
(This is the first week we’re devoting to Crashing the Gate. Next week the authors will be joining us for a discussion of the book, once again at 2pm PDT/5pm EDT.)
That the book Crashing the Gate by Jerome Armstrong and Markos Moulitsas Zuniga would have an impact well beyond the blogosphere became quickly apparent when it wound up on the cover of the New York Review of Books . Since the dominant narrative regarding liberal blogs had heretofore been shaped by people like Jim Brady, Deborah Howell and Hugh Hewitt whose agendas involve deflecting criticism of their own weaknesses by focusing on what they perceived as "incivility" in their critics, it was refreshing to see that there was finally a new and much more perceptive way to talk about the blogosphere. Speaking about Daily Kos, the article observes:
Obsessed with developing strategies for defeating Republicans, the site was much involved with the campaign of Howard Dean for the presidential nomination and carrying on his forthright opposition to the Iraq war. Its sophisticated technological structure, assembled by Moulitsas, has allowed its viewers to raise money for favored politicians, rethink and debate issue positions, harass lazy or ideologically biased journalists and commentators, and even help break stories that the mainstream press managed to overlook. In doing so, it has explicitly tried to chart a new future for the Democrats—the subject of the book under review—and implicitly suggested new possibilities for the American political system that might help it break free of the grip of big money. It also raises large questions about the future of journalism. In my view, nothing more interesting has happened in American politics for many years.
The book is light years ahead of anything else out there in terms of analyzing the current political landscape and the growing role of the netroots. Today I’d like to focus on the first half of the book, and pose three questions which strike me as important topics of discussion:
1) The book starts out by confirming what is only too painfully obvious to most observers — rather than go on the attack, leading Democrats are content to sit back and wait for the Republican party to self-destruct. It’s a dangerous strategy. But the GOP is not monolithic, and as Kos and Jerome break it down, it is a loose coalition of interest groups that include Corporate Cons (whom they typify in Halliburton and Joe Albaugh), Theocons like James Dobson and Pat Robertson, the Neocons such as Perle, Wolfowitz and the members of the PNAC, and xenophobic Paleocons like Pat Buchannan and Robert Novak.
If the Democratic party were actually to take an active role in promoting wedge issues that split one group or another off from the consensus, how would it best be achieved?
2) There has been much discussion of the failure of interest groups to support a long-term agenda for a progressive movement as they focus on short-term goals while their causes steadily lose ground. Their description of Karl Rove’s tactics in Texas to push conservative judges onto the bench for lifetime appointments shows just how frightening is the long game of the Republicans, and how glaring the failure is of Democrats to catch up with what is happening. As Rove saw it then, and clearly sees it now, the country can be permanently inoculated against changing political tides that the Democratic leaders seem to rely on for regaining power by stacking the judiciary:
[It's less important to be a majority party in Congress or control the White House or state governments than it is to have a society that has been reengineered to reflect conservative dogma. The longer Republicans can forestall their inevitable fall from grace and power, and the more judges they can place in the judiciary, the closer they come to that realignment of American society. While legislators mark their terms in two, four, or six years, and while presidents come and go every four or eight years, federal judges are appointed for life. The grand conservative vision includes an overhaul of the Constitution, and to do that, the holders of this vision need to place relatively young conservative judges on the bench, ensuring that long after voters finally oust the Republicans, their political interpretations of the Constitution continue to impede progress.
The failure of interest groups to come to terms with this fact is consistently staggering as they argue about the voting record of people like Lincoln Chafee and talk about how "pro-choice" or "pro-environmental" he is, without taking into consideration that most of the votes he casts on behalf of those issues are largely symbolic and he never deviates from the party when it counts, and certainly not when it comes to keeping dangerous judges off the bench. Yet these interest groups continue to give progressive bona fides to these candidates and block the efforts of true progressives to get elected. In that respect they have become downright dangerous to the causes they espouse.
How can these groups be either changed or neutralized in the current political landscape and keep them from at least doing further damage to the causes they have so hopelessly failed to defend?
3) There were two paragraphs that jumped out at me regarding the netroots and the working class. One with regard to the odd coalition of big business and working class voters:
Of the twenty-eight states with the lowest per-capita income, Bush carried twenty-six. Republicans have convinced some of these poorest of the poor that government is powerless to improve their economic situation, thus they focus on "values" issues instead: Terri Schiavo, abortion, gays, prayer in school, the Ten Commandments in public spaces. The promotion of these "values" becomes the government’s top concern, even as the economy suffers and wars rage.
And a bit later, they make what I believe to be one of the most profound observations of the entire book:
While it might be easy to get caught up with the emergence of the netroots effort, and think the internet holds the answer to everything that ails Democrats, it’s currently difficult to reach a large chunk of working-class Americans without labor’s help. These union members are not engaging in politics online, or are not engaged at all, and can be swayed by the Right’s culture-war attacks on Democrats to the detriment of their own economic well-being.
If labor unions can begin to build alliances with the rest of the progressive groups and begin to articulate their concerns in the language of morality and basic human rights — a living wage, access to health care, workplace protections, and so on — they can be a major force in helping revive the progressive movement, and the Democratic Party as well.
Kos and Jerome note that the unions are uneasy about Democrats because of the unchecked negative image sketched by media blatherers, but I’ll also add that many people within the netroots (as well as many of the working-class voters) have equal misgivings about labor unions due to the powerful negative narratives sketched by the right-wing noise machine about them, too.
If there is value in joining with working labor unions into the progressive effort (and I believe it is quite imperative), how can they work together? And what is the best way to overcome the endemic fearfulness that keeps them apart?
Related posts:
- FDL Book Salon Welcomes Matthew Kerbel, Netroots: Online Progressives and the Transformation of American Politics
- FDL Book Salon Welcomes, Marc J. Hetherington and Jonathan Weiler, Authoritarianism and Polarization in American Politics
- FDL Book Salon Welcomes Eric Boehlert, Bloggers on the Bus: How the Internet Changed Politics and the Press
- FDL Book Salon Welcomes Douglas A. Blackmon, Slavery By Another Name
- FDL Book Salon Welcomes Bruce Bartlett, The New American Economy: The Failure of Reaganomics and a New Way Forward





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Yay, book club. :) (I’m such a geek.)
First Fitz, now Colbert…
Legislators like Conyers have brought the necessary discipline to tackling deep issues to the netroots…
Christy and I got lucky, we’ve had the book for a while and have had a long time to digest it. It definitely requires at least two readings, it’s incredibly short but dense. And important. Did I mention important?
“it is a book full of key words and hot air.”
1) “If the Democratic party were actually to take an active role in promoting wedge issues that split one group or another off from the consensus, how would it best be achieved?”
Maybe the Democrats should form some sort of policy council, which would include members from the House and Senate, some governors and state legislators, party officials, and most importantly, some carefully chosen representatives of the grassroots. This could be something like the party’s platform committee, but as far as I know that body only meets every four years. The point is to create some kind of forum for finding out what policy positions the party can agree on, and then encouraging elected Democratic officials to advocate those positions in Congress and the state legislatures. If anything (other than the platform committee) like this already exists, it obviously isn’t working and needs to be fixed. This idea would only work if everyone involved was genuinely committed to building a consensus, not to creating a laundry list of special interests. If the DLC or any of the presidential campaigns, for example, were to hijack it, it would fail.
Thanks for doing this, Jane. Is Christy here too?
Of the twenty-eight states with the lowest per-capita income, Bush carried twenty-six.
This is a good place to start. These are the people who vote emotionally, on hot button issues. These areas have to be targeted to show them how much the GOP has cost them-literally.
It is a fantastic book — and it left me hungering for an answer to “okay, what do we do next?” I think discussion like these are essential in all of us moving the ball forward. And I am SO grateful to Markos and Jerome for getting the discussion started on this. Anyone who hasn’t yet read the book, try to get a copy of your own or one from the library and take a read — it is not only worth your while, but it will honestly change how you view the political landscape. Powerful stuff.
Hi, Christy. Good to see you.
I’ll leave you guys to it :-) Christy thanks for your great posting below – all of that needs to be said and repeated and acted upon time and time again. We’re only as civilised as how we treat our weakest and most powerless. Thanks for hammering that home.
Mark.
For me the big message in Crashing the Gates is that the GOP is only part of what is wrong with America’s political culture- the Democrats and the media are equally to blame, and we can’t begin to turn the situation around unless we confront that painful truth.
The Dems need to analyze the votes of some of those conservative judges the rightwing likes so much, and highlight the votes in corporate cases. Then find people who were affected by those rulings, and show the public what the corporate agenda really is.
See if any of those legal rulings fit in any version of Christianity.
it doesn’t take a rightwinger to see that labor unions aim at protecting their members & excluding others, which is one reason why we have both a high rate of unemployment & millions of illegal immigrants — our labor system creates a vacuum that only illegals can fill, specially when it comes to the smaller businesses that drive our economic creativity — i prefer to side with the illegals: they represent a tide that will ultimately make us competitive worldwide — progressives need to team up with small business — forget large corporations — forget labor unions — how many new ideas that meet the needs of our citizens & thus create jobs come from unions or from large corporations or from wall street? bugger all, that’s how many
Jane — I think that the answers on #1 and #3 are actually intertwined. I’ve been trying to find a path for progressives through the bogus “religious right” wilderness for a while now here in WV. The media and to some extent blogs portray religious people as being as monolothic as “Republicans” and “Democrats,” but it just isn’t so. Moderates exist on all sides who hold a lot of the same values — but we either don’t here from them, or we don’t do a good enough job of speaking to them and to the issues they find to be important. No idea how we best do that, though.
Let me say that with regard to my No. 5 above (question 1), I have been frustrated when I contact the DCCC and the DSCC to tell them, for example, that I will send them money when the Democratic caucuses in the House and Senate support a troop withdrawal from Iraq and support Sen. Russ Feingold’s censure resolution. They tell me that their organizations have nothing to do with policy and that I need to contact the House and the Senate with my policy concerns. How can they coordinate a coherent and effective national campaign to take back the houses of Congress, if they aren’t advising their candidates on issues? I don’t know whether to not believe them, or just to be sad that they are so ineffective in this area. And by the way, when I try to contact members of Congress, such as DCCC chair Rahm Emanual, their offices inform me that they will only respond to contacts from the member’s own state. So where do I go with my policy concerns–Howard Dean?
TheOtherWA — to me that’s where labor comes in. These are the people who instinctively ARE sensitive to the appeals of what labor unions stand for, yet they have been steadily mistrustful of them and cut off from participation in them in a variety of ways (most of which rest in the messaging of the right-wing noise machine). I don’t know how to build a better narrative that will cut through this, but I think it’s imperative that we do so. And we’re going to have to work with labor to do that.
…on the progressive netroots, more like. But anyway, wide-open sites like Kos are powerful and inspirational, but visiting those sites is like attending a large conference: a huge range of seminars is available to select from, but things happen and move so fast that in-depth follow-up is difficult–it’s sometimes like the chatter of small groups who meet just after a meeting and chat a bit about the issue, then move on to the next. On the one hand we can get our ideas ‘out there’ for discussion, but on the other hand, settling on strategies and fine-tuning goals is difficult. Labour unions can perhaps bring the necessary focus and long-term attention required to make the big changes required in the work arena, from OSHA to out-sourcing. The progressive netroots also provide an open forum so that ideas don’t become entrenched and open discussion a pro forma effort.
For #2, how can these groups possible rationalize their support of someone like Chaffee? It’s as if they believe that their only concern is their voting record in regards to abortion, or the environment, and that their will be some other single issue group out there that will take care of someone like Chaffee in regards to their voting in rigt-wing judges. And this is how you can see their “check-off boxes” and candidates being “100% single-issue aligned” comes into play for the voter. Because no longer is there a coherent worldview around which the candidate can align, instead it’s a loosely-connected yarn of whichever groups have strong enough representation to be one of the boxes that gets checked-off.
I don’t think they can be changed, because their worldview is out-dated. As we’ve been out on tour, it’s not the progressive people in the Sierra Club or Planned Parenthood that are out there putting together events; it’s groups like DFA and PDA and DL– these are future “movement groups” of the progressive movement. But in the short-term, we do need to focus on tactics that neutralize single-issue groups.
Hard to ponder three questions at once. So one at a time.
Question 1 about how to split the 3 pieces of the Republicrook party with a wedge.
It seems to me that the beginning of the light came a year ago over Terri Schiavo. The crooks thought they had a winning issue to such a degree that W interrupted his precious vacation to rush in to sign a stupid bill. It was the first time that there was actually backlash from the wingers.They got their focus group polling all wrong.
Too many families have had to deal with loved ones dying sometimes under difficult circumstances that the thought of the government barging into family decision making is abhorent.
Here is a useful wedge that we did not capitolize on at the time since it took us by surprise (shocking ain’t it?) This and other issues like it—take the way it is playing out in Texas— could be a useful wedge to start more and more wingers thinking about their own families again.
I don’t think we are quite ready to go there yet, but someone on TNH was starting to think about what a 28th amendment, “Right to Privacy” would look like. It seems to me that this would be worth putting a lot of work into. I know I’d sign up.
Neurophius — I was going to get into the whole DSCC/DCCC mess outlined in the book but it was getting long and I didn’t have time to do so. Anyone frustrated with the big Dems for cutting the legs out from underneath Feingold on the censure resolution will find in this book that they have a history of doing that with him, up to and including running negative ads against his opponent in the last election in spite of his specific requests that they do not.
Then there is the whole issue of fat consultants beholden to these groups for their jobs, and the candidates who must accept these career losers onto their teams in order to get financial support from the DSCC/DCCC, money that quickly gets sucked up in big consulting fees for expensive, poorly-targeted media campaigns that benefit nobody but the pocketbooks of said loser consultants…it is just disgusting.
Jerome! We have an author in the house ;)
Jerome, No. 18, I think the book is great. I’ve finished reading about two thirds of it. I am wondering, with regard to issue-oriented groups, what you and Markos are advocating. I belong to some of those groups. I give money to some of those groups. I would hate to see a mass desertion of them by progressives. But I would also like to have a group to support that I know is effectively working to build a progressive movement that transcends single issues. Does one exist?
CTG is the best political book I have read in ages. The apparent oxymoronic alliance between the GOP and lower middle class white voters can be directly linked to the destruction of the labor movement begun under Reagan. The GOP has been able to convince this group that democrats don’t/can’t support their goals and aspirations. In addition, the GOP southern strategy has always relied on an undercurrent of racism-that strategy works not only in the south but across large swaths of middle America.
Democrats must speak vigorously of the need to serve the COMMON GOOD and achieve policy success based on this philosophy.
If middle America is tired of the lies, the rubber stamp GOP congress, and corporate welfare perhaps they will take another look at democrats. The democratic leadership however, must play offense and not just defense.
The strongest section of CTG was the case made against national democratic electoral strategy. I was appalled by what I read-we must do things differently in order to win. The 50 state strategy is a great place to start.
To me, the essence of the book was the focus on remedial coalition-building. We need to look for common ground and leverage it for mutual benefit instead of administering litmus tests to disown potential allies. If Democrats can’t do that, they can’t do anything.
No. 23 and 24. Are these contradictory? (50 state strategy vs. common ground) Or can they be reconciled?
Jerome! Hi. The most surprising thing about the book for me too was the consultants and how the money gets spent. The current system of rewarding those who do the party’s bidding regardless of outcome is ridiculous.
But then, that explains why Bob Shrum is still around. Other than giving money directly to candidates and not the DCCC, what can we do to change the way things are done in elections?
Please credit the artist from the NYRoB for the Markos caricature. The magazine, and the artist deserve more recognition, especially from the erudite left blogosphere.
I was struck by how the book surprised some people, in that it dealt with institutional infrastructure, more than message.
But to me, that’s where the action must be. We don’t lack for ideas as a party. We lack for execution.
The best recent message analysis comes from here, to my way of thinking:
http://www.prospect.org/web/pa…..leId=11455
I am also very curious about how to combine the union grassroots energy with the netroots. I’m hoping our Roots Project infratructure could help there, over the long term, if it takes off.
I was struck by the effective presence of the SEUI at the immigration rallies, and hope to see more arenas for collaboration between the Change to Win coalition and the netroots.
I, too, thought the section on consultants was enlightening. I have been active in the Democratic Party in various ways for over 30 years, and I had never heard about the party forcing candidates to hire from a list of favored consultants.
Pach, 28
Being on the outside of the union universe these days, it was not easy for me to understand the big split last year. It does seem to me that there is a change in the atmosphere now though.
I agree with you that seing the SEUI step up and organize over the immigration was BIG. This issue isn’t going to go away and hopefully the unions are working night and day on how to grow their voice and numbers through this.
Jerome, I have a question:
In the Roots Project, a decentralized, locally controlled network we have set up and which we counsel in an advisory capacity, they get a weird reception from their local senators’ offices.
These offices try to label them as an interest group, trying to sort out how they are organized from some top-down perspective, like some issue group.
But these are constituents developing their own agendas and messages in-state.
How do you teach traditional pols to interact with citizen based grassroots movements that are not propelled and funded by some centralized agenda or organization? How can they be taught to understand something like the Roots Project when what they understand is the K-Street Project?
Comments 19 & 20 poit toward how the Democrats became weak. The combined events of the 70’s-90’s of the rightwing mobilization of voters to elect Republicans served to weaken the Democrats confidence in their own party turnout, and increase their reliance upon the consultants for shaping their message. So that with a case like Shiavo (and being afraid of pissing off wingers) it led to the reliance on network polling before a direction was (half-heartedly) taken.
In general, I don’t believe that consultants are useful at all in terms of policy (expept for timing and presentation). We should have candidates that run because they have something to stand for and see the need to legislate. The good ones can sense what the issues are without the need of polling or focus groups.
I think there’s effective wedging going on in MO right now, against Talent over the issue of stem cell research. But the right wingers are not going to go down without a fight there, and are trying to capture the issue by framing it over killing “embryos”, so watch them ramp that one up quite a bit there.
The OtherWa (7) says:Of the twenty-eight states with the lowest per-capita income, Bush carried twenty-six.
This is a good place to start. These are the people who vote emotionally, on hot button issues. These areas have to be targeted to show them how much the GOP has cost them-literally.
My response: I asked my sister why, since these values were important to her, had her elected officials (with the presidency and both houses under their control) not actually accomplished their promises. I didn’t attack her values, which for her, trump the economics. I got her thinking about how her values were being used to gain votes, but not deliver results. I suspect that softened her up a bit and helped her look at Bush more clearly in the aftermath of Katrina. I also asked her to look at the actions of Bush in light of the Sermon on the Mount, a key part of our upbringing, and reminded her that not everyone who says, “Lord, Lord” is of the spirit. In other words, the conservatives lose their arguments on the grounds of the values themselves. I don’t expect my sister to have my values, but I hope she can recognize when she is being played by politicians about her own values.
Some in the DCCC still deny they exercise any message control over candidates, and claim they don’t force campaign staff on candidates as a condition of funding and support.
Jerome 18 — When I had my jaw-dropping moment during the Alito cloture vote, and found out that NARAL cared nothing about Chafee’s vote and weren’t up on the hill yanking his chain fiercely, I had up until that time accepted the notion that they were merely operating on an atatistic political model adopted somewhere in the early 1970s.
We tend to operate on the notion that these groups are run by idealists but I do not think that is true any more (something you cover in your book). The more I started writing about this subject, the more I started hearing from people who had worked in these organizations who felt that 5 years of Republican power had corrupted them, that the idealists were long gone and they were now being run by career lobbyists no different from those on K Street (save for the fact that they are virtually ineffectual) who are interested in self-perpetuation and proximity to power. It’s actually much uglier than it appears.
And when I found that NARAL had hired as a consultant Anna Greenberg, Stanley Greenberg’s daughter — well that was just proof.
On but also off topic is Josh Marshall’s new post about Iran and Rove and moving us into war before the election.
here
The point he is making is that we need to stop cowering in a corner playing defense and start playing offense, which I think is also part of the essence of the book.
Two caveats on this strategy.
1. Country Club Dems, comfortable with their station in life, will stab the working class in the back as quickly Republicans. CCD’s are more dangerous, because they will claim to represent you while they are giving you the shiv. They will oppose a working class uprising. They are already trying to keep net activists in their place.
2. Speaking as a former union lodge officer, legislative chair and grievance chair, unions must be reformed. Unions honchos have the same disease as CCD’s, far too comfortable with their station in life, and don’t want their boats rocked. I don’t know if Stern’s breakaway movement from the AFL/CIO is the right answer, but SOMETHING needed to be done.
The solution to both in an uprising from the membership to take the reins of power. Real people need to attend their precinct and county meetings, participate in the process and TAKE OVER. That is exactly what fundamentalists did to the Republican Party.
An example: After my union gig, I still wanted to be a political activist. I started attending my county’s party meetings. Next thing you know, I being given duties and responsibilities. These small groups, by virtue of attendance, make big decisions.
The key to this is the Internet (yes, Jane and Christie, I emailed my congressman on neutrality, and he emailed back!). Places like FDL are an information source and a means to coordinate activities accessible to regular folks. Net authors are the new Paines and Franklins, and just as important.
Virtual politics is part of the game, folks. Getting our hands dirty in the precincts is the other part.
Come on in, the water’s fine!
One of the big problems that I have seen at the local level here (and I suspect this is true elsewhere), is that the infrastructure for the Democratic party here is quite old, quite lazy and quite uninterested in doing anything other than attending a meeting now and then and hanging out at the annual party convention with their buddies from around the state. I suspect that WV is not alone in having this party issue — I know that Dean has been trying to reviltalize this, but the netroots involvement in this particular issue is going to be essential moving forward if we are going to get anywhere. Changes from outside and from within.
OT – If you want to send a thank-you note to Stephen Colbert and/or Comedy Central, here is the link:
http://www.comedycentral.com/h…..nsCC.jhtml
lol diogenes at 37 — GMTA
Jerome 32 — I also thought it was quite enlightening in the book when the DSCC pressured Tom Carson of Oklahoma not to hire Steve Eichenbaum, who had served as Feingold’s media consultant for the 1992 “miracle campaign”:
That pretty much says it all to me.
Diogenes No. 37
“Real people need to attend their precinct and county meetings, participate in the process and TAKE OVER.”
I agree with you. In my state, you do not need the party’s position to run for precinct committeeman or committeewoman. You just go to the county election office and register. They put your name on the primary ballot, and Democrats who vote in the primary can vote for you or someone else. You can campaign by getting your friends, neighbors and family to vote in the primary and vote for you. The next step is the county committee. The precinct committeepeople meet and elect a county chairman and other officers. They also elect delegates to the congressional district convention. The district convention in turn elects members of the state committee. The state committee elects a chairman and other officers, including Democratic national committeeman and committeewoman, who represent the state on the DNC (in my state the state chair is also automatically a member of the DNC). The DNC elects a chairman, and thus you have Howard Dean.
This is how the conservatives took over the Republican party after Goldwater’s defeat in 1964. You have to start at the ground level and work up.
Christy, 38
I agree with you on the rigidity of the state party structure, at least what I’ve seen of it in MA.
Yes, the party now has a blog and some of them even showed up at a “bloggers conference” last Dec. as did some of the pols. But it seemed to me that they saw our worth as a way of making more contacts that they could hit up or chat up rather than listen to.
With the roots project we are calling on our senators, but we haven’t ever talked about what we can/might do at the local level. In some ways it may be harder to break into that than it is to get a visit with a congressional staffer.
Jane at 41 — That section was a grabber for me as well. It’s not about winning — it’s about maintaining a patronage base. So sad.
Hey Jane, thanks for hosting the discussion.
neurophius, 22, I belong to some of these groups too, and I think we just have to re-orient ourselves to understand that they do not see themselves as part of a progressive movement. Democracy for America and Progressive Democrats of America are two such groups that do.
TheOtherWA, 26, we have to take the next step of accountability, and demanding from the candidates that they are no longer doing things like, for instance, paying media consultants by commission. The blogs in general should not be raising money for any candidate that is going to pay their media consultants by commission.
Pachacuetc, 31, the Roots Project, as you point out, executes on a level that doesn’t exist in their worldview of Democratic Politics. Some of these old pols are not going to adapt, and we are better off focusing on supporting candidates that are already there.
Jane, 35, I think the blogosphere-wide calling out of these groups tactics will go a long way toward getting them to listen.
diogenes — interesting observation that the unions suffer many of the same problems as the D’s and interest groups in general. Not a surprise. I also think the Stern thing is really compelling.
Correction to my 42 (in too big of a hurry)
you do not need the party’s PERMISSION
Also, I would add that in my state, the filing deadline for precinct committee candidates (and other candidates) is in early June. It may be earlier in some states. Now is the time to find out.
diogenes,
I agree that the key is the internet. I think the roots project is a perfect example of the way that people who meet on progressive blogs can weave together groups based on their geographic location, to begin grassroots, local efforts to influence their representatives.
We need to fight for net neutrality with everything we’ve got. It is the foundation. And, as a backup, we need to get our email addresses and contact info to people like Pach so that even if our blogs are taken away from us or limited, we can still flourish and grow via email correspondence.
Also, we should consider subsidizing those who play a role in the technical side of setting up and coordinating the roots project. We need technicians who will enable us to organize and coordinate with other similarly minded and overlapping groups, like the readers of DailyKos, etc.
In other words, everyone participating in and reading this conversation is actually a part of the initial stages of a coalition that, if properly organized and developed, will serve to achieve the goals that Jerome and Markos set forth in their books. The key really is organization. Of all the causes to put our money into right now, it is probably this. We have an army of volunteers, but we need to free up some of them from the regular jobs so that they can devote themselves full-time to developing a roots/CTG coalition effort.
As the effort develops, we can coordinate on points of emphasis and message, with the explicit understanding that even if some of us disagree on certain issues, we are united on winning and will throw our support behind the strategies that we collectively determine are best.
RevDeb at 43 — I’ve been attending my local Dem Women’s group for months now. I was so frustrated after the 2004 elections that I vowed to energize them or die trying. I’m still trying. But it is having an impact — would that I had six or seven more people of my mindset (am working on that as well). If all of us got involved locally, think of the difference that could make over time.
Pach #28
I went to skim the Prospect article you cited. I believe it’s essence is a reminder that leadership begins with a common vision of a preferred future and that government is for what our society holds and needs in common. Instead, it’s been used to get Lee Raymond a $400mil retirement package, to triple Halliburton’s share price, etc.
Turning the Wurlitzer on its head means depolarizing the country. It doesn’t mean blurring distinctions with Republicans, it means making a big distinction: Democrats are for the good of all, Republicans are for the good of a few.
Now that the mask has fallen after the 2004 election, there’s no lack of evidence. People are connecting the dots on their own. So the remaining tasks covered in CTG are (1) how to rewire the Democratic Party so that it’s once again functional is representing the common interest (2) whether Democratic politicians would make use of such a mechanism or run away from it.
Good discussion. I need to step out for a bit. If anyone has any questions or comments re my comments, I will be back later to respond.
Ellen #33, bingo. That’s what I want to do on a large scale.
How do we get conservative voters to read the emails from Abramoff and Reed, and see for themselves how the religious right is manipulating them? In one, Reed jokes about “those people getting their information from telephone trees and church” so it was easy to get them to vote the way Reed wanted them too. Which made him a lot of money, btw.
The facts are on the Dems side, but the message has to simple enough to cut through the fog.
A further point. If we can create a coalition like the one I discuss in my post, we can be the ones who call the special interest groups like Sierra, NARAL, etc. into our meetings to ask them how they plan to help US. It would be similar to the scene in Colorado depicted in CTG, where the candidate called everyone together and basically told them how it was going to be. It is also what Rove does for the Republicans, except in his case the instructions are coming from the top and in our case the instructions would be coming from the collective wisdom of a democratically spirited group.
.
Jerome, first – GREAT book. Perhaps because it validated some of my own experiences about watching candidates (even for state legislative spots and local gov’t) spend so much of their time “raising $$” — which is then spent to send out bs mail — that your views and INSTITUTIONAL analysis gave me hope that things can improve.
So for #2, how can the Netroots create some form of “Accountability Rating” for these groups? I would feel better about supporting them if there were some sort of ‘auditing device’ to show who’s producing results. I don’t see that currently, and am unaware of any resource.
On #3, I’ve taught workshops and retraining courses to guys in the construction, aerospace, and other industries who”d fall into the ‘union’ category and been fascinated by several things: (1) very, very few ever read a newspaper — their political lack of interest and cluelessness is stupifying to me, (2) their ‘cognitive styles’ are perfectly suited toward Karl Rove’s strengthts , cause these guys are nice but they get the bulk of their info in sound bites and at NASCAR and other sporting events (mostly football, baseball, basketball, NASCAR). Meanwhile, the ‘progressives’ play tennis, golf, boat, cycle… in other word, I see a huge culture gap between the two groups and plenty of inability to communicate.
Best thing about the union guys is how much they HATE being lied to… so as they realize the Repubs are bogus, their level of hostility can be impressive. But how to find a common communications method for two such culturally diverse groups…? Do you view my analysis on this point as apt?
What bothers me the most are the reasons why the BushCo GOP carries the lowest income states, and the open hostility of the DC Dems and the single issue groups to the progressive activists.
Low wage Americans vote GOP because they believe that neither party gives a damn about their economic situation, so they might as well vote for the party that reflects their cultural values. The sad truth is, they are right.
While GOP hypocrisy is self-evident, the Democrats have abandoned economic populism, in favor of Wall Street and Corporate cash. Davos Democrats might pay lip service to working Americans, but they vote for NAFTA and CAFTA and GATT when the chips are down.
The hostility of the DC Dems towards the netroots crystallized for me, with Rahm Emmanuel’s hostility towards Christine Cigalis. He went out of his way to sabotage her, and IMO, for no other reason than she was a grassroots candidate. This was more about preserving the top down Hillary control of the party than anything else.
The block-headedness of NARAL and the Sierra Club are self evident — they are entrenched bureaucratic organizations, that have abandoned their missions in favor of fund raising and going through the motions.
In fact, pretending to stand for something while going through the motions is the core problem for the Democratic Party — the comfort level of the entrenched estabishment is way too high.
Which is why Ned Lamont is so important . . .
We return to our regularly scheduled conversation after this short commercial break…
Be sure to stay tuned for the fever-swap’s “vitriolic” response to Joke Line’s mea culpa at:
http://www.time.com/time/colum…..10,00.html
Now back to your regularly scheduled programming…
It’s taken me more than 6 weeks to read this teeny little book; I have to read it in small bites and not in big gulps. Having read some monster tomes in my time (A New Kind of Science, anyone?), I’m shocked at how this one has body-checked me.
First, Kos and Jerome are dead-f*cking right on every single score. I can’t find one thing I would disagree with in their text.
Second, I get so f*cking angry after a couple of pages I have to set it down. I’m angry most of all with myself, for believing for too damned long there were adults in charge who made things happen. I’ve found out, first hand, at point-blank range, THERE ARE NO ADULTS IN CHARGE. There are only people who used to believe in something that have been going through the motions so long that they built a reality for themselves that isn’t. They still live in a 1978 worldview, where labor is king and we’ll win if somebody just wakes us up in September.
Third, I could have written this text myself. I think that also pains me — that some of us have known these truths and simply couldn’t articulate this. Page after page, nodding my head in agreement like some toy dog in the back window of a ‘77 Eldorado…more of us, ALL of us, need to be able to cite this stuff clearly, cogently, needed to do so three years ago. Gah. Makes me angry with myself all over again. Makes me want to camp out at Rockridge Institute, do a Vulcan-mind-meld with Lakoff.
Thank the stars for Kos and Jerome, though. They just plain did it, stepped up and put this truth to paper. And now we’ll have to grow up in a hurry and get on with the business of taking both our country and our party back. I’ll respond to questions 1-3 in a bit; have some ideas I’ve been mulling around for a while now.
ck 56
The block-headedness of NARAL and the Sierra Club are self evident — they are entrenched bureaucratic organizations, that have abandoned their missions in favor of fund raising and going through the motions.
As long as there are real threats to choice and the environment, they raise lots and lots of money. Once the threat is gone, not so much. So it is almost in their own selfish interest to let the repugs run amok.
Until the donors (like me—formerly) see what is happening, this will continue. Perhaps we need to organize our own letter writing campaigns to the issue orgs. and send them messages instead of checks. Maybe they might wake up, but at this point, I haven’t the faintest.
Rayne 58 — agreed, it is a very dense little book, when I initially read it my first thought was how difficult it must have been to compact so much into such a short book. Was it Mark Twain who said “I didn’t have time to write you a short letter so I wrote you a long one?” It’s very true of CTG.
Jerome — Thank you so much for showing up here. This conversation is very exciting to me. Nobody can go back and recreate the conversations that took place in the 60s around the Port Huron statement, and I think CTG is every bit as historic and important as that was. Yet people will be able to come back here and see this conversation and watch the ideas being discussed and developed for a long time to come.
I just love this. Such a geek.
COLBERT ON 60 MINUTES TONITE
CBS) “I truck in insincerity. With a very straight face, I say things I don’t believe,” Stephen Colbert tells Morley Safer in an interview about his character on the hit Comedy Central “fake news” program “The Colbert Report.”
“Kids can’t understand irony or sarcasm, and I don’t want them to perceive me as insincere,” he tells Safer, in an interview will be broadcast this Sunday, April 30 at 7 p.m. ET/PT. “Because one night, I’ll be putting them to bed and I’ll say … ‘I love you honey.’ And they’ll say, ‘I get it. Very dry, Dad. That’s good stuff,’” jokes Colbert.
His penchant for goofiness began in childhood after a profound family tragedy — a commercial plane crash in 1974. “My father and two of my brothers died when I was 10, and I think I did my best to cheer mom up,” Colbert tells Safer. “After they died, nothing seemed that important to me. … I would certainly say I was detached from what was normal behavior of children around me. It didn’t make much sense. None of it seemed very important,” Colbert remembers.
His urge to mock virtually anything has continued into adulthood. “Acceptance, or blind acceptance — of authority is not easy for me,” says Colbert. Nothing is sacred — not religion, nor the media, nor politicians.
Explaining some of his methods, he tells Safer, “Volume is very important. The only real way to tell your audience what’s important is what you say loudest. I can say it up here,” he loudly intones, “or I could say it down here,” he says. Then slipping into character, he demonstrates for Safer. “I will cut off your mic, sir,” he yells. “Shut up! Shut up Safer!”
RevDeb#43. I have been volunteering at chester county dem comm. in west hester, Pa. They are having a nasty internal fight between people who want to do everything the old way and the new people who are go go go all the time. It is tense even in little west chester. It is a mess. They are hiding stuff from each other. It is neverending.
Wedge issue for the Republicans: too much power in the government, esp the presidency.
How to reach the blue-collar red states: war profiteering investigations, and gas prices.
ck, RevDeb — I think that’s why it’s so important that women who are strongly pro-choice to take a stand and speak out about this stuff. It’s too lazy and easy for knee-jerk reactionaries to dismiss the valid criticisms of men regarding the abject failures of NARAL; it’s not so easy for them to do it when women call bullshit, though they certainly do try. Their caustic influence can’t be neutralized without our help.
I hear I am the most hated women in the state of Connecticut right now if you were to ask around in the local offices of Planned Parenthood and NARAL (though surprisingly popular with NOW, who gave Joe Lieberman shit for his Alito cloture vote). I’m rather proud of that.
This being the weekend, I’d like to exercise my right to ask a Stupid Question.
I love reading DKos. I’m a registered user, and have commented a couple times.
However, I have never figured out (and I’ve been trying for a couple years now) how to rate stuff. I mean, the actual interface issues. There’s a bit in one corner of the site that talks about how the rating thing works — but NOWHERE does it answer the burning question: Where does one click to make this happen?
There’s a lot about the general workings of the site that I don’t get. And, please note: I am not stupid with this stuff. I’ve written over 80 consumer software manuals (for companies like you’ve heard of, like EA and Apple), had columns in national computer magazines, and contributed to books by SAMS and O’Reilly. So I’m (supposedly) smarter than your average user about this stuff — which only makes it more embarassing to be asking this ridiculous question.
If there’s a place on the Kos site that offers a basic tutorial on how its very complicated community interface works, I have yet to find it. I’ve written e-mails to admin asking this question, and gotten not a word back.
I’d love to be a vocal part of the community — if I could figure out how the damn thing worked.
Help?
egregious — I absolutely agree that war profiteering is the most immediate, visceral and emotional way to reach blue-collar red staters. Anyone who hasn’t read the first post in Matt. O’s series on war profiteering here on Saturday afternoons, or looked into Robert Greenwald’s upcoming film on the subject, should do so. I really think the issue has the power to transform the political landscape.
For #2, how can these groups possible rationalize their support of someone like Chaffee?
Jerome, they’ve answered this question. They believe that it is important to their set of issues that those issues be seen as non-partisan–that republicans and democrats alike could and should support them.
As you and Markos point out in CtG, that made sense in the 70s, when their core supporters were in the majority, with some southern Dem opposition. This strategy let them pick off some NE republicans and some NW republicans. It also serves a long-term goal. The Sierra Club represents the party of Teddy Roosevelt and the party of Jimmy Carter.
Organizations like the Sierra Club are in some trouble now, whether they know it or not. I’m a member. I became a member because it was the only way to have any influence on environmental policy–help fund a pro-environment lobbying organization.
The story of CtG is that I have now have an alternative to the Sierra Club. I can keep my money, and use my time in netroots activity. They’re gonna have a hard time coming to terms with this. And, as you’ve said elsewhere, it’s not going to all happen at once; money is still a big part of the system.
The netroots applies to the single issue groups as well, btw. We can now organize communication with NOW, Planned Parenthood, Sierra Club, NARAL and make it clear that we now have alternatives. Given the shift in importance from individual bills to the judiciary and (still shockingly) adherence by the executive branch to the law of the land, it’s time for the Sierra Club to shit, or get pushed off the pot.
jane. I live in Pa and NARAL has come out against Bob casey. While that is great, my fear is that people will vote instead for Santorum again thinking its the same. How to combat that? We are having a primary but really it is a joke.
I can’t join the discussion, but to the authors: congrats on the book (I’m, uhh, partway through my copy); and to Jane and Redd: congrats for launching this book group.
Read on!
The government is taking YOUR money and giving it to war profiteers, while our soldiers go without body armor.
Mrs. Robinson — You have to make sure you’re logged in. If you are it will say so on the upper right hand corner of the front page (it’ll either say “login” or “logout.”)
Once you do that, in the discussion there will be a box on the bottom of each comment you can check which says “recommend.” That will recommend a comment.
On the right sidebar there is a button that says “recommend,” and if you hit that it will recommend the diary.
Random thoughts in response to posted questions:
I notice in #1 that none of the groups mentioned are traditional conservatives. Nice. I would love to see us all step away from the lib v. con meme and adopt “common sense” and “building strong communities”. And whenever someone uses “liberal” as a smear, just haul out the old Reaganism “there you go again!” and point out that’s a tactic to avoid the real issue (whichever is under discussion). The right wing has set about destroying and deregulating to make America free for the privileged few while weakening the country as a whole. We need a strong America that values all it’s citizens for whatever skills and talents they have to offer. And we need to build a new infrastructure, both physical and philosophical that will allow us to do that.
Family values: (gays, single parents, etc) Remember how they cried about Dems stealing Their Issue when we talked about it? Oy! But it needs to be said that families already have values and ask, Do you want the government dictating to you what your values must be? You may be ok with it today, but what about tomorrow? “We’re going to make America more like the Waltons and less like the Simpsons.”
(Bush 41)
Abortion rights: This needs a whole new approach. I think we need to look at the idea of a government so big and powerful it can tell you what to do with your body (like Terri Schiavo in a way)–see forced abortion as in the Marianas (?) or China (and we all know about what kind of government China has, don’t we). We don’t want our government to have that much power. The power that says “you can’t” is equal to the power that says “you must.”
IOW: We need to take these issues and frame them in a new way that is clear and concise. We need to ignore the political differences of the voters and just tell the truth in a way they can “get it”.
We can do that with all the single issues and find a new and interesting way to frame it. Hmmm…maybe the media will be intrigued enough to report it.
jayackroyd — “it’s time for the Sierra Club to shit, or get pushed off the pot.”
I like that one ;)
Have bought several copies of the book to give to family and friends. I was sorry to read that Jerome stopped blogging after the false accusations, did he ever resume?
Some in the DCCC still deny they exercise any message control over candidates, and claim they don’t force campaign staff on candidates as a condition of funding and support.
The DCCC may, but see today’s NYT:
Toe the line
Mr. Schumer is no less forceful. At a fund-raiser at a private New York apartment, Mr. Schumer boasted of cutting off the flow of campaign money from his committee to Senators Hillary Rodham Clinton of New York and Edward M. Kennedy of Massachusetts, telling them not to “expect a nickel from us” for their re-election campaigns. (He did not mention that neither of them needs his help in raising money on their own.)
“In the past, if you were a big shot in the Democratic caucus, you got a couple of million bucks,” he said. “No more.”
He went on, as he sought to assure his audience that their checks would not be squandered, to recount the strict conditions he set with senators and candidates alike.
“We’ll give you money, but you have to hire a campaign manager, a finance director and a communications director who we approve,” Mr. Schumer said. “They have to toe the line.”
The piece profiled Emmanuel and Schumer. All process, all centralized control, all money, and all unprincipled. Not to mention stupid and shortsighted.
Jane, 64
I’m a Choice activist. I’m on the Religious Leadership Council of the Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice. NARAL for the most part wants nothing to do with us. You would think after all of these years of not getting it done because the religious zealots block them at every turn, that they would want to work with us, but they don’t.
This whole thing makes me crazy. Since I am just a volunteer, I’m not in the fund raising end of things, but getting grant money to do anything is getting harder and harder which is probably part of the problem. We are all competing for the same $$.
The thought of Casey in PA makes me want to barf, but it has been taken out of our hands and I can see the wisdom of picking a candidate who has a good choice of winning and contributing to the vote count to get the majority. Lots of good dems are going to hold onto their noses when they go into the voting booth. But I do understand it. CTG and the MANY conversations about it on Kos have helped me to get it. Never the less, if I were in PA, I’d be working hard in the primaries for someone else. Once the general election comes, though we all have to hold our respective noses if need be.
GOD! I am SO TIRED OF HAVING TO HOLD MY NOSE WHILE VOTING. I think down deep we all want to support candidates we believe in. That is what I see the DSCC and DCCC subverting and THAT is what makes me really crazy!
Sorry, the Joke Line article was oldish. This seems newer (Bush skips early opportunities to nail Zarqawi):
http://www.abc.net.au/news/new…..627197.htm
Democrats squandering energy: Reid’s attempt to get Lamont to quit. This is just disgusting. Lamont supporters ARE the new Democratic party.
egregious #70, I like it. Short, sweet and right to the point.
RevDeb 76,
Ok so feel bad for me in PA. But the primaries are a joke. They have no money at all. I am volunteering for Joe Sestak, hoping to at least get rid of Curt Weldon. But after reading jerome’s book I am going to help Casey . Better him then more of Santorum
Jfisk at #80 — has the Santorum “when I used to live in Pennsylvania” quote gotten much play there? I’m curious to know if PA news shows caught that or if it was only a bloggy thing?
Jay 67
Alternatives indeed. I’ve stopped giving to Emily’s list since Melissa Bean joined herself to the credit card companies. She had gotten money from me through EL. I am a much better informed voter AND contributer because of the blogs and that is how I will decide where the checks go. I think this is a whole new thing that the traditional issue groups will eventually have to come to terms with—I hope!
RevDeb — the Casey problem is a thorny one. I’m with Digby in that I think he was a poor, lazy choice on the part of the Democratic establishment. Whoever had the bright idea to pick an anti-choice candidate to run against another anti-choice candidate in a pro-choice state was a real genius. That Casey loses ground when people realize he’s anti-choice, and Santorum is (weirdly) using that against him, only goes to underscore how sloppy and stupid it was.
But I acknowledge that at this point in the game I’m going to shut up about Casey and hold my nose. Anything that perpetuates a Republican majority and threatens to put another Alito on the Supreme Court, is extremely dangerous. Nobody in Pennsylvania can beat Santorum right now but Casey and that is the sad awful truth.
I hope that he beats Santorum so Democrats can get some committee control. And I can spend the next 6 years giving him unmittigated, nonstop shit.
Only the blogs Christy, only the blogs. I use to only yell at the tv when they got it wrong, now I am yelling at the paper.
“He who pays the piper calls the tune.” Money in politics is used to get the votes – whatever can deliver the votes sufficiently to help winning gets listened to. Unions have clout coz they can deliver a bloc of votes and they back it up with hefty cash contributions. DLC types can pony up the big checks used to buy the communications to pursuade voters.
Unless you can bring tangible power to the table (cash and/or votes), politicians will ignore you. Ideas are cool but must be translated into votes somehow…
The quickest way to turn Colorado from purple to blue would be to replace Diana DeGette with a Hispanic surnamed Member of Congress, who made voter registration a top priority.
I’ve taken to calling Diana DeGette a bump on a log, but that is insulting to bumpy logs. She generally votes right, but anyone from the CO 1st CD will vote right — this is Pat Schroeder’s district, and it’s 70% Democratic.
At least, I thought DeGette could be counted on; sonate posted this in the Talking Head thread (from CNET news) –
“It didn’t take long for the idea of forcing Internet providers to retain records of their users’ activities to gain traction in the U.S. Congress.
Last week, Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, a Republican, gave a speech saying that data retention by Internet service providers is an “issue that must be addressed.†Child pornography investigations have been “hampered†because data may be routinely deleted, Gonzales warned.
Now, in a demonstration of bipartisan unity, a Democratic member of the Congressional Internet Caucus is preparing to introduce an amendment–perhaps during a U.S. House of Representatives floor vote next week–that would make such data deletion illegal.
Colorado Rep. Diana DeGette’s proposal (click for PDF) says that any Internet service that “enables users to access content†must permanently retain records that would permit police to identify each user. The records could not be discarded until at least one year after the user’s account was closed.â€
But this — introducing legislation to enable the BushCo Big Brother Police State — is a whole other matter.
Jfisk,
I do get it, I just don’t like it. Good luck on ousting crazy Curt!
Thanks, Jane. I’ll try to see if I remember my log-in info (it’s been a long while), and see if this helps it work.
Beyond that, it’s a great discussion, and I apologize for not being on-topic.
As for the Dem establishment: Per Gandhi, they’re still vacillating between the “ignore them” and the “ridicule them” phase, with the latter emerging at the default state.
Which the first punches of the “fight them” stage are going to be thrown before too much longer — probably running up to or in the aftermath of the fall elections, when they’re finally forced to come to terms with the fact that the progressive forces are the party’s real source of energy and power, and will not be going away.
Early 2007 is going to be ugly — very ugly — as the DLC Dems and their ilk come to terms with their irrelevance. The jockeying for position as we organize the party for the ‘08 presidental run will be unlike anything most of us have ever seen.
But then, Gandhi said, we win. At least, let’s hope we do….
jayackaroyd 75 — That Schumer quote was enlightening:
He went on, as he sought to assure his audience that their checks would not be squandered, to recount the strict conditions he set with senators and candidates alike.
“We’ll give you money, but you have to hire a campaign manager, a finance director and a communications director who we approve,†Mr. Schumer said. “They have to toe the line.â€
If Kos & Jerome achieve nothing else with this book I sincerely hope it is to enlighten people about how dangerously stupid and incompetent the people that the are “DC approved” like 0-8 Bob Shrum are. They’re killing us.
FWIW, my copy of CTG won’t arrive until tomorrow. I’m a precinct committeeman and Tuesday is our Primary. Election Day can get long and boring so CTG will be the perfect read !
Jane #37
“…power had corrupted them, that the idealists were long gone and they were now being run by career lobbyists no different from those on K Street (save for the fact that they are virtually ineffectual) who are interested in self-perpetuation and proximity to power. It’s actually much uglier than it appears…”
That also applies to the top eschalon of organized labor and the break-away in the AFL/CIO diogenes #37 mentions may be part of the answer to labors’s current lack of power, but it will be an uphill battle because where once labor laws held companies in check as to what a company could legally do during an organizing campaign, most companies now ignore those laws (they have never been recinded) and thus we are back to the K-Street Project.
Will probably be epu’d here but had to say this.
With reference to possible wedge issues, the immigration “debate” is clearly one of those. It pits the interests of the xenophobes against the corporatecons. This is one that (so far) the Dems are handling relatively well, mostly by staying out of it.
When it comes to wedge issues, sometimes it is better to keep silent and let the other side publicly fight amongst themselves. There is a danger that the issue could become a wedge used within one’s own party as well. For example with respect to immigration, many of those same economically disadvantaged men who maybe could be convinced that Republican economic policies do not aid them, also may distrust Dems for supporting immigration, because they see immigration as driving down wages and increasing unemployment. Also, too much emphasis on it could give the impression that Dems care more about the lives of illegal immigrants than U.S. citizens to those who pay little attention and don’t really understand the issue.
However, other possible wedge issues such as the NSA wiretapping (which presents the possibility of driving away the libertarians)or Terry Schiavo or stem cell research (which drive away everyone but the theocons) are more safe for Dems to hammer on publicly and mercilessly because there is less dissent about them within the Democratic Party.
Schumer seems to think that the Dubai ports issue is one such issue and it is, but it is too specific and needs to be made part of a larger message of ongoing security lapses. No one is going to give a shit about what happened in February in November, especially when the company gave the public appearance of taking one for the team and “bowing out”. Instead, the issue should be tied to the Bush administration’s tendency to “outsource” everything – including our national security. It is not about Dubai. Dubai is a symptom of a larger problem.
Jane at 89 — …and folks like Shrum are still laughing alla way to the bank. SIGH
Regarding pro-choice activists supporting pro-life Democrats –
Bill Ritter is running for Governor in Colorado; he is unopposed for the Democratic nomination. A former Denver DA, he is personally pro-life — but at last week’s Drinking Liberally, he made a point that Roe vs Wade is the law, and it must be upheld. He went on to say that reducing the number of abortions is a universal goal that both sides can support.
Bill Ritter is great — I totally support him.
Details at SoapBlox Colorado
http://www.soapblox.net/colora…..aryId=1395
I believe Democrats have an opportunity to change the debate on abortion and Roe v. Wade by forcing the right to specify the intended criminal consequences…including the length of prison terms they propose for both the doctor performing an “illegal” abortion and the woman receiving an “illegal” abortion.
As long as the debate remains an abstract dialogue that is overwhelmingly focused upon values and religious principles, the right will continue to garner support from voters that would, given a dose of reality (consequences), likely rethink their position on the criminalization of abortion.
Changing the debate would also force Republicans, who have enjoyed the cover of rhetoric, to take a position that they may ultimately find unacceptable and more importantly, politically damaging and dangerous.
If nothing else, the reframing would force an honest debate about contraception and the fallacy of simply promoting abstinence only solutions. When confronted with the possibilities of an unwanted pregnancy and no viable alternatives, the moderate middle of America will likely fall on the side of better education and expanded availability of preventative methods…not a bad outcome from numerous perspectives. Obviously, there are people on the extreme right who will object to this approach…but they will find themselves isolated in their extremity.
I’ve always been convinced that the party that can strike the right tone with reasonable Americans in the middle will win elections. While many politicians garner criticism from vocal members on either extreme when moving towards the center, I’m inclined to think politicians ought to court the center first…and then pick off voters from the extremes.
The obstacles to this approach are the caucus and primary systems where participation is typically skewed to the extremes. At the same time, I think it goes a long way towards explaining the typically low voter turnout seen in this country. The middle becomes necessarily neglected until the general election and by that time they are disenchanted with the rhetoric from both sides.
If the Democrats fail to move the debate, they will continue to lose the battle for moderate voters.
read more observations here:
http://www.thoughttheater.com
We have so much to do together to make the vision of CtG a reality. I do have much hope, but institution building takes long, unsexy work. I hope we’re all up for it.
lotsolurk #91 — very interesting and not very surprising.
Pach #96 — I think CtG points out how long and unsexy it’s going to be, how deeply entrenched the problems are. They’re not going to disappear even with a Democratic majority in 2006 (something I am by no means counting on); that will only slow down the hemmoraging.
readerOfTeaLeaves, 55, in regards to “accountability”, it’s a big question of implementation. I think that there are more of us seeing the need for it speaks to at least movement on the issue. As to the how and what of it being done, I wish I could point toward something out there, but nothing to date. We are talking about something similar to the “buy blue” movement I think.
Rayne, 58, thanks for the comment. I concur with your realization. It’s amazing how little ‘there’ is in place at the top in this party. The things in CTG are what we, as a community, have been blogging about for 2 years, and putting it all together brought it to a whole different level of coherency for us too.
Jane, 60, I remember a moment when we went through the entire book over a course of 30 hours of straight editing (then I got on a plane) and we literally left 20K words on the floor through that exercise of getting rid of the repitition. I still haven’t been able and go back and read the book since that last week of ripping through the excess to get to the core (in concert with Markos and our editor).
jayackroyd, 67, great post. This is where the power of the internet leaps. Your realization is something that would have taken alot of effort to break through into CW thought before you could share it amongst thousands in an afternoon. Those groups don’t realize what the netroots means.
On the appeal to unions question – we will not be able to work with unions until we stop the arrogant, elitist language we use when speaking about working people in this country – joe sixpack, nascar dads, etc. We know that over 2/3 of americans are unhappy with what is going on and that 2/3 clearly includes a whole bunch of workers – maybe we should welcome them as allies rather than constantly using insulting language whenever we speak about them?
What I also find fascinating is the lack of collaboration between netroots and progressive african american leadership and movements. Coalitions require mutual support yet we only seem to notice when Feingold speaks up but barely mention and support Conyers, say little about support for Darfur rallies, ignore the progressive developments in the hiphop community (hip hop convention, etc which bases attendance on registering 50 friends to vote), ignore Color of Change which mobilizes it’s members to stand strong on the issues we care about (censure, alito, etc) but then receives no attention or return support for the issues they lead on – satellite voting for NOLA, Tookie Williams execution, etc.
Unions are losing power but remain capable of effective get out the vote efforts – alliances with other organizations of growing power who are strengthening their GOTV efforts might be a good way to move beyond the mostly white, mostly privileged realm of netroots and build a genuinely inclusive progressive movement.
If Kos & Jerome achieve nothing else with this book I sincerely hope it is to enlighten people about how dangerously stupid and incompetent the people that the are “DC approved†like 0-8 Bob Shrum are. They’re killing us.
Jane, it’s really up to us. The Netroots project is the first vehicle I’ve seen. We’re on our own here, and without the net–and without you, Glenn, John and Pach–we would still be floundering around. But Kos and Jerome have given us the conceptual framework. You guys have given us the dance floor. Now we need to step up. So far, we have been. But it’s a long road, and they have all the money.
Does anyone know how people like Schumer at the DSCC and Emanual at the DCCC get selected? Is there any hope of netroots Democrats contacting Democratic senators from their states (if, unlike me, they are lucky enogh to have them) and trying to influence them to select better chairmen next time, who would be easier for progressives to work with than these two, and less control-oriented?
Refusing to pay media consultants by commission: this is so important. They will game things to their benefit, we must change the rules of the game.
A major cause of corporate hijinks of the last several years (other than the usual rank greed) is compensating CEO’s with large numbers of stock options based on the company’s stock price. Surprise: manipulation of earnings, and fake earnings, to get the stock price up.
Siun No. 100
“the mostly white, mostly privileged realm of netroots”
Do you have data to support that description? I’m not disputing it, just curious.
Jerome 99 — the idea of an “accountability rating” is interesting. These “scorecards” produced by this group are beyond useless. NARAL, for example, didn’t even count cloture votes on judges through 2005 (though I’ve heard unconfirmed rumor they will be counting it in 2006). But how do you weight a vote like Lincoln Chafee’s (against Alito in the floor vote) in light of this? He was allowed off the GOP reservation for a symbolic gesture, but toed the party line on the only vote that mattered.
As for the groups themselves — hard to quantify the craven stupidity of pouring all your efforts into agressively fundraising against Alito’s confirmation, and then not spending any of the money. Why, because some stellar consultant like Stanley Greenberg told you abortion was a “loser issue?” (Or so that NYT post-mortem article implied).
They might have mentioned that when they were terrorizing people into giving money.
The heads of the DSCC and DCCC are elected by their cohorts to lead elections sufficiently well to recapture control of the Senate or House. Folk already elected to Congress are usually not political slouches themselves: they’ve proven it by winning their own elections. When the Netroots can prove themselves by significantly assisting in winning elections, they will be courted assiduously.
Does FDL or any commentator know where I could send Ned Lamont a donation via snail mail? I am leery of putting my politics and money online. Thanks.
bridgehome:
Print out a contribution form and then send it with your donation to:
Ned Lamont for Senate
P.O. Box 422
Greens Farms, CT 06838
Nice to see the props for CTG over here. I will add my voice to the crowd by sharing my reaction (as I have described elsewhere).
I pre-ordered the partner-edition of CTG on faith. I had been reading dKos as a silent lurker for about 6 months, but was far from a committed “Kossack.” Nonetheless I decided to give it a chance, despite strong skepticism. Why was I skeptical?
1. Because I have seen that many short-form writers do not translate well into long-form.
2. I have too often seen such tomes that were little more than a bit of webbing imposed on pre-existing pieces to make an artificial whole.
3. Because I read on dKos about Markos’ and Jerome’s struggles with writing CTG, making me doubtful that it would be a polished work.
Still, I ordered it. At the end of February it arrived. It sat on my bookshelf for 2 weeks, and then I read it.
And to paraphrase Moses: And I saw everything that they had made, and, behold, it was very good.
In fact, more than very good, it was excellent.
The content is original and fresh, the arguments cogent, and it is superbly written. I cannot remember the last political book I read that I can say that about.
I was a unbeliever, but now I urge everyone to get your hands on a copy and read it. ASAP.
neurophius #104:
check out the results of the blogad survey at:
http://www.blogads.com/survey/…..rview.html
while it doesn’t address the racial make-up of the political blogosphere, it does speak to the privileged aspect.
apropos Siun’s observation on race: as far as I can tell, Pachacutec and I were the only 2 regulars here to participate in the Immigration Marches – and I’m 100% Anglo-Hoosier.
Let me share with you an article I just finished for the launch of “Democratic Strategist”, that’s titled, “Replacing the Battleground Mentality with the Mapchanger Attitude in the Democratic Party”.
In it, I talk alot about the 50 state strategy for making the Democratic Party a national party again, but also extend the argument into the problem with our consultants and the role of the netroots in addressing this problem. Maybe it’s not that sexy, but in terms of changing the way things are done, it’s what we need to do:
RickBoston — ditto that.
neurophius 102 –
Schumer and Emanuel are actually very good at what they do — candidate recruitment and fundraising.
We just need to impress on them that it is better to work with the netroots, instead of showing us the back of their hands while treating us like an ATM.
Here was the quote that didn’t show up:
“Activist bloggers do not advocate that the people wait for the Democratic Party strategists in DC to adopt the mapchanger strategy. The Republican Party has become an election machine. The Democratic establishment, while they believed they were the party of governance, wasted hundreds of millions of dollars while ignoring what the Republicans have been building.
Instead, Democratic Party officials and politicians have been under the powerful sway of a cabal of media and polling consultants in DC, whose principle contribution seems to be an extension of this battleground mentality into decisions over campaign expenditures, advocating that the majority of funds be spent on polling and media in a strategic manner that rewards their services with increased profits.
Even for this upcoming cycle, all of the Democratic candidates in big races are going with inside-the-beltway media consultants whose best practices remain entrenched within a conflict-of-interest approach. It is a fact that consumer businesses no longer receive commissions based on the amount of advertising that is done—that racket only remains in DC (particularly on the Democratic side). And if you look closely at what media consultants are doing, they are really only project-managing the task of creating television commercials. That is, they will usually outsource the creation and the placement of the ad, and thus are merely the middleman for the politicians. As project managers, they should be paid a set monthly fee, not commissions without end that sometimes reach into the millions. The Democratic Party and its candidates who are participating in this scam are ripping off people that are contributing through donations.
For beltway outsiders to take more of the duties of the Democratic Party apparatus is really the only option that seems to be available. Waiting for those tired and defeated Democratic consultants to “get it†means remaining in the political wilderness beyond the next decade.
The netroots and grassroots progressive community should begin to take matters into its own hands. It is time to go beyond merely collectively grouping hundreds of thousands of dollars and pushing it toward candidates and consultants that perform business as usual. Building a progressive movement is going to take more than that sort of hit-and-run attitude of activism. We should be creating institutions that effectively spend the dollars raised for campaigns, rather than relying on the establishment channels.”
Jane 98: 2006 is clearly only the begining but it’s already showing them we have teeth (and money etc.).
siun 100: I agree about the language. It’s of a piece with the done use the Rs memes like spineless Democrats. But othere than that how to do it?
I don’t see John Conyers as being dismissed by the netroots at all. He’s one of the heros as far as I’m concerned and to many others as well.
egregious 103: Good idea about the cousultants but how we know. There needs to be some kind of infrastructure so that people can find out and enough transparency in the compaigns themselves.
Campaign finance reports are fairly easy to read – they aren’t as frequent as they should be but can be very informative. They are free and available on the Net … often state campaign finance reports are available too. It’s fun to see all the money spent on ‘consultants’…
FYI: a Report on Steven Colbert is coming up next on 60 Minutes on CBS…perfect timing after last night’s bravura performance!
“There will be time to go back and look at those days of the war and, after the war, to examine what went right and what went wrong,” Rice said on CBS’ Face the Nation.
What I would like to hear from Democrats, any Democrat, when a Republican makes this kind of statement is for one of them to say that for 2400 Americans and many more Iraqis that time will never come.
There are so many places where Democrats could stand up and make powerful statements that would leave the Republicans gasping and with no effective reply. However, with the exception of Feingold and Durbin, and them only occasionally, I just don’t hear it.
Another high water mark day at FDL.
We’re all smarter than any one of us.
Be informed, get involved and take it to the limits. We’re Americans dammit.
Thanks all for opening the way.
Jane and Redd (I just have to use that still), I am retired and have a lot of time to read a lot of progressive blogs, and for the life of me, I don’t know how the two of you do what you do. Do you ever sleep?
Anyway, here is where I constantly finding myself ending up: Things move so fast on the blogs that I see very little substance except tactics rather than strategy. And even the strategy appears to me to be just a little higher level than the tactics.
Jerome and Kos have done a good job of getting the ball rolling, but I still long for a set of First Principles, and that brings me back to reading Thomas Jefferson.
http://etext.virginia.edu/jeff…..ffcont.htm
You can see the beginning of the Democratic and Republican parties emerging from the row between Adams and Jefferson (followed in their later years by a close friendship).
What strikes me about Jeffersonion governmental philosophy is the idea of distributed government, just like the Internet is today. And I get the feeling that something very profound is about to happen in American society,using the model of the Internet.
But there is more; if you look at the work of Richard Dawkins on modeling emergent properties, and in the work of chaos theory, you can see the beginning of a self-organizing, adaptive political system. That is the depth I would like to see in terms of First Principles.
Thanks for listening to a — mostly — lurker.
Guardian UK covers Colbert here
siun @ 100
Parts of me are white while no parts are privileged…and I see your point. ;)
But IMO, that’s why the netroots are so perfect. We don’t have to limit actions to visits to our elected officials. We can go meet with other progressive organizations and INVITE them to join us so that we can be informed when they have issues. If the local LULAC or NAACP chapter, for instance, discovers there’s an instant action group looking to create meaningful change as well expanding diversity of membership, they may want to have at least someone from the org join the state group. They can then share their concerns and issues and generate action. Just thinkin’…
(I say “we” but those who are like me who can’t get around CAN also do the same over the internet…though a meeting is preferred, right?)
Best. Wonkette. Post. Ever.
http://tinyurl.com/pv7ud
Election themes? You want election themes?
The netroots and grassroots progressive community should begin to take matters into its own hands. It is time to go beyond merely collectively grouping hundreds of thousands of dollars and pushing it toward candidates and consultants that perform business as usual. Building a progressive movement is going to take more than that sort of hit-and-run attitude of activism. We should be creating institutions that effectively spend the dollars raised for campaigns, rather than relying on the establishment channels.
Jerome — that is becoming increasingly apparent to me as we try to interface with various campaigns, either because we reach out to them or vice-versa. I got into a conversation with John Amato the other day after he’d had a frustrating encounter with a campaign that just “didn’t get it” (ironically one that is completely dependent on netroot support for its entire existence). I told him that in my experience if they didn’t demonstrate quickly that they understood how to interface with us it was a waste of fucking time trying to educate them. The only campaign I’ve dealt with who understands worth a damn how to work with the blogosphere is the Lamont campaign; they rest of them are pathetic. And the wall between you and the candidate, prohibiting the only way you could possibly effectively communicate to them how they are being sabotaged, is being guarded by the people doing the sabotaging.
You just want to shake your head and wonder how it’s going to change. That change is NOT going to come from within the campaigns themselves, IMHO.
Jane Hamsher No. 125
“I told him that in my experience if they didn’t demonstrate quickly that they understood how to interface with us it was a waste of fucking time trying to educate them.”
Jane, how do you think campaigns should interface with the netroots?
I have been reading the discussion with great interest (lurking). Kinda trivial question, but have copies of CTG been sent to congressional Dems/ and or staff? I assume so. What kind of response? Thx.
it’s important for the Netroots be able to control the money spigot: turning it on is important but demonstrating the ability to turn it OFF gives you real control…
*ilson- maybe that is one of the reasons Jane is so unpopular with NARAL and PP in CT.
Like RickBoston @ 109, I was far more impressed with the book than I’d expected. So far, I’ve sent one gift copy — to a top lobbyist. I plan to send another to an elected that I genuinely respect (will send next week).
I think your book illuminates huge problems in the Dem party, as well as Am politics, that require airing if anything is to improve.
At least in my region, there’s a real problem even attracting qualified candidates to run for office, and as far as I’m concerned, gov’t is like most things: personnel is a huge factor in success. Until the whole political conversation becomes more thoughtful and informative, government will remain in the predatory grasp of those who actually PREFER idiots in elected office because they make such amiable tools.
Thanks for offering so much more than sound bites!
And, BTW, CTG should be required text in Politics 101 (or whatever) in college curriculum. I’d like to see this happen. I will enquire locally. Same for others, perhaps?
We can’t get back into power if the vote is corrupt. I come from Ohio, the state that Diebold stole from Kerry and delivered as promised to Bush.
I would like to hear or help develop a short list of things that all of us can do for the upcoming elections.
1. For example be the monitor on voting day. How?
2. Making sure the infrared communication port on all voting machines is securely taped over.
3. Videotape or cellphone cam any ‘glitches’ or downtime for any voting machine. Who comes to ‘fix’ them?
4. Having parallel voting with those who are willing to fill out redundant paper ballots or writing down who they voted for.
5. Action NOW to get sufficient voting machines into innercity areas that had the long lines last time.
6. More attention to exit polls. Help me out here.
Valley girl and *ilson
I’m going to the book signing on tues in minneapolis. I’ll take along the sheet I send to all the dems begging for money every week. It is a color photocopy of the book jacket for CTG. On it I write that I am targeting my giving through the NETROOTS. Same as sending them the book, I figure.
How about multiplying by thousands every week. Cheap, fast and I use their postage.
neurophius: Good question.
#1 — understand how we operate. Don’t spam us with press releases about issues that are three weeks old. We deal with news in real time. If you can’t grasp that there’s not much way we can support you in getting your message out.
#2 — have someone on your staff who understands the blogs, who covers what and which stories are appropriate for which blogs. Some people (like MyDD and Kos) are always going to be interested in polling and campaign stuff. I’m always going to be interested in choice, and all three of us are going to probably leap at inappropriate interest group behavior. Making some noise over NSA wiretaps? Get it to Glenn Greenwald. Others (like Josh Marshall) deal in GOP scandals. Got a good clip? Send it to C&L.
#3 — when we contact you about something (like I did one senator who had reached out to us following Seymour Hersch’s article on Iran, asking if he had a statement) “we’ll get back to you in a couple weeks” is the wrong answer. If you don’t want to make a statement, that’s fine. But as with #1 above, we work the news in real time. Iran may be a bad example because it’s ongoing but generally in 10 days a story is going to be quite cold and there’s not much we can do with it.
neurophius @15–same response from DSCC. I have given them many thousands of dollars over the last few years, recently wrote saying not one more dime until they back Feingold and stop sabotaging candidates like Hackett and Lamont.
Their tepid response? They don’t do policy. Ok, they won’t respond to me, I won’t respond to any of their begging letters. DSCC: call me when you wake up to the new reality.
Jane, I’m assuming these are campaigns for which the netroots (and/or, specifically, factions you’re involved with) are major donors.
Which means that these gatekeepers are keeping the candidates away from the people who supply their money.
No Republican operative would DARE stand between a GOP congressperson and the corporate titans who are paying his or her bills. My God. In GOP campaigns, pissing off big donors is a firing offense.
Evidently, though, Democrats think they get elected on something other than money.
Jane- re: #2 has anyone actually assembled a list of go-to bloggers for various issues and sent it to Dem campaigns and Cong. Dem staffers?
siun (#100)
You said some things I have been thinking but have been too inarticulate to express. Thank you.
Jane:
I think your
#2 — have someone on your staff who understands the blogs
is key to all three of your points. Maybe state netroots people should contact campaigns of candidates they feel they can support and offer assistance in that area, rather than just talking to them about issues? Not that the offer would always be accepted, but it might be worth a try.
Jane #125:
Reading the thread from the bottom up, I was going to ask what “carrots” we can offer campaigns to go with the “stick” of denying support. Sounds like that approach won’t work, at least for now.
Lamont would be a great case study (I hope!) after the 2006 CT primary. Meanwhile, how can we get access to some up-and-coming candidates who get it?
neurophilus @ 139 – my personal experience (related to trying to deal with complex issues, explain them, clarify them) is that at a certain point, with something like the Net, people have to WANT to come and discover info.
I personally wouldn’t advise too much hand-holding on of campaign folks. I’d rather see energy go into working with hotel, restaurant, and union employees who can then use it in their organizations (which are more long-term than campaigns).
I met with a county exec (Dem) several years back who did not have a computer in his office. One of my local (Dem) electeds told me –scoffingly — a couple years ago that “no one ever uses the Internet.”
Either of these jerks would be **thrilled** to take Netroot $$. Meanwhile, they can’t articulate the basics of global warming, have totally caved to special interests on every single environmental issue that’s come before them for several years, and think their out-of-the-70s Dem barbecues are the way to go.
Sorry to sound like a jerk, but I’m tired of crappy decisions at all level of gov’t. If these campaign folks and politicos don’t have enough brains and decency to come READ the blogs and figure out a few things for themselves, I say “move on without ‘em.”
Better spend organizational resources and time on things like unions groups, churchs, or other places where people are in a longer term, more committed group that will actually follow through — and show some accountability. I’ve seen zero accountability out of campaigns, and I think that CTG helps explain why.
Under the category of how did it get to be this way, the Democratic party used to be associated with liberal Protestants and Jews, Catholics, morality, idealism. Somehow the rightwing has rebranded us as the party of atheism.
Until the Dems shed this mantle of *perceived* hostility to religion, large numbers of middle Americans will not grant us their vote. I come from these people.
Wow, sorry I missed most of the discussion, this afternoon I was out collecting sigs for Lamont’s petition and taping voter interviews. I think CTG should be required reading for anyone involved in organizing a netroots campaign such as Ned Lamont’s.
I’m hoping to be at a meeting with the Lamont campaign manager Tom Swan this week, where we’ll discuss ways to utilize us bloggers more efficiently and also talk about jazzing up their painfully uninteresting campaign website.
And I’ll bring my copy of CTG if he hasn’t read it…Jane, you probably mentioned the book to him; do you know if Tom has read it?
readeroftealeaves #141 – I personally wouldn’t advise too much hand-holding on of campaign folks. I’d rather see energy go into working with hotel, restaurant, and union employees who can then use it in their organizations (which are more long-term than campaigns).
Absolutely. I’m much more interested in forming meaningful bridges with organizations that further progressive values. Campaigns don’t trouble themselves to figure out how to work with blogs? Fuck ‘em. They need us way more than we need them.
Bob Adams #143 — I haven’t asked him specifically but I have no doubt he has. Tom Swan is the only, and I mean the only campaign manager who has sat down behind a computer and taken the time to understand the blogs and how they work. His ability to create interfaces between us and local Connecticut journalists, issues and interest groups is phenomenal. The rest of them are well into the category of useless.
*ilson46201 111
so I’m an irregular here ? or maybe we just missed each other in the threads – I went to three demonstrations/marches and badgered my county chair and co chair to go to the third
Jane, you made my day!
They do need the Netroots. Apart from $$, the Netroots have smarts, brains, an incredible skill set, and… the abilty to SWARM ;-)
139
Maybe state netroots people should contact campaigns of candidates they feel they can support and offer assistance in that area, rather than just talking to them about issues?
That’s just what the CA folks did. Not merely candidates, but they offered a conduit to the netroots for Boxer and Feinstein. We need to have supportive and positive messages as well as holding feet to the fire. The CA folks did a fine job finding that balance. The NY folks are discussing what we can learn from that in advance of our meeting with Clinton’s staffer on the 10th.
From the NY and CA experiences, the degree of insulation from constituents and the subset who make up th netroots, by both Senator and staff is pretty profound. So far, at least, in our experience, the consultants, the lobbyists and the media seem to have Capitol Hill wrapped in cotton wool.
If anything, it seems as if CtG is understating the degree of insulation of the Congress from the public.
Whew, finally, still on a conference call with Progressive Dems of America…but I’ll slip in my feedback to the first three questions:
1) Wedging/splitting the opposition — first, we really need to have a much better handle on the nature of the opposition. It’s easy enough to say they are “conservatives” under one big umbrella, but even though they identify as conservative, they aren’t. They are Libertarian-leaning (like Rep. Ron Paul (TX-R)), Christian Coalition, Wall Streeters, Moderates who believe in science, and so on. Two of the most important resources I’ve found that help me with identification are Spiral Dynamics by Beck and Cowan (based on Gravesian psychology), and Ken Wilber’s “unified field theory of transpersonal psychology”, A Brief History of Everything”. (Beck and Cowan helped work with South Africa post-Apartheid.) We must do a better job of grokking where the opposition lives, what their fears are — because they don’t all respond to the same drivers, the same fears. Wall Streeters are far more worried about security in relation to business than Christian Coalition’s concerns for security about their religion. How did they get to their fear space? How do they get out of it? If we don’t get this, we won’t build the path for them, and they won’t do it for us — and they are looking for a way out. Each of these groups are a market niche, in business terms; we need to identify the product, branding and product placement required for each of the largest niches on the right.
2) Single-issue groups — infiltrate, occupy and take them over. Just like the Democratic Party, take them over from the inside out. We’re doing it with the Dems here in my backyard; I feel confident this is a workable approach, speaking as someone with a foot in the door of Sierra Club. But there is a second approach that is outside in: build a progressive umbrella organization under which we can all work together and align our efforts. It is the lack of an effective umbrella that fragments our power. The RNC functions as one for the right; I don’t think this same model works for the left because Greens and Libertarians, at opposite ends of the progressive spectrum, will resist any Big D-Democratic effort.
3) Labor groups — the progressive effort has been strongly affiliated with labor for decades, but labor shot itself in the foot by becoming fat and sassy. They became their worst enemy when they became too successful, when workers were well-compensated. When comfortable about their jobs and benefits, labor began to vote single-issue, with Guns-God-Gays mantra creating “Reagan Democrats” (I rub shoulders with these folks here in Michigan all the time, I am testifying to this). They forgot what their core competency was, forgot their union; their own leadership gave them little reason to remember their solidarity. Worse, the right was able to play on the insecurity of union folks, by creating this false dichotomy with labeling anyone on the left with education as “elites”. The labor folks kept their distance from business-educated non-labor folks, and more or less brought knives to gun fights by failing to use the same kind of business savvy in negotiating contracts. One retired union rep told me, “But Delphi always told us we were a “valued partner”"; I told him the only valued partner to a corporation is a shareholder with majority interest, and asked him if the unions had any effort to buy shares of their employers stock like CalPers…uh, no, he said. We absolutely must turn this around, by educating workers about the fundamentals of business, and the fundamentals of economics both at a personal level and a corporate-global level. A progressive entity needs to be the go-to resource.
The larger issue for unions is a need for a change of business model; unions need to become more like guilds, where the very best employees are trained and groomed, to which employers would want to gravitate for solutions (versus business’ current avoidance of all things unionized). Once they do more to position themselves as the preferred source of labor, they will have more leverage to negotiate with employers. The flipside of this is that business must get out of its adversarial relationship with labor over healthcare. It’s not a manufacturer’s core competency to provide healthcare; this model pits businesses’ need for reduced costs against laborers’ needs for healthcare. Democrats MUST make this a critical goal in 2006 at the polls; they can appeal to labor as well as business by framing it in terms that make sense to each group. “It’s just good business to be more competitive” and “Take our healthcare into our own hands”, for example.
Phew…now need to finish that conference call.
Jane #145
Tom Swan is the only, and I mean the only campaign manager who has sat down behind a computer and taken the time to understand the blogs and how they work.
Oh, my goodness. That is depressing. One of the things I was hoping to learn from you, Jane, and Christy and others who are in the know much more than I am currently able to be is that the learning curve about blogs was taking a huge upsweep with our netroots breathren. Apparently there is still a great deal of work to be done even to get that ball rolling at any speed at all, much less the break-neck speed that these dangerous times require.
Jane 145
How about Marcy Weinograd(sp)? Any contacts there? I’d very much like to light a fire under Jane Harman like Lamont did under Lieberman.
I’ve only ever posted on FDG once
For my 2c there is a huge fork in the road here.
AFL/CIO protectionist reaction or NAFTA/ IWW progress? Chaves style statism or a Zapatista grass roots commonwealth?
Machievellien Leninism or libertarian socialism such as Ukraine 1917-20 and Spain 1936?
Fortress America or hemispheric currency and Shengen agreement’s?
DLC small target or universal health cover?
GOP Lite or direct democracy?
Democratic socialism or libertarian socialism?
I don’t think there’s any question at all that the Reptiles are going down – it’s what’s to replace them. All advice is bad – good advice fatal.
With all due respect this is a monumental waste of time.
There is nothing to expect from the Democrats. The Republic is dead already; the course is set. Replacing a Caligula by a Claudius is a worthwhile endeavor, no doubt, but the Empire goes on, governed by pigs and hyenas, supported by sycophants.
Like Hari Seldon in Asimov’s FOUNDATION, it’s not hard to preduct the inevitable collapse within a decade or so.
To quote the brilliant Mr Colbert, we, too, are rearranging deck chairs on the Hindenburg — simply, with a larger cast of players, that’s all.
Democrats need a vision. If they want to appeal to the those in the bottom rungs of the socio-economic ladder, that vision needs to be grounded on social justice issues. No, its not about lower pump prices or one off handouts to ease the strain on already stretched budgets. This is more about universal health care funded through progressive fiscal policies that cannot be traded off by corporate cost cutting measures. This is also aboout enforcing labour and employment laws that do not treat workers as disposable but about enacting minimum wage rates and working conditions that reflect the cost of living and confer a degree employment security. This is about an accountable public education system that extends to age 18 – this is common across Europe, Australia and New Zealand who are lot poorer than the US. Accountability does not relate to pass rates for meaningless tests but to the employability of the client population. This is not about less government but about government responsibilities to its own citizens. I realise these are totally unAmerican values but the US seems sooo f****d up.
lupin — defeatism doesn’t build a party or recover a failed republic; action does. Lead, follow or get out of the way.
sona — Dems have had a vision; it’s the same one that built Social Security, the most successful public program this country has ever had. What they lack is 1) clear and cogent articulation, and 2) a streamlined and fully aligned organization to realize the articulated vision. See Al Gore as an example of a Dem who’s closed the articulation gap, and Howard Dean as an example of a Dem who gets the alignment problem. Dean is focused on building a new organization from the grassroots up.
Now if we can just knock off the defeatism and the deadwood, we might have a fighting chance.
professor rat (153) — heh. That sounds rather Galbraith-ian…”Politics is the art of choosing between the disastrous and the unpalatable.” Universal, single-payer healthcare is unpalatable to many, but the status quo is disastrous, yes?
Rayne.
Oh, believe me, I got out of the way.
A dissenting view.
I generally liked the book, but I think they make two huge mistakes in their arguments. From the review I did when it came out
Trashing the “special interest” groups is a good way to denigrate ideas. Because those “special” interests represent ideas — good labor laws, pro-choice — that real people are attracted to. By ignoring ideas, Kos and Jeromme are setting up a situation that leand sitself to the Schumers and Emmanuels and the DLCs of the world. A brand is not enough, especially one that people cannot trust. If Kos wans to reform the relationship between speical interests and the Dmeocratic party, then he needs to change the democratic party. And that does not mean winning — Kos’ ideas on tactics and strategy are as amenable to the Joe Libermans of the world as they are to the Russ Feingolds — it has to start with ideas.
kevin — do you really know who and what the Democratic Party is these days? We’re not just an aggregate of special interests.
Or rather, I should say, unlike the opposition, People are our only special interest.
Rayne
Someday, someone needs to explain to me how people looking for a fair wage for a fair day’s work or for the right to control their own private lives or for the right to be treated as everyone else became “special interests”. Silly me, I thought those were unniversal aspirations.
And while that’s a pretty little slogan you have there, it doesn’t address a single thing I said. Tactics and strategy are just tools — tools that work for the DLC and the Schuemers of the world just as well as for anyone else. So please explain to me, with the Democratic party in the hands of people like the DLC and Schuemer and Clinton, how ignoring ideas and ideology is going to get us a more progressive country. Explain to me how telling the same people that the Democrats betrayed in the ways I mentioned that if they just sit down and shut up and not try to replicate the success of the NRA that everythign will be all better.
Markos and Jerome are dead on about the failings of the consultant class and the timid strategy of the Dems. But they are setting progressives up for failure of they insist that the ideas come after the victory. Especially if they insist that the factories that generate progressive ideas are to be destroyed or treated asi they, and not the DLCs of the world, are the enemy.
OK, just bought Greenwald/Crashing/Neil Young. I never bought a Neil Young album in my life, but I like the album and thought I’d do triple duty.
BTW. I do think these not-so-great establishment people should be scared, *especially * after looking at the rankings at Amazon.com. I can almost imagine the lefty blogosphere surpassing even Oprah in terms of recommendations and book sales and now of course, albums.
kevin — I suspect you’re just another variant of “concern troll”. If you’re seeing a gap, fill it; if you think Dems need ideas, then whip them out. I’ll reiterate one more time s-l-o-w-l-y: I think we have plenty of ideas but lack for articulation and an organization that gets out the message. Obviously a BIG barrier is negativity, to which I say lead, follow or get out of the way.
I just finished reading the book. Its strong on analyses and its conclusions reflect my own thought processes. The book, however, does not have remedial prescriptions. Perhaps discussions on the book could focus on that and a way out of this quagmire.
Rayne asserts that Democrats do have a vision but that the problem lies in articulating it. I think its more serious a problem than mere articulation of a vision. Most ordinary people do not have any idea of a Democrat vision. They do know of Lieberman though and do not see how Democrats like that are any different from the GOP. They also know of Biden’s solution of balkanising Iraq into unviable fiefdoms. They can’t figure out, and I include myself in that crowd, how that differs from the the vision outlined in the neocon policy agenda promulgated in the PNAC 2000 document which referred to civil strife and political instability in the oil rich middleeast as an optimum outcome to further US domination of the 21st century.
One way to convince voters of a Democratic agenda is to table positive policy proposals even if they get shot down in the present Congress. Gore, Feingold and Conyers stand out as exceptions who have done that but there was no sign of broad Democrat support for them from either party colleagues or the DSCC or the DCCC to convince many that this is what the Democrats as a party are about. Most can’t wade through the articualted ambuiguities of Clinton, Obama et al to find a vision.
So what is that vision? What should constitute that vision? How does one and who should articulate the vision? How does the vision appeal to a plurality of voters across the socio-economic spectrum?
In my previoius post I focused on why Democrats are failing to appeal to the least advantaged of the working population. They did not in 2000 and 2004 and do not today think the Democrats represent their realistic dreams or that their expectations are any more realisable under Democrats.
The party has a fractured image as an entity. Is the party going to fight another election as a loose conglomeration of individual egos or as a party that stands for issues and is capable of formulating policies that distinguish them from the sleaze that more or less sums up Federal politics for many people?
There is a groundswell of public discontent but how do you mobilise that if the Democrats cannot articulate a Democrat vision that most can relate to? Ambiguities of mixed messages confuse, they do not convince.
Netroots need to play a role because the mainstream media is the prosthetic arm of corporate wealth firmly wedded to preserving its political power base and privileges. It has no scruples as to how that is done. Ordinary people, however, do want hope to survive in an indecently cutthroat environment.