<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Cutting Through the Malarky</title>
	<atom:link href="http://firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/</link>
	<description>Firedoglake weblog</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 25 Nov 2009 06:39:00 -0600</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: newsrack</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-144234</link>
		<dc:creator>newsrack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jun 2006 23:09:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-144234</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Major Fleener strikes again&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;A post on this blog on Tuesday described a BBC interview with Guantanamo detainee military lawyer Major Tom Fleener; after calling the commissions “show trials,” he concluded “I don’t know how we got here, but I know we shouldn’t be here.”&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Major Fleener strikes again</strong></p>
<p>A post on this blog on Tuesday described a BBC interview with Guantanamo detainee military lawyer Major Tom Fleener; after calling the commissions “show trials,” he concluded “I don’t know how we got here, but I know we shouldn’t be here.”</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: joejoejoe</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143789</link>
		<dc:creator>joejoejoe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jun 2006 18:41:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143789</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Well said Christy.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well said Christy.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: mui</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143641</link>
		<dc:creator>mui</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jun 2006 17:42:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143641</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;The problem with Gitmo is that ordinary citizens like me have long thought that ChimpCo has zero competence and zero credibility. With zero oversight there is no telling what incompetence and other horrors–like detaining and torturing innocents, mistaken identities, etc.– that they could get away with. And what’s worse, they make us all look complicit.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The problem with Gitmo is that ordinary citizens like me have long thought that ChimpCo has zero competence and zero credibility. With zero oversight there is no telling what incompetence and other horrors–like detaining and torturing innocents, mistaken identities, etc.– that they could get away with. And what’s worse, they make us all look complicit.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Phillip Allen</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143577</link>
		<dc:creator>Phillip Allen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jun 2006 17:11:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143577</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Hello friends, colleagues, comrades:&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Please read this article, &lt;i&gt;The Evil of Banality&lt;/i&gt;, which I found to be one of the best, most powerful understandings of the Guantanamo atrocity I’ve seen to date.  You can find it at The Dissident Voice:&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.dissidentvoice.org/June06/Alessandrini14.htm&quot;&gt;http://www.dissidentvoice.org/.....rini14.htm&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello friends, colleagues, comrades:</p>
<p>Please read this article, <i>The Evil of Banality</i>, which I found to be one of the best, most powerful understandings of the Guantanamo atrocity I’ve seen to date.  You can find it at The Dissident Voice:<br />
<a href="http://www.dissidentvoice.org/June06/Alessandrini14.htm">http://www.dissidentvoice.org/&#8230;..rini14.htm</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mary</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143508</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jun 2006 16:38:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143508</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;EPU’d a final multi link.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Sorry to be so disorganized and “dump” with the info, but it is frustrating that info is available, but just flat ignored.   &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Did anyone ask the President just how dangerous the Uighurs had been when he talked about all the dangerous folks there - - has ANYONE EVER drilled him on them?  Or asked him specifics on any of these other cases when he makes his “we got us dangerous folks there” statements?  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;If so, I haven’t seen it (but I confess I find it so painful or infuriating to watch that I don’t much).&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>EPU’d a final multi link.</p>
<p>Sorry to be so disorganized and “dump” with the info, but it is frustrating that info is available, but just flat ignored.   </p>
<p>Did anyone ask the President just how dangerous the Uighurs had been when he talked about all the dangerous folks there &#8211; - has ANYONE EVER drilled him on them?  Or asked him specifics on any of these other cases when he makes his “we got us dangerous folks there” statements?  </p>
<p>If so, I haven’t seen it (but I confess I find it so painful or infuriating to watch that I don’t much).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: rwcole</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143504</link>
		<dc:creator>rwcole</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jun 2006 16:36:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143504</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;It’s pretty dangerous to have a group of proto fascists riding a wave of public fear with no particular restraints on their behavior. If they were COMPETENT it would be even more dangerous.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It’s pretty dangerous to have a group of proto fascists riding a wave of public fear with no particular restraints on their behavior. If they were COMPETENT it would be even more dangerous.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: ck</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143498</link>
		<dc:creator>ck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jun 2006 16:34:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143498</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;new thread &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/with-debate-in-the-house-thoughts-on-iraq-and-the-so-called-wot/&quot;&gt;http://www.firedoglake.com/200.....alled-wot/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>new thread </p>
<p><a href="http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/with-debate-in-the-house-thoughts-on-iraq-and-the-so-called-wot/">http://www.firedoglake.com/200&#8230;..alled-wot/</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: tejanarusa</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143495</link>
		<dc:creator>tejanarusa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jun 2006 16:34:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143495</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I was going to comment on the Alito vote -  time to send “thanks a lot” messages to those who voted for cloture?  Maybe if we deluge them every time something like this comes down they might get the idea the country cares, and grow some spine the next time?&lt;br /&gt;
Then I read Mary’s post on the Catch-22/Twilight Zone world the appointed counsel are caught in on the Guantanamo cases. Sigh. Sigh. I’m speechless, nearly.&lt;br /&gt;
Got a million things to do today, was telling myself “no FDL, no FDL, you don’t have time,” but couldn’t help myself.  Gotta have my visit to the reality-based community.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was going to comment on the Alito vote &#8211;  time to send “thanks a lot” messages to those who voted for cloture?  Maybe if we deluge them every time something like this comes down they might get the idea the country cares, and grow some spine the next time?<br />
Then I read Mary’s post on the Catch-22/Twilight Zone world the appointed counsel are caught in on the Guantanamo cases. Sigh. Sigh. I’m speechless, nearly.<br />
Got a million things to do today, was telling myself “no FDL, no FDL, you don’t have time,” but couldn’t help myself.  Gotta have my visit to the reality-based community.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: lotus</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143493</link>
		<dc:creator>lotus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jun 2006 16:32:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143493</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;ABA members among us, when is the convention this summer?  I sure hope some raising of hell will rise from the floor there about all this!&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ABA members among us, when is the convention this summer?  I sure hope some raising of hell will rise from the floor there about all this!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mary</title>
		<link>http://firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143489</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Jun 2006 16:30:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/06/15/cutting-through-the-malarky/#comment-143489</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I’m going to squeeze in one more multi-link, that has some stories that have been out there about who “some” of the detainees are (and sure, I do believe some were the ‘worst of the worst’ and I do believe in very strong reactions and response to those who are PROVEN to engage in violent crimes or planning of violent crimes) and why the Press should get application of Yoo’s theories everytime it parrots out that they are all just the “worst of the worst.”&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/26/AR2006&quot;&gt;http://www.washingtonpost.com/...../26/AR2006&lt;/a&gt; 042602390.html&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;p&gt;I brought flowers to the isolation cell when I visited Saddiq this month. He likes to draw roses and often asks for gardening magazines.&lt;br /&gt;
Saddiq is one of the many mistakes at Guantanamo Bay. In 2005 our military admitted that he was not an enemy combatant, but the government hasn’t been able to repatriate him. (By a curious irony, Saddiq’s opposition to Osama bin Laden makes him too hot to handle in his native Saudi Arabia.) So he lives behind razor wire in Camp Iguana, with eight other men whom the military cleared long ago but who are nevertheless forbidden newspapers, visits from loved ones, English-language dictionaries — and flowers. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So we have someone (apparently 8 or so) that we have determined are not enemy combatants after all - this guy being one who was jailed by the Taliban for being anti-binLaden and then taken to GITMO by Americans.  Held for years, finally the ooops factor, but now still held, bc his opposition to bin Laden will put him at risk in his home country (Saudi Arabia btw - but we didn’t invade them, did we?).  And “how held”?  No contact with his family — even now that he is “cleared.”  No books, no wilted flowers.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Then there’s these guys - causing a stir in England.  Which is actually having a parlimentary investigation.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/01/AR2006&quot;&gt;http://www.washingtonpost.com/...../01/AR2006&lt;/a&gt; 040101465.html&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;They had some passing contact with an imman who is on the terrorist list.  The Brits came to them in England to try to convince them to go undercover and collect intel.  One did a little, then quit, the others didn’t want to get inovled.  A brother of one of them starts a business in Africa, the three go there (and even though NO ONE raises it, I’m even going to go with maybe there were thoughts and concerns about the African nexus).  When they arrive, they are kidnapped and taken to GITMO.  Where they have been held. For a long long time.  No charges. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Courted as spies, held as combatants.&lt;br /&gt;
. . .&lt;br /&gt;
A review of hundreds of pages of documents recently released by the U.S. Department of Defense, a British court and the men’s attorneys illustrates how the U.S., British and Gambian governments worked together in an operation that circumvented their judicial systems and, through a process known as extraordinary rendition, had two men incarcerated who had not been charged with breaking any law.&lt;br /&gt;
. . .&lt;br /&gt;
The case has caused a political uproar in Britain. Critics say the documents show the British government has helped place people in Guantanamo, despite its claims that the prison is strictly a U.S. operation.&lt;br /&gt;
. . .&lt;br /&gt;
A parliamentary committee is investigating. “The key issue that certainly concerns me is whether our government, the British government, was involved in something that I would consider to be unlawful,” said Andrew Tyrie, the committee chairman. “I don’t want to live in a country that could be complicit in such abuses.” &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Slate piece on the “invisible men” I linked to here:  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://tinyurl.com/pr4oe&quot;&gt;http://tinyurl.com/pr4oe&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;i&gt;&lt;b&gt;Guantanamo represents a spectacular failure of every branch of government. Congress is willing to pass a bill stripping courts of habeas-corpus jurisdiction for detainees but unwilling to probe what happens to them.&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The Supreme Court’s decision in Rasul v. Bush conferred seemingly theoretical rights enforceable in theoretical courtrooms. &lt;b&gt;The right to challenge a government detention is older than this country and yet Guantanamo grinds on.&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;It grinds on because the Bush administration gets exactly what it pays for in that lease: &lt;b&gt;Guantanamo is a not-place.&lt;/b&gt; It’s neither America nor Cuba. It is peopled by people without names who face no charges. ,b&gt;Non-people facing non-trials to defend non-charges are not a story.&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Then there has been the sadly bizarre case of the Chinese Uighurs&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://abcnews.go.com/International/story?id=1997083&amp;page=1&quot;&gt;http://abcnews.go.com/Internat.....amp;page=1&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;You have to read the whole interview - I can’t really excerpt.  But the backstory is that everyone knew right away they were an oops.  But bc no one knew what to do with them, they kept them.  Under the Guantanamo conditions and with no word or notice to their families.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Their case, after lawyers BATTLED to be able to represent them, ended up before the same judge who resigned from the FISA court in protest over the NSA taps program.  Gosh, that DC Circuit court position COULD have gone to someone like this.  *s*  Anyway - the Judge was left with no legal recourse other than to tell the Govt that their detention was illegal (in some places I believe that is called a war crime). But they couldn’t be ordered returned to their home country, bc the reason they were in Afghanistan is that they were escaping abuse in their home country, China, and had been hoping to get to Turkey.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;And despite its ooops factor, the US wouldn’t take them into the US and since immigration etc. is an Exec branch or Congressional matter, court could do nothing.  Did any members of congress come forward to sponsor them?  Nope.  So they languished until — uh, their case on appeal was just about to be listed for the S. Ct. docket.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Cowabanga and Shazaaaam.  We found someplace to take them after all.  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I have to go do other stuff, but this whole situation makes me crazy and ashamed.&lt;/p&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I’m going to squeeze in one more multi-link, that has some stories that have been out there about who “some” of the detainees are (and sure, I do believe some were the ‘worst of the worst’ and I do believe in very strong reactions and response to those who are PROVEN to engage in violent crimes or planning of violent crimes) and why the Press should get application of Yoo’s theories everytime it parrots out that they are all just the “worst of the worst.”</p>
<p><a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/26/AR2006">http://www.washingtonpost.com/&#8230;../26/AR2006</a> 042602390.html</p>
<blockquote><p>I brought flowers to the isolation cell when I visited Saddiq this month. He likes to draw roses and often asks for gardening magazines.<br />
Saddiq is one of the many mistakes at Guantanamo Bay. In 2005 our military admitted that he was not an enemy combatant, but the government hasn’t been able to repatriate him. (By a curious irony, Saddiq’s opposition to Osama bin Laden makes him too hot to handle in his native Saudi Arabia.) So he lives behind razor wire in Camp Iguana, with eight other men whom the military cleared long ago but who are nevertheless forbidden newspapers, visits from loved ones, English-language dictionaries — and flowers. </p>
</blockquote>
<p>So we have someone (apparently 8 or so) that we have determined are not enemy combatants after all &#8211; this guy being one who was jailed by the Taliban for being anti-binLaden and then taken to GITMO by Americans.  Held for years, finally the ooops factor, but now still held, bc his opposition to bin Laden will put him at risk in his home country (Saudi Arabia btw &#8211; but we didn’t invade them, did we?).  And “how held”?  No contact with his family — even now that he is “cleared.”  No books, no wilted flowers.  </p>
<p>Then there’s these guys &#8211; causing a stir in England.  Which is actually having a parlimentary investigation.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/01/AR2006">http://www.washingtonpost.com/&#8230;../01/AR2006</a> 040101465.html</p>
<p>They had some passing contact with an imman who is on the terrorist list.  The Brits came to them in England to try to convince them to go undercover and collect intel.  One did a little, then quit, the others didn’t want to get inovled.  A brother of one of them starts a business in Africa, the three go there (and even though NO ONE raises it, I’m even going to go with maybe there were thoughts and concerns about the African nexus).  When they arrive, they are kidnapped and taken to GITMO.  Where they have been held. For a long long time.  No charges. </p>
<p>Courted as spies, held as combatants.<br />
. . .<br />
A review of hundreds of pages of documents recently released by the U.S. Department of Defense, a British court and the men’s attorneys illustrates how the U.S., British and Gambian governments worked together in an operation that circumvented their judicial systems and, through a process known as extraordinary rendition, had two men incarcerated who had not been charged with breaking any law.<br />
. . .<br />
The case has caused a political uproar in Britain. Critics say the documents show the British government has helped place people in Guantanamo, despite its claims that the prison is strictly a U.S. operation.<br />
. . .<br />
A parliamentary committee is investigating. “The key issue that certainly concerns me is whether our government, the British government, was involved in something that I would consider to be unlawful,” said Andrew Tyrie, the committee chairman. “I don’t want to live in a country that could be complicit in such abuses.” </p>
<p>Slate piece on the “invisible men” I linked to here:  </p>
<p><a href="http://tinyurl.com/pr4oe">http://tinyurl.com/pr4oe</a></p>
<p><i><b>Guantanamo represents a spectacular failure of every branch of government. Congress is willing to pass a bill stripping courts of habeas-corpus jurisdiction for detainees but unwilling to probe what happens to them.</b></i></p>
<p>The Supreme Court’s decision in Rasul v. Bush conferred seemingly theoretical rights enforceable in theoretical courtrooms. <b>The right to challenge a government detention is older than this country and yet Guantanamo grinds on.</b></p>
<p>It grinds on because the Bush administration gets exactly what it pays for in that lease: <b>Guantanamo is a not-place.</b> It’s neither America nor Cuba. It is peopled by people without names who face no charges. ,b&gt;Non-people facing non-trials to defend non-charges are not a story.
</p>
<p>Then there has been the sadly bizarre case of the Chinese Uighurs</p>
<p><a href="http://abcnews.go.com/International/story?id=1997083&amp;page=1">http://abcnews.go.com/Internat&#8230;..amp;page=1</a></p>
<p>You have to read the whole interview &#8211; I can’t really excerpt.  But the backstory is that everyone knew right away they were an oops.  But bc no one knew what to do with them, they kept them.  Under the Guantanamo conditions and with no word or notice to their families.  </p>
<p>Their case, after lawyers BATTLED to be able to represent them, ended up before the same judge who resigned from the FISA court in protest over the NSA taps program.  Gosh, that DC Circuit court position COULD have gone to someone like this.  *s*  Anyway &#8211; the Judge was left with no legal recourse other than to tell the Govt that their detention was illegal (in some places I believe that is called a war crime). But they couldn’t be ordered returned to their home country, bc the reason they were in Afghanistan is that they were escaping abuse in their home country, China, and had been hoping to get to Turkey.  </p>
<p>And despite its ooops factor, the US wouldn’t take them into the US and since immigration etc. is an Exec branch or Congressional matter, court could do nothing.  Did any members of congress come forward to sponsor them?  Nope.  So they languished until — uh, their case on appeal was just about to be listed for the S. Ct. docket.  </p>
<p>Cowabanga and Shazaaaam.  We found someplace to take them after all.  </p>
<p>I have to go do other stuff, but this whole situation makes me crazy and ashamed.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
