
There has been a lot of discussion about whether or not Fitzgerald or members of his legal team are meeting with the Grand Jury this morning. I've been on the phones and have not been able to confirm anything, one way or the other -- but thought this was a good time to reiterate a couple of things.
They are using a regular grand jury -- not a special designated grand jury that would be used solely for the leak investigation and nothing else -- so the regular grand jury can also be used by other federal prosecutors in the DC Circuit. They have a regularly scheduled meeting time for Wednesdays and Fridays, but that doesn't mean that they will always be meeting with Fitzgerald or, frankly, that they will even be meeting that day. What it does mean is that the space within the federal courthouse is reserved for them and, if they are needed, they will be available for US Attorneys for presentation of evidence. (See here and here for past posts on how this works.)
Sometimes I think that reporters miss that, and just keep getting excited about the schedule. I try not to work everyone into a lather unless and until I can confirm that actual jurors, Fitzgerald and/or a member of his legal team have been spotted entering or exiting the building at a time where both groups would have had an opportunity for discussion or presentation of evidence. Or if a big witness has been spotted in the area. You know -- real facts that I can report to you guys. I find that a refreshing way to do business. (Take that, Howie. Ahem.) That said, just because no one will confirm anything for me, doesn't mean they aren't meeting -- grand juries meet in secret for a reason, and we'll hear an announcement at some point if there is any news to announce. (Unsatisfying, yes, but imagine being the person roasting on the "will I or won't I" indictment spit? Have a nice weekend, Karl.)
Tom MaGuire was nice enough to put up a PDF of the latest opinion in the Libby case and, having had an opportunity to read through the whole opinion, I have to say it is nice to see a judge and his clerks write so clearly, concisely, and with a nod to common sense. Refreshing -- and the fact that they dismissed Team Libby's dismissal motion entirely made it all the better.
Pages 1 through 3 of the opinion go through a recitation of the chronology and history of how Fitzgerald came to be appointed Special Counsel in the first place. Ashcroft, conflict of interest, Deputy AG Comey, etc., etc. Plame-a-holics will know the details, but it's a concise review for the newbies out there.
Pages 3 through 12 then run through the arguments on the statutory authority challenge from Team Libby to Fitzgerald's appointment. I'm going to take a moment to brag here that the judge's reasoning somewhat tracked my own here -- but only a very small moment, since it's really basic lawyering 101 that you go first to statutory language and construction and follow the plain meaning of the words used therein. (I mean, honestly, if you didn't learn that your first few weeks in law school, you were in a coma.)
There is a discussion that I wanted to highlight which starts on page 7 regarding recusal of the AG -- because this discussion is really spot on in terms of the common sense of this whole idiotic attempt at dismissal. Of course there has to be some means of replacing the AG where there is a conflict of interest -- otherwise you'd have no means whatsoever to investigate wrongdoing where the AG had a conflict, unless you went to the extreme step of firing your AG every time that happened. (And if you think Congress takes a while on the advice and consent on appointments now...hoo boy! Imagine the stalling tactics that would be employed to prevent an appointment to enable an investigation of criminal wrongdoing in your own party. Sheesh.)
Pages 10 through 12 really get to the heart of the statutory argument on this -- discussing the Congressional failure to make changes in the law under Sections 509, 510 and 515 of the AG's provisions (the parts that enable him to designate someone to perform some of the AG's duties where needed). Because Congress left those parts entirely entact and unchanged when they repealed the Independent Counsel laws, the Court argues that legal precedent says that they meant for those provisions to carry full weight. (And legally, I think this is sound reasoning, based on prior precedents on this.)
The judge then moves to the Appointments Clause portions of the arguement, which was really going to be where any action on this motion would ever have been -- unfortunately for Team Libby, they gain no traction here, either. From page 12 through to page 30, the judge meticulously details why Fitzgerald's appointment was apporpriate under the laws. He starts with a great history of the Appointments Clause, for those legal history buffs out there it's quite well done.
On page 20, fn. 7, the judge is absolutely correct in pointing out that after-developed writings (both by Team Libby and via the Fitz and Comey affadavits filed with the response brief on this) have no real standing in terms of interpretation and analysis. A judge must make these sorts of determinations based on what was in the minds of the parties at the time of the appointment (the two Comey letters detailing scope of authority, for example) -- anything written after the fact or said after the fact is just window dressing for legal purposes. Counsel for both sides know this, but you always file whatever you can to bolster your case anyway -- because you never know when you'll get a judge who is willing to look beyond the contemporaneous information (especially if the judge finds it to be unclear).
Again, though, we go back to the plain language -- this time, that used in the letters from Comey detailing the scope of Fitz's investigative powers. (See p. 22 for this.) The judge sets out a lengthy explanation of the facts and statutory applications thereto to explaint he rationale for his decision -- essentially making a very full record as a means of insulation from higher appeal and also to give a roadmap on his thought process to judges above his pay grade, should they choose to accept an appeal on this issue.
On page 26, fn. 14 and again on page 27, the judge compliments Fitzgerald (and by extension his team of lawyers on this) for comporting the Special Counsel's office within the proper bounds of their limited authority.
This ought to be a dead issue at this point, but we'll see if Team Libby wants to try and kick this up the chain. This was always going to be a very long shot for them with little chance of being granted -- and the detail of the judge's opinion on this makes it even less likely that it will go further up the very busy appeals chain.
The NYTimes is reporting that a decision will be made in the next two or three weeks to charge Rove -- so Libby might be getting some company in the former employee's of Bushie corner. We'll see. Since this is almost assuredly speculation coming from Team Rove and friends, I'm taking everything I read with an accompanying shaker of salt.
(This is a Tom Toles cartoon (from November of 2005) that someone sent me a while back -- sorry, forgot to make a note of who it was. I try not to use cartoons, but this one was so perfect for today, I couldn't help myself. Very, very funny stuff.)
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Fitzy witzy
Thanks for all the info Redd. The Toles is fitztastic!
I deny you a triple
‘Twas the night before Fitzmas, and all through D.C.
The Senate stood empty, just waiting to see.
The Grand Jury listened to Fitz with much care,
He hoped that the votes all would be there.
Ken Mehlman and Rover all snug in their beds,
While visions of November danced in their heads,
And Dick in his bunker, as “W†did sip,
A drink from the flask he poured through his lips.
When out at the Post arose such a clatter,
They sprung from their cubes to see what was the matter.
Away to the phones they flew like a flash,
Called up their sources who asked for some cash.
The Times of New York had the lights all aglow,
As they savored the scuttle they knew soon would flow.
When, what to their wondering eyes should appear,
But a signature sheet with twelve names written so clear.
With Old Crow in his throat, George W then spits,
He knew in an instant it must be the Fitz.
More rapid he guzzled, his Party might lose,
So he bristled and shouted while chugging his booze.
Now Karl! First Libby!
Damn Fitz you vixen!
Lost Browny then Scotty!
Who else are you fixin’
To topple from power!
We’re takin’ a lickin!
Now damn Fitzy, damn you!
Damn you this hour!
If not for those levees and Katrina’s wrath,
Dear God, why all these obstacles, who chose her path?
You live in the big house, but the White House is blue,
What else can go wrong, will Dick Cheney go too?
And then in a tantrum, he ran to the roof,
The stomping and kicking of each little hoof.
As he pulled out his hair and was turning around,
Up through the hatch big Barbara came with a bound.
In blue robe with white dots, from her head to her toes,
Yes her clothes were old fashioned, but everyone knows.
A bag of buckshot she held in her hand,
Then she told him that Karl could not take the stand.
His jaw how it twitched, his chin to and fro,
His cheeks were like roses, his nose white from blow!
His droll little mouth was drawn up like a bow,
She pulled on his ear…you’re back on the snow!
The shaft of a pen he held tight in his fist,
And the smoke it encircled, man was he pissed.
He made a mad face, then reached for the lead,
He shook it and scowled, I wish he were dead.
Righteous and pompous, a nasty old soul,
She slapped him and said, pull Cheney from the hole.
A wink of his eye and a grin on his face,
Soon Fitz he would show that he should stay in his place.
He spoke not a word but went straight to his work,
And filled all the shotguns, then turned with a jerk,
And with shaking fingers, he dialed the phone,
Dick Cheney I need you, he said with a groan.
Dick called for his chopper, to his team gave a whistle,
And away they all flew like the down of a thistle.
But I heard him exclaim as he flew out of sight,
Happy Fitzmas to all and we’ll get him tonight!
read more observations here:
www.thoughttheater.com
Daniel DiRito — enough.
And Rove has remained in that position since last November! On sunny days it is painful, and on rainy days it is not only painful but also carries with it a real risk of drowning.
I wondered where everybody was…
Christy - Just wanted to say that this is the sort of analysis that brought me here to FDL in the first place. I didn’t know how grand juries worked, and while I still don’t know all that much, at least the schedule-related questions are easier to answer now.
Hello, fellow addicts. I see we’re all here. Imagine how much work we’d get done if there were fewer scandals. (yeah right, not with these crooks)
Anyway, the popcorn is ready for nuking, the bubby (apple cider) is chilling.
I guess today isn’t Fitzmas?
MarkC @ 10:44 am (#6) - Considering where he lives and the position he’s in, you’d think that Rove would be more interested in global warming, wouldn’t you?
I love this bar…I mean blog!
Cujo 359 at 8 — Happy to oblige. It’s awfully nice to have an outlet to share my news addiction. (And I know my husband appreciates not have to hear me gripe day in and day out about what’s going on with the Bushies. lol Now the poor man only has to listen when things get really ugly in the news.) They keep committing crimes, I’ll keep an eye on it. ;-)
Christy, thanks for posting the note from Mamayaga, it’s exactly what I needed. Beautifully written.
Nice day here, doors open, cleansing spring air and sunshine. Can’t help but feel that way about things in general too.
C’mon Fitz!
(back to work now)
OMG! MSNBC is promoting that assanine “Hardball Hotshots” cabal as giving hot insights into today’s news. Ummmm…yeah. Tweety, Tucker Carlson, Rita Cosby and Joe Scarborough. They have wasted advertising space on promoting this idiotic panel? Have they lost their freaking minds?
Sorry, but I had to get that rant off my chest. Now back to your regularly scheduled Traitorgate speculation…
Thanks, Christy and Jane. You two make it so much easier for people like me who have to be “spoonfed” the info to understand it!
Also, I’m remembering this from Porter Goss in October 2003: “Somebody sends me a blue dress and some DNA, I’ll have an investigation.”
Oh, please, please, please, let there be a dress with PG’s DNA on it!
Ok, Ms. Smith, got it. Another good article/explanation. Sounds to me like it’s “intermission time” on the Plame front. The show will resume…perhaps in a week or so? Interesting stuff.
Ghostman
Christy,
Good plan on not getting worked into a lather. Lord knows we’ve got enough of that!
Hey, Off-topic, but I need to put it out there: Is anyone willing to stand up against the “You have to learn English to deserve to live here” crap? Of course, it is in anybody’s best interest to learn the common language of the place they live, but the reality is that we don’t have a “national” language, the way the French do, for example. In fact, lots of conservatives like to beat up on the French for trying to protect their own “language and culture” while trumpeting protection of American “language and culture” as the height of patriotism. Well, I grew up in Buffalo, NY, and I used to have wonderful Italian dinners at my friend’s grandmother’s house. There were many US citizens around the table , including grandma, and the adults would translate as she would congratulate me on my eating prowess in Italian. I didn’t hear anybody saying she shouldn’t be allowed to stay in the country unless she learned English. This kind of couched nativism really must be shouted down! We don’t make laws in this country about what language you have to speak!!! This is America!!
peace,
jim
Brilliant, Christy, as usual. Do you think you could accept a fed judge appointment from President Gore?
Daniel, you must have stayed up all night to make that one up. Nice.
Christy - my husband finally coined the term “rant-ful” to describe my mood on days when things are especially bad. :-)
Thanks so much for what you and Jane do - it is such a service to the truth.
Completely OT, but…
This plasma in front of the treadmill at the gym is getting to me…
This morning I look up and see—ulp!—John Bolton yapping away up there.
Seems the great mustached one is ready to hit the Security Council with a resolution condemning Iran for…um…they never said exactly but it sounded dire, like Iran wasn’t fully cooperating with the IAEA inspections and then there’s that thimble full of enriched uranium. AP reported on the IAEA report “that after more than three years of an IAEA investigation of Iran’s nuclear program, “the existing gaps in knowledge continue to be a matter of concern.”†Which is quite different than Bolton’s morning effort: “I think the evidence of Iran’s efforts to acquire nuclear weapons, its extensive program to achieve a ballistic missile program of longer and longer range and greater accuracy constitutes a classic threat to international peace and security, especially when combined with Iran’s long status as the world’s leading state sponsor of terrorism.” (Quiz: did you know our foreign policy was being formulated based on what John Bolton thinks? No? Well there you go!)
Contemplating this caused me to raise the treadmill rate to an 8:34 mile and ponder the question of the last few years: how the hell can anyone wear a mustache that big? At mile five, probably due to oxygen deprivation, I came up with it. We all know how you can tell a neocon is lying, right? (wait for it…) ‘Cause their lips are moving! Well Bolton has come up with a sure-fire solution, seeming as how the ability to lie without anyone being able to tell is a vital tool in diplomacy. I think the mustache seemed like a brilliant solution to a man of Bolton’s obvious intelligence—cover up his lips and no one will be able to see them move, and they won’t know he’s lying. (B-boom! Thank you, thank you, I’ll be here through Thursday.)
1,036 DAYS AND THE KILLING GOES ON!!
Christy,
What’re the chances of the investigation expanding before a Rove indictment…like gettin Woodward’s neck inta the GJ noose?
KEEP THE FAITH AND DON’T LET YER KIDS DATE REPUBLICANS!!
Mary from last thread,
I’m surprised that you would think that Rove’s case can not be relied on to have a political effect. The one thing it will have is precisely a political effect. The question is whether it will be viewed as partisan by the public. An indictment 3-4 months before the election will be seen by many not just Republicans as interference in the electoral process. Similarly, a Rove indictment within 3-4 months after the election will be questioned legitimately by many Democrats, progressives, and liberals (including many here at this site). That is why I think it is important if there is to be an indictment, it happen before such charges can be leveled by either side.
Has this already been posted ? - don’t see it in the thread . . .
Rove’s lawyers have been told there will be ‘no announcement’ in the next ten days
RAW STORY
Published: Thursday April 27, 2006
The attorneys for senior presidential adviser Karl Rove have been told there will be no decision in the case for at least ten days, MSNBC is slated to report today, sources tell RAW STORY.
The announcement that Rove will receive no decision in the next ten days assures that Rove won’t face indictment today or even next week. His lawyers say Special Counsel Patrick Fitzgerald has told them there will be “no announcement” in the next ten days.
MSNBC’s David Shuster is expected to report more this evening.
Christy, re #14 - Hardball Hotshots…
Does anyone else find it a mite strange that Matthews, Imus and the other now-reformed Bushbots never mention Keith Olbermann? They don’t talk about him, they don’t have him on, nothing. He anchors the 8 PM newscast fer chrissake. My guess is … they’re embarrassed about all the water they carried (and still carry for Bush). I think that’s why Imus is spearheading a center for injured vets. Somewhere in his pickled brain, he realized his cheerleading helped get this awful result. Having Olbermann on would just force him to confront that a lot of people did not drink the kool-aid.
Admittedly way off topic, but since she’s been the subject of other FDL threads, I thought this Cincinnati Enquirer story (via Raw Story) might be of interest:
http://news.enquirer.com/apps/...../604280402
Rawstory says MSNBC will be reporting that Rove has been assured no announcements for 10 days.
OT (or my perpetual topic I guess, depending)
http://www.rawstory.com/news/2....._0428.html
As the United States prepares a team of 30 to defend its record on torture before a U.N. committee,
Nice to see we still have a use for the best and the brightest. Otherwise, we might have to divert them to, oh, I dunno, to what better use could their talents be put?
As of now, the U.S. has yet to prosecute a single official, military officer or private contractor for “torture” or “war crimes” related to its occupations of Iraq and Afghanistan, or the “war on terror.”
They make it sound like we’re just not interested, don’t care, aren’t willing to take a stand. It’s not like pro-torture has become the Executive Branch formal position, adopted by DOJ and even argued in our own court system.
What? Oh. Never mind.
“The heaviest sentence imposed on anyone to date for a torture-related death while in U.S. custody is five months,” notes Curt Goering, Senior Deputy Executive Director for Amnesty International USA. “[That’s] the same sentence that you might receive in the U.S. for stealing a bicycle.”
#17
jim preston says:
April 28th, 2006 at 10:59 am
Along with Shrub saying we should sing the national anthem in English. Um, AFAIK, the ‘Star-spangled Banner’ only has words in English, unless someone’s translated it, but I have no problem with any language it’s in. It’s still nearly unsingable. (I spent a year of HS saying the flag salute in German - is that unAmerican also? It was still the US flag we were saluting.) Closed-minded wingnuts…
The one thing it will have is precisely a political effect. The question is whether it will be viewed as partisan by the public.
With Bush at an anemic mid 30’s JAR, with strong approval at 20% and strong disapproval at 45% (and rising) — there is little chance the Rove frog march will be seen as partisan.
If anything, Bush’s JAR will drop into the 20’s, and be headed for the teens — which is Shotgun Dick territory.
While former Governor Ryan has gotten some sympathy for the decent things that he did, most people believe justice has been served. Preznit Clusterfuck will get no sympathy, because he’s never done a decent thing in his life.
just showin’ my face. i’m here hanging out nearby the big kids who rule this hood. and i’m thankful every day i have this place to come to. hope yall all are making plenty of noise about the internet neutrality issue. if we lost the ability to hang out together this way. well…..
Christy,
Since this is the 1st time this G/J has seen Rove testify, they don’t have the whole experience of Rove’s previous appearances — while reading a transcript brings them up-to-date on the facts, it loses his demeanor
Will this make Fitz’s job harder to get an indictment?
VIENNA, Austria (AP) - Shortly after Iran’s president said his country “won’t give a damn†about any U.N. sanctions, the International Atomic Energy Agency said Friday that
IranPatrick Fitzgerald had enriched uranium and was in defiance of the U.N. Security Council.President Bush said “the world is united and concerned†about what he called
Iran’sPatrick Fitzgerald’s “desire to have not only a nuclear weapon but the capacity to make a nuclear weapon or the knowledge to make a nuclear weapon.†…Hugh 22 - I probably did not express it well.
I do not think that reliance should be placed on something happening with Rove on a schedule that will give a political bounce before 2006 elections. IMO, even if there is an indictment, it will be related to a lot of what is already in the public domain (the did he forget/is he a lieing weasel) re: lies, obstruction etc.
THere may be a lot more and it might all be recited in an indictment that hits well in advance of the 2006 elections, but I would not “rely” on that happening. It seems to me from the standpoint of structuring the case(s) there is still too much to be gained for the Prosecution by holding back and holding out for as long as possible. JMO
I don’t want Rove to be indicted — yet.
I’m willing to wait a few weeks. Let the HookerGate and the BillionsStolenInIraqGate scandals get off the ground first; then, when they’re established and rooted, we can go back to Rover.
“…we should sing the national anthem in English..”
And, NO BLUES LICKS or Diva R&B trills, either, thank you very much.
That shit makes me crazy.
Rawstory says MSNBC will be reporting that Rove has been assured no announcements for 10 days.
Let’s see — ten days brings us to the second week of May; the GJ meets on Wednesday; which means the FitzMasBunny presser would happen on May 11th.
Bingo!!!
ding at 30 — It depends. Was it Rove the Charmer — or Rove the man whose buttons got pushed, then he got rattled, arrogant and smarmy in trying to cover his ass? Not having been in the jury room, I can’t say for certain. But I will say this: in all of my extensive trial experience, having watched people on the stand who I knew to be decent and honest and people who I knew to be smarmy and disgusting — sitting in that spotlight where people are staring at you and analyzing your every little tic — every bit of who you are gets magnified. Every single bit. And every time someone was smarmy, lying, weasely, or otherwise — it was usually very obvious. So with that in mind, if Rove was himself, I’d say the Grand Jury got an eyeful and then some.
Okay, God knows it happens on an almost daily friggin’ basis, but once again Condicheezer Rice makes another utterly butt-stupid public statement:
“Secretary Rumsfeld and I have an excellent relationship,” she told Fox News. “We’re working very hard together. We’re actually having a great time here in Iraq.”
What does she think, they went down to Cabo for the weekend? “We’re actually having a great time here in Iraq”?? Shall we count the ways in which this statement is beyond fucked? Is it actually possible that a bowl of leftover breakfast cereal could actually do a better job than any given member of the Bush administration at this point? I think it is.
(Here’s the entire article…)
http://www.washingtonpost.com/.....95_pf.html
Redd-
What’s amazing to me too about people like Rove, is that they never seem to realize how they come off to other people. They totally think they snow and charm everyone.
I’m guessing the Iraqi VP hasn’t had nearly as much fun as Condi the last few days.
Christy Hardin Smith @ 10:59 am (#14) - OMG! MSNBC is promoting that assanine “Hardball Hotshots†cabal as giving hot insights into …
I think they must be actively trying to recruit a panel with a lower collective IQ than The McLaughlin Group. No other explanation I can think of is mathematically plausible.
BobbyG 34
That drives me crazy, too.
A-a-a-nd the ho-o-ome of th-e-e buh-ruh-huh-huh-RAVE.
I don’t know why America the Beautiful isn’t the national anthem, anyhow. Anybody can sing it, and it’s not full of nonsensical rhetorical questions.
10 days of kkkarl twisting in the warm breeze . . . i bet his cubicle is pretty stuffy this morning . . . fitzzz is really doing us proud!!!!
hahaha . . .
i still think ADULTRYgate is better than fornigate. fornigate is too subtle for gop mouth breathers . . .
NorskeFlamethrower @ 11:08 am (#21) - According to this BBC report, the IAEA has declared Iran “has ignored a UN Security Council call to suspend all nuclear fuel enrichment”, and Bolton is asking the Security Council to act. Word appears to be that this will be a resolution that does not include sanctions, but Bolton sounds like he wants more.
brkily — welcome
While I am happily awaiting the Rove indictment in the coming weeks (please Fitz and GJ….PLEASE), I am even more interested in the final outcome of this investigation. Will Cheney be in handcuffs sometime in the distant future? I’m sure the rethuglicans will do everything in their (dwindling) power to stall past 2008, but what is the endgame for Fitz? I’m pretty sure, judging from his past, that he doesn’t plan to stop with perjury charges on these scumbags. Oh what the future may hold!
On another note, I read this article,
Same War, Different States,
By Charlie Cook today. I don’t think that it’s right on the money, but it is an interesting piece about Ned Lamont (etc…) that justifies a dissection by someone smarter than me.
uh clem. (37) what a deliciously cathartic post! i think i love you.
I read that the prostitution parties were going on for 15 years and members of the appropriation committee and intellegence committees were invited. Do we know who was on those committees? If any women were on there, I would think we could rule them out. I need to look it up.
“Economists once wrote: Over the years, Mr. Negroponte has developed a reputation as a poker playing — poker-faced diplomat who never portrays his personal views.”
– Jonathan Salant, National Press Club Newsmaker Luncheon with John Negroponte, 4/20/06 [transcript via Lexis/Nexis, perhaps an error for “The Economist” once wrote]
Enquiring minds want to know: where does Mr. Negroponte play his poker?
just a crazy thought. could we have an fdl film festival? i will volunteer right now for the commitee.
Cathy 47 - would it be too much to hope that Roberts’ name could be on the list?
BTW - obviously Howie K. has forgotten, in his search for cogent thought by symbollic representation, that one picuture is worth 1000 words and of late, this site:
http://www.stuffonmycat.com/
has been worth NTY, WaPo, Time, Newsweek, USNews&WR and apparently the most recent NIEs for that matter.
cleter says:
“I don’t know why America the Beautiful isn’t the national anthem, anyhow. Anybody can sing it, and it’s not full of nonsensical rhetorical questions.”
Well, gee, what would be left of my own argumentation technique without nonsensical rhetorical questions?
peace?
jim?
Fitz is letting Rove and Bushco think about their crimes and punishment.
The longer they have to contemplate their fates, the bigger the fear factor.
The Star Spangled Banner thing is a non-thing for me. I don’t care what language it’s in. Nothing could be worse than what Rossanne Barr did to it.
I have a thought for really long threads. When you reply to a comment thats really far up-thread, put the number in a link so one can pop up and read and come right back. It drives me crazy to continuously page up and down to keep track of what was said. Now all I have to do is learn how to do it myself.
Here’s the intelligence committee:
Peter Hoekstra (R-Michigan) Chairman
Ray LaHood (R-Illinois)
Terry Everett (R-Alabama)
Elton Gallegly (R-California)
Heather Wilson (R-New Mexico)
Jo Ann Davis (R-Virginia)
Mac Thornberry (R-Texas)
John McHugh (R-New York)
Todd Tiahrt (R-Kansas)
Mike J. Rogers (R-Michigan)
Rick Renzi (R-Arizona)
(Vacant)
Jane Harman (D-California)Ranking Minority
Alcee L. Hastings (D-Florida)
Silvestre Reyes (D-Texas)
Leonard L. Boswell (D-Iowa)
Robert E. (Bud) Cramer, Jr (D-Alabama)
Anna G. Eshoo (D-California)
Rush D. Holt (D-New Jersey)
C.A. Dutch Ruppersberger (D-Maryland)
John Tierney (D-Massachusetts)
FWIW/IIRC:
Star Spangled is Scott Key’s poem adapted to the music of a British pub-crawling song.
I like Jimi Hendrix’s Woodstock rendition best.
The appropriations committee is too large to copy here. I didn’t see Roberts’ name.
It seems to me that most of the MSM reporters and pundits would be reading FDL on a daily basis. Redd’s erudite, concise, yet thorough, explanations of legals points are a veritable treasure trove. One would be a fool not to take advantage of her understanding.
Howard Kurtz, he dead! Howie baby, just on this one morning, between Redd and Mammayaga, you have been shown to be so wrong, so out-classed! How DOES it feel?
Blank Kludge @ 11:56 am (#55) - You RC. It has to be one of the least singable of all national anthems not composed by or for a dictator.
#55 … adapted to the music of a British pub-crawling song.
Which explains why a few drinks makes it easier to sing. [/snark]
The original words are interesting if also hard to sing, although probably the fundies would have a fit: ‘entwine/ the myrtle of Venus with Bacchus’s vine’. Party time? Mixing sex and booze, yes?
Marvin Gaye’s version at the 1983 NBA all star game is the best version of the National Anthem that I know of. He did it to “Heard it Through the Grapevine.”
Mary # 32
Any indictment of Rove before the November elections will have a downside for the Republican Party. It will reinforce and solidify negative perceptions of them. So they will take a hit no matter what. The question that I keep coming back to is will it be perceived by most people as a fair hit or not. That is why I think the timing is so important.
What has also been at the back of my mind is that legal strategy must take into account public policy considerations. Why after all should Fitzgerald spend so much time and energy going after Rove if there is no larger public policy goal involved? As in showing that even the mighty can not lie with impunity. Otherwise it is just a sterile legal exercise and Fitzgerald is welcome to it because I personally will no longer care what the outcome is or if there even is one.
In this regard, drawing Rove out as long as possible might be a great legal ploy but ultimately it does not serve the public policy purpose for undertaking such an investigation in the first place. This is why dates are important. I see only about 4-6 weeks remaining where legal maneuvering and public policy are congruent. After that, legalities will predominate. The public policy side will decline and the importance and fairness of the overall effort will be diminished.
Just the House Intel committee? Too bad - this is why I don’t bother with dreams.
Anyone else think that Van dehei should have asked for a “real” news option? Something like - Comedy Central? Where Colbert actually gets more PNAC info out on the table in a few sentences than all the “news networks” together have managed in 5 years?
http://www.crooksandliars.com/.....html#a8079
drouse @ 11:53 am (#53) - I second that recommendation, FWIW.
My other recommendation is that you cut and paste the header of the message you’re responding to, then edit it. Just start at the end of the previous article so that the article number is part of what you’re grabbing.
I include the commenter name, time, and the article number. The article number is easy to look up, but sometimes the webmistresses need to perform major surgery on a thread, and then the article numbers don’t match anymore. That makes the time hack useful.
ppirt (#42)
i was thinkin’last night, what about “Nookie gate”?
The last news alert about Iran noted the report by the Iaea, ending with the statement that they had no ‘proof’ that Iran was violating peaceful nuclear energy, but they are concerned.
That’s the whole story right there. No proof, but who cares — certainly not Bolton.
Meager attempt to combine main and sub topics of this thread:
I once knew a federal judge who loved to tweak the convicted at sentencing.
As example, he once tweaked a tax defrauder by saying something like: Says here I can sentence you to twenty years. But I’ll give you a chance to make amends, reduce the sentence and prove that you’re indeed a good patriot, albeit one that has stolen from the citizens of this nation, if you can sing the 2nd, 3rd and 4th verse of the Start Spangled Banner.
Oh, what’s that? You didn’t even know that our national athem has additional verses? Too bad. Twenty years. What’s next?
May #50 - still snorting through my nostrils at the cat thing. Thanks for the laugh of the day.
Christy #12
You are so right about the spouse.
My wife who was totally non-political when we married in 2001, now shares some of my same passion regarding what is happening.
You, Jane, and the other guest contributors have saved our TV set so many times. We joke about the powers of FDL.
I am not a violent man, but sometimes it is hard not to be angry about what is going on here in this great nation of ours.
Thank you for all you and Jane do for us.
Make that the “Star Spangled Banner” and yes, I had to learn them after that because said judge told my dad that anyone who could sing the additional verses would almost never be considered a traitor.
And no, I don’t remember them anymore. It was a long time ago.
Rasmussen at all-time low of 38% for second day in succession. Also note that the “strongly approve” went down a tick to 17%. In other words, 1% went from “strongly approve” to “somewhat approve”. “Strongly disapprove” held steady at 45%.
What I’m looking for is a 50+ reading on “strongly disapprove” from this, the most Bush-friendly of all the polls.
EPU# 60
I both love and worship the deity EPU !
my favorite version of the anthem as well, and if I wasn’t so link challenged, I’d have already posted it - video version is even better w/Magic, Moses, Dr. J and others groovin’!
site: scubanaked - downloads page, just scroll down to “SSB”
-
Just for the record: for Fitz to get an indictment, assuming the full complement of jurors, he just needs a simple majority. Is that the case?
And I’d say delaying Rove or any indictment beyond MemDay would be next to useless.
The fact that MSNBC seems to parse what I imagine is Luskin ‘a decision in ten days’ indictates to me they have been told to expect an indictment. Otherwise, they could frame is in a better light for Rove. That timeframe is maybe accounting for the other work outside of this and time to draft and consult w/team and GJ. Just my take (but I wish I was a ’source close to the investigaion’-they seem few/far bt…just like they should.)
FitzMate in 1 move.
Hugh - I do not disagree with you on any of your observations as to the political effects and the public policies. I do, however, think that prosecutors should live in more of a “sterile legal exercise†world and I wouldn’t fault them for it or expect that to change to accommodate political concerns. Hopefully the political and case concerns will intersect at a favorable point and I will hope for that, just not rely on it.
There were plenty of ways and opportunities for folks in DOJ to have taken stands on the important political concerns we have faced and which, to me (just me, jmo), are a lot more important issues in the general scheme, either individually or in groups. In general, the response has been to run silent, defer or circle and flank the Exec on each and every one of those issues (with the exception of Kris showing up on the “NSA program which the President has verifiedâ€). Again, just me personally, but I would both have lesser expectations of, and lesser respect for, a case being manipulated for political effect if there is a political concern afoot (and I just haven’t seen it, if it is there at all, for that matter).
That’s not to say I don’t hope for the harmonic convergence and I certainly agree with your assessment as to the possible impacts the case(s) may have, depending on timing of announcements.
No announcement in the next ten days…
GJ meets Wednesdays and Fridays. Who has May 10th in the pool?
Hugh – I think you’re onto something. I think the larger public policy issue is the one that started this journey: the CIA referring to Justice the matter of the outing of a covert agent. The investigation almost immediately ran into the wall which is, at a minimum, Libby and Rove. It is disturbing to contemplate the notion that Fitzgerald can’t get to the main issue without charging and trying those who have willfully impeded that investigation.
If the Ryan investigation is any indication, I don’t think we are likely to see full closure on the outing of Plame until well after Bush is out of office. I think Fitzgerald fully intends to see this through to the end, and seeing this mess extend through 2006, and beyond even 2008, may have the effect of insuring that (1) the Dems pick up more seats in 2006, and (2) we pick up even more seats in 2008, along with the presidency. While this may mean there is no George Bush to impeach, that doesn’t mean he – and Cheney - might not face some criminal charges. And while I certainly would like him and the rest of the coven of criminals to get what they deserve, I could sacrifice that happening while Bush is in office if it means that the Democrats take hold of Congress and latch onto the Oval Office as well.
So - thinking about writing in blogs, I check in with the Poor Man Institute and discover — they were hoping and praying for Roberts to be on the lists too. *g*
http://www.thepoorman.net/2006/04/28/dear-jesus/
Everybody seen the prostitute scandal in the House? Good thing the GOP stands for Christian Family Values.
http://online.wsj.com/public/a.....in_tff_top
Scarborough had an interview with Dean Calbreath, San Diego Union Tribune. Free Sex for the Votes in the U.S. House of Representives. The Tribune was just awarded a Pulitzer Prize for its investigation into the Cunningham Scandal. Word is up to 6 GOP Reps are involved… The FBI has subponeaed records from the apartments where the Repugs have sex parties with the hookers.
http://thinkprogress.org/2006/.....ix-members
http://www.dailykos.com/
http://tinyurl.com/a6erq
Apple canyon 2 #73
Which pool? I have May 18 in rwcole’s pool on when Bush’s job approval rating first enters the twenties. I think I also called 16% as his final approval rating, when he quits/leaves office/gets dragged to the Hague in chains, but I think in a burst of optimism I changed that to 9%
Christy No. 14
I cannot wait to hear Rita Cosby’s scholarly analysis of Judge Walton’s treatment of the Appointments Clause argument.
OMG!!! I stumbled across this, looking for liberal blog digests.
A 54 year old Texas woman is scheduled to have the plug pulled by the FOR PROFIT hospital, because she is incapacitated by bed sores.
The ugly face of GW Bush GOP Compassionate Conservatism . . .
http://elemming2.blogspot.com/.....ke-of.html
“uh clem. (37) what a deliciously cathartic post! i think i love you.”
brkily, ya went and got a blush outta me! ;^)
Glad you dug it. I was just aghast when I read that quote, and I figured this was as good a place to blast off about it as anywhere! Friggin’ Bushies… I just want to line them all up in a row and just trot along past ‘em and give ‘em all a big long Moe Howard smack in the kisser. “You KNUCKLEHEADS!!”
Oops… sorry, just drifted off somewhere else for a minute. I’m back again.
fahrender #64
ding ding ding… we have a winner!
Bowl of cereal better than a cabinet officer: sure, if it’s Life.
I used to sing the national anthem for sports events, no funny stuff tho once went for the B-flat on a dare. My favorite time was when I thought I might actually be forgetting the words mid-song.
neurophius @ 12:28 pm (#77) - So, you think she’s going to postpone the lecture on neutrino detection? ;0
Re Iran
Iran has some of the largest natural gas reserves on the planet, second I believe only to Russia’s. The need for a nuclear program of any kind is pretty much zero. Add to that their clandestine approach to it and their use of the illegal AQ Khan network to facilitate it.
Certainly, there is a certain amount of prestige associated with such a program but it is vastly overplayed. This is 60 year old technology we’re talking about after all. It is not exactly something to brag about. The idea that Khamanei put out this week that Iran would be willing to share this “technology” is ludicrous. If you’re going the legal route, you can do much better than these guys almost anywhere. And if you’re thinking something covert, the answer is much the same. Try the North Koreans, underpaid Russians, or what’s left of the Khan network.
No, the Iranians are going for the bomb. They just aren’t going for it very fast or very efficiently. Think of the Manhattan project as a weekend hobby kind of thing. They will get there eventually but it’s going to take a while.
Taking Khamanei’s statements with Ahmadinejad’s most recent loony tunes comments, I get the impression that they are trying to be provocative. Reasons for this are to play to their base, prop up a deeply unpopular regime and its leaders by playing the nationalism card, distract from corruption and a bad economy, goad us which because of the quagmire in Iraq they can, and lastly and perhaps most importantly keep the oil markets jittery and oil prices high.
hugh (#61):
public policy might not be the right term, but fitzgerald does have an important purpose in his work:
it is important for the nation to feel that there can be accountability in the system. we need to be able to witness the mighty being humbled when they have done wrong.
in this day and time we can use a lot of it.
Jim Preston #17
Hey, Off-topic, but I need to put it out there: Is anyone willing to stand up against the “You have to learn English to deserve to live here†crap?
Yes, that gets my hackles up too, Jim. Aside from it being pointless and bullying to make such a thing a law, I find it grating that many of the people who push this thing, if they tried to learn how to speak French, or German or whatever other foreign language, how well would that go, I wonder. Yet they just let “you must learn english” trip off their tongue as if doing that is easy as falling off a log for anyone and everyone.
Hugh @ 12:33 pm (#83) - I disagree. I’m not even sure “the Iranians” know collectively what they want. There seem to be people in authority there who want nothing to do with atomic weapons. There are also clearly people who want them.
I think your views about how “prestigious” technology is might seem funny to the average Iranian. In much of the world, it is high technology, even if it’s sixty years old. It’s also prestigious because the countries that have nuclear weapons are taken more seriously than the ones that don’t. If you look at the technology from the perspective of a country that doesn’t have it and isn’t taken all that seriously, things look different than they do from someone who is from the West.
There is also the possibility that the Iranian President’s moves have nothing to do with international politics and everything to do with gaining support at home. More than one person here has observed that there are some startling similarities between the Iranian President and our own - both appear to be incapable of running their own countries properly, and would benefit from a perceived threat from the outside.
New thRedd.
cleter #76
I love the numbers you chose. I will defer to you and ck at #35 who picked the 11th of May.
My computer is so #$%^&# slow today. ck picked the 11th before I could enter my choice of the 10th.
I want an indictment of Rover ASAP. 10th,11th,whatever.
Cujo359 says: No. 82
April 28th, 2006 at 12:32 pm
neurophius @ 12:28 pm (#77) - So, you think she’s going to postpone the lecture on neutrino detection? ;0
Yes, Cujo, I think that may actually be outside her areas of expertise, but I’m sure she’d do a fine job explaining the rule against perpetuities…
http://patrickjfitzgerald.blog.....arges.html
egregious No 87 says:
New thRedd.
Why can’t I find it on my computer?
After our cathartic deliverance from the kleptocratic junta ruling the U.S;
After the truth commission’s final report to a humbled U.S. ready to rejoin the world community as a member in good standing;
After we’ve begun making war reparations to the hundreds of thousand of impoverished and tortured victims of our military industrial complex; and
After we have a government led by patriots who learn from our past and serve our future rather than today’s crop of criminals who deny our past and steal our future, then;
We can retire the old colonial drinking song of a National Anthem and replace it with Woody Guthrie’s “This Land is Your Land,†which is the most beautifully stated organic expression of a unifying anthem.
sláinte,
cl
hugh (#83):
do you know who wrote this?:
“My opposition to war is not based upon pacifist or non-resistant principles. It may be that the present state of civilization is such that certain international questions cannot be discussed; it may be that they have to be fought out. We ought not forget that wars are a purely manufactured evil and are made according to a definite technique. A campaign for war is made upon as definite lines as a campaign for any other purpose:
First, the people are worked upon. By clever tales the people’s suspicions are aroused toward the nation against whom war is desired. Make the nation suspicious.
Second, make the other nation suspicious.
All you need for this are:
1.) a few agents with some cleverness and no conscience and
2.)a press whose interest is locked up with the interests that will be benefitted by the war.
Then the “overt act” will soon appear. It is no trick at all to get an “overt act” once you work the hatred of two nations up to the proper pitch.”
How familiar it sounds! It was written many years ago. Any guesses? I’ll post the answer in a few minutes…..
PJF #91. You’re nothin’ but a whore, using the forum created by the amazing talent of the writers here as a megaphone. You are also in violation of your blogspot terms of use agreement. Stop it, stop it, stop it.
#91:
we are not amused with your choice of personas. please go to your room and come up with a new identity. otherwise somebody might break your kneecaps when you least expect it.
have a nice day……..
fahrender #94
If you think I am advocating war with Iran, you are mistaken. If you think the Iranians are Jeffersonian democrats, you are even more mistaken.
hugh (#97)
sorry, nothing of the kind meant by me. i’m really thinking about how Ahmadinejad and Bush/”Got Milk?”Bolton go about their little word skirmish. it’s not the same as the leadup to the Iraq War but the technique is so much as Henry Ford described it.
But for that matter, Bush is certainly no Jeffersonian democrat either! That’s what we’re here for, to keep needling the Bush Administration, lest they drown Jeffersonian democracy in the bathtub.
I found the quote, attributed to Henry Ford, in the Hunter S. Thompson book
“Kingdom of Fear”