I was on our good friend Colin McEnroe’s radio show today and they asked me the dreaded question: what does Viveca Novak have to do with Karl Rove’s situation?
I tried to make it as simple as possible, which is not simple at all, and you could feel the radio dials switching over to Golden Oldies. So I’m going to try again here to make it simple and comprehensible.
There are basically two competing and I would say mutually exclusive theories about the role Viveca Novak plays in Karl Rove’s defense. They are rooted in the initial reporting on the whole affair, done in the days following our scoop (never credited but confirmed three days later by the New York Times) that she had spilled the beans to Rove’s attorney, her good friend Robert Luskin, that his client had been Matt Cooper’s source. My guess is that Rove and Luskin feel it is in their interest to keep the waters muddied by fueling both of these theories, hence the largely incomprehensible mess that exists in the press.
The Shuster Theory
Goes something like this: In the days leading up to Libby’s indictment, Patrick Fitzgerald expressed extreme skepticism about Karl Rove’s series of explanations due to the fact that Rove could never provide an adequate excuse for why the Hadley email was not produced in response to the January 2004 subpoenas until October of 2004. Robert Luskin goes to Fitzgerald and says, in essence, "aha! I’ll tell you why. I was having cocktails with my good friend Viveca Novak of Time Magazine in May of 2004 and she told me that everyone at Time knew that my client was Matt Cooper’s source. I went to my client who was shocked, shocked I tell you to hear this because he had no recollection of talking to Matt Cooper. This sent me on a search through Karl’s emails, and voila! The Hadley email. Karl then goes before the Grand Jury once again in October, his memory has been restored and it all makes perfect sense."
So Fitzgerald tells Time Magazine he wants to have a little chat with Viveca about conversations she had with Luskin starting in May 2004. Except when Viveca testifies, she thinks it’s quite probably March or earlier that the conversations with Luskin took place. According to Shuster, Fitzgerald continues to be quite troubled by the seven month delay between the time Luskin was evidently tipped off by Viveca and the time Karl had his memory restored.
The VandeHei Theory
In VandeHei’s reporting, the alibi provided by Viveca Novak is altered dramatically. Once again, in order to stave off indictment, Robert Luskin walks in to Patrick Fitzgerald’s office and says "have I got an excuse for you." His client Karl Rove first testified before the grand jury in February, 2004, at which time he did not indicate he’d ever had a conversation with Matt Cooper. Nonetheless, he would not offer Cooper a waiver of confidentiality. Cooper quite nearly went to jail and it was only after the judge held him in contempt of court and Time Magazine agreed to turn over Cooper’s notes that Rover’s memory was restored to him. Bless be.
In the VandeHei theory, Luskin tells Fitzgerald he was knocking back highballs with Viveca Novak in January of 2004 when Viveca spills the beans. Luskin gets a hold of himself, recovers from his shock and tells his client that people at Time Magazine think he was Matt Cooper’s source. Rove says "nonsense," goes before the grand jury and claims no knowledge of ever talking with Matt Cooper — exactly what he had told the FBI in October of 2003. Luskin says to Fitzgerald, "see? He didn’t change his story just because he knew Cooper was going to talk — he’d heard that story before and STILL went in and told the grand jury he’d never spoken with Cooper." Or something.
Only same problem — Viveca Novak testifies that she thinks she told Luskin in March or so, and quite possibly after Rove had already testified. Oops.
Two Theories
Now I myself have always given more credibility to the Shuster theory because if Luskin walked into Fitzgerald’s office claiming that he had talked to Viveca Novak in January of that year, why did Fitzgerald issue subpoenas for conversations starting in May? He’s a rather meticulous fellow who has done a very good job of limiting the scope of his inquiry to exactly the parameters he thinks he needs to explore. Pourquoi?
My guess has always been that the VandeHei theory was a second attempt at spin. Once Viveca Novak’s recollections did not match up with Luskin’s and did not support the tight timeline Luskin was trying to sketch between the tipoff and the discovery of the Hadley email I have always thought it possible that they floated a second cover story to try and accommodate the earlier meeting, although it’s always sounded like patent bullshit to me. But you can still see the two theories cropping up in the reporting of each reporter today:
Robert Luskin spoke of a conversation with Time reporter Viveca Novak and a tip about what her colleague Matt Cooper might testify to. Luskin and Rove then searched for White House information to refresh Rove’s memory and found a white house email about the Rove-Cooper conversation. Then, according to Luskin, Rove changed his testimony.
The problem is that the time lapse from the Novak tip to the new Rove testimony…was 7 months.
All the while, Fitzgerald suspected that Rove was acknowledging what had happened only because new evidence was surfacing, according to lawyers in the case. But Rove and his lawyer have presented an alternative explanation: that Rove genuinely did not remember his conversation with Cooper, and testified to that effect even though he was aware of rumors that he was one of Cooper’s sources.
[]
Luskin told the prosecutor that Viveca Novak had informed him that she had heard from other Time reporters that Rove was Cooper’s source for a July 2003 story on Plame. Luskin shared this information with Rove — before Rove testified that he did not recall his conversation with Cooper.
Yesterday, Rove told the grand jury that it would make no sense for him to lie in February, knowing that all of this would soon be public, the source said.
Notice that Robert Luskin seems to be the source for both of these stories.
(graphic by Monk from Inflatable Dartboard)
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“Fitz me once and Fitz me twice, then Fitz me once again, it’s been a long, looong time…”
not that complicated. now back to reading math papers…
F-I-T-Z YAHOOOOOOOOOOkitt
Damn, you guys are just too freaking fast.
Well, FITZ-YAH, anyway!!
Rerun alert:
The excellent filibuster by Senator Ron Wyden, with Dick Durbin et al is being replayed (via c-span2 online or tv) right now, as he attempts to save us BILLIONS AND BILLIONS of further debt issued for the sole purpose of further enriching profit-swamped oil companies…
OT
Josh’s sleuths are thinking Porter Goss might be one of the “users” of the Wilkes prostitution service. That’s the guy who hangs out at the health club most mornings IIRC.
TPM Muckraker
Hopefully they are casting a wide net and pulling in a few big fish!
I love the title.
Sunday! Sunday! Sunday!
VandeHei vs. Schuster
LIVE! Only on Pay-Per-View!
$24.95
Did anyone see Dana Milbank’s great story about Senatorial hypocrisy as they had a little gas-price related event today?
“”Since George Bush and Dick Cheney took over as president and vice president, gas prices have doubled!” charged Sen. Barbara Boxer (D-Calif.), standing at an Exxon station on Capitol Hill where regular unleaded hit $3.10. “They are too cozy with the oil industry.”
She then hopped in a waiting Chrysler LHS (18 mpg) — even though her Senate office was only a block away.”
Milbank article
OMG
I’m not going to spoil the surprise… just go to this link!
http://www.tpmmuckraker.com/archives/000494.php
That story makes no sense whatsoever. How could Rove “kno[w] that all of this would soon be public” if he didn’t remember it, and didn’t believe it happened?
And if Luskin knew in January 2004 that there was a chance that Rove was Cooper’s source, why didn’t he go back and find the Hadley email BEFORE Rove testified, produced the email to Fitz, and prepped Rove to talk about it?
Luskin is utterly desperate — or a really bad lawyer, which is not his reputation — under both scenarios.
Ned’s on Majority Report right now.
Okay, back to Jane’s post.
LOl..
revdeb already beat me.
Anyway, it’s a great story.
Let’s make this really simple – under either theory, Rove was obstructing justice. His lawyers can spin this all they want. Rove lied and for a very obvious reason which has nothing to do was the “I don’t recall” defense.
C’est “pourquoi”, cherie.
If the “why would I be so stupid to lie” defense is such a winner, there would be precious few perjury or obstruction of justice convictions.
This is a really clear explanation Jane. I would’ve LOVED to have been a fly on the wall in that GJ room today as Fitz went over and over and over the different stories that were told to this person and that person and another person.
For me, the key words are the last sentance. Rove/Luskin throwing sand in the faces of the people.
marky—
Mrs. Goss is not a happy camper right now. ROTFLMAO! Whoo boy, how will the NSA recover from this ugliness?
God Jane — when you tell it, it’s so deliciously clear and logical and funny. Can you just go back to the beginning and tell the whole tale in this kind of prose? What a great book THAT would be! A humorous, easy-to-read, retelling of the whole frikkin disaster. I bet that would hit #1 on Amazon in no time.
God bless Monk.
zennurse
Just to put that in perspective — the limo that Bush rides in gets — 8 (eight) miles to the gallon. My ‘67 Chrysler 300 with the 440 engine and holley double pumpin’ carbs did better than that!
But it does weigh something like 4 tons.
OT, but I found an amusing title on a front page diary at RedState:
“IN-02: MoveOn.org continues its relatively baseless attack on Chocola “
“Relatively baseless”? That’s the best they can do?
What next—Bush is “relatively better” than Hitler?
marky #9:
holy fucking shit! to quote tmp: double yowzah.
even the rumor of this is gonna result in beanies poppin throughout goober america.
damn, there’s just waaaaay too much to keep up with. lookout iran…
Anyone care to make predictions tonight? I say Karl Rove gets indicted tomorrow morning for perjury and obstruction of justice.
Does anybody remember what was happening when Rove laid down in front the of the wheels of Air Force One? His excuse to the Grand Jury that forgetting to mention his Cooper conversation would be suicide may be like G. Gordon Liddy’s moment of holding his hand over the candle even when it burned flesh — the secret is in not caring.
Ned’s over, but Greenwald’s coming on.
Sam shreds.
the real question is…. why didn’t Rove call up Cooper and ask him about the rumors?
It is anti-repukian, so how can it be off topic:
What You Need To Believe To Be A Republican:
Jesus loves you, and shares your hatred of
homosexuals, Arabs, and Hillary Clinton.
Saddam was a good guy when Reagan armed him, a bad guy when Bush’s daddy made war on him, a good guy when Cheney and Rumsfeld did business with him, and a bad guy when Bush couldn’t find Bin Laden.
Trade with Cuba is wrong because the country is
Communist, but trade with China and Vietnam is vital to a spirit of international harmony.
The United States should get out of the United
Nations, and our highest national priority is
enforcing U.N. resolutions against Iraq.
A woman can’t be trusted with decisions about her own body, but multi-national corporations can make decisions affecting all mankind without regulation.
The best way to improve military morale is to praise the troops in speeches, while slashing veterans’benefits and combat pay.
If condoms are kept out of schools, adolescents
won’t have sex.
A good way to fight terrorism is to belittle and antagonize our long-time allies, then demand their cooperation and money.
Providing health care to all Iraqis is sound policy, but providing health care to all Americans is socialism.
HMOs and insurance companies have the
best interests of the public at heart.
Global warming and tobacco’s link to cancer are junk science, but creationism should be taught in schools.
A president lying about an extramarital affair is a impeachable offense, but a president lying to enlist support for a war in which thousands die is solid defense policy.
Government should limit itself to the powers named in the Constitution, which include banning gay marriages and censoring the Internet.
The public has a right to know about Hillary’s cattle trades, but George Bush’s and Dick Cheney’s driving records are none of our business.
Being a drug addict is a moral failing and a crime, unless you’re a conservative radio host. Then it’s an illness and you need our prayers for your recovery.
Supporting “Executive Privilege” is imperative for every Republican ever born, who will be born or who might be born ( in perpetuity.)
What Bill Clinton did in the 1960s is of vital national interest, but what Bush did in the ’80s isirrelevant.
There’s nothing wrong with supporting drunken hunters who shoot their friends and blaming the friends for looking too much like quail.
I have to hand it to you, Jane, (and Christy, too) for being so on top of this and keeping the details as straight as it is possible to do with so many twists, turns, and players. It’s hard to believe there is a straight-shooter in the entire bunch, which makes it all the harder to figure out who’s zoomin’ who, and why.
I’m starting to picture Fitzgerald as getting closer than ever to finding the little end of loose yarn that, with barely a tug, will unravel the whole sordid mess, and the Bush presidency will finally – and truly – be in its last throes.
While I think impeachment is a terrible thing to put the country through, I am at the point where I do not believe it is nearly as harmful as allowing these despicable pieces of crap to maintain their hold on this government. I pray America wakes up and realizes that we face far greater danger from the likes of Bush, Cheney and their many minions than we ever have from any terrorist act.
marky says:
April 27th, 2006 at 5:21 pm
Would you call that undercover work?
It’s getting harder than a wedding peter to keep up with all these stories.
p.lukasiak — great post earlier. Really enjoyed it. Sorry my comment is not more timely — can’t post from work.
I’ll go with the FireDogLake Theory: Rove thought the fix was in as long as Ashcroft was in charge of the justice department and he lied like a cheap rug until James Comey put Fitzgerald in charge of the investigation. Suddenly, all those convenient omissions and missing emails acquired an importance they didn’t have before.
“I know what we’ll do,” says Esquire Luskin. “We’ll get Viveca Novak to acknowledge what everybody’s known all along: that Karl has been a lying sack of crap from Day One on this because he just forgot. I’ll admit it, Karl will say he’s sorry and Fitz will be appeased!”
Only Fitz’s response to Luskin was “I’ve got evidence that you and your client have been lying to me. You’re lucky I don’t slap YOU with obstruction for that last little gambit you pulled. And if you don’t come up with a better story by the end of April, this grand jury will be allowed to do what they’ve wanted to do the first time you lied to them.”
Great stuff. Check out NRO’s The Corner. Byron York is confident that no indictment is coming any time soon. This is followed by Andy McCarthy telling us that leaking Ms. Plame’s name was of no consequence. Please go after these two clowns!
I don’t think impeachment would be a terrible thing for the country at all. I think it would be like an exploratory laparotomy (open belly surgery) to remove a huge, malignant tumor that is invading many organs and will kill if not removed.
Impeach.
semblance – 22:
Didn’t Fitz schedule a press conference the day before he indicted Libby? Wouldn’t he do the same for Rove?
Kazuza !!!!!!
It becomes easy if you remove Luskin as the source of Fitz’ knowledge of (i) the alleged conversation with Vivak and (ii) the Hadley email.
Not that people don’t try to obstruct investigations or think they are more clever than prosecutions, and not that Rover isn’t someone who would obstruct or think himself too clever, but I still think the better way to bet on the whole Vivak/Luskin charade is that Fitz knew about both before Vivak testified and Rover testified again.
First, you really do have to assume that prosecutors always know more than they let on. That is particularly true with emails, since we don’t know who might have been copied on it, who it might have been forwarded to, etc. Even if it was erased, they did collect computers. There is also the fact that, IIRC, there were (and perhaps still are) expectations that Hadley would be indicted when Scooter was, and a great deal of surprise when he wasn’t. Admittedly, Fitz having knowledge of a Vivak/Luskin meeting is more less easy to explain, but remember, Time WRT Cooper was in a bind, and there are many ways for prosecutors to gather information that fall short of an appearance before a grand jury.
I didn’t and the time, and I still don’t, think that Luskin through a curve ball into the investigation or Fitz’ schedule. (Not that a prosecutors timetable is written in stone, it is necessarily organic).
I still think the best take on the Luskin/Vivak story is that Luskin learned that Fitz had the email, with the Vivak “story” (not that their meeting didn’t really happen) then being offered up to rehabilitate Rover’s testimony. That is why Vivak then went before the GJ, to put it into the official record, and why Rover followed her.
Most importantly perhaps, if I were to speculate some more (and I will), that would have been the start of Rover’s cooperation (I still don’t believe that anyone who testifies 5x before a grand jury is not cooperating).
What it all means, I don’t know.
The foregoing, being a stream of consciousness that I felt I needed to share, may have holes in it. Poke away at it.
Lina-34 (re semblance-22). It would seem natural for Fitzgerald to hold a press conference on the SAME day the Grand Jury hands down an indictment. Maybe he will tomorrow!
36–
Last time he announced a press conf. the day before the Libby indictment. I don’t expect a surprise indictment.
Didn’t Fitz schedule a press conference the day before he indicted Libby?
I don’t remember. Shuster tonight said that Libby didn’t know until that morning, but I can’t remember the press conference details.
Regarding Porter Goss, time for another lie detector test?
Marky and RevDeb -
thanks so much for the TPM link – please jeebus, please jeebus, please . . .!!!
Wonder if Gannon was covering that story (Goss, Cunningham)
Great, great analyis! I think you nail it here. My favorite part of the supposed Rove defense is that “of course he wouldn’t have lied”… Give me a break. Early on, when Gonzales was directing the investigation, there was no reason to think they’d get caught… I simply don’t believe Rove forgot he spoke to Cooper, unless he was leaking the story to so many people he lost track… Of course, while we can’t know any of this for certain yet, the Shuster Theory plus your take makes a great deal more sense. Those seven months look nothing less than damning. And I trust Luskin almost as much as I trust Rove…
It should be a investigative circus once the dems get control of the house. I think Goss will be the first to be looked at closely.. Having a shameful history of politicizing the CIA in the more shameful effort of covering Bush’s ass makes him a most appropriate target for investigation. He and Senator Pat Roberts are the worst of the worst in bringing down our democratic form of government. They outperform those who threaten our way of life. They have demoralized the intelligence community we depend on for fighting terrorism. Republicans can be proud of what they hath brought forth.
I still don’t believe that anyone who testifies 5x before a grand jury is not cooperating).
EPU, don’t you mean cooperating?
Hell,I almost believe that Bush was the Arabian Candidate, with people like Goss and Roberts his henchmen.
marky #40 -
funny you should mention that as I noted to myself that none of the numerous accounts I’ve read today make any mention of ‘da hookers gender
You are oh so right, zennurse. Though I support censure– it is sorta like finding a horrible , metastasized malignancy during an e-lap, shutting the belly with button closures so that the surgeon can rush the unfortunate person out of the OR and put him/her back in the ICU to die a horrible and slow death in hushed tones.
BTW– Countdown just played the You Spin Me Round lyrics– methinks they read them some Christy and Jane. ;)
OT – Malkin was on O’Reilly. I didn’t realize she has buck teeth if I ever saw any. They were super white, too. Kinda scary.
But I never knew her teeth are that huge.
cbl,
Cunningham has admitted to loving men (although he’s not gay, of course!).
That’s why I wondered about the gender.
Zennurse – I have that double negative thing going. There are plenty of typos, but that isn’t one.
BTW – I once biked from Providence, through the Cape, all the way up to Salem. Been to Rockport and Marblehead (and I lived for three years in the Boston area too). Rockport and Marblehead are great towns.
I’ll take the Shuster version. “…Fitzgerald seems to be quite troubled by the seven month delay between the time Luskin was evidently tipped off by Viv…” and the time Karl cooked up his very unclever senior moment explanation. Yeah, I’ll bet Ranger Fitz IS TROUBLED. I smell whole hog, with an apple in his mouth, Rove, roasting in chef Fitzgerald’s kitchen while being basted with the chef’s special blend of herbs and indictment sauce.
angie #46
I’m sure Olbermann and co. read the blogs.
For Libby, the grand jury was expiring on the day of the indictment, and the press had worked itself into a frenzy, demanding some sort of response from Fitz. That could be one reason why a press conference was announced a day ahead. Maybe now is different.
I’m still hoping. :)
Great, but as Shakespeare might put it “y’are too cold.”
C’mon now. Raw Story has Schuster’s Hardball report quoting Rove as saying his experience in the GJ was “hell.” The Grand Jurors were all over him like white on rice. Put a Republican in a room with people curious about factual information, under no time constraints, and the end result will be a vaguely odiferous puddle under a chair. And Jane, you left out the best part, they are meeting again TOMORROW.
That means we all get to pull out the F-Word again, and jam our fingers silly all day pecking the refresh key, as if some Pavlovian mannah were to be dispensed with each hit.
Add to the mix, the bombshell that Porter Goss might be implicated in HookerGate and you have the makings for a very nice weekend.
zennurse – the only reason I think impeachment is not good for the country is because nothing else seems to get done while it’s ongoing. I am old enough – maybe you are too – to remember Watergate, which I think in terms of criminality, this president has clearly exceeded.
On the other hand, the kind of stuff that has been getting done – and the list is pretty long – hasn’t been good for the country, either, so stopping it in it’s tracks might be be a good thing.
Bush is such a cancer that I agree that impeachment is the only way to “save the patient.”
I used to think the people could be separated from their actions, but I now believe that their actions are a true reflection of the kind of people they are. And they need to go – preferably to jail.
zennurse #33: Impeach.
Not to quibble, but I think the correct spelling is: Chimpeach.
hurm
BTW, if my theory is right, I am claiming double super omniscience, which is the strongest kind there is. :)
About impeachment: look at it this way. Suppose the Dems win in Nov., hold lots of hearing, and all the bad shit comes out. Let the REPUBLICANS call for impeachment then, and if they don’t, hang Bush on them in 08
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..02386.html
OT on McCarthy.
Long time lurker, finally stepping out to say hi.
Because I have to say… damn, Jane, I fucking love you. This post and yesterday’s recapping Rove’s grand jury testimony… well, they’re simply works of art. You brought it all back, so clearly, simply and delicately but delectibly snarky. I think I love you.
But seriously, thanks. I’m a huge fan.
Billmon has some great stuff up tonight. He says it could be that Rove is a squealer: The following, from Billmon:
–
Whether Karl can help give it to him is another story, one that hasn’t been told yet. Like I said, this may all still be about getting Scooter (although Libby could also just be a rest stop on the road to Cheneyville). But if Fitz decides to let Rove off, or taps him lightly on the wrist, in order to get what he thinks he needs to prosecute the foulest son of a bitch to inhabit the vice president’s office since Spiro Agnew copped a plea, then all I can say is more power to him.
Indictments all around on next Wed. Tomorrow would be good, too.
mesoderm– feels good doesn’t? nice to meet you!
doesn’t it? whoops.
Thanks for the link RevDeb, first I heard that
that malevolent piece of shitGoss might get caught in Hookergate.Since Porter likes lie detector tests so much, this is a perfect opportunity for him to take one.
angie – thanks. and yes, it does.
re TPM – Goss is not an un-handsome fella, right ladies? (at least, for a crusty ole gray spook)….probably oozing with charm, n’est-ce pas? So why pay for some action when you’re oh-so-powerful (think “Mona Lisa” movie with Bob Hoskins.) That must have been one heck of a love shack…
Punaise–yet another reason to wonder what sort of forbidden fruit they were offering. I bet it was boys, but there are many other possibilities.
Well said Frank in 42, thanks.
If the subpoena mentioned May, it was probably because Viv herself told Fitz that was a likely date.
From Viveca Novak’s firsthand account in Time, beginning with an informal interview before her subpoena:
Anne–I think it would be a relief to a lot of people in this country. It would look as though at least some damn thing worked right anymore.
I do remember Watergate. I was scared during the hearings because of the depth of the wrongdoing was exposed, and I feared for the country if Nixon stayed on. But he did not.
‘All work and no play makes Karl a dull boy’
Howdy Mesoderm. Ain’t Jane a peach!
Jane:
It’s porquoi
joe scarborough doing the prostitute story
p luk, great catch in 25. That sounds like a question Rove got from the grand jury.
Goss is not an un-handsome fella, right ladies?
i’d agree — the package ain’t bad; it’s the contents that smell.
And is this the man who spends several hours a day at his health club? Is/has he been born again?
Handsome is as handsome does.
Schuster’s greater credibility than Pool Boy’s is evidenced by the fact that we have not seen fit to give Schuster a nickname.
mesoderm — come on in, the water’s fine.
Love the handle! Ecto, meso — it is all skin to me….
Meanwhile, what I just do not get about either Viveca Novakula theory is why Luskin hasn’t been conflicted out of represtenting Rove. I mean, he has insinuated himself as a fact witness. Normally, that means an automatic conflict and precludes future representation. When there are other types of conflicts, the client, once informed of the conflict, can waive it and continue with conflicted counsel. That is normally not the case, however, with fact witness conflicts because the other party is in charge, ultimately, of calling in the witness chit.
So, anyone have a theory about how Luskin continues to be Rove’s attorney?
marky 68: oh, my. that NAMBLA stuff will play well to the base….
punaise– Goss’ lips creep me out as does his voice. Cover those with duct tape and just maybe I can think about it……nope, can’t do it. sorry;)
Markey,
Ya think Goss will be continuing to hang out at the health club or will he have to find another cave to hide in?
Now they’re talking about Jerry (Gerry?) Lewis too!! Getting tastier! Keep it coming. . . .
deadlast #26, Saddam was a bad guy when he was considering using the euro instead of the dollar. Unforgiveable, ya know.
angie – at least you tried
I don’t mean to be a lurker, but by the time I get through reading all the comments, a new thread pops up and I miss the boat. You are all awesome. Thanks so much for all the insight. Jane, Redd and the rest, you kick ass!
61:
Billmon’s theory could be right that Rove was before the GJ, again, because he’s cooperating with the prosecutor. But he makes too much of Karl “volunteering” to go and Luskin being remiss in letting him go. I don’t think anyone volunteers to go. They are just avoiding a subpoena by agreeing to go.
immanentize says: “So, anyone have a theory about how Luskin continues to be Rove’s attorney?”
April 27th, 2006 at 6:04 pm
I have been wondering about that as well – but are there any circumstances that would permit an attorney to continue representing a client when the attorney is also a fact witness, so long as the client consents?
FWIW: Friday, a week from tomorrow, with be the 5th of May — please make it the Fitzo de Mayo … Indict Cheney !
Finally! Hookers and sex. Impeach Porter Goss!!
neurophius #79
I happen to like Schuster, even though he works with Chris Matthews and used to work for FOX News, but he bashed FOX after he left:
Goss is the one cleansing the CIA from Dems. Boyoboy, I’ll bet there are a few spooks that will volunteer their time to help out the FBI on this one.
colleenmiltarymom says:
are you watching scarborough. i’m amazed to see him devoting the first segment of his program on this story. david shuster, melanie sloan, a reporter from san diego union tribune and wonkette all had something to say. lol.
Stephen — plea deal — Luskin could continue to represent Rove then because the facts would be off the table.
Meanwhile, if Goss is implicated in the hooker scandal, I’ll bet anyone a dinner at the Palm that the CIA was the source of the information.
RevDeb #92
I sure hope so.
Isn’t it illegal to fire people based on political affiliation?
mesoderm #60 – well said ! nice to have you join us
am a little disappointed Wonkette did not mention Guckert under ’sex scandals’ but it was still fun to see Scarborough climb all over it
Hi Mesoderm
Desolé, punaise– and I do like men, too. Like Fitz, Feingold, Gore, Neil Young, George Clooney, etc. The list grows every day… and so do they.
Scarborough leads with the Wilkes/prostitution scandal. One of the issues the Republican used against Clinton was the threat of blackmail, not just from Monica, but from anyone who knew about it. The perception is that once a Lobbyist has “something” on you, it’s cheaper to blackmail you than to bribe you.
Karl thinks he’s in bigger do-do than before, and this according to Shuster. Be sure to catch the repeat of Olbermann if you missed it earlier.
There already has been a couple of diaries over at Kos, and one is just now up on the Recommended list.
Story details at Raw Story
Trying to recall, and will stand corrected if recall faulty, but when Scooter was indicted, I don’t think Fitz announced the press conf. until Friday morning. It’s just that there was rampant speculation Thursday night . . . with a huge percentage of folks, even in the MSM, predicting indictments on Friday. Tick-tock, tick-tock.
Maybe he is squealing and Fitz wants others to fret knowing Rove was there so long. I wish I knew if a person had their security clearance pulled, would that fact be classified? I imagine Rove got his clearance pulled…but why would that not be mentioned?
Illegal? What does that mean to this admin?????
Illegal, Schmillegal. They do what they want because no one holds them accountable.
Wouldn’t it be fun to take some of them down for their own blowjobs!
I’m just sayin’
There isn’t enough irony on this planet to let that happen. . . .but please oh please.
Sisters and Brothers,
Let us pray.
bkny, thanks for the tip on Scarbourough, I never would have watched had it not been for your 75.
Let me add about the prostitute thing — Mitch Wade is very possibly not only a corrupt bribing SOB, but also seems to have intelligence connections — CIA, DOD or otherwise. So, Wade’s “relationship” with Goss when the latter was a pro-CIA Congressman would not be surprising at all. Too bad these guys think with their little heads….
I can’t remember when Fitz announced the Libby presser. Everyone knew the GJ term expired on Friday though.
Here’s one you guys should click on for sure. This is a tiger that’s gonna bite alot of people.Insurers continue to pull out of coastal areas
April 26, 2006 – 03:21 PM
From USA Today:
Updated 4/26/2006 12:27 PM ET
By Marilyn Adams, USA TODAY
With the 2006 hurricane season starting in just five weeks, many home insurers from Texas to Florida to New York are canceling policies along the coast or refusing to sell new ones out of fear of another catastrophic storm.
In the widest insurance retreat from coastal property since Hurricane Andrew slammed Florida in 1992, insurers as far north as Long Island, N.Y., and Cape Cod, Mass., are shedding coastal homeowners policies to reduce their exposure.
George Will wrote one of those parrot Op Eds week or so ago, repeating the same talking points as Bush about the cost of Global Warming to the economy. Well the insurers aren’t dummies, and apparantly they’ve done some cost estimates of their own. The News Hour tonight had a story from the Maldive Islands in the Indian Ocean. 4,000 refugees there already, retreating from low islands. Somebody get out a pencil.. the costs of not acting are here and they need to be tabulated.
it was pretty obvious the night before Fitzmas that something big was going to happen. as you recall, that was the night Bob Woodward made his infamous appearance on the Larry King Show poo-pooing the story about him imminently about to break “a big story”.
notimetowaste at 101 — I think that is correct. The announcement for the presser came the morning of the indictment and not beforehand as I recall as well.
101: I stand corrected. The media advisory on Fitz’ web site is dated 10/28.
John Casper
me neither, but i saw the promo for al franken and thought i’d stick around. little did i know. oh hell, i was hoping it wasn’t a pretaped segment, cause franken’s reaction to the hooker angle would have been priceless. guess i’ll have to wait for tomorrow’s radio program.
immanentize #105
Don’t forget, Goss is from Florida, where Katherine Harris is and she has been implicated with the MZM scandal.
ccmask at 102 — when Rover’s portfolio changed in the last few days, there were reports (I belive in the WaPoo) that he maintained his securoty clearance, even with the move across the hallway.
Christy #113
Think Progress noted that McClellan said “absolutely” that Rover-Rover-Bring Karl Rove Over still had his security clearance despite his demotion.
Matt, any chance the company has vid of Harris and Goss with Wade holding fistfuls of cash a la ABSCAM?
I know this is totally OfT, and completely unrelated to the topics usually discussed here, and I apologize for that, but I think it is absolutely hysterical that Rosie O’Donnell is going to replace Merideth Viera on “The View.”
http://extratv.warnerbros.com/…../text.html
Thank you for indulging me. You may now return to your regular blog-programming….
Bingo immanentize in 105.
Your comment got me googling:
Director, Central Intelligence Agency
“Previously, Mr. Goss represented the 14th Congressional District of Florida for almost 16 years. He was chairman of the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence from 1997 until his nomination as DCI in August 2004. He served for almost a decade as a member of the committee, which oversees the intelligence community and authorizes its annual budget. During the 107th Congress, Mr. Goss co-chaired the joint congressional inquiry into the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001. He was the second Director of Central Intelligence to have served in Congress.
Mr. Goss was a U.S. Army Intelligence officer from 1960 to 1962. He served as a clandestine service officer with the Central Intelligence Agency from 1962 until 1972, when an illness contracted on duty forced him to retire. While in the CIA’s Directorate of Operations, he completed assignments in Latin America, the Caribbean, and Europe.
After leaving the CIA, Mr. Goss and his family settled in Sanibel, Florida, where he was a small business owner and founded a newspaper. He was elected to the Sanibel City Council in 1974 and served there until 1983, including three years as mayor. From 1983 until 1988, Mr. Goss was a member of the Lee County (Florida) Commission, where he served as its chairman from 1985 to 1986.
Mr. Goss holds a Bachelor of Arts degree in classics and Greek from Yale University. He was born in Waterbury, Connecticut, on 26 November 1938. He and his wife, Mariel, have four children and 11 grandchildren.H
I remember the anticipation of something happening on Oct. 28 because the GJ was set to expire that day so we were all waiting with baited breath. I had a party planned on short notice, but not that short. We figured that something had to happen.
heh heh: “gosse” in French is slang for kid, i.e. “salut, les gosses!” = hi, kids!
Obssessed @ 106
If you check Fitzgerald’s web site, the press release and media advisory are dated Oct. 28th, same day as the indictment.
immanentize says:
April 27th, 2006 at 6:13 pm
What you’ve said about the plea deal makes sense. It will be interesting to find out when it was agreed to. As for where – would it have been signed at a plea market? *g*
I wonder how the prostitute thing will play on Main Street. Seems like the Gannon thing never really picked up much traction.
But what if it catches on like the Aruba thing? Or the Clinton thing, for that matter! Did anyone ever see the SNL/Eddie Murphy skit “The Shooting of Buckwheat”? It was a parody of the way the news stations love it when there’s a huge story they can run 24/7. How’s this for a dream scenario: The HoGate story takes on Natalee Holloway proportions and gets everyone watching CNN/MSNBC/FOX nonstop for the lurid entertainment value and then WHAM … the Rove indictment hits.
If you think about it, the reason that stupid Scott Peterson trial became so big was that it came out right in the middle of the invasion of Iraq. Everyone was watching cable news to follow the war — I even got my cable turned on for a couple months. And then the Peterson thing came out with that massive audience all tuned in. HoGate could be the spark that turns Plamegate from a confusing sideshow to a blazing inferno.
I know … dream on …
MZM bought Goss and Cunningham prostitutes and Katherine Harris stole their makeup.
immanentize #115
That would be just too easy. It would take some of the fun out of it. Though, it still would be fun.
Security Clearance – Aren’t there differently levels of security clearance? Maybe he got demoted to a very low level. They could still claim he had “a” security clearance.
Gerber Baby is going to jail…
obsessed #122
I like the way you think!
Again, let us pray.
The presser was announced the night before, which was the evening after the GJ met and handed up its indictments.
That’s my recollection. I got up that morning knowing there would be a presser, eager to view it, on the blog into the wee hours the night before.
J. Casper:
when an illness contracted on duty forced him to retire
Now that is just weird….
You are so good at getting us all this info. thanks.
SP, CPA 121, or at the farmers’ market: lettuce pray, says Karl.
Thanks Redd…I’m dying to know this because Rove is, after all, Bush’s brain.
Stephen — plea market? HA
Punaise has some serious competition!
I wonder how the prostitute thing will play on Main Street.
if this story is confirmed, the republicans are finished. it’s the endless litany of corruption and greed and now SEX! WITH HOOKERS! i think people will be so fucking disgusted, esp considering the issues with sex their base has.
i just think this is sooo damn funny.
Now there are two Duke sex cases going on. Mass confusion, I tell ya, mass confusion.
I’m late to this discussion, and haven’t yet read the comments. But, a key item: When did the courts rule that Cooper has to testify? And when did Cooper declare that he would now obey the appeals court ruling…and testify!
You see, I love this article by Ms. Hamsher, but I think she’s missing a key. The Hadley email…it’s “discovery”…is all a red herring. Karl knew he had his pants down once Cooper would testify. Karl knew his lies would be exposed. So, Karl “latches onto”…he “uses” this Hadley email as his “Eureka moment”…oh, Mr. Fitz, NOW I remember what I was talking about so many months ago to Cooper.
To put it another way….I just think the Viveka stuff is a sideshow. Truth is, Luskin IMMEDIATELY reported the Viveka cocktail chat to Rover damn near soon as that little get together concluded. But, the Luskin-Rove “conventional wisdom” was that “it aint no thang. Just gossip.”
ONLY when it became apparent that Cooper would bust his cookies, did Rove do the back-flip double track. He used the Hadley email, and this Luskin cocktail chat as his “Eureka moment”. Alas….he’s also lying thru his teeth. What else is new.
Ghostman
Re: Goss’ Biography:
“He served as a clandestine service officer with the Central Intelligence Agency from 1962 until 1972, when an illness contracted on duty forced him to retire.”
Any guesses? Mono? Syphillis? Slow drip? Fast Drip? Clap? Standing Ovation? Tijuana Crotch Monkies? Jeff Gannon’s Disease?
Oh, Porter!
-GSD
the View has made a wise decision imho. thanks, TeddySanFran. I could go on and on about Meridith and her support of her husband and how much I like them, I will spare everyone. Rosie is a good replacement for her. Heart for heart…
Thesaurus Rex #123
In this picture, Harris reminds me a bit of Joker’s female friend in the 1989 adaptation with Jack Nicholson as the J-Man.
Teddy at 116 — OMG! That has to frost that Hasselback chick to no end. I bet she was hoping for a wingnut — no such luck. Mwahahaha. Too funny.
“Duke” Cunningham and strippers?
Porter Goss and Lacrosse. I am SO confused.
from the Harper’s story: http://harpers.org/sb-red-ligh…..-hill.html
As to the festivities themselves, I hear that party nights began early with poker games and degenerated into what the source described as a "frat party" scene—real bacchanals. Apparently photographs were taken, and investigators are anxiously procuring copies.btw, Jane — great article.
T-Rex: hilarious
Pach. — that’s what I remember too, but maybe the newswire media advisory went out the morning of.
EPU, your 125 makes a lot of sense to me.
obsessed at 122, excellent question, as per usual. As far as I know, no one has swiftboated Tyler Drumheller, the CIA guy on 60 Minutes. We may be seeing that the WH can’t manipulate the corporate media as easily as it once could.
BTW, loved your comparison of Woodward to Gollum last night.
punaise says:
April 27th, 2006 at 6:32 pm
I suppose that he – and others – will someday have plenty of opportunities to reminisce about their salad days.
Stories about Rove’s salad days make me want to toss !
*ilson at 141 — Ack! Why are there always photos. Errrrrgh…my eyes, my eyes…
*ilson46201 #141
That reminds me, a Republican NY congressman was shitfaced with college kids at Union College (NY), some of whom are underage.
There’s pictures, too!
Re: Hookers?
Heh, heh, Another week, another
CongressionalRepublican scandal.think it is absolutely hysterical that Rosie O’Donnell is going to replace Merideth Viera on “The View.â€
actually, i think it’s significant too. cause they were considering that patricia heaton/everybody loves raymond actress — the one who involved herself in the terri schiavo horror. and that blond footbal trophy wife will be sitting on the far end of the couch, no doubt… lol
on a serious note: re porter goss — wayne madsen says he’s started up the drug trade again (recall funding the nicaraguan contras) as an off-books way of raising funds unnoticed. these fuckers are beyond corrupt — they’re motherfucking traitors.
GSD # 136 — by tomorrow morning, Faux will be reporting that it was a minor flu-like virus; move along. Nothing a little ibuprofen and NyQuil can’t take care of… sniff, sniff.
bkny — it is reports like that which actually make me pray Madsen is wrong again. Sadly, it is just too possible….
immanentize says: “Porter Goss and Lacrosse. I am SO confused.”
April 27th, 2006 at 6:35 pm
And if turns out that the CIA was involved with disseminating this story, talk about blowing somebody’s cover!!
with Afghanistan being the world’s premier supplier of opium, do you really think the CIA is uninvolved?
RevDeb (92) — heh. Actually, I’d put money on internal friendlies getting the Goss-Hookergate story out. Especially after that little bit in NYPost Cindy Adams’ column we were passing around yesterday. I think the fix is in and for once in the last handful of years it’s in our favor.
OtisIsHungry, cc: P. Luk — I left a little tidbit towards the end of the last thread for you re: Woodie.
P. Luk. — forgot to add at the end of my post at the end of the previous thread that the reason why Woodie failed to publish “the bombshell” was to shield the notes and the story from the GJ (see Judge Tatel’s opinion re: Miller & Cooper). No published story, et voila, no obligation to report a crime. Another point that goes to obstruction.
Bush and Rove and the Republicans have done it. They are making everyone open their little black books and squeal and sing and rat.
They have attacked too many. They have challenged everyone and everything.
The blows are coming fast and furious now. It is like watching Randall Tex Cobb get his face beaten in. Bang. Pow. Biff.
Heckuva job.
Tony Snow is going to regret his decision in a matter of days.
-GSD
-GSD
GSD
Wonder if his medical file will get leaked out of the CIA records room.
GSD (136), angie (151) — Hmm. Wonder if that might have been the same illness that kept Chimpy McFlightSuit from showing up for his physical…and wow, could it be in the same year? Must have been something in the water…
GSD #157
Did you see TP’s hit piece on Jonah and Mirengoff over Tony Snow’s comments about Bush while on FOX?
wrt the swiftboating of Drumheller, no need. They just ignore him:
http://mediamatters.org/items/200604270015
Matt O.
I like the kid in the background smoking the doobie.
Nice touch.
America has become a Frat-ocracy.
A nation being run into the ground by trust fund punks who never had to lift a fucking thing in their lives.
-GSD
Goss retires from the military and starts a newspaper in 1971 and Woodward retires from the military and starts a job in journalism in 1971…….hmnnnnnn
*ilson, thanks. If we’re really serious about the War on Terror, it seems to me we have to rethink our position, as a nation, on “illegal” drugs. If we legalize a lot of them, they become regulated and a form of taxable income. Best of all, the the next Osama will have to elsewhere else for funding.
My Fear is as the noose starts to get snug,the probabilty of truly evil desperate “wag the dog” actions that can harm our country.These are arrogant,powerful dangerous men,who control the most powerful millitary force ever created in the history of mankind.They dont give a good jolly goddamn about anyones life but their own,and their grip on power.The possibility of a false flag action to start a war in Iran ,or even to fake a terr.attack on a american city ,is real.
The propaganda machine would go on high,and the
results are beyond knowing except it would be worst than we can dream…
WAR.HERE.
There is many leaders ,and powerful groups in the world who feel that WE are the greatest danger to the other peoples freedom,peace and prosperity.After watching this group of sick ,twisted melagomaniacs operate for the last five years,I find myself unable to find any reason why the entire crew is not hauled off to the Hague for trial
I worry this will end badly
Alright, you guys made me go back and dig through the archives and my notes. (Damn, I’m so anal.) What we had on the 27th was some vague hints from media outlets that some statement might be forthcoming on the 28th when the jury term expired. And Jane had a great source who confirmed for us that the buzz had some statement in the offing for that day. See:
http://firedoglake.blogspot.co…..esman.html
http://firedoglake.blogspot.co…..-mill.html
But my notes don’t have any official announcement from Team Fitz until the morning of the 28th. Everything before that was buzz.
Rayne– didn’t chimpy plead dental problems? hmmm. oral diseases vs others. one likely pathogen or virus comes to mind. could it be herpes, hmmmmmmm? the missus(es) cannot be happy.
Redd/CHS you da bomb.
with Afghanistan being the world’s premier supplier of opium, do you really think the CIA is uninvolved?
from madsen:
The Russian plane was said to be on a counter-narcotics operation when a civilian truck pulled on to the runway as the plane was landing, which resulted in the crash. As WMR has been reporting, Porter Goss’ CIA has been restoring its old drug routes in Latin America and South Asia. The Russian plane was leased by the State Department’s Bureau of Narcotics and Law Enforcement Affairs. The interesting element is that the major leaser of such aircraft in Afghanistan with Ukrainian crews is notorious arm smuggler Viktor Bout. Bout has leased his aircraft to the United States in such regions as Afghanistan, Iraq, and Sudan. Bout also flew for the Taliban before the U.S. invasion. Bout is also linked to Russian-Israeli-Ukrainian Mafia kingpins in the drug smuggling business. The Bush administration and Porter Goss’s CIA are keeping some interesting bedfellows in the so-called “War on Drugs.”
CAN YOU SAY, HERE WE GO AGAIN?
Iran, Iraq, it’s only one letter different and they share a border. “It’s like going to Wisconsin…”
http://www.bellaciao.org/en/ar…..icle=11719
House votes 397-21 for “Iran Freedom Support Actâ€
3 comment(s).
As if Iraq isn’t a big enough mess, the House of Representatives has just voted to ‘hold Iran accountable and support a transition to democracy’. Sound Familiar? Only this time Iran is a democracy. They just held an election where their president was actually elected by the people. How refreshing.
After everything that has been exposed…the lies, the profiteering, the long list of war crimes, 397 ‘Representatives’ gave Bush the go ahead on attacking Iran. Only 21 Patriots voted Nay. Sad to say but these are the only people we can trust…
Baldwin, Blumenauer, Boyd, DeFazio, Duncan, Flake, Hostettler, Jones (NC)
Kucinich, Leach, McDermott, McGovern, McKinney, Oberstar, Obey, Olver
Paul, Rahall, Snyder, Stark, Taylor
The most disappointing aspect however is the fact that so many of our ‘progressive’ leaders in congress voted for this lie. John Conyers voted yay. Maxine Waters, Murtha, Bernie Sanders, Lynn Woolsey, Barbara Lee all voted for it. On the hill today the Progressive Caucus is hosting a hearing on Iraq…
bkny:
THEY DON’T CALL THE “CIA” THE “COCAINE IMPORTATION AGENCY” FOR NOTHING….
FDL rules!
I am old enough to remember Watergate/Nixon (as a politically hyper-aware mid-20’s young adult at the time). What FDL et al are doing was not available back then. But, back then, we had more of a truly independent muckraking MSM. Today, without the likes of FDL, this pandemic BushCo criminal shit would be utterly swept under the carpet.
The Suits have taken note, hence the move to privatize the internet and remake it in the China mold (and worse). The importance of supporting ‘net neutrality simply cannot be overstated.
Jane, Redd, and all of you who hang here — you have my total respect and thanks for all the detailed BS detecting and analysis you do for the good of our country.
The relative paucity of wingnut troll flamethrowing here is an indication of the value you add. They simply cannot refute your acumen (nor match your wit); hence, they soon tire and crawl back under their masturbatory philistine GUI rocks.
Here we go again….. very sad.
immanentize at 167 — well, I try. One of the funnier things in my notes was that Imus reported the morning of the 28th that he had heard from a number of reporters that Rove had been calling people directly to tell them he wouldn’t be indicted. For some reason, I still think that is hilarious. Imus was talking to Russert about it that morning when Timmeh finally spilled a little about his own testimony to the G/J.
You not only try ReddHedd, you succeed. You and Jane are truly amazing.
These journalists are all a bunch of BushCo plants. Even if they start to hit Bush heavy, I for one will never gorgive them for what they tried to do for this country.
I am really worried about the blowback. Seems like a perfect storm for another terra tack.
Who has the suitcase? Why is Condi being so vocal about Iran when it has been confirmed it would be 10 years for them to get it off the ground. Actually, they have less than 1000 days, if you go by the BushCo calendar.
I fear the birds. And BobbyG scared the hell out of me last night with the pink flamingo’s, which by the way, made quite a hit at the office today!
I assume that comment #172 is the skeletal remnants of a neutered troll?
chs 173
Isn’t it weird how damn incestuous/inbred this whole affair is? It’s like actors in Britain — they all have to appear in everything.
*ilson46201 89
“Indict Cheney!” — You might as well ‘aim high’
would be very sweet. and plz include Gonzo too. just cuz I disagree with him.
ccmask -
I have to give up Props to my high school bud Bill for sending me that pink flamingos pic, LOL!
I am really worried about the blowback. Seems like a perfect storm for another terra tack.
i hate these paranoid conjectures, but you can’t discount anything with these maggots. a du comments post a couple of days ago wrote that the poster’s cousin had a long-planned shoreleave cancelled, as did everyone on that particular (nuke-carrying) ship. the suggestion was something in june.
*ilson — I think #172 was in response to #169.
Rover’s big problem is that neither theory is as plausible as Rove lying through his teeth to make sure his boss gets re-elected.
*ilson.
I think # 172 was referring to the “here we go again” heading in reference to congress helping to grease ths kids for war in Iran.
Bush would launch bombs in Iran to save the Turdblossom. No doubt about it.
The nation is being run by Doug Niedermeyer.
-GSD
Dan Hopsicker asks THE QUESTION:
Was Porter Goss a member of Operation 40? The CIA hit team tasked with killing Castro, but shot JFK insead? Other members of Operation 40 include E Howard Hunt, the Watergate Burglers, and GHW Bush.
http://www.madcowprod.com/mc6512004.html
Is that Porter Goss sitting next to Barry Seal?
Barry Seal, the notorious drug smuggler, who was killed by men in black, shortly after trying to contact Vice President Bush in 1986.
There’s a funny reason Matt Drudge has been hyping the Bird Flu thing : his alleged kink is smearing raw eggs on naked bodies before sex. He might need a full-body condom if Avian Flu becomes widespread…(in addition to a brown paper bag)
177 immanentize -
Incestuous indeed ! have been trying for the last half hour to turn this DKOS story in to a link for you all – everything’s there on Wilkes/Wade/MZM – from the contras to the aluminum tubes to after hours gay porn shoots -
I’ve seen no follow up from diarist Sherlock Google, but the cannonfire guy he mentions has stayed on it
At the time of the diary, many thought and still think that many of these shell companies were just DOD money laundering ops for the GOP -
what is my frigiin’ challenge here, why can’t I ‘link’ this ?!?!?!?
http://www.dailykos.com/story/…..>linked text
As I try to catch up, am trying very hard to not get down re: Reid asking Wyden to stop his filibuster. Did I read that right? don’t be discouraged my head says.
And then I read that many of the dems in the House voted for this Iran freedom (yeah right – free to be invaded and killed is more like it) bill? What the ****! trying real hard here to understand what their thinking is and not understanding.
Got to give props to tryggyth (http://www.firedoglake.com/2006/04/26/late-nite-fdl-news-bitches/#comment-81380) wrt the Goss / Hospitality Suite report on TPM:
Pissing off the people in the CIA who are 5 years or less from retirement is a REALLY REALLY bad idea.
These are people who specialize in bringing down governments.
Good call!
The “Decider” -
An irascible rumination.
The most powerful man on the planet. Go back through the “Complete Bushisms.”
http://www.slate.com/id/76886/
But for the accident of privileged birth, this INCOHERENT FUCKING ASSHOLE, had he not been killed in Vietnam, would today be — what? — working graveyard at 7-11? Housewares at Wal-Mart? changing tires at Pep Boys? trying to keep his 7th timeshare rep gig?
What?
I think I need a drink.
It’s GOTTA be random. Gotta be.
OT a gift for punaise
Ghandi wore no shoes and developed thick callouses on the soles of his feet.
Hunger strikes made him feeble.
Hailed as a religious prophet.
His odd diet gave him chronic bad breath. He was a:
Super calloused, fragile mystic hexxed with halitosis.
So, when do we get our $100 Uncle Fristy Freedom Rebates? Do we actually have to wait for ANWR drilling to start, or do we get the Freedom Rebates first?
Christy at 165, per immanentize, thanks, that is really helpful.
I’ll just throw this out there. If Rove has been so anxious to tell us it’s all about Vivica Novak/Hadley stuff, that suggest to me it isn’t all about that, because Rove always lies. My guess is some of Rove’s testimony is about issues he doesn’t want
DeadEye, Scooter…?certain people in the WH knowing about. (WAG Alert) Wild Ass Guess.We need a nice catchy nickname if Hookergate goes big time. Anything better than “hookergate”?
G.O.S.S.= Grab Ourselves Some Sluts
Digby has been reading us I think and pulling some of the Goss pieces together here
I’m with him in not giving a shit who is banging who. What I care about is how they are screwing the country.
This has got to stop!
Ghostman #187– no way anyone of any standing (recipient or wannabe recipient of big oil lobby money) is gonna vote for taking away any money from the black gold thieves. As for your 2nd query, it is propaganda show and tell, then think Aipac, PNAC and the survival of the mighty and then go get a very cool and wet towel to lay on your fevered brow and put your feet up and draw the curtains… this is just my humble take.
“Will the highways on the Internet become more few?”—Concord, N.H., Jan. 29, 2000
Whoo boy. To think he was allowed to steal two elections.
-GSD
OOPSIES– that was to GrandmaJ not Ghostman. sheesh.
Some prince in the P. Gulf said today that the price of oil would drop $15 a barrel if the politicians would just shut-up.
“…not giving a shit who is banging who.”
Agreed. But, remember the blue dress.
Or, will The Base conveniently look away in this case?
I like HoGate, but HookerGate sounds so much like WaterGate that it seems like a no-brainer.
Well, we can use a nice Frank Luntz tested phrase that will rile the religious folks about how low their nation has fallen.
Gommorrha Gate=covers everything.
-GSD
BobbyG
I don’t care personally. I’d be delighted if the public can finally wrap themselves around this one if that’s what it takes.
Blue dress . . . limos and hookers (we don’t know if male or female) whatever it takes.
FOUND THE NUKES. HUNDREDS OF THEM. SCARRY:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yf39qkvwOhU
GSD -
Imagine my chronic mental aneurism at the mere thought of this “Decider” — INCOHERENT FUCKING ASSHOLE!
The only problem I have with Kos’ book is that it blames Dems for losing elections they won, but for the damn electronic voting machines.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2…..exit_polls
198: glad you cleared that up!
Ghostman
oooh baby, thehooker story is gonna be better than a blue dress. via harpers:
It gets even more interesting: the man who has been identified as the CEO of Shirlington has a 62-page rap sheet (I recently obtained a copy) that runs from at least 1979 through 1989 and lists charges of petit larceny, robbery, receiving stolen goods, assault, and more. Curiously—or perhaps not so curiously given the company’s connections—Shirlington Limousine is also a Department of Homeland Security contractor; according to the Washington Post, last fall it won a $21.2 million contract for shuttle services and transportation support. (I tried to contact Shirlington but was unable to get past their answering service.)
As to the festivities themselves, I hear that party nights began early with poker games and degenerated into what the source described as a “frat party” scene—real bacchanals. Apparently photographs were taken, and investigators are anxiously procuring copies. My heart beats faster in fevered anticipation.
Ta -DA !
here’s the DKOS link I mentioned above
colossus of corruption
Stephen Parrish 153
“And if turns out that the CIA was involved with disseminating this story, talk about blowing somebody’s cover!!”
that’s a whoreable joke.
Chicago Tom – thanks for the link.
We should respond clearly to this vote – any ideas?
I like the word Hookergate.
It’s interesting how the suffix “gate” gets attached to scandals. What’s also interesting is that our word for scandal–gate–comes from the actions of a Republican president. Amusingly enough, the word “hooker,” comes from another Republican, Civil War general Joseph Hooker, the guy who bungled the battle of Chancellorsville. So, the phrase “Hookergate” manages to encapsulate military incompetence, sleaze, and uniquely Republican criminality and Presidential corruption. It’s all there.
Hookergate works for me.
This is all delicious, but time to turn in and dream of what tomorrow will bring. After the Daily Show, of course.
Anticipation, anticipation
Is makin’ me late
Is keepin’ me waitin’ . . . .
Angie – Advice accepted. Will use ‘wet cloth’ (of rationality) on my ‘fevered brow’ (of worry) and go rest.
punaise, Porter Goss attractive???? Not so much. He’s a real creep. Then and now.
Cleter,
IIRC the Watergate is allegedly one of the places where some of the “hospitality” suites were.
It goes around and comes around.
G’night.
I’m thinking a real sex scandal that has the ‘base’’s fave heroes in the deal will be like the end of that (original) Star Trek where Harry Mudd is henpecked by hundreds of cloned android ex-wives.
Kirk (and I presume Spock) gave the andoids little logic problem viruses. Remember how they just overloaded?
That would leave the base JAR as ‘undefined’.
GrandmaJ– how are you and your loved ones faring? I hope all is well and the road to healing is smooth.
*ilson (185) — oh no, surely you meant TWO brown bags, yes? Good God, that’s definitely a TWO bagger…
Porkher Goss of the CH(ooking)A
link – though from WA Times – for more on the Iran vote Tom Chicago mentioned:
http://washingtontimes.com/nat…..-8121r.htm
The article mentions a similar vote on the way in the Senate.
Can we call him Port-a-potty G-man yet?
*Viagara*
I’m really wondering how W is going to spin PoHoGate. He can’t really ask Rove to step in, can he? Heeee. Snowjob is sure in for a world of hurt. The press will be salivating for details. Talk about a distraction! Meanwhile Chimpy is playing Home Depot and Frist the asshole pimp is trying to rape ANWAR by handing out fucking $100 that we will pay for since the Treasure of the United States is empty. By the time they process the freedom rebate, cut the worthless check and put it in the mail, it will have cost us $200. Hey Frist, just keep it and stop insulting everyone.
Blank Kludge 217
So, is Bush Harry Mudd? Who is Kirk? Would Fitz be Spock? He looks a little like Spock. He’s got that eyebrow thing.
Heh. Too funny. That single magic V word killed the rest of my comment.
Meant to use it to block the domestic spying algorithm that searches for context in our posts.
Anyhow, I meant to say: chicago tom (204), OMFG, warn me next time; didn’t want a cookie from “that” to give the brownshirts a reason to visit me! Sheesh, that’ll bring back the nightmares I had in high school after reading “Alas, Babylon”…
Neurophius #210
So I’ll drag out the hairdryer and try to salvage my keyboard. Again. *Sigh.*
Sorry, al-Scotter. Still, I was hoping Punaise would notice…
Rayne 226
Alas Babylon gave you nightmares too? I thought I was the only one. Sadly, the kids, they are no longer forced to read that.
chicago tom # 204– wow and whoah. scary indeedy.
Oilfieldguy 190 – LOL
GrandmaJ -
If it helps, I think there’s a glimmer of hope that Harry Reid may have simply been bailing Ron Wyden out before he went hoarse, etc. I watched a bit more of it, when C-Span reran some of it, and Senator Wyden was indicating to other Senators on the floor his desire not to interfere with the Senate’s ‘regular order of business’ in a serious way, it seemed to me (before Reid made his move).
Wyden and the others are SO desperate not to “impolitely interfere” with the ongoing bankruptcy of our country known as the ‘regular order of Senate business,’ it gives me pause. Man, I’d be stepping on toes and kicking shins all over the place if I was a Senator, decorum be damned with our very Constitution and country on the line. But Ron Wyden definitely made his point, and I sincerely hope he manages to follow up on it, in UNISON with other Senators, so that this public lands oil royalty amnesty outrage can be deep-sixed.
neuro 210 – double LOL!
Rayne 223 – auto-Trex’d?
ROFL I liked the “that’s a whoreable joke” too. *grinz*
“Some prince in the P. Gulf said today that the price of oil would drop $15 a barrel if the politicians would just shut-up.”
I couldn’t agree more. BTW, they have “shut up” it looks like.
desemenination can only go so far, you know.
or is it disemenation? new word.
Last notice if anyone missed Countdown earlier. I believe it will be repeating in about 30 mins.
Early portion of show deals with Shuster’s reporting of Rove, and his GJ testimony yesterday, and why Rove is now sweating bullets.
I missed Hardball, but I believe Countdown is more revealing.
howsabout. . .
AdultryGate
. . . hit these fauxXtians where they live. this definately calls for something . . . biblical.
Audit-ultra-gate,
that’s an attempt to tie all the strand together money, spies and adultrous purchased sex. The pun is left for the sex.
I guess I should have said missing money (that’s the audit part).
Goss? http://www.yaledailynews.com/i…..4_5920.jpg
That Goss? I dunno punaise, but I think that if you mean 20somethings with other options, yes – there would need to be money or sparklies or pharmaceuticals involved.
Lessee – Goss declares war on CIA, Goss and hookergate hit the press. No connection, move along *g*
T-Rex, I think you may end up having to give one or two of your ears to MattO as a starter for his necklace.
Shuster was a Bloomington kid, so I’llgo with him I think one day after taking over hours of testimony would be really tight for an indictment and I still wonder why Fitzgerald wouldn’t have stayed in DC today, plus I think there are benefits to making Libby & co sweat it waiting to see what happens with Karl, so I am keeping expectations low – but it would be nice if something did happen on Fri.
It will be a busy day for me – but this is where I’ll check for all the news that is the news *g*
punaise – yes, probably a built-in feature of the comments here to prevent comment-spam. No problem, although there are two downsides: can’t use certain key words to hide content from the prying eyes of the brownshirts, and you can’t use those same key words in any of your lovely puns.
And there’s going to be a bumper crop of opportunity for those kinds of puns if Repugs finally gave us a good-old-fashioned sex scandal.
nice ppirt– Adultrygate.
couple that *g* with disemenation and you have a perfect pow to the solar plexus of the faux xtians. See, you can be cool using dis, then comes the semen and incorporated there is the patriarchal men thingy– no offense to the wonderful men here, followed by the nation. Talk about subliminal messaging…
How about Fornicate&FoggoGate?
Robin Williams on TDS with a T-Shirt saying “The Decider”. It gets better from there.
Forni-gate gets my vote.
Mary, have I told you I love you lately?
Waitaminute–Mary 243
TRex has a necklace made of EARS?
How could I have missed that?
Has anyone connected Mary McCarthy with GossGate yet?
“Some prince in the P. Gulf said today that the price of oil would drop $15 a barrel if the politicians would just shut-up.â€
the saudi ambassador to the u.s. said in chicago last week that a u.s. attack on iran would be a catastrophe.
I tend towards stone cold fury where the Bushites are concerned.
I’ve no confidence in American jurisprudence. I’ve no confidence in our legislative branches.
But I’ve still some hope, thin as it is.
I wonder if America’s Eagle Scout, and his Untouchables, would understand what I meant by that? Or would they think me just another clueless chump?
I love that this PoHo thing will put the spotlight back on the horrendous corruption of Cunninghams countless Repugs awarding contracts to phony companies that then funneled the money back into countless Repug campaigns. This stuff goes so deep, it will make your hair stand on end.
Fornigate it is! Rolls off the tongue so easily… easy for everrrybody to say– think throaty Rita crowing that!
Whatever we call this new Republican scandal, when you’re talking to your Bush-voting uncle at the Memorial day barbecue, be sure to tell him “Those Republican congressmen are using your tax dollars to buy hookers.”
FDL had a recent post on Dems holding Truman style war profiterring hearings. I have been wondering why they haven’t been pushing for those too. Maybe the Dems think the citiznery has become so corrupt that no one would care. But now that we have hookers in the mix, seems like a “go” to me. Money for sex definitely one of the top items to keep the press’ attention.
Here is a link to a review of a review of Joe Klein’s new book. I think the paragraph that discusses what Truman was really like politically is important.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/…..19801.html
Truman knew how to win from behind rather than lose from ahead. (But I think he did have lowest job rating ever for awhile, low 20s. But nobody’s perfect.
Rover’s on the hook and Porter’s on the hookers. I’m going to be smirking all the way into next week.
Don’t ruin it lurcher! I am in the West. I have two more hours to go…
Billy Bob Kristol just said the dems win the house in 2006 on Colbert.
Smoochies back at ya Urban. Would it change things if I fessed up to being Porter’s flip side?
Love should be blinder than a Bill Frist trust.
cleter – I will confess, but only bc you have cracked me up several times tognight. T-Rex has a necklace of Repub operative ears. You might have noticed that hats are becoming more and more fashionable (and sitting lower across the forehead) in certain circles.
sorry, Matt. O. there’s plenty more.
T-Rex, I think you may end up having to give one or two of your ears to MattO as a starter for his necklace.
Oh, it looks like there are going to be plenty to go around. Puh-LEN-ty.
My vote goes to HoGate. Even Sean Hannity can spell that.
I think this software is about to explode…..
Meanwhile, in nukular news, Condi’s trying to turn up the heat on Iran. China and Russia look like they may put the kibosh on any sort of Security Council vote, because they say any such vote could then be used by the US to try to justify a pre-emptive strike. Ouch. I think karma’s about to bite a lot of people in the ass.
ROTFPIMLMAO!
Stephen Colbert just ripped Bill Kristol a new one. LOLOLOLLOL
Mary, I’m in love w/ your MIND.
267 Posts and counting. Fitz must be nigh.
I bet the hitmeter is rolling like a gas pump meter.
Waitaminute–Mary 243
TRex has a necklace made of EARS?
How could I have missed that?
Aheh. That was just a little joke, Cleter. Nothing to be alarmed about.
fornigate.
shweet.
oh, there’s a storm of cognitive dissonance a-brewin’….this should corrode much of that last 32% of kool-aid drinkin’ wingnuts. Things are shaping up for a low GOPer turnout in November, and that spells impeachment.
How about Girlie Gate?
“Rover’s on the hook and Porter’s on the hookers.”
Goss had better get himself hooked up with a good attorney..
Those Republican congressman are fornicatin’ with whores! On matresses stuffed with YOUR tax dollars! And some of the whores are MAN WHORES! Those Republicans are defiling your tax dollars with the bodily fluids of their man whores! Think about that when Bill Frist presses a sweaty wad of bills into your hand. That $100 Freedom Rebate might’ve come out of the fornicatin’ mattress. Still want it?
Cleter, you’re on FIRE tonite!
I am about to be EPU’d but y’all gotta see this wrt to FITZ– Dru gave me the heads up via email and tis a gift indeed.
http://www.dingle-region.com/sppatrick.htm
TRex 268
I was just wondering when I missed the thread devoted to discussing human body part trophies. That’s all.
new thread– told you I would get EPU’d; will post again…
On the Countdown replay, they just said that the congressional proposal to kill FEMA and replace it with a new agency has bipartisan support–it’s been endorsed by Sen. Susan Collins (R-Maine)) and Joementum.
Joementum? I thought bipartisan meant that at least one Democrat supported it…
cmask 270
Girlie Gate?
Are you sure the hookers were all female?
I wonder what Exxon CEO Rex Tillerson is going to buy with his $100 FristCard?
i like FORNIGATE too but come on . . .
but: is it not a bit of a challenge for the red state vocabulary???
cleter – you say that as if you think they were using them for something. Ear today . . .
189 BobbyG says:
April 27th, 2006 at 7:28 pm
Bobby: He has absolutely incredible luck. Unfortunately we get stuck with the side-effects.
I remember ‘Alas, Babylon’ also. No nightmares, but it sounded all-too-appropriate for duck-and-cover drill days. (We did them at least once a year, sirens and all. I should have more turning-night-into-day mushroom-cloud nightmares than I do.)
Sorry, I inadvertently submitted the comment. Here’s the punch line.
Rove didn’t know that Cooper emailed his editor about his conversation with Rove. Fitz certainly has a copy of it. Since Cooper had no reason to lie about the conversation, Fitz likely believes him. Meanwhile, Rove’s email to Hadley is coded to conceal what he discussed with Cooper. Because it’s coded, it constitutes powerful evidence that Rove knew that he was breaking the law. Hadley is implicated in the conspiracy because Rove was reporting to him and the report was coded. Finally, waiting to tell Fitz about the email until after Cooper lost his appeal to quash Fitz’s subpoena, some five to nine months later, sure doesn’t seem like a good faith effort to clear-up the record. Instead, it proves that Rove was going to stick with his false, or misleading testimony unless Cooper was forced to testify.
Bottom Line: Rove is done and you can stick a fork in him.
!ztiF
EPU’d Zone has arrived.
–
Paul,
If you’re still hanging around, do you have a theory to fit your question of last night?
the real question is…. why didn’t Rove call up Cooper and ask him about the rumors?
–
Suddenlly as I was reading this I thought …”Oh I know how to expalin this visually …. Just think of Rosemary Woods and the missing 18 minutes. These guys are timeline contortionists”.
having spent much of the latest war prep and execution in an alcoholic haze, I am not exactly sure what I remember. But… didn’t I see that one great technological breakthrough was that all electrical grids could be shut down by some sort of aluminum shower that would preserve all infrastructure? So, why the bombs if not simply to cause a need to rebuild?
Second, did not Bush remove something like 6 thousand pages of the Saddam data dump before giving the info to the UN folk? What was in that group? Why didn’t Saddam save a true copy?
I told my girls when I came back from the first gulf war that my kids and grandkids would have to finish the job that daddy bush was too wimpy to complete when we had the guys to do it. I was astounded when his baby boy tried to do the same thing with less than half the guys we had then. (When we heard that Saddam was killing our friends not 200 k from where we were waiting to go home, the 90% reserve unit I was in (I was a major and must admit I instigated it locally, but with much interaction with other unit leaders), signed 4187’s (requests for reassignment) asking to be assigned to units which would go to our friend’s rescue. That went very well….., but we tried to kick as much ass as we could.
We finally got redeployed (I was in Ops at Med Center West, up in the top of the disputed triangle, actually well into Iraq and straight west from Kuwait City during the war). I then was redeployed back in July to the med center at Dahran, until early December 1991. Maybe folk don’t remember well, but in September the UN inspectors were taken hostage in the Agriculture ministry offices. They were released when GWB made a deal to have all the doors and cabinets tied off with those really secure (Ha) alluminum railroad seals. Our guys were totally ready to resuce the UN team. (I had access to TS reports, and we knew that the team had found the entire WMD program files. Unfortunately, it also included all the US help during the Bush/Reagan rears… Oh yeah, it did.) We had SF guys on the ground. We had the 18th airborne in the air. Our local guys–me–had prepared the medical support part of the operation to rescue the folk. In fact, we had it aced. Fifteen minute standby to execution for more than a week. No problem, few casualties expected, very high payoff in info. Then, boom, GWB made a deal. This was at the same time that all roads from SA to Doha in Kuwait were being BLOCKADED and SEARCHED by Iraqi forces. (We were removing the huge stockpiles in SA to Kuwait, and they had routine roadblocks on the way and diverted the contents into Iraq. There was also a huge and wellknown scavange project by Iraq into Iraq and Kuwait to recover vehicles and ammo. In fact, in Oct or Nov 91 something like a 50 vehicle column, captured and diverted to Doha, blew up “accidentally” a few miles before arriving. Every vehicle blown up. Yep. True. I had the great opportunity to write up the “military history” of the medical operations during the war and after. (I couldn’t leave until it was done.) This is now in the Carlisle Barracks history center. Having had the opportunity to see all secret level intel briefs and sit reps in the Fort Sam Houston medical operations center from about 15 Aug 90 until mid Jan 91 when I finally got myself deployed to the ground war (and always thereafter except while in transit), I knew about the “A team” (anthrax) deployed immediately from FSH after the invasion, and why (we had given Saddam the crap during its Iran war), I knew that in Nov 90 we had a total standown to recount troops because we did not know WITHIN 100 THOUSAND who was in SA or Kuwait or otherwise sent to prepare for war.