
To say I do not understand WTF is going on between the Justice Department, the OVP, the White House and Congressional Republicans in the William Jefferson affair would be an understatement. I doubt right now if many can claim to know what this weird dance is all about.
Abu Gonzales has never found a position so base he could not justify at Dubya's request -- from torture to illegal wiretapping to threatening journalists and rubber stamping all manner of unlimited executive overreach -- but he's finally drawing a line in the sand over returning documents seized in a bribery scandal?
Dennis Hastert has gleefully played marionette to perhaps the biggest crook in the House, Tom DeLay, and has happily facilitated the White House's efforts to hack off limbs of Congressional authority, but now he's ready to force a constitutional crisis defending a member of the Black Congressional Caucus?
Dick Cheney, chief pimp for the theory of the Unitary Executive, is telling the White House to back off? That's like Simon Cowell walking on to the set of American Idol and ordering everyone to stop being so mean.
The only one who's acting in an understandable fashion in all of this is Bush himself, who knows that without Abu to harass journalists and whistleblowers even more of his dirty laundry threatens to bust out into the pubic eye, and should the GOP crooks in Congress decide to play defense and turn up the heat on the White House by providing some oversight he might very likely find himself on the business end of some ugly subpoenas.
As Christy has noted, where the law comes down in all of this is open to debate. Is Hastert just fighting a proxy battle over Jefferson (as the NYT suggests), knowing that his own time is coming? Probably; he certainly engaged in a bit of "bully the press" this week when he threatened ABC news for alleging he was involved in the Abramoff mess. Do the FBI and the DoJ have clean hands in all of this? Unlikely -- as Digby says, the FBI has a long history of abusing their power for political ends, and smart money says every Democratic strategy memo seized from Jefferson's office is presently sitting in Karl Rove's in basket.
Writing at The Left Coaster, Steve Soto has one of the more perceptive analyses I've read:
I doubt that Cheney, for his part, really raised an objection to the raid on constitutional grounds and any newfound concern for a separation of powers, two things that have been an alien concept to him and his staff for five years now. Cheney may have felt the way he did because 1) he correctly calculated that the raid would cost Bush whatever remaining support he had inside his own caucus for his agenda in an election year; 2) he doesn't want Republicans investigated at all and wants Justice to Deep Six the Abramoff and Cunningham inquiries because of where they will lead; and 3) he saw a chance to stick it to Rove and Abu in the ongoing internal White House pissing contest. Gonzales, for his part, wanted to signal back to Cheney that Bush would have to choose between them and saw a chance to stick it back in Shooter’s face that in this battle, Bush will side with Abu and against Cheney. Sure, there will be some face-saving “compromise” between Frist, Hastert, and Gonzales here, but Bush will continue on with the Jefferson prosecution as he should. It will strain the relationship a little more between the GOP caucuses on Capitol Hill, who are now for the first time really afraid of this administration’s excessive power grab, and a White House that has internal divisions and a degree of dysfunction hidden to all of us. And it will mean that scores of GOP representatives and senators on the hill are now seeing that they reap what they sow, and that Justice will be coming after them now also.
However the tightest summation of this whole games-within-games political drama I've read came last night from knuckledragger in the comments:
This is all pig kabuki. There’s no Elliot Richardson or William Ruckelshaus in this bunch. Plenty of Borks, though.
It does indeed seem to be a game being played by a world full of crooks who have operated under a code of omerta, and everyone is suddenly looking around and wondering who's going to turn into Sammy the Bull. Should be some damn good theatrics in store for the political junkies in the weeks to come, since I don't think that 45 day wet blanket is going to hold for very long.
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FITZ
Oh…Crap. FITZ.
Perhaps Roves perplex your enemy strategy is unveiling….
The centre cannot hold.
I dunno, maybe I’m just too simple-minded a lawyer for my own good, but it seems pretty simple to me.
Raid on only Dem. Congressman’s office with any hint of scandal. Raid complete. Gop leaders raise Cain. Smoke and mirrors of “constitutional crisis” and “separation of powers” spread all over. Docs held for 45 days until “compromise” that makes any raid harder to acheive is worked out.
Now only GOP Congressmen left to investigate, but investigation impeded due to new “compromise”. Oops, have to call off investigation.
Something I’m missing?
They have no center…..no core…only whores
why is this only website where pics below thread title dont appear…only little box with red x…anyone else have this problem ? i click hit ” show picture” and still nothing.java up to date thx
Wow! Sounds like Abu is looking for an excuse to distance himself from the Bush administration. Get you tinfoil hats out - my guess is that Cheney is in real trouble and the wheels are comin’ off real soon.
OT: EPU’d from Christy’s “Sincerity” thread…
I found this posted in the comments section of the Jamison Foser article in Media Matters:
Sounds like a good use of five minutes of my Saturday blog-o-rama time.
Read an analysis that compares the thoughts and actions of George Bush with those of Richard Nixon…here:
www.thoughttheater.com
Jane - what you really need is a pig-pole.
hope Kobe feels better…..
Seems like a good way to make a big story out of a small story. exploit the ‘they’re all crooks, what’s the dif?’ mentality- echo bi-partisan corruption and let the voters make up thier own mind. Or stay home, either way.
The main stream waters are fixin to get mighty muddy as November approaches.
Large paddles recommended.
OH! MERTA!!
KOBE!!
I’m with you - this Jefferson-Bush-Hastert-Abu thing makes Plame seem transparently logical.
I mean:
1) Jefferson is a democrat - and he’s as dirty as Abramoff - a dream come true for the Republicans
2) And now Hastert & Abu are bending over backwards to pull his crooked ass out of the fire?
WTF WTF WTF - something is rotten in Denmark
Jefferson is dirty, but not as dirty as Abramoff.
Jefferson enriched himself, but Abramoff built a criminal syndicate.
Since the Republicans *never* do anything that’s no to their benefit my guess(es) is/are. There was a Republican involved with Jefferson, or they’re sweating that Republican offices may be raided. I’m positive that they’re not doing it out of respect for the law.
Jacqrat -
That might work for Howie, but Matthews’ show is taped on Friday.
Of the many nicknames that gave graced this blog, “Abu” Gonzales is the most apt and the most deserved.
May he rot in Dante’s lowest Hell, which probably looks like one of Abu’s prisons.
I agree with Dratty in number 5
“We need a bankshot. Something to get the attention off our own scandals. This Jefferson guy? How can we turn his petty theft into something that will stick in the public’s mind for a longer time? He-he. You know, Democrats are just as baaad!”
I’m with dratty in #5.
oops. . .shoulda read to bottom cuz los diable, i’m with you too.
To make sense of this, you have to ask yourself, “How does this help the Republicans during an election year?” The president has pretty much decided that this year isn’t about is agenda: it’s about making sure they control the congress for the rest of his presidency and beyond.
Maybe I don’t know enough.
For a long-time we’ve been saying that the Republican Congress is a Rubber Stamp for Dubya. By being very vocal about this, it seems as though the Republicans can make a claim that “We’re not rubber stamps. Didn’t you hear us take on the President? And not only did we take him on, but we did it when it was a Democrat who was in trouble. We’re principled, don’t you see?”
While we all know that this is complete and utter nonsense, by being very vocal with little downside to being that way, the Repubs are attempting to take away a talking point for election time.
This makes it even more imperative that Jefferson resign now and that Democrats are loud about not standing for corruption from anyone, especially one of their own.
The raid on Jefferson’s office is so clearly a party putsch, the kind of self-interested targeting of political enemies that characterized the Reichstag or Stalin’s punitive campaigns against his enemies.
I agree with Stevie. This is a way for Repugnantcans to keep the “democrats are corrupt too” story alive and kicking.
If I understand this correctly, the money was found in the freezer last year(July maybe)after it was given to the Congressman by the FBI in a sting. Why are the FBI involved in a sting of a democrat? Wasn’t there a Supreme Court case relative to entrapment?
The other issue for me is why now? It just gets curiouser and curiouser. There is certainly something strange up. More than usual is rotten in Denmark so to speak.
I don’t mean to sound too contrarian on this, but maybe Hastert is livid because he actually takes protocol seriously. After all, without the pomp and circumstance, who would these guys be? The fact that it was Jefferson means that Denny can get all huffy without being accused of a coverup (which is, I would bet, why Pelosi is happy to let him take front and center on this.) I do think that it’s deliciously ironic that Cheney’s office is taking Hastert’s side, but perhaps that’s because Deadeye Dick was a Congressman once, and Addington was a Hill staffer before he became Cheney’s right testicle. Just sayin’.
I would agree with both #5 and #16. The most likely reason the republicans are up in arms is because it keeps the eyes away from their own misdoings. Also I think we are seeing infighting of factions within the various agencies and branches with some trying to do the right thing and others trying to maintain the status quo. The only problem is trying to identify who are the undercover good guys and who are the undercover bad guys.
Hi all!
Back from Cozumel (paradise!) ; )
My first blush on this is to go with Mueller and by default *cough* Abu. This is an ongoing criminal investigation where a signed search warrant was executed. A search warrant has very specific items listed on it that can be seized if found and NOTHING ELSE outside of the “four corners” of the warrant. Why are the Republicans in a feigned uproar? Can you say Abramoff? How about Cunningham?
As for…
“%u2014 as Digby says, the FBI has a long history of abusing their power for political ends”
J. Edgar Hoover died years ago so that “long history” is in fact, ancient history. Further, Mueller IS NOT a “Bush administration official”, contrary to what the media is saying.
What could possibly be so all fired important in his stinking office? Cripes, they have all they need on this guy several times over. Besides, all the offices are bugged and all their communiations are too. For selective Dems I suspect they know the exact time of every dump they have taken the last 5 years. Of course that can’t be used in court but they have all they need anyway. He has the stash of money, he’s black. What more do you need, well besides a confession given under torture administered by Dick that is.
Hassert is the loose cannon in this. Without Delay he obviously is a ship without a rudder. I mean really Denny, is it so hard? The White House does it, you applaud.
He’s gone. Maybe he just figured out who was spreading the story of his own investigation and it was in the direction of the White House. In which case don’t fight back Denny. You’ll just humiliate yourself. Be a man. Take one for the team. You didnt actually think you were important or something did you? Oh my God!!! What an idiot.
Continuing the thread on sincerity…
I’m a nurse, and Lowell Weicker is the only R I ever voted for. I was national co-chair of Nurses for Dean.
In order to be powerful (Oprah, Rush, BillO, Suze Ormond, etc) you have to be totally committed to telling other people what they should do, rather than teaching them how to empower themselves. It’s the “I will deliver you from your poor miserable life, you idiot, if you’ll just promise with your very soul to do everything I tell you to do — without question.”
Two years ago, a book I wrote was published, and got tons of great press. I was on national TV shows, books signings, and ended up with my own PBS special. (And if you get annoyed about having to sit through the #$@& pledge breaks, I can tell you all about faking sincerity doing those things live)
I was feeling damn good, and I got to the table to sit down and talk about where we go from here. My lifelong dream. I had a chance at a series of books and a TV show about health. The problem? I could not figure out a way to justify making pronouncements about what people should do with their lives while telling them they were idiots who could only survive with MY guidance.
Does Suze Ormond make you want to scream every time you hear her voice? Oh, absolutely, but she has no problem telling callers they are idiots and are to blame for all their financial problems, but if they sign up for her “save your sorry financial ass PROGRAM” (cut to only 5 easy payments of $99.95) she will save you while laughing all the way to the bank. (Green rooms reveal a lot about a person) I couldn’t sell out for money,
so instead of sitting in my expensive beach house this weekend, I am here with the true patriots.
IMHO, that’s what kills the progressive movement. It’s the brain cells, ethical part of our being that takes us only so far because we lack that egomaniacal gene.
We believe in empowering people. We do not lie, we realize life is lived in a shade of gray and that we believe what we believe in to our roots, not because it is an expedient belief for the moment. We believe that people are essentially good and that we don’t give them a fish to keep them under our thumbs waiting, begging for the next fish morsel. We teach them how to fish and help them with resources so they can catch more fish, and to fish in different places so everybody has a chance, rather than giving all the fish to the nasty rich guy who bullies the fishermen. We believe in helping those who want to set up a little fish restaurant on Main Street, and those who want to send their fish to other people who don’t have fish in their town.
We believe in America and don’t ever question someone’s patriotism because, in our bones, we are the true patriots. We believe America can be an incredible force for good in the world, and we know that you don’t taks over countries and shove our freedom down their throats. We want to set the example so that people would fight for their own freedom and drink its nectar.
We are incredibly complex people who probably overthink things, but that is because we care about how people less fortunate than us will be affected by policy decisions. We are here to serve, not to use community/public service as a key to the lottery bank.
And, sadly, that is our Achilles heel. We have a collective conscience and ethical grounding. We have a good handle on basic right and wrong. And that’s why we will have trouble. We don’t stomp on the little people to climb higher. We can’t boil our positions down to 4-word bumper stickers. Our commitment to our fellow American won’t let us. Our patriotism won’t let us.
Sorry for the length, but on this Memorial Day weekend, I thought it needed to be said after reading Media Matters.
Be safe, everybody.
Have to admit that this thing is puzzling. If you’ve got video tape of a guy taking a bribe- and the money recovered from the freezer- why hasn’t he been indicted? Worried about an “entraptment” defense? Saving it for the election year? Beats me. And is Hastert REALLY concerned about the FBI over reaching? Don’t know. Guess he wouldn’t like to see such raids become commonplace. No telling what they’d find.
My head is spinning on this one, and is it any wonder? The threads of corruption that run through the administration are many, and they’ve been there since those awful days in Florida in 2000. On top of the corrupt and illegal acts initiated and carried out by the administration, you have GOP Senators and Representatives so thoroughly convinced they are invincible that they engage in illegal activity of their own, and re-shape the rules to make it easier.
You know why we can’t figure this out? Because there are so few people in this administration who have any commitment to the truth. Lying has become something they do with pathological ease, believing in the lies they tell. When you lie like this, when so many people are doing it, at some point it becomes impossible to keep track of who was told what, and why. The interests of the liars so converge and conflict that the decisions they make for one set of interests threatens the ability of their other interests to hold together.
Anyone else feel like this is “One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest?”
I sense an implosion coming.
The whole thing would be easy to understand if it turns out that the FBI is actually investigating a RING of CORRUPTION and sought documents that pertain to goopers as well as Jefferson.
The bribers don’t usually limit themselves to bribing only one congresscritter.
This is all indeed very puzzling. We have little but speculation. Here’s some more.
If Bush were running for reelection, Rove would likely be advising him to run against Congress. It’s happened before, when a President feels stymied by an intransigent Congress, even from his own party. Truman? While we view Congress as “rubber stamps,” it’s quite possible that over the last six months, the WH has come to view the Congress in a very different light. Everyone, including the Repub leadership, seems willing to state that Bush has lost direction, is “clueless,” “out of touch,” etc. For Bush to regain some authority and positive image, he needs to convince more Americans that “I’m the guy who’s trying to do the right thing, and those corrupt congresscritters are standing in the way.” He needs to rebuild an image of truthfulness. So would it make sense for Bush to run against an unpopular Congress even though it’s his own party, and even though he’s not running for reelection?
Some possible arguments:
1. Bush has been quoted lately as concerned about his own legacy. He’s running to improve that. To do that, he has to be seen as a statesman rising above partisan bickering and political self protection.
2. The only thing lower than Bush’s approval is Congress’ approval. He can improve his own image by seeming to stand on principle against a Congress that appears not to have any principles.
3. Though there’s a current Republican majority, a President concerned about his legacy, including the long-run viabilitiy of a neo-conservative ruling class, as well as his ability to govern in 2007-08 could be faced with a majority of revenge-minded Dems in one or both houses. He would be wise to run against them, starting now. Note that when he tries to be the responsible center in the immigration debate, he always adds, “there may be some in the Dems who want pure amnesty.”
4. A Black Demo member’s corruption investigation is the perfect opportunity to put this scheme in place. It threatens none of Bush’s core or his major policies.
5. It would not surprise me to find that Gonzalez and others at the DoJ, as well as the FBI, are eager to demonstrate they have some remaining integrity, as long it is doesn’t require them to oppose Bush’s policies. This is hypocritical to us, but a normal human reaction — most people think of themselves as decent, even when they’re not. Investigations of Congressional corruption are a safe place to make that demonstration, and Jefferson is a perfect target.
6. If the Dems win big in November, Bush will need all the public support he can muster to survive the investigations and paint them as against the public interest. He will accuse the Dems of trying to persecute him for keeping the country safe.
Bottom line: the image Bush needs to portray is radically different from the one he used to get reelected. He is fighting for survival and his place in history. This week’s phony mea culpa press conference is a calculated part of the new image, the first of many instances of the “new Bush.” If this strategy works, the Repubs regain Congress in 2008, and Bush’s neocon majority and legacy are [arguably more] secure.
To paraphrase Kurt Russell in “Tombstone”….Fitz is coming, and Hell’s comin’ with him! Hell’s comin’ with him!
“Fitz is coming”
Well- maybe- after the longest streak of foreplay in human history.
The nature and timing of the events surrounding the William Jefferson affair gives me a sense that there is a desired outcome that remains several moves ahead and is not specifically related to Jefferson. I don’t know what play there could be, but hearing about Abu and McNulty threatening to quit over aspects of this matter make me wonder ultimately how Fitzgerald could be affected.
Bush administration and Republican congressional strategy with regard to Jefferson:
1. Using Bush’s bully pulpit to create a constitutional furor over the FBI’s raid puts media attention squarely on Jefferson, above and beyond Delay, Abramoff, Goss, etc.
2. Making Bush look like he actually cares about the Constitution and separation of powers by the fact that he is getting involved and putting in place the 45 day period for resolution.
3. Creating a standoff that will allow republican congressmen to appear to take a principled stance on something - thus appearing not entirely in Bush’s pocket.
4. Creating a public spectacle that will distract generally from all the other bad news about Iraq, the economy, gas, etc.
5. Allowing Bush to look like a judicious peacemaker, who came up with the 45 day resolution period to make sure everything is resolved correctly and in the appropriate fashion.
6. Related to 5 above, Bush has a well deserved reputation as someone who does not wait for all the facts to come in before he makes a decision, and often seems to make decisions in spite of the facts, by taking action to impose a cooling off period, Bush makes himself look less rash and more diplomatic (helps to deflect the criticism that he is not negotiating with Iran and did not allow the inspections process to run its course in Iraq).
7. Generally muddy the waters in the public’s mind with regard to separation of powers issue. This is actually a case where the law is a bit murky, as opposed to the other unconstituational actions Bush has taken without Congressional authorization. Once the public has been innoculated against caring about separation of powers by witnessing this tempest in a teapot, they equate other conflicts with it (with the help of the media and Republican efforts to conflate and equate) and will come to care even less about the other intrusions of the executive branch into the legislative branch’s historical powers.
8. And many more reasons that I’m sure FDL’ers can help fill in. Make no mistake, none of the reasons here have to do with separation of powers or moral principles.
Bush administration and Republican congressional strategy with regard to Jefferson:
1. Using Bush’s bully pulpit to create a constitutional furor over the FBI’s raid puts media attention squarely on Jefferson, above and beyond Delay, Abramoff, Goss, etc.
2. Making Bush look like he actually cares about the Constitution and separation of powers by the fact that he is getting involved and putting in place the 45 day period for resolution.
3. Creating a standoff that will allow republican congressmen to appear to take a principled stance on something - thus appearing not entirely in Bush’s pocket.
4. Creating a public spectacle that will distract generally from all the other bad news about Iraq, the economy, gas, etc.
5. Allowing Bush to look like a judicious peacemaker, who came up with the 45 day resolution period to make sure everything is resolved correctly and in the appropriate fashion.
6. Related to 5 above, Bush has a well deserved reputation as someone who does not wait for all the facts to come in before he makes a decision, and often seems to make decisions in spite of the facts, by taking action to impose a cooling off period, Bush makes himself look less rash and more diplomatic (helps to deflect the criticism that he is not negotiating with Iran and did not allow the inspections process to run its course in Iraq).
7. Generally muddy the waters in the public’s mind with regard to separation of powers issue. This is actually a case where the law is a bit murky, as opposed to the other unconstituational actions Bush has taken without Congressional authorization. Once the public has been innoculated against caring about separation of powers by witnessing this tempest in a teapot, they equate other conflicts with it (with the help of the media and Republican efforts to conflate and equate) and will come to care even less about the other intrusions of the executive branch into the legislative branch’s historical powers.
8. And many more reasons that I’m sure FDL’ers can help fill in. Make no mistake, none of the reasons here have to do with separation of powers or moral principles.
dratty’s simple minded lawyer take sounds about right but I was also really struck by how this story sounded when CNN headlined with it this morning - the whole tale was convoluted and hard to follow until they got to the line about how W took a firm stand and imposed a 45day delay. Like W was such a righteous deciderer …whatever is going on here (fbi off the reservation, Hastert off the reservation, Jefferson set up to give corruption a bipartisan face (and the McKinney and Conyer’s slams haven’t showed much staying power) someone in the WH sure moved fast to spin this for W’s benefit.
What really makes me want to weep in anger and frustration is that none of the goings-on have a single thing to do with actually governing, leading, running the country. I am sick to death of this being one campaign after another to “improve image,” and the desperate nature of the current campaign has me worried on many levels.
Nuff said
scarecrow #35
excellent analysis..you may haveve something there..
Talking about spin
The NYT Magazine article by Matt Bai on YearlyKos Convention is live at
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05....._lede.html
Woohoo!
xyz #40
“Allowing Bush to look like a judicious peacemaker, who came up with the 45 day resolution period”
who do you suppose gave bush this idea? Tis surely beyond his ability to come up with.
“Congressional Black Caucus,” not “Black Congressional Caucus.”
Carry on…
keith of orlando: ummmm, could it be. . . karl rove?
Oscar Wilde’s Grandson attacked at Gay Demo in Moscow
xyz,
“8. And many more reasons that I’m sure FDL’ers can help fill in. Make no mistake, none of the reasons here have to do with separation of powers or moral principles.”
Bingo! Take Abu out of the equation for a minute. Who’s left? Mr. Unitary Executive Addington himself, Hasstert, Cheney etc. on one side vs. Mueller. This is a preemptive (Abramoff, Cunningham) partisan political stunt.
The reason for the raid was spelled out in Wednesday’s WaPo
I don’t know if it is true, but it is a reasonalbe explanation.
One the other hand, today’s Washington Post story about the raid had me scratching my head. Gonzales threatening to resign on principle; the OVP standing up for the separation of power; and Bush not pushing back at a “white-hot” Hastert, while remaining agnostic on the issue. When I first read the Post story I had to look around the room to see if Rod Serling was leaning against the wall.
It took me awhile to come up with a plausible explanation for this man bites dog story. I think the White House is using the Post to set-up a good-cop/bad-cop negotiating stance with Bush playing the role of honest broker. If I were Hastert, I wouldn’t fall in to this trap. Let the judiciary sort things out.
Creativo #35
“Why Karl, you look like somebody just walked over your grave.”
Keith of Orlando,
I have no idea who came up with the 45 day idea. If I had to guess, it would be Rove.
But, as I’m sure you agree, the main point of my post is that for Bush and the republicans this whole thing is about perception and positioning - so Bush’s actual ideas about the Jefferson matter and the constitution generally (if he has any except “I, as president, can do whatever I want”) are completely irrelevant to the analysis.
Gonzalez’s so-called (and of course phony) threat to resign was designed to be a cover for bush with anger congressmen. Congress demands that bush return documents, bush wishes he could, he really does. but with gonzalez threatening to resign and all that, he just can’t.
kirby at 31 — exactly, well-said, and thanks.
Somehow, the notion that the same people who brought us that wonderfully thought-out Iraq war, are now bringing those same talents to bear on the inner workings of the government, leaves me very, very cold. When my blood is not boiling, that is.
OT
http://www.latimes.com/news/na.....crosspromo
Strong Signs of Rift Among Democrats
[]”This is a fight for the soul of the Democratic Party,” said Marshall Wittmann, a senior fellow at the centrist Democratic Leadership Council. “It will have repercussions for the 2008 presidential campaign and whether centrists will feel comfortable within the Democratic Party.
Lieberman, the 2000 Democratic vice presidential candidate, long had been considered politically invulnerable in his home state.
[]Lamont’s credibility as a candidate also should benefit from MoveOn’s stamp of approval, said Scott McLean, chairman of the political science department at Quinnipiac University in Hamden, Conn.
“Getting 33% at the convention is really impressive, but [Friday’s endorsement] is even bigger because it shows the grass-roots and money [donors] %u2026 that there is something behind Ned Lamont,” McLean said. “It’s big. It’s huge.”
Wittmann said that if Lamont and his allies succeed in ousting Lieberman, “it would be devastating to the Democratic Party” by suggesting that centrists are no longer welcome.
“This shows that [MoveOn] is trying to precipitate a civil war within the party,” (Wittman) said.
xyz 52
Yep, I do agree with you 100% and mainly beccause bush is unable to do anything other than be in the campaign mode. I’ll bet Miers was in on it too for the so called legality of it.
kirby, 31
Spoken like a true patriot. On Monday, fly your flag with pride.
I agree it’s highly unlikely (1 in 1000) Bush “thought” of the 45-day cooling off period. It was only necessary that he get credit for it. It would be first time in his career Bush would be cited for doing something “thoughtful” that seemed to balance competing interests in an impartial manner.
Seems likely this idea would have come from some career attorney in the DoJ, someone who understood that there is a balance that has to be struck between: (1) the DoJ’s ability to investigate evidence of possible felonies by Congresscritters and (2) the possibility of misuse of FBI, even with court-warrant searches and prosecutorial discretion for partisan reasons.
Also, does anyone know about the federal judge who issued the warrant? Is he someone who would be amenable to stronger executive prosecutorial/investigative powers vs Congressional perogatives?
To figure it out: think like a criminal.
One small point: voters who would consider voting Republican are not going to impressed by the Republican congress’ “principled stand” in defense of the seperation of powers, especially when that stand benefits an obviously corrupt black Democrat.
Scarecrow, you said “It would be first time in his career Bush would be cited for doing something “thoughtful” that seemed to balance competing interests in an impartial manner.”
Actually, this 45 day period idea reminds me a lot of Bush’s stem cell research (bullshit) “compromise” wherein he allowed for continued research on only certain lines of stem cells (which was an asinine and reprehensible decision for both moral and logical reasons - but we’ll leave that aside for now).
At the time of the stem-cell decision, the press played right along with the idea of Bush as a solomnic and thoughtful decision-maker. That was pre-Iraq and pre-so-much-else.
One might imagine that Bush and his team are wistfully trying to remanufacture the same sort of press coverage that he received then, back when the some of the country could swallow the idea that Bush was capable even of reasoning his way out of a paper bag.
There’s a troubling pattern going on here. For the first time, we’re hearing the term “executive overreach” in the MSM, and it’s always connected with the Jefferson office search, and rarely if ever connected with any of the more troubling issues.
I think framing is the key to understanding this. Framing the issue, as in “Don’t Think of an Elephant”.
Remember Rathergate? Once the Rather report came out, the matter of Bush’s ROTC service records was primarily framed in terms of the Rather documents. Once those were discredited, the whole ROTC issue was discredited because of the framing.
I’d bet that we’re going to see the same pattern here.
1) Frame “executive overreach” as the Jefferson office search. (Done)
2) Generate a scandal based on the framing. (Pretty much handled, what with the histrionics of Hastert, Gonzales, et al.)
3) Discredit the scandal, either by showing that the search is clearly constitutional, or preferably reaching a compromise that seems to reduce the executive overreach in this one situation.
4) FINIS: Since this scandal has been handled to show that there is no executive overreach, then there is no executive overreach, and anyone who claims otherwise is a nutty conspiracy theorist. QED
At first blush after hearing about the raid and then the outrage it occurred to me that perhaps the republicans are afraid their offices might be raided as well. After all the FBI did acquire warrants.
On the other hand if this is simply a political ploy it would not surprise me. Notwithstanding where are the democrats on this particular issue? Why haven’t they said anything in regards to the raid on Jefferson’s office?
However, to their credit, Pelosi and others asked Jefferson to step down from his commiittee post and even went so far as to ask him to resign from the House. Jefferson refused.
Of course not much has been said to highlight that!
Great analogy.
“The Justice Department signaled to the White House this week that the nation’s top three law enforcement officials would resign or face firing rather than return documents seized from a Democratic congressman’s office in a bribery investigation, according to administration sources familiar with the discussions.
The possibility of resignations by Attorney General Alberto R. Gonzales; his deputy, Paul J. McNulty; and FBI Director Robert S. Mueller III was communicated to the White House by several Justice officials in tense negotiations over the fate of the materials taken from Rep. William J. Jefferson’s office, according to the sources, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the issue…”
_____
Pardon my skepticism that ANY of this is true. More likely a staged “crisis,” one with utterly obvious benefits to the BushCo/Gooper criminal enterprise.
Notice the story is all leaked info. It is supposed to mean that the people involved have principles that they will quit for.
It is the biggest game I have ever witnessed.
-GSD
Jonathan Turley appeared before Congress yesterday (it was on C-SPAN? last night) arguing that the DoJ and FBI had overreached and violated implied Constitutional princiles relating to separation of powers. He argued that although the FBI/DoJ must be able to investigate crimes by Congresscritters, it needs to be done carefully so as not to raise the specter that the investigation is for partisan/intimidation reasons. When the Congress is stongly at odds with a President, and when the opposition party is particularly enraged, the suspicions re motives are stronger. So how should FBI investigate Jefferson and not raise these concerns? Not clear, but he suggested more precise subpoenas, followed up with court contempt orders for non-compliance, rather than full scale raids of the offices of a Congressman from the opposition party. The fact that the FBI took a copy of the the office computer hard drives with all messages, not just those related to alleged bribery, was particularly troublesome.
Other con-law experts on same panel were less sympathetic with this argument. But we should recall that on more than one occasion, the WH and DoJ have leaked information about possible criminal investigations about someone very soon after they opposed this President (and there’s a history of this with other Presidents, too, so the principle is important.)
Bush and the Republican congress want the same thing–for congress to remain Republican. Making Bush look good (solemn, thoughtful executive) and congress look bad (protecting their own asses) doesn’t achieve their shared end.
Noel -
Agree 100% - please see my comment above in post # 40 (in my seventh bullet) for my take on Bush’s efforts to use this situation as a chance to tie the Jefferson scandal anchor around the entire concept of executive overreach and throw it to the bottom of the ocean.
The old saying “hard cases make bad law” is applicable here. This is indeed a situation where the law is somewhat murky. If Bush can create a feeling in the public’s mind that the very idea of separation of powers is a wholly grey area in which reasonable people can disagree on virtually everything, then he has succeeeded. He wants to smear the murk and the grey of this case over 200 years of constitutional jurisprudence and the many clear delineations and separations that have been established and which were acknowledged by virtually all until this administration.
As a corrollary - it seems clear to me that Watergate couldn’t happen now. Bush would say that his tapes were protected by executive privilege and he would marshall the political and legal forces necessary to turn back Archibald Cox and whoever else sought to investigate the matter.
xyz — good example; it’s even more ludicrous that Bush could fashion a plausible scientific middle groud.
laura bush should be suspect of elizabeth (the paris hilton of the nyt)’s blowjobs. at least georgie is getting it up for a woman in addition to jeffy and rove.
Are the goopers becoming desperate? Well they probably SHOULD be.
We are now approaching the five month mark until the midterm elections.
In January, there were 28 competitive house seats according to the the Cook Political Report- 10 of them democratic seats. Cook now reports 46 competitive seats- still only ten of them democratic. The number of competitive gooper seats has grown from 18 to 36 since the first of the year- and could easily grow even further.
In the senate- there are good signs and not so good signs.
The good signs include Montana and Pennsylvania- where dems have leads in races against incumbent goopers.
There is also some bad news- DeWine now leads in the Ohio race- although the polling is not from reliable sources.
Dems have challenges in New Jersey, Minnesota, and Maryland- New Jersey is a virtual tie- but it’s a dem state- so there is good reason to think that the dems will pull it out.
Dems have to be disappointed about Tennessee to this point- where Ford is sinking rather than rising in the polls.
Missouri is still very competitive as is Rhode Island.
I’d give the dems a very slim chance of taking over the senate- but a pretty good chance in the house.
Losing the house would be the end of the Clusterfuck presidency. He would ride out the final two years of his term in shame and fear as dems begin the long process of proctology for every mistep, lie, and error of his six year term of office.
Goopers have every reason to bring their A game to the fight- they’re fighting for their lives.
J. Donne — there’s a way to reconcile what appears to be contradictory. If Bush can raise his credibility significantly over the next three months, he can use the last two months to campaign openly for his Congressional friends in key districts.
What’s clear at the moment is that Bush is dragging most of his party down. If he can save himself, he may be able to save them in the long run.
Again, this is all just WAGGING.
Hastert’s being groomed for the public eye. In the unlikely event everything goes south while he’s still Speaker, the American public need an image of him as a “straight shooter” to take us away from our long national nightmare. In my lifetime, he’s certainly the lowest-profile Speaker ever. Essentially, this may be the first most Americans hear of hm: “he stuck up for the separation of powers and for that Democratic Black Congressman.”
These may be important concepts for the American public to believe about Denny Hastert as he becomes more integral to the survival of The Republic.
Why Cheney is popping off on this, I have no idea. Seems way below his pay grade.
Usually when the pieces of the puzzle don’t add up AT ALL- it’s because key pieces are still hidden. I’d hold my fire on this one until we know more about what’s going on. The response appears to be WAY out of proportion to the incident- which may mean that there’s a lot more to the incident than what we see so far. Patience.
Maybe this is why the Dems have been so quiet. Are they that smart/knowing? Sigh. I doubt it.
scarecrow-Wagging beats working.
Bush wants: a Republican congress.
Republican Congress wants: a Republican congress.
Abu wants: what Bush wants.
In the context of this story, these interests cannot be reconciled. I just repeated Jane’s original post.
Suppose for a minute that Jefferson has been negotiating a deal with Justice for the past several months- and Justice decided to raid his office to make sure that what he’s been selling squares with the facts. If his dealing involves goopers- there’d be plenty of reason for Denny to hit the ceiling. Patience.
Digby says, the FBI has a long history of abusing their power for political ends
They also have a long history of doing their job in a professional manner, including busting crooked politicians. The warrant for the search is still online, and I suggest that folks who are concerned about this read it before making a judgement. The warrant lays out a pretty convincing case against Jefferson. He might not be guilty, but I’d say that if the FBI find whatever they’re looking for in his office, Jefferson is as screwed as Scooter Libby. A warrant, BTW, according to our own looseheadprop, a sworn affadavit. Lying on a warrant is like lying in court.
Anyhow, while I’m always suspicious of anything that might come out of Abu’s office, this appears to be largely unrelated to politics. Until some actual evidence of wrongdoing on the part of the FBI surfaces, I’ll keep my tinfoil hat in the hall closet for now.
Fitzy is obviously sniffing around at Cheney … Addington (Cheney’s rotweiler) jumping in on the side of separation of powers may be a way of smacking down DOJ investigators…
If they have video tape and the cold cash, why did they need his entire hard drive with all his job and party related info on it? yes it is an election year and who else did he do business with? Sounds like a terrorist prosecution where the administration makes such a mess of it they will have to drop the charges to something less and it will fizzle. But is Shooter trying to calm the water since he is going to be a witness for the prosecution soon?
According to Pete Williams (Yeah, I know) on NBC Nightly News a bit ago. The search warrant raid on Jefferson’s office was the result of eight months of back and fourth with the judge that eventually signed it (the warrant) and was carefully crafted with respect to the separation of powers issue.
*ilson — I agree. The thought that DoJ and FBI could get a warrant and then swoop down on your office and carry away boxes of files and copies of harddrives would be enough to send even Cheney and his rubber stamp allies to look for their long lost and never read copies of the Constitution.
I don’t believe Congressional GOPers are genuinely concerned about executive overreach. It’s all theater for propaganda purposes and protecting them in the end.
.
btw, C-Span2 right now is replaying Chomsky’s speech at West Point …
Thanks, *ilson!
cujo and *ilson, I’m pretty much with you. While there’s been a fair amount of press regarding Gonzales and Mueller vs Cheney and Addington, I’d love to hear what the FBI’s agent in charge of the case was telling his/her higher-ups. Likewise what the DOJ lawyer who went to the judge for the warrant said to his/her superiors.
I could easily see the career folks in the trenches passing thoughts up the chain of command like “If you let this stuff get sent back to the Hill, you’ve just stiffed every working grunt in the department, and you’ll have absolutely no respect from anyone around here. And maybe a few resignations . . . or more than a few.”
Faced with rebellion from the ranks, I could see Gonzales getting a bit of a spine in standing up to Cheney, Addington, and Hastert.
Of course, this is all speculation. The press, enamoured with it’s unnamed “senior administration officials,” might want to cultivate a few lower-level sources. I’ll bet they could shed a whole lot more light on this mess.
The other aspect that seems to be missing from this discussion is the whole “law and order” mindset. Not the TV show, but the attitude toward the administration of justice. The WaPo article says that Frances Townsend was Gonzales’ chief ally within the White House, and she’s a former prosecutor. G’s Deputy Paul McNulty is as well. It’s not too much of a strech to think that these former prosecutors were impressed with the work of the current prosecutors, and didn’t want to see them undercut for pursuing a difficult case.
Sending the stuff back also sends a signal to the judiciary that I’m not sure Gonzales, McNulty, and Mueller wanted to send. It says “Judge, you goofed in signing that warrant.” How’d you like to be the next federal prosecutor going into that judge’s courtroom?
“To say I do not understand WTF is going on between the Justice Department, the OVP, the White House and Congressional Republicans in the William Jefferson affair would be an understatement.”
Spot on, as always Jane. No secret, unnamed sources, just a fair, laser sharp analysis of the available data.
IMO we can infer that Rove is losing control of the GOP. Six months ago, he would never have let this mess “leak” out into the press. Republicans read the Libby filings too. They don’t need “anonymous sources” to know that Rove will be indicted. They have excellent reason to believe Rove has flipped and that he will use anything on anyone to keep his sorry ass out of a Federal Penitentiary.
Hope Kobe continues to improve.
“I’m with you - this Jefferson-Bush-Hastert-Abu thing makes Plame seem transparently logical.”
Thanks obsessed, LMAO.
Cozumel — Pete Williams? Well, if he says “carefully crafted,” we just take that as gospel. Carefully crafted means, “take every file and piece of paper in the office.” Must have taken a long time to craft that. ;-)
Even if this raid was a cover to get the Democrats’ secret election plans, Karl Rove will be sorely disappointed.
Secret Democratic Election Plans –
1. Together, we can do better.
2. Culture of Corruption.
3. Dubai Ports.
4. GOTV, and Win!!!
Peterr @ 4:08 pm (#89) - Actually, this is one of those rare times when a Bush Cabinet secretary is backing up his department the way you’d expect him to. At least, when that secretary isn’t Don Rumsfeld. Part of government at that level is give-and-take between various departments and political interests. There should be a disagreement, as their should be on most important matters.
I’m glad for once that there is, even while I can’t help being suspicious.
I think dratty @ 5 and billy pilgrim @ 23 may be onto something. Now suppose DOJ purposely planted the Hastert under investigation story just so they can do a “rare” denial of it, and you can add in the liberal media are against the repugs talking point.
elizabeth bulmiller: the paris hilton of the nyt.
There’s one crime these guys haven’t exploited yet: blackmail. Given Hastert’s recent unraveling, and his anger over Goss getting put in the ejector seat, I’m guessing he went to the WH with a big ‘or else’. I’m sure he has the necessary dirt to get the dogs called off.
[/cynicism mode off]
perhaps Gonzales was simply “playing along” this whole time if only to find himself in the position he’s in where every bit of corruption could be investigated and hopefully prosecuted?
Cheney knows all roads lead to his office, so he’s of course concerned/shitting his pants.
[cynicism mode on]
CNN ran a “scandal scorecard” awhile ago that spent a little time on Jefferson and a lot of time on Republicans, so if all this was an attempt to change the subject, it doesn’t appear to be working. (I’m also not sure how subjects get changed when most of the follow-up coverage takes place over a long holiday weekend.) Jefferson’s alleged corruption is a very old story anyway, although the details that have been coming out are interesting. Apparently, unlike the Republican K Street crowd, Jefferson wasn’t peddling his influence in Congress. He’s a Democrat — what influence? No, what Jefferson appears to have been selling was his influence in Africa. That $100,000 wasn’t for him. He was the go-between for an African official. Like any good agent, he apparently arranged to keep a portion of it for himself (or at least for his relatives) as a sort of commission.
Now here’s where the white collar criminal experts out there can help. As emel #82 notes, a lot of the talking heads are wondering why the FBI needed to search his office. They had the payment on tape and found 90% of the money in the Congressman’s home freezer. Why wasn’t that enough for an indictment all by itself?
My untutored guess is that acting as a go-between helping an American do business in Africa isn’t against the law, even if money changed hands. If he had taken money to do something in the United States — influence legislation or get a favorable contract for an African company here — well, different story. But that is, as I said, an untutored guess. Anyone willing to enlighten me?
Maybe Rove got the 45 day thing from the Documentary 45 Days: The Life and Death of a Broiler Chicken. It features investigative footage%u2014from hatching and factory-farm life to slaughter and packaging. Just a thought.
Rove wants:
A poster child for Democratic corruption. Check.
A perception of an overzealous FBI/DOJ. Check.
A weekend in the Bahamas with Gannon/Guckert. ?
the principle at hand goes back in time to one of the presidents, I forget which, who tried to intimidate congress by issuing warrants
some law, I can’t remember again made it impossible for a president to issue warrants against congress
maybe someone can refresh my memory of the presidencies I’m referring
Decision-google torture memo.
recall that odd timing on the regular reauthorizations of the NSA domestic wiretapping operation: 45 days. I recall asking at the time if anybody knew where they got that time period from: nobody seemed to know here.
still: it’s kinda odd - 45 days?
That would be July 9, 2006 Wilson
I have to agree that this doesn’t add up.
The Occam’s Razor theory, from what is publically known, is that this is a big act of Kabuki, a staged accident, designed to put a roadblock in front of investigations of Congressmen, and to have a Democrat’s name attached to it - all to prevent America from knowing how corrupt the GOP Congress really is.
But even that doesn’t add up - Gonzales is a smug authoritarian pig, but I see no signs that he’s that much of an over-actor. Nor that he’s so zealous about rooting out Congressional corruption.
I do absolutely believe that giving Uncle Karl some Democratic strategy memos was part of the action, but that doesn’t explain why corrupt GOP congressmen are defending Democratic ones against an administration they’ve never stood up to… If they were going to stand up to Bush, how many people would guess they’d do it over a bribe-taking Democrat? Anyone? Anyone?
But now add on a GOP Congressman hearing shots, getting the House offices emptied, and the “law” doing an office-by-office search.
This stinks worse than a Klansman pissing on the Reichstag fire.
Maybe Jefferson had some dirt in his office safe. That would make sense if he was in the corruption game with corrupt Republicans. Then this makes a little sense - take hold of the documents, but bury them from public review - like in a court of law.
All I know is, none of this is anything like we’ve heard.
Let’s also remember that the speech & debate clause does not provide any protection where criminal activity is concerned.
This may just be a case of - as some have suggested - dedicated prosecutors who, after being stonewalled by Jefferson’s refusal to comply with the subpoena issued to him, held fast to the letter of the law, tip-toed through the minefield of the S & D clause and separation of powers, and were finally able to get the judge (the one who sent Judy Miller to jail) to issue the warrant.
I do not see how (although we’ve seen a lot that has surprised us over the last 6 years) either the AG or the head of the FBI could throw their prosecutors and their investigators to the wolves on what appears to be a validly granted and executed warrant.
And, meanwhile, if the way this is being handled is supposed to focus people on Democratic corruption, I’m sorry, but I don’t hear people talking about Jefferson - I hear them talking about the brouhaha that appears to be other members of Congress trying to protect their own asses. Jefferson, at this point, seems like a side issue.
JT-now you’re thinking. Perhaps Jefferson’s first act after the raid was a call to Denny.
II
That sounds about right- there’s a lot more to this story.
kirby at 31 -
May I copy your brief essay and forward to my relatives to explain why I don’t still think W and his crowd are sweetie pies?
Anyone else been following the Pat Robertson story- in which Robertson claims to be able to leg press 2,000 pounds because of his miracle health shake?
Funny as hell. Apparently the record for an NFL player is about 800 pounds- and Robertson is over seventy years old- but he’s stickin to his story.
Now people are pointing out that there is no machine in existance that exceeds 1,000 pounds capacity- but Mr. 700 Club is STILL stickin to the story..unbelievable!
Rev. Robertson: Thou shalt not bear false witness. Recall that?
JT 105 - agreed.
the cheney bush crime family only do what is in their interests. gonzales just some pumped up pomposity of a consiglieri & not a terribly good one at that. the psychopath john yoo is a much more sublime & sadistic counsellor like his master, scalia
no, whatever is happening with & around jefferson concernst this criminal administrations interests foremost - whether it is constructing a jurisprudential fortress to protect a whole swathe of sitting or crawling republicans, or it is an exercise to establish a parity of corruption, whether it is an intra family dispute - i am sure they will settle it as their mythical heroes in italy (toto rina, judge carnevale & president andreottie)have always done - with violence, deceit, & complicity of the crowd
rwcole - nodding, Anderson Cooper really likes that story - got a weightlifter guy to show what 1,000 lbs is like and made it clear that Robertson does not look like that guy.
Robertson is pushing this as part of a sales pitch for some kind of health elixir … snakeoil
still grinning over the Bai article - good YKOS coverage … phew!
This may be more about McNulty than Abu Gonzales. McNulty’s been around for a long time, and has been involved in some pretty high-profile cases, prominently Operation Ill Wind in the late `80s.
If McNulty quits, some of the steam goes out of the Franklin/AIPAC case, too, which this administration wants to use as precedent to go after journalists who publish leaked information.
All that said, there is some kabuki going on here, particularly that Cheney’s name crops up–he’s horribly partisan and he’s spent enough time in Congress to know that this has got lots of Republicans there scared, quite likely for good reason, so that may not be a surprise.
But, one has to remember the timeline–while Abramoff is talking, Wade is talking and Cunningham is now in jail, Brent Wilkes is still out walking around, and even though the Wilkes/Wade/Cunningham stuff was pretty high-profile stuff, and Ney and Burns and DeLay are probably in someone’s sights, their offices didn’t get raided, although such might have cut down on the time required to figure out how earmarks figured into the mess they made. But, instead, Jefferson’s office got tossed.
Which brings me back to McNulty and Gonzales. McNulty’s got a reputation a lot like Fitzgerald’s, except that he’s even more single-minded, if that’s possible. So, maybe, Gonzales thinks he can appease McNulty by making a big show over the Jefferson/Congress business, but also stop it all where it is, sort of saying, “I went to bat for you, Paul, on the Jefferson stuff, put my career on the line, but we can’t do this again or Congress will cut off our funding.”
So, Justice suddenly has a bunch of information on the Democrats–useful for the upcoming elections–and a lot of exposure for a Democratic bribery scandal that they can use to counter Republican problems in that regard. And, maybe, McNulty sees the logic in what Gonzales says, and doesn’t press for warrants on the sleazy Republicans.
M’self, I find it very odd that Gonzales went along with warrants on a Democrat’s office, but hadn’t done so on current, evolving cases of Republicans.
All this comes back to using the power of government for partisan purposes. Cheney? Check. Gonzales? Check. Bush? The seal is a smokescreen. He was probably happy as a pig in shit about the news on Jefferson and the FBI had almost a week to copy everything found before the seal order. (They wouldn’t do that, would they? After Hoover, and Nixon and L. Patrick Gray, call me a cynic.) Hastert? Check. Scream bloody murder after the offices were raided. To serve that warrant, the FBI had to get past the Capitol Police. Hastert could have told them not to admit the FBI and could have taken it back to court on Monday to have the subpoena quashed on Constitutional grounds. Did that happen? Nope.
As it stands now, everyone on the Republican side wins, the Democrats lose, and the Republicans get to make themselves look good standing up for a Constitution they can’t stand in practice and get all of Congress behind them in an effort to prevent further investigation of Republicans. Very good stage management, actually.
So, who’s left? McNulty. Watch what he does in the next month or two or three.
One corollary point (pretty obvious):
This whole charade would not have been believable if it were a Republican’s office that was searched, because then the overreaction would have been viewed as supporting their own.
Rampant speculation:
My big question is why does this whole operation seem to be so extreme? Makes me think that they’re extremely worried about something.
The Wilson/Plame pattern may be apropos, where they started a full-court press immediately after the first public airing of the issue (although they probably prepared ahead of time).
The question is if there’s anything similarly related to the Jefferson office timing.
5/18 - warrant issued for office search
5/20 - office searched
5/21 - news of office search
5/23 - objections by Hastert
5/25 - docs sealed for 45 days by WH
The sealing of the docs, and implicit easing off on the issue, seems to indicate that something became less threatening at that point?
My first thought was the Hayden CIA nomination, and that they might be trying to preempt investigation of the wiretapping during the confirmation hearings. The timing’s sort of right, although the 45-day sealing is strange unless when they realized early on (say on 5/23 or 5/24) that Hayden would be confirmed easily.
5/8 - Hayden nominated
5/15 - Tice previews testimony of “probable unlawful and unconstitutional acts”
5/18 - hearings began
(5/18 - warrant issued)
(5/25 - docs sealed)
5/26 - Hayden confirmed
Other possible contributing factors:
5/13 - Leopold’s report of Rove’s indictment (irrelevant??)
5/15 - FCC commissioner Copps calls for investigation
5/15 - ABC News warned of FBI use of phone records
5/16 - Congress worries about investigative overreach (http://www.rollcall.com/issues/51_123/news/13356-1.html)
5/16 - WH releases list of congressmen briefed on NSA surveillance
5/18 - Balt. Sun reports legal NSA surveillance system killed post-9/11
5/22 - Gonzales confirms FBI right to use of journalists’ phone records
Hmmm…seems to be a “perfect storm” of adverse reports related to the NSA surveillance. I’ve got to wonder whether the Jefferson office strategy was triggered by this onslaught.
*ilson46201 at 4:32 pm - I asked that question as well. There was also the 45 day time frame involved in the Dubai ports deal. And now Bush locks down the Jefferson papers for a 45 day
shredding partyperiod of resolution. What’s up with that? Is there some legal significance to 45 days?I disagree that they believe their lies. I think they have gotten away with lying for so long that they just know they can keep on lying and no one will hold them accountable.
After all, there’s a war going on. Ack!!
Jane,
Has anyone posited the theory that our cable channels are now being used to prop up the bush/rethuglican message? I have noticed an apparent correlation between pro bush/pro war programming on A&E, Discovery Channel and History Channel. When things are bad for shrub, pro war and pro bush shows appear on these channels, and they are subtle in how they are presented. It would be great if you could investigate this, as I could just be projecting and certainly don’t have the time or resources to go back through the schedules to make a true analysis. But it would be very interesting to know.
kirby @ 31- finally got to read your powerful post– it was not appearing for me. thanks!
HI Jane! Hope Kobe is progressing. Is he still snarling behind your back? LOL
6ft6 -
The History Channel generally deals with wars, pestilence, conflict, etc. It’s not new, nor is it related to Bush.
One of my favorite economic texts in college was entitled “Happy People Have No History” IIRC. By this, the author meant that if you were king for 40 years of prosperity, you get a paragraph in the history books; if you were king for 4 years of upheaval and misery, the historians will spend books dissecting the whole mess.
And of all the wars, the History Channel seems to love WWII the most - it has the best film footage!
Wilson @ 103,
that’s funny, that was the first thing I thought of too……probably means nothing, though it’s interesting to speculate about some weird fetish….45 daaaaays……..
The one thing I’m having a hard time with - who authorized the raid on Jefferson’s office? Let me speculate: You can sure as hell bet it was not the lead investigator at the FBI — that person would not have had the authority to order an unprecedented raid on a congressional office.
Nor do I believe FBI director Mueller would have ordered it on his own, without buy-in from above. AG Gonzales was most certainly in the loop but even he likely would have insisted on buy-in from the White House.
If Bush was personally involved in the decision to search Jefferson’s office — and given Bush’s track record I think this is entirely possible, then the whole “Gonzales threatened to quit” story may just be so much smoke and mirrors — intended to take the focus off of Bush on this.
I would also like to know who the source was for the “Gonzales threatened to quit” story.
that WaPo, the NYTimes and CNN all had this odd story from anonymous sources indicates folk really wanted it to get out widely . . .
After reading last night and today many of the the comments about the FBI/DOJ/Jefferson/Hastert/Congress/Addington/Cheney/Bush cluster$#@!, I was going to write my own theory, perhaps borrowing from others, about what the hell is really going on. I tried. But I cannot make enough sense out of it satisfy myself that I have a coherent opinion.
My gut, however, tells me that the Republicans in Congress want to use the Jefferson case as a means of building a firewall between them and the ongoing DOJ investigations related to Abramoff, etc. T
hey fear looking like they have something to hide, by obstructing the investigation of Republicans, so they are drawing a line in the sand between DOJ and Jefferson, a Democrat.
By fighting, apparently to protect him, they set the stage for some kind of “compromise” that allows them to insulate themselves from DOJ as a matter of “principle” (separation of powers–see, we are protecting the Constitution, even though it is a Democrat whose ass is on the line).
DOJ and the FBI contain some professionals who want to nail Jefferson as well as vigorously prosecute Abramoff’s Republican cronies. Abu Gonzo appears to take their side in order to prevent an open revolt.
By doing so, he “proves” that the Administration, as well as the Republicans in Congress, are acting on “principle.” Bush, the Deviser, is given credit for coming up with the brilliant idea of a 45 day cooling off period.
That allows the Republicans in Congress time to shred or remove documents and wipe hard drives and sanitize their offices before DOJ dares to move against them as they did against Jefferson.
It also allows Abu some time to try to calm down the professionals in DOJ and FBI. (Abu never really intends to resign).
What may happen next is that the White House and Hastert (with Frist saying “me too”)come up with some kind of a “compromise” to authorize someone, perhaps a retired federal judge, act as a special master and review the evidence to determine how much of it, if any, is both germaine to and necessary for the prosecution of Jefferson. (They don’t want the judge who approved the search warrant to do this, because he has already determined there is probable cause).
Abu settles for another “compromise” to settle for some but not all of the evidence, as selected by the judge, thus setting a high bar for search of Congressional offices but saving some face with DOJ and FBI. They get some of what they want–they probably already have enough for a conviction–but the Republicans in Congress get a partial firewall.
Bush, all the Republicans hope, comes out looking like Solomon (LOL). Then DOJ goes ahead and gets a conviction against Jefferson, thus bipartisanizing the Culture of Corruption and deflecting it as a 2006 campaign issue.
The Democrats are forced to go along, because they can’t very well allow themselves to look less protective of one of their own, Jefferson, than the Republicans are. But in their case, it looks more self-serving. They are snookered into helping the Republicans build their firewall.
I don’t know whether any of that makes sense. It is a strange situation. I just feel strongly that it is some kind of game the Republicans are playing, not an exercise in harmonizing the three branches of government to protect the Constitution.
OT
Hi *ilson!
Well, that was an enlightening encounter with Noam Chomsky that the cadets were privileged to have as opposed to the address by the simian in chief today.
oh, how I wish all of America could hear him, especially his response to the last question. Thanks again, *ilson, for the heads up!
trial balloon : http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05.....nted=print
NYTimes, May 27, 2006
U.S. Is Debating Talks With Iran on Nuclear Issue
By STEVEN R. WEISMAN
WASHINGTON, May 26 %u2014 The Bush administration is beginning to debate whether to set aside a longstanding policy taboo and open direct talks with Iran, to help avert a crisis over Tehran’s suspected nuclear weapons program, European officials and Americans close to the administration said Friday.
European officials who have been in contact with the administration in recent weeks said the discussion was heating up, as Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice worked with European foreign ministers to persuade Iran to suspend its efforts to enrich uranium.
European leaders make no secret of their desire for the United States to join in the talks with Iran, if only to show that the Americans have gone the extra mile to avoid a confrontation that could spiral into a fight over sanctions or even military action.
Let me just throw something out there, in a devil’s advocate kind of way, because I think there is at least a possibility that an injustice is being done to the DoJ: if the FBI had executed a DoJ warrant for Rove’s office in connection with the Plame matter, would any of you be suggesting that it was done in hopes of obtaining Republican election strategy info? Or would you be convinced this was just about the Plame case?
Patrick Fitzgerald is part of the same DoJ that just obtained the Jefferson warrant, and call me naive, but I do still believe that there are many people working in the DoJ - and the FBI - who have no partisan axe to gind, and are dedicated to the pursuit of justice.
I’m just sayin’.
Valley Girl #121
Behind the back snarly boy. He’s the clever one. Today I had my first pumpkin cookie at the mall (well, half, I shared it with my cousin) in Kobe’s honor. It was dee-lish.
And on Valley Girl #57:
‘This is a fight for the soul of the Democratic Party,’ said Marshall Wittmann, a senior fellow at the centrist Democratic Leadership Council. ‘It will have repercussions for the 2008 presidential campaign and whether centrists will feel comfortable within the Democratic Party.’
At this point along with no spine, there appears to be NO SOUL in the Democratic party and indeed we netrooters are fighting for that. (netrooters=intruders to those jokers) PS. Does that guy think Zell Miller was a centrist? What a whiner.
A little polling on the Connecticut race- it’s from Rasmussen- so take it with a few pounds of salt- but it’s the only polling I could find:
May 5, 2006
Senator Joe Lieberman (D) has angered many Democrats for his position on Iraq and his relationship with the Bush Administration. Despite that, the incumbent is well positioned to win another term in Washington.
Lieberman leads businessman Paul Streitz (R) 59% to 23% in a general election match-up.
However, Lieberman faces a stiff challenge from within his own party. Ned Lamont has raised the banner for those disaffected with Lieberman and mounted a more serious challenge than initially expected. Lieberman has not ruled out an Independent bid for the Senate if Lamont were to win the nomination.
In that case, Lieberman would win 47% of the vote, Lamont 20%, and Streitz 17%. Those numbers are similar to our previous poll on this match-up.
Lieberman’s support from Republicans and unaffiliated voters changes little whether he runs as a Democrat or an Independent.
The impact among Democrats is quite different. Running as the party’s standard bearer, Lieberman attracts 68% of the vote from the party faithful. However, if Lamont is the Democratic nominee, Lieberman earns just 43% of the vote from Democrats in the state. Lamont gets 32%.
The deadline for filing to run as an Independent is the day after the Democratic Primary. In practical terms, because of petition signature requirements, Lieberman would have to begin preparation for filing as an Independent before the Democratic Primary.
Lieberman also leads Lamont by 20 percentage points in a Primary Election match-up.
neurophius,
Agree except for this…
“It also allows Abu some time to try to calm down the professionals in DOJ and FBI.”
Abu has ZERO pull with Mueller or the FBI (rank and file) over this, IMO
Guess if someone really wants to start looking into the Jefferson situation- they might start by finding out who the lead prosecutor is and whether he/she is a career person or a recent appointee.
a factor peculiar to CT is that state’s tradition of independent candidates winning important elections. Lowell Weicker comes to mind. In Indiana, independents have zero chance of winning…
I think it was Mark Shields on the NewsHour, that suggested the warrant was requested by a career prosecutor at the DoJ — and the reason it happened now and never before, is that the top positions at DoJ (Abu & Company) are Bush hacks who don’t have the political smarts to see the problem with this.
It sounds as plausible as anything else — it happened because the BushCo incompetents were too stupid to stop it.
And Robert Meuller being a sraight arrow? Uhhh — no . . .
As a DoJ staff attorney, he helped quash the investigation into Iran Contra in 1986. That makes him a deep cover asset in BushWorld.
Some investigations of official conduct are not okay, according to our DoJ. Gov asks for dismissal of wiretap lawsuits.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/200.....pping_dc_1
After reading the warrant, >30 pages, I am very confused. The DOJ outlines the case againt Jefferson and his family based on a lot of investigative work, that to a non-lawyer, makes a criminal indictment a slam dunk. Why not wait for discovery to deal with the office files?
The warrant is very interesting and Jefferson and his family are very dirty. The $90k in the freezer appears to be just spare change. And this guy is a small frog in the congressional corruption swamp. No wonder Hastert, Frist and the other big frogs are having a stroke.
I’m with Anne and Cujo on this one. I’ve read the partially redacted affidavit with the warrant and no one puts that much work in on a grandstand piece that has an ulterior motive. Yeah - maybe a 30pp affidavit to make the ulterior motive look good, but that 90+ pp affidavit with proofed footnotes — hard work went in to it.
Not only that, the affidavit and warrant paint a very clear picture of something that has been through a lot of vetting and so, despite the source (Pete Williams) I find this from Cozumel’s post very beleivable: “[the warrant was] the result of eight months of back and fourth with the judge that eventually signed it . . . and was carefully crafted with respect to the separation of powers issue.”
Here’s the other piece of that puzzle. Judge Hogan cleared time and was ready to handle this whole mess on Tuesday. I believe in the Hastert-Gonzales-CHeney-Bush Mexican standoff people are forgetting — THE COURT THAT ISSUED THE WARRANT. *g* Uh, that’s the guy who really has the call on who gets the docs from a legal standpoint. That legal point could get resolved ASAP, and is almost 100%, ah heck, 1000%, likely to go Gov’s way - since there is no way in the world Hogan signed off on that particular warrant in a vacumn. There HAD to have been a LOT Of back and forth already.
So here you have FBI and DOJ fuming and Hogan throws them the lifeline — y’all come see me on Tuesday and we’ll work this little matter out - ‘kay? The response - from these guys who are fuming and ready to quit if they don’t get to keep the docs - and who are about to be handed an order authorizing them to keep the docs —–
uh, gee, I’m getting my hair done Tuesday, can we put it off for a bit?
So the 45 days is a bit of a red herring. “The” date is now the mid-June, let’s picnic with Judge Hogan, date. I think he might actually have an opinion about whether the Sol. Gen is actually the appropriate person to hold the docs “under seal.” I believe if they are docs held pursuant to MY ORDER I’m gonna have an opinion about the chain of custody and it is flat bizarre to have those records with Clement.
curiouser and curiouser
Cozumel -
I’m w/ you on Mueller, in fact, I think he threatened not only to quit, but to ’splain some things to the American people about ol Abu if the AG didn’t back the FBI guys
and although it’s clear none of us really know what’s going on yet -
It’s obvious Hastert is holding something over Dick Cheney - jeebus - wonder if we’ll ever know what it is
Apugolypse Now
Sharon- what I didn’t add, but was probably obvious, was that the two choices that Wittman gave were “centrist” and “left”. I wish someone would start calling them (i.e. Lieberman) right wing… well, maybe… just an emotional reaction, not a clearly thought out political modus!!
somehow the phrase “congerie of eels” arises to describe this affair … it’s all so damn convoluted !
If the polling from Rasmussen is close to accurate- it’s possible that the Lamont candidacy could cause the dems to lose a senate seat. This gets more and more interesting.
Hello all, sorry to be so in an out with comments myself, but I am reading while trying to do other things.
Hi Coz!
rw- did you provide a link to the Ras poll that I missed?
“…it’s possible that the Lamont candidacy could cause the dems to lose a senate seat.”
I think the loyalist Leiberman would be blamed for that if it happens. But we’ll see how impressed people are if he starts collecting signatures to run as an independent. And he saw how Ralph Nader got blamed for the 2000 “loss”. But maybe he doesn’t care what Democrats think of him.
Mary at 5:22pm
Thanks, you addressed my next question on this which was - what about the court that issued the warrant and does Bush in fact have the authority to interfere in the way that he has?
If I’m hearing you correctly, you expect movement on this well before th 45 day ’seal’ declared by Bush?
Thanks to Jacqrat at #9, I just e-mailed CNN and Chris Matthews the following missive — “I understand that you are planning to cover the sex lives of Bill and Hillary Clinton on your show tomorrow. I hope that if you wish to engage in gossip and innuendo that you will also be looking into the sex lives of Republicans such as John McCain, Rudy Giuliani, and George W. Bush himself. Maybe members of the media should be covered too, since they are public figures. If it’s sleaze for one, it should be sleaze for all, don’t you think? After all, that’s fair and this is America.”
Open Letter to Mr. Patrick Healy
c/o New York Times-Enquirer
Dear Mr. Healy,
Now that you’ve covered the sex lives of Hillary and Bill Clinton with a front page story in the New York Times, would you please dig into the sex lives of your boss, Bill Keller, the Times’ Executive Editor, or the Washington Post’s media maven, Howie Kurtz, or its lecherous old pundit and political palaverer, David Broder, all of whom stroked your “Post” Page 6 story into premature prominence.
Or better yet, the secret sex life of George W. Bush!
Has he always been heterosexual? Didn’t he do a little walk on the wild side when he was younger, at Yale (check cheerleading, gay roommate, Skull and Bones, and Deke the drinking fraternity with sado-masochistic hazing like branding bare bottoms with hot irons or pouring honey and salsa into the initiates’ butts)? Didn’t he do some time at a faith-based clinic to “cure” him of his wayward ways before he married Laura? And is he completely “cured”? Look at the way he walks and talks even now? Have you ever seen a real man’s man have such an obsession with fondling bald men’s heads? What’s that mean? Why does he surround himself with men who are clearly homosexual like Ken Mehlman and Jeff Gannon or of “dubious sexuality” like Scott McClellan and Karl Rove? What kind of sex do you think George W. and Pickles have? Robotic? Stepford like? What’s she like off medication anyway? Enquiring minds want to know.
And if you want to talk about politics and sex, you really should look into John McCain and his wives (divorcing the loyal first one after getting out of prisoner-of-war camp to marry the rich, pill-addicted beer heiress just in time to go into politics) or Rudy Giuliani (who married his cousin — unusual outside of Appalachia — then divorced her to marry beautiful newscaster Donna Hanover — and then announced their separation on television without first informing his children or his wife — who had, by the way, just found Rudy dick-deep into his pharmaceutical saleslady/ mistress at the Mayor’s office on Father’s Day).
If this is the sauce you’re going to pour over the Clintons and other Democratic candidates, how about cooking a little puree of Republican, too? You know that despite outward appearances, Republicans are a lot kinkier bunch than Democrats. They repress themselves (and others) so much that when it oozes out or spurts out under pressure, it’s likely to be more fetishistic, more about sadism and domination, and, basically, more twisted.
Rush Limbaugh has his “hillbilly heroin” addiction. O’Reilly likes to talk dirty and caress naked women over phones with imaginary “falafels”. And did you hear that when Chris “Tweety” Matthews lived in San Francisco he frequented a “Pre-op Tranny bar called the Black Rose”?
Who knows what we’ll find out about the sex lives of Bill Keller or Howie Kurtz or even the old goat and grandee of the Beltway, David Broder. However, I’m not sure I want to see the pictures.
Just know that you’re not safe if you continue to fluff for the Republicans. You’ll be caught up in their flotsam and drown in their jism.
Sincerely,
radlib1
Hat tips to –
http://www.firedoglake.com/200.....ton-rules/ (comment by KNows at #54) — Chris Matthews
http://mindprod.com/politics/bushismsgay.html#GAY — Bush
Valley- No I didn’t provide a link- but here it is:
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/2006/State Polls/April 2006/Connecticut Senate April.htm
“%u2026it’s possible that the Lamont candidacy could cause the dems to lose a senate seat.”
I would argue that Leiberman is a “Democratic senate seat” in name only.
If was Hastert, Ney, Lewis, DeLay, etc.,etc.,and I read the online docs, I would be very worried. I assume that only a very small amount of investigative product is in the warrant and to me this shows that the DOJ has put a lot of time and effort in Mr. Jefferson’s case. How much investigative effort has the DOJ invested in the big fish? If the DOJ has been totally corrupted, I guess the answer would be very little; if only somewhat corrupted, then at leasr 20 Repbubs are looking at a date with bubba.
rwcole — I am very curious to know under what scenario from the Rasmussen poll that the Republican takes the seat. I’m just not seeing that.
Oops- Looks like the Rasmussen link didn’t work for some reason. Try this one and click on Connecticut Senate.
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/2006/Election Polls 2006.htm
Hi VG,
I’m in and out reading that affidavit (too?). Geeze it’s long! lol
About halfway through, they refer to “CW-1″ (Cooperating witness - one) as a “she”. A slip? I’ve only seen it once so far.
Jane- There is NO scenario where the gooper takes the seat- but there is a pretty likely scenario where Uncle Joe keeps it as an independent. Would he still vote for Dem control? Beats me!
Apparently the Rasmussen links to specific pages don’t work. If you want to see the poll- just go to Rasmussen. I give up!
Cozumel @ 5:10pm
“Abu has ZERO pull with Mueller or the FBI (rank and file) over this, IMO “
Can you given me a sentence or two as to why you feel this is the case? (I’m not disagreeing with you - I’m only admitting my ignorance with respect to the relationships at play here.) Doesn’t Mueller report to Gonzales?
Mary 140 — that was new information, filling in a missing piece from the NYT article today. In that article, it says that .. .
“At the Justice Department, there was hope that the courts might quickly resolve the issue. Government lawyers prepared a brief on Firday in opposition to the motion filed by lawyers for Mr. Jefferson seeking the return of materials taken from his office. The FBI search was conducted on a the basis of a search warrant issued y a fedeal judge, T.S. Ellis, in Alexandria Va.”
So, are you saying that the Jefferson motion would have been heard by Judge Hogan next Tuesday? Is it clear that this hearing is still on? Or has the President’s “45-day thingy” intervention disrupted that? And where did you find that this is now rescheduled for mid June? Who’s in charge: Hogan or Bush?
Dratty #5
Raid on only Dem. Congressman’s office with any hint of scandal. Raid complete. Gop leaders raise Cain. Smoke and mirrors of “constitutional crisis” and “separation of powers” spread all over. Docs held for 45 days until “compromise” that makes any raid harder to acheive is worked out.
Now only GOP Congressmen left to investigate, but investigation impeded due to new “compromise”. Oops, have to call off investigation.
Something I’m missing?
I had a lot the same reaction initially, but I do think some things are missing from that - which is why I am more with Muzzy 38 and rwc77
First off, all that was needed for initial scenario is for Hastert to raise a stink as he did, and the President then sit down with him to look like the great respecter of the Constitution and work things out.
None of the Gonzales foot stomp and, more interestingly, the leak about the Gonzales/Cheney notBFFanymore tiffing would be a necessary or even helpful piece of that scenario.
There is also nothing to show WHY Gonzales would have such a fit to pitch. Even without the evidence seized, they seem to have Jefferson dead to rights. I absolutely can believe that the folks who worked on this would be ready to scream if the info had to go back and that he might want to placate them, but Bush is the boss on this one and the Executive chooses to pursue or not pursue things, more or less agressively, all the time. It also makes me very sad to think that the same folks that have been filing protorture, anti-Constitution, anti-morality, anti-human values briefs left and right would choose this as their “noisy withdrawal” point. Well, sick maybe more than sad. There are just a lot of disconnects.
Moreover, Gonzales is ok with the President having the broad sweeping power to decide to secretly cart off a Canadian from a NY airport to Syria for torture, surreptitously turn over American citizens to secret military detention and interrogations, violate FISA in every way, shape and fashion, thousands and thousands of times over half a decade, put together signing statements to allow for disregard of hundreds up on hundreds of laws, shut down civil litigation under a fascist state secrets approach but
OH MY STARS - that darn President (my boss) absolutely can’t tell me not to use this piece of evidence or I’ll just have to quit?
I mean, the President has Pardon power forgoshsakes, and Gonzales is livid that he wouldn’t be able to use certain evidence? That just doesn’t make any kind of sense.
Esp bc there is no way all this “just happened.” Everyone involved has to have known that COngress would register some kind of a reaction to the raid and the raid - based on that warrant affidavit - has to have been a long time coming.
And Gonzales gets the same thing he already has - the 45 day hold - without leaking (remember how he is supposed to be the plumber *g* for all those “other” leaks?) his tiff.
Plus, he’s the guy who asserts all that lovely privilege stuff (formerly as WH counsel or as AG) - where internal debates involving the President and staffers are subject to privilege bc making them public might interfere with the full and robust discussions that should occur?
Yet somehow HIS fight with the President and the involvement of Cheney and Addington and Mueller (McNult in a supporting role) gets pronto-pronto leaked? I also will never believe in a million gazillion years that Gonzales would “win” any beatdown with Addington or that Addington has any real interest in protecting anything but the VP’s interests.
Plus, it makes no sense if Justice is itchy for a final call on their docs, that overall resolution that Judge Hogan has on the table ready to go, gets sent back to the kitchen to be warmed up for later?
Something’s snot right.
I have to admit it makes me wonder a bit about whether there might be anything about to come out in the Plame matter re: what happened to the missing 250 emails? And any involvement of then WH counsel?
Most interesting scenario would be:
Dems win in the six seats they need to control the senate:
Rhode Island
Pennsylvania
Montana
Missouri
Ohio
Tennessee
Uncle Joe wins as an independent in Connecticut- and then raffles himself off to the highest bidder.
He wouldn’t do that- would he?
Re: 45 days pattern, I’m surprised they don’t always use 40 days, as biblical as that would be, they would love it! Noah, Moses, Jesus, everybody gets 40 days and 40 nights, right?
Ed N Sted,
“Can you given me a sentence or two as to why you feel this is the case? (I’m not disagreeing with you - I’m only admitting my ignorance with respect to the relationships at play here.) Doesn’t Mueller report to Gonzales?”
I’ve got a friend at the “bureau”, OK, I’m biased ; ) I’ve seen nothing to indicate to me that he isn’t a straight shooter. I believe he reports to Negroponte, as does the DCIA.
Actually, there is plenty of reason for Denny to get his titty in the wringer over this case. There a lot more goopers than dems involved in potential bribery actions. If the FBI can search a dem’s office- they can search goopers’ offices too- and they probably will.
Denny needs to draw a line in the sand right now- or watch his buddies get knocked off one at a time- and the search alone is probably enough to cause em to lose an election- even if nothing is found.
Wendy: and 40 years in the wilderness too? I was thinking the same thing, it should be 40 days, not 45 …
our gov, been taken over by the Mob……..
New thread up, but I have to add a couple things here:
1. Jefferson and his whole family are dirty, and DOJ has been building that case against him for a long time.
2. I don’t see any Republican connection to Jefferson’s dirty deals. I don’t think he would work with any Republican in that way.
I had to look up the Sammy the Bull reference.
I found the following:
Gravano would have everyone believe that he was being a dedicated soldier in a “society” that had honor at the center of it.
Honor at the center of it? Perhaps the WH and the Mafia are very different after all.
Ed N Sted 146 -
From a “legal” standpoint there could be movement earlier. The thing about all prosecutions is that they also involve exercise of discretion. The President as the actual “boss” over DOJ has a right, as a political matter, to choose to press or not press certain things.
So you have two issues. One is the legal issue - can they go and get the evidence and is/are there safeguards in place re: review to protect info. This is really between Jefferson and DOJ and the House is going to have a heckuva time showing standing to be involved in any way on that. They might pull it off, but I see that as pretty doubtful.
The other is the political issue - how does the President want to proceed with respect to Congress. Once Judge Hogan rules on the docs, this puts more pressure on the Pres and that is why I think DOJ are getting manicures on Tuesday. Hogan is not going to tell DOJ, even if he tells them they can have the docs, that they HAVE to do anything with them. There, the President can still tell DOJ - his employees (who have sure all been good boys and girls on torture and warrantless spying so far) to hold off for awhile on doing anything.
There, though, it becomes more and more a political issue that he is, in essence, holding up any future raids by those actions and most of the possible future raids seem related to Republicans. So I think he probably wasn’t happy that Hogan is so accomodating. He’d like time IMO.
BTW - re: Hastert: I’d lay money Ross’ source was FBI. Ross made a parsing comment about only using “in the mix” and that there might be some difference in use of terminology between Hastert’s office, DOJ, and FBI. Well, since Hastert and DOJ seem on the same page - that leaves FBI (which has not issued the same stark comment as McNulty’s all clear).
I know what Mueller did on Iran-Contra (and fwow, imo Comey has done worse during this Admin) but, FBI has been, by and large, a lot cleaner through this very messy admin than DOJ, NSA, the military, etc. They have resisted the “militarization” of the response and acted like civilian law enforcement in general, who still believe in following rules and making cases based on evidence.
There have been, as the Mousaoui and Edmonds matters have shown, some really serious “desk” issues, but I still would be more likely to go with the FBI doing solid work that stayed in the lines than most of the rest of the Gov agencies.
Too much Dragnet as a child?
Mary- Well reasoned and objective analysis- as always. Thanks.
Mary,
“Too much Dragnet as a child?”
Just the facts, ma’am. lol ; )
Scarecrow 157 - my understanding is that Hogan was ready to go on Tuesday, but that the Prosecutors asked for more time. It is now set, I believe, for mid-June, but I don’t have the date.
I can’t imagine that Hogan, after granting the warrant and after the way the warrant and affidavit were structured - which makes it really seem like there could have been a lot of prior back and forth - would rule against Gov.
These kinds of things are one reason the DC Circuit Ct (where Jefferson would take his appeal) is one of the most important in the country. The DC Cir - which will soon be graced with the presence of Judge Kavanaugh.
My dentist and the makers of Advil have made out like bandits under this adminstration.
This whole scenario is patently ridiculous– with the K Street Project sliced open and its guts spilling out– with 5 or 6 or 7 Republican congressmen under investigation, and huge amounts of money changing hands, or course hundreds of millions in oil money and pharma money and phony defense contracts and phony Katrina contracts and Delay and Ney and Abramoff’s restaurant, and suddenly they find the Black Guy, and raid his office– he’s got 90,000 smackers in the freezer. You’ve got to be kidding. No one bought him a house for half a million, or two and a half million?
As usual, they arrest the Black Guy for stealing, that will take the heat of the REALLY REALLY BIG major crimes these guys are pulling off against all of us. Against the children, against working people, against retirees. They are impoverishing the country, gutting it. Filling us all with poisonous pollutants, and harmful, untested drugs — thimersol, mercury poisoning, defective heart monitors. Actually even keeping us from saving the world from destruction due to global warning, so that some more oil execs can pay themselves 400 million dollars. And they WANT to collect it from little old ladies and take their social security money away too, and put it into the Market. They are letting the world be destroyed for more money than 400 million because they don’t have enough yet. And they want us to respect that.
Paying 400 million dollar salaries –that’s what the Congressional payoffs get you. Who got the phoney contract for pathetic trailers that were not even delivered to hundreds of thousands of people?
And the AG is going to quit because he’s told maybe he shouldn’t raid the office of a congressman — the Black Guy? Give me a break. How can anyone do anything other than howl — OH NO, YOU’ve GOT TO BE KIDDING!
And the Black Guy was set up, right? It was entrapment, pure and simple.
How red a herring do you need? Give us the MONEY and destroy the world.
–sandra
sandra y,
“And the Black Guy was set up, right? It was entrapment, pure and simple.”
Um, sandra. I think you better read the affidavit ; )
http://www.bayoubuzz.com/jefferson_affdavit.pdf
I think the whole thing is perfectly obvious. Certainly, we can agree that the Bush administration cares nothing about corruption or bribery. This was basically a message to Congress that if they don’t stay in line, they will be dealt with (unless they are completely clean of corruption, which is probably a small percentage of Congress). They took out a Democrat, because that serves the dual purpose of sending the message and going after Dems on the corruption issue. The Republicans in Congress, who are just getting ready to abandon Bush, have now been put on notice that they better take their marching orders and stay in line or the same thing will happen to them. Gonzales considers this important, because it gives the President virtually unchecked power (and they have probably spied on every member of Congress, so they know who has been bad and good). Cheney worries that this could backfire, if the Republicans turn on Bush and actually do one of the 17 or so REAL investigations that need doing (Katrina, Iraq WMD’s, Abu, 9/11 screw-ups, etc.) and go along with impeachment.
What a wondeful analysis. What a wondeful writer.
Hastert comes out strongly against the FBI raids of Congressman Jefferson’s files.
Shortly thereafter, an article appears on the ABC website that an anonymous justice department official has implicated Hastert in the Jack Abramhoff investigation.
Within the same day, the justice department releases a statement that Hastert is not involved in said investigation. ABC, however, stands by its source and its story.
Hastert reacts angrily, accusing the justice department of leaking the Abramhoff scandal implication to silence Hastert’s “interference” in the matter of the FBIs seizure of congressman Jeffersons records.
Today it comes out that Roberto Gonzales, head of the Justice Department, has threatened to resign unless Hastert backs down from his demands for the Justice Department to hand over the records that were seized.
Now, given the M.O. of the Bush administration, and the way they act when someone with authority steps out of the administration line. (See Paul O’Neill, Gen. Shinseki, Richard Clarke, Joe Wilson and more than I can remember right now.) I have to say I think that Hastert is telling the truth. This was a typical administration hardball ploy to get him back in line. It was also a classic case of the administration using the Washington press to leak information to send Hastert a message.
Cozumel at 6:00pm
Thanks for the response. I did locate an org chart for the Justice Department:
http://www.usdoj.gov/dojorg.htm
According to this chart the FBI reports to the AG (or assistant AG)
Not sure where Director of National Intelligence John Negroponte fits into the picture. Their web site is at:
http://www.dni.gov/index.htm
(Maybe Justice department org chart is
outdated?)
Also, here is Homeland Security org chart.
http://www.dhs.gov/interweb/as.....gChart.pdf
I’m just trying to get this straight in my own mind about who reports to whom and how the chain of command works.
Achtung! Achtung!
The Reich has been attacked from within but through the sublime guiding intelligence of our Fuhrer I am happy to report that the culprits have been caught and will be most severely punished. Patriotic Reichsvolk may recall the example made by the Geheim Staats Politzi against Herr Libby Rohm who was hung by piano wire after admitting to corrupting of our Reichs youth with obscene homosexual Japanese sexual practises.
This latest attack was led by the Islamofascist criminal Herr Hastert. He was caught red-handed assisting a subhuman unterman subvert the integrity of the Reichstag. National Socialism relies on absolute fealty to der Fuhrer who expresses the iron triumph of the peoples will.
The human bacilli and undterhuman rats who infest and contaminate the Reich shall not escape the justice of the Reichs Waffen SS.
The Brownshirt SA is formerly disbanded and all Freeping Goopers will now report to the Waffen SS. The Reich always seeks peace in spite of these vicious attacks from so-called ‘ democrat’s’ and filthy lying stateless cosmopolitan’s. So der ist nothink to zee here! Nein danke - KINDLY MOVE ALONG PLISS! raus RAUS!
Ed N Sted,
YOWSER! I still don’t think Mueller reports to the AG though, maybe that wrong or dated?
“The intelligence director will oversee all 15 US intelligence agencies, including the CIA and FBI, but some have warned the job lacks real powers.”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wor.....274337.stm
Plain and simple - this is a diversion!
Ignore this theater and get back to focusing on all of the failures of the Bush administration and Republican Congress.
It is a non-story - please do not spend anymore time on this - focus on the fact that >2,000 American soldiers have died in a war that Bush CHOSE to fight
Ed N Sted,
Jeebus, you’re right! Check out this chart…
http://www.carrollpub.com/2005.....#8217;John Negroponte organizational chart’
Just looking at the surface of this thing, it looks like Hastert and many Congressmen have alot to hide with these documents, Abu Gonzales is pissed Bush told him he couldn’t look at the documents for 45 days and is sick of being bossed around by incompetents. It’s fun to watch this admin is imploding in a desperate panic with rifts like Rove vs. Cheney, Bush vs. Abu Gonzales, Bush vs. Laura.
Look, I dunno what are who is driving this bus but from my experience at my agency and fom stories from friends at other fed. agencies in DC, we are all working for the third or fourth choice of political apointees-not quite the bottom of the pork barrel but getting close. The previous top level appointees have come and gone; spent their time and returned to privare corportations to cash in their connections while good) : hence to ascribe potlical motivations to every effort by doj lower level appointees and staff is probably wrong however once the actions come to light to the politicos in involved in this jefferson/haster/pelosi chum theynade hay. I imagine the politicos and Rove and Bush were first stunned then delighted with the opportunoty presented to them by the the FBI search and the additional leverage it gave them with both Haster and Pelosi. These people smoke us because thay can adjust and use or manipulate everything to their advantage whereas we feel limited by our beliefs or shared values–we need to begin to learn how to adapt quickly without losing our deepest held beliefs; we need to think several steps ahead…Bush wins in this no matter the result after 45 days jefferson goes to indictment, Hastert coopts his stance on immigration, by then we have moved on as a nation we do npt even connect the dots. Its up to us here at FDK and others to conect the dots now and later. Otherwise they win again.
Cozumel:
That last chart you link to is very interesting. It shows Justice reporting to Office of National Intelligence. But I’m pretty certain the AG reports directly to the president.
Accord to:
http://www.dni.gov/aboutODNI/history.htm
“Post-9/11 investigations included a joint Congressional inquiry and the independent National Commission on Terrorist Attacks Upon the United States (better known as the 9/11 Commission). The report of the 9/11 Commission in July 2004 proposed sweeping change in the Intelligence Community including the creation of a National Intelligence Director (NID). Very soon after the best-selling report was released, the federal government moved forward to undertake reform. President Bush signed four Executive Orders in August 2004, which strengthened and reformed the Intelligence Community as much as possible without legislation. In Congress, both the House and Senate passed bills with major amendments to the National Security Act of 1947. Intense negotiations to reconcile the two bills ultimately led to the Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act of 2004, which President Bush signed into law on December 8. In February 2005, the President announced that John D. Negroponte, ambassador to Iraq, was his nominee to be the first Director of National Intelligence and Lt. Gen. Michael V. Hayden, USAF, as the first Principal Deputy DNI, which earned him his fourth star. On April 21, 2005, in the Oval Office, Amb. Negroponte and Gen. Hayden were sworn in, and the ODNI began operations at 7:00 AM on April 22.”
A quick search of the Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act of 2004
http://frwebgate.access.gpo.go.....58.108.pdf
shows that the FBI has at least some responsibility to report to DNI (Negraponte):
Section 102A:
(b) ACCESS TO INTELLIGENCE.—Unless otherwise directed by the President, the Director of National Intelligence shall have access to all national intelligence and intelligence related to the national security which is collected by any Federal department, agency, or other entity, except as otherwise provided by law or, as appropriate,
under guidelines agreed upon by the Attorney General and the Director of National Intelligence.”
Follow the leakers
In unraveling Watergate, the famous advice from Deep Throat was to follow the money. This was because, in Watergate, the Nixon administration had been forced to fund their own shadow security service because the FBI and CIA wouldn’t do their illegal work for them. Tracing the money used to fund the plumbers was the way into the conspiracy. But the Cheney administration, doubtless because of 9/11, met with better success at suborning the government’s own security services to do their illegal bidding. They didn’t have to fund a private security service from private, or diverted govt, funds, but simply used the already existing govt agencies, so no money trail. But, because they used govt agencies, they left behind a trail of civil service professionals in law enforcement and security who cooperated with the illegality unwillingly. These people have already started to leak, to the press, but also to Congress.
If a quick look over to the Anchoress’ site is any guide to wider feelings on the right, it is this leak path, disgruntled civil servants to Congresspersons, that is the real target of interest, of which the struggle over the Jefferson search and seizure is only the proxy fight. Gonzalez et al over at Justice are not so keen to put Republicans in jail for offical corruption that they would threaten to resign over handing back the Jefferson evidence. Corruption isn’t the real issue behind the stalking horse of the Jefferson raid, plugging leaks to protect the NSA surveillance, and other secret Cheney administration surveillance programs as yet unrevealed, is the real issue.
These rightwing bloggers support Gonzalez et al in this struggle with Hastert because they believe in this unitary executive nonsense, at least as long as their guy is the unitary executive. But Gonzalez and the rest of the Cheney administration are keen on getting the gloves taken off on FBI manhandling of Congresspersons, because they badly need to keep potential leakers away from Congress, especially if the Dems take over either chamber of the next Congress.
A Democratic Congress, even with the largest Dem majorities to be reasonably expected from the upcoming elections, would not be able, by itself, to impeach and convict members of this administration, even if it were keen to move in that direction. But there is a high order of likelihood that there is evidence out there that could get BushCo convicted, that unwilling civil servant participants in the crimes of the Cheney adminstration would leak to a Congress in Democratic hands, whom they would look to for some protection from administration retaliation. To keep this from happening, BushCo must make clear well ahead of any Dem takeover of Congress, that Congresspersons will not, in fact, be able to shield whistleblowing leakers, but will instead themselves be subject to vigorous investigation and prosecution should they receive any such leaks.
The only problem with viewing this as some convoluted attempt to make the Republicans look good while disarming the Democrats’ campaign issue regarding Republican corruption is…
… shit this convoluted rarely resonates with the general public. Especially as far as election-year manipulation goes.
If Jane’s having trouble sussing this whole thing out into an easily-encapsulated summary (as, I think, are we all) then how the hell is the general public going to make heads or tails out of it. And if they can’t make heads or tails out of it, then how are they expected to even care about it?
Either the Republicans just got incredibly sloppy with their PR manipulation efforts, or there’s something going on with this whole thing that we’re not seeing.
Personally, I have less and less idea of what’s truly going on with this whole scenario the more I read about it.
Something else is afoot here, I’d bet money on it.
I do agree that this Jefferson thing is nothing but a red herring just as all of the immigration talk has suddenly died down.
I have lost all hope that Fitz is going to indict anyone else. He finally had a chance to bag Rove, but probably never will. The investigation is way too close to the POTUS, Dickie boy and all their errand boys. Nothing will ever come of this. Sorry, I have lost my faith.
SubjuGate City - do I hear bowie?
I can’t help but think the shots fired and subsequent search of the rayburn building are a part of this weeks heavy handed ploy. Just dumb enough for chimpy and mean enough for shooter. WTF! Or Chimpy, Shooter, and Hastert are all in a cold sweat. Bush and Hastert were scared this week.
Perhaps a few members of the thirteen houses of intelligence are putting the screws to the Rethuglicans. Setting up ABC, Hastert, Rayburn shutdown, at the perfect times.
Why do I like this UNDERGATE or SUBJUGATE theory thread? I love it btw! Classic stuff all. I can’t say it enough.
Because Congress is faced with the same dangers we the people are. Today! Every member of the House should feel both a sense of deer in a headlights and wildcat backed into a corner. Will this be enough to ignite a fire in team Hastert? Or is his laundry dirty enough to continue on his/our submissive fascist failure of the Constitution?
Jefferson was all opportunity albeit a perfect pawn.
If Gonzo has that Judiciary committee grin when he denies his threat to resign this week, that will tell me quite a bit. Gonzo may be cannon fodder.
Gonzalez, Hastert, shrub, congress, Pelosi, doj, fbi, cia….worlds are colliding. When the rules are being changed every other day, the gamechangers are bound to be caught up in the tangled web they have woven eventually.
I can’t believe nobody else has pointed out the typo in paragraph 5. “the pubic eye”?? something on your mind, Jane?
Late to the table, as usual:
xyz has it nailed, pretty much, with excellent analysis in #40.
But, it leaves out the obvious, that the FBI was doing its job, properly, according to the warrant, and should not take the “hit” for doing something necessary to prosecute, in spite of the precedent being set. To try to tie everything else, political in motivation, into some grandly executed conspiracy by the WH is just the ultimate paranoia that everyone has been reduced to.
Hastert is worried, as are Democrats who have been “feeding at the trough,” hence the bi-partisan “outrage.” The Prez is taking advantage of it all for his own benefit. Meanwhile, a crook like Jefferson and others in Congress, are having their justice delayed. (No pun intended.)
It’s a pervese type of distraction, I think … betting in a brazen way that there’s enough stupidity out there that a critical mass of people will actually take this as a sign that the Republicans actually care about principles and that standing up for that line in the sand in not partisan … thereby creating some confusion and some sense that all the other actions that have trashed the Constitution are less important, or just Democrat efforts at obstruction in a time of war and national crisis.
Fitzgerald is our Elliott Richardson.
See WMR (Wayne Madsen). he says Jefferson was up to it with Nigerian bribery and his office had docs that linked to Cheney and Nigerian oil.
Cheney and Jefferson have a lot in common.
http://www.dailykos.com/storyo.....16850/4036
Oddly, Cheney was involved with a scandal involving bribes to Nigerian politicians, too. Jerome a Paris reported on the situation in a little-read diary at Daily Kos in June 2005:
This is all linked to a huge LNG project, Nigerian LNG, which has been in the works for almost 20 years, and which finally came to fruition in the late 90s. LNG is liquefied natural gas, it essentially means that you freeze natural gas into liquid form so that it takes less volume and you can then transport it by boats (LNG tankers) to regasification facilities located in consuming countries. This is a good way to make money out of gas which is far away from markets and cannot be brought to a pipeline grid….
So, the big oil producers in Nigeria (Shell, in the leading role, with Total of France and ENI of Italy) joined up with NNPC, the national oil company, to build a big liquefaction plant, NLNG. Now, such plants are very expensive (between 1 and 2 billion dollars a pop, depending on their size), and such large investments are especially risky to make in a country so difficult as Nigeria….
In the case of NLNG, a consortium of four companies, TSKJ (Technip of France, Snamprogetti of Italy, Kellogg of the UK (but owned by Halliburton of the US), and JGC of Japan) was chosen to build the first “trains” (that’s the name of each individual liquefaction facility)….
Our corruption story begins in 1994, as summarised in this MSNBC story form last year…
And, lo and behold, MSNBC had quite a tale to tell:
The Justice Department has opened up an inquiry into whether Halliburton Co. was involved in the payment of $180 million in possible kickbacks to obtain contracts to build a natural gas plant in Nigeria during a period in the late 1990’s when Vice President Dick Cheney was chairman of the company, Newsweek has learned.
There is no evidence that Cheney was aware of the payments in question and an aide said today the vice president has not been contacted about the probe….
The investigation could raise sensitive political questions for the Justice Department because–unlike Pentagon probes now underway into Halliburton’s Iraq contracts–the Nigerian matter specifically involves corporate conduct during the period between 1995 and 2000 when Cheney was chairman and chief executive officer of the company.
The entire article is well-worth reading, as it involves a parallel French investigation, and a dispute as to how influential Halliburton really was in the TSKJ consortium. Now, no one has directly accused VP Cheney of specific wrong-doing, but the French investigators were apparently thinking of bringing indictments against Cheney as late as December 2003. From the Le Figaro article, quoted in globalpolicy.org:
According to projections of the case, he could be charged with “eventual complicity in supplying the means or the orders or the reception (of stolen goods)”, for the misappropriation of public property. If such a prospect is not on the agenda, it is possible since the opening of the judicial inquiry October 8 for “the bribery of foreign public officials and misappropriation of public property” targeting the American company Kellogg Brown and Root (KBR) which is the principal subsidiary of Halliburton, known for having obtained more than 2 billion dollars worth of Iraq reconstruction contracts from the American government and over which Richard Cheney presided as CEO from 1995 to 2000. Concretely, Judge Renaud Van Ruymbeke is trying to identify the beneficiaries of 180 millions dollars of commissions paid during the bidding for a gas complex construction contract in Nigeria for an amount estimated at 6 billion dollars or three times that of Iraq….
In June 2004, the U.S. SEC opened an investigation into the Kellog Brown Root/Nigeria bribery case. LA Weekly reported on the status of a Justice Department investigation into the matter:
A Department of Justice inquiry into the slush fund quietly begun earlier this year under the Foreign Corrupt Practices Act has gone nowhere — partly because it has limited itself only to asking Halliburton for documents, partly because the national press has shown almost no real interest in the story (if it did, the pressure on Justice to move more aggressively would be enormous). And obvious conflict-of-interest questions must be raised about any investigation of a company formerly run by Cheney that is controlled by Cheney’s political pal John Ashcroft.