Emptywheel has a superb post up about "Jerry Doe," a former colleague of Valerie Plame's at the CIA who was assigned to counter-proliferation in the Middle East who is suing Porter Goss and various other people within the CIA for firing him because he refused to falsify information on Iraq.
James Risen has written about him:
In a lawsuit filed in federal court here in December, the former C.I.A. officer, whose name remains secret, said that the informant told him that Iraq’s uranium enrichment program had ended years earlier and that centrifuge components from the scuttled program were available for examination and even purchase.
[snip]
His information on the Iraqi nuclear program, described as coming from a significant source, would have arrived at a time when the C.I.A. was starting to reconsider whether Iraq had revived its efforts to develop nuclear weapons. The agency’s conclusion that this was happening, eventually made public by the Bush administration in 2002 as part of its rationale for war, has since been found to be incorrect.
Doe is claiming that he followed all the appropriate channels to get his information out, but that his information was supressed and he was both harassed and terminated for his efforts. Says emptywheel:
If what Doe alleges is true, the CIA five times tried to force him to stop pursuing intelligence--one time burying actionable intelligence, another time, trying to get him to falsify intelligence--that countered the party line. To punish him for not hewing to the party line, they first withheld a promotion he had qualified for. Then, they accused him (falsely, he says) of sleeping with a female asset, blackmailing James Pavitt, and embezzling money. Doe alleges these accusations served as the pretext to fire him. Then, to make sure he didn't contest the termination, they retroactively negated his move from contract to staff status, 10 years after the fact. By turning Doe, retroactively, back into a contractor, they denied him the ability to appeal or investigate his own personnel files.
Every time we hear the cry about "leakers" being pursued by the Bush administration (or in this case by Porter Goss) because they are dangerous to national security, what they really seem to be dangerous to is to the credibility of the Bush administration and the false narratives they have woven over time. I have no idea if Doe's charges are legitimate, but they do seem to fit into a pattern.
Emptywheel also notes this tantalizing bit, which indicates that the Neocons were already setting the stage for the Iraq war even before Bush was elected, and were just waiting for the appropriate puppet president to take the stage and push the button:
The first time Doe was required to bury intelligence was in 2000, before Bush was inaugurated and probably before he was (s)elected. Which reminds me that the Niger embassy in Rome was burgled (and therefore the plot to forge the Niger documents was presumably in place) in early January 2001, before Bush was inaugurated. In other words, they've been setting up their Neocon moves since before Bush was put into office.
But (again, assuming Doe's allegations are true), the similarities are enough to suggest the beginning of a pattern. Two of the CPD officers most closely involved with ascertaining just who in the Middle East has what kind of WMDs had their careers ruined, and in the process, their ability to provide accurate information that might prevent war.
Doe claims he followed every avenue to get his information out which could have prevented war and was systematically stymied. For any wingnut who needs a lesson in why whistleblowers are a critical check on power and vital to the integrity of the system, this would be it.
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FITZ
Fitz!
A bit OT, but check this out:
http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITI.....index.html
Rumsfeld confronted directly at his speech today.
Is it just me, or are the masses finally turning against this evil administration?
Perhaps the Colbert speech last weekend served to embolden those who would otherwise remain quiet? Whether or not that is the case, I am glad to see this evil bastard getting confronted directly.
link correction: emptywheel’s post is at http://thenexthurrah.typepad.com/the_next_hurrah/
Can we say ‘pattern or practice’? How much more obvious does it have to get before the MSM can (and will) see it?
Not to be a troll, but if this guy was harrased by superiors at the CIA during the Clinton Administration, how did they come to be in power at that time?
Why were Neo Cons in power BEFORE Bushco took office?
Non ideology career civil servant types hold over from administration to administration because they don’t care who is in power. But the political appointees and ideologues don’t hang around working for the other party’s government.
That part of the story doesn’t compute.
D’ oh - out fitz’d again.
but good on ya Sharkbabe
Sharkbabe got the fitz. Angie’s asleep at the wheel.
looseheadprop #5 –
It could compute if such people were both career and neocon. The political appointees are only the top relatively few administrators (at least that’s how it’s supposed to work) and you get to the career folks pretty soon as you work down the org chart. It’s not at all unreasonable to believe that some neocons in place in the Reagan-Bush years stayed through the Clinton years if they were in managerial ranks below the political appointee realm. And remember, not all neocons are necessarily Republicans or even partisan in the commonly understood meaning of the term.
Props to Sharkbabe on her successful FITZ!
;)
looseheadprop says:
May 4th, 2006 at 1:44 pm
You’ve raised some good questions. I hope emptywheel will have more to say about this on her blog and/or here.
why these revelations are not blowing out of the water goes beyond me…
Jane, let me just say that I appreciate this >>I have no idea if Doe’s charges are legitimate, but they do seem to fit into a pattern.
I don’t know how best to say it, but I really respect the fact that, time and time again, you (and Christy) are cautious with your posts. You provide fact, while cautioning reason and open-mindedness.
Fever swamp, my ass. I wish all the media were as thorough, and as concerned about the truth, and it’s implications.
OT and EPU’d:
OT - Patrick Kennedy in traffic accident. Yet unclear if alcohol was involved. Cops at the scene say he was intoxicated but later reports say no alcohol was involved. He’ll never get away with it like Cheney did. At least he didn’t kill anyone like Laura Bush did.
Sounds like GeorgeII was involved in pre-election espionage. Just like his father in the Iran Hostage crisis.
If these fucks will lie, cheat and steal to force or maintain a crisis using the CIA, then cheating the system in a vulnerable election (say Florida, Ohio, New Mexico) can’t be too hard. I mean, do the Secretaries of State or the county election supervisors have better security than the Niger Embassy in Rome?
I feel like I’m living in the Warsaw Ghetto back when many were saying “its for our own good…could be worse.”
Thank god we come together at FDL for truth and honesty. It is our only legitimate weapon.
lhp - from below thread re: the hearing tomorrow.
Two days - basically less than two days - notice to put all that together? You know what the lawyers in a civil suit would be doing. IMO, it is not only going to be massive, it is going to be very telling - like making Gov lock into a process that could tip the hat in other cases (oh yeah, they aren’t going to prove “covert” or “oops - wth are they going to prove “covert” and what does it mean …) etc.
OTOH - it does seem like Walton might need that info to address the materiality and peripheral issues for the reporters subpoenas.
Is it going to be on the open record or chambers and possibly sealed?
Permalink to emptywheel’s post:
http://thenexthurrah.typepad.c.....n_doe.html
Urban Pirate 7, the early babe gets the Fitz.
lhp 5, that’s a good question. It doesn’t make the allegations untrue in my mind, but it does mean there are more questions that need to be answered.
‘headprop (#5):
are you presuming that neocons couldn’t have been deep in the woodwork before pinhead ascended the throne? these guys have been all over washington like flies on shit since hector was a pup. they prolly had more than one sleeper cell at the company. CIA is not monolithic, and thank Allah, the Goddess and Jehovah for that. Wanna bet Moussad hasn’t infiltrated the CIA, the FBI, the NSA, etc.? If you’ve got money I could get rich quick. We know they’ve got people in State (on trial as we speak). The Soviets were little league compared to these guys.
Mary says:
May 4th, 2006 at 1:59 pm
Has anything about this appeared today on PACER?
looseheadprop #5
Skull & Bones is a know recruitment center for the CIA. As is the crew team. Yale has a lock on the CIA, and Georgie No 1, former head of the CIA, still has a few spies reporting to him, I’m sure.
BTW - re: the topic “probably before he was elected” excerpt.
Isn’t it CobraII (I haven’t bought it yet - just seen some interviews) or is it another book recently out that alleges Cheney was on the phone “booking” Iraq briefings pretty much from the Supreme Court steps as its decision was handed down?
Looseheadrop @5
Neo-cons pre-date the Bush Administration. Under the current Bush Administration their malevolence and incompetence has become obvious.
OT - pending Home, Sweet Home for Zacarias Moussaoui - the Colorado SuperMax
ADX Florence is generally home to between 400 and 500 male prisoners. About 22 percent of inmates have killed fellow prisoners in other correctional facilities; 35 percent have attempted to attack other prisoners or guards. As a result, most individuals are kept for at least 23 hours each day in solitary confinement. They are housed in a 7-by-12 foot (3.5-by-2 meter) soundproofed room, built behind a steel door and grate. The remaining free hour is spent exercising alone in a separate concrete chamber. Prisoners rarely see each other, and inmates’ only human interaction is limited to that of the prison guards. Religious services are broadcast in from a small chapel.
Most cells’ furniture is made almost entirely out of poured concrete, including a desk, stool, and bed covered by a thin mattress. Each chamber contains a toilet that shuts off if plugged, a shower that runs on a timer to prevent flooding, and a sink missing a potentially dangerous tap. Rooms may also be fitted with polished steel mirrors bolted to the wall, an electric light, a 13-inch black and white television that shows only educational programming, which not all inmates are allowed to have, and a cigarette lighter. Windows in rooms are small, set high up in the wall, and point towards the sky, confusing the prisoner as to his specific location within the complex.
The prison as a whole contains countless motion detectors and cameras, 1,400 remote-controlled steel doors, and 12-foot high razor wire fences. Laser beams, pressure pads, and attack dogs guard the area between the prison walls and razor wire.
(Wiki entry)
Buh-bye, moron.
whoo-hoo Ray McGovern replay on CNN– And Wolfie puts out the truthy statement from 2003. Oh and now Leslie says it was ranting and ruins the whole dam thing. ugh.
heh–Urban Pirate– I was at the wheel– out shopping :)
Stephen - I won’t get to check out pacer until this evening. (I did a copy/paste for you of the order for the hearing yesterday, but I don’t have anything else - I’d be surprised if anyone had time to file anything else. I have to wonder about some kind of extension or at least trying to book a backup date for Gov to modify, amend or supplement their presentation.)
I do believe that there were many neocons buried in both the CIA and FBI. The FBI under Freeh leaked like a seive anything against Clinton and made his job difficult.
And so the CIA, too, would have people that did everything they could to give Clinton bad info. Like the aspirin factory, or the wrong maps during the conflict in Bosnia where the chinese embassy was hit. These facts came out of the CIA did they not? I know nothing about these events other than what I read, but I don’t believe either of those agencies lifted a finger to help Clinton, and did much to hinder him.
So as Clinton neared the end of his 8 years, they had the media and the country against Gore and for Bush. They were well ready before the election. Just one person’s view from the hinterlands.
Kennedy blood in the water– watch the sharks circle.
bah the kennedy story is gonna get played up to mask Rummy getting exposed.
I just had to share with a crowd who would understand my excitement. . . I wrote Helen Thomas on Saturday night to express my thanks for her performance with Colbert, and she just wrote me back to thank me for my “kind words.” WHOOOHOO!!!! I’ve admired her for years.
Something I don’t understand is how Jerry Doe’s bosses could retroactively make him a contractor. If you’re a contractor, you work for some company that cuts the paychecks. If you’re a civil servant, the government signs your check. They can’t just retroactively say that he hasn’t been working for the DoD.
Is there anyone here familiar with the DoD contract process?
looseheadprop @5,
Career civil service folks do have their own ideologies, but generally speaking they try to keep it in check while doing their jobs. There comes a point in rising through the ranks, where career folks “top out” unless they want to shift into the politically sensitive positions, that they either leave government service or resign themselves to no more advancement.
Confession time: Long ago, in the days of Alexander “I am in control” Haig, I was an intern at the State Department. (There was a time when one didn’t have to apologize for being an intern in DC, but that was pre-Monica. But I digress . . .)
A fair number of my superiors - the career folks, that is - were politically democrats. Toward the end of my internship, I asked a couple of them about the difference in working under Carter and under Reagan. They replied that while they might have liked Carter’s general politics more, Reagan was easier to work for. With Carter, State would send a policy recommendation to the White House and wonder what reaction it would get. With Reagan, there was never any question how he would react. They might not like the reaction, but at least he was predictable.
I’ve since watched from a distance and seen some of these folks retire, others move into NGOs, and still others shift into political appointee positions and thus go in and out of power with the changes in the White House. I’m guessing that you could paint a similar picture at the CIA and DoD, but perhaps the stereotypes would go in different directions. Still, it’s easy for me to imagine budding neocons starting in either place during the Reagan/Bush years, rising through the career position ranks in the Clinton years, then shifting into the political appointee positions during the reign of King George XLIII.
“…9 News has learned U.S. Capitol police officers are concerned about the handling of an accident involving Congressman Patrick Kennedy (D-Rhode Island) about 3 a.m. this morning.
Rep. Kennedy was reportedly behind the wheel of a green Ford Mustang when it crashed into a security barrier at 1st and “C” streets Southeast.
There are no reports of injuries. A Boston TV station is reporting Kennedy told officers he was late for a vote. We are told police drove him home after conferring with higher-ups in the department. So far, Kennedy HAS NOT been charged. A spokesman for his office told CNN that alcohol was NOT involved…”
James Woolsey evidently had neo-con leanings when he was named CIA director. (It seems Clinton’s people didn’t know much about him when they named him.) It seems he quit after being disillusioned with the intelligence bureaucracy and lack of clout with the White House. Not sure if became radicalized between when he left in 95 and signing the PNAC letter, or if he was full-blown neo-con all the time.
I would take him as partial evidence of a scheme to place neo-cons within the military/intelligence establishment. … just waiting for the bat signal to go up (Bush’s election) for them to swing into action.
(If you read Mike Ruppert, his theory is the peak oil endgame became more urgent once it was realized, around 1999 or 2000, that the Caspian oil discoveries weren’t going to pan out. If peak oil–preserving the American way of life as we know it–is a prime motivating factor among the PNACers, then a realization during this time frame would urge a change in tactics away from a slow, steady accumulation of power beneath the radar.)
Cujo - that’s probably something he mentions in his lawsuit. ;-)
If Gov did withholding on him for those 10 years - ? Or if he got pension accrual statements or health insurance bennies and had health claims processed as if he had employee coverage and . . .
Of course, we’ve gone back to pre-Constitution on other items, so the employment status ‘trip back in time’ isn’t shocking by comparison.
Jane - another eye-opening post. Have you or Christy or Pach contemplated submitting op-ed pieces (as bloggers) to the major papers, either on subjects covered in fdl and/or on the blogsphere as “fever-swamp” and/or on the subject of how the MSM is, er, how to put this delicately… incompe… corru… nothing but lying sacks o… er… in a position to improve?
Bennies - another audience, MSM “legitimacy”, new fdl traffic, and another forum from which to fight back.
Cynthia McKinney, now Pat Kennedy. Sounds like the Capital Police are working on sinking some Democrats.
At least no one was shot in the face.
-GSD
OMG #2 House Democrat, Steny Hoyer of Maryland, stabs Stephen Colbert in back, says his comedy is “in bad taste,” defends George Bush!!!!
Jane,
Thanks for picking this up. I hope that, with the recent coverage of Plame and Iran, some attention will be paid to this guy’s case (and if Christy has the time, I’m not sure I was reading the reasons for the amended complaints correctly). It’s fairly clear he has been trying to declassify his complaint so he can make it clear just what proof he had, but they’re fighting that pretty intensely.
looseheadprop @5
You’re right, that is a good question, one I’m puzzling through myself; after all, the Niger breakin presumably wasn’t CIA, it was off-books, so it didn’t matter who was in charge. My bigger question, though, is why they weren’t fixing his intelligence before 2000. We know, for example, that NSA and CIA were involved in bugging UNSCOM in Iraq up until 1998–they had basically used UNSCOM, under the umbrella of UN, to spy on Saddam, which is precisely what Saddam accused us of. And Charles Duelfer was involved back then, spinning intelligence as badly as they could.
Anyway, the context on the 2000 allegation is:
This probably relates to Iraq or Iran (since we’ve been gaming our intell on these countries for some time). But I’m trying to figure out if it’s something entirely different.
Mary @ 2:18 pm (#34) - Well, it just doesn’t make any sense to me. Either he was working for a contractor or for the government. If he worked for the government, he should have several years of paystubs to back up his assertion. Even with direct deposit you receive a stub that shows what you earned, had to pay in taxes, etc.
Maybe the CIA gets to play by different rules, but one thing I learned in the time I did defense contracting was that you never take your money from the wrong place. If the auditors catch it you’ll be very lucky if all you get is fired.
link about stupid stinking steny:
http://www.alternet.org/blogs/peek/35781/
uncle toby @33 I believe the peak oil ‘crisis’ is a manufactured scare tactic, based upon real ecological and economic limits, but is nonetheless being used as a fear tool in much the same way as ‘bird flu’.
I have personally known and spoken with a number of geologists that have many times argued that oil wealth is untapped in many countries of the world simply because the profits of the existing industry all depend on scarcity and price inflation based on ‘artificial scarcity’.
OT - Some of us FDLers were talkin’ about Laura Bush’s interview from inside a library yesterday. Thinkprogress has a little bit on the interview and link to some video of her flip flopping:
http://thinkprogress.org/2006/.....flip-flop/
Uncle Toby at 33
Check out The Pentagon’s New Map by Thomas P.M. Barnett of the U.S. Naval War College.
9/11 was their opportunity to remake the world - ala The Reichstag fire - and they are
OT but Froomkin has a link to an ABC tape of Colbert’s performance the other night. Two things are notable about it: One, on this version you can hear the audience laughing a lot more than on the C-span version. Two, when it goes to the Colbert-Helen Thomas clip, the camera centers on Chimp’s face and stays on it throughout. He is visibly squirming … really worth watching and I hope some tech-savvy people grab a copy before it dissapears…link to Froomkin, scroll down a bit he links directly to the video.
gotta properly preface my OT comments and opinions, apologies all.
Nedless to say in regards to Patches Kennedy. It may be nothing, but it sure looks like another privileged DC type getting some slack cut to him. Add on Pelosi standing behind the soon to be indicted Congressman Jefferson and the questions about Congressman Mollahan, the Cynthia McKinney flap to boot and the Dems appear to be fast on their way to negating any traction with the corruption issue.
Heckuva job.
-GSD
But Remember with Kennedy, the Cheney Rules apply. He had to get in touch with his media handlers and he would report the incident whenever he damn well decides.
Cujo
I do wonder whether they’re stalling this guy so they never have to go to court to prove he was a contractor. He’s unemployed, so I wonder how long he’ll be able to keep pressing his case. Anyway, in the complaint Doe says he was receiving regular government paychecks during that period.
Thanks for the post Jane - I’m a little distracted right now and will have to go back to fully absorb it =
O/T - Everyone will enjoy the Rummy event in Atlanta - C/L has it up - I just watched it 3 times - twice I took off my glasses so the picture was fuzzy and I pretended he was in the witness box at The Hague - finally having to answer for his murderous, treacherous shit
Please, don’t anyone tell me anything untoward about Ray McGovern - he was a Patriot today
Sophist,
I think the difference between peak oil and the bird flu is that none of the powers-that-be want to talk about peak oil. Only now is the subject percolating up to the MSM. But you don’t hear anyone from goverment (other than that repub congressman from Maryland) talking about it.
Artificial scarcity was the reason for the formation of OPEC, but I think those days are gone, and suppliers no longer have any price control with the lack of any productive capacity. If you are interested, you might want to check out theoildrum.com for mostly reasoned discussion of the subject.
looseheadprop #5
our leaders [both parties] have a common foreign policy, specially when it comes to the middle east — zelikow, who administered the 9/11 commission’s work, said in public that we went into iraq in order to protect israel — although oil may have played a role too, it was & still is secondary — just look at how little oil iraq is pumping today: our leaders are realists about such things even though they lie through their teeth in justifying what they do: they knew darn well that iraq would blow up but they & israel wanted a weakened iraq — now they have iran in their cross-hairs
Jane — timely and excellent post.
Re: Jerry Doe — doesn’t this tie in to the high Iraqi official that the CIA had turned and who was reporting that Saddam had no WMD? Or do I have this confused with another event, another time?
Re Colbert: Whether folks laughed (nervously) or not about Colbert’s performance may not be important. That is not the measure of whether he succeeded. I don’t think Colbert cared about being funny, except as a cover for the message; it wasn’t about comedy; it was calculated stinging political satire, and it worked.
The effect on politics is what matters. I see it as an “emperor has no clothes” moment. Everyone looks around, afraid to laugh, but for the very first time, they actually sees what the child sees. No one has argued that what Colbert said, when interpreted as he meant it, was “untrue.” If all they can debate about is whether it was funny, Colbert wins.
As for Hoyer, he’s clueless; when you tell the emperor he has no clothes, and right to his face, and in front of the cameras, you’re not trying to be respectful of the emperor, but you are respecting the truth.
So to tie these and other stories together, it’s now safe for anyone to publicly state that Bush and the neocons are shameless, lying frauds, and we should hear more of this now. There are no boundaries on attacking Bush.
very interesting post JH, picking up on emptywheels’ work. I opened what appears to be the most recent document available (Nov. 15, 2005). http://thenexthurrah.typepad.c.....plaint.pdf
I haven’t read the whole thing (and probably won’t, non lawyer here), but questions from the first page:
“Plaintiff Demands Trial by Jury” - is this just emphatic language which in effect equals “requests trial by jury”? And, these sorts of cases, is it the judge who makes the decision?
I noted the case # Civil No. 04CV2122(GK) In the Libby filings I’ve seen the case number ended in RJW or RW (can’t remember which, but Walton’s initials). So, presumably it would be possible to figure out who the judge in the case is.
Also, is this kind of long time delay (Nov. 2005 til now with nothing new) typical?
Thanks all you laywers types out there if you can answer. And, BTW, haven’t seen Imman lately… anyone?
scarecrow -
“There are no boundaries on attacking Bush.”
Amen. Relentlessly.
http://www.bgladd.com/The_Disgracer_in_Chief.jpg
I agree that this story is worth following, but perhaps we should all remember that complaints aren’t evidence. Allegations can be made on “information and belief,” can be inconsistent with each other, and can be hazy on dates and timing. Complaints are simply the gateway to discovery–and in this case, the government has every incentive to make discovery as difficult as possible.
A redacted complaint is even harder to decipher. As much fun as it is to speculate about just when the neocons took over the CIA, some watchful waiting might be in order. I know we can trust emptywheel to stay on top of it.
PJ Evans @#4
my take was that Mr. McGovern (the man asking the questions) was the one who was booed, and that Rummy was applauded. So i don’t think it indicates the masses, sorry to say.
Woolsey’s just about the biggest and longest term Iraq hawk around - as blinkered and determined as Cheney. No doubt he was able to put at least a few like-minded individuals in the senior management of the CIA.
GSD #36,
More like those particular Dems are sinking themselves.
percy: I have to smile at the idea of the Op-ed editor at, say, WaPo (Hi, Fred!!), taking a submission from any of us. Maybe they would take Christy, someday. Not from me or Jane, I expect. I’m a pseudonym guy anyway, like Digby, only dumber.
To answer your question, no, we have not discussed it. We have our outlet here and it’s got its own power. If we did discuss it, I doubt we’d feel either the inclinination or the need to do op-eds of that variety, though we’d be very happy to see Glenn Greenwald begin to get such opportunities in the wake of his book.
Valley Girl
It appears that they’ve gone through three cycles of: submit complaint, give defendants extensions to respond to complaint, then they submit their motion to dismiss. The most recent document in this is April, so it is still active, though not as active as the Libby case.
BarbaraB
Point well taken. This is a complaint and the government, at least, says Doe is unreliable (though they don’t seem to be responding to his complaint by refuting it at all, and he was cleared of the three charges–CI, bribery, and embezzlement–in 2005). Which means it all comes down to whether, on the basis of the contractor-staff-contractor thing he can get them into court. Right now, though, they’re arguing he doesn’t have a case because 1) it’s not illegal to game intelligence and 2) he can’t prove he was fired because he refused to game intelligence.
VG 52 — A plaintiff has a right to a jury trial unless he/she/it waives it. “Demands” is the standard form. (I won’t bore you with fine distinctions over law vs. equity, or the 7th Amendment vs. statute. You may thank me later. *g*)
Late response to dead last #14:
I love FDL, but it is not our only legitimate weapon; letters to the editor in local newspapers are a powerful way to disseminate what we learn and share here - all politics being local…
Thanks, emptywheel 59. The problem with employment termination cases is that sometimes the complaint is well founded and sometimes it isn’t. That’s also the problem with every other kind of case.
Maybe Doe is unreliable and maybe he is the victim of a government conspiracy and maybe, just maybe, he’s both. At least they’re not calling him a “disgruntled former employee,” which is the standard line. That would be an admission that he was an employee. “Disgruntled former independent contractor” just doesn’t have the same ring to it.
I look forward to reading your future installments.
emptywheel sorry I missed the link to the April 2006 filing in your post. Maybe add this and nov. stuff to your bold time line? So, first page says 04/03/20006. Thanks- link you gave for that: http://thenexthurrah.typepad.c.....plaint.pdf
BarbaraB- thanks for answering my question about “demands”. So, I’ll thank you now.
Still have the question about the (GK) part- I am assuming that this is the judge’s initials. Also, is it the judge who makes the decision re: jury trial, assuming things get that far?
looseheadprop says:
May 4th, 2006 at 1:44 pm
Why were Neo Cons in power BEFORE Bushco took office?
—————-
These people plan years in advance. Jeb had the FL felons voting laws changed in 1998. See how nicely (*cough*) that worked out in 2000?
Lou is completely outraged that Rummy says he is not in the intelligence business– he is on a tear! bravo.
oops- BB- so, he has the right to a jury trial? I just remember some stuff during the Alito hearings- discussion about Alito having denied right to jury trial in some cases- only vague memory here, and again, not a lawyer, so that’s why I asked.
Lou said that it is good that we can speak up in America and McIntyre says give rummy credit b/c they were about to throw this guy out and he asked them to let him stay. sheeeeit, that’s freedom and worth kudos to rummy??????? Therefore rummy gets the credit for the goons not dragging him off and for the process of free speech. nice.
tpres2000 #61 re: #14…
…Yes there are many ways to get the message out. Blogs are wonderful, but letters to the editor are excellent avenues for expression. Some argue that the best way to take the pulse of this country is through reading the letters to the editor. I’m an addicted reader so I like it all. Even the conservative stuff interests me because it let’s me know what the opposition is up to. Of course, of all the blogs I look at, I view FDL as one of, if not, the best of them all.
VG 63 — I’m sorry I wasn’t more clear. My bad. The judge doesn’t get to decide whether there will me a jury trial. The plaintiff has a right to one if he wants it, and that “demand” says he wants it. And yes, those initials are probably the judge’s, unless that particular court has some strange local rule with which I am not familiar.
TheOtherWA 64 –
The illegal Florida Voter Purge was a Karl Rove scheme, first attempted in Texas in 1982. See The Texas Blueprint For The Stolen Election for some of the details — www.democrats.com/blueprint
VG 66 — I should have qualified my answer by saying that a plaintiff has a right to a jury trial if the case actually makes it that far. A complaint can be dismissed for failure to state a claim; that’s the legal version of a “so what?” The defendant is arguing that even if everything the plaintiff says in the complaint is true, the plaintiff doesn’t have a legal case.
The case can also be tossed out early (but usually not until after discovery) if the party who would have the burden of proof at trial does not persuade the judge that there is enough evidence to go to the jury. IRRC, the Alito cases you remember were about the appropriate standards for summary judgment.
My apologies if this is too much information. Old Civil Procedure teachers never die, they just blather on in blogs. *g*
Barbara B:
Just one point of clarification. Not all civil cases are tried to a jury, nor is there a constitutional right to the same. However, this case appears to be one where the plaintiff is entitled to a jury trial, if so requested.
Lou-tz!
BarbaraB #71 no, that is not “too much information”, it is great information. I don’t know if you are a lawyer or not (assume so) but if you have read a lot of FDL comments by lawyers, as I have, one sees that their comments tend to be rather lenghty! And, the lenghty comments are always welcome. Never seen any complaints on that account.
Wow. Great post as usual!
You don’t have to keep any foil in the house to see connections between Watergate, Iran-Contra and Yellowgate. Two elephants ‘ hiding-in-plain-sight’ are Shrub’s superior officers. Von Runsfeld and the Shotgun dictator.
Also when looking at the Niger forgery you have to look at Mossad involvement AND sayanim involvement. Sayanim are people like Michael Ledeen who will work for Mossad and Shin-bet for free or favours. Ledeen also is reported to have excellent Italian fascist/spook/P2 type connection’s.
Another way to look at the CIA is the reported split between the ‘ Waffen SS’ who are ideologues and fanatics and the ‘ Wermacht ‘ who don’t want the good name of the ‘ German army’ dragged through the mud of kidnapping, torture, cooking up lies for war, concentration camps and so on.
While the CIA has a terrible history and reputation and I agree with people like Phill Agee and John Young of Cryptome that their agents are fair game for outing, they still have done some good in the world (in Poland and associated countries ) and some of the information they provide can be used.
I would be more inclined to feel like smashing the Pentagon or the FBI into a million pieces today than the CIA. Maybe the Kremlin can help us out here and release all the stuff Robert Hanssen gave them - the so-called ‘ crown jewels’ of intelligence?
Please Mr Putin, pretty please?
Send it all to Cryptome - and Indymedia as well.
I’d like to see that.