’ll make changes to the avenues of power so as to make governing by democrats as difficult as possible. In this way they can prime the field for a Republican return.
Eli – Was thinking that today. Does martial law trump elections? December 2008 Surprise. Tin foil anyone? geesh
I don’t think it would be a stretch of the imagination to think that if and when they see power slipping away from them, they’ll make changes to the avenues of power so as to make governing by democrats as difficult as possible. In this way they can prime the field for a Republican return.
Or they could just screw things up so badly that the Democrats inherit a completely unmanageable mess, and get blamed for the resulting financial/military/social meltdown.
Hypothetically.
Eli, @199, you have a valid (and scary) point with respect to the Republican leadership, but I’m talking about talking to more-or-less moderate rank-and-file Republicans who might still be persuaded that what this administration is doing is simply WRONG and grossly un-American (by which I mean, it goes against the American ideals as set forth in the Constitution, etc.). Maybe there is too much convincing to be done to overcome the “Diebold effect”? Sure hope not. Really sucks to live in totalitarian states.
Eli – Was thinking that today. Does martial law trump elections? December 2008 Surprise. Tin foil anyone? geesh
I actually don’t think they’d do that, unless there’s a major terrorist attack in the offing (like 9/11 scale or larger, maybe WMDs). I’m thinking more in terms of propaganda and election gaming.
No one worry. I have a secret plan to sink the whole business. I am going to convert to reactionary wingnut, and start commenting on their sites. Over there I won’t have to “maintain” and, you know, try to act sane, like I do here. You will see. I can spread confusion so fast they will sink like a rock. I have changed my name to Wise Eminent Sagacious Gratitudinuous Pettifogging Conservative IX. (note the pedigree!) Bought glasses to look erudite. I am always losing those things, also bought emergency monocle. Men’s garters and spats hard to come by but I am looking. You may say I have wigged out and that is true. My hair won’t part in the middle, so I bought one. Looks just like J Hamsher’s hair, but much shorter. You’ll see they are done for. I won’t be able to keep my identity secret -the bow tie will give me away -yellow stripes on a checkered background. My trademark.
Eli,
While they laugh all the way to the bank? Makes sense. But maybe, just maybe, there’ll be some accountability after the fact.
wesgpc – no, I owe you waffles! (I’ve really been quite out of it due to YKOS work and work work which has been … well … interesting.)
Neuro – I think the party is working very hard at non-transparency and that’s the problem. It’s a challenge. I know this weekend I was reading all the www sites of the Dem challengers here in IL – there were several who were awesome (Laesch, Gill, Stover, and Auman if I remember correctly – sleepy brain here) but several who were so close to W …argh. And one who is being touted as a great guy for liberals to support yet who, if you read his site carefully, apparently worked for Lieberman and sorta likes the idea of attacking Iran on behalf of Israel – doesn’t word it that way but it’s close. It really struck me that we need to dig deep on each … similar to my initial admiration for Obama until I looked at the site for his PAC and noticed that all the candidates he gives money to are established DINOs – Lieberman, Clinton, etc. Suddenly, I got a very different take on him – thought of him as fresh voice, saw that he aspires to be the old establishment voice – and is using his celebraty status to support the good old boy network rather than to help the new voices. But goodness, it takes google/wiki/www time!
and now, for something completely different:
http://english.aljazeera.net/N…..F9CCA2.htm
Spain is considering affirming the rights of Great Apes … very cool indeed!
wesgpc @200, don’t you find that most people who identify themselves as Republicans are borderline wingnuts? (Many of my own family members — who are generally bright and well-educated — fall in this category.)
AirportCat @204:
I think that’s already happened to a large extent. Bush’s approval rating is (IIRC) in the high 60s or low 70s among Republicans, and I think even lower (high 50s?) among moderate ones. The problem is turnout, which Republicans understand the power of, and Democrats don’t.
When you appeal to your base, they get pumped up and turn out in droves. When you appeal to the middle, eh, they may turn out a little bit if the weather’s nice, but they’re not fired up. And you’ve demoralized your base as well. It’s a very bad tradeoff, but the Dems keep trying to make it, and every time it fails, they conclude that they need to do a better job of appealing to the halfhearted middle.
#205 Eli: I am not even sure another terrorist attack would work. Half of BushCo is show biz, but they have forgotten an old vaudeville saying: get a new act or get a new audience. What exactly do they have new? They can’t come up with new smears. Their attack gimmicks are transparent retreads. Their dogs are getting old and won’t hunt no more. I will show you what I mean in a moment.
Spain is considering affirming the rights of Great Apes %u2026 very cool indeed!
Big whoop. Until they can vote, they’re waaaay behind the US.
wesgpc – lmao You would be good at it. I mean that as a compliment. I own spats.
I don’t even own shoes with laces. I must be disgustingly liberal.
Eli @210, exactly so! It’s why you need folks who can inspire and LEAD (Lamont, for example) and who don’t play into the trap of responding to crap attacks, but fight back hard without necessarily going the gutter route (good example in the response to Allen’s attack in the VA race).
#205 Eli: I am not even sure another terrorist attack would work. Half of BushCo is show biz, but they have forgotten an old vaudeville saying: get a new act or get a new audience. What exactly do they have new? They can’t come up with new smears. Their attack gimmicks are transparent retreads. Their dogs are getting old and won’t hunt no more. I will show you what I mean in a moment.
It is my fondest hope that *this* is the year that the electorate rears up on its hind legs and says, Enough of this crap. And I’d like to see the Dems help them by aggressively pointing it out and calling the Republicans on it, a la, “My opponent doesn’t have anything to run on, so he’s resorting to smears, fearmongering, and hatemongering. Aren’t we better than that?”
Of course, I’d *really* like them to say, “My opponent thinks you’re all moronic, cowardly, bigots. I hope you prove him wrong on Election Day.”
#209: I don’t think most people have enough of fixed political identity for a reliable party identification over time. And empirically, it is one of the more unstable things in polls. What kind of half way normal person would be happy to identify themselves as a Republican now? The moderate Republicans in my family (how are very normal and moderate) are very quiet about what they are. I don’t get too excited about party ID, even though I like politicking and election work. A differnt kind of person would willingly ID themselves as Republicans when there Republicans like McCloskey, Jeffords and Weicker around. Now, if you are a Republican, you are either a wingnut, or a Republican moderate (a pathetic nothing).
Eli @210, exactly so! It’s why you need folks who can inspire and LEAD (Lamont, for example) and who don’t play into the trap of responding to crap attacks, but fight back hard without necessarily going the gutter route (good example in the response to Allen’s attack in the VA race).
This is why I’m so pissed that they forced out Hackett, whose mantra I want to see all Democrats adopt: “I said it, I meant it, I stand behind it.” He is tough as nails, as blunt as blunt can be, and does not back down, ever. Completely shatters the namby-pamby Democratic stereotype. I think we need an army of Hacketts.
Siun #208: I was on the Gulf Coast for ten days doing Katrina reconstruction work. Never got around to going to a Waffle House/Hut/Shack/Barn (I forget the exact name now). And they are on every stinking corner in South MS. You think Starbucks is all over. Man, you ain’t seen nothing until you drive through Biloxi. Astonishing Waffle density. Like a black hole of waffles. And I never got around to eating one.
I don’t think most people have enough of fixed political identity for a reliable party identification over time. And empirically, it is one of the more unstable things in polls. What kind of half way normal person would be happy to identify themselves as a Republican now?
This has been reflected in the polling over time. Fewer and fewer people are identifying themselves as Republicans, and the GOP is whining that the polls are skewed because of the small Republican sample size.
Mmm… Waffle House…
They criticize AP’s methodology, though there are some who say the distinguished members can’t even spell it.
“Methodology”, or “AP”?
Nothing like getting sucked into a cracking good political discussion an hour or two past your bedtime…
I think we need an army of Hacketts.
Um. Can I have just one of those to take home?
Um. Can I have just one of those to take home?
Sure. You do have a cloning tank in your basement, right?
Mmm%u2026 Waffle House%u2026
Two eggs, scrambled, bacon, hash browns, scattered smothered, and covered, and a pecan waffle, please.
#219 Eli: Yeah, that is why I don’t go vor demonizing Republicans. They may just be people who don’t have interest or time to think much about politics. When Clinton was popular, a lot of them may have called themselves Democrats. As a guy who has logged lots of hours and lost of shoe leather doing election work, I show utmost respect to anybody who calls themselves anything, is willing to disuss, and will vote. That is my approach.
Did anyone see The Daily Show episode where they turned Hackett into a completely phony, not-really-standing-for-anything candidate, complete with campaign commercial where he says he’s in favor of children and puppies, and demonstrates his environmentalist bona fides by speaking in front of a river?
You, um, probably had to be there…
Wesgpc – I didn’t know you were involved in the reconstruction work – bravo!!!! We had temporary neighbors from NO – they just returned there and when they called me, it was heartbreaking to hear how bad things still are.
the first time I was in the South, I fell in love with Waffle Houses as iconic – from the “good evening M’am” greeting to the nonstop sweetened ice tea … good places!
Hackett quit just before I discovered blogs. I really liked him. I wonder why the blogs didn’t suppot him? Did he quit to early in the season?
Hackett quit just before I discovered blogs. I really liked him. I wonder why the blogs didn’t suppot him? Did he quit to early in the season?
I thought a lot of the blogs did. But the DSCC sure as hell didn’t.
#216, Party identity in south Louisiana does not seem to mean as much as it once did. Seriously, how much difference can you see between our Senators (Landrieu-D, Vitter-R)? Is it the same in other parts of the country? I see a large part of the problem is that Democrats really do not take stands on principles for (Eli has it right) fear of offending the political center. They end up looking like political weathervanes, and who respects that? That’s not leadership, why should anyone vote for that?
*struggles to remember if brain will be needed at work tomorrow*
You, um, probably had to be there%u2026
“Because I’m in favor of agriculture. And adorable children.”
It was brilliant.
Okay, people seem to be agreeing with me, so I really must call it a night…
I could have eaten and gamn waffle down there I guess, but the crawdads, shrimp and catfish kept beckoning. One night my group had just come back from this place called Aunt Jenna’s in Ocean Springs (which is a beautiful place), where we had basically ordered everything all you can eat style. WE wer stuffed. Then, when we get back the Americorps guy running the show walks into where we were staying with a half a big stew pot of boiled shrimp. We ate that too. No room for waffles I guess.
A warning about Waffle House: cash only! Do not go there with only a credit card!
Siun-
Waffle House is the Southern US’s equivalent to the neighborhood pub in the UK. There’s one every hundred yards or so. And they’re always full of drunk people who call each other by their first name and otherwise exhibit a kind of boozy conviviality.
TRex,
What radio station are you at? I’m continually pleasantly surprised by all the classical music people I encounter in left blogostan, starting with a composition professor at ECU I “met” at SmirkingChimp before I moved on to DailyKos. I run a classical label here in Chicago, btw.
Keep up the great posts,
Jim
#229: I love the Gulf Coast, it was fun. MS not so bad, but everything east of NO to Bay St Louis, and a few miles across MS border looks horrible. Like the day after the hurricane, except dry. Lots of wrecked cars still sitting on side of road. Nothing open for miles around except a building supply with a dozen sherrif’s guards standing around outside. Spooky. Sometime in what looked like very upscale neighbornoods. Everyone HATES FEMA.
I remember stuffing myself at a Waffle House after a night of drinking. Lotsa fun.
>>>Handing TRex Hackett on a platter. Another fine post kind Sir.
I seem to have gotten my name onto some kind of right wing publisher’s e-mailing list.
” Ann Coulter’s New Book
Just $4.99
Save Almost $23!
Ann Coulter’s long-awaited new book has just been released- and it’s already creating major media buzz.
The Drudge Report says that “Godless: The Church of Liberalism” is such a hot item that Ann Coulter “received one of the largest advances paid to a conservative author” for the manuscript.
In her book, Ann holds nothing back in detailing liberalism’s war on religion and yes, God.
Chapter titles include “On the Seventh Day God Rested and Liberals Schemed” and “The Holiest Sacrament: Abortion.”
For sure, copies of Ann’s latest will sell out fast – get your copy today at an incredibly low price. This book retails for almost $28 – so with our offer you’ll save almost $23 off the retail price.”
LOL Evil Ann’s book is selling for $4.99. It’s only been out, what, three or four weeks? I wonder how much the publisher is losing on each copy. Maybe the right wing foundations are pitching in to subsidize it. Imagine having to rely on an endorsement from the Drudge Report to try to sell your book. Hee hee hee.
I could move down there. When I get tired of crawdads, shrimp, catfish, and waffels, they have tofu and soymilk and hummus in the stores too. You can get foofy healthy fruitshakes. Interesting Vietnamese places to eat around NO. I ate at one hole in the wall, seemed a to be some kind of Vietnamese Cajun mixed up something or other. I liked it.
AirportCat – Do you think any Dem has a prayer in LA now that N.O. base thinned out?
Trex – it was my first exposure to southern conviviality and initially really confused me … a Waffle House waiter reached over to look at my bracelet and I had a classic NYC type “whatyoudoin?’ reaction until I realized he just wanted to see it better! Then the kid at the grocery store picked up my bags and started to walk out – again, it took me a minute to realize he was carrying them for me! Sorta like my first reaction to Midwest friendly folks … scarey after the NE!
I wish we had a Waffle House – but we do have Mellow Yellow … and Bibs n Ribs which is right next door and scents the air with the most amazing smells! for under $4 you get two chicken breast cooked over the fire with great sauce, french fries, cole slaw … and a slice of wonder bread! LOL
neuroph 243: I registered as a Republican once so I could vote against a very very bad man in the local Republican primary. I got awful stuff in the mail for months and months after I went back to being a Dem. From some experience with some of the very very elderly Repub people in my family, I think that some of it is aimed at people who aren’t all there anymore.
Eli @223 – more like four hours past my bedtime here … but I could probably get away with calling in and telling my boss I’m too demoralized to come to work … yes, we are public employees, Mr Barab, and so far this year we have started to punch time clocks (WTF? we’re salaried!), no more comp time allowed, everyone turn in your take-home vehicles on Friday (and you’ll just have to find some other way to respond to emergencies) and next month we’re cutting everyone back to 32 hours per week … I wish I were kidding.
yum!
and good on’ya wesgpc for heading off to help.
one of my dear doc friends has spent many weeks on and off at the Common Ground clinic since Katrina – the conditions there still sound very difficult for many..
Kirk – are you tapped into the Reclaiming folks? sounds like it from some of your comments … and I find Reclaiming closest to a religion I could practice I should add.
Eli, thanks for the suggestion; I’ll look for the Attanasio book.
off to bed firepups – any more food ideas and i’ll start munching…
good night good people…
#249: I thought for a moment you meant my going over the reactionary sites to wreck them with my support. No, I love the Gulf so much that any excuse to go there is more than good enough for me. I LOVE THE GULF COAST. And the people in southern Louisiana and MS are very friendly. (er, except when I was down there with a non-white girl friend, which is a nother story unfortunately.)
Rereading my Ann Coulter post, it occurred to me that someone might think it is satire. It is not. I copied and pasted it from the e-mail.
hi siun -
just saw your post -
yep, i’m lucky to live so close that tapping in is easy – was just at the Solstice ceremony on Ocean Beach last week…..
do you know any of the Reclaiming peeps…?
Eureka Springs, yes of course Dems have good opportunities in South LA still, but this place is so corrupt and the racial politics are so unhealthy that it is difficult for new faces to break in. However, with all the upheaval, this may be the time, if only the right LEADER would appear? No idea who that might be, or even who will take Jefferson’s House seat once he is convicted and sent to join Eddie Edwards in the Federal pen.
Tell me everything that happened up til now
neuro #254: I think Ann Coulter is an act. But a good one. Keep the base happy. What happens when the swing gets horrified or hilarified, is another question. Problem is that with great leaders like Schumanuel on the case, there is not little inspiration or information about the other side, that that swings may stay home.
neurophius – Her book was priced 4.99 the first week of publication. I checked Amazon a couple of days ago, still @ #7 and sale priced much higher than 4.99.
Kirk … I am so jealous!
I was at Spiral Dance several years ago – got to be part of the calling of the quarters which I will never forget … and got this nasty cut on my hand helping in the kitchen and Star did this amazing healing thing – still needed stiches but it never hurt (well, the zydocaine hurt but otherwise) and we were back from the ER in time for ritual … still astonishes me.
there is not *any* inspiration or information about the other side, that that swings may stay home.
(why do I type so awful and can’t see it until it is posted?)
I have to sleep, but would like to ask siun and Kirk what they are talking about. Is there a short answer?
laughing … I kept picking up on familiar approaches to issues and wondered, Kirk!
I’ve noticed the reclaiming group here but they are rather far from my neighborhood and not very active … if I were in SF, I’d be there though.
wesgpc – I just googled reclaiming
wesgpc – reclaiming is a tradition of witchcraft founded by such amazing people as Starhawk. Many reclaiming folks interpret their faith as a call to an amazing style of activism.
See http://www.reclaiming.org and http://www.starhawk.org
or under $4 you get two chicken breast cooked over the fire with great sauce, french fries, cole slaw %u2026 and a slice of wonder bread! LOL
Oooh, damn. That sounds good.
I love that kind of food. Six bucks for a giant bowl of Thai noodles. Cheap and hot and soulful.
I have these friends that go out for meals that cost hundreds of dollars, ridiculous amounts of money for course after exquisitely prepared course. I’m sure it must be wonderful, but, you know, I’d rather spend six bucks on a bunch of fried catfish and a ice cold coca cola from a glass bottle.
Starhawk is someone worth reading – esp her activism writings on her www site.
and I am quite partial to her novel Walking to Mercury as well
Siun -
So glad you’ve got to spend time with Star – one of my favorite peeps and a powerful healer…
and glad you got to Spiral Dance here….so amazing
(I don’t know where you are located, but there will be another free witchcamp this year in Oregon in the thrid week of August. I was at the initial free activist witchcamp there last year – very, very good. The location is amazing, also.)
Oh, “reclaiming” is a name? OK. I will too. Here is my last thought before I go to sleep:
(June 28, 2006 — 01:23 AM EST // link)
Brown University Poll, 719 registered voters.
Sen. Linc Chafee (R) 37%, Sheldon Whitehouse (D) 38%, Unsure 25%.
Poll conducted, June 24-26, 2006.
– Josh Marshall
I balked as supporting Lieberman for a long time, since the old pol me thought should go for best chance to take a house. FDL poobah said that they were going to work against Chaffee, but the time was not ripe. So, is it now?
Trex! I’m with you … for work, I do occasionally do the snazzy meals but I am happiest munching my way through my wonderful neighborhood. Though for special events, like a Jane visit, I take folks to Calypso – the yummiest, meatiest, jerk chicken wings in the world!
I’ve complimented you on several occasions TRex but tonight I’m just going to say Thank You!
I’m 34, ex-military and I’m a fighter by nature. When I see injustice I get indignant and I challenge it. When I see pessimism and despair I motivate and empower. When I see bigotry and intolerance I stomp on it with as little compunction as I would a rattlesnake attacking an infant. I mean this with absolutely no disrepect to Jane and Christy but I’ve come to look forward to your posts almost as a sort of daily treat for my soul.
Until tonight I did not know you were a radio personality and I still don’t know the address of your blog but knowing these things only re-enforces my admiration. I feel a kinship with your words and your assertiveness and your style.
Your post tonight put into words something I’ve been feeling at an almost subliminal level. Like a distant drumbeat with no real directionality but growing ever-louder. The sound of an approaching army that will overwhelm all in its path by its sheer awesome numbers and its oh-so-righteous indignation. Reading these hatchet jobs on Kos and Jane and co. reek of of anxiety and sheer terror at what they most probably are sensing is ‘The Inevitable’. And it feels good.
So I say again… Thank You!
Ok thanks, siun #265: I will read a bit before I turn in.
I am sacrificing myself to wingnuttery in the cause or Good and Rightness. So you will only get trollery from me after this. I will send things like
You ****ing ****ing ********in ****** ***** ***** Satanic Godless IMPOLITE and RAVING simpering milquetoast sissies!!!
See, clevery designed to get past the Stalinist lefty blog censors.
Final word: I forgot greems. gulf Greens, bayou greens, Sould Fodd Greens, them spicey greens that come with BBQ, LA, MS, and any other kind of greens. Greens greens greens. Love the greens. Turnip mustard collard greens, could eat them morning noon and night and in betweens.
Kirk – I was pretty involved as a reader of the first of the now all too many reclaiming email groups and had some neat exchanges with Star – have admired her for ages but was not prepared for how much I liked her in person – or for her presence … wow!
and while everyone else was a little silly about the cut I got – she just stepped in, held my hand (and it was suddenly warm and cozy), did a bit of Star, and then said “you’ll be back in time for ritual” … we headed out to a jammed ER with like an hour to get back … walked in and this doc appeared from nowhere and said “we’ll see you right now” … stitched me up so fast, sent me back and I proudly joined the North contingent chanting Ain’t No Power … complete with mega bandage which I thought gave me a certain guerilla panache!
good memory – good lessons
oh … and 11 stitches leaving the tiniest scar to remind me of what I learned there.
So I say again%u2026 Thank You!
No, Nate, thank you for serving our country, and for coming here to read and comment. I can tell you’re one of the good guys.
wesgpc – I look forward to your great advances in wingnuttery and salute your sacrifice!
and Nate – so well said re Trex!
hi wesgpc -
sorry for being opaque – but what siun said! :)
and “Spiral Dance” is an annual ritual held at Samhain (Oct. 31). The Spiral Dance I’ve been talking about is held in San Francisco each year….other cities also hold Samhain rituals.
hi Siun -
that is funny….we have seemed to share the same perch and i’d wondered if our paths crossed….
perhaps they have…
hope you get to come to Spiral Dance this year..
guerilla panache
OMG, siun!
Best.
Band name.
Ever.
time for me to sleep too …
Trex – you are awesome! I’m going to save this one and share it with the Ykos crew.
and Kirk – bright blessings!
nite all!
oops … Trex – only if I can be a backup singer! always wanted to be a doowap girl tho I can’t sing!
and Kirk – Sprial Dance this year is a very good idea – I’ll start wrangling a biz trip timed right! (I’m in Chicago but travel …well.. a lot)
now I’m off
bright blessings, Siun
and a warm goodnight to Trex and all the firepups…
off to cuddle with the fog cats…
night.
Good night, siun.
Yeah, that’s my cue. I’m out like a light.
Whew! Great party, huh, guys?
I like our friends.
http://apoeticjustice.blogspot…..bling.html
-TAKE HEED OF THE RUMBLING-
Just in from chores. This is your best rant yet, TRex. It must be very hard to give Bilmon more context than he comes with, but you did it.
And, by the way, you didn’t just luck into this gig. You’re an example of how much suppressed talent is out there and why the “Opinionati,”
as you put it want to crush us like “an over-ripe eggplant.”
I’m going to read back through the comments in a separate window, but I’ll be here too.
TRex… No thanks needed. What is your blog address by the way?
PoetryMan… Another fighter cut from stern stuff. Great new piece. Love the Fox News soapbox touch.
Nate – Just click on TRex name in comments for his blog.
niters
Hi, y’all. Ooo, I spy talk of food as I scroll down to get here — but I’m buzzing straight here to deliver the morning PBPost and FtLSun-Sentinel:
Limbaugh makes light of V*agra possession (Post)
V*agra prescription label found with Rush Limbaugh is focus of inquiries (Sun-Sen)
As before, the Sun-Sen has more ‘n’ better. Now to back up and see what TRex has prescribed . . .
“The Crier Wire”-6/21/06
Defending Democracy: Can we promote democracy in Iraq while our own is under attack?
A media clip of Catherine Crier doing the whole nine yards on voter fraud!!! She gets Katherine Harris, Diebold, Ken Blackwell (and his Diebold links), Jim Tobin (and his Election Day calls to the White House), the RFK article, a Jimmy Carter clip on the untrustworthiness of those with obvious conflicts of interest, all in one 6-minute segment. Haven’t seen anything like it on mainstream air since Olberman did something a while back.
Thanks Eureka, now I feel a little dumb cuz I knew that. I run a video blog for goodness sake. “Damn this forest, I can’t see shit!”
TRex… One small request in passing. Click on your Kingpin-FDL Late Night from two nights ago and have a look/listen to my comment at #163. Your Star Trek references inspired it. :-)
Aloha and good night all.
Thank you to those of you who offer such kind compliments regarding my work. I am far from a genius, however…Merely a dreamer of pictures, seeking rare moments when I can blend inherently attractive materials…Far more of my time is spent making the improbable manifest, often in unseemly ways. ;>)
And it will get worse for the subjects of my derision…As they are but puppets for my amusement (and hopefully yours as well), specters of a forsaken ‘reality based world’ who might judiciously study my verisimilitude while they cling furiously to the dissolving strands of their candy-floss empire…
Darkblack,
How many times have you watched “V for V’?
Incredibly good image work, though. Thanks for helping here.
prostratedragon @ 290
Wow Catherine – tell us what you really think!
Crier steps up. Thanks for the hit!
Ed*ard Teller @ 293:
Actually, never. I do recall reading some of the original Moore/Lloyd series in the ’80’s, however…But I’m hard pressed to remember specifics.
Interesting conversation tonight. I could not sleep and so I came for a visit.
Was there some mention of waffles? In the South? On one of my trips down I35 from MN to TX, one morning I really wanted a good, big breakfast. Saw a restaurant called “Waffles” and so I stopped.
Longest buffet line of ‘breakfast’ foods ever. And someone standing behind a skillet cooking the fattest waffles ever. They had 4 kinds of potatoes, and they had big TX sized steak to go with those eggs. One price – eat ’til you drop I guess. I can still remember how good the food was. Ummmm.
Oops — sorry for the food based interruption.
At the end of the day I wonder how Firedoglake and Daily Kos are playing in Peoria? Or anywhere else?
Has anyone seen a survey on how many people are aware of blogs, particularly progressive blogs? I’ve been watching the rise of blogs in the last thirty months or so and it’s been amazing. But how many progressive blog readers are there altogether? And how does that compare with the 121 million people who voted in 2004? A lot of bloggers are activists, and activists are often key to change but outside of activists how many people are being reached by bloggers and which bloggers are reaching them?
I think I saw a survey the other day of progressives and blogs (MyDD maybe?). If you did a survey of progressive blog readers and a geneal survey of Americans, how would they compare on a number of issues and concerns?
Maybe now is time for such a survey because it would be interesting to see in a year or two how well progressive blogs are changing the landscape when another survey is done.
Well I cannot tell a lie.
I too, would like to be plucked…
Or something that sounds like that.
Love Jane – truly madly deeply. Love jane.
Well, sorry, professor rat, I can’t help you. And I’m rather more concerned about these people — LAT’s Megan Stack on Fear and Posing in Baghdad:
AP has a companion piece to the one I just posted:
Juan Cole begins in Gaza this morning –
– then he turns to Iraq, and from there, to certain chorusers of bunk:
TRex — you’ve probably long ago toddled off to bed, but I have to say this post resonated with me, not because of the content per se but because of the tone. I get it in spades about the swiftboating of progressive bloggers — and I don’t think the folks doing the swiftboating have a clue what they are doing. They are poking a hive of angry hornets; it’s just a matter of time.
The tone of your post sounded so damned familiar, been puzzling over it since I read it earlier this evening…then it dawned on me:
– Neo, The Matrix.
We are so out of The Matrix; we don’t have to play by their f*cking rules any longer.
Screw that, we’re writing the rules, inscribing them on the door of their monolithic institution with a digital Molotov cocktail.
It feels so Lutheran, as if we’re not only taking on a corrupt theocratic monarchy, but the equally corrupt church that is its handmaid; we’re demanding a more direct representation, something that threatens both of these monoliths to the very core of their existence.
“As long as The Matrix exists, the human race will never be free,” said Morpheus. You know, this is absolutely true about these entwined so-called centrists, their mouthpieces, and the current culture of corruption that co-opts them. It’s not enough to ignore them and their swiftboating. We are going to have take apart their Matrix.
Good morning, Rayne. That was wonderful — I’ve never felt Lutheran before, but yes — you and TRex have got your fingers exactly on our pulse and our purpose.
How we differ from our opponents . . .
Last night Paul Kiel channeled Ira Glass with a guest remembering someone from high school. Here’s a taste. Guess the subject of Jonathan’s memory:
Ok,that picture just cracks me the hell up.If I laugh this early in the morning,well,it’s an accomplishment.
Progressives have all the best writers.There’s just a huge pool of talent to dive into every day.I don’t see as much creativity or even fun in spirit coming from the other side of the aisle these days.They should be scared of us,we’re on the side of the good guys(regular people,the worker bees of this country).
And TRex honey,if you’re ever going to be near the western part of Metro Atlanta,there’s a seat at my dinner table for you,any time.
Saw some talk about S/F authors KSR et al…
My fave is:
http://www.hycyber.com/SF/wilhelm_kate.html
Good stories, more of a Twilight Zone bent.
Lately, doing ‘legal mysteries’ for our lawyerly audience.
Found her through an assignment for a ‘Women in Lit’ class. Short story called ‘The Planners’ from late ’60’s that sorta takes ‘Flowers for Algernon’ to a different level.
Lives in Eugene, OR. Many stories based in OR, and at least one set in Ashland (and the theatre).
Led the ‘Clarion’ workshops…
Anyone associated with the word ‘Clarion’ gets props from me.
Today’s Courant on Ned, Joe and FLAG BURNING:
http://www.courant.com/news/na…..ationworld
Can I get a candle with this image on it?
lotus — must say as a “recovering Catholic” that I’ve never felt Lutheran before either (despise his anti-Semitism as well as his departure from the concept that we cannot “earn” redemption through works as well as faith).
But I can get behind the nailing of his theses on the church’s doors in protest of the corrupt practice of indulgences. It’s so emblematic of our efforts as progressive bloggers and blog readers/commenters.
Nice bit, that interview, love the denouement. Tasty, almost as satisfying for me as it must be for Jonathan. Thanks for sharing that one.
lotus,
That guy was Jack Abramhof.
I am Catholic (somwhat lapsed) and my wife is Lutheran — a mixed marriage. I generally take Rayne’s position and reminf my wife of how Luther’s complaint was basically that the Church was too liberal. My wife reminds me of how poorly the Church acted during the civil rights movement. Also, Catholic churches do not welcome other denomination practitioners to receive communion. So, th evidence of Catholic prejudice is more immediate than that of the Mother Church.
TRex
Right on!!!!
Thanks for another f**king fantastic post!!!
They fear our Attacktics.
Show no mercy.They don’t.
America is at stake.
Ok, have been lurking here for nearly nine months.
TRex: Read your blog before I started looking at this some long time ago. You struck me as a unique voice, but here you’ve become unbelievably strong. And the past few days—well, you are a joy to read. Keep it going.
You all must be scaring them to death—I hope. The whole debate and smear from the other side shows you are right. I really hope they mess their pants–full load, special delivery, hey.
The Goddesses Dr. Smith and Hamsher:
I can’t find the words so will just shut up.
Am outside the hemisphere, so maybe my view is a bit more objective. But I grew up in your hemisphere, and know what it is about. You are wonderful, all, and the commentators…
Where I am—well, used to be it was: whatever happens there is gonna happen here, give or take five years, and diluted, and it was always associated with ‘progress’ in the minds of the conservatives.
Then Gingrich went on his balance the budget hysterical tour, and six months later we had some mouthpiece ranting about the same thing: Balance the budget. And put up a running sign in the main street of the capitol pointing to the decrease… only it started to gain again and got taken down.
About two weeks ago, there was the save the marriage vote in the US, and on our version of Press the Meat, we got the Cardinal of the Nation explaining the same talking points a week later. The same Cardinal who jumped right in and got a lot of (negative) local attention for a piece he got published in the NY Times defending ‘Intelligent Design’ The local press ripped him a new one on that, but if we aren’t already under the thumb of global companies—what can we do, and fast?????
This has nothing and everything to do with the current administration there, but to my mind it has to do with global business. Too long to go into all that.
You aren’t the only ones who want their country back. I know this will get EPU’d, but I had to just vent, ok?
And I’m too old, and it is hot and humid and so am grouchy and trying to take the mind off the heat—and we had to heat until June 12th up to when we had 9 degree Celsius nights, and then it went up to 37 degrees C overnight, and stayed there. Humid. Nasty. We don’t have air-conditioning because till about ten years ago, we only had two weeks of hot weather in August, and a floor fan would do. Butvin 2003 We went dry from March to October. Must be the global non-warming…. And every year gets worse. So to speak.
I KNOW you have a precarious situation there. If you can get that fixed. start looking around. We need help too, to correct what your govrenment has done. Whatever it is, it is spreading.
Whatever, hopeless….. and EPU’d
Our conversations these last few days have been reminding me strongly of one of my favorite short stories, Thomas Mann’s “Mario and the Magician.”
A German family, on vacation on the Italian coast, attend the evening performance of a hypnotist. Before the shattering end, Mann crafts an allegory of fascism — the battle-of-wills between Cavaliere Cipolla and his audience (and the narrator’s own wonderment that he and his wife cannot bring themselves to take their sleepy children home to bed) — that resounds sharply in these days of Cheney/Rove, the rubber-stamp Congress, the lapdog press, the matter with Kansas.
How is it that those with power and status of their own are willing to surrender abjectly these things they’ve fought to achieve all their lives in service to another, a lesser, an evil?
Consider these passages:
So there it is, in a story written in 1929 in Germany, an explanation of 2006 in the United States — why “Patsy” Roberts, Arlen Specter, Joe-nertia and just about any other DC politico or journo you care to name (as well as most in the provinces) have been going along to get along.
But resistance — as Jane and Christy and TRex and Teddy and all the rest of us have intuited but most pols and scribes have not — is NOT our position. No. We and the candidates we work for are not playing defense.
We are here to
Attack Attack Attack ATTAAAACK
/b>
Yikes, I thought I had. (Preview on fritz.)
lotus: you did — I checked your HTML or else another moderator jumped in and did it for you …
lotus– well said!
*ilson46201– thanks for all the pictures and, btw, you look just like I imagined! Wise and cute! Thank you also for the great work moderating. ;)
angie,
Where are these *ilson pics you speak of?
Good morning, everybody!
moi– check out #34, 182, 192 on this thread
http://www.firedoglake.com/200…..s-america/
mary jane — you might be able to make devotional candle yourself, if you have the gumption.
- purchase devotional candle(s) of choice, might find them in dollar store or in latin food section of grocery (I know I can find them there in my hometown)
- purchase Avery or other clear mailing labels appropriate to your printer type (might be able to find small packages of these at big box office supply outfit)
- ask darkblack if you can duplicate pic for this purpose, then “lift” into Paint or other graphic software, rotate 90 deg and resize to fit label
- print and stick on outside of candle
- FLAME ON!!
Heh. Very, VERY tempted to do this, too.
Thanks, angie. I should have added that the end of the story proves our point.
Hi there, tommy!
*ilson = wise and cute and kind
RenB, awfully glad you’ve entered the conversation — and of course now you must continue.
Where are you living now (just a tad more specifically), please?
Mornin’ Firepups,
*x:
When you go to your HS reunion everyone will be looking to “catch up” on what each other has been doing with their time since they last saw each other.
A good way to ease into the political discussion and maybe spread the faith, is to tell them about the time you have been devoting to blogging.
Recommend your fovorite blogs, explain the culture and etiquette (BTW Siun, I clicked through to the “reclaiming” site. I REALLY think it is intelligent to have a link to a section with etiquette, etc. Several times posters have said they remained lurkers b/c they did not understand the slang or the rules of the road–maybe this, and other blogs, should consider a permanent “about us” kind of link with that info) and tell them how to get involved in the on line conversation.
Then let the netroots information stream do the rest. I would also inform them about some of the wingnuttia blogs in the interest f fairness. The difference in the seriousness and level of discourse, should be self apparent.
In this way, you are talking about your new “hobby” rather than going evangelical at them about politics. It is less threatening and they may be more inclined to actually hear what you are saying if you don’t trigger an auto defense response.
If you are inviting them to see for themselves what you have found interesting and rewarding, rather than challenging their pre programmed beliefs, maybe they won’t shut down on you and what you are trying to introduce to them will actually get through.
I wish I had time to read all 325 posts (prolly more by the time I write this). Wish I could write like that.
Must.Do. Billable. Work.
Mickey @55: It’s called TOT (Time On Target). As I recall, we tried that on Surabachi. Didn’t seem to help much then either. Good for us. Bad for them.
God Bless
eli – priceless pic of jane!!
I send Howard Dean money last night as a response to TNR’s stage play of War Of The Worlds.
I appreciate their effort, but the original was much better.
send=sent, duh.
Funniest of all is Snitchens in today’s “Slate” (TNR’s Evil Twin.)
One thing you have to realize is that the “upstarts” like Kos are threatening the livelihoods of the “old-farts” among the Democratic pseudo-intelligentsia. Not the politicians, but their “advisors.” If Kos’s “approved and helped” candidates win, the “old farts” may find themselves being taken out to pasture. That is why the “old farts” don’t like the “upstarts.”
It has nothing to do with actually winning elections. It has everything to do with money to the “advisors.” The “advisors” couldn’t give a tinker’s damn whether or not the Democratic candidates win–as long as they get their cut of the campaign contributions.
Welcome RenB -
“….This has nothing and everything to do with the current administration there, but to my mind it has to do with global business. Too long to go into all that.
You aren’t the only ones who want their country back. I know this will get EPU’d, but I had to just vent, ok?
And I’m too old, and it is hot and humid and so am grouchy and trying to take the mind off the heat-and we had to heat until June 12th up to when we had 9 degree Celsius nights, and then it went up to 37 degrees C overnight, and stayed there. Humid. Nasty. We don’t have air-conditioning because till about ten years ago, we only had two weeks of hot weather in August, and a floor fan would do. But in 2003 We went dry from March to October. Must be the global non-warming… And every year gets worse. So to speak.
I KNOW you have a precarious situation there. If you can get that fixed. start looking around. We need help too, to correct what your govrenment has done. Whatever it is, it is spreading.
Whatever, hopeless … and EPU’d”
RenB – I could not agree with you more about the central role of multinational corporations (and the economic system they designed for their enrichment, neoliberal economic policies) in the destruction of our representative government. Corporate power and corporate capital were at the core of the GOP’s purchase of jurists, legisaltures, state houses, and the white house – all under the cover of an immense and sustained propaganda campaign conducted through the Scarfe-Mellon-etc funded network of spin tanks and wingnut welfare trusts.
And even with all that and three decades of manipulating social issues voters (religious fundamentalists) who returned to electoral politics at the behest of Reagan’s ad men, the wingers are losing.
The great project to impose “free market” (corporate tyranny) values on Iraq – first under Garner, then the proconsuls sent to replace him – the Iraq project is a ruin.
The corportations have been trying to re-write national and local laws to allow full corporate dominion since the MAI was rejected in Paris in the 1990’s.
The current round of WTO negotiations – the Doha round – has been staggering in the post Seattle world, and is so behind schedule that it is not expected to cough up corporate-friendly rules before the expiration of the US Congress’s “fast-track” pre-approval of trade deals.
Over a decade of polling indicates American voters’values on economic, environmental, and foreign policy issues are far more progressive than the narrow range of pro-corporate views provided by their purported representatives.
And now the wheels have come off in Iraq, the military-industrial complex is on the short end of a host of criminal investigations into years of fraudulent procurement, and the religious fundamentalists in the US are increasingly derided for their hypocrisy and hatred.
Endless rises in the cost of energy and three decades of stagnant earning power for middle -income wage earners – coupled with the deflation of the housing bubble have put the lie to the Rethugs’ trickle-down claims.
Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld’d willingess to sacrifice the lives and operatonal capacity of the US Armed Forces on the altar of their ideologies has demoralized and divided the officer corps, as well as draining the residual loyalty military family voters hold for the President. Bush’s transparent destuction of VA beenfits and services has only accelerated this process.
Private jet vacations to golf meccas and sex tourism destinations aren’t mainstream even in San Francisco and West LA.
And the whole media freak show of Coulter / Frist / Limbaugh / Rev. Robertson / Ralph Reed/ Norquist still seems to attract viewers – but just cause people slow down to look at the wrecks on the freeway shoulder doesn’t mean they’ll pull over to join in the mayhem.
This morning even National Pentagon Radio is covering the debut of a physician’s scholarly book on the US military’s torture doctors – and their criminal complicity in homicide.
I’ll always be shamed to have colleagues who participate in war crimes – and a president, vice presdient, and secretary of defense and Joint Chiefs who forswore their oaths to uphold the Constitution in order to unleash torture.
But the digust these men have earned from the entire planet for Abu Gharaib and Guantanamo has defeated the largest military machine in the history of our planet.
The disgust and hatred the MAI/WTO/IMF earned around the world for their corporate masters has stopped these efforts.
And the disgust Americans have for the corporate servants who have occupied the Congress is so great that one influential blogger sparked a campaign which will deny a three-term US Senator the opportunity to seek re-election as his party’s nominee.
I think the critical mass of discomfort (from economic decline), disgust (at the personal and financial depravity of Republican buisiness and political leaders), and dissipation (of the ruling coalition as the religious conservatives and corporate radicals fight over the spoils) is already opening the space for change.
William Greider looks at the collapse and the opportunity therein with a breadth and eloquence I could never hope to match.
I still believe that the corporations’ decades long effort to discredit representative government has gone a bridge too far. Citizens in the EU and the US have had a taste of life under corporate rule – and they hate it.
“…but the truth of the matter is that we are the real patriots. We’re here because we love our country and believe that it can be restored to greatness and we’re willing to work together to make sure that it happens.”
Reporting for duty, sir.