there years … or three years?

G’night, all.

Fitz!

fitz!

IT’S CALLED ARTHUR MAGAZINE. YOU GUYS ARE THE ONES THAT SET THIS UP.

totally hysterical. Thanks! And bonus points for using the expression, “tits up.”

Valley Girl
Here’s a diary posted by my sister that talked about the lessons learned about international outbreak management from SARS.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/3/12/204147/206

Did this both ways because the preview wasslow and I have to get to bed now. Hope it posts.

Fitz

Awesome Jane. Thanks

Paul Rieckhoff is on Stephen Colbert and they are both brilliant.

I just happened to be reading through old interviews with John Lydon (Johnny Rotten) of the Sex Pistols. What a contrast with this wanker.

oy gevult. Can someone please tell me what “underlying bed music” is?

oh, what a twit.

Darby Crash, D. Boon, Jeffrey Lee Pierce, where are you when we need you?

Godsmack is no System of a Down, that’s for sure.

Oh, man, duude, like, what’re you like talking about man? This is way too funny. Talk about your anti-protest music. Yeesh!

shoephone #9
I think underlying bed music is the background music

Uh. Mah. Gawd.

That guy is why parents everywhere tell their sons and daughters not to date or marry us musicians.

What a lummox. He could give Scotty McClellan a run for his money in the triple-crown double-talk derby.

He ought to just come right out and say, “We do it for the money, dude. The Pentagon pays legit. We’re just in it for the money.”?

Oh, right, cos that wouldn’t be RAWK and ROLL enough for him.

Oh holy smoking whatever expletive I cannot even conjure up, Jane– Sully is a perfect example of nonthinking and opportunistic cretins that abound everywhere.

Huh, uh, whaaaa?

“We just simply, an opportunity came up, they wanted to use some music for a recruit commercial. What are we gonna say, no?”

Just say no, you p.o.s. non thinking neanderthal. And though I am a fierce protector of free speech, just what the hell is up with that name, anyway? Godsmacked. doh.

“Yeah, but tell me what it said again.” duh.

“Dude, [yelling] WHY DON’T YOU GO LIVE IN IRAQ THEN IF YOU HAVE SUCH A PROBLEM WITH AMERICA? Why are you here?” duh again

“I don’t have enough education in the military to educate them in anything.” duh yet again

Thanks, Jane for more education and exposure and I mean it sincerely!

I feel positively sullied.

Thx, Suzanne.

two beers, I went to high school with Darby Carsh (Paul Beam). He was a freaking asshole, despised by pretty much everyone. He had a posse of likeminded freak/assholes, who tromped around in miltary fatigues, constantly talking about guns, etc. If Crash was alive today, David Neiwert would be posting about him, along with all the other neo-nazis.

OT –

A follow-up to my previous request for thoughts/prayers. Please keep ‘em coming.

Our dear pupster? The vet said tonight it looks like it really IS cancer.

I’ll hang out here when I can, but have to split my time with some extra online research on “anal sac adenocarcinoma.”

Thanks guys, for all the support you’ve already given me. But I may need to reach out to y’all — all my good buds at FDL — just a wee bit more, from time to time, as we go through what’s undoubtedly ahead.

Will do my best not get maudlin or too heavy about it.

[Everybody’s got crosses to bear; and some of you here have much heavier crosses than just a battle against cancer in a beloved pet.]

http://tinyurl.com/a6erq

HELP IMPEACH TODAY

1) Sign Petitions if you have not done so
2) Write your reps in Congress
3) Write the media
4) Pass the link around to friends & family and ask them to chip in some time
5) Thank you for helping!!!

Mrs. K8–

Heart is heavy for you and yours. Healing thoughts your way. I’ll wish very hard for hope.

Kinda OT, but David Sirota has a post at MyDD, that outs Steny Hoyer, the # 2 Democrat in the House, as a BushCo tool.

http://www.mydd.com/story/2006/5/3/123758/5207

Steny Hoyer’s Hostile Takeover

Folks are rightly outraged today about House Democratic Whip Steny Hoyer vigorously coming to the defense of President Bush. You know there’s a huge problem with our political system when the number two Democrat in the House is throwing himself in front of the media to defend an extreme right-wing President.

But then, we shouldn’t be surprised by Hoyer’s behavior. As I document in my new book Hostile Takeover, Hoyer has long led the charge to emasculate the Democratic Party. Whether on economic policy, on the war, on trade policy or on just generally selling out to Big Money interests, Hoyer has self-servingly gone out of his way to undermine his party. Put another way - if you are looking for one of the root causes of the Democratic Party’s problems, look no further than Steny Hoyer.

Fucking cretinous asshole…a classic case of: “I’m stupid so don’t blame me…”

Lots of Sully’s out there. Wish they were all as funny.

The dude deserves the credit for figuring out that he was actually going down.

sooner or later, ALL pro-war voices (from this boob to the eloquent and informed Hitch) resort to the “you must like Osama & Sadaam” rebuttal.

Another opportunist p.o.s. that Hoyer. Needs to crawl under the rock with Lieberman and cuddle.

Godsmack band, dudes, you are nothing but a bunch of sellout assholes. FUCK YOU! Your music sucks but more importantly YOU SUCK! So FUCK OFF and DIE in IRAQ with a Mouth full of dogshit!

Mrs. K8 - Thoughts and prayers heading your way.

I respectfully, yet strongly disagree with Ms. Hamsher’s entire viewpoint and opinion in this article. As far as I’m concerned, the only ASS on display in this article is Jay Babcock. And, if Mr. Babcock, and the employees of this Arthur Magazine are also democrats…they are precisely what’s wrong with the Democratic party. Not only do I view Babcock as an ass….he also, quite obviously, is a pussy.
Now, Mr. Sully Erna may not be the most eloquent fella out there…but I got his point. It’s right there in about the 3rd paragraph [the long one] at the top of the interview. Sully admits that we don’t always make the smartest choices with our military. I agree.
But, BLAMING the military, as Mr. Babcock seems to do, and as Ms. Hamsher seems to approve of….is flat wrong. Folks like Babcock and Hamsher have an absolute right to their opinions, but whenever they want to carp about the military, and a bad POLICY choice….bitch at the gov’t leaders who made the policy choice. Don’t belittle all those boys who died….and died on battlefields and in oceans across this globe…just so bubble-headed people could belittle them, as has been done here. Ms. Hamsher, I protest and object. Respectfully, you should be ashamed of yourself. And so should this little Babcock boy.
Ghostman

This jay guy has huge stones. Awesome interview.

Just freaking hilarious. He would have been much better off had he said “look, we don’t think about politics, we’re not a political band, I’m not a political person, though I’m basically patriotic, and for them to use our music in the commercial was great money for us, what do you expect us to do?”

At least that would have been honest. Instead he came of as aggressively stupid.

You can check out Godsmack’s website here. It’s like, totally awesome.

http://www.godsmack.com/

Ghostman, are you a witch too?

The kid sounds like this is the first time he has been confrontrd with this line of questioning. How much do you all suppose the band was paid by the military money machine? Perhaps Christopher Hitchens could give this band a seminar or something. BRB, I have to go scream.

31……noooo….I really don’t enjoy the Halloween holiday stuff.
Ghostman

I used to be in a band with a guitarist who hated, hated, hated Godsmack. He hated Everclear too, and his quip about Everclear would fit these mooks too:

“There oughtta be a law against that band”

Mostly he said this cause their music was big, dumb, and crappy. That was enough for me. This shit’s just icing on the cake.

JWR # 30– yikes, they have a song called “Bring It On” whoopsies– guess they do know something about politics.

Ghostman # 27– I don’t see anyone here including Ms. Hamsher and Mr. Babcock blaming the military at all. Rather, I see them protecting the military from the dastardly deeds and ambitions of the administration and the military industrial complex.

Ghostman, I’m not sure how you infer that Babcock or Jane are being derogatory about the unfortunate 2400 soldiers who have died in this immoral, idiotic adventure called the Iraq war. If anything, they are taking sully to task for the fact that he makes himself complicitous in those deaths when he sells his music to the military - for the express purpose of using those soldiers for stupid and immoral means! sully deserves to be called on the carpet for his ignorance and his blind greed.

they’re musicians, what did you expect ???

I bet this guy could score lower than 400 on the SAT (you have to spell your name wrong to do that)

ever seen any OZZY interviews ??? (they’re a real hoot)

I wouldn’t trust any of these guys to guard a shopping cart

scientists spend good money to have similar conversations with chimps

it doesn’t prove anything

35: we just read the same article very differently.
36: how can some musician be “complicitous in those deaths”???? By selling a song to a branch of the military? Your reasoning astounds me.
Ghostman

freepatriot @ 37– I have known plenty of musicians with very high IQ’s, heaps of common sense, knowledge about current affairs… and conscience.

Ghostman: Who’s blaming the military? Nowhere in the intervew is a single soldier blamed for anything.

This interview is a perfect microcosm of conservative media strategy. Pretend you’re cool and normal, when challenged warn that your words have been misconstrued, when pressed admit that any failings couldn’t have been foreseen, when called on your bullshit, denigrate the person you are in debate with.

Also goes to show that the so-called Iraq strategy cannot hold up to scrutiny and cannot be defended. Hence the administration bubble, to stave off any possibility of having to contend with reasonable questions and problems.

Ghostman — “Don’t belittle all those boys who died….and died on battlefields and in oceans across this globe…just so bubble-headed people could belittle them.”

How dare you. How fucking dare you. Neither Jay nor I belittled the people who served in the military nor died. You can tilt at straw men all you want but your comments are ignorant, illiterate right wing talking points that are not borne out by any evidence.

Advertising sells the most amazing things…

toilet bowl cleaners

medication

sex

and war.

I stand in defense of dumb kids everywhere.

To paraphrase John Murtha, it isn’t up to the 20-year-olds with guns (or guitars) in their hands to decide whether or not to fund armies, start wars, or entice underprivileged high-schoolers into exciting careers in death and mayhem. Those decisions are for the grown-ups in Washington. Has anybody seen any?

peace,
jim

Ghostman #38 - and your misplaced anger astounds me. sully is an idiot, the Bush administration (that inlcudes Rumsfeld) are criminals.

Jane and Babcock have done a good job of pointing that out. And yes, anyone who takes money from the U.S. government to prop up the current folly of our foreign policy is complicitous.

angie #35 - Lol, I missed that.

OT - Get ready for another episode of “upperdown vote” for another wingnut judge. Georgia10 at Kos has the rundown:

http://www.dailykos.com/storyo.....12156/1492

to make it even weirder…Sully Erna is a Wiccan-bordering-on-Satanist. Goggle the relevant nouns…it’ll come up.

40, mr. blifill….the attack reeks thru-out the article. Whoever this Sully fella is, and whatever his group is….he and they are just musicians. That’s all.
But Babcock wants to launch some harangue on policy to some musician…and criticize the military for iraqi deaths and so forth….that’s an attack. You may not see it….obviously.
Babcock needs to get off his ass and go march on D.C., not attack some kid who’s only act in life is to write a song.
Ghostman

I’m not sure what the point of the post was. I think it was funny. I don’t think FDL posted it to slam military. I’m not sure that the interviewer shows signs of thinking things through much more clearly than the -ee.

But… did the post say that the military is using a Gobsmack song titled “SICK OF LIFE”for recruiting? “Sick of Life” -is that right? That is funny in grim way. I think I want to hear that song and read the lyrics. That alone made the post worthwhile.

This is off topic, but below are some links that seem to be related to some recent topics discussed here. The first two particularly, wrt to Dem political strategy. And I got the yen to advertise Mark Thoma’s economics blog -really top notch expert commentary presented in plain English (’cept when he gets going on monetary policy)
geography of politics (nation not more polarized but religion more important single factor than in past)

http://economistsview.typepad......itica.html
economic torture of working class in US continues apace -help is not coming from either party
http://economistsview.typepad.......html#more

Also of interest
Fairness and efficiency of fairtrade coffee
http://economistsview.typepad......ss_an.html
Journal American Medical Association says British Healthier than their US cousins: universal health insurance prime suspect in case
http://economistsview.typepad......sh_he.html
Social Security Trust Fund’s fate (is unkown: BOO!)
http://economistsview.typepad......_fund.html
(IMHO, productivity growth will be high enough so it will not run out until after boomer spawn go away and stop bothering us)

An interesting simple explanation of net neutrality debate. Turns out, according to these, that its all about rich people fighting over money. Who wudda ever thunk that? Telco’s need to pump terabytes of crappy movie and video feed into your home daily and make a killing off of it. Better to bribe the government to give them monopoly power over pricing than investing in more capacity and earning money the old fashioned way -getting paid same rate for each byte that goes though at given congestion rate (-like mail and parcel delivery services). I figure that means that if telecoms gets the net, they won’t start blackballing places like FDL until they are finished fighting over the TV and movie money.

Internet2-nonprofit, public service, academic and research internet project
http://commerce.senate.gov/pdf/bachula-020706.pdf
http://abilene.internet2.edu/
http://www.internet2.edu/~shal.....ality.html

Ghostman .. wrong logic. Read more carefully, infer a bit, think a little more, and then apologize to Ms. Hamsher.

Ghostman at 33 — I see you are busy but the question about the witch wasn’t about Halloween so much. Since you used so many terms that are associated with familiars at 27 I thought that you might share Mr. Erna’s belief structure and be an actual witch. I must say I was confused when you introduced Ms. Hamshire to the topic.

As far as the military — they are pretty good at taking care of themselves so I will not try to come to their rescue. Its all scary to me.

Billmon’s video diagnosis of Bill Frist’s preznit ambitions –

http://billmon.org/archives/002424.html

Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist today denied reports that his presidential ambitions have slipped into a persistently vegetative state, saying they are alert and responding to visual stimulus.

“Based on the videotapes I’ve seen of recent GOP dinners in New Hampshire and Iowa, I would say my political prospects definitely display signs of higher brain functions,†Frist told reporters in Washington. “They can blink and swallow, and their eyes will still track objects – such as large contribution checks – waved in front of them.â€

Joe– that seems a little teensy bit oh so slightly obvious when I checked the website that JWR link to and saw the graphics… and the name, well you know…

41, Ms. Hamsher:
“You can tilt at straw men all you want but your comments are ignorant, illiterate right wing talking points that are not borne out by any evidence”.
No, no straw men here…and I have no clue what the latest “right wing talking points” might be. I don’t even go to their web sites….they all seem to be on another wavelength than am I.
And, you can call me ignorant and illiterate all you want….but that article was an attack by Babcock. Plain and simple.
Ghostman

Enough with this crap about musicians being dumb. I’ve been playing for almost 40 years. And in that time I’ve been lucky enough to play with some of the best in the business. They are neither dumb, nor fated to do nothing but write songs. They are some of the smartest, most knowledgeable, most courageous, most politically aware people I’ve known.

You know I love this site, and I understand you can’t hit ‘em all out of the park. Have seen Godsmack three times, they improve every time. Having named themselves after a track on the Alice in Chains opus to addiction “Dirt”, their freshman album sounded a little close to Alice. They continued to develop their own sound.

Sully is an excellent percussionist and you can tell by his music that their sound, including the guitar, is based off percussion.

I didn’t like the whole “ambush” interview thing, did nothing for me. All the wonderful free spirited 60’s anthem are now commercial for GM, Ford, or ETrade. Hell, the Beatles “Revolution” was a Nike commercial. Sting’s “Desert Rose” was a Jaguar commercial.

‘Nuff said from me on this topic. I look forward to moving on to a different topic.

And in Ozzy’s defense, can you name me a song protesting the Vietnam War with more biting, scathing lyrics than “War Pigs”?

Make sure you read his lyrics before you rebutt.

If you are up late enuff to watch tonight’s replay of Colbert, do watch it. Paul Rieckhoff
was amazing! (I think angie already said that) I wasn’t paying close attention, then suddenly, Rieckhoff opened his mouth, and WOW.

I think he might have argued fiercely with Ghostman about the role the Godsmacked music might have played in the recruitment of those young ‘uns, many of whom have died in the “protection” of our country against all those Eye-raqis who wanted to invade our nation and attack us. (loooong sentence)

I have to admit that I do not think allowing the military to use a song is a big deal. They would have used something nearly identical anyway. Some one is going to get the money. I guess that is the economist in me. If I had a band, I don’t think I would allow military to use my stuff for recruiting as long as BushCo in power, though. But, the band guy clearly had not thought about any of the ethical issues at all. Not for one second. I’m a musician so I don’t want to imply anything about our smarts, but this guy sounded like he has consumed way too much Everclear of some kind, at some time.

I think the interviewer was all over the map on what the main point he was trying to make, though.

49, shazam….oh. Well, I don’t even know what a witch “religion” is all about. Never followed it, and have no interest in such “religions? beliefs?”
Ghostman

You go Wyo Nate

But you got to agree that he did a good job with the ambush and that is part of the game.

in other words, yes, it was an ambush interview, if you think it is cool for some one not to give one second of thought about ethical implications of how some one uses your music (military, government, private compancy, charity, whatever). I don’t think it is cool at all. So to Erna, all I can say is -grow up, smell the coffee, and get a clue.

Ghostman #47: Babcock needs to get off his ass and go march on D.C., not attack some kid who’s only act in life is to write a song.

If his only act in life was to write a song, there would have been nothing to attack. But he wrote songs that appeal to people of prime recruiting age, and sold some to the military to recruit them. Someone who just wants to “write a song” (or even make a living off it) doesn’t have to sell it to advertisers; that’s pretty much the definition of “selling out.”

Asking him to justify that (or at least admit it was just for the money and he doesn’t care) is just as legitimate as it would be for someone whose songs are used in cigarette ads, or Hummer ads.

Hi Mrs. K8 -

I am so sorry to hear about the diagnosis - I hope you and your pupster can enjoy many more years together.

I don’t know how to weigh one suffering against another. For me, a battle against cancer in a beloved pet seems like a very great burden.

Prayers and healing thoughts for you both.

So the military is going to advertise using a song called “Sick of Life”? Given the current recruiting environment, I’ve gotta give them props for honesty, but…

Or maybe they’re gonna use it to recruit for the Iraqi army…

In other words, I think these people should be able to sell and license their music to whoever they want. Free country, etc. But to get all pissy when some one asks you about the obvious and serious implications of allowing it to be used for military recruiting while a rather suspect war is on, that is silly and sad of him. I do not know one thing about this guy. I wonder, though, if he got all pissy and defensive and “hey, chill, dude” about it because he sensed potentially serious marketing vibes about it. I wunner. Dixie Chicks, and Neil Young, and a few other bands are protesting now with good music and thoughtful music. He might worry if he is endangering all his fans who can think.

Ghostman — find the part where I (or Jay) belittle people who have died in the military. That is a very serious accusation, one I take very personally. Go on, find it. You’ve accused me of it, I want to see it.

I recall there were some celebrities who were sued for the commercials they performed in and the products they promoted. To say or imply that musicians ought not to be held responsible for how their music is used is a bit much. At least when it is the military using the music. I would think that regardless or how the music is used in military promotions, it isn’t being used to promote peace.

Im not sayig the musicians are responsible for death. But I am saying they can’t claim ignorance when they permit the use of their work by an orgnization whose specialty is war.

Wyo Nate #55 - You won’t get any disagreement from me wrt Ozzie, and “War Pigs” is excellent lyrically. And while not nearly as pointed, but as relevant today as in 1970, is Steppenwolf’s “Monster”.

http://www.steppenwolf.com/lyr/mnnster.html

#61, redshift….actually, your comment is the most lucid of the “ghostman dogpile” (chuckle) that most seem to enjoy. Here’s where I disagree with you:
yes, the kid wrote songs to appeal to other kids for recruiting purposes. I say: nothing wrong with that! Under MOST circumstances, serving in the military is a very honorable thing to do. The current problem is a POLICY decision…not a problem WITH the military. There are NO ethical problems with serving in the military. And, to compare the “ethics” of being in the military with cigarette ads is, in my opinion, very incorrect.
We should praise those that serve, and have served over the many decades. When they find themselves in a “bad war”….its not those soldiers who got us there. It was the policy-makers.
redstate, hope you see my distinction.
Ghostman

OT

Valerie Plame Wilson Seeks Book Deal

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05.....ref=slogin

“Don’t belittle all those boys who died….and died on battlefields and in oceans across this globe…just so bubble-headed people could belittle them, as has been done here.”
ghostman, that phony patriotism doesn’t fly here. Have you ever heard of the “Powell Doctrine?” If we had followed it, we never would have occupied Iraq. You can’t occupy a country of 25 million with 150,000 troops. Jane and Christy and their guest posters are leading the fight to SUPPORT our troops by getting them the hell out of harms way, Iraq and Afghanistan. In my opinion you owe a “clear as can be” apology to Jane in the comments, now. You don’t get to insult as thorough an American patriot as Jane Hamsher, with one of the worst insults that can be hurled at an American as “belittleing American dead in service of their country.”

Not to beat a haunted horse, but Ghostman’s perspective on the Godsmack interview is interesting if placed in historical perspective.

Step 3 in progression to outright revolution is granting or withholding support of a regime. The foremost expression of that development is that the grantors and withholders start duking it out publicly. The withholders start to shame their fellows who are complicit in supporting the regime and make it clear that they will be publicly humiliated, followed by progressively worse fates.

Noam Chomsky addressed West Point on April 21st. Steven Colbert openly mocked the preznit the next weekend. This interview, small case in point. This is the humiliation phase. Choose ye this day whom ye will serve, and remember thy oaths.

Ghostman.

I just sell my software to pimps, knowing full well they’re pimps and they’re going to use it to be more efficient in pimping them out the ho’s.

Am I complicit in their schemes?

Certainly.

And if someone attacks me for doing so, is that wrong? (Seems only reasonable, provided you think pimping ho’s is wrong.)

Hey, I only gassed a few jews because it was my job.

Hey, I only rob banks to put my kids through college.

Hey, I only sold them the song to promote their recruiting.

Hey I only sold them my software to help them pimp their ho’s better.

They’re all the same shades of the same motivating stuff.

So, either you’re proud of selling a song that promotes the kids to join the millitary (…and the terrible things the millitary is doing) and the terrible things that may happen to those kids or you’re not. (I suppose you could attempt to make the case that joining the millitary and fighting a war of aggression in Iraq is a GOOD thing…)

I just think he should have simply said. I’m proud to support the millitary. I believe in what they’re doing. But he couldn’t back up the second argument, clearly has no clue about it.

So, one has to wonder about the sanity of saying “I support the military” when you have no real clue what’s going on. You have no facts to back up why what they’re doing is a good thing.

Sure, Arthur mag had a point. They drove it home. But the result was clear. Godsmack was a lot more interested in something other than really knowing and defending the millitary and being used as a tool in recruiting. And it sounds a lot like money to me.

Is Godsmack complicit? You tell me. I know what I think. I’d have a hard time believing you actually honestly think something different.

Cheers,
Greg

Ghostman at 68. Nice try. You still need to apologize.

they recently signed another contract for three years for the use of the song Sick of Life.

“Sick of Life”, join the Navy. Unintentionally appropriate. Apparently the recruitment department is completely irony-deaf.

Quite possibly this Babcock fellow doesn’t care much for the military at all, and doesn’t distinguish between our armed forces saving lives in Kosovo or destroying them in Iraq. But one does not have to share his worldview to agree with his comments as they pertain to a military broken by Bush, Cheney, and Rumsfeld.

The military is an honorable calling. But to join when Republicans have any chance of being in charge of it is about the biggest mistake a young person can make with his/her life, because they will throw your life away just to win the next election. And anyone who lends his fame, his influence, or his art to assist in obscuring how bad a choice it is, deserves nothing but scorn.

hang a left # 69–

thank you!

*ahem* maestro, please (tune West Side Story):

Could it be? Yes, it could.
Something’s coming, something good,
If I can wait!
Something’s coming, I don’t know what it is,
But it is
Gonna be great!

Not withstanding what I just wrote… *grin*

BTW, I think we ought to quit throwing perls to the swine.

Cheers,
Greg

MarcLord #71~
i’m fairly new to revolution. Where are you getting the 3rd step in the progression to outright revolution? and does that mean when I say to people who have bush-cheney bumper stickers they ought to be ashamed, i’m doing the 3rd step? please direct me to what you’re refering…

Godsmacked: The Pied Pipers of US Imperialism

Ghostman #68 - yes, I agree. You have been emitting a dogpile. And it’s stinking up the place.

Oops, the name of the band is Godsmack not Godsmacked (as the post says), or Gobsmacked as I thought. This kind of rock all sounds the same to me.

I know some friends’ kids who were recruited, and what the recruiters tell them these days is damn close to lying. So you got parents and friends saying “Look, if you sign up, you will go to Iraq and you will be in a combat situation, are you sure you want that? I don’t care what they say. They are sending 55 year olds who thought they were retired, you think they won’t send you?” The recruiters swear up and down that its a “specialty” company they are going into, and “look, see here, I got the list of where you might be assigned to go after training, its just a few months away, it’s set, dude. Germany’s on there, Hawaii, Southern California, I don’t see no Iraq”

Of course, as soon as trainings over and they go through the motions of listing their choices for billets, or whatever they’re called, but, gosh, something comes up and they are going straight to Iraq for guard duty. I’ve seen this happen twice.

So, if anyone half way aware should see that is a big problem to support that in anyway. This is tough, becuase the military should be supported, and it is honorable, and if no one joined there would be very dangerous melt down in national security that no one should eant. But I’ve seen two recruiting situations that were just not right by any standard.

I recall Me3 stating why Tamiflu wasn’t very effective against H5N1 and that there was something else readily available that would help more but isn’t being widely talked up. It’s buried in comments from last winter. So, Me3, if you catch this, care to use your expertise to remind us? muchas gracias.

Relenza ;)

I’m in the middle of essay questions for a huge exam tomorrow…but two of my favorite subjects are rock ‘n roll and politics.

On election night 2004 I was at Megadeth. I was happy as hell, having voted for Kerry, and being lucky enough to see Dave Mustaine, the man who had mocked Bush I musically over the course of two albums. Hell, he basically predicted the Bush problem with the song “Holy wars” months before we were in Iraq the first time.

Mustaine was an intergral player for the first wave of Mtv’s Rock the Vote push. He interviewed numerous candidates live at the dNC convention that gave us Clinton.

On election night he stopped the band and asked the crowd if they wanted to know who won the election, then he told them. Then he told a story about John Kerry refusing to talk to him in 1992, something about Kerry thinking it was beneath him to talk to a heavy metal performer. Mustaine said he voted for Bush in 2004, was happy that Bush won. I was in shock.

Megadeth’s latest album is called “The System Has Failed”, I think he wanted Bush to win because he thinks that this will punish Americans for squandering their time and their country on the lesser of two evils. The public gets what they deserve, they were lazy, easily swayed, and compliant with all the corruption running rampant since nixon. And he thinks this might get them off their ass…

Then again, Dave was never known for his ability to get along with others.

Good call, steppenwolf!

#65, Ms. Hamsher, “find the part….”, etc. I never said you wrote any such thing. Find the part where I said you “wrote” such a thing.
I’m going on the entire tone and tenor of Babcock’s article. And your WRITTEN comment, at top of the article, that you think it’s really funny.
Well, I see, or saw nothing funny about Babcock’s interview. He proved nothing to me.
So, does anyone here…can anyone here….say that they ARE damn proud of our military? Go ahead and object to how they’re being used in these times….I sure do. But rather than jump on me, I think the more interesting question is whether anyone can just come out and say “I’m proud of everything our boys have done trying to serve.”
Oh well. I still think redshift is the best comment, but I still disagree with his analysis.
Ghostman

Leslie @77,

Yes, shaming those who have Bush-Cheney bumper stickers would be a 3rd Step thing.

Step 1 would be Splintering, in which groups start to form and take advantage of a growing conflict in a way that benefits them as a whole. Blacks and Native Americans, along with serf-like whites, did this in the run-up to the American Revolution. In essence Step 1 makes a growing conflict more expensive for a regime without resorting to open resistance. It can be as simple as an illegal immigrant not working as conscientiously because of disagreement on new government policy.

Step 2 would be Testing Authority, in which protests are undertaken that are intended to provoke the regime into arrests, but not into shooting the protesters. Obviously results here vary widely.

Not sure where this came from, but it’s probably stolen from somewhere in my readings of the American Revolution as a young boy. Step 4 is Repression, Step 5 is Rebellion.

ghostman, you assumed you were someone who could lecture Jane Hamsher:
“Don’t belittle all those boys who died….and died on battlefields and in oceans across this globe…just so bubble-headed people could belittle them.â€
Don’t weasel out of what you started. You can posture all you like about Godsmack’s right to sell to the highest bidder, AFTER you apologize to Jane. You owe her a “clear as can be” apology. Your ridiculous attempt to paint her as anything than less than the real patriot she is, is beyond obscene.

Ghostman — so let me see if I get your argument. I said the article was funny, and you deduce I am laughing at soldiers who died in Iraq.

And your insinuations that you are the only one on this thread who is proud of the military are pompous and insulting.

85, john casper….well buddy, we just disagree.
Ghostman

My son, who was injured in Iraq and is considered non-deployable now, got orders to become a recruiter. Good kid, doesn’t really want to do recruiting, but will go out there and sell the Army to other kids because that will be his job.

So right now, I’m not seeing that interview as being all that funny.

sorta off topic.

hmmm, I wonder if ole Lt General Boykin would approve of Sully’s message and beliefs? (and btw, I have no problem with any religion/belief or lack thereof at all, I just don’t really think the dudes in power would be happy to advertise this little bitty thingie they may have missed about their theme song group.) Godsmacked would not, I think, appeal to this man.

Remember Boykin? :

>>>>>>
Discussing the battle against a Muslim warlord in Somalia, Boykin told another audience, “I knew my God was bigger than his. I knew that my God was a real God and his was an idol.”

“We in the army of God, in the house of God, kingdom of God have been raised for such a time as this,” Boykin said last year.

On at least one occasion, in Sandy, Ore., in June, Boykin said of President Bush: “He’s in the White House because God put him there.”

“Support the Troops” is a meaningless phrase, Ghostman. Either you support the war, and the criminals who put our troops there, or you don’t. You very well DID accuse Jane of going after our soldiers and now you’re trying to weasel your way our of it. You use the same approach as poor, stupid Sully. Go take a hot bath and get back to us another time.

You’ve lost the argument.

Ghostman,

Read your offensive post. Reflect. And, then deal with it. Accept responsibility.

Ghostman,
With all due respect, it is a big more complicated than that. Yes, of course, we are all proud of people who serve their country with honor, even in a mess like the Iraq invasion. But see my comment above. I have personally seen friends’ kids (kids who I know very well and love -and they are kids, still in high school) being seriously mislead about a life and death situation. That cannot be acceptable to this country, even if it is the US military, which we do still need, doing it.

The Godsmack dude obviously had not given a seconds thought to the seriousness of allowing his works to be used for recruitint kids, for making life and death decisions. So, yeah, I diagree with a lot of the interviewer’s attitude and some of his assumptions. But how clueles can sully be? Too much Everclear?

TR, deepest