
I have a confession. Not only am I a born and raised West Virginian. But I enjoy country music. In particular, I love bluegrass music -- and not just the soundtrack to O Brother, Where Art Thou that was so popular some years back (although Allison Kraus and Union Station kick some serious bluegrass ass, I must say), but the old timey sort of bluegrass that you heard from Flatt and Scruggs, and that you can still catch on the stage at county fairs where I live or on those happy occasions that Dolly Parton puts out a new bluegrass album.
You are probably sitting there thinking "what the hell kind of political analysis post is this?" but bear with me. Digby hits some notes that I want to expand on the whole cultural connection issue, expanding some thoughts from Chris Bowers at MyDD on American tribalism. Living, as I do, in the heart of the "hills and hollers" crowd, I see this sort of discussion is a necessary one at a national political level -- because too often this part of the country has either been written off or taken for granted.
The Democratic party used to pretty much own this area. And they still do in local and statewide elections for the most part. But because the party infrastructure was taken for granted here for so long, and because national campaigns just took for granted that the votes would be here when they wanted them instead of working to maintain a connection -- the well has gone dry the last couple of elections, and we need to do a lot more priming to get the votes flowing again.
Digby writes, talking about a song from the CMAs the other day:
Now that's identity. I emphasized the "can't get no respect" part because I think that's key, as I have written many times before. The belief that these ideas are particular to this audience, that they stand alone as being politically incorrect and are "out of style" for holding them, is a huge cultural identifier. And it's held in opposition to some "other" (presumably someone like me) who is believed not to care about any of those things --- particularly the welfare of the common man.Bowers writes:
Motivating voters and pulling off a landslide election will require a gut-level change of attitude about the two parties among millions of Americans. For all of the great policies everyone will suggest Democrats to run on this fall, ultimately winning will be based just as much on how Americans view their identity in relation to the image of the two coalitions as anything else. We need to avoid falling into the wonk trap of assuming that people are motivated by policy details. It is the identity, stupid. We need to explore ways to motivate voters for progressive causes with that in mind.
The conservative southern coalition has a very clear sense of identity. They always have. I would suggest that back in the day the New England and Midwestern cultural identifiers were pretty solidly Main Street bourgeois --- if you made it your kids got to go to college and you got to join the chamber of commerce and the country club. But that's no longer the case. The non-southern Party appears to exist mainly as a repository of opposition to conservative policies. Is that true?
I'm not certain this goes far enough. Far be it for me to contradict Digby (and I feel queasy even saying that), but here goes: it's not just that the Democrats have been playing the "non-Southern party" in recent elections or that they seem to have morphed into an "at least we're not the other guy" campaign -- but that they haven't even been very good at that in the end. In fact, they suck at it because they keep voting with the other guy.
I feel like all I do is repeat this, but here goes: it's not enough to hope that people will vote against the other guy, we have to give them a reason to get up off their behinds and want to vote FOR us.
Honestly, let's think about it for a minute -- can you count the number of truly principled stands that you can recall the Democratic party taking in the last five years on more than one hand? Me neither. I'm not saying that the Republican party is any better, but now that the veneer of competence and honesty has slipped off their stinking mockery of a rose, wouldn't it be awfully nice for Democrats to capitalize on the opportunity by standing up FOR the American people -- ALL of the American people? Including the ones that have been taken for granted and all but ignored the last few years?
The South is made up of a big mix of economic strata -- but the unifying theme from the very wealthy down to the poorest of the poor is this: what they'd like is some respect and to be treated like they are just as important and intelligent as the rest of the country. Not like some poor hayseed cousin that you are too embarrassed to take to the country club for fear he'll belch the national anthem before the sorbet course.
And don't give me that crap that we can just forget about the South and still take all the "battleground" states and win on the electoral map. There are blue collar people in every freaking state -- or people who come from blue collar stock, and even though they've worked their way up to the suburbs and a two-car garage, they still see themselves as one step removed from the trailer park. (I still do, and I'm two steps removed...)
The Democratic party used to stand for the little guy. The Common Man. The underdog that could make good if he were only given a chance. The widow who got squeezed out of her husband's pension. You know the list.
And they still do -- but the problem is that no one, not even me and I'm a big ole Democratic supporter, NO ONE see the Democratic Party as actually STANDING right now. It's more of a barely raising your hand in class, and hoping just maybe the teacher won't notice you until she's already called on someone else, but you can at least get credit for the hand raising part there.
But for the hills and hollers crowd -- and really all of the South and the parts of the country where we like our leaders to have some freaking balls -- that's not nearly enough.
Which is why the Feingold censure movement caught fire in the blogosphere. Which is why people still adore Paul Wellstone. Which is why there are old people all over the state of West Virginia who have a picture of John F. Kennedy right up there on the wall next to their picture of Jesus.
My whole professional life was spent in the courthouse among the "unclean" in America -- the underprivileged, for the most part, the drug addicts, the petty criminals, the child abusers, the people you get to mow your lawn and then they rob you while you are on vacation, the folks that all those gated communities work so hard to keep out unless they need a handyman. And you know what I learned? For the most part, they were all just like me but for one, simple fact: my parents worked hard to give me a sense of values, identity and hope, and these folks mostly came from crappy families who disrespected them and taught them to expect nothing better from life than what they already had.
You want to know why John Kennedy is so revered, still, in West Virginia? Because when he campaigned here, he spoke in the language of hope. Of lifting people out of the dark hell of the coal mines and into whatever dream they wanted to achieve. And, despite being from a seriously wealthy family from Massachusetts, he took the time to speak to regular folks like he valued their opinion and not like he was better than they were -- and they felt the more valuable for it.
Bill Clinton did the same thing -- because he understood exactly what it was like to be in those shoes.
What is missing from politics today is empathy and respect. George Bush was able to fake it for a while with some of the people, because they hungered for it so badly from their leaders that they were willing to look past the smirks and the sly glances to the side at his staffers when he delivered his lines. But that curtain has long been pulled away, and the frat boy simper doesn't hold the lustre it once did.
What we need is a Democratic party -- and party leadership -- that steps up to that challenge. Karl Rove's faux concern malarky isn't playing well in Peoria any longer, because it's been exposed for the lie that it is. What we need is to step up to the plate and provide real concern. To highlight the plight of real people in America.
But to do that, we need some fresh ideas -- and we need politicians will to step up and honestly run with them. From the gut, from the heart -- all the way, not just half-assed, but all the way to the finish line. And we need to provide hope for everyone, not just the golden parachute crowd -- everyone in this country needs to feel like they have a stake. Because they DO have one. And that their actions can make a difference -- make a change -- and bring something better for themselves and their children.
And it is about time we reminded them of that fact. Now, THAT is a reason to get off your butt and away from that Hee Haw re-run to go and vote.
(This photo is of the gorgeous New River Gorge area, in southern West Virginia. I'm lucky enough to have been there a bazillion times in my lifetime, but a whole lot of my state is still this beautiful. Thought I'd share a little glimpse with everyone else this morning.)
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fitz!!
By the frootz of their labors you shall know them…and by the Fitz they cause.
Fri, May 26, 2006 6:28pm EST
“Media Matters”; by Jamison Foser
The defining issue of our time is not the Iraq war. It is not the “global war on terror.” It is not our inability (or unwillingness) to ensure that all Americans have access to affordable health care. Nor is it immigration, outsourcing, or growing income inequity. It is not education, it is not global warming, and it is not Social Security.
The defining issue of our time is the media.
The dominant political force of our time is not Karl Rove or the Christian Right or Bill Clinton. It is not the ruthlessness or the tactical and strategic superiority of the Republicans, and it is not your favorite theory about what is wrong with the Democrats.
The dominant political force of our time is the media.
Time after time, the news media have covered progressives and conservatives in wildly different ways — and, time after time, they do so to the benefit of conservatives.
Consider the last two presidents. Bill Clinton faced near-constant media obsession with his “scandals,” while George W. Bush has gotten off comparatively easy…..Read On
Thoughtful post.
In terms of presidential campaigns, it pushes me right back into the John Edwards camp. He knows how to talk to people. ALL kinds of people, in the language of hope.
Beyond that, in general party terms I agree. The dems used to be as much about getting down in the dirt with the common folks and giving them a hand to push themselves up, more than reaching down from on high and ‘pulling’ them up. It’s a subtle distinction, but an important one.
I read that Digby post and thought, “Yes. It’s not something I could do, but I’d love to see some real identity based country songwriting!”
I’ve been listening to the new Dixie Chicks album and my partner and I plan to see them when they come to town.
Back in the day, mountain music took on the what it was to be for the union. It’s time to bring more of that kind of people-powered identity back around on the banjo.
Dennis Kucinich in 2004 was just the man to fit your description of what we need in a Democrat candidate. And look what happened to him-Democrats and Republicans made light of him and his message. Some even ridiculed his plain, homespun manner. Every Republican criticism of him was picked up by the Democrats and used against him. Now, many are doing the same thing to Russ Feingold. I’ll stay home in the coming election if the Democrats don’t change their ways.
Nice post Christy. Though I think it’s safe to say that the theme has been repeated over and over again, yet it’s just not registering. Then again, it seems they aren’t listening.
That said, I think Kerry has recently gotten a clue. Rumor has it that he ejected his consultants and is now speaking from his heart. Based on some of his recent statements, there is a palpable improvement. Still though, he’s almost a lost cause. That wind surfing pic will be his albatross for a long time.
Right now it seems the only Democrat that is speaking truth 24/7 is the one that’s not in office or running: Al Gore.
I pray every single day that Gore will find it in his heart to come to this country’s rescue. He’s EXACTLY what this country needs right now. He’s no JFK, but what else do we have? Feingold is doing well, but I don’t believe he can win an election as the top name. (I love the guy, but I just don’t seem him winning.) Then there’s Hillary. Though I was shocked she was on the correct side of the Hayden vote, I still see her as a pathetic pandering DLC lackey. Anyone else is just another name in a bucket. A sudden dark horse could show up, but who would want to take over this train wreck that Bush has made?
My ultimate dream though is for Gore to announce sometime in December 06. But what would make it a dream would be for the Dems to agree that Gore IS the best thing and show united support behind him. Don’t even have run anyone against him. Just join together as one solid party and tell the whole country that the Dems are coming to the rescue and WE ALL support Gore as the leader of the charge.
Oh well, just a dream I know, but it’s that kind of movement that would radically change the Democrat’s image throughout the country.
I see the issue as charity versus solidarity.
Republicans want to see the government get out of the helping people business and let charity take over. But what is charity? It’s money that you pay to keep poor people at arm’s length. Money that lets you tell yourself you are not the same as them.
The Democratic Party needs to step up for solidarity. Solidarity means you help people out, not because you are better than they are but because you are the same as them. You used to be them, or you could be them, or they could be you. It’s a fundamentally different stance.
Slightly OT,
I caught the last 10 minutes of charlie rose on pbs last night. What a disgusting display of despicable giggling whackjobs. They spent their time dissing ‘the angry left’, Markos, CTG and Daily Kos at large.
Guest Host: DAVID BROOKS, The New York Times
BRUCE REED, President, The Democratic Leadership Council
ANDREW SULLIVAN, Senior Editor, The New Republic / Essayist, Time
DAVID FRUM, American Enterprise Institute
Reed, WhoTF cares.
Sullivan, trying to make friends, as usual.
Frum, doesn’t get worse.
Brooks, Mr. meme.
They look in the mirror and see angry, banal wingnuts.
Bonus, Al Gore really scares the piss outa these fcuktards.
fitz
Zergle-
Maybe a good way to think of it is like this:
Would you announce your candidacy now and have the smear machine watching and reporting your every move, or wait until the last minute and avoid all that?
> what they’d like is some respect and
> to be treated like they are just as
> important and intelligent as the rest
> of the country.
I am afraid I must disagree a bit here. I don’t know very many Democrats, “liberals”, “left-wingers”, or even “Communists” who don’t show respect for / disrespect anyone else in any subculture in the US. A few? Sure. Just as there are a few (or more) bigoted Rush Limbaugh disciples out there. But all? Or most? Or constant disrespect? No. If you disagree, please provide me with some significant examples.
The problem I see is that when anyone from any other area/culture in the US does in fact deal with anyone from the South with respect for that person as an intelligent human being, they are THEN criticized for “talking down”, “arrogance”, “elitism”, and “East Coast behavior”. In other words, taking a person seriously as a citizen and expecting them to reciprocate is “talking down”!
So for anyone to the left of Dobson it seems to be damned if you don’t, DOUBLE DAMNED if you do. It is a lose-lose attitude. I don’t see how that can ever be overcome, and trying to do so just twists otherwise good Democratic candidates (e.g. Dean) into pretzels.
Does that mean that Dems / “liberals” are doomed to minority status forever? I say no, because the one thing that Dems could do that would get a workable percentage of southerners to vote for them is to /stand up and fight/. THAT is what earns enough respect to get votes from people who disagree with you. If in the 2nd debate John Kerry had said “Hell yes I am from Massachusets. Just like Paul Revere, [insert more heros here], and George Bush’s grandfather. I am proud of being from Massachusets and DAMN PROUD OF BEING A LIBERAL! Stuff it in your face George”, well then, I think he would have gotten infinitely more respect and, yes, more votes.
Cranky
I’m a bluegrass fan myself, and a solid political Liberal, and I agree with every damn thing you said. There *is* a south. There *is* a midwest. There *is* a heartland. And the folks who live in these places aren’t stupid and their votes *do* count. Our Democratic political leaders need to fire their consultants and strategists, dump their soundbites and focus groups, and look folks right in the eye and talk to them, honestly, and not even worry about whether or not they agree on all the issues or whether they can spin things just right to get more votes.
I know plenty of folks who will vote for someone they have differences with just so long as they know they can trust them to do what they think is right, instead of playing slimeball politician.
It’s all about trust, and you can’t trust folks who you think are playing games with you. Like Howard Dean and Russ Feingold, if the rest of the Dems stand up, explain who they are, and say they are proud of who they are, and stop appologizing for it, they’ll do all right in the next election.
But if our Democratic leaders and candidates think that tossing a whole bunch of TV spots into swing states will win this country over, we Dems are going to be the minority party once again.
Not a bazillion, maybe, but I was in beautiful WVa a lot in the decade I lived in Bristol, TN.
And I think you and Digby and Bowers are bang on about the importance of the identity / tribal driver in politics. But where do identity politics and tribalism come from, and what makes them so powerful?
Tribalism is a very human defensive reaction to fear of Others, and Republicans seem better able and always willing to fan that fear. Tribalism is hard to overcome.
Identity too, I think, often means more than just “he is like me.” I think it means “he is like me, and that makes BOTH OF US okay.”
No matter who we put forth, they will be smeared as fake, phony, weak, etc. So why not put forth people who actually stand for something! Who cares what Republican smear machine and the corporate media (sorry, redundancy) will say about them? We already know. So let’s put forth people who know what they stand for and will keep saying it.
No more “electibility!”
Christy, great post.
I’ve been a longtime bluegrass fan, too (an older brother of a high school friend turned me on to it). I try to go to a festival every summer and even have a big ol’ straw hat that’s been signed by Ralph Stanley and Earl Scruggs. I’m still deciding who gets the coveted #3 spot on the hat. I would’ve liked it to be John Hartford (my first bluegrass fave), but, sadly, that’s not possible.
Nice pic,New River Gorge is’nt it.Climber’s paradise.
Thank you for this post, Christy. I am from Georgia, born and raised, and have often been astonished at the number of people across the country who believe that the South is our national repository for “hicks”, that somehow the rest of the country is made up entirely of dazzling urbanites. I went to college in NY, and some people there seemed to expect they would have to use small words and speak very slowly for me to understand them.
It also seems that people forget that the population of the South is not only white reactionary conservatives. There are plenty of white progressives, there is a huge population of african-americans, and there are newer, rapidly expanding populations of hispanics and asians. And, just like people everywhere, people in the South do need representatives who will reach out to them with genuine sincerity and empathy.
Here’s hoping the Democrats will wake up and stand up.
Laid bare.Too many in this nation are NOT intellectually/politically savy enough to differentiate between what they like/ or is popular and what is a violation of other’s rights to choose or of our constitution.You will never reach enough of these people to make a political difference.It is that ‘gut appeal’ that the GOP has seized upon.When the day comes that showing the declaration of independence/constitution at a 4th of July VFW
picnic is not seen a the writings of ‘commies’ etc. THEN the tide will turn.I’m a realist.George Bush is the ‘perfect’ leader to lead this nation to it’s sad journeys end.Too late IMHO.
Most of the national politicians pass through here in Iowa at some point. Many have already started their ‘08 campaignes. But, you know what?? Most of them won’t be seen in the typical small town Iowa. They’ll be found in the ‘cosmopolitian’ areas like Des Moines, Cedar Rapids, Iowa City, and the Quad Cities, not Vinton, Newton, Shellsburg, or my Aunt Neoma’s farm. They don’t get that as much as 90% of the population here is either still on the farm or are one generation removed. I have a split identity, part farm family and part city family, even though I never lived on the farms of family members. But, I do remember going and visiting aunts and cousins that are still on the farms.
So, yes, I agree that many of the national politicians can’t identify with the ‘common man’. Or there are very few that can. I do know that the current govenor of Iowa is going to try to make a run for president in ‘08. But, some of the rumor is that he’s not expecting to get the nomination, but a cabinet post (probably Dept of Ag). He’s not running for re-election.
DAVID FRUM, American Enterprise Institute
Was he wearing a sweater vest?
I’m from SE Ohio Christy,though I left once the auto industry died leaving behind abject poverty in it’s wake.I still have family there,and life hasn’t improved over the last 20 yrs,it’s got much worse.
Now I live in GA,and even with the 50 state initiative and all,I see very little grassroots activity in the Democratic party here in Metro Atlanta(though it may be different in other parts of the state).
Whenever a progressive visits this area(Metro Atlanta now has sprawled out to include about 20 counties)they only seem to visit Atlanta and rarely if ever go outside that little blue haven.For me,that’s about an hour drive into serious clusterfuck traffic one way.It makes it hard to join in and be active.
In short,I feel written off by liberals and Democrats in general.The short time I spent trying to connect with local Democrats didn’t impress me at all.It’s a club,and not a very welcoming or accessable one.Maybe I just went looking in the wrong places,I suppose that’s possible.
Another thing that bugs me is that when there are discussions about the South among progressive liberal folks(panels,articles,etc),those discussions don’t often include those who live here now.It seems to me that one can’t get a feel for the political climate of a certain place on the map if you never visit there or invest anything in talking to people who live there.There seems to be an unwillingness to move outside the comfort zones,here,that would be Atlanta or places around the city with high minority populations.I’m not chiding anyone for that,and heaven knows that work is needed,but it’s neglecting a huge part of the population currently being written off as”red”.This area is full of people who moved here from other parts of the country over the last 20 yrs.Many came during the big construction boom of the 80’s and never left(like me,lol).In other words,there are many of us down here who came from more liberal parts of the country,or who have always had more liberal views who don’t feel welcomed or that we belong anywhere politically speaking.
Support for the war in this very red county is starting to shift.People aren’t just feeling the sting of gas prices,they’re bitching about overdevelopment and urban sprawl that makes traffic a nightmare and has destroyed alot of what made this area so attractive(the trees,the sense of living on the edges of a rural area and the peace and quiet that goes with that,etc)in the first place.Food prices are going through the roof,it’s getting harder and harder to have any savings or send kids to college.And with this discontent brewing,some smart and simple politics could shift things dramatically.
Sure,there’s still quite a few Republican diehards,many from families who go back several generations as staunch conservatives.And we have megachurches everywhere.But I don’t get the impression that they are the majority these days.People are starting to come around,but when they do,who will be there for them? It’s one of those “vote for the devil you know,rather than the one you don’t”things.
not much a of country music fan, but bluegrass is different. them’s some fine pick’n skills. as even yo yo ma understands.
but i don’t care what they say, Conservatives, just do not get rock and roll.
I felt Howard Dean cared about the lives and hopes of citizens, and expressed his concern honestly and clearly. But within five days of suggesting that we needed to break up the media monopolies, they turned him into a wack-job parody, and that was that.
AKUS has 3 Wins 48th Annual Grammy Awards
AKUS = Allison Krauss Union Station
Absolutely on target, once again, Christy. I have relatives who can still be brought to tears over the loss of JFK and RFK. They were like us, from families who came up from poor roots AND remembered who and what are important. I really miss candidates who are something more that fairly acceptable.
A few years back (I think it was in 1998 or so), NPR did a segment on Bobby on the anniversary of his death. The most moving part was an interview with an elderly man from West Virginia who met and spoke with Bobby when he visited the backroad on which the elderly man lived. The elderly man told Bobby how much JFK meant to him and his family and that he thought someone like JFK must have been just too good to live in this world, then he embraced Bobby. At this point, I’m sitting in my office bawling. The acorn doesn’t fall far from the tree, I guess. Anyway, the elderly man said that a couple weeks later that trucks showed up and workers fixed the road and everyone’s roof. He knew that Bobby had sent them and didn’t want or need credit for it.
In our last election, Kathleen Kennedy Townsend (Bobby’s daughter) ran against Robert Ehrlich (a Gringrich Republican) for governor of Maryland. You’d think this would be a slam dunk for Townsend, but some how during the course of the election she seemed to lose all of her father and uncle’s common touch. She alienated the big African American churches in the urban/suburban areas, blew off the doctors organizations up in Baltimore, and seemed to ignore the farming community. What was she doing? Her campaign seemed to be enamoured with fancy out-of-state interests and taking a LOT of the dyed-in-the-wool Dems for granted. I knew an unfortunate number of people who were majorly pissed off by this and voted for Ehrlich out of spite. Of course, now we’re living with results of that spite, governed by a man who’s trying to sell off beloved State parks (including some that community groups such as a high school had raised funds to ADD to the park system) to cronies in sweetheart deals. We’re finding out that he did a slash-and-burn through State government, firing or driving out highly qualified employees (not appointees) to further an agenda not supported by most residents. Sort of like what we have at the National level, no?
You’re absolutely right. Democratic party needs not only to court swing voters, but to shore up the quiet base groups that have been taken for granted.
> I went to college in NY, and some people
> there seemed to expect they would have to
> use small words and speak very slowly for
> me to understand them.
sp,
From my perspective it is a nice lose-lose situation: if you then speak at the pace of the averge American, and use any words or phrasing more complex than 6th-grade civics, you are accused of “talking down”. There is no way to get to a mutually benefical situation when one of the parties tries to force lose-lose on the other.
Cranky
That is one good post,and so true.Leaders who will stand up become heros to us(Feingold,Lamont,ect.)because so few do.
I recognized the Gorge from the photo before I read the post.
Great topic. Kentucky has the same history/political pattern. I think the split has something to do with never framing the civil rights debate for rural populations. The memes embedded in songs can change our fortunes. Where are the wordsmiths?
ralphinlex
Al Gore is going to save us? The Democrats that brought us NAFTA and CAFTA are going to save us? The Clinton/Gore administration did more to screw American working people than any Republican administration I can remember. Every time American workers see their factories close and their jobs shipped off to China or Bangladesh they can thank Clinton/Gore. To hell with Al Gore and the rest of DLC Free Market cabal. Let him keep making movies.
Great post, Christy.
I couldn’t agree more. People are yearning for a message of hope.
Two weeks ago, I attended my son’s college graduation at the University of Maine. U Maine is a big state school and most of the parents and grandparents in attendance were NOT old money types. It appeared that for many of the families there, their child was the first family member to earn a college degree.
John Edwards was the commencement speaker. He spoke to this crowd and they responded. He was excellent, and more importantly–genuine. I think most of the people who heard him felt inspired and invigorated. He would get people to set down their bag of Cheetos, turn off the TV and go VOTE on election day. And feel good about it.
what Dems used to stand for was a kind of ubuntu—the concept of community being enriched by each member of the community—and thus each member respected all the others. Where did we lose that—how did the flower power generation lose that sense????? that’s what Dems need to exhibit again—that’s what the blogs exhibit—everyone has a voice, everyone respects that each of us have something to say, that we add to our community here, that we are all lesser when some one leaves (hence the reaction a couple of weeks agowhen someone–epicurious maybe– was upset and signed off and people BEGGED her to stay, that we needed her, and showed how much we all cared about her—-that’s what the Dems need to exude on a larger scale.
Christie, last fall I did some volunteering just before the election in Boone County WV (I live in Putnam)—they were still talking about when JFK came, how he couldn’t be heard so he jumped into the back of a pick up truck on the Madison courthouse lawn and spoke to the crowd—those old miners still haven’t gotten over that one simple act of being willing to be one of “us”
Terry,
Kathleen Kennedy Townsend had a horrible campaign,seemed utterly aloof and incompetent(remember the’boys boot camp’scandle on her watch),and coming out of the Glendening camp did’nt help.Basically the Dem party strategy in miniture.A loser.
What is missing from politics today is empathy and respect.
Because having empathy has been framed as being condescending, being a do-gooder, which is equated with being weak. This really struck me as the most important point. How do you change the soul/psychology of the country?
Greg-
The Clinton/Gore administration did more to screw American working people than any Republican administration I can remember.
WHAT? are you kidding me? What about this administration? Do you have short-term memory loss?
Well, learning to respect people from the south will probably be a long row to hoe for most of the “progressive” community, especially north-easterners. They have a deeply rooted idea that they are, infact, better than people from the southern parts of the country.
I’ve been around progressive blogs for a while and whenever I have the nerve to reveal that I’m from the south I get alot of insults right off the bat. Some “progressives” seem to think the south does nothing for the nation and that we are somehow a sponge for your tax dollars, and they’re all too happy to tell “us” about it. Others think we sit around on our porches all day playing our banjos and drinking whiskey waiting for the next klan rally or welfare check to come in the mail to motivate us to get up. That kind of attitude would make you vote republican if it were directed at you often enough from democrats. Think about it, if one political party openly reviled you, where would you cast your votes?
Then there is the issue of immigration. Believe it or not, some southerners grew up seeing the horrors of the civil rights struggle and are VERY thoughtful about race, and have no racism in them. Those people take it very personal when you call them racist and guess what, plenty of them still care about the immigration issue too. When “progressives” start spouting about them being racist… they’ve just flushed that vote down the toilet. Infact, I would say that stopping the knee-jerk accusations of racism would be the first step to learning to respect people from the south, or feigning it.
I do appreciate you posting this(though I have to assume the hee-haw remark was in good fun and not condescension), I think it’s important not just for the south, but for the nation, to finally put an end to the animosity between hillbillies and yankees. And I do think you hit on an important point about how the Republicans swept the south. Americans have pride, that does include those from the south too, therefore faux respect, even if you know that’s what it is, is still preferable to outright dis-respect and that’s all the left seems to have for the south these days.
Terry,
Have you ever thought about joining the roots project?If interested,mail me at paradox65@comcast.net.
cathy 32 - just ignore it, it’ll go away
D. Mason at 33 — As someone who watched Hee Haw with her granny every week as a kid, and who lived for the Grandpa banjo moments (damn! that old guy could pick, couldn’t he?), it was most decidedly a personal tease at all my fellow hicks and nothing more.
A timely message. When I think of Hubert Humphrey or RFK or Paul Welstone, I become conscious of that populism that’s missing in today’s Democratic Party. Because Gore has populist roots in Tennessee he might be able to communicate respect to the people you write about, Christy. Makes me think that a Gore/Edwards ticket could take us back to our true Democratic legacy.
If someone has a copy of a Gore email address they should send him a copy of this post. It has a lot of food for thought!
Dearest Christy,
“My whole professional life was spent in the courthouse among the “unclean” in America… and these folks mostly came from crappy families who disrespected them and taught them to expect nothing better from life than what they already had.”
This one paragraph gave me chills. Thankyouthankyouthankyou.
Dammit, I have to run off to a meeting. I’ll catch up later, if that’s OK, for there is one so very crucial point that Digby makes Via Bowers that Christy includes and it’s this: It is the identity, stupid.
Spotonbingocouldn’tagreemore. And I could write pages on this very topic.
The trick is, how to recapture it. These parts of the country that Christy writes about, they were all staunchly Democratic and for decades so. The good news is, recapturing can be (not always) much less daunting and difficult than establishing.
It’s the identity, stupid. I love it!
I agree with you about Democrats not “standing up.” Let’s just take that as a given (and I’m betting, Digby doesn’t disagree on this point at all). But that’s something the Democrats have to do not just in terms of the South, but in terms of the nation as a whole.
What Digby is addressing, I think, is that the south’s “special” identity is more vulnerable to manipulation by both conservatives and the media, in part because there is a stronger sense of regional identity there than in other areas of the country.
In other words, the conservatives say “Kerry is a liberal Yankee that the Democrats are trying to shove down your throat” and the media follows it up by saying “Yes, Bush is so genuine, compared to stiff, stilted Kerry” while pointedly ignoring the Yankee silver spoon George had in his mouth when he was born. They did the SAME EXACT THING TO AL GORE and he was FROM the south.
The media, in this day and age, has the ability to alter and even overwrite an individual’s *immediate* perception of a candidate or of the Democratic Party in general. The net effect of that has been for Democrats to try not to say anything that the media can highlight as being particularly a) stupid or b) antithetical to… [southerner’s regional identity, as an example]. My sense, personally, is that Democrats need to be able to come out and make strong statements that they defend fiercely *even if* it gets someone’s regional nose out of joint. The trick is, though, if only one Dem does it, they have to face a) the conservatives, b) the media, and c) other Dems/progresives (who wish they hadn’t said what they said, or think that it’s a good point but was overstated, or that it was innapropriate to the moment, yada, yada.)
Until enough Dems speak out in unison, and not only slap down the media and the conservatives down, but exercise enough party discipline to NOT take the media when Tweety or Pumpkinhead offer it (ie, “So, what did you think of Russ Feingold’s motion to censure the president?”) Dems have to learn how to sidestep the question if they can’t respond with an unqualified “hell, yeah.” The need to respond by saying something like “evidence suggests that we were misled into this war, and I think the American people deserve to know X and I’m going to do Y.” In other words, reinforce the message that the Republicans suck and DON’T SLAM YOUR COLLEAGUES AND BY EXTENSION YOUR PARTY. Or, hell, say “What I came to talk to you today about, Tweety, was the X bill, which I’m sponsoring. All Americans need P and we’re going to do our best to make sure they get it…”
As an aside, I’d also like to point out that, from my perspective, the “good” image of the South is one southerners take pride in. But there is, conversely, no attempt by the media to create or reinforce any sort of positive identity for the Northeast (and I’m betting the same is true of the West Coast). And, to be frank — and I know you don’t think the South can be/should be ignored — but at a certain point, I can’t care about the South’s hurt feelings anymore. We northern media elite latte sipping Volvo driving liberals up get cast as/are told we’re as cold, unemotional, permissive (sex out of wedlock, gays, gay marriage, single motherhood), ruining the fabric of our society, overpriviliged, and out of touch, etc., etc., etc., and yet we manage to keep on keepin’ on.
It’s not so much we need fresh ideas–there is plenty of good in the policies and underlying philosophy of the Democratic Party–as long as we winnow away those corporatist/accomodationist/Liebermanist policies. What is needed is a politician or even a new type of campaigning who can relate these policies to the identities of the various segments of the electorate. That is, the messenger more than the message, is what needs fixed.
Christy is right that empathy is key. It can’t just be outward signs of class or regional identity. After all what plays well in Tuscaloosa doesn’t fly in Boston. I rather liked John Kerry–the effete, intellectual New Englander was fine by me (though I like the John Kerry of Going Upriver more than the John Kerry of 2004). But I can see how his style was a turnoff to large swaths of class and regional identities. Conversely, a good ol’ boy persona would have an uphill battle to win my vote. John Edwards, though, did seem to bridge that gap. Maybe someone from the West–someone in the Brian Schweitzer mold–would have enough local color about him to appear authentic at first glance, but not the baggage that seems to come from being a “Southerner” or “New Englander”.
The first step, though, is winning the war against the media. The trashing of the Clintons, the trashing of Gore, Chris Matthews continued homoerotic fixation on Bush, all show that they will trash whoever the Democratic nominee is.
The American public is finally awaken to fact that the RNC is more like Hollywood then the Dems.
They all read from the same script(Republican Talking Points)
Everything is choreographed for the cameras( Mission accomplished Banner,colors of flight suits,landing of plane etc)
Just like some hollywood movies,Republican policy plans have great titles but poor content.( No Child Left Behind,etc)
As Dens we need to talk our values to every voter in every state
When you talk about a campaign of hope, I immediately think of John Edwards. He seems to me by far, the Dem that understands and relates to the common folk. I have no idea why he hasn’t gone further to the top of the candidate heap.
I wonder if a JFK of today would make it. If the media and pundits who so love to take the Dems down, would ever alow him to get out of the gate. Is that what happened to Edwards? Is he not “cool” enough for the cool kids.?
Lord help us.
D.Mason,
Do you think it is disrespectful to black people who are the descendents of slaves to drive aound with the Confederate Battle Flag on your car? And/or to fly it from your state capitol building? Why or why not?
Cranky
Cathy - I TOTALLY agree. If Gore were to announce now it would be a complete mistake. No, I think he’s playing his cards right. Any announcement prior to Novemeber would be a wreck. Let the GOP focus on Hillary bashing. I mean they enjoy it, so let them at it. Then when Gore does announce he can do it like a 2×4 upside the GOP’s collective conciousness.
They act like Gore is a joke, but I have no doubt that the thought of Gore running scares the crap outta Rove and his cohorts.
I just hope when he does announce, it will be greeted with the kind of reaction I alluded to: A United stance from the entire Democratic party.
Oh and Greg…I was of the exact same mindset until just recently. Gore seems to have completely abandoned the DLC mentality. At least his speeches sure make it seem he has. I don’t blame you for your total distrust of the man, but I’d ask that you just give him a 2nd look. Frankly, he’s just not the same putz who lost in 2000. His change is radical, refreshing, and honest. And to me he’s a hell of a better option than Hillary. And have no doubt if we don’t get Gore, the odds of it not being Hillary are extreme.
Oh and one last thing to sum up the southern thing: Intelligence (or lack thereof) is not zip code specific. Just like it’s not race or nationality specific.
Cathy-
I think you’re suffering from long term memory loss. NAFTA, CAFTA and…I forgot to mention the WTO. If Clinton/Gore is the best Democrats can do then we are truly screwed.
twolf1-
Yeah, anyone who criticizes Clinton/Gore must be a troll, there is no other possible explanation.
NAFTA: A Clear Failure of Public Policy
by David Morris March 11, 1996
“…. Yet it was not Democrats that put NAFTA over the top. Sixty percent of the Democrats in the House voted against Clinton. It was Newt Gingrich’s aggressive intervention and Republican votes that made the difference….”
Emphasis mine.
While I, too respect the thinking in many of Digby’s posts, I have been dismayed, continually, by his “put down” of the South. As a southerner, I am all too aware of the political shortcomings and historical, racial equality failures, but the stereotyping that he exhibits and the responders to his posts show that there is still much prejudice against the South, even when the region has changed so drastically over the last 50 years.
There is still much to be done, but discounting a region and its values is not an intelligent strategy for the Democratic Party. There is much in southern behavior which could lift the Party to success, if they paid attention to it. Someone mentioned John Edwards ability to communicate genuine compassion for “the common man.” This is not an anomaly in the South. The reason for his empathy is the context from which it comes: genuine economic hardships, religious faith, family loyalty and cohesiveness, and hard work.
In spite of the influx of new people from other parts of the country, the South still retains the warp and woof of a tightly-woven psyche which embraces values worthy of emulation and
imitation on the national level. Bush hijacked those values and bambozzled innocent people who were disgusted with Clinton’s sexual
recklessness. Now, Bush is shown for what he is: a complete phony, and his Party is corrupt.
This is the opportunity for the Democrats to listen to Edwards and others who know how to speak to people and inspire them. Kerry is not the one. Clinton (Hillary) is not the one. But, the obvious integrity of a Russ Feingold could, or an Al Gore. Where is any “dirt” on Gore? Any sexual pecadillo? Not any. A straight arrow, a straight talker.
But, you only get straight talk from a candidate
who eschews consultants, and a Party which allows the candidates to speak for their own selves. The Party needs to trust its candidates and their ideas. The Party has failed. And, their choice (Kerry) for Presidential candidate has failed. They need to listen to citizens not paid consultants. For instance, how can one trust their loyalty? Look at David Gergen, who served as a Republican advisor, in a Republican administration, and then, advised Clinton? How did this escape the nation’s attention as a very weird thing? There is no such thing as an impartial consultant: they are whores for money and will work for the highest bidder. Our political health reflects the influence of their
behavior.
My brother, Mark Campbell, has won fiddling awards in the Blue Grass Festival held there on the New River. The whole family has been going there for years.
Clinton/Gore was DLC. Clinton made the decisions and the policy. Gore embraced the DLC mindset, had Joe running with him and it cost him the 2000 race. In some ways, I’m thankful because over the last few years Gore has learned that it was a mistake to side with those idiots. His endorsment of Dean was another stake in the heart of the DLC beast. Unfortunately though Hillary/Biden/Joe still continue to give it life support.
Seriously Greg. I know where you are coming from and I’m not one to give politicans a 2nd chance either. But I really think you will find a completely new Al Gore if you are willing to listen to him with an open mind. Don’t write him off. 8 years can make a big difference in a man. At least one who is willing to come to terms with his past failings, unlike our current putz-in-charge.
Greg-
Even including NAFTA, CAFTA, and sex in the Whitehouse, you can’t possibly think that the Bush adminstration hasn’t done the most to damage this country and everything we used to stand for in the history of this country.
OT but you gotta love the rude pundit:
the rude pundit
Really interesting post Redd. You are probing the most important political dividing line in the nation- but you left out an important ingredient- race. To be the party who represents both the rappers and the country western crowd is a lot easier said than done- and I don’t think Russ has the answer to it. What’s the minority population of Wisconsin?
Wherever the democratic party is viewed as the party of minorities- the goopers win with the blue collar crowd. That’s an oversimplification- but it’s pretty close to the truth.
Bowers and Digby talk about tribes but don’t mention tribal leaders.
People adhere to leaders first because of shared beliefs and more importantly because the leaders can articulate and rationalize the beliefs.
98% of people 98% of the time act on their beliefs without any critical examination of the beliefs. Many people are incapable any but the most shallow explanation but believe their leaders have a deep convincing explanation.
For example, I’ve had some discussions on social policy with sincere deeply religious people. When I’ve questioned a belief they offer Bible quotes in support. When I mention that parts of the Bible that support the opposite position they consider that and become thoughtful. Then a few days later I get an email linking to an article by a “religious thinker” that support their original position and they consider the discussion closed.
I’m not making fun of such people here. For example, most people who believe in evolution do not have the technical knowledge to construct a long argument using it without making numerous glaring scientific mistakes. Evolutionists like the religious believe in experts who can articulate their beliefs for them.
I don’t know of any current Democratic leaders that people turn to as experts on their own beliefs. Al Gore may be becoming one on global warming but much advocacy is unclaimed.
Greg has a point– Clinton is not a liberal. There’s still a big difference between a democrat and a southern democrat.
The way I see it, the South has the country by the balls because they are so idealogically unified. The only democrat that can get elected president is a southern democrat because the south won’t elect a northern democrat. So that basically means DLCers only need apply.
When they try, Democrats speak the language of hope eloquently. In a radio address FDR fleshed out “The Forgotten Man”-
He went on to refer to opponents as “the unthinking” and “the shallow”, an “administration which can think in terms only of the top of the social and economic structure. It has sought temporary relief from the top down rather than permanent relief from the bottom up. It has totally failed to plan ahead in a comprehensive way.”
I STILL feel like he’s talking to me. At the end of the paperback printing of Conason’s SoSec book, there’s a great cartoon of FDR meeting “the forgotten man”. It’s very powerful.
GREAT post Christy, thanks.
I am a southerner who lives in CA. The rest of my family still lives in the South. When I visit (one week spent mostly at my parents’ nursing home every three months) I spend a lot of time talking to their caregivers, all working class African American women.
What I noticed around the election was a pattern in which their politics was counteracted by their religion. One was vocally anti-Bush, but said it didn’t matter because soon the rapture would come. Several spent all their time with the TV tuned to the 700 club and similar right-wing noise machines disguised as religion.
I don’t know how Democrats/progressives will make headway in regions where the churches counteract their message by labelling them as sinful abominations or teaching that it isn’t necessary to do anything about problems, since you’ll soon leave them behind for good times in heaven.
The other key ingredient- of course- is religion. In American Theocracy, Kevin Phillips traces the growth of the Southern Baptist Church in America. Where they become the major religion- the vote becomes gooper- he traces the growth on a map- and the result is astonishing.
Is the left ready to vote for a politician who caters to the Southern Baptists?
The Southern Baptists bring the CULTURE of the south with them as they invade border states and even the west. It’s pretty familiar- blue collar and white as the driven snow.
what they’d like is some respect and to be treated like they are just as . . . intelligent as the rest of the country.
I hear ya, but–they did vote for Bush. Twice.
I appreciate that they want respect, who doesn’t? But again: They voted for Bush in 2004.
And I don’t think I’m the only one here whose reaction to anyone who did that is: What motive could you possibly have for that vote that doesn’t show you to be racist, greedy, small-minded and/or utterly fucking stupid?
So the perception that the rest of the country doesn’t respect them isn’t some weird Southern neurosis. They’re picking up on a basic truth. I certainly don’t respect these folks’ choices and beliefs–we’ll be paying for their choices for generations.
But here’s the respect I will show them: I won’t lie about it anymore.
And Dems have ro come up with another strategy for dealing with the gap between the respect Bush supporters want, and the contempt they deservedly get. Insulting their intelligence every 4 years by pretending–ineptly–that we think they’re just the bee’s knees isn’t really working for us. They’re not that dumb.
No. This reflects a cultural claim of victimization more than anything. This is like Christians saying they’re disempowered and disrespected in this country. In fact, the South has a disproportionate amount of power, and even when Democrats choose Southerners as national leaders–who presumably do not feel the South is ignorant and embarrassing–they are not what you’d call wholeheartedly supported by the South. Say, for example, Jimmy Carter.
Yes, there are stereotypes of the ignorant Southerner, and the cold uptight Northerner, and the idiot New Age Californian. But what’s missing in other regions is the ‘rally round our wounded pride’ feeling which exists among some in the South.
Hell, our president -pretends- to have a Texan accent.
blow it out your ass greg. what a fucking douchebag. go spew your spittle at judy miller’s site. it’ll be welcome there.
If dems want the southern vote- then they need to carefully deconstruct GW Clusterfuck. How’d he get it?
He feigns ignorance. He refuses to use words of more than two syllables. He mentions God every other sentence. He eschews experts and any intellectual justification. He milks the flag and the bible and fear.
That’s how ya get these people. Do dems have the stomach for it?
Well, first off I make a major distinction between “my car” and a state capitol building. My car is my car, and though I’ve never adorned it with a confederate flag, if I wanted to it doesn’t matter if a black person is offended because it is my car and my flag and therefore none of his business. Just like, if he wears a Malcolm X shirt, to celebrate a man who was seriously racist against “white devils” like myself, it’s none of my business.
State capitols on the other hand, are a no brainer. They are either loyal to the union, as it were, or they are still fighting the civil war. If they can’t wrap their heads around that and take down the confederate flag(or send some troops into battle somewhere) then I think there needs to be a special election to get some people in office who have a fucking clue about the last 150 years. And before the point comes up no I am not advocating that they go into battle and re-hash the civil war. I’m just saying, shit or get off the pot.
We are clearly short on gracious leaders, men who invite one to share their dreams rather than dwell on their problems and fears. What I remember about the men who are wistfully remembered here, is that they instilled both confidence and clarity about the challenges that a gracious nation might face and resolve. They did not lie. They encouraged progress by meeting change with faith in potential, rather than fears about consequences. Dubya is the most ungracious man to ever hold the office of prez. Revenge and retribution have never soothed problems and fears, they always build on them. They make for shaky and uncertain foundations. Great leaders invite a nation to appreciate the potentials for a nation, as a whole, as a challenge. We are currently ‘led’ by a group of men who have written off most of the country. The major sympton of this is the further consolidation of wealth. Bush has exceeded the Class warfare raged by the Reagan administration by doing in 5 years what took Reagan 8. We have 2 1/2 years left with this fool. It’s time to find gracious leaders who appreciate that this nation is up to the challenges, not down for the count. They are out there waiting for the attention and appreciation we might accord them that the MSM does not. Just look for dlear statments about policy. Look past hypocrisy, it’s only a spped bump on the road of progress.
By the way- I love bluegrass too- but it’s not exactly at the top of the pop charts in blue collar america. It’s another of those pieces of nostalgia that “liberals” embrace.
I’m with you all the way, Mr.Smith. As a boy, my musical taste was formed (60 years back), when the late night airwaves opened up and I stumbled on WWVA. The two Lees, Moore and Parr, introduced me to Bill Monroe and all those blessed singers.
Now, not to complicate things, but I belong to the part of New York (second poorest county) where lots of folks get by cutting cordwood and killing more deer than is strictly legal. The only AM radio here plays what passes for country and western these days. There are lots of real folk up north too.
It’s a heavily Republican county, but these Republicans can’t stand Bush and are disgusted by the war. There is hope.
just left this comment over at digby’s, but since you guys are on the same subjuect: tribal identities are derived from conflict and if dems want to appeal to rival tribes they need to prop up a boogey man for the good ol’ boys to hate. rich people could replace gays and libruls quite smoothly…
I am not a Southerner but I live in the South. Dean lost me with the remark “we want to be the party of the guys who drive pick-up trucks with gun racks and confederate flags on the back” (that is pretty close to what he said). I thought whoa! how to offend everyone in the south in one remark! Some people have defended this remark, but I can’t imagine why. This was such a stereotypical view, and it is so important to get past the stereotypes. great post, Christy
> My car is my car, and though I’ve never
> adorned it with a confederate flag, if I
> wanted to it doesn’t matter if a black person
> is offended because it is my car and my flag
> and therefore none of his business.
I thought the issue was respect?
Cranky
At age 18 there is a separation of the sheep from the goats in America. 25 percent or so go off to college, get what passes for an education, and join “the elite”. The rest become roofers and plumbers and insurance salesmen. The division between the two groups is very strong- and the majority blue collar crowd doesn’t trust the “college boys”. You don’t break through to them with highly principled stands on constitutional issues. They’ve never read it.
I’m from western Maryland (Washington County) and I’m a big fan of Hayseed Dixie, does that count?
First principle: Avoid appeals to people’s religious convictions.
Second principle: Avoid appeals to patriotism.
Third principle: Do not play on people’s fears.
Fourth principle: No pretend conservatism.
Fifth principle: No dumbing down of issues.
Sixth principle: Challenge Americans to champion the simple values that once made us a great country: a basic fairness, tolerance of others, competence to get the job done, the willingness to reinvent ourselves.
As a Massachusetts liberal, I honestly don’t get this all-consuming sense of victimhood going on here. I am so tired of claims that Dems/liberals/progressives universally sneer at Southerners.
Where’s the proof??? Can anyone come up with a single example of a sneer, on par with, say, Bush’s repeated campaign rant about “Massachusetts liberals”?
I simply cannot imagine Gore or Kerry campaigning on a “Bush is a dimwitted redneck” theme. The press would have jumped down their throats and there would have been a truly ugly backlash.
This “northerners look down on Southerners” theme is a carefully crafted GOP talking point. STOP FALLING FOR IT!!!!!
Great post, Christy!
OT– Turley on CNN says we are in a Constitutional crisis. Will that wake up the public at large? I think so. I think that the erosion of our rights hits every American if framed properly and honestly. This is what our people fought every war on our soil for. The South and the North , the East and the West remember those wars and revere the memory of the dead and the battles won and lost in the name of freedom.
I liked the movie “The Song Catcher” set in the 30’s (?) about recording mountain music before it was lost. Taj Mahal made an appearance in it. A couple of years ago at a visitor center in the North Carolina mountains I asked a couple of women working there if the movie was accurate. They thought it was except for the romance scenes between 2 women…they didn’t think that that was realistic & not likely to have ever happened. What was interesting to me was the difficulty getting to the remote places, seeing how they recorded the songs with the early recording devices available then & the infighting between the music scholars of the time.
I just couldn’t get into the “Oh Brother” movie…
Watch the goopers as they take the irrational fears about “mexicans” to the polls this fall. That’s how THEY work the system.
The religion is going to screw us here.
Yes, we need to be taking a stand. But the other thing we need to do, in conjunction with Dean’s 50 state plan, is start actively supporting progressive churches. The Southern Baptist crowd is becoming the o