Crooks and Liars has a great clip up from the Senate hearings in 1971 when Nixon wanted to cut the funding for the Corporation for Public Broadcasting in half and Fred Rogers made an impassioned plea that won over his listeners. It really stands as a great example of what we were talking about in the discussion of Rick Perlstein’s Before the Storm last week — a wonderful expression about an appropriate place for government to be involved, for society to be investing in the education, mental health and yes the much-vaunted "values" of the nation’s children. I urge everyone to listen to it, it will give you goosebumps.
I’ve been reading Eric Boehlert’s book Lapdogs and one of the stories he puts together so well is that of Bush crony Kenneth Tomlinson’s steadfast attempts to dismantle and politicize the CPB. Tomlinson was adamant that PBS was crawling with liberal bias, and his own emails to Paul Gigot indicated he felt the need for "our side" to get more air time. He told Gigot that, "I deeply appreciate all that you will be doing. I jut want to win!"
But no data supported Tomlinson’s allegations. Most people associated PBS with educational, scientific and historical programming; only 6% said that the last program they watched was a news show.
Says Boehlert:
For Tomlinson and administration aides who privately cheered him on, the most obvious obstacle to his public crusade against PBS’s alleged liberal bias was the polling Tomlinson’s CPB paid for in 2002 and 2003. Conducted jointly by respeted Republican and Democratic firms that contacted 1,008 randomly selected participants from across the country, the polls showed not only that Americans held public broadcasting in extremely high regard, but the surveys also showed conclusively that the vast majority of Americans — both regular public broadcasting consumers as well as those who only occasionally sampled the programming — agreed the network did not have a problem with liberal tilt.
[]
The poll results made a farce out of Tomlinson’s pronouncement about PBS nd NPR, undercutting any momentum he hoped to create in moving public broadcasting to the right. To combat that problem Tomlinson simply ignored the polling data, paid no attention to requests from his CPB embers who wanted the results widely promoted to the public, and when word of the results did get out Tomlinson did his best to denigrate the data.
Tomlinson sat back and put up no fight when Congress tried to slash the funding for public broadcasting, despite the fact that he claimed he needed to fix the "liberal bias" in order to prevent such cuts:
In the end, the full Congress, by a vote of 284 to 140, agreed to restore the deep cuts to public broadcasting, which accurately reflected the wishes of most Americans; CPB’s own polling showed that just 10 percent of Americans thought the federal government was spending "too much" on public broadcasting. A separate 2005 Roper poll found that Americans believed PBS provided the second best use of tax dollars; only military defense was a better use of tax dollars.
I mentioned in the Before the Storm discussion that the extremists of the GOP have taken everybody’s experience standing in line at the DMV and extrapolated it to conclude that all government is bureaucratic, incompetent and does nothing that private industry cannot do better. It’s the reasoning that makes Grover Norquist’s call for bathtub drowning sound good to people who aren’t thinking very deeply, or even at all. One of the things that progressives must do is define the appropriate place for government in our lives, and I would argue that this should include protecting and promoting the public good of its citizenry, and staying out of their private decisions.
Fred Rogers makes a very direct and compelling case for public funding of children’s shows and it serves as a great model for progressives/liberals as we try to learn how to clearly state what we believe in, what our "values" are and what we think the role of government should be.
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Fitz!!!!!!!!
Mr. Rogers, RIP most sincerely.
“…the extremists of the GOP have taken everybody’s experience standing in line at the DMV and extrapolated it to conclude that all government is bureaucratic, incompetent and does nothing that private industry cannot do better.”
Yes-indeedy, and next time I’m stuck on the phone pressing numbers in response to recorded queries, I’ll just keep thinking about what a great job private industry always does on customer service.
What’s with ABC, Enemy of the State…NSA nice…whatch it…Smith and Voigt
watching it, Harry and liking it the 2nd time as much as the first; maybe they’ll do Minority Report next weekend or on Memorial Day…
Though the goosebumps and alarm bells this time round are very real. ;(
I am just back from C & L and the three of us home this week end watched Mr. Rogers’ testimony together – big lumps in throats all around – could there be a better epitaph than
“what a decent human being ” ?
Fred Rogers modeled a lot of good behavior that we might take note of. It’s easy to mock “Mr. Rogers’ Neighborhood” but his call to treat the world as a bunch of neighbors sounds downright . . . well, progressive. :-)
Fess up, folks: how many of you learned respect for others from Mr. Rogers and his friends?
I surely did, Peterr. It supported everything that I was taught at home.
Aw fucking hell. Mr Rogers just made me cry like a baby. That was amazing.
But think about it — what Tomlinson said: “PBS was crawling with liberal bias.” Does it use only facts? No BS? No lies (example: global warming)?
Bingo! If all is truthful, it IS “liberal bias” to them.
He was frantic to get the GOP lies out there even more.
Just last nite I was ragging on Tomlinson– hateful wingnut crony pork barrel politico.
“I just want to win”
Because you know, politics is just like a basketball game or a racketball match, except instead of losing, people die.
It’s a very moving clip. The GOP want to “own” values but what they really want to do is see liberal boogeymen behind every tree and use it as an excuse to steal more. There is no good governance here, no desire for public service — just the notion that all government is bad, all deregulation is good, and the “free market” is the best possible arbiter of any situation. It’s bunk, and we need to learn to speak about what we believe in like Fred Rogers did.
Fred Tomlinson: Capybara.
Fred Rogers: Mensch.
Pat Mitchell was pretty good in her last Press Club speech wrt Tomlinson. And nobody nailed him better than Moyers!
>>>>>>
Someone has said recently that the great raucous mob that is democracy is rarely heard and that it’s not just the fault of the current residents of the White House and the capital. There’s too great a chasm between those of us in this business and those who depend on TV and radio as their window to the world. We treat them too much as an audience and not enough as citizens. They’re invited to look through the window but too infrequently to come through the door and to participate, to make public broadcasting truly public.”
To that end, five public interest groups including Common Cause and Consumers Union will be holding informational sessions around the country to “take public broadcasting back” – to take it back from threats, from interference, from those who would tell us we can only think what they command us to think.
It’s a worthy goal.
We’re big kids; we can handle controversy and diversity, whether it’s political or religious points of view or two loving lesbian moms and their kids, visited by a cartoon rabbit. We are not too fragile or insecure to see America and the world entire for all their magnificent and sometimes violent confusion. “There used to be a thing or a commodity we put great store by,” John Steinbeck wrote. “It was called the people.”
http://www.freepress.net/news/8120
Er, Ken.
prostratedragon, I think you may have grievously insulted a noble South American rodent
President Bush’s job approval rating has fallen, and his personal favorability is down significantly as well, leading many Republicans to worry about the impact a weakened president will have on his party’s showing in the fall mid-term elections. Even among one of the president’s most supportive constituencies, white evangelical Protestants, Mr. Bush has suffered declines. Given the importance of evangelicals for the electoral successes of the Republican Party over the past several years, how serious is Bush’s slump among this key voter group for the party’s prospects this fall?
A new analysis by the Pew Research Center finds that while the president still has the support of a majority of white evangelical Protestants, significantly fewer of them now approve of his performance in office (55% approve, 38% disapprove) than was true at the start of his second term when 72% approved and only 22% disapproved
(interesting tidbit from Pew)
(
rwcole-
Interesting. Did the Pew report indicate what percentage = white evangelical Protestants in whoever they sampled?
It’s a wonderful day in the blogosphere . . .
I think our Congress is different enough these days that, to win them over, instead of someone showing up with Mr. Roger’s passion and intelligence, they would need to show up with the handpuppets.
*s*
Tomlinson may have been right. It is well known that science and history have a liberal bias, especially science. I mean, we can’t have our young people exposed to science, for crying out loud. They might start to believe in evolution, or that the earth revolves around the sun, or some other such heresy.
The partisan lunacy of these people (Tomlinson) knows no bounds or sense of decency. Maybe it takes the very decent Mr. Rogrers to make that plain.
I was at the Maryland DMV (they call it MVA) in Waldorf yesterday. It always entails waiting because of so many people, but it gave me time to marvel at the considerable intelligence and efficiency of the whole setup. Good job, MD! And I’d like to see Hell-Mart or Cheneyburton or Wackenhut do better for the same money. The repuke privatization-always-better mantra is such bullshit snake oil.
prostratedragon, how about “Kenneth Tomlinson: lamprey on the arse of the body politic”
Valley- yes- here’s some of the verbiage:
The rising political clout of evangelical Christians is not the result of growth in their numbers but rather of their increasing cohesiveness as a key element of the Republican Party. The proportion of the population composed of white evangelicals has changed very little (19% in 1987; 22% now) and what growth there was occurred in the late 1980s and early 1990s.
However, in 1987, white evangelical Protestants were closely divided in their partisan attachments, with 34% identifying as Republicans and 29% as Democrats. The shift toward Republican identification among white evangelicals came in two stages. In the late 1980s, white evangelicals in the South were still mostly wedded to the Democratic Party while evangelicals outside the South were more aligned with the GOP. But over the course of the next decade or so, the GOP made gains among white Southerners generally – and evangelicals in particular – nearly eliminating this regional disparity. Since the election of George W. Bush in 2000, Republican identification has grown among both Southern and non-Southern evangelicals.
Today, Republicans outnumber Democrats among white evangelicals by more than two-to-one (51%-22%), and hold a 63%-29% lead when partisan “leaners” are included. Although Republican Party identification among both evangelicals and non-evangelicals increased slightly following the September 11 attacks, it has since retreated to pre-9/11 levels for non-evangelicals. Among evangelicals, it has continued to rise. Today, white evangelicals make up 22% of the population, and constitute nearly four out of every ten (39%) Republicans.
Amen, Morris Sheppard (21)!
On my last visit to the DMV, I took a number and sat down. My number was called within 30 seconds, and I was out of there in less than 5 minutes.
Truth has a Liberal Bias . . .
I will go listen to Fred in a minute, my 24 year old can still remember certain favorite programs. I loved those years, my kids would be so still when they watched his program and so very calm afterward. Sesame Street was like Disneyworld compared to Fred’s comfortable little home and his peaceful, simple friends.
Tomlinson was doing his best Cheney imitation during his time at NPR and I’m glad he was so publicly humiliated. There were casualties as we mentioned last night, but I hope for better things to come from them as we move into the elections. They are definitely weaker now.
Wonderful posts today, I just read up but had to skim the comments. Very late, but I sent my little donation to Tester, he sounds like my kind of guy, really walking the “live and let live” talk. Many thanks to Howie.
The one thing I see coming out of all the Jefferson papers insanity is that already cynical americans will see all this as stupid political posturing by Abu, Hastert and Bush, a real CYA moment if ever I saw one, and I hope others do, too. Just think of the “papers” Abramoff can direct them to.
…and democrats should point out those things the government should not do. Too often are progressives labeled as “big government” liberals. Regulate the “reproductive” factory but deregulate Sago and Halliburton. Darwin has no place being taught in school but social Darwinism in business should be revered as the prophet of the burning bush. And the dems aren’t clear?
I mentioned in the Before the Storm discussion that the extremists of the GOP have taken everybody’s experience standing in line at the DMV and extrapolated it to conclude that all government is bureaucratic, incompetent and does nothing that private industry cannot do better.
I’ve spent a good deal of time working for both large corporations and, indirectly, the federal government. Based on that experience, any assertion that government is necessarily less efficient than a large corporation is hooey. There are plenty of shirkers and malingerers in both, and they aren’t all the guys at the bottom of the chain, either.
In fact, I see the continued privatization of the federal government as a dangerous trend. It’s made it difficult for technically minded people to stay with the government – nowadays nearly all the engineers and scientists doing technical work for the DoD are contractors. What the civil servants have become is contract managers, and since they aren’t practicing engineers or scientists themselves, they are often unable to understand the technical issues involved.
I could go on, but I need to go. In short, I agre with Jane on this one. It’s foolish in the extreme to assume that a gevernment agency is necessarily less efficient than a corporate one. It really depends on the people, the structure of the organizations, and the mission or goals.
And, this is what I first thought of when I saw the photo of Mr. Rogers… so evocative. He looks a lot like Mr. Smith, in Mr. Smith Goes to Washington. sigh.
http://i8.photobucket.com/albu…..l48/Mr.jpg
http://i8.photobucket.com/albu…..smith2.jpg
If anyone tells you that private enterprise can always do it better, just say, “Healthcare.” Medicare the government program is the only thing that is keeping American healthcare from going completely off the rails. The private side of it is an unmitigated disaster. Other stellar performances include Enron, the oil companies with their $400 million dollar pay packages, the foundering car companies, and the deregulation of the airline industry.
For my part, I always thought that NPR and PBS should be fully funded by the federal government (none of this fundraiser stuff). They are two of the best and wisest investments the government ever made and it would cost about one or two days what we are wasting in Iraq.
prostratedragon (14) — You know, I can’t agree with your comment about Tomlinson.
Should have been:
Fred Tomlinson = chupacabra
I’m plenty okay with the comparison of Fred Rogers, though. Exactemente.
I wanna join in the St. Fred verklemptitude…dang dialup :(
BTW, if anybody remembers cool historical TV moments like this let John Amato (C&L) know, he’s got access to a lot of this stuff now.
ck (26) — I wouldn’t have had to physically visit the DMV except for my stubborn streak, resist doing my annual auto registrations over the internet on a timely basis, always end up in the DMV on my birthday. For the last 3 years it’s taken me less than 10 minutes in and out. It’d be a minute, tops, if I simply remembered to do the registration when I get the renewal form in the mail a month before my birthday.
It’s not the fault of government that it sucks; it’s the people, of, by and for that make it suck when it does. I don’t know how and where we ever came to a cultural agreement that the government was somehow separate from the people. Of, by and for the people…how did we forget?
ot but …
Info Clearing House provides this link to view Baghdad ER for those without HBO
http://www.informationclearing…..e13192.htm
Hey Jane, this isn’t exactly a cool historical moment, but the TV clip engraved on my young brain at the time was Kruschev pounding his shoe on the podium. That was a scary historical moment for a young person. Sorry, that’s what first came to mind for me in my TV watching history.
For me it’s truth, truth, and more truth with supportable facts, and bibliography where necessary, that will carry the day for progressive-liberals. Along with compassion for children and the downtrodden. Fred Rogers reminds me of Jimmy Carter. And Jimmy Carter reminds me of Fred Rogers. Both men spoke, and speak the truth. And both men are, and where, absent a malicious or selfish bone in their bodies. I miss Fred Rogers. I wish we could all live in “his neighborhood”.
A moment on television that I remember is this one (well before American Theocracy came out):
11/5/04 Kevin Phillips on NOW with Bill Moyers reviewing the 2004 Presidential election
“Well, the worst thing to me is we’ve had so many second rate choices really, for the last 30 or 40 years relentlessly. It seems that that’s likely to be true in the future, too. I don’t see what changes it. I don’t have any sense that the average person sees a whole lot of hope for politics. And as a result, the turnout among young people, the people expected in this last election, didn’t materialize. I would hope that something would really engage ordinary Americans, not just those who are mobilized by churches and that was a very large percent of the mobilization this time, I don’t know what’s going to produce that.
I think the United States is really in some respects, on the sort of downhill slope that the great economic powers of the world get when they’ve got this division between rich and poor, when they’re overextended globally, when they’re building up debt. I mean, this has happened many times before. It seems like it’s where we are. And I don’t expect politics to address that honestly. I don’t expect the people to be mobilized in a serious across the board way. And frankly, that makes me very concerned about where it’s all going. So I’d like to be proven wrong in the next four years.”
When my kids were very little, we watched Mr. Rogers every day (sometimes twice a day). It was the only TV show we watched and, no matter what he was talking about, it always seemed to be relevant to the events of the day. The kids and I would constantly burst into Mr. Rogers’ songs to illustrate our feelings. What a lovely memory and what a lovely man.
An a somber note, the death toll in Indonesia is more than 3000 with more than 10,000 injured.
Will Bush declare war on the planet now?
This is planetary terrorism, isn’t it?
If he would shut down Iraq, we might have a check to send to help the people lying in the streets and buried under the demolished ancient architecture. YOu know he will make some lame speech and send a couple of helicopters, promising bazillions of dollars in relief, but he hasn’t even lived up to his promises to his own citizens in NOLA.
And prepare yourselves for the TOP NEWS STORY tomorrow:
Brangelina had a girl, they’re naming her Cheetah..
I didn’t know what DMV was til Rayne talked. I also never mail in my license and reg. renewal and I never have any trouble in line and the people are always helpful and polite. Just like the folks at the Post Office. I love the feds. Just not the DC feds.
I loved Fred Rogers when I was three, and started watching him again when my daughter was that age. The first show we saw, I burst into tears. Imagine–the idea that we all have value!
What a perfectly vulnerable and loving man. Peace be upon him.
Let’s remember why Republicans are in government in the first place: to ease the way for their corporate buddies and benefactors to make disgustingly large sums of money for themselves and their stockholders, regardless of whether the policies they institute in that endeavor result in an overall good for the people and for the economy.
It seems to me that the best thing Republicans could do to improve government would be to get out of it altogether.
The DMV? Good grief, try the whining about lines at the Postal Service.
My God, the stories I can tell about how absolutely, mind-bogglingly STUPID the people in those lines are.
“We should care because the issues raised by a policy of cruelty are too fundamental to be left unaddressed, unanswered or ambiguous. We should care because a tolerance of cruelty will corrode our values and our rights and degrade the world in which we live. It will corrupt our heritage, cheapen the valor of the soldiers upon whose past and present sacrifices our freedoms depend, and debase the legacy we will leave to our sons and daughters. We should care because it is intolerable to us that anyone should believe for a second that our nation is tolerant of cruelty. And we should care because each of us knows that this issue has not gone away.”
Alberto Mora in tomorrow’s WaPo
prostratedragon, I think you may have grievously insulted a noble South American rodent.
Aha! The capybara faction has been heard from! (Sorry gang, had to step away for a moment.) Noble rodent indeed it may be, but would you want one running your national broadcasting system?
Actually, it just came to me one day while Tomlinson was still in office, that this badministration finds the blandest no-counts alive for so many of its posts. Bland like—well, Ken here is too big and baritone to be compared to a guinea pig, but sort of a big one. Oh yes, a capybara! Then when I noticed what little cavies Gonzales, Jackson, that fellow who just brown-nosed his way into Harvard, and the like are, I thought maybe there was something to it as an indicator.
(Lampreys. Yucky.)
Man, Jane…you are my biggest hero. As a Canadian, I’ve been despairing for the last three years, and all of sudden, I love Americans again, thanks to you.
My kids always thought Mr. Rogers was a dick. They liked Captain Kangaroo though.
Matt Bai’s article on YearlyKos
I’ve been looking for that clip for a while. First saw it on special about Mr. Rogers after his passing.
An amazing human being.
LOL, Mary at 20.
I would very much like to see Michael J. Fox’s testimony for the Senate Judiciary Cmte. replayed. Chris Reeve could not be there, but his letter was read by Michael and Frist is obstructing this being brought up because he has to worry about gay marriage… Doktor indeed.
>>>>>>>>>>>
Stem cell research could also help those with spinal cord injuries. My friend Christopher Reeve sends his regrets that he couldn’t be here today to emphasize the urgency that we both feel. His testimony has been submitted for the record, but I’d like to share a few of his words with you now.
“Since its inception, a fundamental principle of our government has been to respond to the needs of people. Now a major scientific breakthrough has given us the opportunity to uphold another principle of our government to do the greatest good for the greatest number of people. I’m referring, of course, to the recent discovery of the miraculous potential of stem cells.
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRA…..se.03.html
rwcole- sometimes you say just the very wrong thing at the very wrong time.
Valley- Yeah- history of my life- but I couldn’t help but remember my two sittin in front of the TeeVee makin fun of ol Mr. Rogers.
I (childless) was a Capt. Kangaroo kid growing up. Mr. Rogers seemed a little quiet to me—do you sense a pattern here?—but as I’ve tried to grow up I’ve come to appreciate genuine quietness and gentleness like Mr. Rogers’. Of course I always recognized that his values accorded with those in our house, as someone upthread also said.
Chupacabra. Hmmm, I saw that X-Files episode. Could be, but the critter has to be able to cloak itself in a seemingly nice, bland, pet-rodent-like exterior to get what I had in mind—and then turn out to be something that just wants to gnaw at you.
My older daughter used to drool through Mr. Rogers and then take her nap. In between these several shows, Sesame St., Electronic Company, and one I can’t remember that had stuffed animals sitting in chairs, a commercial for LDS would run: A mother running beside a child on a bicycle. The song lyric was: “Mom, you failed your Masters Degree, but Mom, you never failed me!” My kids used to yell for me to come in the room then so I could yell at the t.v. At the time I was studying for my own M.A. and would turn the t.v. off if I heard that tune.
Remember the two old guys in the balcony at the start of the Muppets? They sang, “Why do we always come here? I think I’ll never know. It’s like a kind of torture to have to watch the show!”
I feel that way about the Jefferson theatre.
The most shocking fact about public TV in America is that there is none. The annual public production subsidy PBS gets is less than NBC spends in one hour.
We are on a mission to make the most public show on TV by deconstructing TV commercials. Jane and Redd have a standing invitation to appear with us. The creators of THE SIMPSONS and THE DAILY SHOW appear with us, Jane & Redd should too.
Fox news caused the war. Public TV could have prevented it – if it existed.
and, hey rw, I hope you’ve been reading the recent news re: Lamont. He is shaking up things, big time. Are you finally gonna support the guy?
BTW, if anybody remembers cool historical TV moments like this let John Amato (C&L) know, he’s got access to a lot of this stuff now.
Here’s what I’d love to see once more:
The Gore Vidal vs. William F. Buckley knock-down, drag-out fights, uh, I mean debates during the 1968 Democratic Convention.
Spectacular fireworks! Buckley lost it completely one night, thought he was gonna try to punch out Vidal.
They took place every night of the convention, IIRC.
Now that was teevee! Real debating over real issues, by two people who were masters of the language and displayed their full range without dumbing it down.
Sigh.
Jane — SO VERY happy about Kobe! Please say a prayer or light a candle for our little canine girl — surgery on Tuesday to remove cancer (and pull a broken tooth). Thanks!
And thanks for all you and Redd do.
prostratedragon –
Me too on Captain Kangaroo (and Mr. Greenjeans, Grandfather Clock, Mr. Moose and my fave, the irrepressible Bunny Rabbit [who forever managed to pull off the falling ping-pong ball trick, to the Captain’s annoyance]).
Ah…good times. :-)
And best served up with a chaser of The Bullwinkle Show.
VG, Hi, there. I laughed out loud at rwcole’s post. I didn’t take it seriously–it was a funny break in the thread. Not unlike punaise’s jokes sometimes within a serious thread. One of the funniest I remember was in a Sunday morning bird watch thread. rwcole remarked that in his neighborhood there were some “large black-colored birds and some small brown-colored birds. And a pigeon.”
As someone who regularly watches public TV, and whose kids watched Mr. Rogers and Sesame Street, The Magic School Bus and Marty Stouffer’s Wild America (my girls used to make “beards” out of shampoo bubbles in the tub, and imitate him – still makes me laugh when I think about that!), I remember when the only “commercials” were the “this program is provided by gifts from the John D. and Catherine D. MacArthur Foundation” tags; now it’s Toyota and others with tasteful, but clearly still, commercials.
prostratedragon –
Me too! Captain Kangaroo, all the way. Along with Mr. Greenjeans, Grandfather Clock, Mr. Moose, and my fave, the irrepressible Bunny Rabbit — who always managed to pull off the big ping-pong ball drop, much to the Captain’s annoyance.
Ah, good times.
And served up wonderfully in our house with a big chaser of The Bullwinkle Show.
Valley– I’m not supporting anyone in any primaries. Savin it for the general election. If Ned’s running then- you can bet I’ll support him- and he may need it- recent poll shows Ol Joe killin him runnin as an independent.
I AM of course supporting Busby in her congressional race- but that’s not a primary- it’s the real deal.
Great clip from the days when we had human beings in congress.
Hi Dana! Now THAT was a funny line from rwcole. But, he doesn’t have the same “funny” legacy as punaise. rw- you gotta work more on the “funny” xxoo
On my end, this blog software is acting up a bit. I tried to post, and my comment at first went poof! Now it looks like I may have double-posted, and if I did, mea culpa!
And best served up with a chaser of The Bullwinkle Show.
Da-da-da-da-a-a-h dah!
Da-da-da-da-a-a-h dah!
Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-dah dah da-da!
Da-da-da-da-a-a-h dah!
Da-da-da-da-a-a-h dah!
Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-dah dah da-da!
Da-da! Da-da! Da-da!
(And so off again for a while.)
It made me cry. What a unique and special human being.
The Catholic church is rushing to make John Paul a saint.
Seems to me we just heard one…
Mrs. K8 — best wishes for your little girl. That’s an EXCELLENT suggestion on Vidal/Buckley. I’ll let John know.
I think I have an old Esquire somewhere covering that…I’ll dig it out.
prostrate –
LOL!!!
Somewhere a long while ago I found a website devoted to teevee theme songs, and downloaded that so I could play it whenever life was getting me really down.
I was too old for Mister Rogers by the time I lived in a place with public TV, so my memory of him is from the parent’s perspective.
For a while, I was a stay-at-home Mom, and his show was one of the few that I would let my child watch on TV. Mr. R spoke calmly, he didn’t have flashy special effects and all those hideous clashing colors or loud music. And he taught kids so many valuable lessons, like how neat the world around them could be (hell, I would sit there in fascination when he would show how crayons were made!), and how wonderful people were. It was one of those programs where you could take what he talked about one day, and talk about it some more with your child after the show was over, or when something arose, or remind him, let’s put away our clothes, that’s what Mr. Rogers always does, remember?
It was ironic that our local station ran a series about the little prince guy being upset with his parents’ fighting at the same time that my marriage was imploding. Mr. Rogers helped the LJ spawn understand that people weren’t necessarily mad at each other over him, that people do fight, yes, it’s scary, it’s okay if you wish it would stop, it doesn’t mean they don’t love you anymore & etc. He did it in a way that I wasn’t prepared to, and that I was a bit too upset to do rationally, besides.
It just blew my mind when religious freaks here in Texas would talk about Mr. Rogers possibly being a “commie.” It was so telling that they could think that of him just because he was a decent human being and used a light touch in trying to help our little ones become decent human beings, too, rather than scaring them into obedience with fire and brimstone.
Mrs. K8,
the Vidal/Buckley smackdown is an excellent suggestion
wonder if there’s a copy of the Paul Krassner/Al Capp smackdown somewhere -
am lovin’ this YouTube technology ((very easy for us technically challenged types) just got back from there – listening to Aretha live – w/ Memphis Horns and Duane Allman in the band – good god I love the internets !
Captain Kangaroo and Sesame Street were more entertaining on a superficial level–fast and silly and got kids wired. But Mr. Rogers really talked straight to kids. You had to slow down and listen to appreciate how wonderful the show was. Unfortunately, most kids shows, including Sesame Street, make kids hyper and teach them to be consumers. Mr. Rogers taught them to like themselves and care about others.
Mrs. K8…
William F. Buckley vs. Gore Vidal in ‘68. Now that was a treat! Far and away superior to the blather and drivel we get these days. I used to watch “Firing Line” too on PBS channel 9 out of San Francisco like an addict needing a fix. Those were truly ‘the days’. Smart days.
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http://www.freewayblogger.com/
http://kommandos.blogspot.com/
VG, *g* I’ll just say each one’s humor has its own special character.
“One of the things that progressives must do is define the appropriate place for government in our lives, and I would argue that this should include protecting and promoting the public good of its citizenry, and staying out of their private decisions. “
1. Yep, I agree. I think this quote sums it up well.
2. Maybe the “R” team considers Public TV as liberal is due to the fact that it FAILS to put forward all their values agenda stuff…thus, “they’re liberal!”
3. And maybe they focus too much on Bill Moyers…but I think he’s one of the best reporters in the business. He asks intelligent questions…maybe the R team can’t handle that. Moyers, by the way, would be excellant to run Meet The Press.
4. As to old videos…..a) the speech by…?…before the UN during the Cuban Missile Crisis where he presented the photos b) speaking of Meet The Press, perhaps some old Lawrence Spivak shows, and c) I’ve seen a few clips somewhere, but long ago in the EARLY days of 60 minutes they used to have a “point-counterpoint” thing with Adela Rogers St. Johns…some of those might be interesting.
Ghostman
Thanks Jane!
I was just a kid when that was on, but I remember clearly how my big sister and my parents urged me to stop playing, come in the house, and sit down and watch the debates.
Just the other night we were watching Good Night and Good Luck. Great stuff — one of the things that really got me (and there were many notable moments in the film) was the “Kent” commercial, the cigarette company having been one of Murrow’s sponsors.
It was pure deceptive crap, of course, but the interesting thing about that particular crap was the way it played up to the viewers of Murrow’s show as being intelligent and well-read and intellectually curious.
Imagine that. I’m old enough to remember a world where “smart people” didn’t apologize for being smart, and where mostly everyone WANTED to be smart. It was a virtue, something you looked up to.
Can we bring that back somehow?
Dana- one of my all time favorites for that special sense of wit– Emma– JA, as I’m sure you know. Oh, extended wit. Very extended wit.
Seems that some Marines got to feelin their oats in Iraq and gunned down some momma’s and kids. Now come on guys- boys will be boys- but really now- you really should- well- chill out a little. This could cost you your stripes.
OK now- everyone just settle down- let’s not get upset with who killed who’s auntie. We’ve got a serious war ta fight here.
Mrs K8, sending good wishes for the katgal (I have one of those and a boy too).
As a kid I recall liking the Schoolhouse Rock things. And I learned something about “I’m just a bill…on Capitol Hill”
Do those still run?
Mrs. K8 (62) — Ah. Bullwinkle. You know, that’s the second time this week I’ve thought about that show. I told my kids they have missed some really great comedy in old cartoons, not this crap that passes for kids’ shows these days. The stuff that’s produced today is so politically sanitized as to be fluff; Bullwinkle, though, was loaded with political commentary, even if it was a constant bashing of communism. My kids also missed shows like Laugh-In; the closest thing to that doesn’t appear on the major networks, only on the Comedy Channel or SNL on NBC, and only after my kids have gone to bed. What a shame.
Heck, Nixon was hipper than Dubya, could even poke fun at himself with “Sock it to me”. (Probably got Nixon reelected, too.)
Ah, and the Jetsons and the Flintstones, too; they were rife with anti-corporatist humor. Kids today are so deprived.
Sharon
go over to YouTube and type it in – Voila !
(you can also find the Family Guy parody)
hey Tom @ 77
let’s just say I know someone inspired by the freeway blogger site and her Chimpeach! sign stayed up for almost a week – her family knew immediately who the um, blogger was
Sharon –
Thank you! [Although the “katgal” is a pupster…but my best greetings and regards to ALL of our furballs out there, feline as well as canine. They steal our hearts, but make life sweet, don’t they?]
Off to make dinner, but will check back later to see if anybody has any bright ideas on making being smart and informed “cool” and “sexy” again.
There’s gotta be a way. And since we’re smart — we should be able to figure it out, eh? ;-)
Rayne,
“Kids today are so deprived.”
check out Fairly Odd Parents, (Joe Biden is Chet Youbetcha)
Rayne –
Before I skedaddle, just want to mention that several years ago I bought several Bullwinkle videotapes (they were on display at a CVS pharmacy, and I couldn’t resist).
My guess is that they might be on DVD now! Woo hoo, now that’s an idea as a present for someone….
Does anybody know when Mr. Rogers started on national TV? I never watched him when I was a little kid (we watched Captain Kangaroo). I was first introduced to him in my high school biology class, when the teacher (very progressive)used a Mr. Rogers record album to provide sex education to 10th graders.
cbl — good suggestion, I’ll send it to the C&L bat cave.
George Bush Speaks Spanish.
Stephen Colbert was not funny.
Helen Thomas is old and batty.
Mexicans are taking our jobs.
Iraq sent its WMDs to Syria.
Democrats don’t want to wiretap terrorists.
Joe Wilson admitted that Valerie Plame wasn’t covert.
Karl Rove has a faulty memory.
Scooter Libby has a faulty memory.
Tom DeLay is like Jesus Christ.
No one could have anticipated that the levees would be breached.
We do not torture.
There is no global warming.
There is global warming, but humans didn’t cause it.
John F. Kerry is a flip-flopper.
George W. Bush is a decider.
John McCain is a straight-shooter.
Dick Cheney is a sober shooter.
Nobody at the White House knows Jack Abramoff.
The economy is great.
Evolution isn’t supported by the facts.
We’ve turned a corner in Iraq.
There’s a war on Christmas.
There’s a war on Easter.
There’s no civil war in Iraq.
Up is down.
Black is white.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/5/2/11532/98245
Mrs. K8, yep, you wrote canine, and I saw feline. Totally freudian but I DO love the doggies too, and always feel that much worse for the animals since they can’t talk to express just where it hurts.
cbl, thanks for the info.
Thanks for linking to the Fred Rogers clip. It gave me the second chance in one day to be proud to be an American.
The first occurred when Garrison Keillor led his audience in singing The Star Spangled Banner on Prairie Home Companion.
It was nostalgic and a bit sad to see Senator Pastore leading a hearing that actually investigated an issue, rather than the current practise of posturing and rubber stamping. Fred Rogers gave a clear and honest defense of a program in jeopardy. His success was all the more heartwarming because it was not assured by some crony agreement.
That clip, and the national anthem being sung by people who could only be described as progressives and liberals, gave proof to me that the republicans do not have a monopoly on love of country, or morality, or values. However much they would like everyone to think so.
NEWSWEAK: WILL YOUR VOTE COUNT IN 06?
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12888600/site/newsweek
May 29, 2006 issue – Just when you thought it was safe to go back into the voting booth, here comes more disturbing news about the trustworthiness of electronic touchscreen ballot machines. Earlier this month a report by Finnish security expert Harri Hursti analyzed Diebold voting machines for an organization called Black Box Voting. Hursti found unheralded vulnerabilities in the machines that are currently entrusted to faithfully record the votes of millions of Americans.
==moderator deleted bad link===
How bad are the problems? Experts are calling them the most serious voting-machine flaws ever documented. Basically the trouble stems from the ease with which the machine’s software can be altered. It requires only a few minutes of pre-election access to a Diebold machine to open the machine and insert a PC card that, if it contained malicious code, could reprogram the machine to give control to the violator. The machine could go dead on Election Day or throw votes to the wrong candidate. Worse, it’s even possible for such ballot-tampering software to trick authorized technicians into thinking that everything is working fine, an illusion you couldn’t pull off with pre-electronic systems. “If Diebold had set out to build a system as insecure as they possibly could, this would be it,” says Avi Rubin, a Johns Hopkins University computer-science professor and elections-security expert.
I sang along with PHC, lump in throat and all off key, jarotra.
So many decades later and still there are real Nazis and real fascists being called ‘ crypto-fascists’ or ‘ neo-Nazi’s’.
People please wake-the-fuck-up!
If it goosesteps like a Nazi, salutes like a Nazi and dresses and talks like a Nazi then it’s way past time we called a spade a bloody shovel.
‘ Fascism is as fascism does ‘
Paul Gigot’s name takes me back – he was on ‘ The Lehrer report’ before David ‘ babbling’ Brooks. My mom sort of looked at me once like , why aren’t you smiling at Mark Shields – he’s the goody! I just said , yeah but Gigot makes me laugh. All these freeping goopers do when they are campaigning – it’s like watching Lucy steal the football this thing they have with the ‘ smaller government’ meme.
Dems fall over everytime.
wow…go Mr Rogers! in late, no time to read, love,love, love you Jane. One of Mr, Rogers handknit sweaters is in the Smithsonian zip and all. Orange one when I was there.
The clip of Frank Zappa on Crossfire in 1986 laying a smackdown on Novakula that C&L had a couple of months ago was great. Anyone remember that one?
Ghostman
If I recall correctly, you are thinking of Adlai Stevenson at the UN doing the Cuban Missle Crisis thing. He was Kennedy’s U.S. Ambassador to the U.N.
#99…bingo. That’s it.
Ghostman
tom, I am shocked, SHOCKED that that’s in the Corporate Controlled Crappy Media (CCCM)
And awed too!
Cool.
Troll
Email: glare@gmail.com
IP: 17.255.241.178
OrgName: Apple Computer, Inc.
OrgID: APPLEC-3
Address: 20740 Valley Green Drive, MS32E
City: Cupertino
StateProv: CA
PostalCode: 95014
Country: US
cbl (86) — nuts, I’ve missed Chet YouBetcha, will have to ask the kids to point him out if Nick replays older FOP’s.
The more obvious political statement in FOP is Jorgen von Strangle — the character a mockery of Schwarzenegger — but the kids don’t get it, don’t see much of Schwarzenegger’s movies or his political work (we’re in the midwest, far away from Arnold’s reach, thank goodness).
Back to the topic at hand: I’m still trying to figure out what the hell Tomlinson thought was so damned liberal about Victory Garden or This Old House, or Great Performances…maybe he was twinked about Frontline, but hey, suck it up. The truth f*cking hurts some times, like Frontline’s programming about North Korea. That was one of the best programs I’d seen on PBS, and the corresponding website continues to be an excellent reference. It was the first place that demonstrated to me the folly that is Richard Perle, with his advocacy for a policy of disengagement from NK to deal with the nuclear threat (horrifically parallel with Iran, in many ways). I can see where Tomlinson would want to go after this specific programming — but it would be very, very wrong to do so.
#102…good lord. I may intellectually disagree with Ms. Hamsher alot (chuckle)…but she really does present interesting news items and research.
Ghostman
prostratedragon (14)
and Rayne at 32
thank you for jointly giving me a great belly laugh! I skimmed the capybara thing and didn’t think deeply about it and would have to agree with Rayne’s correction. However… upon comparing photos of a capybara and Mr. Tomlinson, I agree with prostratedragon, too.
Tom in Chicago-
That is amazing. Dawn breaks on marblehead!
I can’t believe that after all this time, the Diebold story is finally getting some legs.
Please god, let it stick.
Zennurse – the Mora quote:
“We should care because the issues raised by a policy of cruelty are too fundamental to be left unaddressed, unanswered or ambiguous. We should care because . . .
Alberto Mora in tomorrow’s WaPo
Is that online? That is one man who absolutely should be called a hero by anyone with the bare essentials in value. When he has Cambone and Haynes there, and gets out the War Crimes statute and reads it to them (as if we had a Justice Dept that cared) – that’s the real deal.
begone,you who are “not” hottuna in any way shape or form! go away, forever– you added nothing to discourse and are a scourge on the blogosphere.
tell me, how afraid are you?
tom %u2014 chicago,
Re: “George Bush Speaks Spanish.
Stephen Colbert was not funny.
Helen Thomas is old and batty.
Mexicans are taking our jobs.
Iraq sent its WMDs to Syria.” etc.
That reminds me of a song ; )
http://www.billyjoel.com/disco…..eFire.html
JoyB (103) — Heh.
Ken Tomlinson or,
Ken Tomlinson.
Hmm. Still looks like a goat-sucking “vampiro” to me. Maybe I need to clean my glasses.
OMG!!!! Rayne that is hilarious! Look at their hands!!!
how we talk about it, is maybe the key to the midterm and the 2008 elections. and then there is taking back the national conversation. and directing it and owning it.
looseheadrop challenged us awhile back to strategize about how we might render swift boating impotent, and he spoke about bogarts and the ridiculous curse and seeing the scary thing as the funny thing.
why not? there is so much ridiculous and blatantly cheap about the same sex marriage issue, and immigration, flag burning, english as the national language, christinaity as the official religion of michigan (oh please), it just goes cockamamey on… . If it wasn’t so disgusting it would be hilarious.
how do we turn it on them to make them look as ridiculous and pathetic as they are?
markos and jerome talk about advertising towards the end of ctg. how we talk about it is so important.
thanks for this post jane. i love mr. rogers too.
go fuck yourself, hottuna.
—————————–
while we’re on the subject of tv, perhaps it’s time to eliminate the sunday morning roundup and boycott the shit. why ruin your weekend becoming enraged listening while rove and his bitch, “i’m not gay” mehlman roll out lies and spittle via the usual suspects while timmeh, tweety and wolf unabashedly blow them?
if i see mushroom-cloud mary with her glib pseudo-academic doubletalk and vile st. john dallas suits trying to paste yet another happyface on the death and destruction she facilitated i’m gonna jump out the fucking window.
the shot of bush a few threads back says it all. these people have nothing but disdain for the american people, let alone the rest of the planet.
I have always believed that my generation was motivated to stop the Vietnam war because we watched Crusader Rabbit as little kids. Captain Kangaroo and Lone Ranger helped too (and yeah, I know it was racist) … the primary message of our childhood tv was that good guys fight for justice and we took it to heart.
Of course, I can never find another member of my generation who remembers Crusader Rabbit and it’s gotten mighty fuzzy to me!
Zenn! hi – and what did you think of the article?
tom in chicago
ireland spent 60m euro on black box machines and they have all but scrapped them. “at what cost” was a campaign to urge the government to abandon their use in the 2004 national election. people just said, no fucking way. they probably won’t be used in ‘07 either.
wish there was more dialogue and action on this issue on a national level.
cbl at 87
One of my favorite shows. Cartoons are an overlooked venue for social commentary. Things can be said that would never make it into more “adult” shows. They might be for kids, but they’re written by adults. What about Kim Possible on Disney? If it’s possible to have a crush on a cartoon character, I have one for her.
Tomlinson and all his Middleberg VA horsefarm phony genteelism–funny how quick these guys are to make lots of money off their government connections….Rumsfeld: regulated cable tv boxes made him rich, Cheney oil and defense connections, Bush and his Carlyle/Bin Laden money, etc.
way OT–spent the day listening over and over again to the new Dixie Chicks CD. Beautiful.
Sharkbabe, you’re comments earlier re: Lullaby… yes, yes, yes. Soothing, seductive, sublime.
Thank you all for this place.
siun –
Hey there! I remember Crusader Rabbit, although it’s fuzzy for me too, but then rabbits are supposed to be fuzzy, no?
How about “Tom Terrific…and his friend Mighty Manfred, the Wonder Dog” — Ring a bell? The villain in that cartoon was “Crabby Appleton,” which in our household, since Mr. K8 remembers it well too, is MY nickname when I wake up with a stiff neck or back, in a cranky mood. I think “Crabby Appleton” is a great name. :-)
There were lots of creative names for villains then, weren’t there?
Snidely Whiplash
Crabby Appleton
Boris Badenov & Natasha
Wile E. Coyote
In fighting against the “bad guys” there was always a place for humor.
cbl says:
May 27th, 2006 at 8:10 pm
Rayne,
“Kids today are so deprived.”
check out Fairly Odd Parents, (Joe Biden is Chet Youbetcha)
One episode had Timmy in a limo for some reason, going to a prom at school. The limo door opens and you see W and Karl whispering to each other in the back seat. When they see the camera, they get guilty grins and hold their hands up as if to block the lens.
Norquist is a psycho and an extremist; it’s a travesty he’s considered part of any mainstream movement. Tomlinson should stick to hackery and keep his hands off all effective government programs. Shame, shame, shame.
mommybrain (121) — wow, I’ll have to watch for that. Wonder if that was in the last season? Apparently I’ll have to spend more time with kids watching FOP…
Living near the northern border, my kids watched local pbs channel Sesame Street with the spanish segments & then I would turn to the canadian channel we could receive & that Sesame Street would have french segments. There would be occasional moments that were great fun for adults. I loved the slovanian polka band with John Candy.
Why do Tomlinson, Norquist, Rove, Gingrich, etc, all look like they share the same genes? I think these tweedledum/tweedledee, chubby, balding, pig-faced similarities need to be studied to see if those physical characteristics correlate with their psychopathic tendencies.
I believe our Constitution’s preamble says it all, if it were genuinely preserved, protected and defended by US citizens and those who purport to be our leaders.
Mary #107,
I don’t know about WaPo but I googled and found the speech here:
http://www.jfklibrary.org/Education and Public Programs/Profile in Courage Award/Award Recipients/Alberto Mora/Acceptance Speech by Alberto Mora.htm
That link sucketh, so can just google a phrase to find Acceptance Speech by Alberto Mora (won the JFK Profile in Courage Award)
This video almost made me cry. I love Mr. Rogers and miss him deeply. I think he was a saint, not in the flip way the word is sometimes used, but literally.
I was born in ‘88 and I grew up watching Mr. Rogers.
That mans show helped me through some difficult times… From my first dogs death when I was four and then through my Mothers death when I was 7.
I stopped watching his show shortly after that, but I still remember the Crayon Factory Episode :)
RIP Mr. Rogers.
But as for Rove, Tomlinson, and the Republican Machine fighting against Public Television — I’ve got nothing but contempt for them. They’d rather have kids playing violent army video games than learning how to peaceably resolve their differences.
There is a time and a place for partisan hackery, and Public TV funding is not the place for it. Public TV teaches children that they can be anything — and while that might not always be true, they deserve the opportunity to dream.
Captain Kangaroo and Lone Ranger helped too (and yeah, I know it was racist)
Y’all do know that Tonto means”fool” and Kimosabe is slang for “You know nothing” in Spanish? (Kimo is a really rare entry in Spanish dictionaries; it might have been a fad word for a while.)
If the writers slipped that into the show, way back when, there might be other bits of dialogue to investigate more closely. Maybe not. But maybe.
Siun:
I think HBO ran the old Crusader Rabbit for a while. I watched a few of the episodes.
One of my favorite cartoons as a child was George of the Jungle, but I think that may be for its theme. When I was in the AF with a bunch of other kids of the 60s and we’d hit a lulll in a conversation, somebody would invariably start singing, “Dom dom dom-dom da dom dom” the rest of us would start singing, then shriek with laughter. It was one of those things that you got it or you didn’t.
And how about those Banana Splits? Who let that bit of counteculture on the air? It was Saturday Morning TV on LSD!
One banana
Two banana
Three banana
Four
Four bananas playing in the bright blue sun.
Tell me that’s not acid talking.
When PBS called, and called, and called in their unrelenting attempt to get a contribution from me recently….I laughed out loud.
I asked if the caller was a volunteer, and she admitted being paid to make the calls. So, I let her have it. I explained in painful detail why I was no longer going to support PBS or NPR or any of the ‘independent’ media that had betrayed their trust and capitulated to the extreme right.
Money talks. Withholding money resounds loudly.
I also suggested she get an honorable job…and gave her the URL of the
TvNewsLIES.org web site.
Strangely, the caller said she’d log on. I surely hope so. A mind is a terrible thing…well, you know..